Naked Science Forum
General Discussion & Feedback => Just Chat! => Topic started by: Karen W. on 06/04/2009 07:59:59
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If a man and a woman are in a very troubled marriage.. is it possible for one person to look to themselves to correct all of their own flaws and think it plausible to save a marriage by just working on themselves and just trying to make themselves happy with who they are.
Does that seem doable in fixing a marriage that is not working. Do you think if you try to be a better person and ignore the other problems that that will somehow repair the marriage.
I have heard counselors say things like this.. not my counselor but others... etc..
I feel it takes two to row a boat 24 hours a day and expecting one person to do all the work is illogical and one sided.
What do you think?
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No takers?
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I agree with you! Seems that if a relationship isn't working, both parties have to try to make changes.
but then again, my wife had me altered to her specifications
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Yes I don't understand that line of thinking... I spent years trying to conform to what he wanted but no amount of conformation or self improvement changed me to what he expected.. LOL..
I guess I am broken...LOL...But I think I like me better now that I can be me again.
I am a huge Dr. Phil fan read and bought all of his books but there are some points I cannot agree with after spending tons of time trying to work on me... It definitely takes two... I like me just fine and I always work on and admit my own short comings... so I have decided that it is never just one sided..
I Think I find that I prefer no alterations.... Learn to love the whole man boyish charm or manly pride but at least be honest and real....we are different people..
It is such an odd belief to think that one person exercising the fine art of self improvement can save a marriage where there clearly are problems on both sides! It needs to be both people working on self improvement but then that does not guarantee
a successful repair of relationship! It may even settle the fact that they should move away from one another to grow and be happy.
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Karen, I don't think you have any problem with loving :)
A 'companionship' of any kind implies two (at the very least:) people.
When it stopps 'working' although no one abused the other, both need to discuss, the worst way I know of is to hold it inside until it's to late, never getting to know what the other person thinks.
In most relations that breaks up there seems to me to be one that is 'actively' doing it and the other one more passively letting it happen, when at this 'stadium' there is small chances of finding a common ground for rebuilding it again. Loyalty and patience is important to me, as to most of us. after that first intoxication :) But, it's all part of life Karen, there are no guarantees for anything, But remember, as long as you have the capacity for love yourself, love can be found.
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Those are very sweet thoughts and I tend to agree... The problem for me is the fact that I believe that I have run out of steam.. The capacity to love has never been a question as I am a lover of people.. but I really give my whole heart and soul.. and its hard to do that repeatedly once let alone twice... Me thinks I am done doing that......
I have spent a long time being upset with him and still caring so much about him.. It just ripped my heart out....Then feeling like It was me... what did I do what didn't I do and being angry with myself for failing...and for being a nice smiley Mrs even when he was cheating with 4 or 5 people a week...every week of my 27, soon to be 28 year marriage and 32 year love fest! LOL..
I wonder if I had really opened my eyes and pulled myself out of denial if Things would have been different... I mean with how I feel now.. cause right now I doubt that there really is real love .. you know the kind that keeps your heart beating fast every time you see him.... or her.. LOL
I guess The last month and a half I have come to realize that love is pretty much a big slap in the face....
And I don't think I want it anymore......I don't have any heart left to rip out!
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Karen, I don't think you have any problem with loving :)
A 'companionship' of any kind implies two (at the very least:) people.
When it stopps 'working' although no one abused the other, both need to discuss, the worst way I know of is to hold it inside until it's to late, never getting to know what the other person thinks.
In most relations that breaks up there seems to me to be one that is 'actively' doing it and the other one more passively letting it happen, when at this 'stadium' there is small chances of finding a common ground for rebuilding it again. Loyalty and patience is important to me, as to most of us. after that first intoxication :) But, it's all part of life Karen, there are no guarantees for anything, But remember, as long as you have the capacity for love yourself, love can be found.
By The way Yor_on I hope you have that in your life....
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Karen, I'm sure there are people around you that loves you, don't give up on them. Life is very much a struggle and people can be amazingly egoistical at times. That doesn't mean that time stops, you have to let it heal, and that will take time. Some 'sores' may never heal totally when the relation have been that long but it will get better, I promise :)
And reach out to your friends for help, talk about it and try to let that anger and disappointment go, it will only sour your life if you allow it to fester. there are other things waiting for you Karen, just outside your door. How was it Bilbo said? something like, 'You may just go out for a little walk but there are a thousand paths waiting for you'?
Well, something like it anyway. Talk it off and set some goals for what you want to do. And keep to them, it's routine that works wonder, not the 'seven day miracle cure' :) We like you Karen.
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My spelling is atrocious without my reading glasses.
Edit edit edit:)
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Karen, I'm sure there are people around you that loves you, don't give up on them. Life is very much a struggle and people can be amazingly egoistical at times. That doesn't mean that time stops, you have to let it heal, and that will take time. Some 'sores' may never heal totally when the relation have been that long but it will get better, I promise :)
And reach out to your friends for help, talk about it and try to let that anger and disappointment go, it will only sour your life if you allow it to fester. there are other things waiting for you Karen, just outside your door. How was it Bilbo said? something like, 'You may just go out for a little walk but there are a thousand paths waiting for you'?
Well, something like it anyway. Talk it off and set some goals for what you want to do. And keep to them, it's routine that works wonder, not the 'seven day miracle cure' :) We like you Karen.
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My spelling is atrocious without my reading glasses.
Edit edit edit:)
No worries...I have my kids.... I love them.
Friends... lol.....we won't even go there.......The one good friend I had moved away.....The others I thought were my friends turned out to be gossiping drama Queens that do not know how to be friends with anyone..... right now...I am quite fine without any.
Any way just waking up each morning is my goal now. My councelor says to make some goals for my future...but...I really can't see one....
My niece came home for a few weeks and it was gonna be permanant move..but she left this morning 2 AM....back to Idaho. I took a couple days to get out some of my collections and decided to make sure they went to my nephew's and niece's. I gave my great Nephew my 109 year old Jar of Marbles collected from 1900 some from the late 1800's for him to take care of and hand down to the next generation. I passed on an old 100 year old jar and Dice collection from way back several generations....Passed some collectibles on to my Niece.
I want to find a home for my stamp collections. Things I don't want to think about anymore. I have no desire to work on it anymore, there is too much history involved.
Your right...it takes a long time to heal.... and Just when you think your there the rug gets snapped out from under you, and back to square 1.
That's life Like you said.. take the good and the bad. I guess I am just tired thats all.
Paths, paths, too many paths for me! I believed that we were all predestined to follow a certain path and that it was already determined.. that was how I was raised, but when I decided to listen to my heart... I think I jumped off a huge bridge and got lost........when I found myself in unfamiliar ground...It was wonderful....I found a part of me that had been lost for a very long time... now... I wonder if it should have stayed hidden away? I tend to lay myself out there and end up feeling like a piece of asphalt all
exposed and getting trampled. I need to just shut up and be quiet and let everything just move on by like the cars on a freeway.
Cest la vie..Thank you for the kind words and nice things you said... good advice....I like you all too.
Gettng back to my question..Is it really common for therapists to share so many different opinions when it comes to resolving marraiges.
I love my therapist she is wonderful. I understand what she says when she says that I am not responsible for my husbands behaviors... but my raisings tell me that I should perform some miracle and shut my mouth and stay in this mess and allow his behavior to continue... now the real modern normal me says bullcrap, the insecure scared me just wants for it to all stop and for everything just to disappear.....I wish I was one of Don 1's turtles.. and cold just climb into my shell and never come out again.....Too bad I don't know a dead Giant Galopagus that did not need his shell anymore.
My therapist suggests setting some goals for wha I want for my future... then start going after them or a least working toward them.
There are things I wish..I could do...but no longer feel them possible to do....I don't know if its just That I am disheartened or really don't believe in love anymore..at least the way I feel love is..... I do feel it but really don't know what to do about it anymore..... at least for myself. I love to see it around in young and the old... I loved giving love...but after all these years and Now being so empty....everything feels really pointless.
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First of all Karen, I'm flattered :)
that you cared.
Next thing I want to say is that your counselor is perfectly correct.
Life consists of a lot of 'small steps', some of us have a innate feeling of the importance of choosing directions. Most of us don't, as our society becomes more complicated those first steps becomes more important. But nowhere can we avoid experiences. They are on good and bad. When we dress of our neighbors they are very much like ourselves, they too don't know for sure what makes 'life' worthwhile either. You have kids Karen, and you are a good mother, I just know that, remember that all living things are fragile, we all are. So girl, I expect you to do what you are born too, to nourish and care.
Love as seen from the male side is very much finding a woman like you and try to hold her near, nothing more, but nothing less either. So take care of yourself and those you love. the guys will recognize you for whom you are. And remember that people are scared of change, most just wants things to be the 'same', that is as we all know that things change, and most of us want life to be 'understandable' and plan-able, but its not, Karen. Life is a mystery, so strange and amazing, in both bad and good ways. You will find new, better, friends if you just dare to open that door. That's a promise Karen.
Remember that all healing takes time, and craves you to want it, nothing is free, except love. That we give and take girl, so keep on, Bilbo is correct, there are a thousand paths waiting for you, and there will be someone dreaming of you. Life is a journey and we all die, at that time and place it will be just you and your shaper, you will stand there without any hiding, that is the time when you take that final look at yourself, and I promise, you will find yourself beautiful Karen, Don't worry, you have eternity on your side, and love.
Just remember continuity and those 'steps', one at a time, just like a baby. And be yourself, there is nothing wrong with you, you've just been wounded, healing do take time, no one is totally lost, we can all find our way back.
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And that I definitely need to buy some glasses, it, or rather I, seems I lose 'letters' all the time.
anyone seen a A running past? It's mine.
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My first wife and I divorced many years ago after struggling with each other over just about everything conceivable. I tried to change for her and I'm sure she also made attempts at it herself. The problem with many marriages is, one or both partners begin their marriage by trying to mold the other to suit their own expectations. Many times, this is a hopeless endeavor and frankly, will almost always ultimately fail. Personal happiness is really the responsibility of the self, nobody else can be responsible for your's or mine. Once I learned this, life became much eaiser for me. Thankfully, I'm presently remarried to a fine lady and we both more or less understand this basic principle. As a result, we are not only partners in co-operation but, good friends to boot. We give each other a lot of space, and believe me, many times in marriage, space and time given to self examination is very necessary.
I'm pulling for you Karen and I certainly hope you can work things out within your family. Just remember this however; You are a sovereign individual and you are the first line of defense responsible for securing your own happiness. Determine today that whatever happens, live your life in a manner that brings you the happiness you deserve.........................Ethos
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Do you and your husband still have sex? If yes, how many times a week?
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Do you and your husband still have sex? If yes, how many times a week?
this question does not have anything to do with my topic really... but FYI THE ANSWER IS A HUGE NO..... NOT FOR 2 PLUS YEARS NOW!
during our marraige before he spilled the beans and I found out we had sex several times a week..because it was nice..I loved him and sex was always good.
He claimed that he just wanted extra curricular sex on the side and that no amount would be enough because he likes the different partners....
I only want one person. I enjoy sex always did.
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My first wife and I divorced many years ago after struggling with each other over just about everything conceivable. I tried to change for her and I'm sure she also made attempts at it herself. The problem with many marriages is, one or both partners begin their marriage by trying to mold the other to suit their own expectations. Many times, this is a hopeless endeavor and frankly, will almost always ultimately fail. Personal happiness is really the responsibility of the self, nobody else can be responsible for your's or mine. Once I learned this, life became much eaiser for me. Thankfully, I'm presently remarried to a fine lady and we both more or less understand this basic principle. As a result, we are not only partners in co-operation but, good friends to boot. We give each other a lot of space, and believe me, many times in marriage, space and time given to self examination is very necessary.
I'm pulling for you Karen and I certainly hope you can work things out within your family. Just remember this however; You are a sovereign individual and you are the first line of defense responsible for securing your own happiness. Determine today that whatever happens, live your life in a manner that brings you the happiness you deserve.........................Ethos
I know all about personal happiness but there is also the happiness two people find in each other and they are totaly different.... I Like myself..I am a worth while person and find happines in many different things, myself, my own accomplishments, children, learning, writing, exploring my inner self, the world....
I want something more because without that shared happiness I feel empty...
There will be no marrital resolution in this home.... as far as our relationship, its over... the way it once was... but my pain comes in trying to finalize things I am so torn and regardless of what I know is the reality of the situation It makes it no easier to end the attachment and let all those feelings go...I don't know how to juggle the feelings, the history. You know...my feelings are wishy washy. Everything I know of my life has been turned upside down and I can't figure out why my feelings are still so raw....
How can I not stand him, or even tolerate him and his messed up ideas, and still care so much about him and what we shared....? *tears* It makes no sense to me...My councelor says its normal to feel all those things... I do not hate him I could never. but I do not love him in the way I once did. We failed at our marriage, we succeeded in making three beautiful children, and I have great memories of my children, and some family things, some funny anecdotes, but its like everything I believed in has changed... from God to love which I believed was God...
God was all the good in the world and most of all love... I feel that my whole foundation has fractured and My house of cards is caving in...It took too long to establish and build trust and love in a man and now its gone. Seems like overnight.
So there is more to love then just self fulfilment... its sharing and giving of love to another, and giving happiness to another. The give and take of love, the sharing of hearts, inner thoughts, as well as physical satisfaction, weather that be a simple hug, or the holding of hands, or sharing your bodies with each other. These things help complete happiness.. Sure there is happiness in tons of everyday happinesses. There is also a need to make someone else happy, bring a smile to a special someone, and have that returned. Its way more complicated then simply finding inner happiness....
We all have different things that bring us happiness !
We are all different! What brings one person happiness, does not always bring another happiness.
Some people like being alone others do not. There is nothing wrong with either way, but my own inner happinesses are mine always. They will never go away but as the person I am, I need that affection that closeness of sharing and knowing a person so well, that he could breath for me....I know thats an exaggeration...But..I do love, love, and I love. Weather I believe in love any more.. is questionable.
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First of all Karen, I'm flattered :)
that you cared.
Next thing I want to say is that your counselor is perfectly correct.
Life consists of a lot of 'small steps', some of us have a innate feeling of the importance of choosing directions. Most of us don't, as our society becomes more complicated those first steps becomes more important. But nowhere can we avoid experiences. They are on good and bad. When we dress of our neighbors they are very much like ourselves, they too don't know for sure what makes 'life' worthwhile either. You have kids Karen, and you are a good mother, I just know that, remember that all living things are fragile, we all are. So girl, I expect you to do what you are born too, to nourish and care.
Love as seen from the male side is very much finding a woman like you and try to hold her near, nothing more, but nothing less either. So take care of yourself and those you love. the guys will recognize you for whom you are. And remember that people are scared of change, most just wants things to be the 'same', that is as we all know that things change, and most of us want life to be 'understandable' and plan-able, but its not, Karen. Life is a mystery, so strange and amazing, in both bad and good ways. You will find new, better, friends if you just dare to open that door. That's a promise Karen.
Remember that all healing takes time, and craves you to want it, nothing is free, except love. That we give and take girl, so keep on, Bilbo is correct, there are a thousand paths waiting for you, and there will be someone dreaming of you. Life is a journey and we all die, at that time and place it will be just you and your shaper, you will stand there without any hiding, that is the time when you take that final look at yourself, and I promise, you will find yourself beautiful Karen, Don't worry, you have eternity on your side, and love.
Just remember continuity and those 'steps', one at a time, just like a baby. And be yourself, there is nothing wrong with you, you've just been wounded, healing do take time, no one is totally lost, we can all find our way back.
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And that I definitely need to buy some glasses, it, or rather I, seems I lose 'letters' all the time.
anyone seen a A running past? It's mine.
I am ot sure why you are flattered by my caring... I like my online friends always have... :)
You are right about benefitting from both our good and bad experiences. .They are part of life...I just need to learn to take more careful tiny steps as its just as easy to walk off a cliff taking tiny steps as it is taking running jumps!
I'll post more later..my brain is frazzeled tonight... night yor on. Thanks for your encouragement! By the way, what did you mean by my shaper? Do you mean my creator or God?
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That's a question between you and eternity Karen. For myself I don't know what to call it/her/him. Something made a very Big Bang at some time :) Whatever it was it shaped spacetime and us too. What I do know from personal experience is that, at least in my 'mind', there is a silent 'contemplator' sharing none of my emotional modes. I've meet this viewer some times and although it may make me to seem certifiable :) I think that this is 'me' too.
Another 'me' though, as far as I noticed not really understanding the intricacies of living a 'human' life. And I'm sure that I will meet this 'viewer' one final time. We are in a constant sea of sensations and stimuli living giving little time for contemplation, it can be hard on the senses and emotions at times. But that's why we are here I think, to live and experience, good and bad. I think Ethos is correct in that one first need to find some happiness in one self.
Companionships seems to consist of a lot of different 'modes' and what I might find as being 'natural' another person might find 'strange'. Still, we can all recognize a good man or woman, have no doubts Karen. You are already a fair part on your way to recovery, looking at your writings, its just that neither life nor we are perfect. We learn as we go :)
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So... you're saying that your husband has sex with multiple partners?
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So... you're saying that your husband has sex with multiple partners?
If you had read what Karen has said already, you would already know the answer to that, and you wouldn't have asked the question in the first place let alone persue the issue now.
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Thanks Variola.! [;)]
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That's a question between you and eternity Karen. For myself I don't know what to call it/her/him. Something made a very Big Bang at some time :) Whatever it was it shaped spacetime and us too. What I do know from personal experience is that, at least in my 'mind', there is a silent 'contemplator' sharing none of my emotional modes. I've meet this viewer some times and although it may make me to seem certifiable :) I think that this is 'me' too.
Another 'me' though, as far as I noticed not really understanding the intricacies of living a 'human' life. And I'm sure that I will meet this 'viewer' one final time. We are in a constant sea of sensations and stimuli living giving little time for contemplation, it can be hard on the senses and emotions at times. But that's why we are here I think, to live and experience, good and bad. I think Ethos is correct in that one first need to find some happiness in one self.
Companionships seems to consist of a lot of different 'modes' and what I might find as being 'natural' another person might find 'strange'. Still, we can all recognize a good man or woman, have no doubts Karen. You are already a fair part on your way to recovery, looking at your writings, its just that neither life nor we are perfect. We learn as we go :)
I think we all find happiness in ourselves and beautitudes and all the wonderful things in this world and some of us need diffrent things to complete that circle of happiness,, for me it WAS my husband and chldren ..I still have my children and my husband is alive and i will aways feel a fondness for him...I will never hate him or anything like that..but we have different dreams and he certainly does not find his happiness here. he needs more then love he needs counceling and help....before he is ever truely happy.
I am different I have always needed a closeness that comes from friendship, love, affection, and trust, as well as loyalty and a monogumous sexual relationship which is based on those founding emotions of friendship, love, affection, trust loyalty and passion that has built that loving relationship...
I agree with much of how you believe... thanks for your expanation.
I guess what I was trying to say is hat I think it takes two people to make a relationship work... and what you said about one actively working and the other passively sitting and letting th breakup happen leaves little hope for resolution of the relationship. Well this relationship as it was is over and Now I am trying to make some sense of whatever is left of our friendship without loosing it completely... This is were I am struggling.....I am just struggling with my own feelings.. I do not want to be angry with him or get in a position of hate...That eats at a person and I am fighting every instinct I have to not feel that towards him...I am angry and hurt... but at the same time my heart is soft towards his man I have given my life to and I fnd it difficult to just wash my hands of the whole twenty seven years of joy and sorrow..I can't separate the two which reeking havoc with my emotions because I Don't understand having them all at once...
I have filled out paperwork but they await my signing but frankly i am scared to death of all the legl ramifications etc.... It is a lot to deal with including who works on what to salvge exacty what ..I am not sure... friendship or just simply civility???
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Back to the original question. The problem lies in peoples attitudes to marriage in the first place. We fall in love and stagger blindly into marriage. The small things that annoy us about our partners are ignored because we are so in love with being in love. At the back of our minds we think we can change our partners small imperfections. We also put on a bit of a show for our partner because we love them. As married life goes on we stop putting on a show as it is hard to keep a show going. We realise that the small imperfections are massive carbuncles and we also realise that our partners don't want to change and wont be changed. As familiarity breads contempt we stop breeding altogether. This is when the marriage starts to be in trouble. Excepting our partners weaknesses right from the beginning and realising that this is it and there wont be any change is the only way a marriage can progress. Having to change to save a marriage is the hardest thing in the world.
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I do agree with you...I BECAME STIFFLED EARLY ON IN MY MARRAIGE BECAUSE OF THESE LOVING COMMENTS THAT WERE ALWAYS MADE TO ME SUPPOSEDLY WITHOUT PRESSURE BUT WITH REGULARITY....Whoops sorry for the caps....I stopped writing and I could no longer speak with him about things from my past because he said he did not want to know the details.. 27 years later find out it was because he was molested as a boy with his two brothers, by a preachers son who at the time was a much older then the three boys were... It changed the way he felt about sex with women as well as sex with men... at least thats what he tells me..... He said he hated what happened to him and could not hear what happened to me...
Thus it changed him but he never bothered telling me and I did not know until this last year and half two years. It has been torture. .. The cheating has been the whole marraige but not confirmed in the quanities until much later in my marraige. I felt as if I was a fool to not have seen these things.. but he was my first love I knew nothing else except him.... and I loved him and gave him everything he ever wanted... I just could not change who I was physically...... I was not right for him... he claims that the way he feels had nohing to do with me.. he said he felt lucky that he had me and still claims his love for me.. but that is not enough......His attraction to
both genders is really one sided.. as he seeks something I can't change or be.
No amount of love and understanding can change his feelings and It is not that that hurts so much as him taking away my right to choose a love based on the truth.. I fell in love with a wonderful man..but a lie.... don't get me wrong...he is good.. but he does not want me or a woman.
He thinks he is bisexual but has only had two experiences besides me out of hundreds of relationships over the years.. they have all been same gender.. I just feel he should have told me.. he knew before we were married and chose to keep it a secret.....knowing he would always be unfaithful to me.. thats where I loose my trust the cheating not his sexual choice although my choice is not to be with a partner who is gay..
I would have chosen to have looked for a heteral sexual relationship in my life.. and not built my world around him as the love of my life....just to have it ripped away now so cruely.....his partners have emailed me terrible pictures of them together sexually as well as his partners in different sexual positions.. and although I put a stop to it..... I believe they were trying to help him face truths about himself although it has just hurt me more and made my life hell in the last two years.. I suppose I should apologise for my emotional states over this time period it has not been helped by my illnesses... My apologies.. I need to find a middle ground with my emotions and it has been really difficult as the children do not know ...This forum has been my haven of learning and safety also.... so I am afraid you all have been hit by my emotional avalanche but rest assured I am really trying hard to put things right in my head and get back to being my normal happy self someday soon...I just do not know how? I want to be able to let go of the gray cloud..It is just not something I can just blow off..I have my children to think about and he needs to tell them..... That is not my place...
Thanks ..MIL .... It is difficult to try to change and it is not worth the heartache and pain that is added over the years.. the isolation even whilst being married is horrible and lonely.....I want out and I want it to be over in a way that I can salvage a friendship somewhere in this mess with a good man who fathered my kids.... end it with civilized amicable feelings as I cannot go on if I can't.....Its killing me...
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Karen, I'm so sorry about all that is going on in your life. The guy lied to you and himself. I have heard of so many men marrying good women, knowing deep down that they are gay. I have always been honest with David about my sexuality. He knows that I would never stray but I do have double the temptation. When he is being a pig, I sometimes think that if I divorced him I would choose a woman next time.
Karen, If you think the marriage is damaging your sanity, you have to think about you. Everything else should come second. Staying friends is going to be very hard but steel yourself and try. We are all here if you need us. It is a brave decision.
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He knows that I would never stray but I do have double the temptation.
Maybe he thinks twicw as many people will not fancy you! Does this give him better odds?
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I get men chatting me up constantly. Sadly I don't get any women but I don't mix in the right circles for that. The best chat up line I got was a man who said "I can be a lesbian."
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Karen, I'm so sorry about all that is going on in your life. The guy lied to you and himself. I have heard of so many men marrying good women, knowing deep down that they are gay. I have always been honest with David about my sexuality. He knows that I would never stray but I do have double the temptation. When he is being a pig, I sometimes think that if I divorced him I would choose a woman next time.
Karen, If you think the marriage is damaging your sanity, you have to think about you. Everything else should come second. Staying friends is going to be very hard but steel yourself and try. We are all here if you need us. It is a brave decision.
Thank you MIL...I appreciate your honesty... I wish he had been as honest at least then I would have had a leveled out playing field.. his sexual choice is not so much where my big problem lies, although, it angered me that he lied, and gave me no knowledge. It is the whole disloyal no trust issue which gets me...I think I could handle the bi-sexual thing knowing his choice was me, and love was the winning factor but obviously there was never intention on his part to ever have a monogamous relationship and therefore I have been partnered with every Tom, Dick and Harry he has bedded for 32 Years! Further more he used no protection.....NADDA, 0...none! This angers me to no end!
It is making me crazy and the fact he is still here does too.. he says we cannot afford to be apart. He also says he does not want to leave me now because of the illnesses I am facing... I do not want his pitty....
I am stuck because of finances..but I am going to find a way to move him on....Even if I have to sell my property and downsize! I love my home land plot..almost two acres but at the same time that is not much to have but it is mine... It was my mothers...I do not want to loose the home...
Anyway... you are right about it being hard and thus my dilema...I cannot imagine not being his friend, as we have shared everything..good and bad and I accepted the things I have learned and I know its over and can never be what I had dreamed that love was supposed to be... even friendship at this stage is sucking big eggs...cause I can't stand to look at him most of the time...I feel like I needed to make more effort but he makes no effort or rare effort anyway.....
Anyway..Thanks for your comments it gives me things to think about and a new perspective also.
I really do appreciate it. Thank you!
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Karen, I would be wary of seeing your X as Gay, he had a ugly experience forced on him when young. Those things leave scars and as most victims the question may become. 'Did I want this', 'could I have avoided it' etc. Those questions can lead both you and him astray. Neither of you planned for this, I think it's just time and human fragility combined. You may yet become friends, no matter his sexual inclination(s).
So take it easy, and btw, I think it's okay to hate/feel extremly angry with him, not forever Karen, just for a little while :) Anger is there anyway, so you better let it out. After all, he did force a great change upon you both. But one step at a time Karen, and get a routine working for you, those small steps will get you happy again.
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(Sorry Karen, missed your last reply (above mine) before I wrote, but here is a 'update' correcting it, well sort of :)
Karen, you will not sell your land. That is from your mother and not to be used like that. Be honest with him and tell him to move out. Let that anger out so that he will understand. Words may not be enough here, so get angry.
He needs to move, not you.
Contact the police if nothing else helps. If he cares about you he will move.
If it's only himself he cares about, then you use what 'help' you can get. And then what I wrote above will be incorrect, as this guy in my eyes then becomes a conniving manipulating piece of sh**
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Thanks for your post..I will post.... later on this..just wanted you to know I have seen it and appreciate it..Just having a problem right now.. be back soon.
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Karen, I would be wary of seeing your X as Gay, he had a ugly experience forced on him when young. Those things leave scars and as most victims the question may become. 'Did I want this', 'could I have avoided it' etc. Those questions can lead both you and him astray. Neither of you planned for this, I think it's just time and human fragility combined. You may yet become friends, no matter his sexual inclination(s).
So take it easy, and btw, I think it's okay to hate/feel extremly angry with him, not forever Karen, just for a little while :) Anger is there anyway, so you better let it out. After all, he did force a great change upon you both. But one step at a time Karen, and get a routine working for you, those small steps will get you happy again.
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(Sorry Karen, missed your last reply (above mine) before I wrote, but here is a 'update' correcting it, well sort of :)
Karen, you will not sell your land. That is from your mother and not to be used like that. Be honest with him and tell him to move out. Let that anger out so that he will understand. Words may not be enough here, so get angry.
He needs to move, not you.
Contact the police if nothing else helps. If he cares about you he will move.
If it's only himself he cares about, then you use what 'help' you can get. And then what I wrote above will be incorrect, as this guy in my eyes then becomes a conniving manipulating piece of sh**
Yes.... I am not sure what to think of his choices as well as the choices that were hence forced onto him also. Being sexually abused as a child and teenager young adult' I do know the frustrations involved. (he differences werethat I was not abused by a person of my same sex at that time .I think that must leave different scars and different mind set also.
I have experienced hate in my life and I wil not allow that in my heart again...I have no room in my heart or life for hate of any kind...but just saying it doesn't stop the feelings I need to practice love and friendship to keep that out of my feelings for him... I will not allow it to eat me alive....anger I do have and I agree that to some extent it is ok.. but none the less I do not like being angry it makes me feel ugly inside and I really don't like it.
I do not wish to sell but if things don't get better right away I will be forced to sell.
I love this place. Thankyou for your sweet words..the really helped.
I am working on getting him out... he claims he stays to help, it is just reall difficult for him to be here.. I need to breath without feeling so torn..
it just makes it more difficult. Privacy and things like that... very complicated to say the least.
My Daughter is moving out again my son is Joining the Army active duty.my older boy...
so his siter is taking over the ren on his little house he will be here for a few weeks before he leaves. big changes again.. so many problems and upheaval in my life right now.
I am doing my best at this juncture and can only hope he will do as I have asked as soon as possible.
Thank you for your suggestions and the advice will be kept close and used when needed..Thanks so much and so sorry to have taken so long to respond ..I have been very sick this last week and extremely worried and excessively tired....I slept this afternoon for the first time in 5 days but only had four hours.. better then none..made me feel way better but I am still lagging a bit... need some more sleep.
Thanks again Yor_on.