Naked Science Forum

General Science => General Science => Topic started by: neilep on 24/07/2007 14:56:32

Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: neilep on 24/07/2007 14:56:32: Hello,

Below is a piccy of a boy with a toy !

I have labelled the two so that you can tell the difference.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv185%2Fneilep%2FDSC03200edit.jpg&hash=dccfbe86cb53c584444dd512bad25ca4)

This toy when used as shown by the boy makes your voice echo !!.........there is some echoing/reverberation stuff going on !!....

Protestations by the boy denied me the opportunity to disassemble (ie : break the toy) which I thought to be unfair actually...........anyway ,on close inspection I can see that there is no Mountain range within the toy.

So, how does this toy produce the echo that it does ?
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: paul.fr on 24/07/2007 15:12:08: Note to Carolyn: This is a boy with a toy, not a toy boy. move along nothing to see here.
Title: Re: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: kdlynn on 24/07/2007 15:17:08: are you sure there aren't any mountains in there?
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: neilep on 24/07/2007 15:19:59: There is definitely no mountains cos I could see disgruntled snowboarders with nothing to do !!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 15:27:48: Quote from: paul.fr on 24/07/2007 15:12:08
Note to Carolyn: This is a boy with a toy, not a toy boy. move along nothing to see here.

Note to Paul.. Don't you mean a "BOY TOY".. LOL
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 15:28:56: I have one of those somewhere here in a box! LOL My kids were fascinated with it. As I recall it was green!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Carolyn on 24/07/2007 15:50:54: Quote from: paul.fr on 24/07/2007 15:12:08
Note to Carolyn: This is a boy with a toy, not a toy boy. move along nothing to see here.

Hmph!!! I'm sure I have no idea what you're talking about!!! [:(!]

p.s. Why is everybody always pickin on me? [:-'(] [;)]
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 16:12:25: LOL LOL..Hee hee Cause we LUVS YA!! LOL
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: another_someone on 24/07/2007 16:31:47: Do you mean echo, or reverberate (never having used the toy myself)?
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 17:22:35: I think it is reverberate.. I am holding one I just un-boxed along with my son's Daniel Boon Hat of which I combed and hung on the wall! LOL I am now trying to see how to dismantle said, microphone! When I talk into it it does not say hello hello hello hello, but it does sound like sort of echo only the last part and very small "ooo"

LOL i know thats not helpful. when shook it sounds as if there is a coiled spring inside that is not coiled really small but large and giggly .. thats what it sounds like to me. I would expect a stiff tiny wound spring to have less movement and be stiffer so to speak. I suspect this spring if I were to guess might be 1to 1and 1/2 inches in diameter.
Title: Re: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: kdlynn on 24/07/2007 17:38:29: and now we've got a preschool teacher breaking toys... lol
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 18:10:49: Dang George Now I found a toy to play with and cant quit saying silly things into it..nor can I get apart! Just wait Kadie! Here come some pictures before I break the toy! LOL

This is the top you speak in to!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2FPicture96-1.jpg&hash=4a75ebc980995a8934375968eb2639b0)

This is the bottom of which mine is missing..(Note to kadie I did not break that part me kids did! LOL,which makes it the perfect science project eh?)LOL

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2FPicture94.jpg&hash=dd33b76ee9debdbfad4b44e495dad100)

This is a small button which is attached to what sounds like a spring!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2FPicture99.jpg&hash=d2548f03592dc4af73c1c2d33008c021)

This me pulling the button out to show you as I needed the other hand to take the picture!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2FPicture95.jpg&hash=29f7482096d39dab30ce9097b4bfaafa)

This next picture I am pointing to two slots that are open on that side of the microphone. On the other side are two more opposite those!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2FPicture97.jpg&hash=3b492e71e352bad202e20b7be6e56428)

Now I have inserted a knife inside the slot from above as there seems to be a shiny cylindrical plastic cover inside the microphone. It looked like that really pliable soft plastic that you can curve around to make things, it has a opalescent look about it! Very thin.. Well after touching I was right.. I think there is a spring inside of this which is attached to the button at the bottom!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2FPicture98.jpg&hash=805b716eaac9d7834d5f404a63d448cd)

So far that is all I know!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 18:20:56: Neil, Look at James's toy! at the bottom where his has slots without taking it apart can you see the button that is on the bottom of mine, and if so is it attached to anything? I think it must be, because why else would it pull out and spring back in, when released? mine is missing the little cage at the bottom. it also has what looks like and on off switch but it is just for looks and doesn't really work!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 18:25:09: When I pull that button and release it it send a dongawongawongawonga wong kinda sound echoing from the bottom up to the top where my ear heres it traveling up the coil like someone stuck a big bell and the residual sound travels up inside the bell.. sort of!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: neilep on 24/07/2007 19:25:10: Mine does not have a button in the bottom (though my bottom does have a button)..erhmm......you're must be the Sueprdeluxe model !!

You are right though Karen....it does reverberate and NOT echo.

Hopefully George can now provide an answer to this intriguing little device !!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Bored chemist on 24/07/2007 20:17:17: Is a preschool teacher one who is , for example, still eating breakfast or on their way to school?
Anyway, I think it's probably something like the echo described here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delay_%28audio_effect%29
If you only store a very short segment of the sound then you get a reverb effect rather than an echo.
The coiled springs could be a classic spring delay line or they might just be holding the electronics (and microphone) away from the sides to stop them getting damaged.
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: that mad man on 24/07/2007 20:34:51: Does it have a battery? if not then as it reverberates and seems to have a spring maybe its a passive spring line reverb!

A guess!

When you talk into it the sound wave hits a diaphragm that is attached to a spring that reverberates causing the diaphragm to emit and repeat the sound like a loudspeaker.

Bee

ops, a bit slow on posting that.... [;D]
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: another_someone on 24/07/2007 21:08:46: I was thinking, if it is simply reverberating, and has no battery, that it would be no more than a low frequency resonator.
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: neilep on 24/07/2007 21:31:21: It does Not have a battery
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 22:08:33: Quote from: neilep on 24/07/2007 19:25:10
Mine does not have a button in the bottom (though my bottom does have a button)..erhmm......you're must be the Sueprdeluxe model !!

You are right though Karen....it does reverberate and NOT echo.

Hopefully George can now provide an answer to this intriguing little device !!

The little cage part of yours is still in tact. Mine is broken off. I see yours has slots throughout the bottom cage part!.. Your button would be inside that part attached to the bottom of the microphone! Yes it is a short sound stored..

Tell me what part to remove first? Oh Here is what I have done so far..
I began with the bottom and used a steak knife to saw through the yellow band as follows!
(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment009.jpg&hash=42b5ce3f9faab53a5095dc0011c7383d)

Then I removed said band hoping to find another way to access the insides
by inserting steak knife under ring and breaking the glue seal all the way around and slipping ring off!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment013.jpg&hash=bc6c4b836435c397fb247dc4fb396509)

Next to my disappointment I find a sealed unit all one piece so I must now work on the top since there will be no access from the bottom without crushing it with my foot.. LOL ( which I will do in final attempt, if access is continually denied via other means) LOL
(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment011.jpg&hash=c8119114092e97d2ce20456353621b1b)
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: neilep on 24/07/2007 22:17:21: wOW Karen !!

Excellent work !!

.....and it's great to see the forum on your PC monitor in the background !!

WOW !!...you have gone above and beyond the call of duty here !!

Make sure you have a grown up whilst you use the knife Karen !!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 24/07/2007 22:42:03: Oh dear I never thought about that! I should be careful eh! I stepped on a florescent light bulb whilst retrieving this lovely item..LOL My son had dropped it from his pocket it was small and I cut my foot open in two places whilst crushing said bulb because I saw the microphone and nothing in between ..LOL much like and excited two year old! LOL.. So I am exercising caution! LOL
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 25/07/2007 01:31:40: OK here are the next steps in removing case:
Using the dremel tool to cut open both sides of the case.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment014.jpg&hash=c413878355af1e65d427014008873e8d)

1rst cut is complete!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment015.jpg&hash=697f0104fcc871cb2dad6dffdaf41479)

One side of microphone cut in half with dremel tool.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment017.jpg&hash=8696dc79cfc9b93c38901009acd057cc)

2nd side of microphone cut in half with dremel tool.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment016.jpg&hash=cd9f5c61c03ac5d7fcc3286ce52dbd62)

I now have opened the microphone and it reveals 1 plastic medicine cup type cylinder, plastic being lighter weight then a medicine cup! 1 two inch medium tensioned spring attached to the cup via a yellow button

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment018.jpg&hash=7452b5e05ef2056b47aef9d4ae33fd3a)

This is the plastic cup! LOL

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment019.jpg&hash=d5f5397fe188a9b037cd04a4e972318c)

This is the spring and cup assembly which is attached to the button on bottom of microphone.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment022.jpg&hash=b703f3545bf586f904f1bfa2d5092394)

This is just the spring and button.
(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment020.jpg&hash=19eebc25f1de1932e1947945cf2c8074)

This is upon opening it!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment018-1.jpg&hash=6d01d371dd770151a1e2e7d464d4e62d)

This is how it sits in the case.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment.jpg&hash=a1f00e32fcfd6c38f97a6c6a1b02a790)

These next two pictures if you can see show the grove which the rim of the cup sits in as the case holds it in place. the last picture shows a small half cut out hole which holds the button in place allowing the spring to be partly stretched out!

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment028.jpg&hash=51fe15a55920ad58d585c2323c6b575f)

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment029.jpg&hash=2cf56f13d8f74562316846db1f774f4c)

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2Fkarenw44%2Fexperiment030.jpg&hash=0d86d87e8c407e71a2f02e2709f6fb58)

Now you know what it looks like I still don't get it. when I talk into the cup with half a case it doesn't work so I gather it needs the case and the vents to act as some kind of ear so to speak does the cup work like a eardrum when the sound hits it then send the sound reverberating down the spring or what?
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: another_someone on 25/07/2007 03:43:39: It looks like the plastic cup is simply acting as a diaphragm, with the spring being held in tension, just as the string on a musical instrument. Your voice energises the spring, which then resonates at a low frequency, and continues to resonate for a while even after your voice ceases to energise it.
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: neilep on 25/07/2007 13:46:41: THANK YOU all for your wonderful responses....and thank you Karen too for your dedication in demosntrating the mechanics of the toy. It is a most curious thing and there's probably little rationale to it but I do feel it's weird getting what appears to be a revereberation resonating sound from something so small !

Dare I ask how anything else works ?.. [;D]
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 25/07/2007 13:56:00: Hey! It was a good Question and I had a lot of fun taking that thing apart! It kept me occupied for quite awhile yesterday! I had a lot of fun and learned something in the process.. Now if I get to go back to school with the kids I have a demo science project that I may be able to duplicate for the kids, Perhaps they can make their own microphones! Thanks Neil!

Well Maybe you can ask about how a refriderator works or a gas stove?? I have a dead one of each! LOL
Title: Re: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: kdlynn on 25/07/2007 15:14:08: your new stove and your fridge broke?! karen... please come nowhere near my appliances. i just got new ones of most of them. lol. the computer is the only thing still broken, and i'm enjoying having no internet bill to pay...
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: Karen W. on 25/07/2007 15:19:19: NO these are the old ones that Robert has not removed from the carport yet! LOL Why not dismantle them first? LOL

Problem is I think I have accidentally ruined my new small tv! Will explain in new topic!!
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: that mad man on 25/07/2007 18:30:37: Wow, top marks for your effort! [;D]

Looks like I was right....hehe
Title: How Does This Boy make this Toy Echo ?
Post by: neilep on 25/07/2007 19:00:05: Quote from: that mad man on 25/07/2007 18:30:37
Wow, top marks for your effort! [;D]

Looks like I was right....hehe

You were right !!....you're the tops !!