Naked Science Forum
On the Lighter Side => That CAN'T be true! => Topic started by: 4getmenot on 24/07/2006 20:24:52
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When we r young we find a first "love" and we REALLY believe we love that person...yet we get a little older and decide that another person is loved more or differently and get with them...and this continues through our lives....does it mean that the first love was not really love? or does love change into other things? does it mean that the first love was not really love at all but that the last love was??? or was all of them really love? and if they all really were love then if u loved them y r they no longer part of your life????hmmm. what is love and how do u know it is real?????
k
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This is a question I have asked myself since I was 10 years old. I then came to the conclusion that love is a form of self delusion, and I am not sure to this day if I have a better answer than that.
Ofcourse, self delusion can be a very powerful and potent force, and can even cure some illnesses.
OK, I suppose the question of love is a very diverse one, since the word has been used to describe about half the human emotions one can be susceptible to. In a sense, yes, it is a delusion, but it is also part of the illusion by which we create our place in our world, and by which we view how we relate the people closest to us. In a sense, it is less important to us what it is, than that it provides the binding force that emotionally binds us to our closest points within our society, the people upon whom we choose to depend the greatest. It is our imagined safety net (whether it actually works like that or not is another matter) that allows us to take the greatest risks with a few people. Without it, we would not dare to take those risks.
George
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love is not real. no one loves you.
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when i have watched differnt shows about it, some say that......that love is a selfish thing, no one "really" oves another but for what that person makes" you " feel and claim as love. It is a good feeling you get to be around someone else that you call love...saying you love someone can be called false i guess because really what you are saying is " i love the way you make ME feel" therefore love yourself only right? or what someone can do for you or make you feel?
k
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Interesting point....4getmenot...
"Lo" Loretta
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What does it mean to be selfish or selfless.
Whatever love is, or is not, if both people feel good about it, then is it not both at once selfish and selfless for both of them. It is only if one person feels good and the other is made to feel bad that you can ask who is being selfish and who is being selfless.
George
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To love someone is different than to love a feeling or even just an image, and voice... You should see a person and their parts. Character, do you love it? Will, what is it about and their feelings and mind and heart too?
To love it means manners, so good manners, unselfishness, not self centred objectives and self interest only or at all. It involves kindness and patience in committment... I read 1Cor13.
It inovlves presence of mind, knowing the past and future, it has intelligence. If he is with a girl than to attract him is self centred in one angle and a misgiving generosity in another angle, to him.
If you have a first love, you could leave with him a piece of your soul, to varying extents, a lot if it involves sex.
Then your second love has a division too. Short of ideal, possibly conflicting.
Love can be possessive.
Lust can seem as love. It perhaps shows generaous affection but does not really care. A lustful person may lie though... really self centred.
Love involves committment so to leave the first love is not ideal. To take a second can possibly be cruel to the first and selfish to him.
You can hurt your love. Contradict it. You can be cruel.
Love is more than a feeling. Loving thought and discernemnt and committment should be. Use your mind and strength to avoid selfishness and cruelty.
Choose love, and think about how and who to love. Be faithful.
Titanscape
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After reading this, I want to fall in love again! LOL Thanks Bren!
"Lo" Loretta
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when i have watched differnt shows about it, some say that......that love is a selfish thing, no one "really" oves another but for what that person makes" you " feel and claim as love. It is a good feeling you get to be around someone else that you call love...saying you love someone can be called false i guess because really what you are saying is " i love the way you make ME feel" therefore love yourself only right? or what someone can do for you or make you feel?
k
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Interesting point....4getmenot...
"Lo" Loretta
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What does it mean to be selfish or selfless.
Whatever love is, or is not, if both people feel good about it, then is it not both at once selfish and selfless for both of them. It is only if one person feels good and the other is made to feel bad that you can ask who is being selfish and who is being selfless.
George
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To love someone is different than to love a feeling or even just an image, and voice... You should see a person and their parts. Character, do you love it? Will, what is it about and their feelings and mind and heart too?
To love it means manners, so good manners, unselfishness, not self centred objectives and self interest only or at all. It involves kindness and patience in committment... I read 1Cor13.
It inovlves presence of mind, knowing the past and future, it has intelligence. If he is with a girl than to attract him is self centred in one angle and a misgiving generosity in another angle, to him.
If you have a first love, you could leave with him a piece of your soul, to varying extents, a lot if it involves sex.
Then your second love has a division too. Short of ideal, possibly conflicting.
Love can be possessive.
Lust can seem as love. It perhaps shows generaous affection but does not really care. A lustful person may lie though... really self centred.
Love involves committment so to leave the first love is not ideal. To take a second can possibly be cruel to the first and selfish to him.
You can hurt your love. Contradict it. You can be cruel.
Love is more than a feeling. Loving thought and discernemnt and committment should be. Use your mind and strength to avoid selfishness and cruelty.
Choose love, and think about how and who to love. Be faithful.
Titanscape
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After reading this, I want to fall in love again! LOL Thanks Bren!
"Lo" Loretta
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Originally posted by another_someone
What does it mean to be selfish or selfless.
Whatever love is, or is not, if both people feel good about it, then is it not both at once selfish and selfless for both of them. It is only if one person feels good and the other is made to feel bad that you can ask who is being selfish and who is being selfless.
I totally agree with George.
Love you lots
Helena xxx
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Bravo little Helena!
"Lo" Loretta
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Why, thank you ma'am.
Love you lots
Helena xxx
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You are welcome little Helena!!!
"Lo" Loretta
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I must've been away when it was dished out LOL
Love you lots
Helena xxx
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yepperdoodle...
"Lo" Loretta
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quote:
Originally posted by 4getmenot
When we r young we find a first "love" and we REALLY believe we love that person...yet we get a little older and decide that another person is loved more or differently and get with them...and this continues through our lives....does it mean that the first love was not really love? or does love change into other things? does it mean that the first love was not really love at all but that the last love was??? or was all of them really love? and if they all really were love then if u loved them y r they no longer part of your life????hmmm. what is love and how do u know it is real?????
k
Each love is different. No two loves are ever the same. they can not be...because it is different people who we are loving.
My first love was incredible....I had of course already poured out an abundance of love already to my family but this love...this First love was a new type of love...and that in itself makes it extra special....though, it does not set it aside as a love that one would never feel again.....the very fact that it's just the first is the uniqueness about it.
This first special love becomes for a lot of people not too long after puberty.....your body is literally oozing with the need to love...and to demonstrate that love....so...when the first love hits you...boy...does it hit you hard. And YES, it IS love...in every essence of the meaning of the word I have never found myself more torn to tears then the experience of this first love....so many landmark barriers may be fulfilled and accomplished in this first love.
The problem with the first love (s) is age...we do feel the love but we are not yet mature enough to deal with it adequately...so many mixed emotions going through your head for the very first time. First loves are notoriously fraught with short sharp shocks to reality...
This of course does not mean that love gets easier as one gets older....it can get quite a lot harder in fact.
Love DOES change....as mentioned....the love you have for one person is unique to that one person...it can not be ignored and will only be like that for that particular individual.
What is love ?....is that all ? [:)]
I don't think anyone really knows....there are ways to define the consequences perhaps...the symptoms maybe......like...when all you can do think of that person....when your every waking moment is monopolised by the thought of that person to the degree when the journey continues into your dreaming world....it is an intense emotional attraction on a scale that is far removed from what you may feel for a friend.........However, these are the symptoms of falling in love.....establishing an atmosphere of complete trust and total understanding....one where you know you can tell that person anything but at the same time feel happy to retain some privacy of your own....
...getting inside someones head to the degree that you know what they are thinking....and likewise of course.....this is love...it is also familiarity and if one is in love then one would know what the difference is.
Is it an illusion ?...only in that it's not a thing that can be held or seen as a separate entity in it's own right....but when the heart beat stronger and faster and the adrenalin begins to rush...when the skin starts to perspire and urge for closeness overtakes then this is where love is NOT an illusion but a manifestation within yourself.
All your loves ARE apart of your life....the people who shared that love may no longer be there but the love you had will always be. It does not necessarily mean then that if you were to meet that person again later in life that one could just so easily run away with them...no no no...for they will be different and so would you be...but it does happen...and it is very easy for love to rekindle the spark...though for some...it may just be a hankering to an earlier time and one may find that the spark is no longer there...but the memory of the love is
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I really do not know what love is...after all it just a term that is used in a language to communicate an emotional state.
But everyone who is a member of a family should already know a what a form of love is...look to your parents, your siblings, your children...how do you FEEL about them ?..you love them don't you ?
Men are the same as women, just inside out !
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I don't know how i feel about them today...I could not have a bit of privacy after I awakened and in hopes of more sleep...aagghh! lol
"Lo" Loretta
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most definatly....
k
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quote:
Originally posted by moonfire
I don't know how i feel about them today...I could not have a bit of privacy after I awakened and in hopes of more sleep...aagghh! lol
"Lo" Loretta
surely there was a time when you have loved ?[:)]
Men are the same as women, just inside out !
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quote:
Originally posted by 4getmenot
most definatly....
k
...are you saying you have no love for your family K ?
Men are the same as women, just inside out !
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LOL Yes, there was a time that I loved...but I loved and lost...roulette is nothing fun in the game of life...I love my family and only wish they would give me time to clear my head and give me a moment or two besides hearing me get up and then bombard my bedroom!!!
"Lo" Loretta
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Seems like the busiest time in the bathroom is when I want to take a bath.....that just seems to always work out when everyone just wants to come in and talk...why is that???lolool...
k
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You have kids right K? Yep! Same here...kid still bugs me when I am in the bathroom...he is 19 this Saturday! LOL
"Lo" Loretta
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lol....19??? yep, well i guess it doesn't stop then??? so i guess i CAN'T look forward to it getting any better...lol
k
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Psssst, K...I don't want my kid to see this so I am going to let you in on a secret...it is when they have moved out...LOCK the door, quick before they change their mind...awww, bubblebaths, candlelight, mozart, vin, and a daydream or two...oh, darn..my mom lives in my condo too! Awww, send her on a vacation...and enjoy peace and quiet...oh, crudola...there is a cat who needs to be fed...glaring at me as if he knows I want to be left alone...cage him up in birdcage with Tweetie pie...let the strongest one win on the patio of course...back to my fantasy...sorry have to go...phone is ringing! Drats! Can't everyone leave me alone for a moment or two???
"Lo" Loretta
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About Love, (by the way, this is the most important thing of life, to me) I feel there are many (maybe infinite?) kinds of it; when someone says, for example that, love between 14 y.o. boy and girl is only "childish" love, I don't agree with them. Can we judge what Love really is? Can we judge other's people feelings?
I was 26 when I fell in love for a girl the first time. Unfortunately, her intentions were not what she made me believe they were. She was much more experienced than me in love affairs (and also intelligent and smart). When she left me, and it was the worst experience of my life, she said I was didn't "really" love her, I was only idealizing her image. The reality is that she didn't really love me, she only wanted someone to play with, but I realized it only some months later (it was impossible for me to accept this idea immediately).
I don't think love can be something objective; if it was, would it still be love?
Indeed, I have never been in love so deep again in my life; I would like to repeat an experience of that kind (but with the right person, this time).
Love to you all.
Alberto.
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quote:
Originally posted by lightarrow
About Love, (by the way, this is the most important thing of life, to me) I feel there are many (maybe infinite?) kinds of it; when someone says, for example that, love between 14 y.o. boy and girl is only "childish" love, I don't agree with them. Can we judge what Love really is? Can we judge other's people feelings?
As I said above, the word love is used to describe a very substantial proportion of the range of human emotions.
I assume what people are mostly focussing on is romantic love.
Even within that context, there is no reason why anyone who has gone through puberty cannot feel the emotions of romantic love (in past centuries, people would even be marrying at that age).
quote:
I was 26 when I fell in love for a girl the first time. Unfortunately, her intentions were not what she made me believe they were. She was much more experienced than me in love affairs (and also intelligent and smart). When she left me, and it was the worst experience of my life, she said I was didn't "really" love her, I was only idealizing her image. The reality is that she didn't really love me, she only wanted someone to play with, but I realized it only some months later (it was impossible for me to accept this idea immediately).
I do agree that there is a naivety about a first love that can never be repeated on subsequent occasions.
I think love does depend on an element of idealisation, but the question is whether the two parties are willing to co-operate in perpetuating that fiction.
George
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so all love is real? Only as you grow it changes and becomes a diffeent kind of love? so again..how do you know which one is the "THE" one?
k
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quote:
Originally posted by 4getmenot
so all love is real? Only as you grow it changes and becomes a diffeent kind of love? so again..how do you know which one is the "THE" one?
Because you believe it.
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quote:
Originally posted by 4getmenot
so all love is real? Only as you grow it changes and becomes a diffeent kind of love? so again..how do you know which one is the "THE" one?
k
Is there a 'THE ONE' - I don't think so. It is often a case of someone who is approximately right who just happens to be at the right time and the right place, and then both parties agree that they will put the work in to make the relationship work and grow. It could just as easily have been any one of a million other people, but they were not there at the time.
Clearly, there are many people who would be the wrong one, but I don't think there is only one person who could have been the right one.
George
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I call it the "acceptable one" not Mr. Right, not Mr. Perfect...my expectations would of course, set someone up to fail...
"Lo" Loretta
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quote:
Originally posted by another_someone
quote:
Originally posted by 4getmenot
so all love is real? Only as you grow it changes and becomes a diffeent kind of love? so again..how do you know which one is the "THE" one?
k
Is there a 'THE ONE' - I don't think so. It is often a case of someone who is approximately right who just happens to be at the right time and the right place, and then both parties agree that they will put the work in to make the relationship work and grow. It could just as easily have been any one of a million other people, but they were not there at the time.
Clearly, there are many people who would be the wrong one, but I don't think there is only one person who could have been the right one.
George
so when you meet someone and get that feeling yo have "never" felt before not sure what the feeling is and you assume it is love at first sight...it could have been the same feeling had it been any one of those other million people?? it was just that that person was "there" at the "right" time??/
k
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I think the naivety of a first love IS repeated many times...One can just be plain predisposed to a naive nature...so. not just in matters of the heart but in matters of all....in fact..unless one Knows they are experiencing true love I think we are all naive in our perception of it.
The thing is...love is such a complex subject fraught with many avenues and branches of extremes and subtleties that no one really ever does know the definition....and yet....as Humans....boy do we like to talk about it...write about it..sing about it...in fact...a lot of the human experience is spent in matters of love...art..literature..philosophy...science forums....
...except....well...I think only you know when you are in love....
.......if you have to question it ? ..well..maybe you still could be in love but not realise it..........
.......Like has been said here ...love is subjective...but then so is every other emotion you can think of....even our senses are subjective and unless you experience love (and I am referring to the romantic love) then THAT is when you find your own definition of love is.
Some people shy away from love....they don't want it...perhaps they have suffered greatly because of love....maybe they do not wish the loss of control...of their individuality...
...for some Love is a trap....love is a cage...it's a loss of freedom...concentration...a madness !
It's bizarre that such a beautiful thing can cause so many extremes in other emotions too...
..can any one of us ever be sure of any feelings that we have ?
Men are the same as women, just inside out !
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quote:
After reading this, I want to fall in love again! LOL Thanks Bren!
hey, what you doin saturday "lo" [:D] [}:)]
all in one place
http://www.p-r-travel.co.uk
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quote:
Originally posted by time-cop
quote:
After reading this, I want to fall in love again! LOL Thanks Bren!
hey, what you doin saturday "lo" [:D] [}:)]
all in one place
http://www.p-r-travel.co.uk
I don't know about LO...but I'm free on Saturday !! *blows him a kiss* [:D]
Men are the same as women, just inside out !
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i`ll book a limo, and motel (https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi48.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ff238%2Frayhinton56%2F36_1_11.gif&hash=e7e20375c55a98c3d10a58846d0920f6)
all in one place
http://www.p-r-travel.co.uk
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Oh my! I see that there are cops and robbers loosely running around here...stealing some words and funning with me..oh, babe..this saturday night I can be free...if you can lose Denny, we can run around the fountains and play...hehe Neilsy, you are such a thief! LOL Okay I will share him with you...or do you want to come out and play too?
"Lo" Loretta
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I hear a party starting...and i "love" it...lol
k
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K, there is plenty to go around...don't you feel love in the air now...awwwww, scratch that, it is only a fantasy! Never wake me up out of it!
"Lo" Loretta
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lol....i see that and i promise not to...(for now) he he
k
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I hear a party starting...and i "love" it...lol
k
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K, there is plenty to go around...don't you feel love in the air now...awwwww, scratch that, it is only a fantasy! Never wake me up out of it!
"Lo" Loretta
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lol....i see that and i promise not to...(for now) he he
k
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Here you go K! Something special I wrote on a few minutes ago thinking about the way my perspective is...ick! LOL
When we fall in love with someone or make a new friend, we sometimes see that person in a glowing light. Their good qualities dominate the foreground of our perception and their negative qualities. They just don't seem to have any. This temporary state of grace is commonly known as putting someone on a pedestal. Often times we put spiritual leaders and our gurus on pedestals. We have all done this to someone at one time or another, and as long as we remember that no one is actually "perfect," the pedestal phase of a relationship can be enjoyed for what it is-a phase. It's when we actually believe our own projection that troubles arise.
Everyone has problems, flaws, and blind spots, just as we do. When we entertain the illusion that someone is perfect, we don't allow them room to be human, so when they make an error in judgment or act in contradiction to our idea of perfection, we become disillusioned. We may get angry or distance ourselves in response. In the end, they are not to blame for the fact that we idealized them. Granted, they may have enjoyed seeing themselves as perfect through our eyes, but we are the ones who chose to believe an illusion. If you go through this process enough times, you learn that no one is perfect. We are all a combination of divine and human qualities and we all struggle. When we treat the people we love with this awareness, we actually allow for a much greater intimacy than when we held them aloft on an airy throne. The moment you see through your idealized projection is the moment you begin to see your loved one as he or she truly is.
We cannot truly connect with a person when we idealize them. In life, there are no pedestals-we are all walking on the same ground together. When we realize this, we can own our own divinity and our humanity. This is the key to balance and wholeness within ourselves and our relationships.
"Lo" Loretta
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quote:
Originally posted by moonfire
...The moment you see through your idealized projection is the moment you begin to see your loved one as he or she truly is...
I don't agree. I accept the fact that the way we see another person can change, you could say "it evolves". But we can never see how our loved one really is. Objectivity doesn't apply here.
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love is bidirectional feature of a living being as the real love is seen when there is reciprocation of love/.
lets keep trying the untried since the birth of science innovations have been like toy but their impacts have rocked the world
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quote:
Originally posted by lightarrow
quote:
Originally posted by moonfire
...The moment you see through your idealized projection is the moment you begin to see your loved one as he or she truly is...
I don't agree. I accept the fact that the way we see another person can change, you could say "it evolves". But we can never see how our loved one really is. Objectivity doesn't apply here.
This is probably true of anything – we only see things filtered through our emotions and our expectations – which is why eye witness reports are always so unreliable as objective evidence.
George
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quote:
Originally posted by thayo
love is bidirectional feature of a living being as the real love is seen when there is reciprocation of love
Is it?
It is very difficult to sustain love if it is not reciprocated, but a parent may continue to love their child even if it is not reciprocated.
George
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quote:
Originally posted by lightarrow
quote:
Originally posted by moonfire
...The moment you see through your idealized projection is the moment you begin to see your loved one as he or she truly is...
I don't agree. I accept the fact that the way we see another person can change, you could say "it evolves". But we can never see how our loved one really is. Objectivity doesn't apply here.
You can never see how your loved one really is??? hmm, true one one side of the coin, but is it really evolving??? I think it is the same as this person really is the same as before, but changed for a moment and returns to whom they really are...they have not changed. Just my perception which maybe jaded at the moment...
"Lo" Loretta
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Loretta, human beings could changed but the environment where geniune love prevails, it stands to be invulnerable, appreciate this with me
lets keep trying the untried since the birth of science innovations have been like toy but their impacts have rocked the world
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I love,Love,and know nobody anywhere that doesnt like or enjoy some form of love. I married when I was 20 to a man 27, we had dated 1 year and lived together one year. We thought we were so in love. And indeed we loved each other and still do, but there was never passion or real Romantic love with the exception of the 1rst year that spark and romance that some need just wasn't there and never has been.
The minds comming together in mutual respect and like. I was never giddy, but nervous yes as experiences in my past had left me nervous with men in general. We spent all our time together but rarely talking. Mostly cuddling and being affectionate. All great but we never got inside each others head as one should do that when they find their true love. To this day 25 years into my marraige my husband cannot go out and order a meal or buy a gift or even remember my birthday or our wedding Anniversary. It does me a disservice that in all these years, he does not know me any better then that.
Someone who knows you and can say honey please don't cry, and not even be able to hear you or know from seeing that you have begun to cry...someone that knows your heart and and knows how you are going to react to something before you say it....its really extrordinary when you think about it... that doesnt come from years of being together, It simply comes from true love and understanding of your partner. Knowing whats in there hearts because you have taken the time to listen and and hear what lies inside of them.... Everyone has their own private thoughts and we can never know every one, but we indeed , like the seasons have our own way of developing feelings of love evolving regularly. Changing like the seasons love has many faces and it comes in so many ways to each of us. We must be faithful to our hearts. For if we don't we become bitter sad humans and pain lives deep inside of bitterness and eats away at you untill you have lost your self respect and repect for others too. You loose your focus your own values and sight of your dreams. Everday functioning becomes difficult silence becomes a prison and a dronning reminder of your unhappiness.. and heartache.
Karen
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quote:
Originally posted by thayo
Loretta, human beings could changed but the environment where geniune love prevails, it stands to be invulnerable, appreciate this with me
lets keep trying the untried since the birth of science innovations have been like toy but their impacts have rocked the world
I do appreciate this with you and this is an interesting thought here Thayo! Thanks![:)]
"Lo" Loretta
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Wow! Karen, that is deep! You described it very well as a marriage of friendly convenience. I know love, have had love, but guess I cannot hold onto love. For whatever reason, I think unrealistically some of us live in a fantasy world surrounding it...I don't believe in fairy tails and maybe my view is tainted because of my recent past relationship...but I go in with realistic expectations and when I view others from the outside, things look so perfect, so magical, and more...but I still wonder what is really behind that door if it is as true as they say...oh, well, if not then it is a lie they have to live with...
"Lo" Loretta
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I love,Love,and know nobody anywhere that doesnt like or enjoy some form of love. I married when I was 20 to a man 27, we had dated 1 year and lived together one year. We thought we were so in love. And indeed we loved each other and still do, but there was never passion or real Romantic love with the exception of the 1rst year that spark and romance that some need just wasn't there and never has been.
The minds comming together in mutual respect and like. I was never giddy, but nervous yes as experiences in my past had left me nervous with men in general. We spent all our time together but rarely talking. Mostly cuddling and being affectionate. All great but we never got inside each others head as one should do that when they find their true love. To this day 25 years into my marraige my husband cannot go out and order a meal or buy a gift or even remember my birthday or our wedding Anniversary. It does me a disservice that in all these years, he does not know me any better then that.
Someone who knows you and can say honey please don't cry, and not even be able to hear you or know from seeing that you have begun to cry...someone that knows your heart and and knows how you are going to react to something before you say it....its really extrordinary when you think about it... that doesnt come from years of being together, It simply comes from true love and understanding of your partner. Knowing whats in there hearts because you have taken the time to listen and and hear what lies inside of them.... Everyone has their own private thoughts and we can never know every one, but we indeed , like the seasons have our own way of developing feelings of love evolving regularly. Changing like the seasons love has many faces and it comes in so many ways to each of us. We must be faithful to our hearts. For if we don't we become bitter sad humans and pain lives deep inside of bitterness and eats away at you untill you have lost your self respect and repect for others too. You loose your focus your own values and sight of your dreams. Everday functioning becomes difficult silence becomes a prison and a dronning reminder of your unhappiness.. and heartache.
Karen
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quote:
Originally posted by thayo
Loretta, human beings could changed but the environment where geniune love prevails, it stands to be invulnerable, appreciate this with me
lets keep trying the untried since the birth of science innovations have been like toy but their impacts have rocked the world
I do appreciate this with you and this is an interesting thought here Thayo! Thanks![:)]
"Lo" Loretta
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Wow! Karen, that is deep! You described it very well as a marriage of friendly convenience. I know love, have had love, but guess I cannot hold onto love. For whatever reason, I think unrealistically some of us live in a fantasy world surrounding it...I don't believe in fairy tails and maybe my view is tainted because of my recent past relationship...but I go in with realistic expectations and when I view others from the outside, things look so perfect, so magical, and more...but I still wonder what is really behind that door if it is as true as they say...oh, well, if not then it is a lie they have to live with...
"Lo" Loretta
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IN deed It is. I can no longer live with it. I am not happy. I will stay but not under pretense. I know feelings are bad both sides I just would like to salvage the friendship!!
Karen
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Wow! You are good! I am trying to at least get a friendship from Denny, but after having several talks he cannot accept anything less in our relationship than to be together...aagghh!
"Lo" Loretta
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That is what I fear the most as I can't keep this up much more!
Karen
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wow...
k
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yep...sad, as I know i will truly miss his friendship, but we cannot mix oil and water
"Lo" Loretta
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Did I offend you K? I hope not. Sorry more then you wanted to know?
Karen
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I know things will be tense, he said before he left this week, plan out four hours for saterday ok!! What is with that?
Loretta, I feel for you and Denny, I know this has been very hard and I too feel the same. 25 years is alot of time to just let go.. Thing is it isn't sudden the letting go has been happening since he cheated. He started the process and it has just taken me all these years to give up, I tried getting him to see a councelor , to talk about our problems, he said what problems we get along great! He has blinders on. He thinks the only problem we have ever had was his infidelity, but thats not true.. that only was the surface. he was unhappy he says he wasn't but you don't just go seeking love somewhere else if you are so happy! It doesnt work like that! Problems like not ever talking never saying goodmorning , goodnight honey, orI love you... Having to prod with a cattle prod to elicit the right response, I may as well set him up to a shock collar.. who wants to live with that where you constantly have to ask your sweetheart to love you.. my husband stepped out because his heart was never fully in our marraige. He wanted sex a companion when he came home a friend. I was young and thought that was what love was.. I even remember thinking am I in love shouldn't I feel something else. Nope I thought we have lived together for a year have a child comming and that must be that we are like old married couples.... man what a joke.Should have slammed the brakes on then! what was I thinking? Not much I think!~ I hope there is still hope to keep a friendship with him as he is a good man however misguided. I am not perfect either and it takes two to make or break a marraige. So we are both responsible. I just have to find a way to be able to live with myself and keep his heart safe too. He is my friend always has been!
Karen
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I understand Karen,it is so sad. It is a difficult decision to make...but like myself, I have to break it off completely as I know his terms...I cannot accept it and he cannot accept mine..
"Lo" Loretta
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I am proud that you have set your mind and are being firm about your decision.. I just wish maybe that I had not waited 25 years... we both could have had a happier life... but I really don't regreat , as I have three of the most beautiful children whom I love... and they do infact have his best qualities as well well as my worst! Some combo huh? There are things that have come to past but I need to know that was the way it was supposed to be for every thing there is a reason and I believe I have learned a great deal about my self as well as him and I.. It is a mistake to think that people don't change , because they do change.. The old qualities might still be there, but they have evolved in mind spirit and in many ways that are beyond understanding except to say life experiences change everyone and you cannot expect that to be any different.. Accepting all the new changes, now that's the trick, isn't it?
Karen
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Yepperdoodle...it sure is! My biggest issue is with my family learning to accept my decision was right for me as this was a relationship I would've had to live with the rest of my life...grant it, it would've been interesting trying to juggle time to live on both sides of the other world even though he has told me he is willing to give up his father's estate and come over here permanently he doesn't realize it is not enough...it wasn't an issue with location for me..it was on a whole different realm...as we really already had that worked out...?
"Lo" Loretta
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So sorry Loretta I wish things could have been different, Love is strange sometimes and I guess things just happen because they do... People change Priorities are different people all need different levels of love. some need passsion fire romance some need a friend only or a companion.. Others who knows, Love is so funny and yet its so very important.. Even if the love you choose is to love your self and respect that, for some thts monumental!!
Karen
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I hear ya! Yep...I prefer passion, but companionship is awesome with it!
"Lo" Loretta
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Well, I hope everything goes the way its supposed to for everyone and at least if things are resolved one way or the other, life will become much less complicated..
Karen
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It is and it will! It has no choice! It has to leave! I am a bit mad as I had a bit of manipulation with my cellie tonight...sorry if I sound a bit pissed....okay, I am! No cellie as he wants to see who has called or is calling me...ooooo...awww, I feel better now!
"Lo" Loretta
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So sorry Loretta. I guess he is really wearing out the welcome!! YIKES>>> Well let me know I would be happy to call you up babe, hows about a whittle date!!HEE HEE HEE!! WANNA SHAKE THINGS UP!!LOL Really it will be alright hang tough soon soon soon!! COUNT TO TEN, then do it again! Breath deeply, no hyperventilating... HA HA, never works for me, usually to upset to breath deep!
Karen
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Yep...he is in his desperate mode...but it is working against him. so sad. LOL You are so funny and thanks for making me smile! I have counted to 500 in French and German....I am about to start in Spanish...uno, kidding..If I breathe, someone is going to have to call 911 as Loretta will definitely turn blue from holding it in too deeply!
"Lo" Loretta
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Oh Loretta, I am so sorry, now tell me about Niagra falls? was were the falls spectacular? could you feel the spay of water in your face!! Hey Lo, write me a poem!! Make it Good I will do one for you..Ready set Go::
Karen
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You are so funny...yes, Niagra Falls is very refreshing...with the water splashing upon your face and if you ride the queen boat, you will need to wear a raincoat! You will see prisms through the spray and discover you have just dreamt all day! Karen you are the pride and joy and I am so glad that you are rather cute and coy! What else can I say, that can express it anymore than a Niagra spray! You will have to go and see it...and go along with all the rest to be it! There you go and it is especially written to you by only one Lo!
"Lo" Loretta
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Geesh, I am Blushing that was cute, very nice Loretta, You feeling bettta??
Karen
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yeah, home and cell with flowers and note is on my bed...but i am still disappointed...geez, I hate jealousy...
"Lo" Loretta
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Oh Loretta, I am so sorry! Try to relax huh! Love yo friend!!
Karen
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I will...I still haven't emailed you yet
"Lo" Loretta
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Nope you havent I have 14 new
Penquins for you!
Karen
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LOL I need those penguins now...LOL
"Lo" Loretta
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WHO WHOO whats up .. there all yours!! I made the changes we discussed how does that look I hope I got enough removed to be of protective qualities...!
Karen
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I give you a thumbs up...it is rather interesting to read now...lol
"Lo" Loretta
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Yeah, I guess it wasn't before eh?LOL
Karen
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quote:
Originally posted by Karen W.
Did I offend you K? I hope not. Sorry more then you wanted to know?
Karen
huh? nope..not tha i can remember anyway..lol
k
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in my opinion, "love" is an elaborate term for no more than attraction, coupled with compatibility. it is all based around the mating instinct, finding a partner that can spawn healthy offspring, but that will stay around to support you and them. two people create dependancies on one another so great that separation is catachlysmic[8)]
"Never tell the same lie twice."
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Very emotional Xule...sniff, sniff..such insight! LOL
"Just Me, Lo" Loretta
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There is a lady sweet and kind,
Was never face so pleased my mind;
I did but see her passing by,
And yet I love her till I die.
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beautiful!
"Just Me, Lo" Loretta
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Love means a lot of things to a lot of people. The Greeks had it a lot clearer than we did, with 'eros' - sexual love, 'philos' - virtuous love (like for friends or brothers), 'storge' - family love (like parents and children), and 'agape' - unconditional love.
Chemically, love is identified, sometimes, as vassopressin (Cys-Tyr-Phe-Gln-Asn-Cys-Pro-Arg-Gly-NH2), a protein found in mamals that dictates monogomy in social relationships and makes your kidneys hold back water out of urine. ?
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quote:
Originally posted by bostjan
The Greeks had it a lot clearer than we did, with 'eros' - sexual love, 'philos' - virtuous love (like for friends or brothers), 'storge' - family love (like parents and children), and 'agape' - unconditional love.
This sounds a very sensible distinction to make.
Maybe it is an indication that the Greeks took a greater interest in such things than we do, that they had more words for it.
quote:
Chemically, love is identified, sometimes, as vassopressin (Cys-Tyr-Phe-Gln-Asn-Cys-Pro-Arg-Gly-NH2), a protein found in mamals that dictates monogomy in social relationships and makes your kidneys hold back water out of urine. ?
Does this mean that the amount of water in your partners urine will be a predictor of how unfaithful they will be [}:)]
George
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Yes, I agree with you on the greeks knowing a tadbit more as they were sensual beings, ritualistic, as well as very competitive...
George good point!
"Just Me, Lo" Loretta
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I believe it does allude to that conclusion. [;)] I heard a rumor that there was a nasal spray some scientists gave people, then had both a control group and the treated group answer questions from an attractive young person of the opposite sex. Supposedly, the people who were sprayed with vassopressin were far more candid and trusting than the control group.
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did it have a drug in it or something?
k
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Umm yeah, it had vassopressin. I have not seen the literature, though.
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That i svery beautiful Steven.. How have you been?
Karen
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Love! What a beautiful, meaningful word if you have experienced it in any way. Hollow for the one who doesn't know if it's real or not.
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Love! What a beautiful, meaningful word if you have experienced it in any way. Hollow for the one who doesn't know if it's real or not.
This is true..