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Author Topic: Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?  (Read 8641 times)

another_someone

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #25 on: 01/10/2007 02:07:06 »
There is one case where the issue of two observers can interact with each others observation without directly communicating between them, and that is with the EPR paradox (i.e. making observation (e.g. of spin) of two entangled particles that have been entangled).
 

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Offline dkv

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #26 on: 01/10/2007 06:19:25 »
Shrunk
I repeat once again:
1.We are made up of associations which defines the expected constitution of world.
2.The associtions were learned or taught by system when you were young and not so intelligent.
3.The constitution relates events and your senses.
4.The cat dead or alive is driven by such associations.
So much on the nature of laws and its relation with observer.
=================================
Quantum Theory says there are chances of finding cat dead or alive:
1.As I said this expectation is driven by past association.
2.The outcome is driven by past knowledge of outcomes.
3.If more number of people know the story then more likely it is to be true.
4.Therefore the wave function does not manifest in independent form if Observers share the History.
5.IF the Observer is a kind one and has no desired purpose of demonstrating the "magic" it to the world then he can achieve singular validations. He can in other words discover a different physical constitution. Such new observations break the past associations ... but now he doesnt have any way to demonstrate it to anyone.

In other words it is a number of observer dependent reality.
For a Group or Groups the laws "appear" to be different and for individuals the same constitution appears different.
All manifestations of past(which defines what is real or not)come out of one grand constitution and are equally true.

Happy?
 

lyner

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #27 on: 01/10/2007 16:00:46 »
If we refer to the original thought experiment, surely the CAT would know whether it were alive or not. Hence the  quantum problem is resolved.
I don't like cats anyway - they crap on my garden and they kill lots of nice birds.
If I did the experiment, I'd forget about the fancy bit of quantum equipment - just stick with the Cyanide tablet. Oh you brute!
 

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #28 on: 01/10/2007 16:25:27 »
Shrunk
dkv - I really don't know what you are trying to say. QM has nothing to do with expetations or levels of intelligence. And how can the outcome be driven by past knowledge of outcomes? If every outcome you've known says the cat is alive, that does not mean the cat is alive this time. All you can say is that your expectation of the outcome is driven by knowledge of past outcomes.

As for your assertion that the more people who know a story, the more likely it is to be true - that is absurd. Urban myths gain status by the number of people who believe them. Millions of people know the story of Harry Potter. Does that mean it must be true?

And what do you mean by "If the Observer is a kind one and has no desired purpose of demonstrating the "magic" it to the world then he can achieve singular validations. He can in other words discover a different physical constitution. Such new observations break the past associations ... but now he doesnt have any way to demonstrate it to anyone."? I just don't understand what you are trying to say.
 

another_someone

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #29 on: 02/10/2007 00:33:40 »
If we refer to the original thought experiment, surely the CAT would know whether it were alive or not. Hence the  quantum problem is resolved.

The cat (not sure about a CAT - what has Computer Aided Tomography got to do with it) would be the initial observer, but ultimately the final observer is you, and you do not know whether the cat is alive or dead until it communicates this fact to you (it either jumps up and scratches your eyes out for the dastardly experiment you subjected it to, or it is lying there with its legs in the air - either way, it has communicated to you whether the particle was emitted or not).
 

paul.fr

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #30 on: 02/10/2007 00:42:53 »
I'm going to hate myself for asking this, but how and does the cat know it's alive.
 

paul.fr

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #31 on: 02/10/2007 00:50:24 »
Can the cat still be the initial observer if it is not alive?
 

another_someone

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #32 on: 02/10/2007 01:02:34 »
Can the cat still be the initial observer if it is not alive?

Why not?

If I were to look inside the box, and make my observations, and then write notes for someone else to see, and then promptly keel over with a massive heart attack (or overcome by the cyanide because I failed to take adequate precautions when opening the box); then my observations are still valid, as I have documented them and passed that information on to my successor.
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #33 on: 02/10/2007 07:14:59 »
Can the cat still be the initial observer if it is not alive?

Why not?

If I were to look inside the box, and make my observations, and then write notes for someone else to see, and then promptly keel over with a massive heart attack (or overcome by the cyanide because I failed to take adequate precautions when opening the box); then my observations are still valid, as I have documented them and passed that information on to my successor.

Are you saying we should put a laptop in the box for the cat to use?  :D
 

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #34 on: 02/10/2007 08:12:23 »
Shrunk
It is important to realize that there is only one observer and that is you.
If you die who knows what happens to the world.
If you go mad all the theories go for toss.
No one other than you is responsible for what you see and understand.
Even in a network the purpose is selfish and that is Towards Sustainable Pleasure. or TSP.
 

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Can quantum waveforms un-collapse?
« Reply #34 on: 02/10/2007 08:12:23 »

 

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