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Offline spubar44

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Please tell me what this rock is!
« on: 23/10/2007 01:52:17 »

  newbielink:http://s125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/spubar44/Metal%20Rock%20found/ [nonactive]











There you go!
« Last Edit: 18/11/2007 05:11:56 by Karen W. »


 

Offline Karen W.

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Please tell me what this rock is!
« Reply #1 on: 23/10/2007 02:07:09 »
Do you mind if I put your pictures here in the forum...where it is easier to look and post?
 

Offline JimBob

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« Reply #2 on: 23/10/2007 02:49:41 »
Can you get some close ups of the cut surface after you have wiped it with a wet rag? It does not look like a normal nickel-Iron meteorite but that doesn't mean it couldn't be a meteorite.

 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #3 on: 23/10/2007 03:09:46 »
karen w. Sure, if you want to post them here go ahead. I just didn't know how.
 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #4 on: 23/10/2007 03:16:07 »
jim bob. I can try to get some close ups, but when i tried before, the surface caused such a glare, it was just a bright blob. Let me try to post another pic.
 

Offline Karen W.

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« Reply #5 on: 23/10/2007 03:21:55 »

They are great pictures! You did a great job!
« Last Edit: 23/10/2007 03:41:33 by Karen W. »
 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #6 on: 23/10/2007 03:24:03 »
karen w.

here is another one, It is a close up of the inside surface. I scratched the surface some to show the shine of the metal since my saw didn't make a smooth shiny cut.



« Last Edit: 23/10/2007 03:35:51 by Karen W. »
 

Offline Karen W.

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« Reply #7 on: 23/10/2007 03:30:49 »
There you go! Welcome to the forum Spubar44
« Last Edit: 23/10/2007 03:43:16 by Karen W. »
 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #8 on: 23/10/2007 03:42:41 »
Thanks karen. There you go Jimbob. It isn't the best pic but that might give you an idea. Let me know what you think.
 

Offline Karen W.

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« Reply #9 on: 23/10/2007 03:45:02 »
Your very welcome. I put the post in your original!
 

Offline Bass

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« Reply #10 on: 23/10/2007 05:11:35 »
Looks like there is a distinct layering?  The fresh metal looks dark gray to black with a metallic luster?  The outside appears to weather to iron oxide- but goethite instead of hematite.  You think it's weakly magnetic?  Try putting a compass close to the specimen and see if it affects the needle at all.
Have you checked the streak?  Find a small piece of the fresh metal and rub it on a rough ceramic plate (not one of your dinner dishes).  What color streak does it leave?
Can you see any crystals?  Are they elongate?  bladed?
My first guess would have been meteorite, but as JimBob pointed out, it just doesn't quite look right.  Are there any mines or old smelters near where you found this?
Can you determine the hardness?  Can you scratch it with a knife?  will the metal scratch glass?
My first impression, based on the photos and the weak magnetism, would be specular hematite- but that is a wild guess at this point.
 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #11 on: 23/10/2007 15:06:01 »
Bass,

It may look like layering, but that is my saw marks from the blade when i cut it. The other side i tried to smooth out to get rid of them but it only worked so good, and when i tried to smooth it out it took the shine and made it dull, that is why i scratched the one to show the metal a little better. When i say weakly magnetic i only used a small round magnet from my fridge, i may have to find a bigger stronger magnet to get better results. I will get piece of ceramic today, streak it and post a picture today to see what you think. I do not see any crystals, it is pretty solid.
There are no mines, smelters or anything, that would create something like this around here in ms. Just sandy fields and dirt, That was the first thing i looked into. How do i determine the hardness? Yes i can scratch it with a knife, as shown in the one picture. I am not sure if it will scratch glass. I will try and see, the outside is rough and hard enough to scratch glass. Thanks for your input. Let me know what you think.
 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #12 on: 23/10/2007 21:09:43 »
Bass,
 I did the scratch test and it left a dark shiny mark.
 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #13 on: 23/10/2007 21:39:57 »
could this be a lead rock? Is there any such thing. When i scratched it, it reminded me of a fishing sinker, the way it looks when you scratch them.
 

Offline Bass

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« Reply #14 on: 23/10/2007 21:50:07 »
Could be galena (lead sulfide)

Looking at your photo, I thought I could see layering (black lines) and several rounded fragments (circles).  If these are layers- would rule out meteorite.  Galena will scratch very easily with a knife (should be able to scratch it with a penny) and has a grayish-black streak.  Also very heavy.
May I ask where you found this specimen?

 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #15 on: 23/10/2007 23:28:53 »
Bass,

that sounds like that may be it. But for galena, it does not have the cube formations that galena should have. Not syaing it's not, cause i only know about these things by what i see on the interenet, I'm no pro, that's why i look for the expertise of members here. I can scratch it with a penny somewhat around the outer edge of it but i as i get closer to the center it gets harder to scratch it. Right in the center where it has that rough area, it scratches off easy there but it is a little more rough in that spot. I found it at my work in Mississippi. We have about 12 acres fenced off so only employees can enter. The building is at the back of the property and we have an 11 acre  field out front with nothing in it but sand, dirt and weeds. It is so soft that it can't be driven on or you'll get stuck so it is just open. So I figured since no one is allowed inside the fence unless you work here and i know that no one that works here is into this, that my son and i would go out and see what we could find since it won't be filled with trash that would set off the metal detector all the time, and that is where we found it, along with smaller rocks that the detector picked up, but we didn't even get to do half the field and we were still out there a long time. So It is pretty much like a small desert with weeds.

The black lines you see are little lines of like air pockets i guess you could say, and the circles are the same thing. Is this sorta thing a natural item and is this rock common? Thanks
« Last Edit: 23/10/2007 23:46:46 by spubar44 »
 

Offline Bass

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« Reply #16 on: 24/10/2007 00:02:00 »
If the galena is fine-grained, you won't see cubic crystals.  However, galena does have perfect cleavage, so by looking at the specimen with a magnifying glass, you should be able to see tiny shiny surfaces, where the galena breaks along cleavage faces.  I don't know that galena is much found in Mississippi, but this could have been brought in from elsewhere (as fill).  I'll check my MS references a little closer.
 

Offline JimBob

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« Reply #17 on: 24/10/2007 02:20:38 »
spubar44,

How close to a river that has or had boat traffic did you find this rock? Something like this, if not meteoritic, could also have been either part of a shipment going to a riverbank smelter or part of the ballast for a baot that had no cargo.

 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #18 on: 24/10/2007 02:50:15 »
Jimbob

I am fairly close to the mississippi river but there are no shipments that go through our land and the surrounding companies deal with only fertilizer and grain which only tow boats push the barges they fill with those items. They would not ballast barges and the towboats don't need the ballast, so i don't think that this would be from anything like that. I would say half a mile from the lake that leads to the river.
here is a link to a satelitte view of where i found it in relation to water which is the lake. The long black area at that you see is where my building is. You can follow the driveway all the way to the road and that will show how long the fenced in area is. The little white crosshairs shows roughly where i found the rock in the front field. Hopefully this helps a little. Thanks

newbielink:http://maps.yahoo.com/broadband#mvt=s&trf=0&lon=-91.089465&lat=33.374598&mag=1 [nonactive]


spubar44,

How close to a river that has or had boat traffic did you find this rock? Something like this, if not meteoritic, could also have been either part of a shipment going to a riverbank smelter or part of the ballast for a baot that had no cargo.


« Last Edit: 24/10/2007 03:02:52 by spubar44 »
 

Offline Bass

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« Reply #19 on: 24/10/2007 03:38:17 »
Spubar44- According to the MS Dept of Environ Quality, only sand, gravel, clay, bentonite, chalk, iron ore and limestone are mined in Mississippi (not including energy).  There are large lead-zinc mines close to the river in Missouri and east Tennessee (known as Mississippi Valley type deposits).  With the river and railroad tracks in such close proximity to your discovery, I suspect you may have a piece of ore from these mines that was lost in transit, as JimBob suggested.  If that's true, there may be more in the area- I'd check around a bit more with the metal detector when time allows.
Most of the specimens of Mississippi Valley type ore that I've seen are coarse grained with visible crystals of galena and sphalerite- but I haven't spent any time in that area, and maybe the specimens that I've seen were collected as "show" pieces.
« Last Edit: 24/10/2007 03:41:35 by Bass »
 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #20 on: 24/10/2007 03:55:42 »
Bass,

I really appreciate your research and information on this. Well, since this isn't anything special, next time i wont waist my time digging it out of the ground if i find anymore out there. Well i guess i'll throw this one to the side and keep all the info that everyone has helped me with and look for another rock to learn about, hopefully it will be one worth looking into. Thanks again to everyone on this and i'll be back again for information when i find another neat unknown rock.
 

Offline Andrew K Fletcher

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« Reply #21 on: 24/10/2007 08:41:10 »
The metal has obviously been formed by heat, this is why crystals are not present. You mention smaller ones around the same location have been found. This could suggest an impact while the object was hot also.

Are there any sources of undergound heat close by, such as evidence of ancient volcanic activity in the local rock formations?

Might be worth taking it in to get it properly examined before throwing it away.
At the very least it is worth an advertisement on EBAY to see if a collecter places a value on it.

Andrew

 

Offline spubar44

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« Reply #22 on: 24/10/2007 12:49:07 »
andrew k. fletcher,

 There are no sources of any kind of heat source in the delta here. As for volcanic activity and rock formations, This area really isn't a rocky area, mostly sand and dirt. I have been in this area for some time now and i have never seen this kind of rock. Where would be a place that would examine this sorta thing? and as for ebay, that's an idea. Thanks
 

Offline Andrew K Fletcher

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« Reply #23 on: 24/10/2007 17:58:51 »
Something’s just come back to me re your rock. a long time ago when really young, we used to tat. Collect metals for selling to the local scrap metal merchants. Occasionally we would melt lead down when it was combined with impurities or too difficult to separate from other metals it was secured to like copper tube ends and brass fittings, which were more valuable than the lead when separated and the lead was virtually worthless when combined with steel, copper and brass. So we used to melt it down to separate it and retrieve all the bits of other metals and ended up with a saleable lead block, well more a splurge or a lump than a block once tipped out impurities quickly adhered to the lump of metal.

Could it be that this hefty lump was the result of a similar process and the lead spilled out onto the floor making it a manmade lead lump rather than a natural rock which could account for the impurities located on the outside, possibly where the molten metal came in contact with the material on the ground where it was either knocked over or most probably poured into a hole in the ground and more material kicked over it. Lead was used a lot during the civil war to cast bullets, badges etc and the oxidising of lead in a cauldron if memory serves caused a red crust similar in colour to your discovery. It may also pre-date the wars, just guessing at the moment.

To purify lead instantly we used to pour it into a large bath of water, the lead that came out of the bath was very clean and shining. However, you could not pour it into a metal container that had water residues on it as it would explode in your face and send molten lead many metres through the air and water vapour as the water violently exceeds boiling point and errupts through the lead, burning everyone daft enough to be too close. This could have happened when the moton lead was poured into a hole containing water causing gas to impregnate it and send lumps of it off in all directions possibly injuring or even killing the person that poured lead into a hole containing water.
« Last Edit: 24/10/2007 18:09:13 by Andrew K Fletcher »
 

Offline Bored chemist

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« Reply #24 on: 24/10/2007 19:38:10 »
You can scratch lead with a fingernail. Can you do that with this rock?
 

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