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Author Topic: Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?  (Read 14585 times)

Offline BenHermer

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« on: 10/05/2008 13:59:00 »
I got quite into this as a youngster, all started after watching a documentary by the BBC called "The real X-Files"

Though after buying a few books, and spending a few hours sitting in chairs, never had any positive experience. Was wondering if anyone else (this being a science based forum) had had any real world experience?

I noticed the MOD have releasd their findings now, but nothing conclusive.

newbielink:http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/FreedomOfInformation/DisclosureLog/SearchDisclosureLog/RemoteViewing.htm [nonactive]



« Last Edit: 10/05/2008 17:54:38 by BenHermer »


 

Offline Bored chemist

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #1 on: 10/05/2008 18:17:50 »
Imagine, for a moment, that many years ago someone, somehow managed to acquire the git of being able to "see things" at a distance. He would certainly be a lucky man. He would be more successfull hunting and also better at avoiding enemies and predators. Compared to others, he would have a massive evolutionary advantage. If his children inherited this ability then they too would be at a great advantage over those without it.
After a relatively short while evolution would see to it that we could all use this ability.

We can't; so it never happened.
 

Offline BenHermer

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #2 on: 15/05/2008 09:32:27 »
Bored chemist, Good answer, makes sense. Though with that in mind, one wonders why we dont all have 20/20 vision, or the same muscle density and or endurance.

On the other hand, and dont get me wrong, your answer makes sense, I have never seen proof of this. But we are talking about a higher level brain function, could it also be possible that this is a part of our evolution that still has the possibility to evolve? Or could it be that this is actually a way of 'tricking' a sense we already have?
 

Offline caboose17

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #3 on: 16/05/2008 19:24:10 »
I have tried astral projection and all i got from it was a nap. I believe that it is possible but not in the sense that we can see things from a distance but our conscience mind leaves the body and is free to think without emotions to hinder our conclusion. If we could learn this than the world would perhaps be a better place.
       I also do not believe that it would be hereditary because if it was then it would imply that our ideas and thoughts, experiences, teachings would all be passed down to our children. Because a person must learn to astral project it isn't something we can all do. just like math.
 

Offline einsteinium252

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #4 on: 29/07/2008 21:07:38 »
I watched a show (relatively recently) on the History Channel called "Wierd U.S." and one of the segments in the episode explored remote viewing.  The show stated that the CIA used remote viewing to identify a new russian submarine before satelites were arround.

The Wierd U.S. team hooked up with the ex-remote viewer to test his ability.  Through a controled scientific experiment, one of the members of the team was coached to use remote viewing.

The team proved that remote viewing is a natural ability that almost everyone has, but do not know how to really use.
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #5 on: 30/07/2008 19:48:22 »
OK, so why haven't the few who know how to use it taken over the world? It's the same problem as I pointed out before. If anyone could do this (and the trait were heritable or teachable) then it would wipe out the "have nots" in a few generations.
It hasn't; why not?
 

Offline einsteinium252

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #6 on: 04/08/2008 04:35:20 »
Bored chemist,

First of all, the Stargate project was dropped, that should tell us something right there.

One explanation is that remote viewing is not precise enough to conquer the world.  Usually the readings vary from 5-15% above chance.  In the CIA, the method was used as a last resort, to provide intelligence where there was none.
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #7 on: 04/08/2008 19:46:25 »
"First of all, the Stargate project was dropped, that should tell us something right there."
Specifically, it should tell us that it didn't work. The military are not noted for dropping ideas that work.
Secondly, the military have not been here for long. Evolution has.
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #8 on: 14/08/2008 09:51:28 »
Remote viewing is possible; I have personal experience of it. But I can't do it whenever I want. Even when it does happen, the visions are usually too blurry to actually discern anything. I can only recall 1 instance where I've remotely viewed with clarity.

But, remote viewing and astral projection are different things.
 

Offline Bored chemist

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« Reply #9 on: 14/08/2008 19:32:28 »
Coincidence is possible too.
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #10 on: 14/08/2008 19:50:34 »
Coincidence is possible too.

Indeed
 

Offline einsteinium252

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #11 on: 30/08/2008 02:06:52 »
Bored Chemist,

A) I was agreeing with you (I was just unclear), because even though the show came to that conclusion, I'm still not convinced.

B) The methods used for remote viewing are open to 'Subjective Validation,' which can render the evidence inacurate.
« Last Edit: 30/08/2008 02:11:25 by einsteinium252 »
 

Offline streetsmart1980

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #12 on: 05/09/2008 14:04:02 »
This is the first forum topic I read.  I busted up laughing when I kept reading Bored Chemists reply's.  Very clever and matter of fact.

I've tried this astral travel (having a sort of out of body experience to interact with the after life) and remote viewing (watching things far away in a psychic kind of way).  I have found both of these things to be superstitions.  No offense Doctor Beaver.

Here are some videos by the Skeptic Society that shed some light on the issue.

You can induce an out of body experience in people with magnets on the head.  This might explain why people are convinced it is possible to leave your body.  You can trick the brain into having this reaction.  We are hard wired to do so.  The fact that it happens by accident is then no surprise.

feature=related

Here are Penn and Teller showing experiments that induce near death experiences in which people have similar out of body type experiences.  If we can do it at will, then maybe it is not some sort of spiritual mystical event.


Here is another Shermer video 1/4 about Remote Viewing and how it is just guessing and highly inaccurate.

feature=related

You might say, oh this is not real science.  For me it is good enough.

My personal theory is this:

'Humans are hard wired to sleep, and dream.  When humans are extremely stressed and the brain or body is put into the correct state they will absolutely have an experience where they feel like they are leaving their body.  They aren't leaving their body, their perception of where their physical body is shifts in relation to where their mind says it should be.  Essentially the stress makes reality, self perception and dreaming kind of mix together in the mind.  The fact that what people see when they sense that they leave their body sort of corresponds with actual reality is a coincidence or a just a subconscious memory of their surroundings.

This lady is a brain researcher and she describes a stroke she had.  She is a little bit fufu, but her description of a sort of out of body mystical experience is interesting.  I guess a stroke can kind of short circuit your brain.  When your brain is unable to clearly communicate the boundaries of your body with the expected image in your mind your perception of reality can be severely altered.  I imagine an astral travel experience would occurr in a similar sort of fashion.

newbielink:http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/jill_bolte_taylor_s_powerful_stroke_of_insight.html [nonactive]

 

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Is Astral Projection reality or fantasy?
« Reply #12 on: 05/09/2008 14:04:02 »

 

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