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Offline stereologist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #75 on: 28/08/2009 01:10:07 »
Tracar what was your user name before you became a troll?
 

Offline tracar

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #76 on: 28/08/2009 01:25:14 »
what kind of troll? you are a fable player right?
 

Offline stereologist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #77 on: 28/08/2009 03:08:31 »
What was your name on this forum before you became a troll?
 

Offline tracar

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #78 on: 30/08/2009 02:03:52 »
possibly a bored chemist.
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #79 on: 20/10/2009 19:26:17 »
Sorry for the necromancy but I just found some information about Dr Rath who was cited earlier in this thread as an authority on the matter.
I'm sure that you will make up your own minds about his work.
http://www.generoom.net/features-story.php?id=58
 

Offline StFual

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #80 on: 28/04/2010 16:23:35 »
Pardon the resurrection, but no one properly answered the question...

Yes, sodium chlorite does have healing "powers".

Consider WF10 and Oxovasin/Oxoferin:

WF10 (IV drug):
Contains the ions chlorite (4.25%), chloride (2.0%), chlorate (1.5%), sulfate (0.7%), and sodium (4.0%).
1 mL of WF10 solution contains 4.25 mg (63 μmol) of the active chlorite ion.

Oxovasin Active ingredient (diluted WF10, applied topically):
Produced from: 10.28mg sodium chlorite, 1.38mg sodium hypochlorite,
0.75mg sulfuric acid 69%, 0.6µg potassium chlorate,
0.37mg sodium carbonate – hydrogen peroxide (2:3),
1.09mg sodium peroxide

WF10 is in in clinical trials:

Development of WF10, a novel macrophage-regulating agent (PMID: 12054081).
Reduced recurrence of late hemorrhagic radiation cystitis by WF10 therapy in cervical cancer patients: a multicenter, randomized, two-arm, open-label trial (PMID: 15542165).
A phase II study to evaluate WF10 in patients with late hemorrhagic radiation cystitis and proctitis (PMID: 16169580)


With regard to oral chlorite, there is a gang of animal data in the ATSDR's Tox profile of Chlorine Dioxide and Chlorite.
newbielink:http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp160-c3.pdf [nonactive]

Limited information is available regarding health effects in humans following exposure to chlorine dioxide or chlorite (ATSDR link, p.55).  There is ONE cited case of someone eating 10 grams in an attempted suicide.

In animals, a variety of gastrointestinal infections can be controlled with "acidified sodium chlorite"; e.g. Salmonella and Campylobacter in chickens (PMID: 17169454, PMID: 12696692).  They also spray this stuff on a variety of meats to kill pathogens.

This whole Miracle Mineral Solution (MMS) is fishy, in that WF10 is given IV.  If sodium chlorite was very active at a systemic level as an oral formulation, then this would be a clinical application.   I am very skeptical of any use for sodium chlorite outside of topical and GI infections, unless it is given IV.

Carry on or SHOW ME THE DATA....











 

Offline Bored chemist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #81 on: 28/04/2010 19:32:18 »
Interesting but unfortunately, apart from the website you cited which confirms these things are toxic I can't see any of the data. "PMID: 15542165" doesn't mean a lot to me because I can only see the abstract.
I'm inclined to wonder about this.
Did someone really do a trial and only look at "occurrence of late hemorrhagic radiation cystitis in cervical cancer patients"?

Or did they do the study, look at lots of outcomes and find the one that (by a fluke) is statistically significant?
Never forget that "at the 95% confidence level" means  that you get the wrong answer one time in 20; if you look at 20 things you have a good chance of getting one answer that's wrong.

It's also noteworthy that neither of the materials cited is a pure chemical.
If I did an experiment with eye of newt and aspirin as a cure for headaches and found it to work, would I be justified in saying the eye of newt worked?

There's one bit of your post I have to agree with; SHOW ME THE DATA.

By the way, if this therapy does work for this particular condition then that's nice to know. The original claims were that it cured things like malaria. No evidence has been put forward to support that.
« Last Edit: 28/04/2010 19:36:14 by Bored chemist »
 

Offline StFual

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #82 on: 30/04/2010 17:53:03 »
I referenced peer-reviewed scientific articles. Please gain access (via a library) to the data BEFORE you draw conclusions. You have insulted the scientists, clinicians, and editors that took the time to write, review, and publish an experiment before you have even read it?  Claiming they as a group do not understand multiple comparison testing would indicate they are either too ignorant to perform a study or are unethical in their reporting.  That is just part of the issue, also note, the studies I referenced have been reviewed and replicated by different groups. 

I thought the questions were "Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?"  and "what it does do" and "disseminate some of the information about it".

Note that I have not found one clinical or scientific article supporting chlorate, chlorite, or tetrachlorodecaoxygen (oxd-chlorite) usage for treating maleria, multiple sclerosis, ALS, chronic fatigue, or fibromyalgia. 

In cases where something like MS or Chronic Fatigue was caused by a microbe, the concept is reduction of chlorate to chlorite ion by the pathogen COULD cause oxidative damage to the pathogen in the process (PMID: 19824635).  This is still CONCEPT, hence the patent.  There is no scientific studies/data to support the claims of the patent or use of MMS to treat such conditions.

However, back to the REAL question: Yes, sodium chlorite does promote healing.

I will not digress into formulation chemistry, but I assume you are well aware that active compounds are typically formulated before they are tested clinically.  The chemist that produced the clinical formulation indicate "Sodium chlorite (NaClO2, 15 mM) is equivalent to undiluted Oxoferin." and "Our data indicate that Oxoferin may be equated essentially with aqueous sodium chlorite." (PMID: 2921839).   Again, scientific peer-reviewed data.  I would pull the article to also review that data, but I do not read German.

Got data?  They do, I do, do you?
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #83 on: 01/05/2010 13:14:20 »
Citing a reference is not the same as showing the data.
Also, I didn't draw a conclusion, I asked a few questions.
Would you care to answer some of them?
 

Offline StFual

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #84 on: 04/05/2010 18:37:35 »
The study design you questioned was indicated in the title (...a multicenter, randomized, two-arm, open-label trial).  IF a study uses multiple comparisons and does not indicate or correct for it, it would be outright uneducated or unethical. 

When testing a null hypothesis, note that the probability (p-vale) of obtaining a result also indicates the probability of false-positives, but does not indicate if a result is a fluke or if a result is correct or incorrect.

Here are "free" scientific studies (i.e. no library card required) to further support my conclusion:

Application of Acidified Sodium Chlorite in the Drinking Water to Control Salmonella serotype Typhimurium and Campylobacter jejuni in Commercial Broilers( newbielink:http://japr.fass.org/cgi/content/full/16/1/45 [nonactive]).  Actual data from this study showing decrease in Salmonella  and Campylobacter ( newbielink:http://japr.fass.org/cgi/content/full/16/1/45/T2 [nonactive], newbielink:http://japr.fass.org/cgi/content/full/16/1/45/T3 [nonactive]).  Yes, I realize that this is in chickens...

Development of WF10, a novel macrophage-regulating agent ( newbielink:http://74.125.155.132/scholar?q=cache:GsxrxFnDjPYJ:scholar.google.com/+Oxoferin&hl=en&num=50&as_sdt=10000000000000 [nonactive]).  A study of AIDs patients and the impact of chlorite on T-cells.  Google has a problem with the *.pdf conversion.  If you want the tables, get the *.pdf.  I will not post it due to copyright.

Reduced Incidence and Severity of Acute Radiation Mucositis by WF10 (IMMUNOKINE) as Adjunct to Standard of Cure in the Management of Head & Neck Cancer Patients ( newbielink:http://www.mat.or.th/journal/files/Vol90_No.8_1590_9639.pdf [nonactive]).  It appears to reduce inflammation associated with cancers therapies.
 

Offline Farmer

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #85 on: 28/08/2010 05:47:32 »
Hello all... I'm new here, but caught this thread about the Sodium Chlorite or MMS by Jim Humble.. 
 I'm not rich in the brain department like so many of you here, but I can tell you straight about my experience with taking the MMS.. 
 It started about 2 years ago..I fell very ill and ended up in a wheel chair because I was so weak that I just couldn't get around, the doctors told me that I had end stage HCV with chronic kidney failure and Asides due to a blockage in my portal vein.. They basically told me that I had 6 months or less to live and to go home and be with family and friends as they could do nothing for my terminal disease and condition...
 I'm thankful that my wife got some info over the inter net, and soon I was taking the MMS, it took me about a week to work up to 5 drop doses, but from that point I started taking it once an hour for 8 hrs a day...3 months later I was jogging around the block with my dog...
  Now that's not bad for an ole' man like myself, I am still thanking the Lord for leading me to this simple chemical solution...
  I am not totally renewed...as I still have to take diuretics and I still take MMS every week now..but I appear quite normal and am quit active...
  I don't know about all the chem. talk of this or that...but for what it's worth... I'd simply say that if you are down to facing deaths door... you won't be disappointed with what MMS does...
  I do know, that if someone is not sick or have any real illness,that they can take MMS and it does not do anything... but to others that has ill health issues, it is truly a miracle to what it does.. 
« Last Edit: 28/08/2010 05:50:33 by Farmer »
 

Offline gratefulme

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #86 on: 01/09/2010 00:33:09 »
Hello all, I'm a user of MMS, here's my story: Several years ago, I was diagnosed with IBS (irritable bowel syndrome). Within a year of receiving that diagnosis, I was experiencing chronic vomiting, horrible diarrhea, terrible depression, etc. from constantly being ill. As my health continued to deteriorate I went down the long path of trying to identify the foods to eat/not eat, what to drink/not drink, what medicines to take/not take, while continuously undergoing several doctor-ordered tests, all to no avail.
 
After five long years of dealing with IBS, I started to experience other health problems with almost every organ and tissue in my body. I was then diagnosed with Grave’s disease, with T3 & T4 levels at triple the normal levels. As I slowly battled these additional health problems, I continued to search for the reasons behind them, not wanting to take medication for a 'no-cure disease' for the rest of my life. As Grave’s is an autoimmune disorder, my research led me to look for something natural to boost the immune system, which eventually led me to MMS.
 
It seemed safe enough to try, but I thought I would just test it in the tub water first. I have had athlete's foot for about 30 years, on both feet, and after only one soaking, I noticed a difference, it had cleared up some. So I repeated the soaking a few days later, and it cleared up some more. And shortly after that, it disappeared completely! Not only that, it has not returned – it’s actually gone!

More research convinced me to give it a try internally, and I decided to detox the metals and pathogens out first. I went through the cleansing process as far as I could, for two days, with the usual diarrhea, pain, nausea, etc. that I had experienced daily from my IBS.  On the third day, I had severe diarrhea, and stopped the detox.

Once my system settled back down, I underwent the process again, and this time I stayed on it for several days, with no additional problems. My mornings slowly improved as my stomach and bowels began to return to normal, and I began to eat whatever I wanted, with no side effects! Much to my joy, each and every day my health improved!

A month later, I was scheduled for blood work, and a visit to see the doctor again for my Graves disease, and upon arriving I was pleased to hear that my T3 & T4 counts were now nearly at ‘perfect’ levels! My good health has continued to remain constant, those counts have remained at/near perfection ever since, and my intake of the drug prescribed by my specialist has now been reduced to only one half of the smallest dose available! My disease is finally under control!

On another issue, I am also happy to say that the day I started MMS, my 'annual cold sore' began to swell under my lip. As I went through two days of detox at that time, it seems to have driven that virus/pathogen from my body as well, as that cold sore never did break the surface -- and there has been no sight of it ever since!

I now take MMS at least twice a week, or more if my Grave’s issues act up, and I can honestly say I haven't felt this well in years! I am mobile again, I am sleeping again, and I am eating again! Most importantly, I am also pain free! I have not had any issues with my IBS since I began this product, I have not thrown up since undergoing the first cleansing process, & I have not had any additional health concerns or problems, My continued good health is all the proof I need!

And now, after such great health improvements through using this product, can you imagine my disappointment when I read the recall issued by Health Canada, telling me to return it! For ten years I did what all the doctors told me to do, and more, but continued to only get sicker, and continued to develop even more health issues. And now, after having found something that controls the suffering I previously went through, I am being told to throw it away!

I cannot tell you how much this product has done for me; just know that I am thrilled to have it. After a decade of daily illness, and now almost a full year of good health, it has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt to work for me.

There are times I forget to take it, and my Grave’s begins to act up again, but just one or two doses bring everything back to normal again. I know that I need to continue taking this product in order to control my health, and am willing to fight strongly against this recall. I want legal access to this product for my own medical use. To remove MMS from the market infringes on my rights, and also leaves me open and vulnerable to more health problems. I have an autoimmune disease, and this recall denies me the right to use a product that has already proven to work better for me than anything else available!

The recall appears to be ignoring the obvious success of this product. There are thousands of users who, like me, searched out their own health care when our own doctors and scientists failed us, and found our own answers! The disappearance of both my herpes virus and my athlete's foot is just one of the testimonies of it's power, and one that the entire medical establishment haven't even offered to sufferers of either affliction -- they'd rather send us home with expensive creams & ointments that don't really work, & ignore it (hint: there's no money in MMS!)

We must not loose the right to choose what we want to put into our own bodies, especially when that choice has already proven to aid in the healing processes. We all deserve the right to choose, and I choose MMS & good health over what I went through ANY DAY!
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #87 on: 01/09/2010 20:20:07 »
Just remember; the plural of anecdote is not evidence.
 

Offline Lor

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #88 on: 05/09/2010 05:50:57 »
my mother caught head lice as a child(circa 1940) and had her hair washed with kerosene  by her mom.yes it killed the lice, would you do that today? nooo.
I'm with Bored Scientist- ive read this thread and trust in his responses.
theres a BIG difference between homeopathic treatments and snake oil salesman.I believe in natural cures that are relatively safe but will not use or take anything new and unproven-new drugs from drug companies included.
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #89 on: 05/09/2010 11:09:44 »
"theres a BIG difference between homeopathic treatments and snake oil salesman."
Really?
What is it?
Snake oil doesn't work, and nor does homoeopathy.
 

Offline Lor

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #90 on: 05/09/2010 12:03:30 »
I'm not sure why you're debating what i said since i agree with your basic view on that malaria cure. Hhomeopathy and snake oil salesman arent necessarily  mutually exclusive.There are many homeopathic/natural/herbal remedies that have much merit. a snakeoil salesman sells things with unwarranted medicinal claims;deceiving practices,for ailments it has absolutely no  positive effect on. in the past, 1800's for instance cocaine,morphine and alcohol sold in all sorts of medicinal concoctions with wild unasserted claims.
 

Offline BenV

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« Reply #91 on: 05/09/2010 15:32:16 »
...There are many homeopathic/natural/herbal remedies that have much merit...
No, there are natural and herbal rememdies that have much merit - don't fall into the trap of including homeopathy in with them.
 

Offline rosy

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« Reply #92 on: 05/09/2010 17:16:51 »
For anyone who thinks (as many do) that "homeopathic" is a synonym for "herbal", see the wikipedia article here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy#High_dilutions
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #93 on: 05/09/2010 19:02:41 »
Jazzderry,
let's be quite clear about this .
Not only does homoeopathy not work, but there is no way in which it could work.
There's just nothing there in homoeopathy "remedies". The "active" ingredient was diluted out of existence.

The chlorite stuff is bollocks, but at least they are claiming that "some stuff has an effect" rather than "stuff that's not there any more has an effect".

Homoeopathy should only turn up on scientific website when we are making jokes.

http://xkcd.com/765/
« Last Edit: 05/09/2010 19:05:25 by Bored chemist »
 

Offline JAB

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #94 on: 10/09/2010 05:18:47 »
Does the sodium chorite solution have healing powers?  Yes, it does, plain and simple.  Is it the miracle cure for malaria, cancer, AIDS, Hep c, etc. I don't know.  That has yet to be determined.  There are people out there who claim to have been desperate enough to try it and claim it worked for them. I am happy for them.  I guess it's possible that all those thousands of positive posts I have read over the years could have been fabricated by liars. Just "bored" people with nothing better to do. 
  I have found it works well on athletes foot and other rashes quite well.  I brush my teeth with it weekly and my dentist scratches his head every six months.  I had an opportunity to test it against over the counter products on two identical burns.  The sodium chlorite  treated burn never blistered and was healed in less than half the time as the other.  That's my experience.  I will keep a bottle of the stuff around as long as it works for me.  It is being studied and I believe in time it will become more accepted.  Here is a study where it was used with some success on dogs.
newbielink:http://veterinarymedicine.dvm360.com/vetmed/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=141749&pageID=1&sk=&date= [nonactive]
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #95 on: 10/09/2010 07:23:13 »
The stuff will act as a simple disinfectant. Treating surface infections is one thing; treating systemic infections is another matter.
 

Offline Farmer

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #96 on: 03/10/2010 06:53:19 »
As I said above, I'm not overly bright, so I hope that you guys will know what I am trying to say, even though I explain things poorly at times..
 Another treatment that I am doing is the ozone IV's with the Sodium Chloride in the Saline solution that I use.  I think this is the same stuff that is used in MMS, not sure, but if so, then it's used for more things that just cleaning floors.
 Another thing that I caught above, is the deal about homopathy, [I should get a dictionary to look the meaning of that up, but it sounds like someone that stays at home or something...
 There's more to "Snakeoil" than just the salesmen who sells it... No jokeing, There are certain plants that has been used for hundreds of years by witch doctors, sharmans etc. in jungles, countries where they don't have local doctor offices to visit,
  These Witch doctors take care of all the health issued with their Tribes and over the generations passed down their treatments and cures..
 This is a matter of history of distant cultures, backwoods or jungle tribes.
 The Jungles has some pretty poisonous snakes, and one of the witch doctors "cures" for deadly snake bites in the Amazon's is a herb called "Jergon Sacha" which not only effectively stops the poison but helps to counter-act the swelling from the bite area.  Powerful stuff, so I've read...
  I did a lot of reading up on this not to long ago, and the more modern research that has been done on this herb, it contains over a hundred other chemicals within it, but it's been proven to stop the protease actions of the HIV and HCV and HBV. [viruses]
 Now those Witch doctors don't have labs etc..
 "Plants" [herbs] has a low line of intelligence about them, they grow and evolve with their own chemistry or chemical make up,
 ~I say "evolve" because some plants actually will change their chemistry if the climate or whatever brings around a new predator, like inscects, snakes etc. that attacks the plants..
[thus you find different species of the same plant in different areas],
~ they build in their own defenses with chemistry to ward off their local predators...  So it's easy enough to understand why a Witch doctor who wants to find a remedy for a poison snake bite, would find it within the same local area where the snake in question lives.. given a little trial and error... and bingo...a treatment.
 I read my eye balls sore for hours day in day out for awhile trying to find a cure for my disease with about every kind of herb that you can think about, and have probably taken a couple truck loads of herbs fighting the virus for awhile...but nothing overpowered the virus with herbs... not even Jergon Sacha... 
 Maybe those Witch doctors has an art to it, or perhaps they use the fresh plants whereas dried herbs won't work as well...don't know..
 This is my experience with "herbs"...they are helpful in many ways, but with major diseases.. it takes something stronger in my opinion.
 
 I use Sodium Chorite to make my own M.M.S. and if taken with the right doses, it does kill the pathogens in the blood the same as it does in water purification of pathogens, bacteria etc..
 It is a strong Oxidant... and this is where someone can get into trouble is they try hammer away too hard at fighting a disease without taking the time to "Protect" their body with Antioxidants in between daily dosing with MMS.  [been there done that too]
 There should be at least 2 to 4 hours separation between taking oxidants and antioxidants. 
 Taking too much oxidants opens a can of worms with free radicals, and if continued it can cause free radical damage. So~ though it is an excellent means to treat with, and to stimulate the immune responses, it is not a stand alone treatment protocol..
 
« Last Edit: 03/10/2010 07:11:24 by Farmer »
 

Offline RD

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Offline BenV

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #98 on: 25/10/2010 20:02:33 »
Another thing that I caught above, is the deal about homopathy, [I should get a dictionary to look the meaning of that up, but it sounds like someone that stays at home or something...
 There's more to "Snakeoil" than just the salesmen who sells it... No jokeing, There are certain plants that has been used for hundreds of years by witch doctors, sharmans etc. in jungles, countries where they don't have local doctor offices to visit,
  These Witch doctors take care of all the health issued with their Tribes and over the generations passed down their treatments and cures..
 This is a matter of history of distant cultures, backwoods or jungle tribes.

No no no no no no no! Again - homeopathy has nothing to do with herbal cures, plant extracts or anything that could remotely help.  Homeopaths do very well out of people lumping homeopathy (water or sugar pills) in with herbal remedies (which may well have beneficial active ingredients).
 

Offline maffsolo

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« Reply #99 on: 25/10/2010 23:29:10 »
...There are many homeopathic/natural/herbal remedies that have much merit...
No, there are natural and herbal rememdies that have much merit - don't fall into the trap of including homeopathy in with them.

I am constipated is there an herbal remedies for that?  ::)

Oh there's my seat right ther in the corner.
 

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Does sodium chlorite have healing powers?
« Reply #99 on: 25/10/2010 23:29:10 »

 

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