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Author Topic: Why are people holding back science?  (Read 4818 times)

Offline TheHerbaholic

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Why are people holding back science?
« on: 13/06/2008 01:39:16 »
This is more of a debate than actual science... I'm not sure if this is in the right part of the forum but I'll say anyway..
After reading comments on youtube about creationism over evolution, and how the same people who believe in creationism think that tinkering with DNA is playing god, will we ever make real physical changes in ourselves?
On TV the other day, there was a biologist who had found the gene in a worm that was related to age. She turned off the gene and the worm lived alot longer, and was alot more active than they usually would be. The equivalent if it was done in humans is we would lead a long active life upto the age of 1000.
But how would this kind of thing ever be released to the public?
Moral grounds are holding us back, because a volunteer would probably be found, if enough money was offered to them, or to their family if anything was to wrong. But it's like all the controversy over cloning.
If people are so against this, then doesn't that put a real time limit on our own species (the suns burning time). Because we'll never be able to reach other planets and colonise them with different atmospheres if we can't alter ourselves to be able to deal with them. This seems to not be the way alot of people are thinking these days so what are your opinions on this subject?


 

Offline neilep

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #1 on: 13/06/2008 02:09:22 »
If we are ever to survive as a species it will be because we have adapted ourselves and lived on generational ships that will leave this solar system to find a new world somewhere....and this will of course require us to deal with all the hazards and changes that space will demand of us.

The human of the future will most certainly be genetically modified and cybernetically enhanced and will eventually bear very little resemblance to you and me....in my opinion !

But I also have faith in the ingenuity of human kind and who knows what the far distant future will bring ?...we may in fact have a way of controlling the Sun and saving the Earth.....but I think we'll always have the need/want to travel out there !!
 

Offline Supercryptid

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #2 on: 14/06/2008 12:38:12 »
Because we'll never be able to reach other planets and colonise them with different atmospheres if we can't alter ourselves to be able to deal with them.

There's no need to genetically modify ourselves in order to colonize other planets. In principle, we can build our own habitats on other worlds that contain all of the resources we need to stay alive.

But I also have faith in the ingenuity of human kind and who knows what the far distant future will bring ?...we may in fact have a way of controlling the Sun and saving the Earth.....but I think we'll always have the need/want to travel out there !!

You'd have better luck in towing the Earth to a new star system than keeping the Sun from going out, both of which would be tremendous tasks.
 

Offline neilep

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #3 on: 14/06/2008 13:18:04 »
Hi Supercryptid


I know the ideas sound so far fetched but I don't think we're capable of contemplating what us as a species will be capable of in only a couple of hundred years , let alone a billion or so.


I do think though, that to cope with the radiation, lack of gravity etc that space imposes on the body that we may have to alter ourselves somehow for the extraordinary long trips....there will be generations of humans that are born , live and die on the way there .
 

sooyeah

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #4 on: 14/06/2008 13:29:01 »
On TV the other day, there was a biologist who had found the gene in a worm that was related to age. She turned off the gene and the worm lived alot longer, and was alot more active than they usually would be. The equivalent if it was done in humans is we would lead a long active life upto the age of 1000.

OK here's my problem:

The averave age most people in the world live to, today, is what 65? And the world today is too over populated. If your plan actually happened, well it could just end up killing us all. For lots of reasons which I'll let you ponder.
 

sooyeah

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #5 on: 14/06/2008 13:30:45 »
I do think though, that to cope with the radiation, lack of gravity etc that space imposes on the body that we may have to alter ourselves somehow for the extraordinary long trips....there will be generations of humans that are born , live and die on the way there .

Which would by it's very nature, cause an evolution to take place naturally. I don't have a problem with that.
 

Offline neilep

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #6 on: 14/06/2008 14:36:36 »
I do think though, that to cope with the radiation, lack of gravity etc that space imposes on the body that we may have to alter ourselves somehow for the extraordinary long trips....there will be generations of humans that are born , live and die on the way there .

Which would by it's very nature, cause an evolution to take place naturally. I don't have a problem with that.


I'm of course no expert and this is just my opinion, but I doubt a natural evolution would happen quickly enough to enable adaptation. I do think it will require some human intervention to assist the acclimatisation.
 

sooyeah

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #7 on: 14/06/2008 16:03:46 »
I do think though, that to cope with the radiation, lack of gravity etc that space imposes on the body that we may have to alter ourselves somehow for the extraordinary long trips....there will be generations of humans that are born , live and die on the way there .

Which would by it's very nature, cause an evolution to take place naturally. I don't have a problem with that.


I'm of course no expert and this is just my opinion, but I doubt a natural evolution would happen quickly enough to enable adaptation. I do think it will require some human intervention to assist the acclimatisation.

Good technology, should make that unnecessary.
 

Offline neilep

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #8 on: 14/06/2008 16:23:10 »
I do think though, that to cope with the radiation, lack of gravity etc that space imposes on the body that we may have to alter ourselves somehow for the extraordinary long trips....there will be generations of humans that are born , live and die on the way there .

Which would by it's very nature, cause an evolution to take place naturally. I don't have a problem with that.


I'm of course no expert and this is just my opinion, but I doubt a natural evolution would happen quickly enough to enable adaptation. I do think it will require some human intervention to assist the acclimatisation.

Good technology, should make that unnecessary.

DOH !!...Good Point !!.......
 

Offline SquarishTriangle

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #9 on: 14/06/2008 17:14:27 »
I'm of course no expert and this is just my opinion, but I doubt a natural evolution would happen quickly enough to enable adaptation.

Especially not if we're all going to try to live for a thousand years! Long life history and rapid evolution just doesn't go together.

And I tend to agree with Jolly on the age issue. With everyone living to that kind of age, imagine the enormous population that we'd end up with. The planet barely has enough resources to support us as it is, let alone a population with an unopposed rate of growth.

I doubt you'd really want to work for the entire 1000 years, so that means you'll need to be supported financially by, most likely, the next generation during your long retirement (and they would be oh so pleased about that!). If you did continue to be employed for the majority those years, it would leave little room for the latter generations to get employment opportunities.

Why do we need to live for a thousand years anyway? What on earth is so important and meaningful about your life that you need that long a life span to do it in? If you knew you had that much more time in your life to live, would you still go about things with the same urgency and determination, or put things off knowing you have another, say, 900 years to do it in?

And imagine the degenerative conditions that would accumulate by the time you reach 1000, and the associated pressures on the health care systems (assuming they exist). Perhaps cellular processes in the body would be slowed as well, and that may limit the rate of ageing...but in which case, growth and development, repair and metabolism could also slow similarly.

And finally, excuse the crudeness, but I certainly would not like to put up with my ageing parents for an extra 900 years or so.
 

lyner

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #10 on: 14/06/2008 17:51:08 »
If you were to live to 1000 just think how long you'd have to wait to collect your retirement pension. People are already moaning about the consequences of our, recent, modest extensions of life span.
The social consequences of such a situation would be horrific.
 

Offline Madidus_Scientia

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #11 on: 15/06/2008 04:26:29 »
But with the state of the real estate market at the moment i'll need to live to 1000 before i can ever pay off a house!
 

Offline TheHerbaholic

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #12 on: 18/06/2008 18:14:59 »
Interesting points.. But if we could actually make it too a thousand, who would be able (or have enough money) to get this treatment to cure ageing? Like if DNA was ever understood 100%, could their be DNA tests when applying for a job? Showing how motivated, strong, intellectual, etc that you are as a person? Also, if we could live to a thousand why would the world become so over populated if you could have children at say 800years old? If every person only had 1 or 2 children this wouldn't be a problem. On the TV programme that showed the biologist who found the gene in the worms, they where active right up until the time of their sudden death. So imagine how wise somebody would be who was still able bodies/minded and was a thousand years old... Possibly that alone would lead to evolution within the brain, if it was used for such a long time at a time.
 

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Why are people holding back science?
« Reply #12 on: 18/06/2008 18:14:59 »

 

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