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Author Topic: Gravity Problem Solved  (Read 48183 times)

lyner

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« Reply #125 on: 03/10/2008 23:54:51 »
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I plan to publish a professional paper in the Nexus, if I have to.
That would merely prove that Nexus are prepared to publish 'anything'.

Possibly Prof Murty was just humouring you. Did he catch a glimpse of the wild gleam in your eye?
 

Offline Bored chemist

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« Reply #126 on: 04/10/2008 16:34:02 »
Who or what are "Nexus" anyway?
 

Offline common_sense_seeker

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« Reply #127 on: 09/10/2008 09:11:51 »
Who or what are "Nexus" anyway?

A magazine that covers alternate issues which can be against the mainstream. When I have read it in the past, most were of no interest to me, but occassionally there was a good article.

BTW my theory of matter at the center of Earth having a lower entropy and so a higher gravitational force of attraction would increase the effect of a gravity gradient. This is the effect which creates the ocean tides by a flexure of the lithosphere. If my theory is correct then the tidal force calculated due to the Sunīs gravity gradient should be too low to actually create the observed flexure. Iīm currently working on the mathematical calculation from the bottom up, assuming nothing. The discovery of this discrepancy would help in my explanation of how a giant cometīs gravity could raise the seafloor by over 6 km. This is because the effect of a gravity gradient is greatly increased by small bodies with a high gravitational field being at close range.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_force

My theory would also increase the gravity gradient effect which produces tidal heating. The internal heating of Jupiterīs moon Io is currently not very well understood and something of an enigma. Yet another clue to the validity of my new idea? Iīm convinced it is.
« Last Edit: 09/10/2008 09:19:58 by common_sense_seeker »
 

lyner

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« Reply #128 on: 09/10/2008 17:57:47 »
Validity?
Do you realise that, not only do you need to justify your new idea but you have to show that the normal gravitational laws actually DON'T apply. That would be very hard in the face of all the perfectly good evidence in their favour.
 

Offline Bored chemist

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« Reply #129 on: 09/10/2008 19:22:42 »
For a start, "alternate" is a verb, not an adjective.
Anyway, perhaps you could oblige us by pointing out the web address of this publisher. I'm sure we would all like to judge for ourselves (thne laugh)
 

Offline common_sense_seeker

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« Reply #130 on: 09/10/2008 20:08:30 »
Validity?
Do you realise that, not only do you need to justify your new idea but you have to show that the normal gravitational laws actually DON'T apply. That would be very hard in the face of all the perfectly good evidence in their favour.

Iīve found some data and calculated that the pressure needed to flex the crust by 0.2m due to the load of an ice sheet is 727kg/m/m. The calculation to find the internal pressure due to the Sun is a lot trickier. Iīm assuming that this pressure will be a lot less than the figure above, which will lend credibility to my theory. Iīm still working on the maths.
 

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« Reply #131 on: 09/10/2008 20:54:33 »
What do you mean by "the internal pressure due to the Sun "?
 

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« Reply #132 on: 09/10/2008 22:09:53 »
What do you mean by "the internal pressure due to the Sun "?

You really need to read up on the current theory of ocean tides. Itīs the pressure produced from the gravity gradient of the Sun. Simple in concept, the side facing the Sun is slightly closer and so therefore experiences a greater force of gravitational attraction. Iīm saying that this effect is too small to produce the flexure of the lithosphere of around 0.2m. The pressure would have to be around 727kg/m/m.
 

lyner

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« Reply #133 on: 10/10/2008 00:12:35 »
Really, BC, you should read more of the fringe Science press. Don't you keep up with 'current theory'? I regularly read Nexus, Viz and the Beano so I am well ahead on this new stuff.

It strikes me that the 'new theory doesn't seem to have an explanation for the fact that we have TWO HIGH TIDES every day.
Gosh darn - we may have to go back to the old theory after all.
 

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« Reply #134 on: 10/10/2008 08:15:00 »
Really, BC, you should read more of the fringe Science press. Don't you keep up with 'current theory'? I regularly read Nexus, Viz and the Beano so I am well ahead on this new stuff.

It strikes me that the 'new theory doesn't seem to have an explanation for the fact that we have TWO HIGH TIDES every day.
Gosh darn - we may have to go back to the old theory after all.

Itīs just the same as the current theory, of course. An effect due to the gravity gradient produces a bulge on either side of the Earth. Hence two tides a day.
 

lyner

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« Reply #135 on: 10/10/2008 10:26:28 »
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due to the gravity gradient

Would this be from the Sun or the Moon?
Do rotational forces play a part?
Which bits of the conventional gravitational forces are you claiming not to exist? How massive does an object need to be to have gravity?
These are but a few of the questions which you haven't fully addressed yet.
I would advise you to prepare a much more complete theory about this before you go public. Wouldn't that make 'common sense'?
"Fools rush in", as they say.
 

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« Reply #136 on: 10/10/2008 10:34:29 »
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due to the gravity gradient

Would this be from the Sun or the Moon?
Do rotational forces play a part?
Which bits of the conventional gravitational forces are you claiming not to exist? How massive does an object need to be to have gravity?
These are but a few of the questions which you haven't fully addressed yet.
I would advise you to prepare a much more complete theory about this before you go public. Wouldn't that make 'common sense'?
"Fools rush in", as they say.

Iīm just considering a simple Sun-Earth system without rotation. I wish to calculate the pressure on the crust induced by the Sunīs gravity gradient. Itīs very simple in concept.
 

lyner

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« Reply #137 on: 10/10/2008 23:25:57 »
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Iīm just considering a simple Sun-Earth system without rotation.
Isn't some sort of ORBIT involved?
And, as the Moon contributes most of the tidal effect, perhaps your theory should include that?
Your Science is somewhat lacking, I fear.
(However subtle you like to think it may be.)
 

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« Reply #138 on: 11/10/2008 13:39:46 »
"Itīs just the same as the current theory, of course."
Then shut up about it.
"Itīs very simple in concept. "
I think it was Einstein who said
"Theories should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler."
 

Offline common_sense_seeker

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« Reply #139 on: 13/10/2008 14:18:11 »
No orbit is needed because tidal forces are the same thing as spegettification in principle. Although the surface of the Earth is moving at 465m/s, it's effects can be ignored due to Einstein's inertial frame of reference .i.e it isn't accelerating. The science is coming along just fine. It's getting technical now with mathematical equations using TeX in another forum where people are just a notch higher in their ability than you guys.

Funnily enough I will be comparing this now calculated force with the force producing the equatorial bulge. This will take into account the viscoelasticity of the mantle for a more accurate comparison and give an additional figure to the ice sheet deformation calculation. Coming along just fine.

 
 

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« Reply #140 on: 13/10/2008 18:47:42 »
It would be a high school level question to ask how long, if there were no orbit, it would take for the earth to fall into the sun.
CSS is under the delusion that this doesn't matter.
(BTW, rotating frames of reference are accelerating; please learn some physics)
And this "It's getting technical now with mathematical equations using TeX in another forum where people are just a notch higher in their ability than you guys." is too funny to take as an insult.
I could use a laugh and perhaps an education; please tell me where I can find these grandmasters of tex.
(I tried serching for them, but the results didn't seem helpful; they all thought I couldn't spell latex.)

Incidentally, when you have consulted these demigods and done your calculation, what are you going to do if it gives the wrong answer?

After all we already know how much the land moves from things like GPS measurements.
 

lyner

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« Reply #141 on: 13/10/2008 23:38:53 »
Why should using a lame notation be something to be proud of? Tex is perhaps the only way of getting things across when all you have is the medium of text. There is little else to recommend it.
Conventional Maths notation is a lot more useful for showing patterns and doing manipulations. Why do you think it was developed?
If you really want to impress everyone just come up with some real maths which 'proves' your theory. That should be very straightforward for someone who has mastered Tex.
 
 

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« Reply #142 on: 14/10/2008 09:54:15 »
Incidentally, when you have consulted these demigods and done your calculation, what are you going to do if it gives the wrong answer?

After all we already know how much the land moves from things like GPS measurements.


You're still missing the point, as usual. The simplest way for my theory to have credibiliy is by showing that the resistive viscoelastic force due to the mantle or outer core has been underestimated. This would then mean that the tidal force calculated due to the gravity gradient of both the Sun and Moon is actually lower than needed to produce the observed deformation of the crust. Hence the idea of a core which is more gravitationally attractive than baryonic matter becomes viable, since this would increase the effect of a gravity gradient, which is necessary to overcome the viscoelastic forces.
 

lyner

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« Reply #143 on: 14/10/2008 12:44:53 »
I don't think you know what a gravity gradient is. Could you just give me an idea of what you mean by it and include some numbers please?

BTW, that wasn't a 'typo'; it was incorrect and confusing grammar. There is a difference.

Apart from introducing the 'new word' "tex", what do you know of it? I notice you have no reply to my comments.
 

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« Reply #144 on: 14/10/2008 19:16:06 »
CSS.
I have made a profound observation about the viscoelastic properties of the crust; I believe it is sufficient to rather severely undermine your conjecture. I have pointed it out before but you seem not to have realised the importance it holds. Here it is again - sorry it's not in TeX.

Water is runny; rocks are stiff.
 

Offline LeeE

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« Reply #145 on: 14/10/2008 20:49:35 »
I think that CSS has a bet on with a friend to see how long (s)he can keep his/her topics bumped-up in the forum listings.  There's certainly no scientific merit in his/her postings and (s)he is not responding to questions posed, in an effort to resolve anything, by other forum members.  Personally I'd like to see this thread closed - it has achieved nothing and is just a waste of life.
 

lyner

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« Reply #146 on: 14/10/2008 22:15:51 »
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Water is runny; rocks are stiff.
That's a bit technical, BC!
 

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« Reply #147 on: 15/10/2008 07:05:16 »
That was the idea.
Anyway, if CSS can't provide a link then I aggree that this thread should be put out of its misery.
 

Offline common_sense_seeker

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« Reply #148 on: 15/10/2008 12:19:53 »
I don't think you know what a gravity gradient is. Could you just give me an idea of what you mean by it and include some numbers please?

A gravity gradient is the effect which gives us the ocean tides. It is simply due to the side of the Earth which faces the Sun being in a slightly stronger gravitational field compared to the side away from the Sun. This is because (as we all know) the gravitational field strength of the Sun falls of by 1/r(sq). The wikipedia explanation is very good, the link of which I have already posted:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_force
 

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« Reply #149 on: 15/10/2008 12:24:12 »
CSS.
I have made a profound observation about the viscoelastic properties of the crust; I believe it is sufficient to rather severely undermine your conjecture. I have pointed it out before but you seem not to have realised the importance it holds. Here it is again - sorry it's not in TeX.

Water is runny; rocks are stiff.


This just shows your ignorance of the subject. All matter can be flexed, it's just the amount of pressure required that is a factor. Stating the obvious bears no hindrance to my theory what-so-ever. Can you explain why you think your comment has any relevance?
 

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« Reply #149 on: 15/10/2008 12:24:12 »

 

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