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Author Topic: Is perpetual motion impossible?  (Read 59540 times)

lyner

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #125 on: 25/11/2008 07:53:47 »
ABH
Any system for PM will or will not work because of the actual quantities involved. You have not quoted a single value in your arguments.
If you can't show by calculation how, for each of your "actions" and  "reactions", you will get something extra out, then the system won't work. Flowery phrases don't make an internal combustion engine or a generator work and they won't make your machine work either.
You have proved to yourself already that machines don't go on for ever. Why not believe your own evidence if you won't believe what Science is telling you?
 

Offline Bikerman

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #126 on: 25/11/2008 13:22:29 »
Greetings Bikerman

 I see you are well versed. Very good for you might be able to see what I have truly been saying.
Each action in a wheel system works by angle gravity and direction. Also each action overbalances a wheel. Now this is the basic theory for a perpetual wheel. Now in thousands of attempt that have been done they would move and then balance before another action can take place. This is an obvious and typical problem and used to show the impossibility of perpetual motion.
 Now lets take a system where each typical movement and expected but added together. movement reaction to another typical movement reaction, which react to another typical movement reaction creating a continuous overbalance to keep spinning and keep shifting until it breaks or something from the outside stops it.
 Each and every action by itself lays within the known laws of physics. But together since they react to each other setting them in motion perpetuating the reactions in a closed system. Now how can that break the laws of physics? Logic say it shouldn't but the physicist says it does. Under these circumstances if proven a new understanding will have to occur, no matter how hard the physicist says no.
 So under what I wrote here. How can you say it breaks the laws of physics?
I'm sorry, I just don't understand what you are proposing. Everytime movement is transferred from one element to another you have a loss of energy - either through heat or inertia.
Perhaps you can sketch your proposal so I can properly critique it...?
 

lyner

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #127 on: 25/11/2008 17:39:28 »
Can you draw a cukoo on a cloud, perhaps.

 

Offline Flyberius

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #128 on: 25/11/2008 18:28:29 »
Am I right in thinking Andrew said we shouldn't over specify what PM is?  If thats the case then I vote the universe a perpetual motion machine.  Why you ask?  Because it wont stop moving.  Ever.

I win.  Whats more I can see my discovery benefiting millions of humans accross the globe with its highly practical deeper message.  Go quackery!!!
 

Offline AB Hammer

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #129 on: 25/11/2008 21:13:52 »
Can you draw a cukoo on a cloud, perhaps.



 Sarcasm A?

 Well you say perpetual motion doesn't exist? Well then why is it in the dictionary?

Hit you with some of your own style logic. LOL
 

lyner

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #130 on: 25/11/2008 22:22:51 »
You will also find fairies, witches, magic and God in the dictionary. Not everyone would say that they believe in any of them.

But let's have some numbers from you. If there is enough energy to overcome the losses - plus some to spare, you must know where it is coming from and have an estimate of its value.
Presumably you do understand the concept of energy and work.
 

Offline AB Hammer

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« Reply #131 on: 26/11/2008 00:38:03 »
LMAO

 Well here is a believed photo of fairies, I am married to a witch, I have a graduates degree in theology for the belief in God, and miracles are also call magic.


PS I took the photo.
« Last Edit: 26/11/2008 00:50:04 by AB Hammer »
 

Offline AB Hammer

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #132 on: 26/11/2008 00:48:44 »
But let's have some numbers from you. If there is enough energy to overcome the losses - plus some to spare, you must know where it is coming from and have an estimate of its value.
Presumably you do understand the concept of energy and work.

 Well here are some numbers 20%. Out of a 100 lbs of weights in a wheel I keep 20% greater advantage. This is the same as 20 lbs value to the descending side 100% of the time constant spin. This is the numbers that count the rest is trivial.
 

Offline Bikerman

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« Reply #133 on: 26/11/2008 00:51:07 »
But let's have some numbers from you. If there is enough energy to overcome the losses - plus some to spare, you must know where it is coming from and have an estimate of its value.
Presumably you do understand the concept of energy and work.

 Well here are some numbers 20%. Out of a 100 lbs of weights in a wheel I keep 20% greater advantage. This is the same as 20 lbs value to the descending side 100% of the time constant spin. This is the numbers that count the rest is trivial.
That's not numbers - that is words. 20% greater than what? Sketch your device and, as I said, I will point out your error (and yes, there will be an error - there ALWAYS is in these cases).
 

Offline AB Hammer

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« Reply #134 on: 26/11/2008 01:03:12 »
Quote
That's not numbers - that is words. 20% greater than what? Sketch your device and, as I said, I will point out your error (and yes, there will be an error - there ALWAYS is in these cases).

Greetings Bikerman

 I have 20% more weight constant on the descending side of the wheel under constant shift of the total weight of the weights in the wheel. Since this is my secret and until all protections are in place. I can not show you what it is. Nor do I ask for money either so I am not a scamer. I work under an honest approach but personal design. Well all and all this is what Bessler had to deal with as well. But his was ready and the people just wanted it for free. Bessler could not afford to do that so he died with his secret and I may be the person who found it.
 

Offline Bikerman

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« Reply #135 on: 26/11/2008 01:37:59 »
Greetings Bikerman

 I have 20% more weight constant on the descending side of the wheel under constant shift of the total weight of the weights in the wheel. Since this is my secret and until all protections are in place. I can not show you what it is. Nor do I ask for money either so I am not a scamer. I work under an honest approach but personal design. Well all and all this is what Bessler had to deal with as well. But his was ready and the people just wanted it for free. Bessler could not afford to do that so he died with his secret and I may be the person who found it.
LOL....if I had a pound for everytime I had heard that then I would have enough for a new bike.
Anyway - if your invention is unprotected then why are you posting on a public forum about it? Why don't you simply register the patent and show us science bods how wrong we are? Could it be, perhaps, that it is total baloney and that you simply want to sound like you have something? After all there is a long and ignoble tradition of such postings in many forums...

I'll make you a wager. I'll bet you than in (say) 12 months you have no working prototype, no patent protection and, essentially, nothing to offer. I've offered the same wager to 4 people previously who made similar claims about PM devices - funnily enough none of them took me up. Should we say a thousand pounds? I can easily provide credit details to be arbitrated by a third person...
« Last Edit: 26/11/2008 01:42:18 by Bikerman »
 

Offline AB Hammer

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« Reply #136 on: 26/11/2008 01:53:18 »
Greetings Bikerman

 I am preparing myself, For once shown, I will have to talk allot to very intelligent people and despite the showings there will be people trying to prove it a hoax and those people will attack vigorously due to our teaching we have lived by. It will be kind of like breaking someones religion, and when peoples belief's are broke. Some people become violent. Most hoaxers show some form of machine with a hidden driving units. I will not show my machine/machines until I can show them inside and out safely. 
 

Offline Bikerman

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« Reply #137 on: 26/11/2008 01:56:56 »
Words, friend, just words.
Why not take my wager if you are so confident? After all, 1000 is not to be sneezed at. Simply provide details of a deposit, I will do the same, and we'll nominate a third party to act as arbiter.

You can register a patent for 130 search fee here in the UK. That would leave you 870 profit.

PS Bessler WAS a scammer. The fact that we don't know how he did it is largely down to the fact that it was so long ago and much of the detail has been lost in history. Like all such 'mysteries' a whole body of internet folklore has been created around his wheel but the simple facts are that his 'invention' contradicts the known laws of science and nobody has ever been able to replicate his results.
« Last Edit: 26/11/2008 02:06:26 by Bikerman »
 

Offline AB Hammer

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« Reply #138 on: 26/11/2008 02:13:16 »
Greetings Bikerman

 A wager would be breaking the rules. But the real truth is. If I am correct a 1000 would as valuable like the penny you just didn't pick up for it wasn't worth the bother. Not to mention it would open up an opportunity for someone to take such a breakthrough for so little. ::)
 

Offline Bikerman

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #139 on: 26/11/2008 02:19:17 »
Greetings Bikerman

 A wager would be breaking the rules. But the real truth is. If I am correct a 1000 would as valuable like the penny you just didn't pick up for it wasn't worth the bother. Not to mention it would open up an opportunity for someone to take such a breakthrough for so little. ::)
Oh yeah..right...So registering a patent (which provides 20 year protection) would be giving your idea away would it? Sure it would...

I'm afraid you are now consigned to my ever-growing list of internet loonies..
 

Offline AB Hammer

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« Reply #140 on: 26/11/2008 03:09:10 »
LMAO Bikerman

 I can afford to laugh for you have it and you don't. I already have what I need. Bessler went through the same type of statements from those who attacked him as well. So I feel I am in good company. ;D ;D ;D 
 

Offline AB Hammer

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« Reply #141 on: 26/11/2008 03:53:50 »
 I figure I would clarify what I said.(you have it and you don't.)

I have given all the information you need, but you don't have the foresight to use it. you allow your teachings to cloud allot of your possibilities. So all and all you will just have to wait. Another forum I spent some time on did experiments and they where skeptics as well, but they put it to a true testing and even tried to do simulations and even a build. All from the design I posted here as well. ::)
 

Offline Bored chemist

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« Reply #142 on: 26/11/2008 07:09:26 »
Until you have a working machine nobody will believe you.
Stop posting; start building
 

Offline Pumblechook

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« Reply #143 on: 26/11/2008 11:05:49 »
Any news from the MIT prof who reckoned he could transmit power several metres through the air by radio with very little loss?   He hadn't demonstrated it but had proved (?) mathematically it could be done. 
 

Offline Don_1

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #144 on: 26/11/2008 11:22:07 »
The problem everyone will encounter with most systems planned and dreamt up is in the fact that they all have common problems; wear on moving parts which contact other parts, friction and gravity.

Why does everyone assume that perpetual motion must be a stable and uniform motion?
 

Offline Don_1

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #145 on: 26/11/2008 11:53:12 »
In this diagram, two permanent magnets are suspended from a gantry with fishing line. The N & S poles are aligned with each other. Gravity will pull them down, but the like poles will push them apart. Would they eventually stop moving? Does the external force of gravity exclude this from the accepted term of perpetual motion? Is this too simplistic to work?

What say you?
 

Offline dentstudent

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« Reply #146 on: 26/11/2008 11:55:46 »
Isn't there an awful lot of energy that has gone into the polarisation of the magnets in the first place?
 

Offline Don_1

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« Reply #147 on: 26/11/2008 12:20:42 »
Good point!
 

Offline AB Hammer

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« Reply #148 on: 26/11/2008 13:09:52 »
Until you have a working machine nobody will believe you.
Stop posting; start building

@ Bored chemist

 The reason I went looking for another forum is because I have been stuck in the house with phenomena and now that I am getting over it I have to do my living work first before I can get back to my hobby work. I have built around 30 wheels and untold amount of test over the last year and a half, as well as designed around 400 wheels, and have helped others with designs counting around 40. Hands on tell you more than any math can tell you when it comes to balances and effects. I have had 3 near runners up to date.
 

Offline AB Hammer

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #149 on: 26/11/2008 13:32:15 »
The problem everyone will encounter with most systems planned and dreamt up is in the fact that they all have common problems; wear on moving parts which contact other parts, friction and gravity.

Why does everyone assume that perpetual motion must be a stable and uniform motion?

 Fortunately wear and tear is accepted in the real world, when it come to machines. But Gravity is your friend once you learn how to use it. Also the reason people look for a uniform motion is for smoothness and it will work more expectantly with modern day machine designs the way they are expected to work.
 

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Is perpetual motion impossible?
« Reply #149 on: 26/11/2008 13:32:15 »

 

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