# The Naked Scientists Forum

### Author Topic: Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?  (Read 3394 times)

#### PocketLint

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##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« on: 20/09/2008 20:21:58 »
I hope I can put into words what I'm trying to question. It';s a bit wordy I'll warn you of that now..

Take a race car traveling in a straight line (call it the X direction) and is traveling at a fixed speed of let say 150 mph.

As the car is racing along, it crosses a starting line and travels until it crosses a finish line that is 150 miles away fro the start.

Traveling 150 miles in the X direction will take him 1 hour.

Lets say that on the next run of the test, the driver angles the car such that the car travels at a 45 degree angle to the original straight line path in the X direction.

Timing shows that it took the car 2 hours to travel from the starting line to the finish line. This Tells us the car went a total of 300 miles, 150 in the X direction and additional 150 miles in a new direction (lets call it the Y direction).

Since the speed of the car is fixed at 150 mph, we can also say that the car traveled 75 mph in the X direction and 75 mph in the Y direction.

Restart this test with the car traveling in the X direction only and then it starts to swerve into the Y direction.

One can picture that as the car adds momentum to a new direction, that a related amount of momentum is lost (or transferred) from prior direction(s) of travel.

Now restart the test again, this time beginning from a stand still. You start the car moving in the X dimension. If you apply the statement from above, to be able to add momentum to the X direction, a related amount of momentum has to be transferred from some other dimension. But the car is not traveling in any other dimension in this example.

We only have 3 spacial dimensions to pull from so how can the car start to move at all?
Well I know enough about things to know that time can be thought of as a 4th dimension. We often refer to time in the same terms as space.
For example: Which is farther away, tomorrow or 2 days from now?

When worded like the example, time obviously has spacial properties.

So lets say that time is a dimension on par with the 3 spacial dimensions we normally think about. Then in the car example we were last working on, to make the car move from a stand still, the momentum must be transferred fro the time dimension as it is the only one left.

If this is true, then we can say a few tings about the nature of space-time (the 3 normal space dimensions and the time dimension).

1) When standing still, you are always traveling at full speed through the time dimension

2) A you add momentum in any of the 3 spacial dimensions, you decrease your momentum in the time dimension.

3) As you increase your speed in and or all the 3 spacial dimensions, you will at some point use up all your speed in the time dimension and be unable to go any faster. There is a universal speed limit?

4) If you combine your speed (momentum) in all 4 dimensions, you will come up with the same speed as your speed through time when you are at a stand still.

ok, after all that, now gettng around to my question...

Everyone seems to talk about the speed of light as being the ultimate speed limit in the universe but it would seem to me that light has the speed that is does because of our speed through time. If we were traveling through time any faster then light would have a greater speed and so on..

Which sets the actual speed of light? Is it some properties inherent to light/electromagnetism or our speed through time?

Or is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?

Because either way Light and Time seemed to be as linked as Space and Time.

I'm just a regular guy trying to wrap my little brain around a big subject so please be kind in your responses
-Bob

#### graham.d

• Neilep Level Member
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##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« Reply #1 on: 20/09/2008 21:56:45 »
I'm afraid I got hung up in the first part and did not get to the second bit were you restart the test again. Maybe you should be more precise with your description or, better still, draw a picture.

When the car goes at 45 degrees and takes 2 hours to get to "the finish line", what finish line is this? It can't be the same line as previously as the car is travelling at 45 degrees to the original direction. If it is an extension of the previous finish line the it would not have taken 2 hours but about 1.414 hours.

You say that the car went 300 miles, 150 in X and 150 in Y, but assuming that X and Y are the usual axes at right angles this is not true. If the car goes 300 miles at 45 degrees to each of the X and Y axes, the two vector components are each about 212 miles.

I gave up here. I think you should draw it out on paper. I may have misunderstood your description.

#### PocketLint

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##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« Reply #2 on: 20/09/2008 22:59:47 »
I tried the drawing sidget but could not figure out how to add labels so I'm tying text art.

Run #1 @ fixed speed of 150 mph

FINISH LINE     E-----------------    -----
↑                 *                      /|\
150 Miles         *                       |
Start to Finish   *                       |
↓                 *                     150 miles
*                     Start to Finsh
↑                 *                       |
X                 *                       |
*                      \|/
STARTING LINE   S-----------------|   -----
|<-- 150 miles -->|
Y→

S = Start of Run
E = End of Run
* = Path of Run

Total elapsed time = 1 hours, distance travel = 150 miles.

Run #2 @ fixed speed of 150 mph

FINISH LINE     ------------------E   -----
↑                                 * |    /|\
150 Miles                       *   |     |
Start to Finish               *     |     |
↓                           *       |   150 miles
*         |   Start to Finsh
↑                       *           |     |
X                     *             |     |
*               |    \|/
STARTING LINE   S-----------------|   -----
|<-- 150 miles -->|
Y→

S = Start of Run
E = End of Run
* = Path of Run

Total elapsed time = 2 hours, distance travel = 300 miles.

Hope this helps some?
-Bob

#### PocketLint

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##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« Reply #3 on: 20/09/2008 23:07:33 »
The details I was trying to highlight was not so much about the distance traveled and the math involved with that as much as how momentum is diverted from one dimension to another.

#### graham.d

• Neilep Level Member
• Posts: 2208
##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« Reply #4 on: 20/09/2008 23:36:09 »
The line drawn in asterisks in your second drawing is about 212 miles. If it took 2 hours the car was not doing 150mph.

#### PocketLint

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##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« Reply #5 on: 20/09/2008 23:44:29 »
the line might not be drawn to scale so please overlook that.  and again, it's not about the distance traveled..

True A^2+B^2=C^2 in this case would = 212... for my example so

Lets restate the test to be, the car is driven at such an angle that the total distance driven from start to finsh is 300 miles in 2 hours..

But this does not really matter though.. The post was more about momentum being diverted from one dimension.

-Bob
« Last Edit: 20/09/2008 23:58:56 by PocketLint »

#### graham.d

• Neilep Level Member
• Posts: 2208
##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« Reply #6 on: 21/09/2008 10:05:48 »
Bob, I have some idea of what you are saying I think. I'm not sure about your analogy with the car though. When a car changes direction, in a perfect world without energy losses, it could do so without loss of momentum, but only with respect to the surface on which it is travelling. In turning through 90 degrees the tyres exert a force on the road surface and will accelerate the mass to which the surface is attached - the earth maybe. The net momentum vector remains the same. There is no NET transfer from one dimension to another.

You would be better thinking about perfect billiard balls in space as this is a less confusing picture.

#### The Naked Scientists Forum

##### Is the passage of time of side effect of electromagnetism?
« Reply #6 on: 21/09/2008 10:05:48 »