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Author Topic: How important is E=mc^2  (Read 58615 times)

Offline Andrew K Fletcher

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #75 on: 18/12/2008 11:09:28 »
Not implying anything just providing some news on significant earthquakes taking place after the lunar event on the 12th of december as was suggested might be the case based on higher and lower than normal tides.
Implying what?
 

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #76 on: 18/12/2008 18:45:26 »
Fine but, having made a suggestion - a reasonable one, if you want to advance things you need to do some detailed statistical analysis (or find some which has already been done). There is no point in quoting an instance which supports your theory, at random. There may or may not be millions which don't support it. In any case, does it show a causal relationship?
That's the difference between a Scientific approach and the whimsical one.
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #77 on: 29/12/2008 01:09:02 »
From the common light bulb, to decay creations of photons, E=Mc^2 is very influential.
 

lyner

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #78 on: 29/12/2008 10:42:26 »
I don't understand what you are getting at. Is the mass change of a light bulb measurable?
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #79 on: 29/12/2008 11:35:48 »
No. Electrons with mass are converted into photon energy, hence, E=Mc^2.
 

lyner

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« Reply #80 on: 29/12/2008 11:43:40 »
Don't be daft.
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #81 on: 29/12/2008 11:56:32 »
How am i being daft? Do we not use electrons to power the bulge, in which the electrons are converted to make the energy that we observe leave the bulb? Do you know something i don't?
 

Offline lightarrow

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« Reply #82 on: 29/12/2008 18:18:12 »
How am i being daft? Do we not use electrons to power the bulge, in which the electrons are converted to make the energy that we observe leave the bulb? Do you know something i don't?
Yes, he does. The electrons are not converted into anything.
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #83 on: 30/12/2008 06:41:15 »
So, please explain to me then, where the electron energy is being used up? And where do photons come from if they emerge from the technology of a light bulb?

I'm not so civy on electromechanics, but i am willing to learn.
 

Offline lightarrow

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« Reply #84 on: 30/12/2008 15:10:42 »
So, please explain to me then, where the electron energy is being used up? And where do photons come from if they emerge from the technology of a light bulb?

I'm not so civy on electromechanics, but i am willing to learn.
Let's say that you power the lamp with a battery; then photon's come from chemical energy stored in the substances inside the battery. Releasing energy, those substances fall in a lower potential energy level and so their mass decreases; the missing mass goes away as electromagnetic energy from the lamp. The total number of electrons in the entire system doesn't vary (unless you use nuclear reactions or radioactive compounds...)
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #85 on: 31/12/2008 04:54:04 »
Let's say there isn't a battery, because i know how battery's work.
 

Offline lightarrow

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« Reply #86 on: 31/12/2008 12:13:33 »
Let's say there isn't a battery, because i know how battery's work.
Ok, what do you want as source of electric power? Make a specific example, so I don't have to write many useless posts.  :)
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #87 on: 31/12/2008 12:15:28 »
My arguement is not putative. If there is no battery to power the light, such as found ina  general lightbulb in the cieling, it is powered by electricity; the photons are a by-product of this electroactivity.
 

Offline lightarrow

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« Reply #88 on: 31/12/2008 17:36:34 »
My arguement is not putative. If there is no battery to power the light, such as found ina  general lightbulb in the cieling, it is powered by electricity; the photons are a by-product of this electroactivity.
It doesn't change anything: in a power plant some kind of energy is converted into potential electric energy, which drives the electrons, which number stay constant; the electric energy is then converted into photons in the lamp. Where is the problem?
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #89 on: 02/01/2009 07:07:57 »
No problem. You proved my point either way. The electric energy is converted into photons, the original point i raised before people where trying to tie my shoelaces together.
 

Offline lightarrow

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« Reply #90 on: 02/01/2009 11:20:10 »
No problem. You proved my point either way. The electric energy is converted into photons, the original point i raised before people where trying to tie my shoelaces together.
No, you didn't write that, you wrote:
"in which the electrons are converted to make the energy".
You certainly convert electric energy into photons, but you certainly don't convert electrons into photons: the electrons remain electrons and their number doesn't change.
« Last Edit: 02/01/2009 11:23:25 by lightarrow »
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #91 on: 02/01/2009 11:42:13 »
The electrons, if they are converted into photon energy, then the electrons are no longer electrons.

Would you be clear about this please?
 

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #92 on: 02/01/2009 14:28:20 »
When water drives a water wheel around, the water isn't 'converted' into anything or 'used up', is it? The Kinetic Energy of the water transfers to Kinetic Energy of the wheel.
The electrons have energy when they emerge from the battery /  generator / whatever and that energy is transferred in the light bulb as heat and light. The electrons end up with less energy (Electrical Potential).
The charges flowing round a circuit are like the links of a bicycle chain- they go round and round without changing in number. This is Kirchoff's First Law. His second law says, basically, that the energy put into a circuit is used up on the way round.
« Last Edit: 02/01/2009 14:30:53 by sophiecentaur »
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #93 on: 02/01/2009 17:49:55 »
I am not familiar with Kirchoff's law. The electrodynamic course i took for electrical appliances was very tame. But i am somewhat puzzled. I understand that particles give up their energies, however, where do the electrons go if they are not converted wholey into photons?
 

Offline lightarrow

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« Reply #94 on: 02/01/2009 19:39:13 »
I am not familiar with Kirchoff's law. The electrodynamic course i took for electrical appliances was very tame. But i am somewhat puzzled. I understand that particles give up their energies, however, where do the electrons go if they are not converted wholey into photons?
In the case of a battery, they go from one semi-cell to the other, where they bind with positive ions travelling in the opposite sense, so the net charge accretion is zero in every point. The law of charge conservation is a very important one, you should have known it.
 

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #95 on: 02/01/2009 22:20:10 »
Put an ammeter in all the possible places in a single loop circuit. It will measure the same values of current all the way round.
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #96 on: 03/01/2009 07:17:07 »
Yes, i understand circuitry. This is not my problem here. Its the words, ''electrons converted into photons'' that is puzzling me, and until i get my head around this, i will continue to ask without recourse.
 

Offline lightarrow

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« Reply #97 on: 03/01/2009 08:57:41 »
Yes, i understand circuitry. This is not my problem here. Its the words, ''electrons converted into photons'' that is puzzling me, and until i get my head around this, i will continue to ask without recourse.
Don't know, maybe someone told you at school, you fixed that phrase in your mind and you haven't thought about it anylonger (or you where only thinking to electron-positron annihilation).
 

lyner

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #98 on: 03/01/2009 17:24:17 »
''electrons converted into photons''
is not a phrase that I have seen anywhere. If you are as old as I am, you are forgiven for mis-remembering what you heard!
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #99 on: 03/01/2009 17:29:20 »
My arguement is not putative. If there is no battery to power the light, such as found ina  general lightbulb in the cieling, it is powered by electricity; the photons are a by-product of this electroactivity.
It doesn't change anything: in a power plant some kind of energy is converted into potential electric energy, which drives the electrons, which number stay constant; the electric energy is then converted into photons in the lamp. Where is the problem?

It was here.
 

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How important is E=mc^2
« Reply #99 on: 03/01/2009 17:29:20 »

 

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