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Author Topic: Can you think without 'sounding' your thoughts 'inside' as you think?  (Read 22344 times)

Offline yor_on

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It's strange but I've noticed that I always sound the words I think inside.
I know that when meditating one of the goals is to let the words 'go'.
But, like, when writing here and 'discussing' physics etc, I do 'sound' the words inside myself...

Is it just me?

Can you think 'rationally' about a subject without sounding words?
And when you think about 'things' without 'sounding' them 'inside' your brain first.
What kind of 'things'/concepts are that?

Or is it when remembering?
Or.. :)

What do you think?



« Last Edit: 19/01/2009 22:42:49 by yor_on »


 

Offline Chemistry4me

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'Sound' the words inside yourself? How can you possibly not?
 

Offline yor_on

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When meditating you stop the words.
At least sometimes:)

But 'awake'?
It seems very hard, but I do know that I've had complex 'thoughts' not involving words.
But not connected to 'rational thinking' though.
And yes, I was sober:)
« Last Edit: 19/01/2009 22:49:07 by yor_on »
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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I was just wondering if you could EVER stop thinking? When I try to do it I always notice myself holding my breath, maybe my brain stopped thinking for a second and turned many/every thing(s) off. You should try and stop thinking. Not that it probably helps burn many calories...

That was what I said here and I still haven't got a good answer.
 

Offline Karen W.

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well...I thought that, that was called THINKING!
 

lyner

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It might be more accurate to say that you think about a problem in the same terms that you communicate with other people. Someone who uses signing would, presumably, think in signing!

Would anyone who signs care to contribute to that?

The question is along the same lines as "How does a blind person picture their surrounding space?"
You must use what you know.
 

Offline yor_on

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Chemistry4me?
Would that make 'two thoughts, one mind'?
If we had it both it must be a goood question::))
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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I don't know. Is there such thing as 'bad minds think alike'  ;D Not that I am implying anything of course ;D. Have you meditated before?
 

Offline yor_on

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Let me meditate on that first:)
 

Offline yor_on

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SC That's good thinking
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Go sit somewhere quite and try not to think at all, make that voice inside your head disappear.
 

Offline lightarrow

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Can you think without 'sounding' your thoughts 'inside' as you think?
It must be so, otherwise people who has never heard (deaf) wouldn't be able to think...
But I agree with you, most of the time I think in the same way too. When we think in a fast way, or in some different situations, however, we probably don't use that mechanism. When I read a question here in this forum, e.g., I first have to understand the meaning from english, but I don't always  translate it into my language inside of my mind, so I presume I think and I reason on the pure concepts and then I put them into english again when I reply.
« Last Edit: 20/01/2009 18:47:35 by lightarrow »
 

Offline Make it Lady

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I occasionally think in pictures. I guess it is a bit like dreaming.
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Do you think athletes in some sports think? For example, tennis or badminton players, do they 'think' aloud to themselves when they are playing? E.g, hit down the line, cross court etc... I mean, they hardly have time to make a shot let alone 'think' aloud to themselves. But maybe someone here is a top-class sportman and can enlighten me on this issue...
 

Offline yor_on

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Yes lightarrow, i like to read SF (No surprise, huh:) and started to read English ones when I couldn't find any Swedish SF any more.
So in a way I learned the language as I read them :)

And when I write in English I express myself differently than I would when speaking/thinking in Swedish.
English is a very 'rich' language.

And It's a little like you wrote Lady, its like a different 'coloring' of how I think when I use English.
But I never (as I remember?) thought in pictures, but it sounds real nice.

I think that it is 'muscular memory' that 'jumps' in when athletes do their thing?
And I guess that a deaf mute person can't use words the same way?

They sort of have to reinvent speech on their own I guess.
Sounds very tough/difficult to me.

Ps: didn't Einstein have some sort of dyslexia?
Maybe that's why he thought so differently?

The same as Chinese scholars sees things 'differently' than Westerners when it comes to physics etc?
(Am I sounding stupid now:)
-------

Sometimes when I write it do seem to come out differently than I meant though.
So don't get to pi***d :)
« Last Edit: 21/01/2009 23:22:06 by yor_on »
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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The same as Chinese scholars sees things 'differently' than Westerners when it comes to physics etc? (Am I sounding stupid now:)
-------
??????
 

Offline BenV

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I don't have a visual thought process, so I generally 'sound things out' in my head (My Mrs pictures words in her head, meaning she's far better than me at spelling and anagrams, and wipes the floor with me in scrabble). I can think in terms of sound though, without having to 'narrate' my internal dialogue.  This comes to a head occasionally when I'm falling asleep, and can almost convince myself to 'hear' music I'm thinking of.

It also means I'm pretty good at recognising voices (especially in music) and I'm quite good at the 'musical intro's round' in pub quizzes.

Shame most of the pub quizzes I go to just have questions about Eastenders and premiership football...
 

Offline yor_on

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I don't have a link to that Chemistry4me:)

I read an article a few years ago about a Chinese discovery in physics.
And their approach was unusual.

And inspired to some thoughts about how your language, who could be seen as a mirror of society, might form ideas and concepts.

It seems reasonable to me?

--------------------------

BenV :) didn't Beethoven have a similar ability?
I have a vauge memory of him writing music after he became deaf?

Knowing how it would sound without hearing?
« Last Edit: 22/01/2009 14:41:59 by yor_on »
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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I don't have a link to that Chemistry4me:)

I read an article a few years ago about a Chinese discovery in physics.
And their approach was unusual.

And inspired to some thoughts about how your language, who could be seen as a mirror of society, might form ideas and concepts.

It seems reasonable to me?
Hmmmm... sounds fair, not sure what you mean by:
And inspired to some thoughts about how your language, who could be seen as a mirror of society, might form ideas and concepts.
 

lyner

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I would hazard the suggestion that language often needs to develop a certain way before certain ideas can emerge at all.
Let's face it, without the modern language of Maths - mainly thanks to Islam, I believe - we'd still be whittling sticks and worshiping the Moon. Science just wouldn't have gone anywhere. We couldn't have 'thought' most of it.
 

Offline yor_on

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Yeah, SC I agree.
Is there any of you mathematicians that 'think' in math?
When 'working', so to speak.
That would be rather interesting:)

------------

I meant that it started a discussion about how much the cultural influences , language and all, meant for in which way you might solve a problem Chem:)

I don't know how important that is, but it seems to me that different cultures create different solutions.
In old China they had a length measure called 'Li'(?).

And using that, from 'A' to 'B' they might say that it was five Li for example.
But from 'B' to 'A' it was only four Li:)

And it was perfectly logical.
Anyone wanna guess how they thought?


« Last Edit: 22/01/2009 22:51:24 by yor_on »
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Anyone wanna guess how they thought?
Don't have a clue!
 

Offline AllenG

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When preforming some tasks I don't think in words, and the more physical the task the more "quiet" my thoughts.
For example, while driving aggressively, I'm not constantly telling myself what I need to do to operate the car. Likewise while cycling I don't have to speak to myself to stay upright, and when picking through harrying traffic my internal conversation is silent.

The less physical  the task the more I mentally speak to myself.
I can't do mathematics without "speaking" the problem out. 


 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Those tasks all require different parts of the brain so there might be a clue as to how people 'think'.
 

lyner

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Quote
Is there any of you mathematicians that 'think' in math?
My point is that we ALL 'think maths',  even if only when adding numbers together in our head. Our appreciation of simple 'number' is highly formalised and a learned skill. The digits are there in our heads when we pour out milk from a bottle, I'm certain - and that's an analogue quantity. If we didn't think Arithmetic, we couldn't decide how many potatoes we had in the pot and how many each the family would get.
I must say, I 'think' calculus - differentials and integrals- when addressing many of the problems posed on these pages. I 'feel' the Fourier transform on a regular basis.
Does that make me a nerd?
 

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