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Author Topic: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?  (Read 22547 times)

Offline 7Kira

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What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« on: 01/02/2009 07:40:45 »
What do you all think about the impact and effects of alcoholism on youths?
« Last Edit: 02/02/2009 14:50:29 by chris »


 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #1 on: 01/02/2009 08:02:49 »
Really bad.
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #2 on: 01/02/2009 08:19:12 »
I forgot to say, this is probably a really bad place to start a thread, if I had the power I would move it, but hey, that's life... ;D;D;D;D;D;D;D;D
 

Offline LeeE

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #3 on: 01/02/2009 14:01:44 »
I'm afraid that this question isn't very well thought out.

As the result of alcoholism is to reduce ability in just about every area I think of, it is obviously bad, not just for youths but for everyone.  However, as not everyone who drinks alcohol becomes an alcoholic, alcohol does not cause alcoholism; excessive and inappropriate consumption of alcohol is the result of alcoholism, so the original question is really asking if sickness is good for you? which by definition , is no.
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #4 on: 01/02/2009 14:10:17 »
LeeE makes a good point. It is a common error to equate heavy drinking with alcoholism. The 2 are very different.

As LeeE said, alcohol does not cause alcoholism. Sure, without alcohol there would be no alcoholics; but my research indicated that their addiction/dependence would be to something else. Alcohol acts as the key to unlock the door to alcoholism. The potential for addiction is already present.
« Last Edit: 01/02/2009 14:15:43 by DoctorBeaver »
 

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #5 on: 01/02/2009 21:22:37 »
It's just another example of exploitation of one group of people by modern commerce. It's wicked in just the same way that T~V and other advertising are changing society. Cynical and reprehensible.
 

Offline Karsten

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #6 on: 01/02/2009 23:29:54 »
... excessive and inappropriate consumption of alcohol is the result of alcoholism, ...

It also may lead to alcoholism. I believe it is the only way to get that disease.

And not every person suffering from alcoholism drinks alcohol. As far as I understand, you may still be an alcohol addict, but not using it right now.
 

Offline Karsten

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #7 on: 01/02/2009 23:41:06 »
... alcohol does not cause alcoholism. Sure, without alcohol there would be no alcoholics; but my research indicated that their addiction/dependence would be to something else. Alcohol acts as the key to unlock the door to alcoholism. The potential for addiction is already present.

While this is temporarily going somewhere completely different: "Guns don't kill people. People kill people". That is what I hear in my country. So is the easy availability of guns a problem? Is the easy availability of alcohol to young people a problem? Are the alcoholism rates in the UK or Germany higher or lower than in the US, where the legal drinking age is 21 in many states and those laws are attempted to be enforced well.

What else than alcohol causes alcoholism? What do you do with research that points out that certain people have "potential" to be addicted to something? I see a million ways to abuse such data and discriminate against people with such potential.
 

Offline LeeE

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #8 on: 02/02/2009 05:00:53 »
... excessive and inappropriate consumption of alcohol is the result of alcoholism, ...

It also may lead to alcoholism. I believe it is the only way to get that disease.

This is not so.  Excessive and inappropriate consumption of alcohol is more likely to make you throw up and swear never to get drunk again.  While many, if not most, people have drunk alcohol to excess at some time, only a small proportion of them will become alcoholics who then go on to drink excessively all the time.

Quote
And not every person suffering from alcoholism drinks alcohol. As far as I understand, you may still be an alcohol addict, but not using it right now.

This statement contradicts what you're trying to claim; if people addicted to alcohol are not currently using alcohol but are still considered to be addicted then it can't be the alcohol that makes them an addict.
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #9 on: 02/02/2009 05:06:21 »
What do you all think about the impact and effects of alcoholism on youths?
The effect of alcohol is that many teenagers think binge drinking is cool and that is the wrong attitude. "It's not the drinking, it's how we're drinking" says the ad on TV.
 

Offline Chemistry4me

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #10 on: 02/02/2009 05:15:20 »
But parents should also cop some of the blame.
 

Offline yor_on

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #11 on: 02/02/2009 12:43:22 »
Alcohol is 'relief valve' just like all other mind changing drugs.

There is research in Sweden stating that most of the people susceptible to alcoholism died as the result of former generations abuse of that fluid.

I read somewhere that in the seventeen(?) hundreds, no matter how poor you were, there was always some sort of pail with a wooden or metallic spoon at the side of the door.
The first thing you did was to take a 'house coming/warming' swig from the alcohol residing in that bucket.

There are genetic reasons why some take so strongly to it.
When Captain James Cook sailed he pacific (Hawaiian Islands?) sometimes he invited the natives to drink.
It was said that the natives experienced it as a hallucinogenic, having visions colours etc.

So we westerners are 'predisposed' to be able to drink .
As other cultures may be 'predisposed' to other drugs.

And we do need to 'get away' at times:)
« Last Edit: 02/02/2009 12:49:50 by yor_on »
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #12 on: 02/02/2009 12:46:47 »
Karsten - I deliberately didn't go into too much detail and maybe, as a result, my post was somewhat misleading. For this I apologise. In response to the valid points you raised I shall explain further.

What I meant by "alcohol does not cause alcoholism" is that I perceive alcoholism as a manifestation of a deeper condition. Alcohol can trigger presentation of this deeper condition in the same way that it can be triggered by drugs (I also think that gambling addiction and some forms of OCD could be related although I did not research that). It is the same underlying condition. Maybe what I should have said is that alcohol does not cause addiction. (Blame my medication!  ;D )

Quote
What do you do with research that points out that certain people have "potential" to be addicted to something? I see a million ways to abuse such data and discriminate against people with such potential.

For my research I took over 300 existing profiles of alcoholics & drug addicts. In addition I interviewed 250 myself. For the interviews I conducted I used a modified version of an existing profiling method. As the existing profiles had been compiled using a variety of methods I developed a technique of mapping those and mine to a common profile format so that they could be compared. I discussed this process at length with my PhD leader to ensure I wasn't weighting the results or including questions that would lead the participants into giving answers that would slew the results in a biased way.

I then interviewed 200 non-addicts to use as a control group.

The results were then subjected to statistical analysis (thanks to a brainy bugger from the maths faculty because I'm thick when it comes to that sort of thing).

What I found was a strong correlation in the profiles of alcoholics and drug addicts that was not present in most of the non-addicts' profiles. It was this correlation that led me to the conclusion that there is a predeliction, or potential, to addiction. Those non-addicts where I found correlation with the addicts I deduced was indicative of a latent potential that had not presented.

As anyone who has done a PhD will appreciate, my research was subjected to very rigorous examination by some of the most critical and unforgiving minds in the field. Their job was to try to find holes in the research in order to invalidate it. It is different from ordinary research in that respect where papers can be published without so much of a critical peer review. The panel was satisfied that my research was sound; the results & conclusions valid.

Subsequent research at Oxford university found indications of a genetic factor to addiction which would seem to support my own conclusions.

Your question about what can be done with such research can be applied to many subjects. I have no control over how it is used in the same way that those who developed a method of testing for HIV hold no sway over the life assurance business.
« Last Edit: 02/02/2009 22:29:13 by DoctorBeaver »
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #13 on: 02/02/2009 12:53:09 »

Quote
And not every person suffering from alcoholism drinks alcohol. As far as I understand, you may still be an alcohol addict, but not using it right now.

This statement contradicts what you're trying to claim; if people addicted to alcohol are not currently using alcohol but are still considered to be addicted then it can't be the alcohol that makes them an addict.

Alcoholism cannot be cured. All that can be done is that the condition be controlled. I personally know alcoholics who can drink quite normally most of the time, but every once in a while it gets hold of them again. I also know those who have not had a drink for years only to relapse.
 

Offline yor_on

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #14 on: 02/02/2009 12:58:17 »
Yes DB, you are definitely on the spot there.
Those genetic predispositions still exist.

Perhaps they are one, or more, combination of genes?
Just as there are some people that do other drugs without loosing their 'identity'.

Rolling Stones, don't remember the guys name, may be an example of that (heroin)?
But for anyone of those you will find hundreds that loose everything to drugs.

With the exception of those drugs, like for westerners alcohol, that we sort of are 'hardwired' through long use and abuse to manage.
In that case we still will see 'alcoholics' but not as many as if it was some other drug used.
At least that's my belief:)
 

Offline yor_on

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #15 on: 02/02/2009 13:21:23 »
Reading your latest reply DB I get an impression that you might draw a different conclusion from your research?
You see it as a generalized predisposition for drugs in general?

It is old knowledge that those who do amphetamine, and those who do heroin have preferences for their own drugs.
Why would it be so if all drugs where as 'interesting' for those people?
I agree to that there will be an 'overlapping' of drugs, also that social circumstances will play a big part in who will do what, but I still think that genes have a large part of the 'blame' to take.
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #16 on: 02/02/2009 13:28:22 »
Reading your latest reply DB I get an impression that you might draw a different conclusion from your research?
You see it as a generalized predisposition for drugs in general?

It is old knowledge that those who do amphetamine, and those who do heroin have preferences for their own drugs.
Why would it be so if all drugs where as 'interesting' for those people?


I think that may be due to other psychological factors.
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #17 on: 02/02/2009 13:31:30 »
I think my research may also indicate why some people are able to use drugs or alcohol to the same extent as addicts yet not become addicted.
 

Offline yor_on

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #18 on: 02/02/2009 14:10:13 »
That one will be interesting to read DB
And? I guess you don't want to present it just yet:)

But be sure to drop us the link when you're ready.
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #19 on: 02/02/2009 14:12:52 »
I meant the research I have already done; that which I referred to above.
 

Offline yor_on

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Re: What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #20 on: 02/02/2009 14:41:52 »
I thought you might have embarked on an larger scale.

So what do you see as the correlations DB?
 

Offline DoctorBeaver

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What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #21 on: 02/02/2009 18:51:21 »
It was a correlation of various nodes on the profiles
 

Offline yor_on

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What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #22 on: 02/02/2009 20:45:30 »
Ahem, I see?
Pointy things, were they?
 

Offline Karsten

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What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #23 on: 02/02/2009 21:46:11 »
... excessive and inappropriate consumption of alcohol is the result of alcoholism, ...

It also may lead to alcoholism. I believe it is the only way to get that disease.

This is not so.  Excessive and inappropriate consumption of alcohol is more likely to make you throw up and swear never to get drunk again.  While many, if not most, people have drunk alcohol to excess at some time, only a small proportion of them will become alcoholics who then go on to drink excessively all the time.

But you do have to drink alcohol to become an alcoholic, right? Maybe not excessively (whatever that is) and inappropriately (whatever that is), but you will have to drink it. it seems, "ideally" for a long time and just a bit at a time.

 

Offline Karsten

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What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
« Reply #24 on: 02/02/2009 21:47:26 »
I am still wondering about alcoholism rates in the USA, Germany , UK, other European country. I would like to compare. Anyone got some numbers?
 

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What is the impact of alcoholism on youths?
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