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Author Topic: Saudi Size Oil field claim  (Read 38910 times)

Offline erich

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Saudi Size Oil field claim
« on: 14/08/2005 16:15:43 »
Dear Folks,
 
What do ya'll think of the talk of the 6 billion barrel claims of Eden Energy?
They have contracted three wells this fall to 15000 feet on their Noah prospect in Nevada.
 
Eden Energy Corp.
http://www.edenenergycorp.com/
 
Ely Times- Eden Energy seeks oil near Ely
http://www.elynews.com/archive/2005/07/15/LocalNews/324444.html


Erich J. Knight


 

Offline Bass

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #1 on: 14/08/2005 18:41:07 »
From a geological standpoint, all the right ingredients are present:
good source rocks
geologic structures to transport and trap hydrocarbon deposits
younger cap rocks

The only thing missing at this point is...    OIL

Sounds like a great place to look for the stuff, but other promising spots in the US overthrust belt have not panned out as expected.  Wait for some positive results from the drill holes before investing.  There may be a reason why Exxon pulled out the area years ago.

Prediction is difficult, especially the future.  -Niels Bohr
« Last Edit: 14/08/2005 18:41:38 by Bass »
 

Offline erich

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #2 on: 15/08/2005 01:55:12 »
I believe I read tha exxon only went to 8000 feet, and pulled out at the time of the Valdese spill.

Erich J. Knight
 

Offline erich

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #3 on: 15/08/2005 02:04:28 »
And I found this today, they are talking trillions of barrels for the whole structure

:ELEPHANT HUNTING IN NEVADA

SPEAKER
Alan K. Chamberlain, Cedar Strat Corp.

DATE
11:30 am, Tuesday, June 29, 2004

LOCATION
TELUS CONVENTION CENTRE, CALGARY, ALBERTA - MACLEOD HALL BCD*

PLEASE NOTE:
The cutoff date for ticket sales is 1:00 pm, Thursday, June 24th. Ticket price is $28.00 + GST. (For ticket purchasing information CLICK HERE.)

The central Nevada thrust belt provides an opportunity to explore for giant oil and gas fields. Thick, thermally mature, organic-rich, lacustrine oil shales deposited in the Mississippian Antler basin flood plains are the source beds for the fifty million barrels of oil already produced in Nevada. Karsted unconformities, stromatoporoid reefs, impact breccias, and sandstones make Nevada's Devonian reservoir rocks most favorable for giant accumulations. Late Cretaceous thrusting created the compressional features of the prolific Canadian foothills, Utah/Wyoming thrust belt and the central Nevada thrust belt.

Typically, oil seeps are associated with oilbearing thrust belts worldwide. However, a blanket of Tertiary volcanics sealed in many of Nevada's oil seeps and concealed Nevada's thrust belt. Some of these seeps, including Grant Canyon, Blackburn, Trap Spring, and Eagle Springs oil fields, built up enough oil to become commercial. So far, all of Nevada's crude has been produced from these commercial oil seeps. Little effort has been expended to identify the source of these commercial oil seeps because of the lack of an accurate geologic map and model.  In contrast to other states, the State of Nevada has never surveyed its mineral potential. The cursory geologic mapping by the federal government is not adequate for exploration purposes. Old depositional and deformational models, based on insufficient data, have been entrenched into the literature, thus impeding exploration.  An old model championed by the United States Geological Survey is the theory that the Mississippian Antler Basin siliciclastics were deposited as flysch turbidites into a deep foreland basin between the Antler highlands in central Nevada and the Utah hingeline in central Utah. However, new field data indicates regressive sequences containing vascular plant roots (Stigmaria) penetrating bedding planes and lacustrine palynomorph assemblages. This new data dispels the old model and supports a new depositional environment model. The new model shows that the richest and most oilprone Mississippian source rocks are lacustrine oil shales. Lacustrine oil shales make oil exploration in the Antler Basin very attractive. Cumulative thicknesses of these world-class lacustrine oil source rocks are measured in thousands of feet in outcrops and wells. They are thick enough and rich enough to generate trillions of barrels of oil.

Until the early 1980s the typical exploration practice in Nevada was to drill just the Tertiary valley fill in synclines.Therefore, most of the eight hundred wells drilled in Nevada penetrate only syncline Tertiary valley fill. Few wells have penetrated any Paleozoic section.  However, two significant fields were found by drilling "too deep" and penetrating Devonian rocks below the Tertiary unconformity. Oil flows from Devonian reservoirs in the Blackburn and Grant Canyon oil fields. One well in Grant Canyon flowed 4,000 barrels a day for ten years. It has now produced more than 15,000,000 barrels of oil since its discovery in 1983. The Grant Canyon reservoir consists of 200 to 400 feet of karst breccia at the top of the Middle Devonian Simonson Formation. This karst interval is found in wells and measured sections throughout the eastern Great Basin. In addition to the karst interval, stromatoporoid reefs, impact breccia, quartz sandstones, and other intervals provide world-class reservoir rocks within the eastern Great Basin Devonian sequences.An isopach of all the Devonian sequences reveals a structurally compressed basin –the Sunnyside Basin – and can be used to predict the spacial distribution of potential Devonian reservoir rocks. The Simonson karst breccia interval alone has the capacity to store billions of barrels of oil in certain structures.A careful analysis of logs from the few wells that penetrated other significant portions of Paleozoic rocks shows that, contrary to preconceived notions, many intervals contain similar reservoir rocks. Another deeply entrenched notion that discouraged exploration investment is that the north-south structural grain of the eastern Great Basin was caused by Tertiary extension which could have compromised seals on older, compressional structures. However, new mapping is revealing many uncharted compressional features and a lack of extensional features. The new maps demonstrate that the region underwent much more compression than previously thought. Furthermore, some of these features show no evidence of being broken by major Tertiary extensional faults. Several unbroken compressional structures in the Timpahute Range, 50 miles south of the prolific Grant Canyon field, are exposed. Another example of an intact compressional feature is the Golden Gate fault fold 40 miles south southeast of the prolific Grant Canyon field and ten miles north of the Timpahute Range.The Golden Gate fault fold is ten miles long and five miles wide and has more than five thousand feet of closure. It may have trapped billions of barrels of oil before it was breached by headward erosion of the Colorado River.New mapping reveals that no Tertiary extensional faults compromise the structure. Similar structures, along strike that have escaped erosion, likely contain billions of barrels of oil and trillions of cubic feet of gas.  Oil seeping from these giant fields is probably the source for the commercial oil seep fields in Nevada.However, old opinion and theories based on little or poor geologic mapping have obscured the true understanding of Nevada geology for at least five decades. As a result, past oil exploration efforts in Nevada based on old tectonic and depositional models have been disappointing.

BIOGRAPHY

Alan K. Chamberlain received his B.A. and M.S. from Brigham Young University and his Ph.D. from Colorado School of Mines. His dissertation, Structural Geology and Devonian Stratigraphy of the Timpahute Range, Nevada, provides a new exploration model that could lead to significant discoveries in this frontier region.  After he worked for Exxon, Gulf, Marathon, and Placid, he became president of Cedar Strat Corp. in 1984.

Cedar Strat was organized at the request of several major oil companies to fill a need for exploration data for Great Basin exploration. Alan conceived the idea of using a scintillation counter to create a surface gamma-ray log of measured sections while working for Gulf Oil after having worked for Exxon Minerals USA in uranium exploration. It was not until Placid hired him away from Marathon to head up their Great Basin program that he had the freedom to test the idea. At Placid, Alan had the unique opportunity to visit many of Shell Oil Company's staked measured sections by helicopter with former Shell geologists. They had been involved in measuring the sections in the 1950s and 1960s. Using the Shell measured sections he learned the Paleozoic stratigraphy of the Great Basin. As he remeasured many of the sections, he applied his new technique of surface gamma-ray logs. He earned the Best Poster of the Session Award at the 1983 National American Association of Petroleum Geologists when he presented his work on surface gamma-ray logs in the Wyoming thrust belt and in the Great Basin.  His abstract and subsequent paper attracted the attention of national and international oil companies that have applied his surface gamma-ray log technique worldwide. Development of this successful technique resulted in the formation of Cedar Strat Corp. in 1984. A presentation to the American Association of Petroleum Geologists of the results of Alan's new, sequence stratigraphic model of the Mississippian Antler Basin including lacustrine source rocks secured him the Levorson Award in the late 1980s.

*Room location subject to change without notice




Erich J. Knight
 

Offline Evie

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #4 on: 15/08/2005 19:18:39 »
This is very interesting to me as I live in Nevada. I agree that the preponderance of revenue-producing geological exploration has been based in silver and gold mining, ignoring the potential for oil. The fact that this company already has wells planned is a good sign, as a lot of work is put in before they will make that kind of investment. I remember doing a lab in one of my geology courses when we had to essentially create our own oil company, bid on plots of land, do research, drill exploratory wells, etc. We had a certain amount of money and based on the oil we hit, we could make more...whoever ended up with the most money won. It was an expensive process, and drilling an exploratory well was still very risky. You could have all of the signs that this was a prime location for oil, drill, and find nothing.

The conditions have to be just right for oil production, and often, that oil can escape. Personally, I think that any oil discovery is just prolonging the inevitable. We are going to eventually run out of the fossil fuel (estimates on current reserves is 50-150 years), and will need something else to provide not only energy for our cars, but raw material for the production of many of our wonderful plastics. And you know how much we love plastic!


I like to lick rocks....
 

Offline David Sparkman

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #5 on: 16/08/2005 03:08:27 »
Below a certain depth, you don't find oil, you find gas. But it is still useable energy. As far as plastics go, we can use vegatation to make any plastics we need. It is just more expensive. If we keep drilling real deep holes, hell, geothermal might just get back in the picture in some places...

David
 

Offline erich

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #6 on: 16/08/2005 05:00:18 »
A post from Earth Science Forums http://www.scienceforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=45

Re: Saudi Size oil field Claim

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wish them luck, but I don't see it as a good investment for oil or gas production given their posted data.


Quote:
Source rock is Mississippian lacustrine oil shales with organic content averaging between 3% and 6% and thousands of feet thickness.  


Oil shale is not a good source rock for petroluem. It is way too hydrogen-deficient, and the organics are bound to the clay fraction of the rock. Diagenesis could give you pyrolysis and oil release, but that product would be highly unsaturated and prone to repolymerization. Much more severe conditions would give you cracking to natural gas, but they claim things were mild over time.

Pyrolysis of Colorado oil shale, in situ by combustion or mined and surface processed by heat exchange, gets you rivers of shale oil. It is the perfect refinery poison:

1) It is heavily unsaturated. Even refinery hydrogen costs a fortune.
2) It is rich with nitrogen. That kills the acid zeolite support in your reforming catalyst.
3) It has a nice arsenic content. That kills the noble metal in your reforming catalyst.
4) It has a pour point not much below room temp. That makes pipeline transportation somewhat interesting.

DO YOU WANT GUARANTEED CHEAP BIG OIL PRODUCTION FROM DOMESTIC FIELDS? Drown some Enviro-whiners and re-open the Santa Barbara Channel oil fields in Southern California. It's that simple and fool-proof. It's an ocean of oil sitting under the asses of a few sea otters.

--------------------
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/qz.pdf

Erich J. Knight
 

Offline erich

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #7 on: 16/08/2005 05:41:20 »
Dear Evie,

I agree totaly, all great points, and I hope at least one of these  two companies  will provide the energy cure and not just a band aid: Borealis and or Electron Power Systems


 Big science has spent 10's of billions ,all tolled, and we are no closer to a break even fusion reactor. Just a few hundred thousand toward these alternative concepts may get us there, and in years, not decades.

I have posted these questions at many physics forums, and to academics in this field, with little response, I thought you all may be interested.

There are three companies pursuing hydrogen-boron plasma toroid fusion, Paul Koloc, Prometheus II, Eric Lerner, Focus Fusion and Clint Seward of Electron Power Systems. A resent DOD review of EPS technology reads as fallows:

"MIT considers these plasmas a revolutionary breakthrough, with Delphi's
chief scientist and senior manager for advanced technology both agreeing
that EST/SPT physics are repeatable and theoretically explainable. MIT and
EPS have jointly authored numerous professional papers describing their
work. (Delphi is a $33B company, the spun off Delco Division of General
Motors)."

and

"Cost: no cost data available. The complexity of reliable mini-toroid
formation and acceleration with compact, relatively low-cost equipment
remains to be determined. Yet the fact that the EPS/MIT STTR work this
technology has attracted interest from Delphi is very significant, as the
automotive electronics industry is considered to be extremely demanding of
functionality per dollar and pound (e.g., mil-spec performance at
Wal-Mart-class 'commodity' prices)."

EPS, Electron Power Systems seems the strongest and most advanced, and I love the scalability, They propose applications as varied as home power generation@ .ooo5 cents/KWhr, cars, distributed power, airplanes, space propulsion , power storage and kinetic weapons.

It also provides a theoretic base for ball lighting : Ball Lightning Explained as a Stable Plasma Toroid


The theoretics are all there in peer reviewed papers. It does sound to good to be true however with names like MIT, Delphi, STTR grants, NIST grants , etc., popping up all over, I have to keep investigating.

Recent support has also come from one of the top lightning researcher in the world, Joe Dwyer at FIT, when he got his Y-ray and X-ray research published in the may Scientific American,

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&colID=1&articleID=00032CE5-13B7-1264-8F9683414B7FFE9F

Dwyer's paper:
http://www.lightning.ece.ufl.edu/PDF/Gammarays.pdf


and according to Clint Seward it supports his lightning models and fusion work at EPS, Electron Power Systems


Clint sent Joe and I his new paper on a lightning charge transport model of cloud to ground lightning (If your interested I'll send it,he did not want me to post it to the web yet). Joe was supportive and suggested some other papers and Clint is now in re-write.

It may also explain Elves, blue jets, sprites and red sprites, plasmas that appear above thunder storms. After a little searching, this seemed to have the best hard numbers on the observations of sprites.

Dr. Mark A. Stanley's Dissertation
http://nis-www.lanl.gov/~stanleym/dissertation/main.html


And may also explain the spiral twist of fulgurites, hollow fused sand tubes found in the ground at lightning strikes.

Not to blow my own horn, but I got them talking with my E-mail inquires!


In my searches for efficient home technology I came across Electron Power Systems. I E-mailed EPS about the obvious synergies for their home generator with the power chips of Borealis. I also contacted Borealis. I have been mediating an argument between Clint Seward of Electron Power Systems with Rodney T. Cox of http://www.powerchips.gi/. Basically Rodney said they got the math wrong and NASA is right and Clint says MIT doesn't get their math wrong. I thought you may have an interest and be of help. Both companies are proposing very disruptive technologies, Borealis in Quantum Tunneling thermoelectrics and EPS in micro fusion.
Mediating, in this case, means in the middle of e-mail exchanges.
The issue seems to be Dr. Chen's paper and whether his assumptions of the aspect ratio for the plasma toroids, match the model of Clint Seward proposed device. Will the ion stability condition be satisfied to maintain equilibrium?
I'm in way over my head here and have been seeking help from interested parties, if you know any plasma physicist that may help that would be great. All pertinent papers are at EPS's web site.

(Also
Borealis has an interesting patent on a thermionic car that uses the companies quantum tunneling thermocouples and Chorus motor electric drives. I sent their president, Rodney Cox, the news of this new carbon storage technology using grafite, and asked him about the estimated over all well-to-wheel efficiency.
The Chorus motors produce 300% more torque by overcoming harmonic drag and the Power Chip thermocouples may be up to 80% efficient. This means that with a hydrogen storage system that has an equal energy density to an average gas tank, this car would have a range of 1500 miles!........... and Boeing just anounced it's plans to use Chorus drives in the nose gear of it's airliners :  http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2005/q3/nr_050801a.ht     )

After posting to several Science, physics and Energy forums I collected up comments and questions and asked Clint Seward , to respond:

"Your most important point was that others have suggested that I should be
able to demonstrate a collision of EST's and even a level of fusion with a
few hundred thousand dollars and about a year. I agree. Here is what I
need to do:

1. Capture the EST in a way that I can measure them. I have designed a
method in the last two months that will do this.
2. Measure the density of the EST. This requirement is something everyone
is asking for, and will enable me to get serious funding from sponsors.
3. Collide two EST's. I have found a simple way to do this based on the
TRISOPS work by Wells.
4. Consulting work by Chen to verify the physics I have outlined for the
density.
5. Make and measure an EST based on Deuterium.
6. Collide two Deuterium EST's.

Each of these requires some cash outlays, so I am working them as I can get
resources. Several people, including yourself, are considering helpful
investments of $5k to $10k to 25K to 50K to 100k. Work will progress with
any investment, no matter how small. Capturing an EST is a $5k investment.

Your second most important point is that more people want to see more data
and even a video. I have many of these, but have not published them yet. I
have concentrated on the physics, which I feel I now know completely, and
can get confirmed. This is a smaller effort, about $15k

Clint Seward"


This technology is so green (only by product helium) and solves such a panoply of world problems, if it is as viable as the Department of Defense feels it is, it is the fuel of the American dream.

Thank you for your Attention.


Erich J. Knight
Shenandoah Gardens
E-mail: shengar@aol.com
(540) 289-9750
 
 


Erich J. Knight
 

Offline erich

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #8 on: 16/08/2005 16:48:51 »
Here's a reply to Uncle Al, from :Raging Bull: Eden Energy Corp Message Board
http://ragingbull.lycos.com/mboard/boards.cgi?board=EDNE&newpost=1

By: blanketpower
16 Aug 2005, 02:34 AM EDT Msg. 1112 of 1116
(Msg. is a reply to 1111 by erichknight.)  
Re: scienceforum post

The guy's data is specific to the area and type of rock he is talking about (Colorado oil shales). Has nothing to do with EDEN. At EDEN we are NOT talking about the pyrolysis of oil shales (mining and "cracking" of oil-bearing shales, similar to mining Athabasca "tar sands"). Rather, we are talking about the pumping of trapped oil from dolomitic reservoir formations, with lacustrine shale as the original source rock.

Here are a couple of (the many available) examples of commercial oil derived from lacustrine shales as the source rock:

A large proportion of Oklahoma's oil resources are derived originally from shale (Woodford shale, for example) but are not extracted from the shale itself - the viable deposits are found in formations adjacent to the shale that have trapped oil that was squeezed (squozen?) out over time.

Equatorial Guinea is another example - world class oil and gas hosted in sandstone, but the source rock is underlying lacustrine shales from Kissenda and Melania formations.

These examples are the type of thing that EDEN is talking about - in our case, Mississippian lacustrine shales overlain by porous dolomites. If you drill into the shale itself you find the kind of hydrocarbon-bearing crap that poster is talking about (relatively common in eastern Nevada, and uneconomical), but if you have a sealed reservoir over the shale (in our case a very porous Devonian dolomite) you may be in business.

That is what makes EDEN attractive. We know the original source rock (shale) is all over the place, and is hydrocarbon rich. We also know that the source rock is overlain by a porous formation, and that the geological structures (anticlines) are in place that (a) show evidence of tectonic compression; and (b) have created generally enclosing structures. We also know that within the overall anticline several terminal structures are in place that would serve as specific trap-points for the oil.

(Note: Anticlines are sort of like railway tunnels in shape... long structures with big domed roofs, but open at the ends where the train enters and leaves. Open anticlines tend not to trap oil - when compressed it leaves via the ends of the tunnel. Terminal structures are analogous to roof collapses in the tunnel. They create "dead ends" within the tunnels where oil can accumulate. That's why the recent news was so significant - several of these terminal structures are present within our anticline). All of the pieces are in place for a world class deposit. Still not a guarantee, but a very good bet.

I have not been a geologist for over 20 years, and do not feel like getting into a p*ssing match with some new college grad with a shiny diploma and un-scuffed field boots who wants to show the world how brilliant he is. It has been too long a time - I would lose. I will gladly defer to a better explanation from a more recent practitioner of the art, but thought I would post this from what is left of my crusty, half-dead geological memory in an effort to put your mind at ease.

Good luck to all.
 


Erich J. Knight
 

Offline mmagic

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #9 on: 17/08/2005 06:06:52 »
quote:
Originally posted by erich

Dear Folks,
 
What do ya'll think of the talk of the 6 billion barrel claims of Eden Energy?
They have contracted three wells this fall to 15000 feet on their Noah prospect in Nevada.
 
Eden Energy Corp.
newbielink:http://www.edenenergycorp.com/ [nonactive]
 
Ely Times- Eden Energy seeks oil near Ely
newbielink:http://www.elynews.com/archive/2005/07/15/LocalNews/324444.html [nonactive]


Erich J. Knight

 

Offline mmagic

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #10 on: 17/08/2005 06:28:43 »
If you haven't yet done it, play the following speech by Adam Chamberlain using Real Player to get the benefit of all the Powerpoint slides.
newbielink:http://www.insinc.com/onlinetv/cspg29june2004/ [nonactive]

I'm not a geologist but I've been in Oil and Gas since '76. In my book this is a legitimate wildcat oil and gas play, not a scam. I find it most interesting the amount of lease acreage acquired by Eden.... at least 293,000 acres including Noah (Diamond Mountain) and Railroad Valley before turning a bit.

Follow closely Tri-Valley's Midland Trail well being completed in Railroad Valley.  Watch the Oil Springs Prospects 1 and 2 next to Diamond Mountain that Tri-Valley is preparing to drill. Tri-Valley appears to be using much of the geology that Eden. Tri-Valley drilled Midland Trail with only 3,000 acres.

Yes, Shell once owned Railroad valley and poked dry holes every six miles right down the middle of the valey.  Subsequently, others drilled Grant Canyon, Midland Trail etc. right up close the mountain ranges.

Eden has a different problem for the investor. With only 10 mil shares in float, they've been trading 2 to 3 mil per day the last month up from 90 thou. Momentum traders and Short players are all over this thing. Buyins.net reports that brokers haven't covered short sales for 32 days and they must buy back shares in the open market at 13 days. This problem is insame volatility.... totally aside from any functional value.

Personally, I've been in and out of this one using 15% stop orders to the point that I'm playing only with house money. You need luck both on your stock trades and on the holes drilled on this one.

 

 

Offline VAlibrarian

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #11 on: 20/08/2005 03:16:25 »
I do not take a position on this Nevada oil exploration effort, because I am no geologist.

However, it is very clear that most of the recoverable petroleum in the lower 48 has already been pumped. And there are reasons to believe that the petroleum reserves of planet Earth are reaching their halfway point- an extremely significant event since the second half of such a resource is much more difficult and more expensive to locate than the first half was.
Do not try to tell me that we can drill our way out of our oil issues, because it just aint that way.

chris wiegard
 

Offline mmagic

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #12 on: 20/08/2005 04:38:18 »
Quote
Originally posted by VAlibrarian
"I do not take a position on this Nevada oil exploration effort, because I am no geologist."

Oxymoron... If you are not a geologist how do you know that most of the petroleum in the lower 48 have been pumped??  

Yes, the earths reserves are finite and alternatives such as nuclear will become cost effective as demand exceeds finite supply driving oil prices to a point that real alternatives are cost favorable.

The point you miss is that in 1950 it was beleived that there was onlly 7to 10 years reserves, ditto 1960, ditto 1970 etc. However, no one knows what the finite reserves really are.

If you are willing to write off proven reserves such as the Santa Barbara channel, areas where a toad might have to relocate or a tree hugger objects to the sight of a well head, dooms day will be sooner rather than later.

Among the arguements against your hypothosis are the changing technologies for recovery and the fact that in many of the older abandoned fields in OK and TX the mineral ownership is so fragmented that it is virtually impossible to obtain title to harvest oil revoerable under current methods.

For the time being you best be cheering the efforts and risk taking  by companies like Eden and Tri-Valley Corp.    


 

sharkeyandgeorge

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #13 on: 20/08/2005 14:36:59 »
watching a tv programme on scottish north sea oil last night (whos fields provide over half the oil and most of the gass used) i was surprised to learn that around seventy percent of the fields oil is still there but up till recently was too deep to be drilled. although like every one i would prefer to live without our dependance on fossil fuels if we have to continue to use oil would we not be better to use up all the oil in the fields already active before we violate and destroy the ecosystems of new fields?

Giggidy Giggidy Goo
The philosopher Q man
 

Offline VAlibrarian

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #14 on: 21/08/2005 01:33:55 »
okay, as stated i admit i am no geologist. However, mainstream thought of petroleum analysts is consistent with my position. Read Out of Gas, a recent book on the future of oil.

I like having a car as much as the next guy. However, it is hard for me to rejoice at the prolongation of our dependence on petroleum for transportation because the faster we pump the recoverable reserves, the worse the panic when the price suddenly goes up due to an imbalance between supply and demand. I watch the news.
The other problem with fossil fuels is that they cause global warming. The problem with global warming is that it promises severe climate change, but only after it is too late for us to take steps to prevent it. It's like HIV- nobody runs away from the guy spreading it because at first he still looks great.

chris wiegard
 

Offline mmagic

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #15 on: 21/08/2005 08:08:49 »
Oil and gas reserves are finite but that doesn't mean that on some day in 2010 it's all suddenly gone. The cost of recovery becomes gradually more expensive as the fuels are recovered from deeper or more obsure and difficult loactions. And, the return economics are required to justify the risks of such recovery.

That is why oil production companies like Suncor and BP have become actively invested in alternatives such as wind. Oil and gas producers are risk takers and they are willing to go places and make investments while the left coast will only ring their hands about the unavailbility of hydrogen cars.

The transition to alternatives is driven by the economics of the options. Note the use of electricity generating solar panels that has quietly become common place for traffic signs and remote power needs.      The economics has taken advantage over old hard wired sources that generally rely on fosil fuels.

Drive accros Wyoming and count the hundreds of wind turbines generating power. It is an evolution to alternatives and it is happening.

Unlike manufacturing of say cell phones where supply can be accelerated virtually immediately, there is a several year cycle to  bring addtional hydrocarbon production on line once justified by commodity price.  So in the short run supply is fixed while demand may fluctuate quickly due to weather, wars or warm winters leading to the only natural consequence in a free market of price fluctuation to sort out who needs it the most.

As for global warming... that has more political arguements than    inteligent design.

Back to the original reason for this thread.  If in fact Eden's 293,000 acres of lease provides 5% of the 6 billion barrels some have suggested it would likely be produced for far less than $20 a barrel because it is on shore and the discovery cost to the company is minimal. My point is that modest success could result in a a good return for investors. 6 billion barrels would be a lottery win.        
 

sharkeyandgeorge

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #16 on: 22/08/2005 10:58:03 »
That is why oil production companies like Suncor and BP have become actively invested in alternatives such as wind.

that may be true mmagic but what about the rumours that have been circulating for forty years that large oil companies have been buying the patents for alternative enery for years simple so that they do not get on the market and spoil the oil industries stranglehold on energy are all of these thousands of rumours untrue?.  bp and others are researching other energys im sure but only so that when the oil runs out they will hold all these patants too and if they are sitting on the next cold fusion or star in a jar you can be sure it wont come out till they have squeezed every last penny out of oil.

Giggidy Giggidy Goo
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Offline daveshorts

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #17 on: 22/08/2005 12:24:04 »
I think that is a bit harsh - I would have thought that oil companies are investing in alternatives for two reasons:
-Possibly to make money if conventional sources become more expensive
-To look cudley and not so evil...
There is no point in them investing in finding the next cold fusion if they don't patent it, and if they do patent it then we would hear about it...
 

Offline hogbody

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #18 on: 24/08/2005 00:44:17 »
1) Mississippian "oil shales". There has not been a single outcrop of Miss. oil shales reported in the western U.S. Most of this purported source rock contains some coal, or is marine where deposited away from the Roberts overthrust.
2) The majority of oil found in Nevada is derived from Tertiary oil shales.
3) Buy Eden stock now and sell BEFORE they reach TD. Then you can make a little $$$. This thing is not the Zagros and it is not the Covenant discovery in Utah. It does, however, seem to be a bunch of hype.
 

Offline mmagic

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #19 on: 24/08/2005 05:31:24 »
The old rule.... Buy on the rumor sell on the fact.

Even if the prospect is tremendous, it would take years to drill it out and turn potential into bottom line.

One must separate the underlying fundamentals from the stock momentum. That is not to say don't trade it. Just don't bet the farm and throw the stock in a dresser drawer. You must be on top of this one and/or have your trailing stops in place. When it starts to move in any direction it has on occasion moved like a dragster.

 

Offline Buy beer for a miner

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #20 on: 24/08/2005 20:09:00 »
One thing's for sure though. If Chamberlain is right and Eden finds a thrust trap for the Mississippian Chainman "oil shale", there will be a lot of small companies sitting pretty in Eastern Nevada with the land they have already leased for pennies.
Check out:
newbielink:http://www.ewg.org/oil_and_gas/search.php [nonactive] , if you are interested in who is best positioned for a possible boom.

Cheers
 

Offline VAlibrarian

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #21 on: 25/08/2005 03:24:27 »
I'm also trying to figure out how to say this without being pompous- it is possible to "hype" an investment by praising its upside potential on the web. I think that is NOT the intent here, but it still makes me uneasy.

chris wiegard
 

Offline David Sparkman

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #22 on: 25/08/2005 23:56:35 »
There are all kinds of laws to try to prevent fraud and deception in claims like these. But as far as I know, none of those laws pertain to the internet. Every day I get emails asking me to help some person in Africa move illegal money into my country by providing my bank information. Of coures that is a fraud which would quickly empty my bank account with no legal resource available to get my money back.

People trying to sell you a get rich scheme over the internet are in the great tradition of the scam artists of the 1800's before there were any laws restricting the craft.

Personally, my get rich scheme is hard work, and I can't afford "Free".

David
 

Offline VAlibrarian

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #23 on: 26/08/2005 02:11:02 »
yes David, I get some of those emails from Nigeria with somebody wanting to give me $200,000- they just need me to send along $500 first so that they can bribe somebody to open a bank vault. Somehow they also found out that I am a Rotary Club member so they always make sure to mention that up front.
Are there any people in Nigeria who do not make a living from scams?
There must be.
The "phishing" messages are annoying too. Those are the ones from my bank (not really from my bank) saying that I need to give them my bank account number so that they can make sure their records are correct. As if any bank anywhere would need the account holders to tell them the account #s! I'm sure that if I were dumb enough to go along with it and type my #, I would find out the next day that my checking account is suddenly empty.
I wish it were possible to catch these guys and give them some jail time, but apparently it is not.

chris wiegard
 

Offline VAlibrarian

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Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #24 on: 26/08/2005 02:12:44 »
Sorry, that was really departing from the original topic and I should not do that.

chris wiegard
 

The Naked Scientists Forum

Re: Saudi Size Oil field claim
« Reply #24 on: 26/08/2005 02:12:44 »

 

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