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Author Topic: If the Higgs Boson doesn't exist, what will take its place?  (Read 3969 times)

Offline The Craftsman

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I've been following the LHC patiently for many years now waiting for it to come online and find that pesky Higgs boson.  But more and more recently as I consider the implications of it I'm reminded of Michelson-Morely and the search for the aether.

The situations are somewhat analogous.  Without the aether contemporary models of light fell apart, and the door was opened for all that radical particle wave, quantised packets, photoelectric effect stuff.  If the Higgs Boson fails to emerge the standard model will fall apart, its somewhat difficult to do physics if nothing has mass I've heard.

So the question is, if the Higgs boson is found to not exist, what are the currently radical/fringe theories that will fill the vacuum after the fallout?

[MOD EDIT - PLEASE PHRASE YOUR POST TITLES AS QUESTIONS, IN LINE WITH FORUM POLICY. THANKS. CHRIS]
« Last Edit: 07/10/2009 19:48:44 by chris »


 

Offline JP

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Perhaps someone else knows more about these theories, but there are a few alternatives listed on the Wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higgsless_model

It would be very exciting to not find the Higgs, because that means a new theory will have to take the place of the standard model.
 

Offline sbannist

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So here goes. Deep breath. There is a fringe theory that infers mass from a generally covariant unified field theory. Much else (everything physical I suppose) is inferred.

The principle author is vilified by the mainstream and routinely criticized on or expunged from popular sites such as wiki; he threatens almost everything in mainstream physics, notably the funding.

I am not a physicist, but have absorbed much of the maths to follow this as, if true, it is a revolution. I think the odds are pretty good.

If you have the stomach for revolution, the maths, and most importantly an open mind, then here is a window:

newbielink:http://atomicprecision.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/geometry-and-matter-in-ece-theory/ [nonactive]
 

Offline The Craftsman

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Interesting stuff.  The math is a bit over my head, so I'm going to have to spend some time with it to get a better grasp of it.  The Higgs field along with singularities, uncertianty principle, dark matter, and the big bang among others have all been tossed out.  I can see how that might upset a few physicists. 

If what they're claiming (ECE math syncing up with experimental data better than SM equations) is true, its worth some serious consideration.  Thanks for the link, fascinating.
 

Offline Ron Hughes

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Craftsman, the collision of two protons will always produce waves and QM has made the decision to call a detected wave with a particular energy a particle,no matter that the wave exists for nanoseconds or less. Science couldn't explain mass, charge, gravity or inertia so they invented QM as an alternative solution.
 

Offline sbannist

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Welcome to the fringes, or maybe the region of dragons. I have found the following link useful on the maths...Sean Carroll is a very well known theoretical physicist with a GR book - Evans uses him fairly extensively. I think this link will have much of the foundation you will need.

newbielink:http://nedwww.ipac.caltech.edu/level5/March01/Carroll3/Carroll0.html [nonactive]
 

Offline Vern

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I suspect that we are inventive enough that we can find something we can call a Higgs Boson. We may only be able to observe its signature events as with Quarks but this will probably get the papers published.
 

Offline FlashValor

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Maybe, instead of asking if the Higgs Boson exists or not the more important question at hand is if the LHC will ever go fully operational or not... [xx(]
 

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