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Offline Mr. Scientist

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Quantum Brain or Non-Classical?
« on: 15/11/2009 04:57:35 »
Part One


The Quantum Mind (of God?)

So does the mind work according to classical laws of physics, or can the fundamental aspect hold gems for the theory of the mind and how consciousness, subconsciousness and awareness come into play?

This is a contending question and an area of physics which have quite a spectrum of scientists working in this area to be the first to quell this question once and for good.

Neuronal activity is not exactly quantum related on the non-classical sense, so neuronal theory of brain function and its resultant conscious state - the underltying question in the contentions made, is whether the effects of protons, nuetrons and electrons have any influence over our conscious appearance of states. Fred Alan Wolf not so long ago published a rather astounding and audacious theory which mathematically-unites a plausible mechanism to the unification of the human experience, with that of a universal mind (1). I admire him so much for being so bold to propose the theory, hut very few scientists could even deny that his theory is not scientifically-plausible - the boundaries we give ourselves when reading the work is really just an act of dogmatic and crannied-like reflection on our behalfs. I can give many reasons to proove why, but i simply don't have enough time to cover the topics in this essay.

An arguement i have made independantlty of reading Wolf's paper (1) 3 years ago, that even if the brain can be explained from a classical sense, the classical mechanisms (nuerons ect.) all still have an even elementary component in the form of quarkian activities, so the eigenstates of a neuron ultimately do dependant on local and non-local interactions of the quark make-up of nucleons - so the arguement to whether the mind operates classically only becomes completely erreneous since the states of the classical workings depend primarily on the quantum states operating their internal structures. So the mind not only uses the classical mediators of molecules/neurons, but it also means that quantum interactions keep the neurons acting as mediators - systaining them if you like for the emergent phenom of conciousness and awareness, and that deep and mysterious non-cogent state of unconsciousness and possible existence of a collective unconsciousness.

No longer, according to these assumptions really equated from a pure deduction of logic, the scientists who argue over a classical or non-classical model are only partially right. The mind actually requires both.

(1) http://www.fredalanwolf.com/myarticles/Quantum%20Field%20Theory.pdf - Here Wolf boldly asserts the existence of negative-energy particles of the form with superluminal qualities that mediate a universal mind which can be interpreted as a God-Field of an All-Conscious, One-Mind state. It's clever, but you do require an open mind to the controversial elements required to make his excellent theory work. Noting also, this work he performed was in itelf an attempt to finalize the classical-non-classical arguememt for brain computation.


.............................................................................................

The Strong Classical and Non-Classical Unification


Another quantum-related configuration entangled within the existence of classically-mechanized objects exists within the interconnected relationships that require the mapping of a complete description of systems using the measure of thw wave function.

The wave function of fundamental matter actually measures not only the ''infinitessimally-small'' (2) particles like electrons, but also entire galaxies. This has a mathematical description called ''a State Vector'' and its a vector state measured using the wave function, which can measure galaxies, supergalaxies, clusters of supergalaxies and to the entire universe. An arguement of a quantum level (such as electrons and protons and nuetrons) making the atoms which construct nuerons are all required to have a fundamental wave function which ''comprises'' the sturcture of the nueron, which in turn operates as a description of the eigenstates which are projected from its wave function of possibilities. So in a more simpler form, the ''adding up of all'' the wave function activities of the electrons and nucleons inside of the atoms which make the nueron is itself what comprises the energy level state of the nueron, permeability of electrical signals, and in a greater whole, determines whether that nueron is required or not depending on whatever activity is present within the material brain.

This is a very strong arguement, and i would assume there is really no ''misunderstanding'' on my behalf, because i cannot find any quantum-related subject to mind which could invalidate the above comments sufficely.

(2) Since there is really no upper limit to how large a macroscopic body can be, there is actually a limit when reaching the size of an electron, where it seems to have almost no structure at all. Its pointlike, meaning its a non-dimensional system, and truth be told it seems you can't seem to get anything smaller, so scientists have likened to naming particles of pointlike size (infinitessimal). I guess this might have the fact that whilst there is a lower limit, the upper limit can extend into infinity. A similar relationship is how when the electron is being observed, can be found to have a lowest ground state energy, but as soon as someone looks away, the electron theoretically ''should have'' an infinite amount of energy.


The Weak Classical and Non-Classical Unification

When a photon of light hits off the retina, changes occur inside
of the cells located in the retina. What the eye has ''caught'' is in fact a two dimensionsional image. A molecule called the Cis-Retinal undergoes a physical
change into Trans-Retinal. This is itself not a chemical change, but rather a spatial difference or shift within the molecule itself. This ultimately changes a
protien located that is present within these cells, and this protein attaches to another protein because of an actual chemical reaction in the original protein.
Molecules are then cut in half, which in turn causes electrochemical imbalances, where certain electric channels are cut off. This final event is then transported
through electrolytes in the nervous system to the brain itself. The most amazing part of all of this is that the original two dimensional capturing of the image
is then [[somehow]] transconfigurated into the three dimensional phenomena of perception. This baffles scientists as we are not entirely sure as to how the brain
is capable of such a reconfiguration. The cell inside the eye which had captured that original photon then requires to rebuild itself for if it could not, then we
could only use such a cell in the retina once. Some of the cells contained within the eye will be used for color perception, and others for the abstract shades of
black and white perception. 

The arguement is quite simple. A photon certainly has a non-classical description, since its a quantum object just as influenced under non-classical rules as all of the fundamental particles of the standard model, so their interaction alone is itself a quantum related-subject when it reaches our eyes, more specifically, the retina. After all those quantum chemical changes and eventual signalling to the brain, the quantum photon still had that influence over the new-projected information we holographically-observe within our neural networks. So as a weaker arguement, you can say you cannot neglect the influence of that single photon and then say the mind operates soley is an emergent phenomena of consciousness.

..............................................................................................

In the third part,
« Last Edit: 15/11/2009 05:02:32 by Mr. Scientist »


 

Offline Vern

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« Reply #1 on: 15/11/2009 13:13:54 »
Quote
The Weak Classical and Non-Classical Unification
The quoted section seems more to resemble reality than the Quantum infused section above it. I view Quantum theory as more of a hindrance than a help in trying to understand nature.
 

Offline glovesforfoxes

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« Reply #2 on: 15/11/2009 13:21:14 »
Quote
Here Wolf boldly asserts the existence of negative-energy particles of the form with superluminal qualities that mediate a universal mind which can be interpreted as a God-Field of an All-Conscious, One-Mind state. It's clever, but you do require an open mind to the controversial elements required to make his excellent theory work. Noting also, this work he performed was in itelf an attempt to finalize the classical-non-classical arguememt for brain computation.

The key problem this argument still has is that the universe does not have only one consciousness. BC has already pointed this out to you, and you have yet to satisfactorily resolve it.

Confederates agreed with slavery, Unionists did not. Explain how this can possibly occur if we have one consciousness.
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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Quantum Brain or Non-Classical?
« Reply #3 on: 15/11/2009 13:30:24 »
Quote
The Weak Classical and Non-Classical Unification
The quoted section seems more to resemble reality than the Quantum infused section above it. I view Quantum theory as more of a hindrance than a help in trying to understand nature.

I would tend to agree that.
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #4 on: 15/11/2009 13:36:27 »
Quote
Here Wolf boldly asserts the existence of negative-energy particles of the form with superluminal qualities that mediate a universal mind which can be interpreted as a God-Field of an All-Conscious, One-Mind state. It's clever, but you do require an open mind to the controversial elements required to make his excellent theory work. Noting also, this work he performed was in itelf an attempt to finalize the classical-non-classical arguememt for brain computation.

The key problem this argument still has is that the universe does not have only one consciousness. BC has already pointed this out to you, and you have yet to satisfactorily resolve it.

Confederates agreed with slavery, Unionists did not. Explain how this can possibly occur if we have one consciousness.

I do beleieve i have given an appropriate explanation. I will get the link, and if there is any part of it you wish to discuss, please do.

''thinking there is only one consciousness make no sense when i am awake... but my mind has no ordered-sense of consciousness when sleeping. Only when there is order in our brains, can we individualize ourselves. In a sleeping state, its rare that any one can achieve that without the use of hallucigenics. Where is the mind when it is not fully aware of its surroundings? Is this the uncollective-consciousness of a one-mind?''
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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Offline Madidus_Scientia

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« Reply #6 on: 15/11/2009 13:52:05 »
Quote
Neuronal activity is not exactly quantum related on the non-classical sense, so neuronal theory of brain function and its resultant conscious state - the underltying question in the contentions made, is whether the effects of protons, nuetrons and electrons have any influence over our conscious appearance of states.

Indeed, so you'll need to give an example of how quantum mechanics is relevant in the functioning of a neuron.


This is an excellent video in helping to understand how brains work.

Quote
The most amazing part of all of this is that the original two dimensional capturing of the image
is then [[somehow]] transconfigurated into the three dimensional phenomena of perception. This baffles scientists as we are not entirely sure as to how the brain
is capable of such a reconfiguration

What? It doesn't baffle me, it does it by combining the image with the other 2d image from the other eye.

You might as well be saying there is only 1 combustion engine because combustion engines are made from atoms and the function of atoms all depends on quantum mechanics

Quote
Where is the mind when it is not fully aware of its surroundings? Is this the uncollective-consciousness of a one-mind?''

They are most commonly found inside the skull of the head of the person it belongs to, most often this will be on a pillow or bed.

Where is a program when the computer is turned off?

Any why do you repeatedly double or triple post? Do you realise you can modify posts?
« Last Edit: 15/11/2009 13:57:13 by Madidus_Scientia »
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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Quantum Brain or Non-Classical?
« Reply #7 on: 15/11/2009 14:13:57 »
Quote
Neuronal activity is not exactly quantum related on the non-classical sense, so neuronal theory of brain function and its resultant conscious state - the underltying question in the contentions made, is whether the effects of protons, nuetrons and electrons have any influence over our conscious appearance of states.

Indeed, so you'll need to give an example of how quantum mechanics is relevant in the functioning of a neuron. 1) - o'k, i can easily do so below.


This is an excellent video in helping to understand how brains work.

Quote
The most amazing part of all of this is that the original two dimensional capturing of the image
is then [[somehow]] transconfigurated into the three dimensional phenomena of perception. This baffles scientists as we are not entirely sure as to how the brain
is capable of such a reconfiguration

What? It doesn't baffle me, it does it by combining the image with the other 2d image from the other eye.

You might as well be saying there is only 1 combustion engine because combustion engines are made from atoms and the function of atoms all depends on quantum mechanics


If you are right, then i apologize for my mitake, but i know you cannot state this.The reason why the fourth dimension is not real. It's an imaginary dimension of space, which hence resolves the paradox back to its beginnngs.

Quote
Where is the mind when it is not fully aware of its surroundings? Is this the uncollective-consciousness of a one-mind?''

They are most commonly found inside the skull of the head of the person it belongs to, most often this will be on a pillow or bed.

Where is a program when the computer is turned off?[b/] (3) ah, very funny. But you did not suffice to invalidate the claim. A computer is hardwire boolean perhaps. Not living carbon organisms.

Any why do you repeatedly double or triple post? Do you realise you can modify posts?
 

Offline that mad man

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« Reply #8 on: 15/11/2009 14:53:05 »
''thinking there is only one consciousness make no sense when i am awake...    

That is something individual to you but something that the majority do not think or worry about.


but my mind has no ordered-sense of consciousness when sleeping.

Why should it? we sleep for a reason and go into that unconscious state on purpose. Our brains need that time to re-order the data from the stimuli gained in the conscious hours. Its a bit like a computer de-fragmenting, it don't work when programs are up an running so we sleep and most activities are at minimal. Its detrimental to our health if we don't sleep so it would be daft to feel conscious when doing so.

Only when there is order in our brains, can we individualize ourselves. In a sleeping state, its rare that any one can achieve that without the use of hallucigenics.

See above as that's why we need to sleep and why we feel no consciousness while asleep. You can only use and experience hallucinogens while awake so its an impossible scenario. There are plenty of people with brain disorders that believe that they are individuals.  


Where is the mind when it is not fully aware of its surroundings? Is this the uncollective-consciousness of a one-mind?''

Its asleep or unconscious and no its not an uncollective-consciousness of a one-mind.




 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #9 on: 16/11/2009 19:06:24 »
''thinking there is only one consciousness make no sense when i am awake...    

That is something individual to you but something that the majority do not think or worry about.

I know.. but it's my arguement and added-theorem

but my mind has no ordered-sense of consciousness when sleeping.

Why should it? we sleep for a reason and go into that unconscious state on purpose. Our brains need that time to re-order the data from the stimuli gained in the conscious hours. Its a bit like a computer de-fragmenting, it don't work when programs are up an running so we sleep and most activities are at minimal. Its detrimental to our health if we don't sleep so it would be daft to feel conscious when doing so.

When i said it, i was rhetorical. I mean't to hopefully embrace the reader into the wonderful possibilities when these selfish boundaries are shuttered.

Only when there is order in our brains, can we individualize ourselves. In a sleeping state, its rare that any one can achieve that without the use of hallucigenics.

See above as that's why we need to sleep and why we feel no consciousness while asleep. You can only use and experience hallucinogens while awake so its an impossible scenario. There are plenty of people with brain disorders that believe that they are individuals.  

Maybe you should have read the whole thing then.. but i am not getting at you, i have done this myelf a few time

Where is the mind when it is not fully aware of its surroundings? Is this the uncollective-consciousness of a one-mind?''

Its asleep or unconscious and no its not an uncollective-consciousness of a one-mind.

No but that is a current theorem by many scientists




See above
 

Offline Madidus_Scientia

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« Reply #10 on: 16/11/2009 19:16:19 »
Theorem? Surely you meant theory

I'm not even sure theory is right, because a theory is something which explains observed facts. But what observed facts is this explaining?
« Last Edit: 16/11/2009 19:18:54 by Madidus_Scientia »
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #11 on: 16/11/2009 19:25:34 »
Theorem? Surely you meant theory

I'm not even sure theory is right, because a theory is something which explains observed facts. But what observed facts is this explaining?

Your logic is ever-so-slightly distorted. Just because a theory has no validated evidence for it, does not make it any more less plausible than another. That lyes to prefence.
 

Offline Madidus_Scientia

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« Reply #12 on: 16/11/2009 20:26:49 »
So the theory that the earth is flat is just as plausible as the theory that it is round?
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #13 on: 17/11/2009 10:50:38 »
Not out-dated theories.

Is this much not obvious? I sigh in shame.
 

Offline Mr. Scientist

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« Reply #14 on: 18/11/2009 12:57:06 »
Last part

Part Two


Bio-electromagnetic fields cover all life-forms, even plants themselves. Residue electromagnetic energy can even be seen when removing parts of leaves from plants. Our brain consists of around 10^8 electrons, and has itself a bio-electromagnetic field. If any field (at least to my line of logic) should have any interconnectivity over large distances should remain perturbative to the theorem of Fermi-Dirac Statistics. It seems no coincidence that fermion particles have two polirazation states, and it is when any resolution in the wave function is solved for one photon, the instantaneous action of the other particle situated billions of light years will immediately be polarized but with an opposite angular momentum.

Instantaneous fields are quantum fields which have mediators in the form of particles which can communicate from one point in space (x) to another point in space (x)* in a synonymous nature. So a tachyon which is a fundamental yet a hypothetical particle which moves at superluminal speeds can reach any part of the universe within no moment to pass... though, from its perspective, it actually oscillates throughout the imaginary time dimension, and still reach at its required destination as though from an inertial frame of view that it happened absolutely instantaneously. Electrons cannot do this, because their inertial speeds do not suffice the required destinations, but the mediator of the electromagnetic field also suffers because a photon (of whatever class)

It is possible that uncertainty is caused in a particles position to the extent that it manifests into a virtual particle under the stress of satisfying an action-at-distance - the uncertainty of the virtual particle does not obey the natural laws of relativity and can mediate to the required destination at a superluminal speed. It is said in quantum mechanics that virtual particles travel at the speeds for only a short amount of time, but to travel long distances at speeds that require multiples of c require very little time if no time at all.

So instead of a tachyonic field for the mind, we can enduce this new mechanism. Who is to say there is no inherent information written within the fabric of spacetime itself to suggest that when particles become immensely stressed under non-local activities that a particle itself will not simply vanish back into the vacuum (4)

(4) - If it vanished back into the vacuum, then another electron, an antielectron will be released (a*), since virtual particles do not obide by conservation of energy, by the typical classical formulization. In a similar scenario, its a little like how when an particle of gamma energy falls back into a balck hole, the solutions of Hawkings Calculations prove that the particle must immediately tunnel back into the vacuum as to retain a no-loss of information. The stress itself of the particle under those conditions certainly make it act in the obscure way of instantaneously re-emerging somewhere in the vacuum. There might actually be an underlying pressure-principle emergent to alter the natural casual effects of quantum mechanical inetraction when certain boundaries have been crossed, entangled themselves from paradoxes which can inexorably arise. If these particles did not find these solutions, quantum physics would not make sense when these subjects are taken into consideration.

(a*) note this is a prediction of my theory, however, it makes sense that this may be what actually happens since experimental work (sep. 1996) into photon-photon collisions require an electron-mediator.

................................................................................................

But if the photon turns into a virtual particle, how come a particle always remains present during polarization?

This isn't actually a problem. According to the contentions and physical laws presented in the excerpt:

''It is possible that uncertainty is caused in a particles position to the extent that it manifests into a virtual particle under the stress of satisfying an a
action-at-distance - the uncertainty of the virtual particle does not obey the natural laws of relativity and can mediate to the required destination at
superluminal speeds.''

This dual-barrel-process alone would have faster than a chronon.
 

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