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Author Topic: Does God Really matter?  (Read 7267 times)

Offline latebind

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Does God Really matter?
« on: 20/02/2010 17:27:45 »
I apologise for this question, it appears to have offended certain people.

I didnt realize that 'Life, the Universe & Everything... ' (in Just Chat)  excluded God...


Suppose we found out that god exists, so what?

It wont make any difference to the world, the world will not be a better place miraculously, it will still be the same old earth that its been for billions of years. There will still be criminals and there will still be violence and death.

So to everyone who tries to impose their religions on others, take this from me, it doesnt matter. It is going to be us and us alone who make the world a better place.
« Last Edit: 22/02/2010 17:27:04 by latebind »


 

Offline JimBob

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Re: Does God Really matter?
« Reply #1 on: 21/02/2010 03:29:45 »
I WANT A NEW RULE ON THIS FORUM!

NO discussion of God or of politics - not even anything remotely related to these subjects.

We have beat this subject to death. It is great that people have their own opinions BUT that is all they are. There will always be disagreement.


Lets just leave this be.

« Last Edit: 21/02/2010 03:56:38 by JimBob »
 

Offline neilep

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Re: Does God Really matter?
« Reply #2 on: 21/02/2010 07:37:02 »
I WANT A NEW RULE ON THIS FORUM!

NO discussion of God or of politics - not even anything remotely related to these subjects.

We have beat this subject to death. It is great that people have their own opinions BUT that is all they are. There will always be disagreement.


Lets just leave this be.





Amen to that !  ;)
 

Offline latebind

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Re: Does God Really matter?
« Reply #3 on: 22/02/2010 17:24:43 »
I WANT A NEW RULE ON THIS FORUM!

NO discussion of God or of politics - not even anything remotely related to these subjects.

We have beat this subject to death. It is great that people have their own opinions BUT that is all they are. There will always be disagreement.


Lets just leave this be.




I apologise for this question, it appears to have offended certain people.

I didnt realize that 'Life, the Universe & Everything... '(in Just Chat) excluded God...
 

Offline rosy

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Does God Really matter?
« Reply #4 on: 22/02/2010 17:27:56 »
Quote
I apologise for this question, it appears to have offended certain people.

I didnt realize that 'Life, the Universe & Everything... '(in Just Chat) excluded God...
It doesn't. Or not currently. There's just a growing current of opinion that maybe it should.
 

Offline Madidus_Scientia

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Does God Really matter?
« Reply #5 on: 23/02/2010 05:53:02 »
I disagree that religion and politics shouldn't be discussed.

I do agree it's been done to death, but they are important issues, why should they be immune from discussion?

Those who aren't interested don't have to read the thread.
 

Offline latebind

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Does God Really matter?
« Reply #6 on: 23/02/2010 12:52:27 »
I disagree that religion and politics shouldn't be discussed.

I do agree it's been done to death, but they are important issues, why should they be immune from discussion?

Those who aren't interested don't have to read the thread.

Amen! Well said!



Free speech is something that we didn't have in the earlier centuries, mostly due to the church. But now, in 2010, its all about speaking freely, and fairly.

I do not wish to fight or offend those who dislike this topic, so I will try not post anymore because I am decent.
But I very strongly believe that you should not ban these topics, purely because everybody has an opinion worth hearing, and yours is no more important than mine or others!
« Last Edit: 23/02/2010 12:59:47 by latebind »
 

Offline Madidus_Scientia

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Does God Really matter?
« Reply #7 on: 23/02/2010 23:56:23 »
Much of the information on these kinds of topics is not provable, so then it becomes a matter of opinion.

Wouldn't that be true for just about any thread that wasn't to do with science? And what's wrong with discussing opinions? Whether provable or not, if you have an opinion on something you have reasons for it, and should be able to defend that reasoning.

Also, some religions proselytize (try to win you over to their side), so such "discussions" generally involve some of this.  Finally, most people don't want to be told they are wrong, especially in a major way (ie, religion), and that's what essentially happens when people talk religion (and politics).

In a debate between a thiest and an athiest for example, neither may convince the other, but you don't have to be involved in the discussion to appreciate the points made by either side, which may help you form your own opinion if you were previously undecided, or if you were decided but the reasoning behind your decision was illustrated to be fallacious, it may make you think again.

Basically it's a good way to see both sides of a story. If you ban the discussion, some may never be able to see that other side.

I guess a key word there was debate, if either side is reduced to ad-hominem or doesn't so much debate as evangelise then I guess that calls for moderator action, but I don't think the debate should be banned before it even has a chance to be a healthy one.

Quote
I'd just like to say that virtually everyone bases their life on something bigger than themselves, otherwise there'd be a lot more crime happening (and I can't bring myself to think that most people don't commit crimes only because of the possible punishments).  So, even though some people may claim that they don't have a "religion", they must have a "philosophy about life".  In fact, I know an organization whose members use philosophy as their religion.

I would simply call that morals.
 

Offline Geezer

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Does God Really matter?
« Reply #8 on: 24/02/2010 08:15:35 »
I agree with JimBob.

The object of this forum is not to encourage free speech on any and every topic. There are plenty of other forums that allow that (and they are usually a total waste of time.)

The object of this forum is to facilitate discussion and debate of things that have, at least, some bearing on science, and to do that in a collegiate way that allows people to explore and learn.

Discussions of religion and politics always end up in a fight. People get upset and offended, and they will be driven away from this forum, even although they can make a significant scientific contribution to the forum. That does nothing good for this forum.

I don't allow political or religious arguments in my house because I don't want to fall out with people I respect. We should do likewise on this forum.
 

Offline latebind

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Does God Really matter?
« Reply #9 on: 24/02/2010 13:31:56 »
I agree with JimBob.

The object of this forum is not to encourage free speech on any and every topic. There are plenty of other forums that allow that (and they are usually a total waste of time.)

The object of this forum is to facilitate discussion and debate of things that have, at least, some bearing on science, and to do that in a collegiate way that allows people to explore and learn.

Discussions of religion and politics always end up in a fight. People get upset and offended, and they will be driven away from this forum, even although they can make a significant scientific contribution to the forum. That does nothing good for this forum.

I don't allow political or religious arguments in my house because I don't want to fall out with people I respect. We should do likewise on this forum.

Well said Geezer.

I formally apologise.

It seems we have all had our say on this topic and I somehow do agree that the question was out of line with this forum. So I then submit that we have all said what we wanted to say, and lets put this one to bed now and carry on with our science related posts.

 

Offline yor_on

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Does God Really matter?
« Reply #10 on: 25/02/2010 02:03:41 »
To answer the caption.

To those that believe it certainly does.
To us that don't know?

Well, I'll just wait and see, and if so?
Hopefully he/she/it have a sense of humor :)
 

Offline Madidus_Scientia

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« Reply #11 on: 25/02/2010 07:23:15 »
The object of this forum is to facilitate discussion and debate of things that have, at least, some bearing on science, and to do that in a collegiate way that allows people to explore and learn.

Whether we like it or not, religion and politics are having a bearing on science. Creationism and global warming, for example. Would these be banned from discussion?

Quote
Discussions of religion and politics always end up in a fight.

They may always end up in lively debate, but not always fights.

Quote
People get upset and offended, and they will be driven away from this forum, even although they can make a significant scientific contribution to the forum. That does nothing good for this forum.

The only reason someone should get upset or offended is if the debate deteriorates into personal attacks, at which point the protagonist would usually be dealt with by moderators, and then the upset/offended person need not be driven away. In the case of people who throw a tantrum and leave merely when faced with reasonable arguments, do we really want them to stay anyway?
« Last Edit: 25/02/2010 07:32:33 by Madidus_Scientia »
 

Offline Titanscape

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« Reply #12 on: 25/02/2010 13:41:18 »
Well of course I am biased, and can change my mind and could have many times. But The Gospel inspired Rome and Europe, to go from pagan ways. It shows such a good way, justice, mercy, kindness. The burnings at the stake showed human nature and ambition for the creeds but not the love... just like the law shows us our faults by stirring up sins. There are a few neo-pagans who are sure Odin could have managed a better society than under Christ's varying degrees of authority and influence.

William Wilberforce shows great Christian influence, ending slavery, free education, stopping some cruelty to animals... and that came before socialism, and has done better. Helped by John Newton, once a driver. He wrote Amazing Grace.

In people the conscience is among the best things, also ideals, philanthropy, pity... it is supported by the Gospel and Moses, and it is good we have the justice systems, laws.

I think Jesus is good for us, not all gods are good, or as good.
 

Offline neilep

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« Reply #13 on: 25/02/2010 13:49:20 »
We are debating about the nature of debating !
 

Offline JimBob

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« Reply #14 on: 25/02/2010 17:01:49 »
The problem is that these two issues reach to the core of our being. They are our basic beliefs - at least religion or lack of it is. This causes people to have gut level reactions that inflame passions more than any other subjects I am aware of. With such volatility involved, the discussions get heated, peoples feelings get hurt and lasting harm is done.

I am too much a fan of this forum to want to see this type  of discussion tear people apart, although I realize the number of persons who will be really alienated are few.   

All I really want is a friendly place. I do not like to see this forum become a place where people are at each others throats, which has happened all too often.


 

Offline latebind

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« Reply #15 on: 25/02/2010 17:29:41 »
It is really such a pity that people fight over these things.

Personally, I feel that a big part of being a good person is respecting other people, and their views (even if it hurts a little because nothing in life comes without pain)

You should not be offended by someone elses view on god, for 2 reasons :

1) Everybody is entitled to an opinion, and thats all it is, an opinion.
2) You should be secure in the knowledge that your god is true, and therefore you should not be upset when someone
says something different, because your love for god and hence your love for the fellow man should be stronger than that.
« Last Edit: 25/02/2010 17:42:42 by latebind »
 

Offline neilep

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« Reply #16 on: 25/02/2010 17:52:07 »
It's when they go and get all fundamental and extreme which really causes all the raucous !
 

Offline yor_on

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« Reply #17 on: 25/02/2010 23:09:58 »
We are debating about the nature of debating !

Yep Neil, and that fact, if I may say so, put us straight on the bleeding cutting edge of scientific philosophy. I'm proud of being a member of a forum thats debate debating. That we are able to have a debating debating debate seems to draws me closer to my inner truths and maybe, just maybe, even bring out my inner deeper female qualities :)

Well, as they say, as long as there's hope there's life..
Or something to that matter ::))
==

Or was it the other way around?
« Last Edit: 28/02/2010 22:25:38 by yor_on »
 

Offline Geezer

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« Reply #18 on: 26/02/2010 00:58:52 »


 even bring out my inner deeper female qualities


I'm not sure there is a MacYoron tartan, so I'll send you a swatch of tartans so you can pick out one for your kilt.
 

Offline JimBob

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« Reply #19 on: 26/02/2010 16:51:14 »
The MacYoron tartan would be made of home spun horse and dog hair, according to Wikipedia.

It takes a tough viking to wear dog cloth!! All the wolves would try to mate with you!
 

Offline Geezer

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« Reply #20 on: 26/02/2010 20:45:43 »
Here you go Yoron.


http://www.kiltmakers.com/
 

Offline yor_on

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« Reply #21 on: 27/02/2010 09:00:54 »
I see we have reached new heights of taste here :)
Well, he seemed pleased with it?
 

Offline JimBob

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« Reply #22 on: 27/02/2010 22:37:42 »
Geezer amuses easily. He's simple, you know.
 

Offline yor_on

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« Reply #23 on: 28/02/2010 22:16:55 »
Ah, well, whatever titillates.

But I was actually thinking of the male in that tasteful mini skirt.
It might have had something to do with the female in the matching dress though?

Ah, the link I meant, Gezeers :)
 

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