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Author Topic: Do aliens exist?  (Read 22953 times)

Offline omid

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Do aliens exist?
« on: 02/08/2010 18:07:40 »
Last night omid was watching this movie where a scientist communicate with the aliens and invite them on the earth through a special computer and the UFO actually lands on the earth.
omid's question is that is there any evidence found if aliens exist really?
if yes, how do we know?
if no,how do we know again?

any comment would be appreciated :)


 

Offline neilep

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« Reply #1 on: 02/08/2010 20:19:44 »
In MY opinion......the univserse is just so vast...bigger than ewe can possibly imagine....and new planets are being discovered every day that in MY opinion....life does..probably has..... and will exist somewhere else. It's quite possible that life exists elsewhere in our own solar system too.

Now ewe are being specific to the kind of alien life that ewe see in sci fi films and I am sure that intelliegent life of (of all levels compared to us) probably exists elsewhere too...in my opinion !

Just investigate some of the numbers regarding how big the universe is...and then it becomes almost difficult to believe that life does not exist anywhere else........oh...did i mention that this is in all my opinion !!
 

Offline Make it Lady

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« Reply #2 on: 02/08/2010 23:05:31 »
As conditions have to be quite specific in order for life to exist, in my opinion, I don't think there are too many aliens per universe but there must be some out there. I guess we will only find out if we get a message. The good people at Jodrell bank are always listening and they have enormous ears pointing into the sky. I used to live really close to them. In my opinion we don't have any advanced species in our near proximity or they would have already contacted us.
 

Offline neilep

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« Reply #3 on: 03/08/2010 00:08:38 »
 . . . . .actually i think i was  contacted because i just received a text from am unknown sender. . . .The message reads "get 2 pizzas for the price of one" creepy !!
 

Offline tommya300

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« Reply #4 on: 03/08/2010 00:35:52 »
. . . . .actually i think i was  contacted because i just received a text from am unknown sender. . . .The message reads "get 2 pizzas for the price of one" creepy !!

I got something of the same...
"get 2 pizzas for the price of one" Cheapy !!
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #5 on: 03/08/2010 01:24:18 »

With the most recent X-Conference in May at The National Press Club in Washington,D.C., it's getting harder and harder to not believe that there is a massive amount of highly credible evidence worldwide as to the existence of extraterrestrial beings and technology.

About the X-conference:
http://www.paradigmresearchgroup.org/X-Conference2010/X-Conference2010.htm

press conference video
 

 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #6 on: 03/08/2010 03:14:48 »

press conference video (Part 2) - UK RAF Bentwaters disclosure
 

Offline JP

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« Reply #7 on: 03/08/2010 11:48:00 »
With the most recent X-Conference in May at The National Press Club in Washington,D.C., it's getting harder and harder to not believe that there is a massive amount of highly credible evidence worldwide as to the existence of extraterrestrial beings and technology.

I find it quite easy to believe that there is no credible evidence out there, especially when the alternative is a conspiracy to cover up UFO sightings.  But regardless, there is no credible evidence available to science, and therefore no evidence of extraterrestrial life.

That doesn't mean that it isn't out there.  I happen to agree with neil that it's extremely likely that life exists elsewhere in the universe.  But it's very difficult to say what those odds are, since you'd need to know about how life can arise in a variety of conditions, and so far the only sample we have is the earth!
 

Offline neilep

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« Reply #8 on: 03/08/2010 15:21:20 »
There are many examples of life living under extreme conditions here on earth of course.....a whole variety adapted to 'non-human' conditions.
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #9 on: 03/08/2010 18:04:55 »

JP, I think I agree with your point of scientific evidence. What sways me is more in the form of massive testimony from a very large array of very credible "witnesses" and participants (astronauts, scientists, presidents, top military personnel, police chiefs, commercial airline pilots, physicians, surgeons, conferences at  MIT, etc.). More along the lines of evidence that would hold up in a court of law rather than a scientific laboratory. How can we totally dismiss this?
« Last Edit: 05/08/2010 02:08:18 by demografx »
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #10 on: 03/08/2010 20:29:10 »


I think the key question here is: what does the believer/disbeliever think constitutes real "evidence"?
 

Offline neilep

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« Reply #11 on: 03/08/2010 20:47:54 »
I just looked in my fridge for something that my wife cooked**. It seems to have developed it's own intelligence !











**The word 'cooked' here is used for indicative purposes in that the said item has undergone some form of preparation and treatment.
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #12 on: 03/08/2010 22:42:03 »

See? Neil has just presented the kind of 'firm' evidence that we all need!
 

Offline Soul Surfer

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« Reply #13 on: 03/08/2010 23:07:12 »
Looking at things generally it is just about certain that basic  life exists many times elsewhere in the observable universe and extremely probable that many examples of intelligent life with a capability at least equal to ours also exist in the observable universe at this moment.  The big questions are, is it close enough and does it last long enough to have some chance of communicating with us.  Even more fundamentally will we last long enough to communicate with them!

Most people just do not realise how big our galaxy is, let alone the size of the universe and how sparsely stars are distributed.

We have only had radio communications for about one hundred years and any radio signals from us have hardly reached even the most local bits in our galaxy and any returned message would take at least as long.  The galaxy is one hundred thousand light years across and one hundred light years is only .1% of this and only contains a relatively small number of stars which are in our area around 4 light years apart. or about 50 cubic light years per star or in a volume of radius 100 light years  around 20,000 stars most of which are very small and dim.  Note this does not mean that they are poor possibilities of life because small dim stars are the most stable and long lived and planets at habitable distances are unlikely ever to be disturbed by close encounters with other stars.
« Last Edit: 03/08/2010 23:10:21 by Soul Surfer »
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #14 on: 04/08/2010 05:29:38 »

It's hard to think that "I Love Lucy", "Howdy Doody", and "Amos & Andy" is how we might all be represented to "them". :)
 

Offline JP

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« Reply #15 on: 04/08/2010 06:08:34 »
We have only had radio communications for about one hundred years and any radio signals from us have hardly reached even the most local bits in our galaxy and any returned message would take at least as long. 

And the signal power of those early transmissions is going to die off roughly like 1/R2, where R is the distance the signal has traveled.  I wonder if these signals are even detectable against background noise at 100 light years...
 

Offline Murchie85

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« Reply #16 on: 04/08/2010 18:17:23 »
There may even be life in our back yard in the solar system, or something that constitutes life but very basic and would probably be single celled anyway or at least may have existed billions of years ago when conditions were different. 

Intelligent life is a whole different kettle of fish, a thing worth the consideration is as soul surfer tried to give us an understanding of the sheer vastness of the universe and our galaxy, intelligent lifeforms may just simply see it as too big a waste of resources to journey to earth as we would have little to offer a civilization that could master the engineering and scientific challenges of traversing light years to earth. Even from a resources point of view, there isn't much on earth that could not be found elsewhere and in more abundance.

As for the chance to interact with lifeforms on a planet (earth) that is dominated by predatory species that feed of others (figuratively, literally and metaphorically) and has almost no unifying government that could agree unanimously on any form of exchange, trade or diplomatic relations well I will leave that for you to decide. 
« Last Edit: 04/08/2010 18:19:08 by Murchie85 »
 

Offline syhprum

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« Reply #17 on: 04/08/2010 21:10:59 »
Although there can be no doubt that in the vastness of the universe other forms of advanced and technologically able beings exist their rarity must be such that given the limited speed of light no communication could be possible.
I used to be enthusiastic about S.E.T.I but now believe it to be futile
 

Offline Murchie85

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« Reply #18 on: 04/08/2010 21:53:18 »
Syhprum I totally understand your frustration and am inclined to agree slightly I think relying on radio waves and thing that propagate at the speed of light is an ineffective way of communications between the huge voids and advance civilizations would also realize that and have developed other means.

The DRAKE EQUATION is a good way of breaking the information down into digestible bits.
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #19 on: 05/08/2010 02:23:12 »
If we in fact have some reasonable evidence that alien technology that could help advance our civilization is being withheld, should we push for disclosure?

BTW, "conspiracy theories" turn me off, but how do I dismiss this huge lineup of credible 'witnesses' ? (as I posted above http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=33287.msg318326#msg318326 )

I'm not proselytizing, I'm seriously soliciting advice - one way or the other - as to whether I should bother getting involved.
« Last Edit: 05/08/2010 17:02:11 by demografx »
 

Offline imatfaal

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« Reply #20 on: 05/08/2010 14:18:28 »
Demo,

I read through the list of speakers at the x-conference (from your link) - I must admit I was pretty underwhelmed.  You mention above standards of legal proof against a scientific standard; very little of the testimony I have seen for alien visitation would be enough to get to trial let alone secure a conviction.  Uncorroborated witness testimony, with no physical evidence, especially in an area which has its share of charlatans and hoaxers(qv crop circles) would not constitute even prima facie evidence.  I would not question the honesty and self-belief of the majority of the participants at such conferences - but people can convince themselves of anything (you mention the conspiracy theorists).

There are probably thousands of amateur astronomers with fairly decent optics and cameras out every night in the UK alone - yet not one decent photograph.  To dedicate any real time to this area is, in my belief, a little wasteful - there are so many areas where amateur scientists make a real difference it would be a shame to devote effort to a fruitless pursuit. 

Matthew

BTW I desperately want there to be aliens - I just don't believe they come here on day trips
 

Offline graham.d

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« Reply #21 on: 05/08/2010 14:52:35 »
The sun is about 4.5 billion years old. Most of the stars in the galaxy vary from 1 billion to 10 billion years old. Life on earth is thought to have started possibly as early as 3.5 billion years ago with early humans only about 200,000 years ago. It does not need a lot of maths to realise that if life is anything like common in the galaxy, then the likely range of development must be something like between 5.5 billion years in advance of earth's to 2.5 billion years behind. 

Assuming that humans are not in any way special then we are faced with a huge range in the development of alien cultures (+/- billions of years). If interstellar travel is in any way practical it is unimaginable (at least to me) that such aliens would not know about earth already.  If, for any reason, they visit or monitor the earth we simply would not know about it if they did not want to let us be aware of them; the technology difference would be too great. On this basis I doubt the veracity of sightings and rather feel that there is little point pondering the issue until the aliens, should they be around, wish to communicate with us. I doubt this will happen until we reach the stage of being "in their faces" (if they have them) and have interstellar travel capability, which is a long time off I think.
 

Offline syhprum

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« Reply #22 on: 05/08/2010 16:11:28 »
The only way I can conceive of inter stellar travel being possible is if the crew have a different conception of time to us with lifetimes of maybe 100,000 years.
In this case their communitions would be at a much lower data rate, the Aricibo receivers that S.E.T.I use look for signals within a bendwidth of about 1 Hz perhaps they should be using a bandwidth of 0.001 Hz which might be difficult.
« Last Edit: 05/08/2010 18:09:27 by syhprum »
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #23 on: 05/08/2010 16:44:20 »

Matthew, I sincerely appreciate your view, and I will seriously take it into account as I deliberate how much, if any, time I should put into this direction.
 

Offline graham.d

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« Reply #24 on: 05/08/2010 16:54:38 »
Syphrum, I would not rule out interstellar travel just because we can't see how to do it. Our understanding is limited. Who knows what can be worked out in the next million years or so, or even just 1000 years. Agreed there are the slight obstacles of the vast energy required and problems of time dilation (or very slow travel - take your pick), but there may be ways around these limitations (warp drives, wormholes etc) given enough knowledge and a little engineering.
 

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Do aliens exist?
« Reply #24 on: 05/08/2010 16:54:38 »

 

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