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Author Topic: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?  (Read 7010 times)

Offline Airthumbs

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What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« on: 24/01/2013 04:07:29 »
If an object with a mass of 17 billion times that of our Sun exploded what would happen?

I have to assume that the mass is coming from the Singularity as that is where all the matter is concentrated once it enters, as far as I understand from what I have read.

I am guessing that there would be quite a lot of energy released but in what form and would that eventually form matter?

Also if it's possible that light can exceed C in a singularity then would that create a larger explosion then would be currently predicted?



 

Offline bizerl

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #1 on: 24/01/2013 05:15:04 »
A galaxy can be considered an "object". According to that well respected scientific journal "Wikipedia":
Mathematical models of the Milky Way suggest that the total mass of the entire Galaxy lies in the range 1-1.5×10^12 M☉
and at the centre of our galaxy there is a:
...supermassive black hole with an estimated mass of 4.1–4.5 million times the mass of the Sun
So your object would have to be a small satellite galaxy (globular cluster perhaps?).

I guess expansion could be defined as a really slow explosion. So I guess life would just go on. :)

Now having read the actual topic question I see that you refer specifically to a black hole. From what I understand, it would have to be a super-super-ultra massive black hole, and it would be subject to the mysterious Hawking radiation (which has quantum in it :)) and would not exactly explode, but just fizzle away, however, from what else I understand, not even Hawking himself really understands Hawking radiation.
« Last Edit: 24/01/2013 05:18:29 by bizerl »
 

Offline Airthumbs

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #2 on: 25/01/2013 17:29:27 »
I would like to say that now I have suggested this, over the next year watch this space.  I think the Universe is aware of our consciousness and that is one of the reasons we can alter QM by observation.  Consciousness seems to change the fabric of the Universe!

I am almost prepared to go and put a bet on that in the next year the James Web Telescope will observe what will be an exploding Black hole!
I wonder what odds I could get for that, not that I am a betting man mind you!
 

Offline Pmb

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #3 on: 25/01/2013 17:39:16 »
Quote from: Airthumbs
If an object with a mass of 17 billion times that of our Sun exploded what would happen?
Since the laws of physics says that a black hole of that much mass can’t explode then you’re asking about something outside the known laws of physics. Since you’re asking about what’s outside the known laws of physics I suppose you can make up your own laws. :)

Quote from: Airthumbs
I am guessing that there would be quite a lot of energy released but in what form and would that eventually form matter?
Awesome question. A friend of mine is writing a text about black holes right now. It’s theorized that micro black holes can explode. Let me see what happens when they explode.
 

Offline Airthumbs

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #4 on: 25/01/2013 17:45:57 »
PMB, I do have a bad habit of not fully understanding the laws of physics, it's a bit like trying to swim without any arms or legs!

I would be fascinated to know what happens when a micro black hole explodes and also just generally fascinated by black holes....

I thought the laws of physics break down when you arrive at the definition of a singularity so I thought I might be safe in there :)
 

Offline Pmb

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #5 on: 25/01/2013 18:26:36 »
The answer to your question is that it's doubtful that anybody knows what would happen.
 

Offline Airthumbs

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #6 on: 25/01/2013 18:35:11 »
A friend of mine is writing a text about black holes right now. It’s theorized that micro black holes can explode. Let me see what happens when they explode.

Please can you tell me what your friend comes up with regard to micro black holes.....
 

Offline syhprum

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #7 on: 25/01/2013 20:17:28 »
Black holes are the most stable of things barring collisions they are the ultimate in implosion and although if the universe cools to near absolute zero temperature a SLOW evaporation will take place taking 10^66 years for a solar mass one and much longer for massive ones.
 

Offline evan_au

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #8 on: 26/01/2013 09:48:31 »
It is thought by some physicists that the Large Hadron Collider in Switzerland may have enough energy to create a micro black hole. However, it should decay before it leaves the facility, dissipating no more energy than other collisions at the LHC. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micro_black_hole

This is very different from the situation with larger micro black holes that evaporate away to nothing, which are thought to explode at the end with the energy of a thermonuclear weapon.
 

Offline Bill S

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #9 on: 26/01/2013 14:28:55 »
Could the Big Bang be considered as something akin to a super-massive black hole exploding?
 

Offline Airthumbs

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #10 on: 26/01/2013 14:37:05 »
Could the Big Bang be considered as something akin to a super-massive black hole exploding?

I think that is what I was getting at but I would be interested to find out just how much energy would be released in this imploding explosion.
 

Offline Pmb

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #11 on: 26/01/2013 15:10:30 »
Could the Big Bang be considered as something akin to a super-massive black hole exploding?
No. A super-massive black hole couldn't explode. The gravitational force due to the black hole is so strong that not even light could escape, never mind fragments of any kind ofexplosion, even a matter/anti-matter explosion in which all matter is converted into radiation.
 

Offline Bill S

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #12 on: 26/01/2013 18:15:50 »
Quote from: Pmb
The gravitational force due to the black hole is so strong that not even light could escape, never mind fragments of any kind of explosion

Point taken, but if the entire Universe were concentrated into an infinitesimally small space, would that not result in an enormous gravitational force?

A possible answer occurred to me as I was typing.  Gravity is not a force, it is a curvature of spacetime. The nascent Universe was not in spacetime, therefore there could be no gravitational influence other than that which was generated within the Universe. 

How would that effect expansion? 
 

Offline Airthumbs

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #13 on: 26/01/2013 20:05:20 »
Is this all not theory?  PMB I think you would be qualified to have a good guess at what would happen if one did explode.... so come on, lets assume it is possible, what would we need to look for theoretically of course....
 

Offline syhprum

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #14 on: 26/01/2013 20:39:27 »
Assuming the black hole evaporates (according to Hawking) until it reaches Planck mass I would expect it to convert to radiation E=MC^2 with the release of the equivalent energy of 1959 MJ = 0.42 Kg of TNT , not much on a cosmic scale

Arithmetic correction !
« Last Edit: 21/01/2014 20:43:45 by syhprum »
 

Offline Pmb

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #15 on: 26/01/2013 21:53:14 »
Quote from: Bill S
Point taken, but if the entire Universe were concentrated into an infinitesimally small space, would that not result in an enormous gravitational force?
But in that case the black hole wouldn’t be expelling matter outside of it, would it? It’d remain within the black hole as would the rest of the universe.

Quote from: Bill S
Gravity is not a force, it is a curvature of spacetime.
Common misconception. People for some reason believe that GR “proved” that “gravity isn’t a force.” I’m not sure what that means. It’s like saying that “Relativistic dynamics proved that Electromagnetics isn’t a force.” If it were true, which it isn’t, then what does it mean? Does it mean that the electric/magnetic/electromagnetic/force wasn’t a force at all but something else? Or does it mean that the value of the EM force is zero?

In this case does it mean that the gravitational force is zero? That one cannot even define a gravitational force or that the force one defines isn’t a force?

I believe what happened is that Einstein showed that the gravitational force is an inertial force. At that time people thought inertial forces were merely manifestations of the choice of non-inertial coordinates. Einstein demonstrated that inertial forces were identical in nature to gravitational forces and for that reason should be accepted as “real” forces just like gravity was a “real” force. People, not willing to give up their philosophies of physics rejected Einstein’s views on this point and claimed that its gravitational forces themselves that aren’t real. In any case the gravitational force is a well-defined quantity given in Eqs. (12) and (15a) at http://home.comcast.net/~peter.m.brown/gr/grav_force.htm

Relativists nowadays see tidal forces as the true signature of gravity. The only problem with that is that a tidal force is a difference between the gravitational forces at two locations. So if you can’t have a gravitational force then you can’t take the difference.
 

Offline Airthumbs

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #16 on: 28/01/2013 00:53:36 »
I understand that Hawkings himself would prefer not to be associated with Hawking radiation.  His reasons are that for it to exist it would be necessary for it to travel faster then the speed of light to escape from the Black Hole.
 

Offline Bill S

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #17 on: 28/01/2013 20:51:47 »
Quote from: Pmb
Common misconception.

What is the non-scientist to think when confronted by quotes like the following from David Deutsch; to give just one example?

   David Deutsch (The Fabric of Reality).  “In the nineteenth century, few things would have been regarded more confidently as real than the force of gravity.  Not only did it figure in Newton’s then-unrivalled system of laws, but everyone could feel it, all the time, even with their eyes shut – or so they thought.  Today we understand gravity through Einstein’s theory rather than Newton’s, and we know that no such force exists.  We do not feel it!  What we feel is the resistance that prevents us from penetrating the solid ground beneath our feet.  Nothing is pulling us downwards.  The only reason why we fall downwards when unsupported is the fabric of space and time in which we exist is curved.”  That seems pretty clear.  There “…is no such force.  We do not feel it!  Nothing is pulling us downwards.” 

 

Offline ig33ku

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #18 on: 21/01/2014 16:28:49 »
I have a question, since it has been confirmed by the observation of UV radiation that the black hole at the centre of our galaxy did explode, would that have proven that light can escape the pull of a black hole? Baring that mind wouldn't it be possible that if the big bang was the explosion of a black hole that would have created the universe as we see it?
 

Offline MrVat7

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #19 on: 22/01/2014 08:16:49 »
Supernova.
 

Offline yor_on

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #20 on: 22/01/2014 20:22:00 »
The Black hole doesn't explode. It's before the event horizon and probably has to be a interaction with matter of some kind, or a gas. We will see soon http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/161637-the-giant-black-hole-at-the-center-of-the-milky-way-is-murdering-a-huge-gas-cloud
 

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Re: What would happen if a Black Hole Exploded?
« Reply #20 on: 22/01/2014 20:22:00 »

 

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