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Author Topic: Goodbye Christianity  (Read 2384 times)

Offline Pmb

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Goodbye Christianity
« on: 26/07/2013 08:26:40 »
For a while there I went back to my religious roots of Christianity. However I've now realized how much pain, suffering, torment and injustice that I've had to face in the last decade and decided that if a God exists who'd put me through all that and sit back and do nothing about it I want nothing to do with him. Some say that God doesn't give you more than you can handle. What a crock. I've been thinking alot about all those chronic pain patients whose doctors were too much of a scumbag to prescribe pain meds and they couldn't stand the pain and killed themselves. This isn't hypothetical by any means. It's quite real. I was very suicidal from the pain and my doctor didn't give a damn. He just sat back, watched my suffer intolerably and did nothing. There was never even a hint on his face that he even felt bad about it. No wonder so many people with chronic pain kill themselves. I sure don't blame them. In fact I envy them for having the guts to actually do it.


 

Offline David Cooper

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #1 on: 26/07/2013 19:43:59 »
Whenever there's a discussion of euthenasia we are told that there's no need for anyone to be in pain and that it can be managed, so why isn't it being managed? No wonder people have to resort to taking illegal substances for pain relief.
 

Offline Pmb

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #2 on: 27/07/2013 00:07:40 »
Whenever there's a discussion of euthenasia we are told that there's no need for anyone to be in pain and that it can be managed, so why isn't it being managed? No wonder people have to resort to taking illegal substances for pain relief.
That's a crappy lie. Pain can't always be managed and doctors would rather see you suffer than prescribe pain meds. Crappy fact but true.
 

Offline Pmb

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #3 on: 27/07/2013 16:35:46 »
After I read your response about euthenasia I did a search and found out that physician aided suicide is legal in Vermont which isn't far from me. So when pain meds stop being effective or they stopped prescribing them to me and the pain becomes more than I can tolerate this may be what I'll chose. Thanks for the thought!
 

Offline CliffordK

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #4 on: 27/07/2013 19:00:04 »
In Oregon, the physician assisted suicide has very strict guidelines, and only applies to terminally ill patients (for example with an untreatable terminal cancer diagnosis).  And, I assume the doctors assisting with it take it very seriously. 

Doctors regularly prescribe high doses of pain meds to terminally ill cancer patients trading off significant mental dysfunction for presumed end of life comfort.  And the idea is that the terminally ill can't become "addicted".

You are in a different situation.  You make well appreciated contributions to this forum, and perhaps elsewhere. 

I am not in your situation, nor am I close to anybody who is, but I don't believe that progressively higher doses of narcotics is the only answer.  You need to find a physician that is willing to work with you with different pain management options.  You should only have one primary care physician, but if yours isn't working with you, then talk to others.

I mentioned earlier that my parents had thought that Voltaren was helpful for their arthritis pain.  Have you tried it?  What about the Voltaren Gel?

Also, start looking for triggers of the pain.  For example, I have found that certain situations can lead to very uncomfortable back pain.  For example, a soft bed will leave me hardly able to move the next morning.  Belts and tight pants also cause me problems.  So, I learn to avoid triggers that I know about.  I still get out to do the stuff I enjoy, drug free.  And, with a lot of things in life, it is best to keep active whenever possible, whether it is walking to the end of the driveway to get the mail, or getting out to do other activities that you enjoy.
 

Offline Europan Ocean

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #5 on: 27/07/2013 19:12:05 »
Try seeing a pain specialist/anaesthetist who uses ketamine, proving to be a popular or trendy new substance. I am asking for it with regards to my needs. It is being used now to treat depression and addictions.

I understand God seems far away, it is an old problem mentioned many millions of times. Coupled with the difficult to believe idea, that Jesus was resurrected and will return in the flesh and create a great new order. Less spiritual blindness... great fair play.

I have found at the time when I was awakened to the terrors inflicted on local girls by gang rapists here, I then went on to think of my possible marriage, with first thoughts on what could seriously go wrong! Date rape, adultery, children conceived out of wedlock, past loves, better looking guys, being trapped overseas, taken for dead, and returning home to find another man living in my house and my wife pregnant... rotten ideas. I was tormented, to add to that, I felt I loved honour more than God, and saw the plight of my cousins in eastern Europe, slavery, and thought back to the days when the Russian soldiers raped tens of thousands of girls... almost my own Nanna... God seemed unacceptable. But I think he is worth holding onto for end highs.

« Last Edit: 27/07/2013 19:20:50 by Europan Ocean »
 

Offline Pmb

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #6 on: 28/07/2013 05:12:07 »
Quote from: CliffordK
In Oregon, the physician assisted suicide has very strict guidelines, and only applies to terminally ill patients (for example with an untreatable terminal cancer diagnosis).  And, I assume the doctors assisting with it take it very seriously. 
And that may never well apply to Vermont. I sent an e-mail to the Governor of Vermont to find out the details and whether anybody has used it yet and whether residents of Mass can go there. Otherwise, and Iím speaking of extreme circumstances like I was facing in the past with too much pain to handle, Iíll have to do something serious like buy an illegal handgun. Thereís no way Iím going back to that hell hole they call jail because the doctors donít believe me when I tell them that the pain is messing with my mind big time. I hate them for that.

Quote from: CliffordK
Doctors regularly prescribe high doses of pain meds to terminally ill cancer patients trading off significant mental dysfunction for presumed end of life comfort.  And the idea is that the terminally ill can't become "addicted".
It wasnít always that way from what I came to learn. Some doctors refused to prescribe narcotics for terminally ill patients because they might become addicted. Thatís what I call dumb!

Quote from: CliffordK
You are in a different situation.  You make well appreciated contributions to this forum, and perhaps elsewhere.
That is a very kind thing of you to say Cliff. It means a great deal to me that you think that. Sometimes I feel like a useless human being not being able to work. But when people like yourself remind me that I can still be useful by helping people online learn math and physics I start to change my mind. But its having to deal with pain that severe that I canít face again. Especially facing the risk of ending up in jail again. One time I got arrested because I was basically cornered and tormented by a nurse who was yelling at me unceasingly and insulting me. If was unable to walk away because a pig (what a cop is called when they break the law in order to bully people) forced me to sit there and take it. I eventually flipped out and yelled back ďStop yelling at me. I canít take it. And stop shoving your finger in my face. How would you like it if I did it to you?Ē and the pig arrested me, the scumbag. I wrote it all up here http://home.comcast.net/~peter.m.brown/ref/scumbag_nurse.htm

Quote from: CliffordK
I am not in your situation, nor am I close to anybody who is, but I don't believe that progressively higher doses of narcotics is the only answer.
You should keep in mind that when someone says this its highly likely that theyíve tried every thing else under the sun and narcotics is what is used when everything else has failed.

A great article on this is at http://opioids.com/chronicpain/  The author explains how patients are often slandered by doctors even when theyíve gone through surgeries and very painful procedures, i.e.
Quote
Many of my patients with chronic pain have been refused treatment by previous caregivers who apparently believed that their pain was not real. Even after undergoing painful procedures and surgeries that failed to bring relief, some of these patients were labeled as drug-seekers when they continued to ask for help. They had to contend not only with the pain but also with feelings of frustration, isolation, and abandonment by those on whom they had most relied.

Quote from: CliffordK
You need to find a physician that is willing to work with you with different pain management options.  You should only have one primary care physician, but if yours isn't working with you, then talk to others.
Itís very hard to do that. It takes a while to get an appointment and then they want records from the last ones etc. I tried that and it turned out that the doctors were slandering me in the records and not telling me. For the same reasons listed in the above article that I quoted too.

Quote from: CliffordK
I mentioned earlier that my parents had thought that Voltaren was helpful for their arthritis pain.  Have you tried it?  What about the Voltaren Gel?
No. I never heard of it. I just learned I have arthritis in my back too. Iíll check into this. Thanks mucho!

Quote from: CliffordK
Also, start looking for triggers of the pain.  For example, I have found that certain situations can lead to very uncomfortable back pain.
Iíve had nine years to learn what triggers the pain. Iíve got it down to a science now. Iíve also realized that the pain is a function of anxiety. I got to find a shrink that will prescribe anxiety meds while taking narcotics. Iím not sure how well these doctors understand the meds theyíre prescribing. A lot of doctors seem to think that narcotics makes chronic pain patients euphoric. That hasnít been the case for about six years now. They might think that the combination of a benzodiazepines and a narcotic might make me too sedated. But I know thatís not the case.
 

Offline alancalverd

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #7 on: 28/07/2013 07:24:00 »
The hallmark of civilisation is whether you can choose the time and cause of your death. I have, and barring accident or disease, will probably kill myself in 2029. I have kept the date under review since 1963 and have had no reason to alter it. Preferred method is hypoxia or hypothermia - both very pleasant if carefully administered (I have done the experiments) and no mess to clear up.

Meanwhile, whose body is it? Nobody has the right to inflict suffering on another, so why should anyone have the authority to prolong suffering or deny anyone's chosen relief? People are addicted to caffeine, nicotine, alcohol, coca, ganja,...and as long as we do no harm to others, society allows us to choose our drugs. Things only get difficult when the drug of choice is prohibited from general sale.
« Last Edit: 28/07/2013 07:25:36 by alancalverd »
 

Offline CliffordK

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #8 on: 28/07/2013 07:40:01 »
Have you gone to your physicians and hospitals and requested your medical records?  I believe you have a legal right to them, although I'm not sure of the laws. 

I'm not sure if you can get pages expunged, but you would at least be able to be prepared with knowing who said what. 

Perhaps you would be able to transfer the "pertinent" pages to a new physician, although if doing so, it would be best to disclose that you are transferring pages related to the condition and diagnosis.

Records can only be released with your permission.

I'm not big on the idea of manipulation, but there are licensed doctors of osteopathy (DO) which may worth consulting.
 

Offline David Cooper

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #9 on: 28/07/2013 19:27:06 »
I often hear people talking about turning to Mary and Joanna for herbal pain relief, but does it actually work? If it does, no one's going to know if you grow a few house plants and never sell any of the product to anyone.
 

Offline Europan Ocean

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #10 on: 29/07/2013 05:50:33 »
One fellow I knew, took it for art, but more than twenty years later is still in a padded cell, probably on injectables. I think that is why it is not allowed, for what is maybe 7 in 1000 unlucky ones.
 

Offline David Cooper

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #11 on: 29/07/2013 17:57:16 »
I've never taken any banned substances, and have never even taken enough alcohol to get drunk because I don't want to damage my brain, but I think if you're at a point in your life where you have little future left, the rules should be different. Anyone who's so ill that they're thinking about ending their life ought to be allowed to take anything they like if it makes life tolerable for them, just so long as it doesn't result in them harming others.
 

Offline Europan Ocean

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #12 on: 30/07/2013 10:48:04 »
Good thing here and in all of this, is to ask the Drs or scientists who advise politicians, "why is it so sir?"
 

Online Bill S

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #13 on: 24/08/2013 15:19:35 »
Quote from: Pete
Sometimes I feel like a useless human being not being able to work.

My son has atypical trigeminal neuralgia so, when awake, he is never without pain.  He shares your feeling of uselessness, but I know that when he is able to be on line he brings a lot of positives into other people's lives.  You do the same.  In my book, that is a long way from being useless. 
 

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Re: Goodbye Christianity
« Reply #13 on: 24/08/2013 15:19:35 »

 

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