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Author Topic: What are the consequences of being sprayed with barium and aluminium?  (Read 13970 times)

Offline scienceofscience

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Can someone tell us the physical consequences of being sprayed upon with the above subject matter?
and any possible antidote or protection?
« Last Edit: 01/07/2016 07:32:59 by chris »


 

Offline evan_au

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #1 on: 26/10/2013 01:12:32 »
Aluminium is a quite reactive metal, with a melting point of 660 C, 1220 F.
Barium is a very reactive metal, with a melting point of 727 C, 1341 F.

If you were sprayed with liquid aluminium or barium, you would be burnt to a crisp, and there is no antidote.

In fact, both metals are so reactive that they quickly oxidise in air, to form a much safer and more stable oxide.

So most likely, you would be exposed to a chemical compound containing these elements.
  • Aluminium (with its aluminium oxide coating) is used in cookware and soft drink cans.
  • Barium Sulphate is very safe, and is fed to people when taking X-Rays of the digestive system (a Barium meal). On the other hand, Barium Carbonate is used as a rat poison.

So if you can find out what compound it was, we could provide some more information.
« Last Edit: 26/10/2013 01:14:44 by evan_au »
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #2 on: 26/10/2013 17:02:25 »
If there is any chance of this turning into some discussion about "chemtrails", forget it.
They myth just isn't possible- for a start the Ba and Al oxides would coat the turbine blades and trash the engines.
It isn't even remotely possible so there's no need to discuss the other issues like- why nobody has ever actually analysed jet fuel and found Ba or Al or how they managed to get the entire world to play along.
Or even, why don't air crashes burn with a green flame?

It gets even stupider when you look at the numbers.
According to this
http://www.indexmundi.com/energy.aspx?product=jet-fuel&graph=consumption world

jet fuel use is about 5 million barrels a day.
Imagine that they could get 10% (w/v) barium into that (which is absurdly optimistic)
that's about 70 million kilos of barium per day (never mind that they don't mine that much, I said it was absurdly high).
Most of that is spread sufficiently high up in the atmosphere that it won't fall straight down- it will spread out over the whole of the earth's surface.
That's 500,000,000 Km^2
So each square kilometre gets 0.14 Kg
So each square metre gets 140 micrograms of barium each day.
On average the earth;s crust contains about 400 ppm Ba by weight. That's 400 mg in each kilo.
So a square metre of a layer 1 cm thick would contain about 10 litres of soil something like 12Kg
So, the top 1 cm of soil will contain something like 4800 mg of barium (it will vary a lot from place to place- but that's a fair guess at the average).
So if that gains 140 micrograms per day from the impossibly high estimate from the mythical chemtrails, over a year it will pick up 50mg of barium
But it already contains about a hundred times that much.
It wouldn;'t make any difference
Since aluminium is much commoner in the soil the same sort of calculation for aluminium is even more absurd.

Why would anyone bother?
Since world barium production from mining is only 6 million tons per year or about 16000 tons  or 16 million kilos per day they can't be adding 70 million to jet fuel

How come this idea ever gained any sort of credibility?



 

Offline lightarrow

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #3 on: 31/10/2013 12:25:13 »
Aluminium is a quite reactive metal, with a melting point of 660 C, 1220 F.
Barium is a very reactive metal, with a melting point of 727 C, 1341 F.

If you were sprayed with liquid aluminium or barium, you would be burnt to a crisp, and there is no antidote.
If you were sprayed with a liquid metal at those temperatures, it woudn't make much difference if it were aluminum or barium or brass or else  :)
 

Offline Skyli

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #4 on: 31/10/2013 15:11:28 »
Now that's not a question one hears every day. I don't know about protection or antidote, but a bit of blue touch paper could be fun :)
 

Online tkadm30

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #5 on: 30/06/2016 01:37:40 »
They myth just isn't possible- for a start the Ba and Al oxides would coat the turbine blades and trash the engines.
It isn't even remotely possible so there's no need to discuss the other issues like- why nobody has ever actually analysed jet fuel and found Ba or Al or how they managed to get the entire world to play along.
Or even, why don't air crashes burn with a green flame?

Dear Bored chemist, a nozzle is a specific type of device for aircrafts to deliver chemicals in a downward direction:

Quote
Aerial delivery system
US 7413145 B2
Abstract
A method and apparatus for aerial fire suppression utilizing a potable fire retardant chemical dispensing system, readily adaptable, without extensive aircraft modification, to various makes of aircraft, for dispensing current types of forest and range fire fighting chemicals. The aerial delivery system is self contained and reusable. It enables cargo/utility aircraft to carry and dump a load, under control. The aerial delivery system is capable of attachment at the wing box, pressurized delivery from the nozzles, and nozzles directed straight downward.

http://www.google.ca/patents/US7413145

Quote from: Bored chemist
jet fuel use is about 5 million barrels a day.
Imagine that they could get 10% (w/v) barium into that (which is absurdly optimistic)

Barium and aluminium fumes are simply by-products of the reaction of dumping [coal fly ash] particles in the atmosphere, reacting with oxygen to form oxides. Theses chemicals are not blindly mixed with the jet fuel... It's foolish and absurd to think the delivery mecanism would involve burning them. Why don't you educate yourself on how coal fly ash reuse has emerged into clandestine geoengineering activity? Why don't you get informations on the chemical composition of coal fly ash ?

I hope you learn that clandestine geoengineering activity is designed as a military technology, and that the reuse of coal fly ash is an evidence of the weaponization of this poorly understood chemical agent.

"Myths which are believed in tend to become true." -George Orwell
 

Offline Bored chemist

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #6 on: 30/06/2016 22:25:12 »


Dear Bored chemist, a nozzle is a specific type of device for aircrafts to deliver chemicals in a downward direction:

Quote
Aerial delivery system
US 7413145 B2
Abstract
A method and apparatus for aerial fire suppression utilizing a potable fire retardant chemical dispensing system, readily adaptable, without extensive aircraft modification, to various makes of aircraft, for dispensing current types of forest and range fire fighting chemicals. The aerial delivery system is self contained and reusable. It enables cargo/utility aircraft to carry and dump a load, under control. The aerial delivery system is capable of attachment at the wing box, pressurized delivery from the nozzles, and nozzles directed straight downward.

http://www.google.ca/patents/US7413145


 Why don't you get informations on the chemical composition of coal fly ash ?

I hope you learn that clandestine geoengineering activity is designed as a military technology, and that the reuse of coal fly ash is an evidence of the weaponization of this poorly understood chemical agent.

I see you have brought up an old dead post to show that you still don't understand the nature of evidence.

The patent shoes that it's possible to spray things from planes. We know that.
However the chemtrails lie was that the stuff was mixed into the fuel. And I was pointing out that it is nonsense.

I don't need information of the composition of fly ash- though you might want to explain why it's got so much barium (which is relatively rare) in it   and yet so little silica which is very common.
The reasons I don't need to look up data are firstly that I know it- at least well enough to show that your idea is dross,and also
There is no evidence of fly ash being used in any sort of high altitude spraying operation except- possibly- on a very small experimental scale.

Also, it's not actually very toxic so it's not much of a weapon.
And there's the old problem - the one you persist in ignoring.
If "they" put chemicals in the air, what do "they" breathe?
 

Online tkadm30

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #7 on: 30/06/2016 23:49:54 »
I see you have brought up an old dead post to show that you still don't understand the nature of evidence.

You don't need evidences to ponder on the nature of chemtrails. The stuff they are spraying is by itself an evidence that this is NOT water vapor. An empirical evidence can be acquired by simply observing the phenomenon and formulating an hypothesis.

Quote from: Bored chemist
The patent shoes that it's possible to spray things from planes. We know that.
However the chemtrails lie was that the stuff was mixed into the fuel. And I was pointing out that it is nonsense.

Good to know you're making progresses in your understanding of chemtrails. However the mecanism to deliver chemicals via a nozzle attached to an aircraft is a patented technology from Evergreen International Aviation, a CIA front company who ceased its operations in 2013.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evergreen_International_Aviation

Quote from: Bored chemist
I don't need information of the composition of fly ash- though you might want to explain why it's got so much barium (which is relatively rare) in it   and yet so little silica which is very common.
The reasons I don't need to look up data are firstly that I know it- at least well enough to show that your idea is dross,and also
There is no evidence of fly ash being used in any sort of high altitude spraying operation except- possibly- on a very small experimental scale.

The research of Dr. Marvin Herndon provides substantial evidences that coal fly ash is the prime suspect in the chemical agent being sprayed on a global scale. However you don't seem to recognize his work as legit. Why? What is your definition of scientific progress if you refuse to examine the evidences put forward by a trained scientist?

Quote from: Bored chemist
Also, it's not actually very toxic so it's not much of a weapon.
And there's the old problem - the one you persist in ignoring.
If "they" put chemicals in the air, what do "they" breathe?

We are breathing and drinking potentially neurotoxic aluminium sulfate, thanks to Philip Lader.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2946821/
 

Offline evan_au

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #8 on: 01/07/2016 06:49:04 »
Quote from: tkadm30
You don't need evidences to ponder on the nature of chemtrails. The stuff they are spraying is by itself an evidence that this is NOT water vapor.
OK, so what stuff are they spraying?

My guess is: Kerosene + Oxygen = Carbon Dioxide (gas) + Water (vapour)
                   CnH2n+2 +  (2n+1) O2 =     nCO2        +       (n+1) H2O

Perhaps you are assuming that it must not be water vapour, so it must be something else; then clearly it is not water vapour! If so, this is a logical fallacy called a "circular argument".
 

Online tkadm30

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Re: barium and aluminum
« Reply #9 on: 01/07/2016 10:22:30 »
OK, so what stuff are they spraying?

My guess is: Kerosene + Oxygen = Carbon Dioxide (gas) + Water (vapour)
                   CnH2n+2 +  (2n+1) O2 =     nCO2        +       (n+1) H2O

I assume you guess that this patented aerial delivery system uses jet fuel, but as I explained to Bored chemist there must be some kind of nozzle attached to a pressurized tank in the cargo of the aircraft. And yes, practically all aircrafts emits some water vapor, I'm sorry for the confusion.
 

Offline alancalverd

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Barium dust will make you heavy. Aluminium dust will make you reflective. Any molten metal (apart from mercury) will burn and possibly kill you.
 

Online jeffreyH

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I believe there is a conspiracy to produce conspiracy theories. It is insidious, addictive and should be prohibited by law.

What do you think?...
« Last Edit: 01/07/2016 10:47:10 by jeffreyH »
 

Online tkadm30

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I believe there is a conspiracy to produce conspiracy theories. It is insidious, addictive and should be prohibited by law.

What do you think?...

Disinformation should be prohibited by law, not the opposite. The "conspiracy theory" label is just a marketing strategy created by the CIA for anyone who dares to challenge the official narrative. It is the job of scientists to shed light on the truth, and to dispel the propaganda we sought to believe without using a scientific method.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-02-23/1967-he-cia-created-phrase-conspiracy-theorists-and-ways-attack-anyone-who-challenge

 

Online jeffreyH

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I believe there is a conspiracy to produce conspiracy theories. It is insidious, addictive and should be prohibited by law.

What do you think?...

Disinformation should be prohibited by law, not the opposite. The "conspiracy theory" label is just a marketing strategy created by the CIA for anyone who dares to challenge the official narrative. It is the job of scientists to shed light on the truth, and to dispel the propaganda we sought to believe without using a scientific method.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-02-23/1967-he-cia-created-phrase-conspiracy-theorists-and-ways-attack-anyone-who-challenge

So you agree that we should outlaw the disinformation. Then start with the disinformation of the conspiracy theorists.
 

Online tkadm30

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So you agree that we should outlaw the disinformation. Then start with the disinformation of the conspiracy theorists.

Disinformation and propaganda are not created by random peoples who report chemtrails. It is websites like wikipedia that spread insidious conspiracy theories and disinformation.

Meanwhile, a recent scientific study reported that bumblebees contains high levels of aluminium. This is likely an epistemological evidence that clandestine geoengineering activity may cause their populations to decline.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4456414/ 
 

Online tkadm30

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Quote
However, we do not know how commonly bees are exposed to aluminium, and no studies have investigated whether such exposure may contribute to bee health problems. Here, we quantify the concentration of aluminium in bumblebee pupae taken from colonies that had been foraging naturally in the UK landscape. We also examine whether aluminium concentration correlates with measures of colony fitness.

I think it's necessary we connect the dots... The increased levels of aluminium in the biosphere has been validated scientifically (Exley 2015) and new evidences suggests that aluminium exposure is neurotoxic and could be involved in Alzheimer pathogenesis (Kawahara 2011). Furthermore, the causality of aluminium poisoning by clandestine geoengineering activity has been characterized scientifically (Herndon 2015).

What else is needed to connect the dots?
« Last Edit: 02/07/2016 02:03:21 by tkadm30 »
 

Offline Bored chemist

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I assume you guess that this patented aerial delivery system uses jet fuel, but as I explained to Bored chemist there must be some kind of nozzle attached to a pressurized tank in the cargo of the aircraft. And yes, practically all aircrafts emits some water vapor, I'm sorry for the confusion.

And as I explained you have no evidence that this "nozzle attached to a pressurized tank in the cargo of the aircraft" is anything but a figment of your imagination.
You can't say "because I made something up, the things that depend on it must be real".

 

Offline Bored chemist

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Meanwhile, a recent scientific study reported that bumblebees contains high levels of aluminium. This is likely an ...


It isn't "likely" at all- you just made that idea up.
 

Online tkadm30

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It isn't "likely" at all- you just made that idea up.


Yeah right. I suppose I imagined that bees are dying for nothing. And the increase of Alzheimer cases must be also the product of my imagination. The persistent trails made by aircrafts must be water vapor I suppose...  How can you make such nonsense claims without even examining the evidences from scientists with higher education than you?
 

Offline Bored chemist

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It isn't "likely" at all- you just made that idea up.


Yeah right. I suppose I imagined that bees are dying for nothing. And the increase of Alzheimer cases must be also the product of my imagination. The persistent trails made by aircrafts must be water vapor I suppose...  How can you make such nonsense claims without even examining the evidences from scientists with higher education than you?
Ignoring the fact that there is noway that either you or I know how well educated those scientists are and you don't know how well educated I am so you are not in a position to say "scientists with higher education than you". That's just another example of you not understanding  what evidence is.

No, you didn't imagine the dead bees- and nobody said you did- that's a straw man argument.
However you did imagine the idea that it is likely that the source of the aluminium in the bees is from nozzles spraying fly ash from aircraft.
And, having dreamed up that idea, you somehow came to the conclusion that it was "likely" when a better assessment would be "bloody near impossible".
 

Online tkadm30

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No, you didn't imagine the dead bees- and nobody said you did- that's a straw man argument.
However you did imagine the idea that it is likely that the source of the aluminium in the bees is from nozzles spraying fly ash from aircraft.
And, having dreamed up that idea, you somehow came to the conclusion that it was "likely" when a better assessment would be "bloody near impossible".

Your wishful thinking certainly won't help. In reality the possibility that clandestine geoengineering activity is harming public health is being censored by our governments. You can ignore this fact but I'm confident that
the truth cannot be suppressed forever.

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. -Winston Churchill
 

Offline Bored chemist

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No, you didn't imagine the dead bees- and nobody said you did- that's a straw man argument.
However you did imagine the idea that it is likely that the source of the aluminium in the bees is from nozzles spraying fly ash from aircraft.
And, having dreamed up that idea, you somehow came to the conclusion that it was "likely" when a better assessment would be "bloody near impossible".

Your wishful thinking certainly won't help. In reality the possibility that clandestine geoengineering activity is harming public health is being censored by our governments. You can ignore this fact but I'm confident that
the truth cannot be suppressed forever.

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. -Winston Churchill

So, once again, no actual evidence.
 

Offline alancalverd

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I suspect the increasing incidence of Alzheimer's is due to (1) increasing survival from other problems (Alzhiemer's being predominnatly a disease of old age) and (2) a greater propensity to diagnose senile dementia (which was the Big Problem of the 1960's) as Alzheimer's (whcih is much more fashionable).

Increasing Al in the biosphere is hardly surprising. It is a very reactive metal whose natural incidence is as very stable salts that take a lot of energy to refine into pure metal - very much a 20th century product following the introduction of deep drawing (beer cans and briefcases) and Tig welding (vehicles and aircraft). It returns to nature principally via the water-soluble and biologically reactive chloride and hydroxide, so it gets everywhere, but it is very debatable whether it does any actual harm en route, except possibly in the shells  of smartphones, which destroy social interaction.
 

Online jeffreyH

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That must be why every time you see government officials on TV making statements they are wearing breathing aparatus.
 

Online tkadm30

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That must be why every time you see government officials on TV making statements they are wearing breathing aparatus.

LOL.

Chemtrails propaganda (and disinformation) is an epistemological evidence that the chemical composition of the nanoparticles have neurotoxic properties on humans: Aluminium toxicity is likely to participate to Alzheimer pathogenesis.
« Last Edit: 05/07/2016 12:12:38 by tkadm30 »
 

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