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Author Topic: How did dogs get to Australia?  (Read 2481 times)

Offline thedoc

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How did dogs get to Australia?
« on: 10/02/2014 00:30:02 »
Miss Christine Brooks asked the Naked Scientists:
   
I read that dogs separated from wolves between 19,000 and 32,000 years ago http://sciencenordic.com/wolves-became-domesticated-dogs-much-earlier-thought.  

I also read that the Australian aborigines reached Australia around 50,000 years ago http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australians.

I have read variations on these two items in various places. So how did dogs get to Australia? Did the aborigines take them there? Dingos are apparently features in Aborigine cave and wall paintings and were there before Europeans reached Australia. So who took them there?

What do you think?
« Last Edit: 10/02/2014 00:30:02 by _system »


 

Offline RD

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Re: How did dogs get to Australia?
« Reply #1 on: 10/02/2014 02:41:25 »
.... Dingos are apparently features in Aborigine cave and wall paintings and were there before Europeans reached Australia ...

Not a dog / wolf ...



... it's a wolf-like carnivorous marsupial ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thylacine
« Last Edit: 10/02/2014 02:43:48 by RD »
 

Offline CliffordK

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Re: How did dogs get to Australia?
« Reply #2 on: 10/02/2014 08:07:15 »
In reading about Dingos, apparently DNA analysis indicates that they were more closely related to an East Asian Domestic dog than being related to wolves.

The separation from the Asian domestic dog occurred between 5,000 and 10,000 years ago. 

Being closer related to domestic dogs than to wolves would indicate that the dingo was likely intentionally brought to Australia by humans, and predated the arrival of the Europeans.  Also, being most closely related to Asian dogs would also indicate a pre-European origin.  It is possible that all Australian dingos are related to a single breeding pair, or perhaps a single litter.
 

Offline goingtothedogs

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Re: How did dogs get to Australia?
« Reply #3 on: 10/02/2014 10:55:26 »
Fair enough - so a single pair - but it still raises how they got there. Would it be feasible to raft across to Australia. It seems a bit of a co-incidence that man's favourite domesticated animal would be the only placental mammal to make it over there without human intervention.

It's the timing that confuses me. If Australian dogs go back only 8,000 to 10,000 years but the local humans go back 40,000 years, then how did it happen?
 

Offline CliffordK

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Re: How did dogs get to Australia?
« Reply #4 on: 10/02/2014 12:23:20 »
There does seem to be a fair amount of isolation of early Australia. 

At the end of the last ice age, most of Indonesia was connected to southern Asia, and New Guinea was connected to Australia.  However, there still would been about a 90 km separation between Asia and Australia.  I wonder if the beginning of the Holocene and the rising sea levels would have stimulated some sea faring around Indonesia, new Guinea, and Australia about 10,000 years ago.  How fast did sea levels rise?  Perhaps initially one could wade across short stretches of ocean to reach what are now islands.  As sea levels would continue to rise, there would have been a great stimulus for open sea navigation.  There likely had been some ancient fishing and short navigation. 

Anyway, if there was an increase of open sea navigation about 10,000 years ago.  Sometime around 5,000 years ago, the Polynesians were sea faring.  Perhaps Australia was rediscovered during that period, and the early dingos hitched a ride on one of the boats.
 

Offline nicephotog

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Re: How did dogs get to Australia?
« Reply #5 on: 10/02/2014 17:43:59 »
Ultimately they have no idea about when Dingoes arrived! (except what little ever found of fossils)
note: Dingoes originate from the North East corner of Thailand with Laos and Cambodia (present day and prehistory).

(Disambiguation: Dingo is not related to South East Asian Dhole wild dog, and absolutely no species relation to either Tasmanian Tiger or Mainland Tiger Marsupial dog)

http://www.scribd.com/doc/15048847/Dingone (Dingone.pdf) Note: Many associate links and downloads are from sites of no longer exist for this document.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/31078120/Dingo-Origin (Dingo Origin)

Quote
....The other surprising finding was that most living dogs turned out to be more closely related to ancient wolves than to modern ones....
Not a surprise or they would be hybridised in it somewhere and lacking proper separation from wolves!  (you wouldn't have anything to measure above 10% being wolf)!
I'd take that article a bit localised for it's results!

These timelines are annoying, i get all manner of results reading articles, but the main separation i read in articles from DNA was 300,000 years , this one wanders all over the place too but is to 100,000..........................
http://6000generations.wordpress.com/2013/03/10/ancient-dna-confirms-altai-dog-from-33000-years-ago/


Transcript quote: ..."Still even early on, wolves were found fossilized with humans that date back 300,000 years ago"...
http://prezi.com/jcf_ubkzznql/history-of-domestic-dogs/

Various resources on Dingoes:
http://www.wild-canidae-conservation-forum.netne.net/
« Last Edit: 13/02/2014 08:54:56 by nicephotog »
 

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Re: How did dogs get to Australia?
« Reply #5 on: 10/02/2014 17:43:59 »

 

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