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Author Topic: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?  (Read 26989 times)

Offline lightarrow

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #25 on: 27/07/2015 08:04:50 »
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Then an electron or a photon is the same, for you
No, an electron does not obey Maxwell's equations (in particular, it cannot travel at c); a photon does.
"An electron does not obey Maxwell's equations..a photon does"? Not very correct, because it mixes classical and quantum description.
An electron AND a photon are described by QED = Quantum ElectroDynamics.
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Prove it, if you can.
I don't think it is a matter of proof. I think it comes down to how it is defined.
"A state with n = 1 of the quantistic hamiltonian of the electromagnetic field in absence of charges" is a definition nearer to the concept than your definition.
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I don't know what would be an authoritative definition, but in this one: "a photon is a discrete bundle (or quantum) of electromagnetic (or light) energy", ..the focus is on the photon as a quantum of energy, rather than on the photon as a disturbance in the em field.
My God! That would be "an authoritative definition"? It seems a popular book!
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More authoritative definitions & interpretations are welcome!
At this point you are perfectly right! But it's very difficult to find a correct definition of "photon" because it's a very technic concept.

While I'm looking for a link with that definition, have a look at:
http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/polopoly_fs/1.14183!/file/photon.pdf

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Offline lightarrow

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #26 on: 27/07/2015 13:12:53 »
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Then an electron or a photon is the same, for you
No, an electron does not obey Maxwell's equations (in particular, it cannot travel at c); a photon does.
You are mixing classical and quantum concepts here. If you want to talk of Maxwell's equations, then forget the word "photon".
If you want to call for a quantum description, then BOTH electron and photon are described by QED: quantum electro dynamics.
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Prove it, if you can.
I don't think it is a matter of proof. I think it comes down to how it is defined.
I don't know what would be an authoritative definition, but in this one: "a photon is a discrete bundle (or quantum) of electromagnetic (or light) energy",
And from that how can you deduce that the photon which exits a piece of glass is the same which entered?
If it were so simple, Einstein wouldn't have had the need to say something like: "50 years of thoughts about the subject didn't bring me closer to understand what a light quantum is...but nowadays every Bob and Alice thinks to know what it is..."
A photon is a much complicated concept. Have a look here:
http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/polopoly_fs/1.14183!/file/photon.pdf
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..the focus is on the photon as a quantum of energy, rather than on the photon as a localized disturbance in the em field.
More authoritative definitions & interpretations are welcome!
It's very difficult to find one because it's a very technical subject, despite the fact we always talk about it as if we knew it well...
Here is one from an extract of a discussion in other forum (and I admit not to have completely grasped it :)):
Given a free electromagnetic field (that is without electric charges) a photon is (something alike) the subspace with n = 1 of the hilbert space of quantized field's states, where n are eigenvalues of the operators "number of particles" N which gives the hamiltonian of the field when multiplied by ħω, which gives the field energy when applied to the state.

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Offline jeffreyH

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #27 on: 27/07/2015 17:16:02 »
I'm about to start reading up on Hilbert spaces.
 

Online evan_au

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #28 on: 28/07/2015 22:10:53 »
When you calculate the path and speed of a photon through a block of glass, you must do a calculation at the boundaries of the glass block, because the conditions change (ie glass has a higher refractive index than air), and this affects the speed of the photon. It does not matter whether you are using classical optics or infinite-dimensional Hilbert spaces to do the calculation.

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You are mixing classical and quantum concepts here. If you want to talk of Maxwell's equations, then forget the word "photon".
The fact that QED is able to unify the behaviour of photons & electrons makes it better than classical physics; maybe one day we will have a theory that includes gravity too, and that will be even better than QED.

But the existence of a "better" theory does not necessarily render the old theory invalid. The new theory is only considered valid because in the "classical limit", it predicts the same results as the experiments which had already been successfully explained by the classical theory.

So in selecting a method to solve a particular problem, it is important to know how accurate an answer do you need?

All design calculations are approximations; will the approximations of a given method yield an answer which is "good enough" for the problem at hand? This means you must understand the domain of applicability of the different theories:
  • Where they will give essentially identical answers
  • Where they will give answers that are "close enough", and you can build a prototype and tweak it to correct the discrepancies that occur because real objects are never exactly the same as even the best theoretical models.
  • Where they give divergent answers, and you must use the more complex theory (but you still need to build the prototype!). 

In cases 1 & 2, the selection is essentially made on pragmatic grounds like simplicity and accuracy (the proverbial "back of the envelope calculation" may be all you can afford in the middle of a discussion). 

For myself, my maths classes did not go beyond eigenvectors on finite dimensional vector spaces, so I don't have all the mathematical tools needed for determining the eigenvalues of infinite-dimensional Hilbert spaces.

However, I would argue that you do not need these advanced mathematical tools to calculate the path and speed of a photon through a glass block, because this is in the domain of classical optics. The answers are "close enough", provided the size of the block of glass is much larger than the wavelength of light, and the size of the atoms in the glass is far smaller than the wavelength of the light. You just need to recognize that the classical term "a ray of light" is an approximation to "a stream of photons" in quantum theory.

Undoubtedly, a grand unified theory which includes gravity (or even a small extension of current theories which is able to explain why calculations on Feynman diagrams work so well) will require additional, even more complex mathematical tools in your toolkit.

You don't always need a sledgehammer to crack a nut...
« Last Edit: 29/07/2015 03:52:38 by evan_au »
 

Offline McQueen

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #29 on: 29/07/2015 05:18:01 »
One thing that is significant about the answers given here is that they either tend to ignore physical facts as in the posts favouring the propagation of light through a substance in accordance with  Maxwell’s equations or they  give static answers which ignore the dynamics present. Too often (almost exclusively) the emission and absorption of photons by electrons in an atom is treated as a one off case, an electron within the atom absorbs and then emits an electron, this does not fit in with the observed data Firstly the definition of spectroscopy is as follows:

  Spectroscopy is a scientific measurement technique. It measures light that is emitted, absorbed, or scattered by materials and can be used to study, identify and quantify those materials.

In order for the above to be true it is implicit that electrons in the atoms comprising the substance must be absorbing and emitting light of a given frequency at precisely that same frequency. (i.e., If green light at 540 THz is being observed it means that the electrons are oscillating at that same frequency of 795cee584c7413ec14b888fa5c4f851e.gif THz  and absorbing and emitting electrons in those same numbers.

Next examining Lene Hau’s experimental results on the slowing down of light, it is found that while the results wholly substantiate the emission and absorption theory the results equally completely rule out Maxwell’s electromagnetic field, interacting with the fields of the atoms in the material while allowing the light to pass through only slightly slowed down.

Again what makes  an object transparent or opaque? An opaque material such as wood will absorb all or most of the visible spectrum of light releasing the extra energy as heat, while a transparent material such as glass will absorb and re-emit most of the  visible spectrum, resulting in the passage of light .  A photon is characterized by its energy which is directly related to the wavelength of the light when the radiation is considered as a wave. This relation is :

7cab6b13f2fdddd677b2f0d1be757fc4.gif

A large amount of photons make a ray of light, this ray of light can be characterized by its wavelength, intensity and the variation of this intensity over time. This translates in the particle domain to the amount of particles crossing an imaginary surface per unit of time. Particles interact with each other by exchanging particles or energy. A photon interacts with other particles by transferring its energy to the other particle (absorption). This exchange of energy happens if the maximum energy that the photon can bring is at least equal to the smallest quantum of energy that the other particle can accept.

In a transparent material such as glass the photons of all frequencies are transmitted by being absorbed and re-emitted, since this represents a longer path than the light would experience while travelling through air it results in a slowing down of light and a speeding up once again as it exits the medium.  Also since the speed of light undergoes a change it is obvious that the wavelength must also increase according to the relation 3767d606fcbf6a6d6fb60d3ca30453f4.gif.
« Last Edit: 29/07/2015 16:32:49 by McQueen »
 

Offline lightarrow

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #30 on: 29/07/2015 12:38:24 »
I'm about to start reading up on Hilbert spaces.
Good. Let me know what you grasped (or not).

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Offline lightarrow

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #31 on: 29/07/2015 13:06:29 »
When you calculate the path and speed of a photon through a block of glass, you must do a calculation at the boundaries of the glass block, because the conditions change (ie glass has a higher refractive index than air), and this affects the speed of the photon. It does not matter whether you are using classical optics or infinite-dimensional Hilbert spaces to do the calculation.
No, if you use classical optics and/or classical electrodynamics you calculate the path, speed, phase, etc, of a light beam or of an em wavefront, not of a photon, because "photon" is a quantistic concept which have to be treated quantistically. Infact in all of these discussions we could better never talk of photons at all; to talk of photons it's a sort of "trend".
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You are mixing classical and quantum concepts here. If you want to talk of Maxwell's equations, then forget the word "photon".
The fact that QED is able to unify the behaviour of photons & electrons makes it better than classical physics; maybe one day we will have a theory that includes gravity too, and that will be even better than QED.
But the existence of a "better" theory does not necessarily render the old theory invalid.
Certainly, I'm the first to say that, in most of the cases, we could and should better talk of classical electrodynamics only. But it was you to write "No, an electron does not obey Maxwell's equations (in particular, it cannot travel at c); a photon does". In case it's the opposite...
But anyway is an incorrect statement for what I've already written.
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The new theory is only considered valid because in the "classical limit", it predicts the same results as the experiments which had already been successfully explained by the classical theory.
So in selecting a method to solve a particular problem, it is important to know how accurate an answer do you need?
All design calculations are approximations; will the approximations of a given method yield an answer which is "good enough" for the problem at hand? This means you must understand the domain of applicability of the different theories:
  • Where they will give essentially identical answers
  • Where they will give answers that are "close enough", and you can build a prototype and tweak it to correct the discrepancies that occur because real objects are never exactly the same as even the best theoretical models.
  • Where they give divergent answers, and you must use the more complex theory (but you still need to build the prototype!). 
In cases 1 & 2, the selection is essentially made on pragmatic grounds like simplicity and accuracy (the proverbial "back of the envelope calculation" may be all you can afford in the middle of a discussion). 
I agree with you, but as I said, we can't answer the question "the photon which enters the glass is the same which exits?" without using QED, at least I'm pretty sure it's impossible to do it with Maxwell's equations only.
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For myself, my maths classes did not go beyond eigenvectors on finite dimensional vector spaces, so I don't have all the mathematical tools needed for determining the eigenvalues of infinite-dimensional Hilbert spaces.
However, I would argue that you do not need these advanced mathematical tools to calculate the path and speed of a photon through a glass block, because this is in the domain of classical optics. The answers are "close enough", provided the size of the block of glass is much larger than the wavelength of light, and the size of the atoms in the glass is far smaller than the wavelength of the light. You just need to recognize that the classical term "a ray of light" is an approximation to "a stream of photons" in quantum theory.
I wish it were enough!
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Undoubtedly, a grand unified theory which includes gravity (or even a small extension of current theories which is able to explain why calculations on Feynman diagrams work so well) will require additional, even more complex mathematical tools in your toolkit.
You don't always need a sledgehammer to crack a nut...
Do you agree, at least, that a photon is an excitation of the em field and that the field outside the glass is not equal to field inside?

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« Last Edit: 29/07/2015 13:10:34 by lightarrow »
 

Offline RTCPhysics

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #32 on: 02/08/2015 10:42:34 »
I have never read anywhere that wave amplitude is a factor. Do you have any references for that?

It was the absence of references that caught my attention. All the diagrams of the electro-magnetic (e-m) spectrum, that I have seen, have always shown each photon as having the same amplitude, whatever the wavelength. But if, in practice, photons can vary their amplitude, then it is reasonable to conclude that photons interacting with the electrons on the surface of a denser ‘isotropic’ medium, conserve their energy by exchanging velocity for amplitude upon entry and  amplitude for velocity upon exit, rather than increasing or decreasing their wavelength.

But if it is a fact that the wavelength of a photon changes, then how does this actually happen? Relativity is one possibility. For a photon to hold its energy level constant, measured in cycles per second, upon entering an isotropic medium implies that the intervals of time that it experiences remain unchanged, but the shortening of its wavelength to slow it down implies that it experiences a reduction in the distance intervals of space as it traverses through the isotropic medium, reverting back to its original velocity upon exit. However, this explanation of the reduced velocity by the application of relativity theory to photons is another with no references!

As you will have read by now, there are many more informed and interesting replies which rebut the logic of an amplitude variation in the photon, restricting its role to interference effects, so unless there is a path to rebutting them, amplitude variation remains what it is, a personal idea.
 

Online evan_au

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #33 on: 02/08/2015 12:04:49 »
Quote from: RTCPhysics
if it is a fact that the wavelength of a photon changes, then how does this actually happen?
The wavelength of any wave is directly related to the velocity: v=nλ, where:
  • v: velocity (=c for light in a vacuum)
  • n: frequency in Hz
  • λ: Wavelength in m
If the frequency remains the same, then reducing the velocity as a photon enters a block of glass causes a proportional reduction in wavelength inside the glass. This is explainable using classical optics, without reference to relativity.

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rebut the logic of an amplitude variation in the photon
The photon's energy is exchanged between an electric field and magnetic field as it propagates through space (as per Maxwell, applied to a single photon).

Inside a block of glass, the permittivity ε≈4ε0, which results in a higher refractive index for glass.

We can draw analogy with another case where ε>ε0, which is a capacitor. The energy stored in a capacitor is E=˝CV2; the higher the dielectric ε, the larger the capacitance (for the same physical arrangement of the plates).

If you apply the same amount of energy to a capacitor with vacuum as the dielectric, and also to a capacitor with glass as the dielectric (εr≈4), you find that the strength of the electric field inside the glass dielectric is halved, ie the amplitude of the electric field is halved.

The energy of the photon does not change as it enters, transits or exits a block of glass. If the above analogy holds(?), the amplitude of the photon's electric field is reduced when it enters glass.

On the other hand, normal silica glass is almost non-magnetic, so the permeability μ ≈ μ0, and the amplitude of the magnetic field of the photon is not really affected while propagating through glass.

The velocity of the photon is determined by both the permeability & permittivity of the medium.
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #34 on: 02/08/2015 18:57:21 »
I'm about to start reading up on Hilbert spaces.
Good. Let me know what you grasped (or not).

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At the moment I am reading through quantum physics. I now understand the double slit experiment and the relationship between photon wave length and measurement. Also exactly why position and momentum cannot be measured together. I have started on complex vector spaces and bra ket notation and am up to complex conjugates. When I get further I may have questions.
 

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #35 on: 03/08/2015 01:34:52 »
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as a photon enters a block of glass causes a proportional reduction in wavelength inside the glass.
Surely you mean a proportionate increase in wave - length ?
 

Offline chiralSPO

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #36 on: 03/08/2015 03:14:10 »
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as a photon enters a block of glass causes a proportional reduction in wavelength inside the glass.
Surely you mean a proportionate increase in wave - length ?

no, a reduction of wavelength would be expected when light enters the glass from air or space (or water).
 

Offline Colin2B

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #37 on: 03/08/2015 08:42:12 »
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as a photon enters a block of glass causes a proportional reduction in wavelength inside the glass.
Surely you mean a proportionate increase in wave - length ?
λ=v/f
f doesn't change, so if the light slows wavelength reduces.
 

Offline timey

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #38 on: 04/08/2015 00:24:34 »
At the moment I am reading through quantum physics. I now understand the double slit experiment and the relationship between photon wave length and measurement. Also exactly why position and momentum cannot be measured together. I have started on complex vector spaces and bra ket notation and am up to complex conjugates. When I get further I may have questions.

I happened upon this most interesting thread by chance, but nearly fell off my chair when I read this post!  You have made comment on my thread about there being limits to my understanding.  I want you to know that I have long since read through quantum physics, "Quantum" by Manjit Kumar as well as touching on the subject in the dozens of physics books I've read over the last 5 years.  I've also studied complex vector spaces and bra ket notation and complex conjugates with Professor Susskind on YouTube on ""The Theoretical Minimum Lectures, I'm on lecture 8 of the GR lectures at present.  I want you to know that I understand mathematics but I just don't have a flair for the notation in much the same way that I can understand musical notation but am incapable of playing unless by ear.  The concepts of the physics themselves I find really rather simple.

Can I ask you please not to underestimate my understanding?
« Last Edit: 04/08/2015 02:09:39 by timey »
 

Offline timey

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #39 on: 04/08/2015 12:37:10 »
It has been mentioned above as to an exchange of energies between the light and the medium it is passing through affecting frequency.

IF... (I have my ideas, but I'll say 'for whatever reason')... If the length/rate of a second is not a constant then Planck's h constant can actually be considered as a variable.  If velocity is measured by seconds that are not constant then the length measurement is affected.

We know that mass and a gravity field affect the phenomenon of time dilation...

IF we can view the experience of time from the perspective of the quantum world as being of a different length/rate of second in relation to our own experience of time, then Planck's h constant becomes an inadequate tool in the measurement of lengths/frequencies.

IF the quantum world experiences time at a rate much slower to our own experience, Planck's h constant would actually be 'blocking' the view of quantum activity.

The implications of this notion are that the quantum world may not be granular but may in fact be as smooth as the macroscopic world, and if Planck's h constant were to be variable in accordance to the variability of the length/rate of a second... then perhaps it would be possible to measure both location and velocity simultaneously.

Under the remit of this notion, the energies exchanged between the light and the medium of the glass would be time related.
 

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #40 on: 04/08/2015 14:09:06 »
You are misunderstanding what a photon is and how it travels, if you look on my post TOE fun you will I have demistified it and that includes the slit experiment apparent wavelike effects as well and much more. ;)
 

Offline timey

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #41 on: 04/08/2015 14:24:54 »
Erm...Nope,sorry I am not misunderstanding the photon or how it travels.  What I am doing is extrapolating a notion regarding Planck's h constant with regards to measuring frequency and relating it to quantum light theory...but I'll gladly check out your thread. :)
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #42 on: 04/08/2015 18:05:06 »

IF the quantum world experiences time at a rate much slower to our own experience, Planck's h constant would actually be 'blocking' the view of quantum activity.

The implications of this notion are that the quantum world may not be granular but may in fact be as smooth as the macroscopic world, and if Planck's h constant were to be variable in accordance to the variability of the length/rate of a second... then perhaps it would be possible to measure both location and velocity simultaneously.


Poppycock.
 

Offline timey

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #43 on: 04/08/2015 19:25:24 »

Poppycock.

I do so hate it when people quote a portion of your presentation as if that portion was going to make sense when not attached to the rest...and then insult it without providing an explanation of their discordance.

JefferyH, are you saying that there is no varition in the length of a second?  Or are you saying that Plancks h constant takes into account variations in the length of a second?

Oh wait...that's right, you're not really saying anything at-all are you?
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #44 on: 04/08/2015 20:28:56 »

IF the quantum world experiences time at a rate much slower to our own experience, Planck's h constant would actually be 'blocking' the view of quantum activity.

The implications of this notion are that the quantum world may not be granular but may in fact be as smooth as the macroscopic world, and if Planck's h constant were to be variable in accordance to the variability of the length/rate of a second... then perhaps it would be possible to measure both location and velocity simultaneously.


Poppycock.

No it was the statement that you may be able to measure position and velocity or more properly momentum simultaneously. You say you understand quantum physics and yet your statements indicate the opposite.
 

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #46 on: 04/08/2015 22:06:58 »
As far as I am aware JefferyH, I am not questioning the mathematical structure of the Dirac delta function or of the momentum operator.  These are  considerations that were formulated after Plancks discovery of quanta and his dirivation of the h constant which is an action of a time or a length, whereas Planck tried, to no avail, to iron out the quantum nature of his findings.

Now if you could actually relate the first half of the post that you didn't quote, to the part that you did quote - then we might even be in danger of having a proper conversation!
« Last Edit: 04/08/2015 22:10:38 by timey »
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #47 on: 04/08/2015 23:00:05 »
It has been mentioned above as to an exchange of energies between the light and the medium it is passing through affecting frequency.

IF... (I have my ideas, but I'll say 'for whatever reason')... If the length/rate of a second is not a constant then Planck's h constant can actually be considered as a variable.  If velocity is measured by seconds that are not constant then the length measurement is affected.

You may be confusing proper time with coordinate time. Proper time runs at a constant rate and is always in a local frame of reference. Coordinate time changes when viewed from remote frames. Planck's constant is just that, a constant. You cannot consider it as a variable. That is what the term constant means.

We know that mass and a gravity field affect the phenomenon of time dilation...

I have no idea why you should choose the word affect in this context as they are the very reason for time dilation.

IF we can view the experience of time from the perspective of the quantum world as being of a different length/rate of second in relation to our own experience of time, then Planck's h constant becomes an inadequate tool in the measurement of lengths/frequencies.

If you are writing in terms of Planck's constant then the second is the wrong base. You then need to be thinking in units of Planck time. You can't mix the two and hope to get meaningful answers.

IF the quantum world experiences time at a rate much slower to our own experience, Planck's h constant would actually be 'blocking' the view of quantum activity.

The implications of this notion are that the quantum world may not be granular but may in fact be as smooth as the macroscopic world, and if Planck's h constant were to be variable in accordance to the variability of the length/rate of a second... then perhaps it would be possible to measure both location and velocity simultaneously.

Under the remit of this notion, the energies exchanged between the light and the medium of the glass would be time related.

The rest is unsubstantiated speculation.
 

Offline timey

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #48 on: 05/08/2015 00:14:41 »
Nope, I'm not confusing these relativity/space time related considerations of proper time or co-ordinate time.  I do have my own ideas on time - but this thread is not my thread, nor is it in the new theories section...therefore for the purposes of this conversation I think it within the remit of accepted physics to say that we have time as a measurement and, as a separate issue, that we observe the occurrence of the phenomenon of time... and that this time is subject to change in the rate of its occurrence due to changes in the gravity field.

Of course my post/posts are entirely speculative, :) , is there something wrong with that?

IF we can view gravity fields on a smaller scale, as in our own personal gravity field, ie: if we get fatter we feel heavier, if we go to the moon we feel lighter... on the basis that a black hole will change the rate of time fairly drastically, 'maybe' the gravity fields of the quantum world are 'differently oriented' in relation to to time dilation.

The smallest quantum package is delivered at an unbelievably small fraction of a 'second'.  Clearly Planck has used a time measurement factor in the derivation of this constant... But IF the quantum world is operating within a time structure that is different, ie not occurring at the same rate as our own, the time measurement that Planck has used to derive these units of Planck time as constant would be rendered inadequate in measuring the entirety of the quantum world.  The gaps between the quantum leaps being the point of relevance here.
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #49 on: 05/08/2015 01:12:30 »
Nope, I'm not confusing these relativity/space time related considerations of proper time or co-ordinate time.  I do have my own ideas on time - but this thread is not my thread, nor is it in the new theories section...therefore for the purposes of this conversation I think it within the remit of accepted physics to say that we have time as a measurement and, as a separate issue, that we observe the occurrence of the phenomenon of time... and that this time is subject to change in the rate of its occurrence due to changes in the gravity field.

Of course my post/posts are entirely speculative, :) , is there something wrong with that?

IF we can view gravity fields on a smaller scale, as in our own personal gravity field, ie: if we get fatter we feel heavier, if we go to the moon we feel lighter... on the basis that a black hole will change the rate of time fairly drastically, 'maybe' the gravity fields of the quantum world are 'differently oriented' in relation to to time dilation.

The smallest quantum package is delivered at an unbelievably small fraction of a 'second'.  Clearly Planck has used a time measurement factor in the derivation of this constant... But IF the quantum world is operating within a time structure that is different, ie not occurring at the same rate as our own, the time measurement that Planck has used to derive these units of Planck time as constant would be rendered inadequate in measuring the entirety of the quantum world.  The gaps between the quantum leaps being the point of relevance here.

Well now you are clearer in meaning and actually saying something interesting.
 

The Naked Scientists Forum

Re: How does light speed up when it exits a denser material?
« Reply #49 on: 05/08/2015 01:12:30 »

 

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