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Author Topic: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?  (Read 14929 times)

Offline alancalverd

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #25 on: 29/12/2014 15:44:41 »
The international unit for magnetic moment is measured in Joule per turn.

No, it is joule per tesla. Nothing to do with rotation.
 

Offline lightarrow

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #26 on: 29/12/2014 16:47:43 »
I am only interested in facts and not text book quotes. 
But you can't even *describe* the facts of physics you are interested in, if you don't know:
1) The basics of physics.
2) The language in which those facts must be written.

Could I talk about physics here if I didn't know english language?
I physics it's the same. In Physics "electromotive force" has a very precise meaning, as all the terms in physics.
And the meaning is not the one you wrote.
And, please, don't refer to wikipedia for the correct meaning, better a good college book of physics; even better, a good university book of physics.

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Offline acsinuk

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #27 on: 31/12/2014 12:02:21 »
Lightarrow,   have looked up Nelkon revision books and he can't define a Tesla and avoids EMF and even volt is vague.
The reason could be that Faraday who outlived Maxwell never formally accepted the maths as Faraday knew that electrical magnetic energy was 3 dimensional as demonstrated by the right hand screw rule. 
Even today our physics definitions can't define magnetism at all!
We need new physics that defines in absolute terms a force at right angles to the direction of motion. Energy is force times distance but it is not a scalar quantity it is a 3D volume of energy. More like magnetic momentum inertia than ML^2/T
If we introduced an EMF of one twisting Volt, plus the Current {already in} but needs to be multiplied by Cos$ to give a flux area , to our SI fundamental units, then we can start to investigate exactly the x,y,z position of the positive charge proton and negative touching neutron bundles inside the electron enclosure, see how they spin together   
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #28 on: 31/12/2014 14:00:09 »
Lightarrow,   have looked up Nelkon revision books and he can't define a Tesla and avoids EMF and even volt is vague.
The reason could be that Faraday who outlived Maxwell never formally accepted the maths as Faraday knew that electrical magnetic energy was 3 dimensional as demonstrated by the right hand screw rule. 
Even today our physics definitions can't define magnetism at all!
We need new physics that defines in absolute terms a force at right angles to the direction of motion. Energy is force times distance but it is not a scalar quantity it is a 3D volume of energy. More like magnetic momentum inertia than ML^2/T
If we introduced an EMF of one twisting Volt, plus the Current {already in} but needs to be multiplied by Cos$ to give a flux area , to our SI fundamental units, then we can start to investigate exactly the x,y,z position of the positive charge proton and negative touching neutron bundles inside the electron enclosure, see how they spin together   

So you are suggesting a moment of inertia for magnetism. The problem is that when iron filings are placed around a magnet they do not move and are therefore independent of whatever individual particles are doing. It requires an impetus for movement. Although the impetus being the flow of current is the movement of individual particles. Only not of the nucleus. So if you are looking for direct source at the proton and neutron level then you are barking up the wrong tree.
 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #29 on: 31/12/2014 15:07:32 »
Quote from: acsinuk
I am only interested in facts and not text book quotes.
I can't believe that you still haven't listened to our advice and picked up a textbook and learned what EMF means. Nobody suggested that you read a physics textbook for any other reason than to learn facts and the facts that you'd learn is exactly what an EMF is and how it's defined. In this entire thread all you've been posting is nonsense about EMF. You simply have no idea of what it is and you've rejected everyone's attempt to help you. EMF is a mathematical term and as such requires an understanding of math to understand the definition.

Quote from: acsinuk
The fact is scientists do not understand that magnetism is a massless flux current area that can exist in space vacuum permanently without energy loss provided there are no charged particles to react with.
That's quite wrong. On what basis are you making this claim? I.e. where did you ever hear of such a thing? What makes you think you know more than all the physicists in the world? If this is what you believe then why don't you post a justification of this assertion?

Quote from: acsinuk
Lightarrow,   have looked up Nelkon revision books and he can't define a Tesla and avoids EMF and even volt is vague.
So what? Just because one scientist doesn't understand something it doesn't mean that it's wrong. Science is based on what the community of scientists hold to be the case.

Quote from: acsinuk
The reason could be that Faraday who outlived Maxwell never formally accepted the maths as Faraday knew that electrical magnetic energy was 3 dimensional as demonstrated by the right hand screw rule. 
That sentence makes no sense whatsoever!!

Quote from: acsinuk
Even today our physics definitions can't define magnetism at all!
That's not true at all. It's very easy to make such claims but those who do are never able or willing to back them up. Physicists know very well what a magnetism is and how all the quantities defined within the field are defined and measured.
 

Offline acsinuk

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #30 on: 04/01/2015 17:20:46 »
JH    I am afraid that the magnetic momentum energy has never been explained properly to me.  Why is there no such thing as an electron magnetron?? Or is it that the neutrons are connected to the electron??  There is a break in symmetry here that is not explained in QED or anywhere else.  Please post a website that explains this.  Thanks
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #31 on: 04/01/2015 19:05:42 »
JH    I am afraid that the magnetic momentum energy has never been explained properly to me.  Why is there no such thing as an electron magnetron?? Or is it that the neutrons are connected to the electron??  There is a break in symmetry here that is not explained in QED or anywhere else.  Please post a website that explains this.  Thanks

You could start with this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_moment

"The magnetic moment of a magnet is a quantity that determines the torque it will experience in an external magnetic field. A loop of electric current, a bar magnet, an electron, a molecule, and a planet all have magnetic moments.

The magnetic moment may be considered to be a vector having a magnitude and direction. The direction of the magnetic moment points from the south to north pole of the magnet. The magnetic field produced by the magnet is proportional to its magnetic moment. More precisely, the term magnetic moment normally refers to a system's magnetic dipole moment, which produces the first term in the multipole expansion of a general magnetic field. The dipole component of an object's magnetic field is symmetric about the direction of its magnetic dipole moment, and decreases as the inverse cube of the distance from the object."

In the sentence "The magnetic moment of a magnet is a quantity that determines the torque it will experience in an external magnetic field" the term "will experience" is crucial. Without any external field it is static. The puzzling part about this is exactly the static nature. We consider that all particles have angular momentum and are never stationary. This implies a balance in the system. In much the same way we consider gravity at the centre of a mass to cancel.
 

Offline acsinuk

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #32 on: 06/01/2015 15:33:59 »
Jeffrey
"The magnetic moment of a magnet is a quantity that determines the torque it will experience in an external magnetic field." 

In order to explain " a quantity"  [ of flux] needs a new physics approach that uses VICos$MKS;  as we can then define the magnetic spin momentum in terms of the ICos$ flux being spun by the at right angles voltage.  Indeed, MKS alone cannot define force or energy at all adequately, in my view.  Fundamental energy is VICos$xtime and need not be matter related.
We know inside the molecule there are positive charged protons and negatively charge electron/neutrons so there has to be an internal voltage between them that is spinning the magnetic field; so to speak
 

Offline lightarrow

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #33 on: 06/01/2015 17:46:56 »
Which is the English way of saying for "to shoot stupid things"?
😊

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Re: Can someone explain the neutron magnetic moment?
« Reply #33 on: 06/01/2015 17:46:56 »

 

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