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Author Topic: Theory of light  (Read 18933 times)

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #50 on: 26/04/2015 20:13:31 »
Alan,

i always say/think orbitals are imaginary, i never said gravity has anything to do with it.

you are at it again! created words/ideas for me.
 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #51 on: 26/04/2015 22:44:06 »
Alan,

i always say/think orbitals are imaginary, i never said gravity has anything to do with it.

you are at it again! created words/ideas for me.
I find it amazing how someone like you who has almost no understanding of quantum mechanics can claim that orbitals are imaginary when in fact you don't have the skills to make such arguments or to theorize why orbitals would be imaginary. lt's quite clear that you don't know what you're talking about and know that you're unable to produce a logical argument to support your claims. All you've done since you've got here is make random statements with no thought put into them.
 

Offline Ethos_

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #52 on: 26/04/2015 22:48:34 »


if the electron possible to discharge from earth atom into positive charged far away moon, why can't it discharge into own nucleus?
Because the strong force is dominant at the nuclear level and overcomes the electrostatic force.
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #53 on: 26/04/2015 23:28:46 »


if the electron possible to discharge from earth atom into positive charged far away moon, why can't it discharge into own nucleus?
Because the strong force is dominant at the nuclear level and overcomes the electrostatic force.

anyone can read can copy and paste that. but what's the mechanism? energy level? orbital? 

if we still go around.....
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #54 on: 26/04/2015 23:40:54 »
Alan,

i always say/think orbitals are imaginary, i never said gravity has anything to do with it.

you are at it again! created words/ideas for me.
I find it amazing how someone like you who has almost no understanding of quantum mechanics can claim that orbitals are imaginary when in fact you don't have the skills to make such arguments or to theorize why orbitals would be imaginary. lt's quite clear that you don't know what you're talking about and know that you're unable to produce a logical argument to support your claims. All you've done since you've got here is make random statements with no thought put into them.

Pete, since day 1 i came to this forum, you said the same thing over and over.

if you really understand qm, please tell me the mechanism of energy level and orbital?

attack my theory/idea/logic, not my education/personal, please be professional, and friendly.
 

Offline chiralSPO

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #55 on: 27/04/2015 03:01:15 »
If I may speak for Pete, the problem is that QM is fairly straight forward for someone who can do multivariate differential and integral calculus and simple differential equations (though it still takes a lot of effort to make sure it all makes sense), and nearly impossible to "prove" anything to someone who lacks those tools.

The "logic" of quantum mechanics is totally at odds with what we observe in the macroscopic world, but totally in line with (fairly) simple mathematical equations.

It may have been Feynman who said "shut up and calculate" (though some attribute it to Mermin)
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #56 on: 27/04/2015 03:32:59 »
If I may speak for Pete, the problem is that QM is fairly straight forward for someone who can do multivariate differential and integral calculus and simple differential equations (though it still takes a lot of effort to make sure it all makes sense), and nearly impossible to "prove" anything to someone who lacks those tools.

The "logic" of quantum mechanics is totally at odds with what we observe in the macroscopic world, but totally in line with (fairly) simple mathematical equations.

It may have been Feynman who said "shut up and calculate" (though some attribute it to Mermin)

i am not seeking the prove of the equations. i want to learn the logic to make those equations.

how many equations to support the big bang theory? is the big bang theory correct?

maybe, tomorrow, big bang will become flat earth. maybe not.

are you sure there is orbital? are you sure there is photon and graviton? based on what fact?

isn't we all science lovers and good thinkers? can we help each other to uncover truth/science instead of compete known knowledge?

 

Offline Ethos_

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #57 on: 27/04/2015 03:48:31 »


i am not seeking the prove of the equations. i want to learn the logic to make those equations.


Expend the effort to learn the equations and the logic will follow.

Shut the ____ up and calculate!!!!!!
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #58 on: 27/04/2015 04:34:05 »


i am not seeking the prove of the equations. i want to learn the logic to make those equations.


Expend the effort to learn the equations and the logic will follow.

Shut the ____ up and calculate!!!!!!

the logic followed you all the way to here, mind to share a picture of it?
 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #59 on: 27/04/2015 05:33:57 »
Quote from: jccc
Pete, since day 1 i came to this forum, you said the same thing over and over.

if you really understand qm, please tell me the mechanism of energy level and orbital?

attack my theory/idea/logic, not my education/personal, please be professional, and friendly.
See? This is a major problem in your grasp of physics. Physics has yet to been able to reveal what mechanisms are at work in various processes. That's not what physics does, i.e. it doesn't tell people what mechanisms are. In a lot of situations it very well can do so. However when it comes down to the basic theorems it's unable to. The reason being because they are basic which means that they can't be described in more fundamental terms. The Schrodinger is a postulate of quantum mechanics. That means that it can't be rigorously derived. While there are derivations they're not really rigorous. They are only meant to give a feeling for where that equation came from. Given the Schrodinger equation one plugs into it the potential function and one of the results obtained is the possible energy values.

You have chosen to remain ignorant by your choice not to learn physics. When I say that you've chosen not to learn physics I mean the only way that a physicist can learn physics - but hard long study. You want to take a short cut and just ask questions thinking that you'll understand the answers. When you get an answer that doesn't jive with your experiences with the world then you reject it claiming that it's all an illusion or that all of us physicists are wrong and/or deluded. And you're going to remain that way because there's no other way to learn physics correctly other than hard study. That means reading the texts which were written to teach people to be physicists and to work out the problems created by the author to instil the knowledge into you.

So enough with your accusations and listen to Ethos, ChiralSPO and myself and shut up and learn physics.
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #60 on: 27/04/2015 06:01:17 »
that's your way of science, no my way.

anyone agree with you? how about start a pool?

why don't you shut up and think the logic behind your science?
 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #61 on: 27/04/2015 06:21:36 »
Quote from: jccc
that's your way of science, no my way.
That's the way of the scientific community. You never had to tell us that your way is no the way of the scientific community.

Quote from: jccc
anyone agree with you?
Everyone who understands physics does. I'd bet that if you contacted any physicist at MIT, Harvard, Caltech, etc., they'd agree with me too.
« Last Edit: 27/04/2015 12:04:24 by evan_au »
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #62 on: 27/04/2015 06:43:30 »
please be friendly.

you guys say calculate and then logic will follow.

calculate what? 1 proton and 1 electron to form an atom, is the electron table at atom radius or circling the proton?

calculate the attraction force between them or the circling speed of the electron?

what are those have anything to do with photon emitting and energy exchanging?

what is energy level? what's the mechanism?

 



 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #63 on: 27/04/2015 11:19:56 »
Quote from: jccc
please be friendly.
When you start acting like a reasonable person and stop making accusations I will. Until then you get what you deserve.

Quote from: jccc
you guys say calculate and then logic will follow.

calculate what?
If you read a text on quantum mechanics you'll learn that. Why should we who have worked so hard at learning this keep shoveling it to you when you're going to keep saying its all in our imagination? You'll then learn which questions have answers and which ones don't.
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #64 on: 27/04/2015 14:49:29 »
Pete,

if there is a clear logic, why can't you simply state it? what's the secret?

anyway, this thread is about light.

is light gravitation wave produced by exited atom?

is light photon particle/wave emitted by electron?

what's your opinion? Thanks.





 

Offline Colin2B

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #65 on: 27/04/2015 15:25:23 »
Pete,
is light gravitation wave produced by exited atom?

is light photon particle/wave emitted by electron?

what's your opinion? Thanks.

I thought he (and the others) had already stated this very clearly. Not just in this thread but others.

 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #66 on: 27/04/2015 15:34:13 »
Quote from: jccc
Pete,

if there is a clear logic, why can't you simply state it? what's the secret?
And you wonder why I'm not polite? It's because you never listen to what we're telling you. For example; just now I told you how to obtain it. I.e. I wrote Given the Schrodinger equation one plugs into it the potential function and one of the results obtained is the possible energy values. Why did you ignore that? The problem here is that you don't have the math skills to understand the derivation. For example, see: http://users.aber.ac.uk/ruw/teach/237/hatom.php

Do you understand this derivation?

Quote from: jccc
anyway, this thread is about light.
Then why did you ask are you sure there is orbital?

Quote from: jccc
is light gravitation wave produced by exited atom?
Surely, you must be kidding? Of course it doesn't.

Quote from: jccc
is light photon particle/wave emitted by electron?
It's a photon. A photon is a quantum entity. Particles and waves are classical concepts. The best that can be said is that it depends on how its observed. That's what the wave-particle duality means. You've seen this discussed thousands of times since you've been here and you still haven't got that?
 

Offline Thebox

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #67 on: 27/04/2015 20:27:28 »
If I may speak for Pete, the problem is that QM is fairly straight forward for someone who can do multivariate differential and integral calculus and simple differential equations (though it still takes a lot of effort to make sure it all makes sense), and nearly impossible to "prove" anything to someone who lacks those tools.

The "logic" of quantum mechanics is totally at odds with what we observe in the macroscopic world, but totally in line with (fairly) simple mathematical equations.

It may have been Feynman who said "shut up and calculate" (though some attribute it to Mermin)

i am not seeking the prove of the equations. i want to learn the logic to make those equations.

how many equations to support the big bang theory? is the big bang theory correct?

maybe, tomorrow, big bang will become flat earth. maybe not.

are you sure there is orbital? are you sure there is photon and graviton? based on what fact?

isn't we all science lovers and good thinkers? can we help each other to uncover truth/science instead of compete known knowledge?


Thumbs up to you JC I am on your wavelength of thinking and you are correct I can never find no facts either.

 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #68 on: 27/04/2015 21:25:03 »
Dear Brother,

are you sure about this?

they got laser guns and we got rusty swords, they are many, we are 1*1=0.
 

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #69 on: 28/04/2015 00:32:29 »
Dear Brother,

are you sure about this?

they got laser guns and we got rusty swords, they are many, we are 1*1=0.

Jccc, is it really that hard for you to grasp the concept of addition and multiplication?
...Or were you poking fun of your own 'Science brother'?
« Last Edit: 28/04/2015 00:36:59 by Jasper Hayden »
 

Offline jccc

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #70 on: 28/04/2015 00:40:32 »
1 electron * 1 proton = 0 charge.

he'll agree.
 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #71 on: 28/04/2015 01:16:34 »
Quote from: jccc
i am not seeking the prove of the equations. i want to learn the logic to make those equations.
It's the exact same thing. The equations of physics that you're referring to are postulates which means that they can't be logically derived from simpler equations. They are obtained from the analysis of experiments using inductive reasoning.
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inductive_reasoning
Quote
Inductive reasoning (as opposed to deductive reasoning or abductive reasoning) is reasoning in which the premises seek to supply strong evidence for (not absolute proof of) the truth of the conclusion. While the conclusion of a deductive argument is certain, the truth of the conclusion of an inductive argument is probable, based upon the evidence given.
Since the conclusion of inductive arguments are probable and not 100% certain, crackpots use this to claim that the laws of physics are wrong.
 

Offline PmbPhy

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #72 on: 28/04/2015 01:22:48 »
1 electron * 1 proton = 0 charge.

he'll agree.
How does that follow from the word salad you wrote saying
Quote from: jccc
Dear Brother,

are you sure about this?

they got laser guns and we got rusty swords, they are many, we are 1*1=0.
The "*" symbol is used to represent multiplication, not addition. And this was written with two "1"s, not a 1 and a "-1" so jccc is doing what we call "backpedaling".

Jasper - jccc claims to have meant that total charge = +q + (-q) = 0.  However that's the first time he mentions charge in this thread (other than some meaningless drivel where he wrote if the electron possible to discharge from earth atom into positive charged far away moon, why can't it discharge into own nucleus?)
 

Offline jamesmaxwell767

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #73 on: 28/04/2015 15:37:10 »
I had a thought about electromagnetism/ electrostatics concerning gravity some years back.  It stemmed from working as an apprentice electrician studying for my journeymans license.  In our home we all notice that we need three wires to ensure a safe connection.  A hot, A neutral and a ground.  There are only two wires that come off of the pole.  Each one consisting of ~120 volts 60hz.  If you combine the two you have ~240 volts 60hz.  When you get to the panel though, you will notice that the neutral and the ground are actually the same thing, they hook up to the same terminals.  Why is this I thought?  The ground on a panel is nothing more than an 8 ft solid copper rod drove into the ground.  (hence the negative polarity).  I've did a few of those, not an easy job.  If you want 120volts you merely attach onto one of the hot lines, and connect the other side to the ground.  So, what is the point in the "neutral"?  Then I was studying the late Tesla and remembered a project he done where he merely pushed the light bulbs into the ground(Earth) and the bulbs lit up.  In his experiment he had found a way to transmit positive energy wirelessly.  In order to use it, it must be grounded first to complete the path.  I've did a lot of other research on this as well.  One being the schuman resonance frewuency of the earth.  Also numerous papers on the Earth being extremely negatively charged.  I wondered then, what would happen if we were negatively charged as well?  EM and ES says that we would fly off the planet because opposite charges attract, like charges repel.  I've since abandoned this for many reasons.  But what is your take on this.  Since one of you mentioned that gravity is an EM wave or of EM origin?
 

Offline jamesmaxwell767

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #74 on: 28/04/2015 16:29:16 »
So, I just don't see how light could be a gravitational wave.  Maybe it could be a consequence of gravity or something, like if not for gravity light could not be.  Like the center of a black hole, too much gravity and light cannot escape it.  Of course I did see something awhile back where scientists have found a way to make light take on a new state of matter.  Is there more to this?  It is an interesting thought, but you better brush up on a LOT of math.  newbielink:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/scientists-bind-photons-together-to-create-new-state-of-matter-comparable-to-lightsabers-8841612.html [nonactive]
Of course you could just google "light takes on new state of matter" and read what literature is out there about it.  I would recommend only reading published university research papers though.  Still, very cool stuff.
 

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Re: Is light a Gravitational Wave?
« Reply #74 on: 28/04/2015 16:29:16 »

 

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