The Naked Scientists

The Naked Scientists Forum

Author Topic: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?  (Read 35086 times)

Offline Pecos_Bill

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 334
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #75 on: 05/09/2015 04:01:48 »
I have been asked to avoid "ad hominem " comments. Then I will speak ad populem.

In my opinion as a Scottish-American, the aim of this paper is to deny equal educational opportunity to working class people. In America it is called "tracking" by Donald Trump. See this naked scientist segment for what it is - it's not science.

How long until this is deleted for ostensibly not speaking La-di-dah English?

"ad populem" is just "ad hominem", en masse - moderator.
« Last Edit: 05/09/2015 11:25:18 by evan_au »
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8648
  • Thanked: 42 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #76 on: 05/09/2015 11:14:50 »
I have been asked to avoid "ad hominem " comments. Then I will speak ad populem.

You don't have to be Scottish -American to see the game being played here. In America it is called "tracking" by the Trump gang. Whatever you want to call it, the aim is to deny equal educational opportunity to working class people --not science. Make no mistake. See this naked scientist program for what it is.  God save America and Scotland from this "science" 

How long until this is deleted for ostensibly not speaking La-di-dah English?
It's more likely to be deleted because you are making a derogatory statement without offering any supporting evidence.

Why not try supporting your position with actual facts and logic rather than poetry and strawmen?

Please avoid repeating derogatory statements - mod.
« Last Edit: 05/09/2015 11:23:53 by evan_au »
 

Offline Pecos_Bill

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 334
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #77 on: 05/09/2015 16:17:40 »
The history behind this "research" is telling in its nature but it was deleted.

This does not go far to support the claims that there is no hidden agenda at work here to help rob children of their equal right to education,"scientifically"...

As for you, Mister, when will you respond to my question? Why were females presumed to have different intellects by the authors? I would love to see you try that one in America.

Keep it civil...mod
« Last Edit: 09/09/2015 13:38:00 by evan_au »
 

Offline cheryl j

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1460
  • Thanked: 1 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #78 on: 06/09/2015 01:26:42 »
I don't see why in this instance it's an either /or question. That identical twins results were more similar than fraternal twins doesn't seem to rule out that environmental factors could also significantly restrict or enhance their progress.
 

Offline Pecos_Bill

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 334
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #79 on: 06/09/2015 02:33:32 »
Contrary to the simplistic assumptions of this research, identical twins do not share the exact same DNA [1.] The fact that these people fail to address this issue does not argue well for their candor and integrity.

The moderator has chosen to delete my citations of scientific deceptions in Britain -- including the field of "behavioral genetics" as tangential. I wonder if he would buy a horse without enquiring into the reputation of the seller or would that be too beneath the salt?

These facts coupled with the lack of reproduced results confirming its findings, and the political interest in Plomin's results cause me to be amazed that it has found such dogged insistence here that it is the actual gospel truth ---two years after it was published. Nor do I understand why bona fide gentlemen would subject me to rebuke, scorn and ostracism for expressing my doubts---even in England.

And that is before I ask why these people consider women to be naturally incapable of matching the GCSE scores of men.

At the risk of being "tangential" I include a link to an article called, " The Crumbling Pillars of Behavioral Genetics" in Gene Watch, published by The Council for Responsible Genetics [2.]




[1.] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2427204/
[2. ] http://www.councilforresponsiblegenetics.org/genewatch/GeneWatchPage.aspx?pageId=384
« Last Edit: 06/09/2015 02:36:14 by Pecos_Bill »
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8648
  • Thanked: 42 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #80 on: 06/09/2015 09:55:50 »

2. As you perfectly well know, all my supporting evidence has been deleted by the moderator as "tangential". I believe that is an example of what passes for "civility" among your sort. In American baseball we call that "corking the bat".

3. Finally, since bored_chemist has chosen to remain in his tent, will YOU answer the question, "Why does this research presuppose the inferiority of women's GCSE scores if they are not, in fact, (how to make this civil enough for your delicate sensitivities? Hmmmmm) ....   sadly fallen prey to the victorian misconceptions as to the true nature of the feminine mind?"
Your so called evidence was deleted because it wasn't relevant.
That's what happens when you cite poetry in science; people start to look really closely at the other stuff you post.
It doesn't matter that some bloke many years ago made up some results in a related field.
The thread is discussing the data that some other group  genuinely found recently.
Do you not understand that?

and re.
"Why does this research presuppose the inferiority of women's GCSE scores if they are not, in fact, (how to make this civil enough for your delicate sensitivities? Hmmmmm) ....   sadly fallen prey to the victorian misconceptions as to the true nature of the feminine mind?"
that's easy.
It doesn't presupose anything of the sort.
That's another strawman of yours.

Why not quote the bit where you think it says that they assume women are inferior and then we can explain to you what it really means.

(You may struggle with this as the paper never actually mentions women),.
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8648
  • Thanked: 42 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #81 on: 06/09/2015 10:12:13 »
I don't see why in this instance it's an either /or question. That identical twins results were more similar than fraternal twins doesn't seem to rule out that environmental factors could also significantly restrict or enhance their progress.
It doesn't. Indeed, the study assumes that the environment does affect their results.
That effect is pretty much the same for pairs of twins.
So twins should have very similar scores.
But the way that identical twins are treated is pretty much the same as the way that fraternal twins are treated.
Both types of twins grow up in the same household, the same culture, the same wealth or poverty.
So the difference in scores between pairs of identical twins should be the same as the difference in scores between pairs of fraternal twins.

But it isn't.
There is a bigger difference with the fraternal twins than with the identical ones.
And the only difference is genetic.
Identical twins are much more genetically similar than fraternal twins.
So, the variation of scores is different for the two, and the only difference between the groups is genetics.
So there's a genetic component to the scores.

Bills' observation that identical twins are not strictly genetically identical is true and relevant.
But it argues against his point of view.
That difference should "wash out" the effect that is seen.
But, in spite of the small differences between identical twins, the effect shows up.
The effect of genetics  must be slightly stronger than that calculated by the model.
 

Offline Pecos_Bill

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 334
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #82 on: 06/09/2015 18:17:57 »
As to the claim that these people don't presuppose that women don't match men in their GCSE scores....

" Quantitative sex differences refer to differences for ACE parameter estimates for male and female twin pairs. Qualitative sex differences indicate that different genes or different environmental factors influence males and females, which is suggested when the correlation for dizygotic opposite-sex (DZO) twins is less than the correlations for same-sex DZ pairs, based on the assumption that genetic or environmental influences that are specific to one sex will reduce within-pair similarity for the DZO group"  [1.]

Is this paper sexist? If the shoe fits- wear it and weep.

 [1.]  http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0080341

*****************************

Gracious me!

I haven't encountered such fervid efforts to sell me some dodgy "facts" since  George Bush and Tony Blair were whipping up the mob to invade  Iran.

I got banned from the "Letters to the Editor" for expressing my doubts then as well.

I don't care if every "Behavioral geneticist" in the world testifies to the value of this research  --it still reeks to me of yellow cake, aluminum tubes, and secret mobile poison gas factories.

Or is comparing the push to sell this paper to the push to sell the Iraq fiasco too "tangential" for you.
This bit of hyperbole is out of scope for this thread.
Rationale: This forum is primarily about Science (and its impact on society). The science of WMD is sufficiently removed from the science of twin studies that it belongs in a different thread. - Mod.


***************
Mr. bored_chemist disparages me for having quoted T.S. Elliot here as reason to refute this "research". Had more people read Elliot's poetry in 2002 there might not be hordes of people thirsting for our blood today.  And a careful reading of Elliot's poetry today would show the soulless denial of humanity which underlies this "research".
« Last Edit: 07/09/2015 03:48:42 by evan_au »
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8648
  • Thanked: 42 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #83 on: 06/09/2015 18:58:36 »
Do you actually understand that there is a difference between
" we found differences" and we "presuppose the inferiority of women's GCSE scores" ?
 

Offline alancalverd

  • Global Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4699
  • Thanked: 153 times
  • life is too short to drink instant coffee
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #84 on: 06/09/2015 22:01:01 »
Humanity is sexist. There are boys and there are girls, they look different, have different chromosomes, and they have different biological functions. It turns out (not that anyone "presupposes" it) that they also get different scores in public examinations, which explains why the majority of medical students in the UK are female. For this reason it is important to correct for the underlying sex differences in various subjects if you want to maximise the yield of statistical data from twin studies.

It's somewhat bizarre to criticise people for reading an allegedly racist paper published in 2013, by quoting
an antisemitic  poet who had the decency to die in 1965.
« Last Edit: 06/09/2015 23:12:54 by alancalverd »
 

Offline Pecos_Bill

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 334
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #85 on: 06/09/2015 23:25:44 »
In my opinion, women's different GCSE scores than those of men cannot depend on their DNA...

It is curious, is it not, that calling T.S. Elliot an anti-semite here is not deleted  as "tangential" by the moderator as long, it seems, as it is uttered by an Englishman? ...

When I cited Elliot's poem, "The Hollow Men" I was linking to people who hold that the sum of a person's humanity is encapsulated in their DNA. For what else is "Behavioral genetics" when you strip away its window dressing?

Reader, after the AI singularity what will your children's fate be when soulless machines have assessed their DNA for its possibilities?  The behavioral genetics people claim that I am an alarmist  -- besides being familiar with poetry.
This "ad hominem" is becoming "ad nauseum"...Mod

« Last Edit: 07/09/2015 06:50:51 by Pecos_Bill »
 

Offline Pecos_Bill

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 334
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #86 on: 07/09/2015 06:45:19 »
The gentleman states that since the majority of medical students in the UK are female this is evidence against gender discrimination because of their GCSE scores.

Here is evidence ( in the BMJ) that female doctors in the UK earn 29% less than male doctors. [1.]Now then, is that a natural effect because they have inherited it in their DNA being, after all, ...girls?  The behavioral geneticists differentiated them in this study because they assumed so. Is that not so?

I am a retired male RN.  Friends and neighbors do NOT try to feed me baloney about how fairly women are treated. I have watched them - and often borne that same burden. We have gotten the shaft throughout my career by smug "gentlemen" just like these "scientists" who call themselves "Behavioral geneticists".

[1.]  http://careers.bmj.com/careers/advice/view-article.html?id=20019204
 

Offline Pecos_Bill

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 334
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #87 on: 07/09/2015 07:15:46 »
Readers,

I had originally come to this place because as a retired RN, I enjoy still helping people with their medical questions. I became embroiled in this matter because it seemed to be a perversion of medicine for very tawdry, mean political ends. Having devoted my life to medicine, that sickens me. I would have been ashamed of myself in front of those who taught me the art and science of nursing had I failed to confront such a perversion, so help me God.

If I get the chance, I would like to help some more people here, we shall have to see.
Political comments moved to a different thread...Mod
« Last Edit: 09/09/2015 13:32:25 by evan_au »
 

Offline alancalverd

  • Global Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4699
  • Thanked: 153 times
  • life is too short to drink instant coffee
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #88 on: 07/09/2015 15:07:20 »
In my opinion, women's different GCSE scores than those of men cannot depend on their DNA...

A worthy opinion, but not tested by the paper (you would do well to read it before criticising it). The fact is that boys and girls score differently in different subjects, for whatever reason, so if you are looking for an inherited factor you have to correct for that potentially confounding variable, which they did.   


Quote
The gentleman states that since the majority of medical students in the UK are female this is evidence against gender discrimination because of their GCSE scores.

You would get more respect if you refrained from garbling other people's utterances into complete drivel. The point is that if you select people on the basis of their exam scores and interview performance, more girls than boys seem suited to medical studies. Whether this indicates discrimination against males or not depends on the relative performance and weighting of different examination subjects at A level (not GCSE) for which I have only anecdotal evidence that girls generally outperform boys in all subjects except physics - an unexplained anomaly, and quite irrelevant to the present discussion.

Quote
Here is evidence ( in the BMJ) that female doctors in the UK earn 29% less than male doctors. [1.]Now then, is that a natural effect because they have inherited it in their DNA being, after all, ...girls?

Yes! As in every other profession, women tend to take time out to raise children during their career development phase and often return to work part-time, and usually in the public sector, thus reducing both their career prospect and maximum earning potential. For those who stay, the public sector offers equal session pay at all levels and there is no earnings limit in the private sector. I pay my radiologists for what they do, not what they are, and since female patients generally prefer to see a female doctor, the women in my team can take home more than the men. Whether they do is up to them.

Quote
The behavioral geneticists differentiated them in this study because they assumed so. Is that not so?

No. If you had read the paper, you would know that there was no assumption. The statistics were based on actual examination results, which showed consistent gender differences, so they discussed and corrected for those differences.

If there is a difference between our cultures, and if you and I represent it, then I'm pleased to live on the side of the Atlantic where we are taught to examine the patient before diagnosing, and to read the instructions before administering the treatment!
« Last Edit: 08/09/2015 17:29:04 by alancalverd »
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8648
  • Thanked: 42 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #89 on: 07/09/2015 20:07:41 »
In reviewing my last posts, the biased interference of the moderator has shown me what a rigged game is being run here. I refuse to participate further in this charade of an open, honest  debate. 

You have yet to participate in this debate.
In a debate, if someone poses a question, you are expected to answer it or accept that you are wrong.
Posting poetry isn't an acceptable response.

You have totally failed to support essentially any assertion you have made (apart from a  few commonplace ones that nobody ever disputed anyway such as the fact that women are discriminated against or that Burt told lies).
 

Offline evan_au

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4101
  • Thanked: 245 times
    • View Profile
MOVED: Who controls the Naked Scientists?
« Reply #90 on: 09/09/2015 13:13:50 »
This topic on editorial control of the Naked Scientists show and Forum has been moved to New Theories.

Subsequent discussion of politics on this Physiology & Medicine thread is banned.

http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=60152.0
 

Offline alancalverd

  • Global Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4699
  • Thanked: 153 times
  • life is too short to drink instant coffee
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #91 on: 09/09/2015 18:24:00 »
As to the claim that these people don't presuppose that women don't match men in their GCSE scores....

" Quantitative sex differences refer to differences for ACE parameter estimates for male and female twin pairs. Qualitative sex differences indicate that different genes or different environmental factors influence males and females, which is suggested when the correlation for dizygotic opposite-sex (DZO) twins is less than the correlations for same-sex DZ pairs, based on the assumption that genetic or environmental influences that are specific to one sex will reduce within-pair similarity for the DZO group"  [1.]



You should distinguish betwen presupposition and observed fact. See my earlier response on this subject.
 

Offline Franklin_Uhuru

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 54
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #92 on: 11/09/2015 15:13:01 »
In reading this thread, a tear was brought to my eye seeing that the Naked Scientists have shown how  the genetic basis for paying women differently is absolute scientific truth. Of course British women doctors are paid 29% less because they are, ipso facto, genetically women. I mean, Duh! It's just  what I intend to tell my new bride when she learns enough English to speak with the neighborhood women.

I am so pleased as well to see that disgusting Pecan Bob person has now departed. The absolute gall of that person to say that these good men here were playing with a  " twerked" bat. The very idea is so ludicrous. Well, we have shown the world, haven't we? I notice the new verification methods to prevent future disturbances from such riff-raff and bearded anarchists. What times, eh?

God bless the naked scientists, Dr. Plomin, and England!
 

Offline alancalverd

  • Global Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4699
  • Thanked: 153 times
  • life is too short to drink instant coffee
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #93 on: 11/09/2015 18:27:07 »
Dear FU

The correspondence here has pointed out exactly the opposite of your assertions on the pay of women doctors in the UK.

Like PB, you seem to believe in your own psychic ability, to the extent of summarising arguments that you clearly have not read.
 
Be careful crossing the road.
« Last Edit: 11/09/2015 18:30:50 by alancalverd »
 

Offline Franklin_Uhuru

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 54
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #94 on: 11/09/2015 19:32:40 »
Thank God you have cleared that up, Sir!

For who could ever doubt the word of a British Gentleman when it comes to "The rights of women"? (Cf: Mary Wolltonstonescraft for historical context).

Even though you appear to be talking out of the other side of your mouth - again -- I am sure that is only due to my misapprehension of your earnest desire to be fair to the "weaker sex".

However, to avoid a lamentable accusation of being "ad hominem" perhaps you would show me the courtesy to address me by the private messages facility -- instead of publicly here -- so that I may respond to you more appropriately.

I am not, you see, one of the naked scientist elect and not allowed to pretend that I am speaking in condescending contempt to people after they have been secretly eliminated.

We naked scientist wallahs do so love having the last word. Do we not?

But this thread risks becoming tedious with you rhyming variations of your original theme.
 

Offline alancalverd

  • Global Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4699
  • Thanked: 153 times
  • life is too short to drink instant coffee
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #95 on: 11/09/2015 22:51:37 »
Alas, you seem to be cut from the same cloth as that fellow Pecos. Curious chap, started off full of interesting information and searching questions, then got a bee in his bonnet about a paper he clearly hadn't read, tried to cover his embarrassment with irrelevant insults, and rather lost credibility. We scientists just say "OK, I was wrong" and get on with life, because science is all about having your preconceptions challenged by facts.

So don't expect any PMs from me: if it can't be said in public, it's probably not worth saying.

If you happen to come across Pecos Bill in your exploration of cyberspace, you might pass this on:

 
Quote
Sept. 2 (Bloomberg) -- Female physicians in the U.S. continue to earn less than their male counterparts, with the pay gap widening during the past two decades to more than $50,000 annually in 2010, researchers said.

Women doctors had a median annual income of $165,278 from 2006 to 2010, compared with yearly earnings of $221,297 for male physicians, according to the report published today in JAMA Internal Medicine. While the annual pay for women doctors has increased since the median of $134,995 in 1990, itís only now beginning to approach the $168,795 annually earned by men 20 years ago, the researchers found.

He will probably point out that a 25.5% earnings gap compared wth 29% in the UK just shows that the USA is a haven of gender equality, but he might just have a lucid moment and ask his alter ego whether there's something other than prejudice involved.     
 

Offline Franklin_Uhuru

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 54
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #96 on: 12/09/2015 01:39:24 »
I recall Pecos_Bill saying that while people still struggle against sexism in America, they do not cook up phony pseudo science to claim it is due to genetic difference there. He made that point clearly shortly before he was eliminated by the forum's puppet master because it nauseated him (the puppet-master) to hear it.

Quote
Sorry Pecos_Bill, you are banned from using this forum!
Ad hominem, ad nauseum

After Pecos_Bill's "disapperance" we heard - at great length - these two gentlemen hammering on and on -now with no voice to refute them -- in classic "Big Lie" thuggish tactics. Give em the old razzle-dazzle! [1.]

Oh dear, have I upset your delicate Sassanach sensitivities by saying this? Will I, too, not survive the night? The suspense is terrible. I hope it lasts.

[1.] 
« Last Edit: 12/09/2015 01:48:27 by Franklin_Uhuru »
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8648
  • Thanked: 42 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #97 on: 12/09/2015 14:11:16 »
I recall Pecos_Bill saying that while people still struggle against sexism in America, they do not cook up phony pseudo science to claim it is due to genetic difference there. He made that point clearly shortly before he was eliminated by the forum's puppet master because it nauseated him (the puppet-master) to hear it.

Quote
Sorry Pecos_Bill, you are banned from using this forum!
Ad hominem, ad nauseum

After Pecos_Bill's "disapperance" we heard - at great length - these two gentlemen hammering on and on -now with no voice to refute them -- in classic "Big Lie" thuggish tactics. Give em the old razzle-dazzle! [1.]

Oh dear, have I upset your delicate Sassanach sensitivities by saying this? Will I, too, not survive the night? The suspense is terrible. I hope it lasts.

[1.] 
And your evidence that the science is phony is...?
Or are yo just making an unjustified claim because you don't like the outcome?
 

Offline Franklin_Uhuru

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 54
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #98 on: 12/09/2015 23:36:58 »
Has British science not learned its lesson from Wakefield's recent autism/vaccination British crime against humanity?  Guess not. Just as Burt's behavioral genetics crimes have now been swept under the rug. Too old and irrelevant , they say.

Quote
In "The Mismeasure of Man" by  Harvard Professor, Stephen Jay Gould we read of the shameful history of biological determinism (another term for the "genetic psychology" of this paper) from obvious fallacy like "Craniometry" right down to the ... Burt Affair.[deleted text here]
In my opinion, this [paper] is a warmed over re-hash of the Burt Affair, and The Naked Scientists should not have publicized it.
 

Quote
The history behind this "research" is telling in its nature but it was deleted.
 

Quote
The moderator has chosen to delete my citations of scientific deceptions in Britain -- including the field of "behavioral genetics" as tangential. 


Here is a list of discussions of Wakefield here to show that is the case..
1.  Topic: Was Doctor Andrew Wakefield Right After all? http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=51468.0

2.     Topic: VACCINES INTERVIEW   http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=2810.0

3.    Topic: Is there a link between vaccination and autism? http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=13710.0;nowap


It should have been allowed so as to compare this similarly dodgy research in "behavioral genetics" to let the readers decide themselves.
« Last Edit: 14/09/2015 12:54:31 by evan_au »
 

Offline Bored chemist

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8648
  • Thanked: 42 times
    • View Profile
Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #99 on: 13/09/2015 10:02:40 »
The fact that some people like Burt and Wakefield have been charlatans is well recognised.
But it has nothing to do with this research because those charlatans didn't take part in it.

Do you have either an alternative explanation for the observation of more similar scores for identical twins or evidence that the science in the paper is flawed?

If not you have nothing to say except that you don't like the results.
« Last Edit: 14/09/2015 12:55:32 by evan_au »
 

The Naked Scientists Forum

Re: Do your genes affect your GCSE grades?
« Reply #99 on: 13/09/2015 10:02:40 »

 

SMF 2.0.10 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
SMFAds for Free Forums