# The Naked Scientists Forum

### Author Topic: How do radio waves work?  (Read 3592 times)

#### thedoc

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##### How do radio waves work?
« on: 17/09/2015 03:50:01 »
Andy asked the Naked Scientists:

If electromagnetic waves are  dipoles glued together turning end over end in space they can seperate to go through slits and rejoin does this not repeat the slit experiment for wave particle duality without going through all points in space, and hard maths.

Also if a 2 objects in space are seperated by long distances they can be viewed as a points in space that emits radio waves in all directions, the electromagnetic field can be viewed as a vortex that attracts. to simplify the statement, lets say it is emits radio waves with a clockwise spin, from both points the vortices will produce an attraction force for all clockwise spins, Is this not gravity. The vortices will be like clockwise screws turning into each other.
If you take the bohr hydrogen model as an example, seperated by space this would be the effect I think??

In addition to this would anti matter and matter not have spins the opposite directions and so repel expanding the universe, is this not what you refer to as dark matter.
Also quantum mechanics having allowed levels of spin ie 2p 4p 6p etc is this not the same as an induction motor. With matter made up of magnetic dipoles joining together, electron spin and positron spin are dipoles spinning in opposite directions, radio waves are dipoles spinning pole over pole, protons are dipoles joined up in a torus and spinning neutrons have an electron spinning in the middle of the torus
Is this coming towards quantum wave theory, sorry I haven't been in university for 30 years my maths is rusty, and my text books are 1000 miles away in storage.

Kind regards Andy

What do you think?
« Last Edit: 18/09/2015 08:07:52 by chris »

#### dlorde

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #1 on: 24/09/2015 14:07:35 »
Does anyone have a comment yet.
You say you have discovered "the key to understanding the universe", but nobody take it seriously? I'm sure I've heard that before...

So what novel testable predictions does your model make? how can it be verified or falsified?

Can you demonstrate mathematically how it accounts for the same observed phenomena with at least the same precision or better as the current model of quantum field theory, or at large scales, General Relativity? Post up just a couple of worked examples, to add some meat to the description.

Your 'lindas', permeating all space, sound a little like a quantum field - is that a useful analogy?

In your paper, you say that photons (lindas rotating pole over pole) 'move energy without loss' (it's not clear to me precisely what that means, besides the 1st Law of Thermodynamics), and at every point in space, they disturb the surrounding lindas, causing a ripple of motion to spread out in their wake. Where does the energy for this wake-like ripple of motion come from, if the photons themselves don't lose energy - or are you suggesting that photons lose energy as they propagate by disturbing the lindas of the vacuum?

With respect to the double slit experiment, you seem to suggest (correct me if I've got this wrong), that photons from the light source disturb the lindas in the path to and from the slits so as to eventually cause some to become photons themselves, and so add to the photons hitting the detector plate. How does this explain the one-to-one correspondence between photons from the light source and photons detected on the plate, when photons are fired singly through the slits? Also, how does it account for the same effect when other particles are used, such as electrons, or even multi-atom molecules (e.g. carbon-60 'Buckyballs')?
« Last Edit: 24/09/2015 14:19:04 by dlorde »

#### Colin2B

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #2 on: 25/09/2015 11:10:44 »
Andy asked the Naked Scientists:

If electromagnetic waves are  dipoles glued together turning end over end in space they can seperate .......................
Andy,
Can you quote the source you got this from as it is not a valid way of looking a EM waves.
Also, the rest of your post does not seem to relate to the question in the topic header, what are you really asking?
Would be better if you asked one question at a time then folks could get a handle on something and reply.

#### PmbPhy

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #3 on: 25/09/2015 12:12:05 »
Andy asked the Naked Scientists:

If electromagnetic waves are  dipoles glued together turning end over end in space they can seperate .......................
Andy,
Can you quote the source you got this from as it is not a valid way of looking a EM waves.
Also, the rest of your post does not seem to relate to the question in the topic header, what are you really asking?
Would be better if you asked one question at a time then folks could get a handle on something and reply.
To be exact he's not referring to EM waves here. He's claiming that such a device produces EM radiation. However a source of dipole radiation is a device such that that two charges oscillate along one axis only such that the position of the two charges each oscillate in position along the same axis such that there's always a dipole moment.

#### Waterpourer

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #4 on: 25/09/2015 13:50:38 »
Folks I have done my best to explain the force carrier in terms a 5 year old will understand, I have other interests, so am moving on. I don't think you are  interested. I have better things to do for the next few months, like sailing across oceans, its all about freedom of thought and life.
I will deregister from the forum as soon as I work out how too

Kindest regards and Best wishes.

#### acsinuk

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #5 on: 25/09/2015 14:42:47 »
Radio waves are an directional energy vibration through an area of magnetised space.  The misconception is that an electromagnetic wave is considered as electro-negative charge magnetic wave or worse an electron particle wave.
Light is a magnetic energy vibration only; but if it contacts an electron it can under the correct phase angle condition be reflected or even transferred as energy.

#### PmbPhy

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #6 on: 25/09/2015 15:04:03 »
Folks I have done my best to explain the force carrier in terms a 5 year old will understand, I have other interests, so am moving on. I don't think you are  interested. I have better things to do for the next few months, like sailing across oceans, its all about freedom of thought and life.
I will deregister from the forum as soon as I work out how too

Kindest regards and Best wishes.
It's not that we're not interested. It's simply that we answered your question already. And there's no real reason that any subject in physics can be explained to a 5 year old.

#### Colin2B

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #7 on: 25/09/2015 15:31:29 »
......However a source of dipole radiation is a device such that that two charges oscillate along one axis only such that the position of the two charges each oscillate in position along the same axis such that there's always a dipole moment.
That's what I thought, so I couldn't make sense of the post or what was really being asked. Certainly not how radio waves work.
I think I've missed the point that Andy and Wave pourer are one in same!

#### dlorde

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #8 on: 25/09/2015 21:28:43 »
Folks I have done my best to explain the force carrier in terms a 5 year old will understand, I have other interests, so am moving on. I don't think you are  interested.
Go and fetch me a 5 year old child! [/groucho]

Someone called Chris (not Andy or WaterPourer) has removed the link to the 'TOE' paper in the OP. I was interested enough to ask some questions about it. I'm not a physicist or a 5 year old child, so they ought to be easy enough to answer...

I could attach the 'TOE Shortened.pdf' file here, but I guess Chris, Andy, or WaterPourer (??) decided it was a mistake to post it, so it might be unfair.

#### Waterpourer

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #9 on: 26/09/2015 08:36:55 »
If you wish to repost it feel free, it is only a small part of many ideas I have, which im going to publish. I do have to fly now, I'll look in when I get another internet connection and see what is going on maybe. I'm not aiming at main stream physics.
Enjoy yourselves

#### Pecos_Bill

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #10 on: 26/09/2015 08:46:32 »
Radio waves are so much easier to understand when you ignore those tacky Maxwell Equations.

They are, after all, partial differential equations and so much more complicated than take away and "goes into" stuff.

I mean really, you turn it on and tune in the station. Naked scientists, wise up!

#### mathew_orman

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #11 on: 27/09/2015 09:49:30 »
We do not know...
For now all we have is a mathematical model of EM propagation....

#### Waterpourer

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##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #12 on: 27/09/2015 11:44:08 »
Just in case you are too shy to upload the file I deleted, here it is again. You can delete it if you want.

Best Wishes

#### The Naked Scientists Forum

##### Re: How do radio waves work?
« Reply #12 on: 27/09/2015 11:44:08 »

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