The Naked Scientists

The Naked Scientists Forum

Author Topic: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)  (Read 6425610 times)

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1425 on: 02/10/2008 01:46:52 »
yes, hurray, I thought it was very encouraging. Thanks!

And your help in locating Dr. Schweitzer was great; you're a better Googler than me!
« Last Edit: 02/10/2008 01:58:53 by demografx »
 

Offline Counterpoints

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 592
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1426 on: 02/10/2008 08:11:34 »
If anyone is interested, I know an MD PhD researcher in California who has seen POIS patients, recognizes it as a legitimate condition, and would be willing to see new patients. He is aware of all the present research, and this forum.  He has read Dr. Waldinger's paper.  If you are in or near San Fransisco, and would like to find out more about this person, send me a private message and I will send you his CV.
 

Offline Counterpoints

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 592
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1427 on: 02/10/2008 08:28:17 »
Interesting thoughts, B_Jim.

I have been trying Bisoprolol 5 mg/day for slightly over a month now.  I am noticing definite improvement.  Recovery time has gone from 12-40 hrs to
4-5 hrs.  This happened gradually -- I needed to take the medication for at least three weeks to notice much difference. (Assuming the difference has anything to do with Bisoprolol! This could be coincidental).

Also note, I tried Zoloft, starting at the beginning of August, and ending mid September.  It slightly decreased sexual urges, which was helpful, but I do not sense it had a profound effect on POIS. 
 

Offline Counterpoints

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 592
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1428 on: 02/10/2008 08:42:54 »
Remember I was asking about motor control?  For me, motor control isn't noticeably affected during POIS, and it doesn't seem to affect many of those who responded to my question.  But look at this (see bolded text):
From: https://www.neurorelief.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=149&Itemid=48
"Dopamine is an excitatory and inhibitory neurotransmitter, depending on the dopaminergic receptor it binds to. It is derived from the amino acid tyrosine. Dopamine is the precursor to norepinephrine and epinephrine, which are all catecholamines. The function of dopamine is diverse but plays a large role in the pleasure/reward pathway (addiction and thrills), memory, and motor control. Dopamine, like norepinephrine and epinephrine, is stored in vesicles in the axon terminal. Dopamine plays a significant role in the cardiovascular, renal, hormonal, and central nervous systems. The dopaminergic neurons have dendrites that extend into various regions of the brain, controlling different functions through the stimulation of adrenergic and dopaminergic receptors (D1 D5). Common symptoms with low dopamine levels are loss of motor control, addictions, cravings, compulsions, and loss of satisfaction. When dopamine levels are elevated symptoms may manifest in the form of anxiety or hyperactivity. Some therapies utilize L-DOPA for parkinsonian symptoms which can also cause elevations in dopamine."

This seems to cast doubt on the dopamine hypothesis.  Though I do certainly experience "(unexplainable) cravings for orgasm, compulsions, and loss of satisfaction" while feeling symptomatic.
 

Offline hurray

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 170
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1429 on: 02/10/2008 10:56:21 »
Thanks Demografx, your initiative in contacting Dr Schweitzer and Dr Waldinger was the important bit, was glad to be able to help a little!

Interesting view Counterpoints. I have taken selegiline for a long time, it is a dopamine reuptake inhibitor. In laymans terms, it means that your brain has access to lots more dopamine than usual. I have been taking it to avoid alzheimers disease, which sadly runs in my family. I should point out that I had been suffering from POIS for many years before I started taking selegiline.

In theory, all this extra dopamine should help ward off POIS. In practice, it does nothing except make me feel somewhat jittery. When I take it after the POIS has faded, its effects work as they are supposed to (seeing colors more vividly, increased sense of vitality). I have also tried L-Tyrosine supplements (the precursor to dopamine, not to be taken at the same time as selegiline!), with no results during POIS, but a significant effect outside that period.

It feels like I'm trying to penetrate some sort of dense cloud in my mind when I drink coffee or do other things to get rid of POIS, but nothing seems to shift it. If we could somehow find out what was causing the brain fog, we would be so much closer to finding an effective treatment ...
 

Offline hurray

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 170
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1430 on: 02/10/2008 11:40:49 »
Good news regarding your reaction to Bisoprolol Counterpoints! If it's not too personal to ask, are you taking this drug to help with high blood pressure?

I have high blood pressure myself.

Could there be a link between high blood pressure and POIS?
 

Offline longwalkhome

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 10
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1431 on: 02/10/2008 13:12:51 »
This may not have too much to do with finding a permanent solution, but how does everyone on here deal with POIS? Without a doubt it's a very frustrating experience for all of us, but what choices do you make in dealing with it, and how do you live with them? As for me, I've been trying to cut down on all kinds of sexual activity, but it's a very hard thing to do. I'm still rather young, and seeing all prospects of any healthy and regular kind of sexuality wither away at this point gets me down very often. Also, I can always only keep myself from being sexually active for so long before giving in to my bodily needs. How does everyone stop themselves from doing it? How's everyone holding up?
 

Offline Counterpoints

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 592
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1432 on: 02/10/2008 18:53:37 »
Good news regarding your reaction to Bisoprolol Counterpoints! If it's not too personal to ask, are you taking this drug to help with high blood pressure?

I have high blood pressure myself.

Could there be a link between high blood pressure and POIS?

I'm taking it primarily to see how it affects my POIS symptoms.  Before the medication, my blood pressure was fairly good (~120/70).  But sometimes it would go up really high, for an evening (~165/110).  I am not confident, yet, that bisoprolol is helping me. The intensity and duration of my symptoms does vary over a period of months.

There may be a link with blood pressure, but it isn't obvious to me yet. I get symptoms after overheating my head in a hot shower -- they're not exactly the same, but they include expressive dysphasia, etc.  This could have something to do with vasodilation, or a lowered? blood pressure.  ACE inhibitors are now more recommended than beta blockers for blood pressure issues.  It would be very interesting to see the effect of an ACE inhibitor on pois symptoms. 
« Last Edit: 02/10/2008 19:01:59 by Counterpoints »
 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1433 on: 02/10/2008 20:41:35 »
Dr. Marcel Waldinger: received his acknowledgement today that he received and appreciates my private phone numbers and that he wants to speak soon. More encouragement!

Counterpoints, great going with your San Francisco MD! Do you think he would be amenable to telephone or email consultations if someone is too far to visit?

I assume he would charge a fee in either case? Maybe those with insurance plans will be covered to some extent.

It would be nice if there were a medical code # for POIS, so that insurance companies don't raise their eyebrows.
« Last Edit: 02/10/2008 21:08:19 by demografx »
 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1434 on: 02/10/2008 20:49:53 »
This may not have too much to do with finding a permanent solution, but how does everyone on here deal with POIS? Without a doubt it's a very frustrating experience for all of us, but what choices do you make in dealing with it, and how do you live with them? As for me, I've been trying to cut down on all kinds of sexual activity, but it's a very hard thing to do. I'm still rather young, and seeing all prospects of any healthy and regular kind of sexuality wither away at this point gets me down very often. Also, I can always only keep myself from being sexually active for so long before giving in to my bodily needs. How does everyone stop themselves from doing it? How's everyone holding up?
longwalkhome, I think you're doing the right things. There is no magic answer. Some treatments we are testing seem to have results, but we're still testing. Stopping or slowing down the sex drive at your age is most difficult. The main thing is to not give up, we are making a lot of progress. Please re-read some of the posts since last year and you will find some answers and progress!

Did you see "girlwind"'s POIS video?
« Last Edit: 02/10/2008 21:10:37 by demografx »
 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1435 on: 02/10/2008 21:14:01 »
Any news on the Garlic Protocol?
 

Offline hurray

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 170
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1436 on: 02/10/2008 23:30:30 »

Counterpoints, it will be very interesting to see how your treatment develops. It is too optimistic to hope that a drug will ever be developed that specifically deals with POIS, but it may well be that one of the drugs that already exists could be a safe and effective treatment for POIS.

Hopefully, without endangering ourselves, and with the guidance of a qualified health professional, we can slowly begin to pin down which drugs are most effective at dealing with POIS.
Of course, if we fully understood the mechanism behind POIS, this process of discovery would be very rapidly accelerated!
 

Offline John21

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1437 on: 02/10/2008 23:37:45 »
No news from me Demo, I'm avoiding testing things out...NEs have been infrequent. I'll keep ya'll informed if I learn anything. I'm too busy watching our financial system fall apart these days to worry about POIS.  [V]


 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1438 on: 03/10/2008 04:12:00 »
No news from me Demo, I'm avoiding testing things out...NEs have been infrequent. I'll keep ya'll informed if I learn anything. I'm too busy watching our financial system fall apart these days to worry about POIS.  [V]
John, don't watch it. It's too depressing. I'd rather hear about garlic and hormones, and neurotransmitters ;D
 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1439 on: 03/10/2008 19:13:30 »
At the moment, i'm looking for another cause of possible adrenal dysfunction and I will have the results in 1 or 2 months.

B_Jim, that sounds very interesting. I look forward to your findings!
 

Offline girlwind

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1440 on: 03/10/2008 20:49:49 »
At the moment, i'm looking for another cause of possible adrenal dysfunction and I will have the results in 1 or 2 months.

B_Jim, that sounds very interesting. I look forward to your findings!

A new insight on the THYROID--ADRENAL Connection
I got my hormone tests back last week and found out that (among other things) I am hypothyroid. This is exactly
what I suspected, as many of the symptoms I present fit the hypothyroid profile. Several weeks ago I'd discovered
that I am iodine deficient, and since iodine is a key nutrient for maintaining healthy thyroid functioning, I had been
searching to find "clean" (non-toxic and organic) sources of iodine rich seaweed. After trying out a few seaweed
supplements, that had NOT been tested for toxicity (thanks to Martin88 for pointing this out), I FINALLY found a
a powdered kelp that is farmed in Iceland, and which is certified organic. I have been taking the seaweed (both
the former ones and the new one) for a few weeks now, and I DEFINITELY notice a difference in both my CFS
and POIS symptoms.
My energy is better, less brain fog and quicker recuperation from orgasm. And I
haven't even begun to "officially treat the thyroid" itself--this is just from increasing iodine in my diet! HELLO!

For so many years I have been focused on repairing exhausted ADRENALS, and not paid much attention to the
thyroid.  Most of the time in the past, my saliva tests for cortisol have been clearly out of range. Though fortunately,
this last time, they showed that I have made definitive headway on adrenal restoration, so I know all those years of
adrenal boosting supplemets have actually worked. 

Since my past blood work for  thyroid almost always showed me in the very "low normal" range on thyroid tests, I
never pursued  the thyroid issue. However, from what I have recently read, there are  quite a number of doctors who
disagree with the "normal" reference ranges of thyroid tests, especially the TSH. What is dawning on me now is that I
could have had a subclinical thyroid problem for MANY YEARS, which went undiagnosed because of this.

There is SO MUCH info I've gathered in the past weeks that it's too much to go into here in one posting. All I can say
is that this has been a blazing revelation of an experience for me, and I am still taking it in. I'm going to see an actual
MD in mid-October, who is known for her excellent work on hormone balancing, and leans toward natural remedies,
diet and supplements in her practice. We'll see what happens next. In the mean time, for anyone who is interested, I
have posted just some of the articles I have read.

Because iodine is HUGELY involved in metabolism, as well as thyroid health, hormonal health, brain health,
digestive health, immune health and reproductive organ health, I think it's worth it to know more about it.


http://holtorfmed.reachlocal.net/article_info.php?articles_id=2
http://thyroid.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?zi=1/XJ&sdn=thyroid&cdn=health&tm=13&f=22&su=p284.9.336.ip_p726.4.336.ip_&tt=2&bt=1&bts=1&zu=http%3A//www.thyroid-info.com/articles/mercola.htm
http://www.mercola.com/article/hypothyroid/diagnosis_comp.htm
http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/brownstein-hormones.htm
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/
http://www.dcnutrition.com/Minerals/Detail.CFM?RecordNumber=73
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2004/08/11/thyroid-health.aspx
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=nutrient&dbid=69#deficiencysymptoms
http://www.iodine4health.com/index.htm




 

Offline Counterpoints

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 592
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1441 on: 03/10/2008 22:24:50 »
Counterpoints, great going with your San Francisco MD! Do you think he would be amenable to telephone or email consultations if someone is too far to visit?

I assume he would charge a fee in either case? Maybe those with insurance plans will be covered to some extent.

It would be nice if there were a medical code # for POIS, so that insurance companies don't raise their eyebrows.

Demografx,

Good questions.  Naturally he would charge a fee for personal visits.  I'm not sure about telephone conversations, but I doubt he would be open to this.  He's extremely busy, and couldn't afford to have many POIS sufferers calling him and expecting equal shares of his time. I will ask him what he would consider doing in this regard, though.

It's probably best if we stream-lined our contact with him through a spokesperson.  This way we could represent all of us.  For example, we could all co-sign a letter detailing our individual concerns and questions, and our theories on the causes, and correspond with him this way. (e.g. he responds, we work on another letter, he responds, we collaborate on another letter, etc.).

He *is* interested in doing a serious research investigation into this problem, and that would help all of us.  He has begun writing some questions for us.  We would not be charged for this, though we may be able to help him get a grant to fund this study.  He will likely be able to focus on this starting in a month or two.

(To all those who have sent me messages, I will respond.  Please give me some time.  Thanks).
 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1442 on: 04/10/2008 00:48:57 »
girlwind, good news on the thyroid-adrenal front. And I'm glad you're feeling better with the treatment! More pieces of the puzzle come together.
 

Offline girlwind

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1443 on: 04/10/2008 01:57:47 »
girlwind, good news on the thyroid-adrenal front. And I'm glad you're feeling better with the treatment! More pieces of the puzzle come together.

For now it's really been about taking care of the IODINE DEFICIENCY. It is making a HUGE difference in my overall
health to get more iodine in my diet.  I'm sure this is something my thyroid is appreciating, but all my other hormonal
activities are better too. FYI: I had an orgasm last night and my POIS are 80-90 percent better.

 http://www.iodine4health.com/body/body.htm
 

Offline Guthrie

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 189
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1444 on: 04/10/2008 02:09:21 »

A new insight on the THYROID--ADRENAL Connection
I got my hormone tests back last week and found out that (among other things) I am hypothyroid. This is exactly
what I suspected, as many of the symptoms I present fit the hypothyroid profile. Several weeks ago I'd discovered
that I am iodine deficient, and since iodine is a key nutrient for maintaining healthy thyroid functioning, I had been
searching to find "clean" (non-toxic and organic) sources of iodine rich seaweed. After trying out a few seaweed
supplements, that had NOT been tested for toxicity (thanks to Martin88 for pointing this out), I FINALLY found a
a powdered kelp that is farmed in Iceland, and which is certified organic. I have been taking the seaweed (both
the former ones and the new one) for a few weeks now, and I DEFINITELY notice a difference in both my CFS
and POIS symptoms.
My energy is better, less brain fog and quicker recuperation from orgasm. And I
haven't even begun to "officially treat the thyroid" itself--this is just from increasing iodine in my diet! HELLO!

Girlwind, could you tell us the brands of the kelp/seaweed products that you've been taking?
 

Offline girlwind

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1445 on: 04/10/2008 02:26:42 »
Girlwind, could you tell us the brands of the kelp/seaweed products that you've been taking?

Sure. I found a company in Oregon, called Mountain Rose Herbs, that has kelp from Iceland.
It's the only place I found that actually tests their seaweed, and gives it a certified organic label.
As you will see, some of their seaweeds are wild harvested, but the one I bought was the organic.

Prior to that I took a product called Modifilan--which is a very strong laminaria japonica extract.
It was either just TOO concentrated, or it was chelating heavy metals out of me, or it was toxic.
I tried it a while and noticed energy improvement, but couldn't handle the detox (or just plain toxic)
symptoms. I would no longer recommend it. But some people I know HAVE benefitted from it.
I'm sending you both links to check out for yourself.

http://www.mountainroseherbs.com/seaweed/seaweed.html
http://www.modifilan.com/
« Last Edit: 04/10/2008 02:33:10 by girlwind »
 

Offline tarkington

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 39
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1446 on: 04/10/2008 03:10:07 »
This was on the Kelp from Iceland information webpage.  Do you have any recommendations on how often to take the powder?

Precautions
Don't use on a daily basis for more than 2 weeks at a time, taking a 2 week break before using again. This will prevent you from overdosing iodine with potential imbalance in thyroid function. For periodic use only and not to be taken for extended periods of time. Not to be used while pregnant.


 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1447 on: 04/10/2008 03:49:42 »
I had an orgasm last night and my POIS are 80-90 percent better.
Great news, girlwind!

And...sorry if I missed it: how did you test for your iodine deficiency? Do you think iodine could make a difference in POIS for men vs women?
« Last Edit: 04/10/2008 03:57:18 by demografx »
 

Offline demografx

  • Moderator
  • Neilep Level Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8196
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1448 on: 04/10/2008 04:00:43 »
This was on the Kelp from Iceland information webpage.  Do you have any recommendations on how often to take the powder?

Precautions
Don't use [iodine product above] on a daily basis for more than 2 weeks at a time, taking a 2 week break before using again. This will prevent you from overdosing iodine with potential imbalance in thyroid function. For periodic use only and not to be taken for extended periods of time. Not to be used while pregnant.


Thank you, Tarkington!
 

Offline girlwind

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
    • View Profile
Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1449 on: 04/10/2008 04:02:42 »
This was on the Kelp from Iceland information webpage.  Do you have any recommendations on how often to take the powder?

Precautions
Don't use on a daily basis for more than 2 weeks at a time, taking a 2 week break before using again. This will prevent you from overdosing iodine with potential imbalance in thyroid function. For periodic use only and not to be taken for extended periods of time. Not to be used while pregnant.


I'm only taking a 1/2 teaspoon per day (in a vegie smoothie) and am not too concerned about overdosing.
Since I'm already very deficient in iodine, and hypothyroid on top of that, I'm just going to see how I feel
as I go. If I feel symptomatic (as in overly amped up), I will stop it for a while and then continue later, as
they suggest. Since this iodine is in a food source, not an extract or concentrate, it feels like a pretty safe
way to get my iodine level up.

As I have read in my research on this topic, there are a lot of arguments about how much is too much (or
too little) iodine. David Browstein (an MD who has worked with several thousand patients who have had some
form of iodine deficiency and is one of the experts on the subject)) claims that the recommended daily
requirements are much too low. He points out that in Japan, where they ingest ten times the amount iodine
that we do in the US (from seafood and seaweed), there is very little hypothyroidism and very little breast
cancer (a connection that is worth any woman considering).

I can't recommend how you should take the iodine, because everyone is different, but I did want to pass this
information along because it has already been so dramatically helpful for me.
« Last Edit: 04/10/2008 04:15:34 by girlwind »
 

The Naked Scientists Forum

Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #1449 on: 04/10/2008 04:02:42 »

 

SMF 2.0.10 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
SMFAds for Free Forums
 
Login
Login with username, password and session length