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Author Topic: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)  (Read 6457342 times)

Offline bastianb

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Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #14900 on: 10/11/2011 03:12:45 »
I don't want to steal the topic, I know I've been posting a lot but I just want you guys to vote on these profiling polls I've spent time on that could help us see what things we really shared before getting POIS and how it's related to other disorders:

newbielink:http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=247.0 [nonactive]

newbielink:http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=246.0 [nonactive]

 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #14901 on: 10/11/2011 03:40:48 »
Thanks demografx and Daveman!

The most interesting article I read from those you linked to, was the New York Times article.
I think it stands out more from the others because of the writing style and in-depth info.

Thank you for the feedback!
 

Offline B_Daniel

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« Reply #14902 on: 10/11/2011 06:38:25 »
bastianb, i played hockey for 8 years growing up and was never very good.  In hindsight, I think some of that may have been POIS related.  Welcome to the forum, you've got a lot of reading/ catching up to do.  Finding relief from the campfire smoke is quite bizarre, but anything's possible with this crazy condition.  The relief you found with chocolate may be bc of chocolate's caffeine content.  Does coffee help you?  How about ADHD meds like adderol and ritalin.  As long as I don't take ritalin too often, it affords me a few good hours.  All in all, your symptoms are very similar to that of most of us here: the only minor difference I'd say is that many of us have symptoms which last from 5-12 days.  I'm glad you found us.

I feel like finding our forum is akin to that scene in the movie The Beach, when Leonardo DiCaprio jumps into the water from the cliff and finds the secret village. 

Suppertime, welcome as well.  When you go see your Urologist, bring with a copy of Dr. Waldinger's POIS study and give it to the doc to read over.  Besides that, I don't really know.  If the doctor doesn't take Waldinger's work seriously, I'd stop going to him.
« Last Edit: 10/11/2011 06:40:00 by B_Daniel »
 

Offline bastianb

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« Reply #14903 on: 10/11/2011 15:00:08 »
bastianb, i played hockey for 8 years growing up and was never very good.  In hindsight, I think some of that may have been POIS related.  Welcome to the forum, you've got a lot of reading/ catching up to do.  Finding relief from the campfire smoke is quite bizarre, but anything's possible with this crazy condition.  The relief you found with chocolate may be bc of chocolate's caffeine content.  Does coffee help you?  How about ADHD meds like adderol and ritalin.  As long as I don't take ritalin too often, it affords me a few good hours.  All in all, your symptoms are very similar to that of most of us here: the only minor difference I'd say is that many of us have symptoms which last from 5-12 days.  I'm glad you found us.

I feel like finding our forum is akin to that scene in the movie The Beach, when Leonardo DiCaprio jumps into the water from the cliff and finds the secret village.

Suppertime, welcome as well.  When you go see your Urologist, bring with a copy of Dr. Waldinger's POIS study and give it to the doc to read over.  Besides that, I don't really know.  If the doctor doesn't take Waldinger's work seriously, I'd stop going to him.

Exactly! finding this forum took me AGES! It needs better exposure in my opinion, not saying the website is designed bad, actually it's very easy to use but it's often not found easily by any means.

I don't think the hot chocolate brought relief because of its caffeine because of the fact that caffeine usually energizes me during non-POIS days but during POIS days any form of caffeine has the reverse effect.

If coffee makes me wake up by 50% usually, in POIS days it may make me feel worse (easier to catch cold, worse breathing etc.) by 50% while SOME relief from the brain fog.

The kind of relief I got from hot chocolate, melted cheese and even smoke (!) were quite the same. Not Placebo I'm sure but my own theory is it might be that I consumed (or breathed in) ALL of them while they were VERY hot.

So maybe breathing in hot vapor is the answer? Something I'm going to try soon along with a few others I have in my research list!

I'm saying that because on all of above cases I had immediate, 100% relief from brain fog, breathing difficulty, feeling like I'm going to catch a cold etc.
 

Offline pois1

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« Reply #14904 on: 10/11/2011 23:29:46 »
I went to see Dr. Bewtra and was diagnosed positive.  Both the skin ***** and intradermal tests showed positive.  He prescribed Allegra.  Has anyone here had luck with that?  So far it doesn't seem all that impressive.  I have found quick release Clariton right after an episode to help with symptoms.  I wonder if taking it an hour before helps.  I do want to try to get desensitization therapy done but haven't found anyone closeby.
 

Offline Pharaoh

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« Reply #14905 on: 12/11/2011 01:46:27 »
I went to see Dr. Bewtra and was diagnosed positive.  Both the skin ***** and intradermal tests showed positive.  He prescribed Allegra.  Has anyone here had luck with that?  So far it doesn't seem all that impressive.  I have found quick release Clariton right after an episode to help with symptoms.  I wonder if taking it an hour before helps.  I do want to try to get desensitization therapy done but haven't found anyone closeby.

Allegra hasn't done anything for me.  Over-the-counter meds will be as unhelpful for us as it is for people with severe allergies to specific foods or bee stings. 

I saw a psychiatrist who specializes in sexual medicine yesterday.  He put me on Wellbutrin to help with the cognitive problems and depression, and will contact an allergist for me.  He and his team had printed out Waldinger's papers and have promised to help with finding a solution.  Today is my first day on Wellbutrin and I must admit, I feel a lot better.  Although it's not wise to load up on the caffeine while on this stuff.  I'm going to request the same type of hyposensitization treatment that Waldinger administered.  Will let you know about the progress.
« Last Edit: 14/11/2011 00:38:17 by Pharaoh »
 

Offline bastianb

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« Reply #14906 on: 12/11/2011 02:15:47 »
I just found this page, might be helpful due to the info it gives AND it adds yet another mystery possibility:

newbielink:http://www.drdaveanddee.com/headache.html [nonactive]

Also I want to repost the little theory I had that I posted in POIS Center, which is a theory in contrast of the website I linked above:

"By doing more research... I actually found a correlation between Chickenpox and similar viruses such as Lyme disease developing Encephalitis which has the same symptoms as POIS give or take a few details.

but they are only side effects of the illness themselves so they can't usually happen after the person is immune (healed off the virus) but what if because of ejaculation at time of illness, the body used some of the virus contents in the semen and thus continued to rely on the virus to make future semens? while producing the virus inside to add to semen, the person with the condition suffers Encephalitis because of the shock received by suddenly having a virus inside the body and when the virus is produced in the right amount the Encephalitis stops shortly afterwards. This also explains the prolonged days of POIS in older individuals, maybe they make semen slower? Also when most POIS sufferers have back to back orgasms their symptoms get worse.
This is just a theory but to me it sounds very likely to be true or similar to what REALLY happens."

 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #14907 on: 12/11/2011 03:52:12 »
 
What we have is Anaphylaxis...


No! What evidence do you have for this?




edit - There are 1,500 U.S. deaths yearly from Anaphylaxis.
            Source: National Center for Health Statistics






« Last Edit: 12/11/2011 04:09:22 by demografx »
 

Offline Vincent M

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« Reply #14908 on: 12/11/2011 07:47:12 »
over-the-counter meds will be as unhelpful for us as it is for people with severe allergies to specific foods or bee stings. 

i don't wanna be rude or anything but i just wanna point out that normal over the counter Claritin has been very effective in treating mine and some others' POIS symptoms. I plan on trying benadryl next.
 

Offline Pharaoh

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« Reply #14909 on: 12/11/2011 13:02:00 »
over-the-counter meds will be as unhelpful for us as it is for people with severe allergies to specific foods or bee stings. 

i don't wanna be rude or anything but i just wanna point out that normal over the counter Claritin has been very effective in treating mine and some others' POIS symptoms. I plan on trying benadryl next.

How has it been effective?  Has it eliminated the brain fog and fatigue?  Do you function normally?  If so, then what's the big deal - it's just a simple allergy and all we needed was over the counter anti-histamines.  I have regular allergies and the effect Allegra or Claritin have on them is no way similar to how it effects POIS.  Nonetheless, the fact that anti-histamines do help supports the theory that this is an auto-immune response. 

As for Anaphylaxis, I understand that it's typically a life-threatening disorder, but many of the same symptoms appear with POIS, without the "shock" symptoms.  I can quote something from the web as well:


Symptoms
Symptoms develop rapidly, often within seconds or minutes. They may include the following:

Abdominal pain or cramping
Abnormal (high-pitched) breathing sounds
Anxiety
Confusion
Cough
Diarrhea
Difficulty breathing
Difficulty swallowing
Fainting, light-headedness, dizziness
Hives, itchiness
Nasal congestion
Nausea, vomiting
Palpitations
Skin redness
Slurred speech
Wheezing
source: http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000844.htm [nofollow]

Looks familiar?  Sure, we don't need immediate hospitalization, but it's clear this is a severe auto-immune disorder.  I've looked more carefully at Waldinger's paper, and although there is no control, his methods are sound.  And we can not deny that the hyposensitization treatment has worked.  There are many technical explanations for his theory in the papers that are beyond any of our training.  So, I will be following the peer-reviewed academic literature and stop trying every freaking pill in the local pharmacy.  Something to keep dopamine levels up and an allergy treatment is the only way to go now.  I'm wondering how many of us have seen allergy doctors? 
 

Offline kurtosis

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« Reply #14910 on: 12/11/2011 13:17:23 »
Never posted here before but, to cut a long story short, I believe I'm suffering from some variant of this condition. An orgasm feels nice while it's happening but the low that comes soon afterwards is violent and fast. Pressure at the back of my eyes, dizziness, disorientation and the feeling that all my thoughts have been shut off. As if my neurotransmitters (or some of them) are depleted in a few minutes and these effects last at least 2 days. I don't feel any guilt about sexual thoughts at all but I'm certainly frustrated. I've spent far too much money over the past few years trying to resolve this but the doctors where I live in Europe know jack sh1t about the problems. I'm also finding it very difficult to discuss honestly with my partner. I've found that foods like spirulina and chlorella improve things but the major problem that I can't seem to get over is that, after several years with this, I cannot seem to learn effectively. Orgasms seem to both wipe my memories and reduce my ability to concentrate. As a child I tested with a genius level IQ (still thereabouts in my early 20s) but I often struggle for simple words now. For a scientist this is a  severe problem. The classic psychiatrist response (I've heard it 2ce) to this is "general anxiety disorder" but I'm not a very anxious person, except about a condition that's ruining my life. If anything, I'm stoic and accepting. I believe that this condition may have a root in a pituitary gland disorder but that's merely based on a range of symptoms including sleeping issues, visual disturbances and acne. It feels that with algae and fish oils I'm lessening the symptoms but I'm nowhere near back on track and I wonder whether I'll ever be. I've read quite a few posts here and I feel empathy for every one of you. There have been times over the past few years that I'd rather have been diagnosed with a terminal disease than cope with the innuendo that this is a psychosomatic condition. That may sound ridiculous but life is cruel and as my mental powers wane I've been treated very harshly by those who were intensely jealous of my abilities. Here's hoping and praying a cure is found...
 

Offline Wibin

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« Reply #14911 on: 12/11/2011 14:22:46 »
Not quite sure if anyone will find this helpful or not. If they do, I'd say it's a big leap forward for some if not many.  :o

First of all, I'm "cured" now thanks to my doctor (and the pills he prescribed  ;D).

In short, I've found that my cognitive functions are between 60%-100% of what could be considered normal approximately five days after an O. After two weeks we're closer to being in the range of 85-100 %. The day after an O, well.. most of you probably know. Might as well erase all in my calendar for the next half-week.

I've noticed that Sam-e gives me a slight relief, but not something that could be attributed a cure. Tyrosine gives me a temporary boost, which helps, sometimes a lot, most of the time just slightly.

The doctor wasn't too keen on the idea of POIS.. considered it more a symptom than anything else. Not the actual problem. He, however, was quick to prescribe me bupropion (known as wellbutrin too). That definitely made me feel better by a large margin  :), but I had my "crash" days too.  :-\ Now, after me giving up on wellbutrin, my doctor and I went along with further treatments for ADD, or attention deficit disorder.

So, immediately after popping the pill for strattera, I've gradually started to feel what is "normal", or dare I say almost perfect!  :o  ;D

I have a lot of strength, I move about much more freely, exercising is a breeze and I feel energetic.  :) After an O, I still feel a bit woozy for a day (the same day, maybe the next one too), and I have some trouble concentrating, but this is closer to being at "day 5"! So no more lethargy and tiredness and that awful feeling in your head, especially when you try to work your brain.  ::)

So, I have been diagnosed with (some degree of) ADD, which appears to be the correct diagnosis thinking even way back from childhood. However, if I haven't had an orgasm for two weeks or more, I would hardly be classified as a true ADD.

So ADD or POIS? I don't think they can be excluded in any way. Have POIS? Then what you get is ADD after an orgasm. Have ADD? Well the problem is likely to be aggravated by having an orgasm as it depletes the very chemicals that an ADD person is deficient in.

Strattera are not the same as stimulants! So it can't be really compared with adderal or ritalin. Instead, strattera are overpriced pills that have really gut wrenching (literally) side effects, and may not work for everyone with ADD. My experience is that the initial single dose of 40mg is too much, or at least too much at a time. Too tired & too wired. But splitting a 80mg dose (to save money), so you have 10mg in the morning, 10 in the afternoon and 10mg in the evening is splendit to say the least.
[O8)]

This is just my thoughts on the issue! I may have ADD, I may have POIS, but I probably have both. 8)

Hope this is of some help, especially for those going the ADD/ADHD way.  ;D

Cheers!
Wibin  :D
 

Offline Pharaoh

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« Reply #14912 on: 12/11/2011 18:17:42 »
The problem with the ADD theory is that POIS symptoms are only triggered following ejaculation and persist for a definite period of time.  The ADD meds work because they initiate dopamine release, thereby counteracting the cognitive symptoms.  This does not address the underlying pathology. 

Kurtosis,

I know exactly what you're going through.  I was taking university courses in mathematics in the summer as a 6th grader.  I could sleep through classes and still manage an A.  Then in high school things started to change.   In university, it was disastrous.  Now that I'm a doctoral student, it's extremely difficult, but I still manage.  The exams are toughest.  To concentrate for that length of time and retain the information I've read is near impossible.  I find that people believe I'm incompetent because I'm unable to communicate, but then are baffled when my work is superior.  No doubt this illness has had an immeasurably debilitating effect on my life.  It's a curse. 
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #14913 on: 12/11/2011 23:23:07 »
over-the-counter meds will be as unhelpful for us as it is for people with severe allergies to specific foods or bee stings. 

i don't wanna be rude or anything but i just wanna point out that normal over the counter Claritin has been very effective in treating mine and some others' POIS symptoms. I plan on trying benadryl next.

Benadryl is great for me to force sleep/naps. The more I sleep, the more I shake off POIS .
 

Offline demografx

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« Reply #14914 on: 13/11/2011 00:01:50 »




kurtosis, wilbin, Suppertime, and bastianb, welcome to the POIS thread of The Naked Science Forum!




Here are some POIS resources which may be helpful to you:

Our new POIS Forum - architectural genius: "daveman" - for detailed subject-by-subject discussion!
http://www.POISCenter.com/forums/index.php
Our 4-year-old POIS thread here at Naked Science Forum will also always remain open for newcomers, for general unstructured discussion, and historical research of the 10,000+ postings here since 2007.

The Learning Channel's (TLC)  feature TV presentation on POIS, featuring our member here at this forum, "Animus". It was aired on May 22, 2011. Here is a link to the YouTube file for the POIS  TV documentary, "Desperate Measures":

Our POIS Information Website, built by "mat780", is here:
http://sites.google.com/site/POISwebsite/

The POIS Information Website is home to the famous POIS Forum Compendium, written by "Pyropeach", and contains theories already discussed here and treatments that have both worked and failed.

Please see "B_Jim"'s POIS Summary of All Cases, here as well as others on the Web. This includes remedies that we have tested, and results.
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149009#msg149009

"Girlwind" has created an excellent POIS Video:

Our new POIS chatroom (realtime chat). Invite or visit another member(s) there, ANY TIME. We can all get to know each other better:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/POIS/chat

Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome "POIS": Case report

Authors:
Abdalla M Attia*, Magda H Al-Ziny, Hossam A Yasien
*Corresponding author: Andrology Unit, Minoufiya University, Shibin El Kom, Eygpt

For more info, check out emi_b's  SMF POIS thread:
http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=191.0;topicseen


Available Upon Request:

1. and 2. POIS Research Studies, 2011

These 2 papers reveal Dr. Waldinger's POIS autoimmune hypothesis and suggest one possible avenue of treatment.

3. First POIS Research Study, 2002

We have a copy of the first formal medical investigation on POIS by Prof. dr. Marcel D. Waldinger,MD,PhD, and Dr. Dave Schweitzer, MD.

  
4. Recent POIS Research Study, 2010

CASE REPORT
Postorgasm Illness Syndrome - A Spectrum of Illnesses
Jane Ashby, MRCP, and David Goldmeier, MRCP
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg316781#msg316781


5. British Medical Journal Case Report, 2010

Case study by Dr. Selwyn Dexter of a patient with a headache-featured POIS symptom treated with progesterone/norethisterone.
http://casereports.bmj.com/content/2010/bcr.10.2009.2359.short?rss=1


How to get any or all of the above 5 studies: send me or "daveman" a Private Message (PM) with your regular email address (use "AT" instead of "@" ) and we'll send you back the PDF(s).

To send a Private Message, click on "Messages" at the top of this page. At the Messages page, click on "New Message". From that point on, it works just like posting a message here, except that it only goes to the person(s) you designate.

Remember to put a quote around the recipient's name, i.e., "demografx", or "daveman".


New York Times article,

January 20, 2009
Mind
Sex and Depression: In the Brain, if Not the Mind
By RICHARD A. FRIEDMAN, M.D.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/20/health/views/20mind.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=friedman%20sexual%20January%2020&st=cse

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

In addition to serving our own informational interests, the resources listed above can be useful for you to show our credibility to the medical world - which often shows little understanding and is sometimes skeptical of our condition: POIS has scientific underpinnings and POIS is not "just another psychological problem" related to sex - to be treated by the psychiatric/psychotherapeutic community. All of this information can greatly help you to fight the immediate reaction of some doctors: so just tell them, "IT'S NOT 'ALL IN OUR HEADS'! "

It can be very  helpful to you when dealing with medical professionals to point out the POIS' official listing, as recognized by the
National Institutes for Health (NIH), Office of Rare Diseases Research
:
http://rarediseases.info.nih.gov/RareDiseaseList.aspx?StartsWith=P, then scroll down until you reach Postorgasmic illness syndrome. 

POIS also appears in credible medical sources such as the Journal of Sexual Medicine (Dr. Waldinger's study), British Medical Journal and wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postorgasmic_illness_syndrome

For over 4 years, our POIS forum has attracted over 200 POIS sufferers worldwide who have posted here, research on an additional 200 sufferers elsewhere on the internet, plus nearly 1,500,000 page visits. Not bad for a rare malady!



SEARCH THE FORUM WITH GOOGLE

We have an overwhelming amount of data: more than 4 years' worth of posts (over  10,000 posts!) from 200+ Forum members, and an additional 200 POIS sufferers found elsewhere on the Internet by Member B_Jim.

In the Google search box, type
whatever-it-is-you're-interested-in-finding-out[space]POIS[space]site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

for example, I tried
nocturnal emission POIS site:http://thenakedscientists.com/

and 740 results came up for "nocturnal emission" within the Forum.

be careful with spaces (you can use them before the word "site") and no-spaces (everything after the word "site")

Google even provides you results with the Message# for each result. But Message #'s do change, so be patient and look for the approximate Message#.








 

Offline Vincent M

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« Reply #14915 on: 13/11/2011 00:44:14 »
over-the-counter meds will be as unhelpful for us as it is for people with severe allergies to specific foods or bee stings. 

i don't wanna be rude or anything but i just wanna point out that normal over the counter Claritin has been very effective in treating mine and some others' POIS symptoms. I plan on trying benadryl next.

How has it been effective?  Has it eliminated the brain fog and fatigue?  Do you function normally?  If so, then what's the big deal - it's just a simple allergy and all we needed was over the counter anti-histamines.  I have regular allergies and the effect Allegra or Claritin have on them is no way similar to how it effects POIS.  Nonetheless, the fact that anti-histamines do help supports the theory that this is an auto-immune response. 

Claritin eliminates about 90% of my physical pains such as joint & muscle pain and skin inflammation from POIS. It eliminates 50% or more of my brain fog and fatigue. I do believe my case is an auto-immune response because of this, but others' POIS symptoms may be caused by something other than an immune reaction or there may be something else going wrong that causes the immune reaction in the first place. However Claritin was a large step for me in improving my POIS as I am now able to work part time at a fairly demanding convenience store job working a register, refilling coffee, making ice cream items, plus stocking and cleaning basically all at once. Very stressful especially with the gas pumps involved and as it's my first job. Prior to the Claritin, fenugreek, and saw palmetto, I was almost completely bed-ridden just waiting for a miracle.
 

Offline Vincent M

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« Reply #14916 on: 13/11/2011 01:37:22 »
Benadryl is great for me to force sleep/naps. The more I sleep, the more I shake off POIS .

I also find that sleep is one of the best remedies for POIS thus I always have my "o"s before going to bed or as I'm falling asleep. Sometimes I have trouble falling asleep so benadryl could possibly help me get to sleep faster as well or perhaps possibly give me better quality sleep even though I believe it's not known for that.
 

Offline Wibin

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« Reply #14917 on: 13/11/2011 10:43:18 »
The problem with the ADD theory is that POIS symptoms are only triggered following ejaculation and persist for a definite period of time.  The ADD meds work because they initiate dopamine release, thereby counteracting the cognitive symptoms.  This does not address the underlying pathology.

This, I feel, is untrue. I can have an orgasm without an ejaculation.. it leaves me wasted for sure. I can also have a ejaculation without an orgasm. This will give me little to no brain fog or all the related symptoms and works great when you need to just "relieve" yourself.

Strattera has very little or anything to do with dopamine. Maybe only through secondary methods, but even then people have surmised that strattera may even decrease dopamine levels as people report side effects such as apathy (often related to low levels of dopamine) - a completely opposite effect than ADD/ADHD stimulants that you are speaking of. It involves norepinephrine solely (at least that's the claim).

Also, you make it sound like POIS-sufferers have some underlying problem that is fundamentally different from that of a "normal" person? I cannot see how, as most people feel tired after orgasm and much of historic asian and modern western methods of making love involve avoiding orgasm and heightened arousal. You can find hundreds of books on amazon on that topic - each of them emphasising the avoidance too heightened stimulus. I believe what differs between a normal person and a POIS-sufferer is the degree of effects, which last days instead of hours, nothing more. Also, I doubt there will be any *real* cure - no one will cut POIS out. So I don't understand why add medication would not be the answer if it indeed addresses the problems, for all intents and purposes, fully. The best one can hope is to manage it with medication when it surfaces, much like ADD, depression etc.

As to the antihistamines.. I do feel they made a difference in my worst days. At least my nose didn't feel as runny and I didn't feel like I was about to catch a cold quite as much. But now the effects are tiny in comparison so I have no need for them. I researched on the matter close to a year ago, and found some ideas as to how histamines affect your system in this case - and not all relate to allergens. I could hypothesise for hours, but that's all it would ever be. For others here, it seems that antihistamines play a major role - I'm definitely not trying to downplay their potential as a cure for some. But only for some! And doubtfully for the countless female POIS-sufferers with no contact with semen. If antihistamines don't work, I doubt stronger immunosuppressants would work either - and can be incredibly unhealthy. Granted, my views are somewhat polarised as my father is specialised in brain study (as opposed to immunology) and a source of endless theories and support. I, myself, picked inv&finance - a big mistake by many accounts, :D and thus of little help in POIS-dissection.

But additional pointers, those who feel gravings for food (like I read from above posts) and sugary stuff after orgasm in particular should definitely look into these neurotransmitter deficiencies. the connection between the two is well known.

I simply strongly urge for you not to dismiss what I've been writing here. I don't feel that I'm getting anything out of this forum anymore, so I'm doing this solely for the selfish reason of wanting to help others.

Cheers!
« Last Edit: 13/11/2011 10:53:08 by Wibin »
 

Offline daveman

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« Reply #14918 on: 13/11/2011 13:35:39 »
So I feel like a big idiot today, Every night before i go to bed i have anxiety of a nocturnal emission happens and gives me POIS.

So i went to sleep eventually and woke up pretty early, I used the bathroom and was worried on wheter to fall back asleep or not, So i figured only for a little while, I went to sleep, And I woke up to find out i had a nocturnal emission in that short period of time.

I really cant figure out how this is possibly happening, so All i can do is take my multivitamins and niacin pills and eat yogurt all day trying to revitalize myself.

Nocturnal Emmisions are most normal in the last hour or maybe two of sleep. Waking up before and going back to sleep again can probably even be worse as far as preventing them. I'd say that if you wake early without N/E, then it would almost be better to stay up, and maybe try to find a way to take a nap in the afternoon. That is normally impractical for a daily regime.

The other would probably be to make a concerted effort to prepare to meet the dreams and control them. This IS possible, but takes maybe a year or two of practice in some cases. There are many techniques, look up "Lucid Dreaming" on the Internet. There are even electronic apparatus to assist.

You might also wake up at 4 AM and take a niacin. Maybe the best solution of all. If you HAVE an NE, you will be protected. And since the NE will "satisfy your system" for a while, you probably wouldn't have to take the niacin every night.

You could probably go 3 or 4 nights after any "O" without taking the niacin.

It's better not to take the niacin regularly for best effects.

 

Offline kurtosis

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« Reply #14919 on: 13/11/2011 14:03:59 »
Pharaoh raised an interesting point. In a way, high achievement and extreme focus required for demanding analytical tasks are as anomalous as POIS symptoms and both may be related to the dopamine cycle. Perhaps our return to homeostasis following orgasm is just as long as anyone else's BUT the amounts of chemicals released during orgasm are disproportionate. I'm thinking of the "orgasm cycle" described here http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/cupids-poisoned-arrow/200908/orgasm-s-hidden-cycle and wondering whether we're not that different to anybody else but the peaks/troughs are great enough to lead to problematic cognitive deficits. Also, has anyone else tried piracetam? It lifts the brain fog (after a day or so) without any side effects even if I'm uncertain as to why (although the action of piracetam is uncertain in any event). Anyway, just throwing thoughts out there. Discussed this with my partner and that's a huge load of my mind!

Re. strattera and it not affecting dopamine levels. It's important to think of the whole system of chemicals here as our brains try to normalise based on whatever chemicals are present. Atomoxetine is a norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor so it's almost certain to have an effect on other catecholamines. They're all synthesised from tyrosine and so preventing reuptake of one can lead to an increase in another. As far as I understand it. Haven't studied much chemistry since my undergrad days :)
 

Offline jacksonsean

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« Reply #14920 on: 13/11/2011 14:07:43 »
Please take a second to complete this poll over at the POIS Centre website.

newbielink:http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=249.msg3158#new [nonactive]


Thanks
 

Offline Defsync

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« Reply #14921 on: 13/11/2011 14:22:11 »
paleolithic diet. ive been eating raw ground sirloin, and i have to say it gives me an energy boost and i heal faster. dunno if it would help POIS symptoms.
 

 

Offline daveman

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« Reply #14922 on: 13/11/2011 14:27:08 »
over-the-counter meds will be as unhelpful for us as it is for people with severe allergies to specific foods or bee stings. 

i don't wanna be rude or anything but i just wanna point out that normal over the counter Claritin has been very effective in treating mine and some others' POIS symptoms. I plan on trying benadryl next.

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Symptoms
Symptoms develop rapidly, often within seconds or minutes. They may include the following:

Abdominal pain or cramping
Abnormal (high-pitched) breathing sounds
Anxiety
Confusion
Cough
Diarrhea
Difficulty breathing
Difficulty swallowing
Fainting, light-headedness, dizziness
Hives, itchiness
Nasal congestion
Nausea, vomiting
Palpitations
Skin redness
Slurred speech
Wheezing
source: http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000844.htm

Looks familiar? 

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I don't have enough fingers to count all the diseases and syndromes that have some combination of these symtoms. I have tended to be a supporter of the auto-immune theory, as it best suits my case, but since the success that's been seen with niacin, it's become more open for me.

The fact the niacin works doesn't really rule out auto-immune, but it opens a deeper potential for other abnormalities in sythesis or assimilation of base neurotransmitter or hormones that effect the brain. Among these elements histamines are involved, and in a way that anti-histamines don't have the normal desired effects.

It is a very complex system and situation, and we have seen more grief on these forums because we try to tie whatever other sickness to ours on the basis of pure symptoms. We don't have CFS or sexual exhaustion or adrenal fatigue or candida or diabetes or hypo-glycemia or ADD or Anaphylaxis WE HAVE POIS.

We may have any one of those potentially exagerated by POIS, or in some cases some have had one of those other things and thought they had POIS, but this forum is for POIS.

The ONLY solution for POIS is through professional research. We can speculate and conjecture and converse and wonder and test until we're blue in the face. But we wont't find the cure without research.

We need something that we can ALL say and agree without doubt, "Yes, That is the cause of POIS".

Nobody here can technically say what POIS is.

If we talk about symptom relief, we have to keep in mind, and those reading must keep in mind that each one reacts differently both to POIS and to the remedies. What works for some may be dangerous for others.

« Last Edit: 13/11/2011 23:02:10 by daveman »
 

Offline daveman

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« Reply #14923 on: 13/11/2011 14:48:33 »
Not quite sure if anyone will find this helpful or not. If they do, I'd say it's a big leap forward for some if not many.  :o

First of all, I'm "cured" now thanks to my doctor (and the pills he prescribed  ;D).

In short, I've found that my cognitive functions are between 60%-100% of what could be considered normal approximately five days after an O. After two weeks we're closer to being in the range of 85-100 %. The day after an O, well.. most of you probably know. Might as well erase all in my calendar for the next half-week.

I've noticed that Sam-e gives me a slight relief, but not something that could be attributed a cure. Tyrosine gives me a temporary boost, which helps, sometimes a lot, most of the time just slightly.

The doctor wasn't too keen on the idea of POIS.. considered it more a symptom than anything else. Not the actual problem. He, however, was quick to prescribe me bupropion (known as wellbutrin too). That definitely made me feel better by a large margin  :), but I had my "crash" days too.  :-\ Now, after me giving up on wellbutrin, my doctor and I went along with further treatments for ADD, or attention deficit disorder.

So, immediately after popping the pill for strattera, I've gradually started to feel what is "normal", or dare I say almost perfect!  :o  ;D

I have a lot of strength, I move about much more freely, exercising is a breeze and I feel energetic.  :) After an O, I still feel a bit woozy for a day (the same day, maybe the next one too), and I have some trouble concentrating, but this is closer to being at "day 5"! So no more lethargy and tiredness and that awful feeling in your head, especially when you try to work your brain.  ::)

So, I have been diagnosed with (some degree of) ADD, which appears to be the correct diagnosis thinking even way back from childhood. However, if I haven't had an orgasm for two weeks or more, I would hardly be classified as a true ADD.

So ADD or POIS? I don't think they can be excluded in any way. Have POIS? Then what you get is ADD after an orgasm. Have ADD? Well the problem is likely to be aggravated by having an orgasm as it depletes the very chemicals that an ADD person is deficient in.

Strattera are not the same as stimulants! So it can't be really compared with adderal or ritalin. Instead, strattera are overpriced pills that have really gut wrenching (literally) side effects, and may not work for everyone with ADD. My experience is that the initial single dose of 40mg is too much, or at least too much at a time. Too tired & too wired. But splitting a 80mg dose (to save money), so you have 10mg in the morning, 10 in the afternoon and 10mg in the evening is splendit to say the least.
[O8)]

This is just my thoughts on the issue! I may have ADD, I may have POIS, but I probably have both. 8)

Hope this is of some help, especially for those going the ADD/ADHD way.  ;D

Cheers!
Wibin  :D

Hi Wilbin,

I have the same benefit from Niacin. I would like to say I'm next to cured. My last POIS session was less than 20% of what it normally is and lasted less than a day! But even if it eliminated my POIS, I really couldn't say I was cured. Like I'm not cured of high blood pressure by taking my BP meds.

Some diseases like high BP or diabetes can only be eleviated by drugs, as though they were cured, but cure is a big word.

I venture to say that POIS IS curable, BUT it may not be.

I agree that many of us have temorary ADD as a reuslt of POIS imbalance. Nicain points directly to a possible source for this imbalance. If there's an imbalance in the system that produces histamines for instance, we consume base elements involved in production of dopamine and other components whose lack would produce ADD.

It's been seen that POIS can cause other maladies like Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, or Sexual Exhaustion. Sometimes we try to fix the CFS or S/E by typical treatments for those, but being that in our case they are POIS aggravated or even generated, we won't ever resolve these probelms unless we resolve POIS first.

Perhaps if the ADD goes away after 7 days of abstenance, it's as a result of POIS imbalances. If it never goes away, it may well be a parallel condition independant of others. The treatment approach would be different.

 

Offline daveman

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« Reply #14924 on: 13/11/2011 15:07:05 »
The problem with the ADD theory is that POIS symptoms are only triggered following ejaculation and persist for a definite period of time.  The ADD meds work because they initiate dopamine release, thereby counteracting the cognitive symptoms.  This does not address the underlying pathology.
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Also, you make it sound like POIS-sufferers have some underlying problem that is fundamentally different from that of a "normal" person? I cannot see how, as most people feel tired after orgasm and much of historic asian and modern western methods of making love involve avoiding orgasm and heightened arousal. You can find hundreds of books on amazon on that topic - each of them emphasising the avoidance too heightened stimulus. I believe what differs between a normal person and a POIS-sufferer is the degree of effects, which last days instead of hours, nothing more. Also, I doubt there will be any *real* cure - no one will cut POIS out. So I don't understand why add medication would not be the answer if it indeed addresses the problems, for all intents and purposes, fully. The best one can hope is to manage it with medication when it surfaces, much like ADD, depression etc.
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I'm not sure what your case is as far as POIS, if you've had it from puberty or not, but it seems that you don't at all know what it feels like to have normal sex!!

I began with POIS later in my life, and can tell you that there is a tremendous difference between normal sex and POIS sex.

Feeling tired after orgasm neither reflects the normal case nor the POIS case. "Feeling tired?"

After sex in a normal healthy male, they may tend to go to sleep, but more from a sort of blissfullness than tiredness. And "tired" falls fall short of what POIS does to me. So I am not sure at all where  you are coming from. I'm sorry, but it just doesn't fit.

I've practiced, and still practice meditiation, and know that what is normally said about conservtion of enery relates much more to a spiritual energy, which is very much more subtle, and whereas it can be profound, not in any way that relates to POIS as I know it.

This is all MY opinion of course, but from other conversations that we've had here, I'm fairly sure that there would be many who agree.

I must reiterate, that POIS induced ADD can only be resolved by resolving POIS, which IS VERY REAL.

ADD or deression in and of itself however should be looked at and treated by professionals in the respective areas. There is no reason why someone may not have both conditions as prime and individual conditions. In those case both need to be treated.

To untangle this mess, real research is desperatedly needed. Donate NOW.

« Last Edit: 13/11/2011 15:09:59 by daveman »
 

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