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Author Topic: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)  (Read 6439556 times)

Offline lauracostis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15850 on: 23/03/2012 23:29:34 »
Laropiprant is a selective antagonist of the prostaglandin D(2) receptor subtype 1 (DP1), which may mediate niacin-induced vasodilation.

Thanks a lot lauracostis,

So now we have 2 candidates that inhibit PGD2 release: Diclofenac* and Laropiprant. We may have a third one: Quercetin: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18831918 and i've found 2 more: Luteolin and Aspirin (the last one is not so effective): http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18223672

Of the 5 candidates, 3 are drugs an 2 are supps. I suppose the effective dose in the supps is much different than the effective dose in the drugs. In the study, they talk about 1000mg (1 kg)of quercetin or luteolin per human. That is a lot, and would be very expensive.

I've also found this thread where they talk about it: http://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/viewtopic.php?f=32&p=672064

They say that Niacin and Laropiprant target PGD2 "DP1" receptor (both in an inverse way), and that a new drug called "Setipripant" is in trials, and it will block PGD2 "DP2" receptor (that is the hair loss one).
But we are here because of Pois, not hair loss, so the "DP1" receptor (the Niacin one) may work well for us.

On the other hand, if we want something to enhance or mimmick  (and not inhibit) Niacin, we should look for something that releases PGD2, and 5-HT (Serotonin). In the above Pubmed links it clearly states that Niacin increases 5-HT levels. Maybe a good candidate would be "triptans"? I think recently someone said his doctor recommended triptans to him in relation to Pois.

Please,  if someone tries any drug or supplement always read the information leaflet before.
P.S.: And sorry if the Post is a bit too technical talk!!  ;D
* Mellivora already tried Diclofenac and it didn't work for him. Interestingly, Diclofenac was proposed by Dr.Goldmeier.
I would try a PGD2 agonist first not a PGD2 antagonist, I would think about maybe focusing on the vasodialatory effect of PGD2 and not try to counter it.  Anyways, NSAIDs are COX inhibitors, which are designed to block prostoglandins, so I am asuming that everyone on this sight has tried an over the counter (OTC) NSAID, which did not cure them.
 

Offline lauracostis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15851 on: 23/03/2012 23:32:26 »
If anyone is interested, any compounding pharmacy will make custom niacin injections for you.  I am having some made right now for me.
 

Offline GoingCrazy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15852 on: 24/03/2012 01:58:43 »
I think if we try to suppress the 3 major inflammation hormones... prostaglandins, cytokines, and histamines, we'd be in good shape.  If only there was one thing to take for all 3?

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Inflammation.aspx

"15) Testosterone. Perhaps surprisingly to some, that all-important male hormone reduces inflammation, specifically TNF-alpha and IF-1B, and is yet another reason to make sure you optimize your androgen levels. [27]"

http://www.healthhabits.ca/2008/11/17/vitamin-c-puts-out-the-fire-of-inflammation/

"The U of C-B study, which will be published in the journal Free Radical Biology and Medicine,  shows that for healthy, non-smoking adults with an elevated level of CRP, a daily dose of vitamin C lowered levels of the inflammation
biomarker after two months compared with those who took a placebo."


« Last Edit: 24/03/2012 02:05:45 by GoingCrazy »
 

Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15853 on: 24/03/2012 05:01:43 »

I know this text is a paste-copy from original Dr. Lin's text.






Now we must find Ctrl+X!!

« Last Edit: 24/03/2012 07:19:25 by demografx »
 

Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15854 on: 24/03/2012 06:24:43 »
Hi Guys,

I had to try new XN tablets two days before of different producer, because my favorite tablets are not shipped anymore to my drug store. I have taken in 300mg and no flush, but despite of this I had sex, I thought they will work, but they didn't and POIS started slowly this day. And I had terrible POIS yesterday. I have suffered the whole day and in the evening it was clear to me that POIS will continue today in its worst form... However in the evening yesterday I decided to try POIS-removal method by taking more tablets to have the flush and to have a sex after that. And guess what - it worked! I have clear mind today despite my expectations to have a worst 2nd day of POIS!!

Victor


Congratulations, Victor!!

« Last Edit: 24/03/2012 06:50:10 by demografx »
 

Offline acronym

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15855 on: 24/03/2012 11:55:33 »
Laropiprant is a selective antagonist of the prostaglandin D(2) receptor subtype 1 (DP1), which may mediate niacin-induced vasodilation.

Thanks a lot lauracostis,

So now we have 2 candidates that inhibit PGD2 release: Diclofenac* and Laropiprant. We may have a third one: Quercetin: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18831918 and i've found 2 more: Luteolin and Aspirin (the last one is not so effective): http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18223672

Of the 5 candidates, 3 are drugs an 2 are supps. I suppose the effective dose in the supps is much different than the effective dose in the drugs. In the study, they talk about 1000mg (1 kg)of quercetin or luteolin per human. That is a lot, and would be very expensive.

I've also found this thread where they talk about it: http://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/viewtopic.php?f=32&p=672064

They say that Niacin and Laropiprant target PGD2 "DP1" receptor (both in an inverse way), and that a new drug called "Setipripant" is in trials, and it will block PGD2 "DP2" receptor (that is the hair loss one).
But we are here because of Pois, not hair loss, so the "DP1" receptor (the Niacin one) may work well for us.

On the other hand, if we want something to enhance or mimmick  (and not inhibit) Niacin, we should look for something that releases PGD2, and 5-HT (Serotonin). In the above Pubmed links it clearly states that Niacin increases 5-HT levels. Maybe a good candidate would be "triptans"? I think recently someone said his doctor recommended triptans to him in relation to Pois.

Please,  if someone tries any drug or supplement always read the information leaflet before.
P.S.: And sorry if the Post is a bit too technical talk!!  ;D
* Mellivora already tried Diclofenac and it didn't work for him. Interestingly, Diclofenac was proposed by Dr.Goldmeier.
I would try a PGD2 agonist first not a PGD2 antagonist, I would think about maybe focusing on the vasodialatory effect of PGD2 and not try to counter it.  Anyways, NSAIDs are COX inhibitors, which are designed to block prostoglandins, so I am asuming that everyone on this sight has tried an over the counter (OTC) NSAID, which did not cure them.
Hi Quasar. Like you I also notice greater hair loss after an O, actually I get dandruff on many occasions (not always, but its really annoying, it bugs me as to what the hell is going on). Very interesting post on PGD2. You want to know what else lowers PGD2, capsicum/cayenne peppers. After reading about a CFS doctor and some guy who claimed he significantly reduced his CFS with daily very hot pepper drinks. I've taken them on and off over the years and it was no miracle cure for me but it helped with brain fog to get me going in the mornings. I wrote about it here before. I think it operates a bit like niacin as regards vasodilatation. I do need a break from it as it can be harsh on my stomach. I'm talking HHhhot peppers. (I take Blairs Mega Death sauce). 
« Last Edit: 24/03/2012 11:58:40 by acronym »
 

Offline observercenter

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15856 on: 24/03/2012 14:30:56 »
Hi Guys,

I had to try new XN tablets two days before of different producer, because my favorite tablets are not shipped anymore to my drug store. I have taken in 300mg and no flush, but despite of this I had sex, I thought they will work, but they didn't and POIS started slowly this day. And I had terrible POIS yesterday. I have suffered the whole day and in the evening it was clear to me that POIS will continue today in its worst form... However in the evening yesterday I decided to try POIS-removal method by taking more tablets to have the flush and to have a sex after that. And guess what - it worked! I have clear mind today despite my expectations to have a worst 2nd day of POIS!!

Victor


Wonderful news Victor! The same has happened to me when i tried this method(after NE.). We should look into this.
 

Offline John21

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15857 on: 24/03/2012 14:54:48 »

I just learned that human growth hormone (HGH) can be increased substancially by intense cardio, such as sprinting:
http://www.readysetgofitness.com/newsletter/10_New%20Research%20shows%20how%20to%20increace%20HGH%20530%25.htm


I am still mystified that I have experienced no symptoms this time around. Racking my brain, here are some possible reasons:

1. Dietary change (previously stated)
2. Recent Relora use (did it change something?)
3. Recent exercise change: High adrenaline/ intense cardio workout once a week (singletrack mountain biking)
4. Sleep change (I am doubtful that this could bring total relief)
5. Unknown factor



Maybe you are  just in a good cycle. You're probably now less stressed, less tired, more relaxed,energized... And so you have suffisant "energy" (hormones/neurotransmitters...) to avoid symptoms after orgasm.

Thinking back to this post in 2009... I am wondering if the intense exercise might have manufactured HGH, which somehow prevented POIS.  Maybe it is worthy of an experiment: the next time you and yours are getting romantic tell her you have to go for a quick run first.  ;)
« Last Edit: 24/03/2012 14:57:14 by John21 »
 

Offline kurtosis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15858 on: 24/03/2012 16:07:25 »

I just learned that human growth hormone (HGH) can be increased substancially by intense cardio, such as sprinting:
http://www.readysetgofitness.com/newsletter/10_New%20Research%20shows%20how%20to%20increace%20HGH%20530%25.htm


I am still mystified that I have experienced no symptoms this time around. Racking my brain, here are some possible reasons:

1. Dietary change (previously stated)
2. Recent Relora use (did it change something?)
3. Recent exercise change: High adrenaline/ intense cardio workout once a week (singletrack mountain biking)
4. Sleep change (I am doubtful that this could bring total relief)
5. Unknown factor



Maybe you are  just in a good cycle. You're probably now less stressed, less tired, more relaxed,energized... And so you have suffisant "energy" (hormones/neurotransmitters...) to avoid symptoms after orgasm.

Thinking back to this post in 2009... I am wondering if the intense exercise might have manufactured HGH, which somehow prevented POIS.  Maybe it is worthy of an experiment: the next time you and yours are getting romantic tell her you have to go for a quick run first.  ;)
Get enough amino acids and work on strength training and your body will manufacture HGH to support muscle growth. Perhaps having a protein shake and bench pressing your girlfriend before "romantic activity" is the way to go :)
 

Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15859 on: 24/03/2012 19:33:01 »
As an idea about how to get more donations, I think we should send email to all members of poiscenter.com forum with the information about activity to gather pois research funds. I know that everyone hates bulk emails, but the reason for this email is special and very important and thats why it is reasonable to do this.

What do you think?

With luck I'll get a newsletter out this weekend. The mechanism is set up and we have a list, although it doesn't include the latest members. There are some 300+ names, plus those most recently added for the surveys.


 

Offline victor.kons

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15860 on: 24/03/2012 19:37:45 »
As an idea about how to get more donations, I think we should send email to all members of poiscenter.com forum with the information about activity to gather pois research funds. I know that everyone hates bulk emails, but the reason for this email is special and very important and thats why it is reasonable to do this.

What do you think?

With luck I'll get a newsletter out this weekend. The mechanism is set up and we have a list, although it doesn't include the latest members. There are some 300+ names, plus those most recently added for the surveys.
Wonderful! Thank you for all your hard work, Dave!

Vic
 

Offline Vincent M

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15861 on: 24/03/2012 19:46:40 »
@observercenter where can I buy this niacin? I hope I dont' appear foolish by asking can I get it in CVS? Also what kind should I try to obtain? One other question that I would like to ask is what is everyone's sex vs. masturbation ratio? I think there could be some relation between that and POIS. On the symptom side of things is it common to be lightsensitive and experience eye folaters from POIS? What about stretch marks on the back?

I think CVS does sell niacin. Just make sure it doesn't say "no flush" on the bottle and make sure it's not some other type of niacin like niacinamide. If the bottle just says "Niacin" on it then you probably have the right kind. Also you'll want to start off with 100mg capsules, because most of our members seem to get the flush with 100 to 200mg of niacin. If you take too much the flush can be pretty unpleasant experience.

I've only had sex a few times in my life and I masturbate every day. My POIS was the same after sex. As far as I know there isn't any relation between sex and POIS especially since many of our members here are married. There were several who claimed to be cured of POIS after entering great relationships. But if lack of sex caused POIS then most virgins would get POIS, which isn't the case.

I don't experience eye floaters, but my eyes are extremely sensitive to sunlight or any kind of breeze or wind while in POIS. My skin feels more dry and less elastic and thinner while in POIS as well. Combined with muscle loss this caused some stretch marks.
« Last Edit: 24/03/2012 19:49:17 by Vincent Marcus »
 

Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15862 on: 24/03/2012 20:08:47 »
We are not looking into "every way we can", Mr. Cool. Our approach is medical and scientific. Which is why we chose to be part of Naked SCIENCE forum.

Welcome again.

This whole line is very interesting . We've been through the whole sexual exhaustion discussion here 1000 times. It's a typical problem we have with POIS. The symptoms resonate through so many disorders. And for that reason, we try to fix POIS by treating the symptoms. I don' t think we've seen any real success, other than light symptomatic relief of POIS following sexual exhaustion solutions.

The problem Mr. Cool, is that POIS creates a drain on our system as a result of some as yet undefined failure in our systems. This drain causes symptoms, similar to S/E, and may even cause certain neurotransmitter imbalances that are seen in S/E. So from the outside, it looks like S/E, but the cause is not the same and the solution is not the same.

As ObserverCenter notes, niacin has helped him (and several others here) extra-ordinarily well. This too points to some imbalance in a related system, but the one cure fits all hype of the sexual exhaustion page is not the answer. This comes from experience among us, who have been at this for more than 5 yrs now.

So you need to know whether you have POIS or S/E. THEN you can treat it according to the remedies that correspond.

May the force be with you.

 

Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15863 on: 24/03/2012 20:22:43 »
Hi Guys,

I had to try new XN tablets two days before of different producer, because my favorite tablets are not shipped anymore to my drug store. I have taken in 300mg and no flush, but despite of this I had sex, I thought they will work, but they didn't and POIS started slowly this day. And I had terrible POIS yesterday. I have suffered the whole day and in the evening it was clear to me that POIS will continue today in its worst form... However in the evening yesterday I decided to try POIS-removal method by taking more tablets to have the flush and to have a sex after that. And guess what - it worked! I have clear mind today despite my expectations to have a worst 2nd day of POIS!!

Victor


That's great, a further confirmation of this method. I don't dare to try it, but if the occasion presents itself, and I somehow am in POIS, it's good to know that it works.

So you were in day 2 when you did teh recuperation treatment. I wouldn't want to chance a second "O" too close to the first. I think it would have to be at least day 2.

 
 

Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15864 on: 24/03/2012 20:47:12 »
As an idea about how to get more donations, I think we should send email to all members of poiscenter.com forum with the information about activity to gather pois research funds. I know that everyone hates bulk emails, but the reason for this email is special and very important and thats why it is reasonable to do this.

What do you think?

With luck I'll get a newsletter out this weekend. The mechanism is set up and we have a list, although it doesn't include the latest members. There are some 300+ names, plus those most recently added for the surveys.
Wonderful! Thank you for all your hard work, Dave!

Vic

Yes! Thank you, Dave!

 

Offline observercenter

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15865 on: 24/03/2012 21:44:54 »
@observercenter where can I buy this niacin? I hope I dont' appear foolish by asking can I get it in CVS? Also what kind should I try to obtain?

Thanks again and God bless.


I am using a Solgar (U.S. brand) of 100 mg each tablet. It says it can cause "redness" as a secondary effect -aka, the flush-. You could get it in most herb stores. If you wish further information i could send you a PM. Regards.
 

Offline nathan123

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15866 on: 25/03/2012 00:30:31 »
Hi i am new member to pois. I am suffering from mental fatigue,difficully in speaking,anxiety,hayfever etc there wil come after few hour of ejaculation and requires 4 to 5 days to recover from it. Doctor insists absolute eosinophil count test and it is 610. Whether is there any connection b/w pois and abnormal high aec. Further i am masturbated on an avg of weekly 5 times from the part 7 years. Whether it is excess and whether this is the cause for pois
 

Offline jferr

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15867 on: 25/03/2012 02:49:19 »
Guys, is there a similar medication to niacin? I have been taking it once a week before orgasm but recently I have not been able to obtain a flush. I had previously been able to successfully obtain flushes with about 150 to 200 mg for the few months i've been taking it. Recently I have not been able to get a flush even if I take over 300mg while fasting for 5 or 6 hours.
 

Offline monkeyboy

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15868 on: 25/03/2012 04:47:40 »
Ok so I had an interesting thought today I have heard that alergies to food like gluten, wheat, oats, dairy...siliacs disease things of this nature can make you very groggy and mind very unclear like pois does. I also know that eating or drinking certain things changes the color, content, and consistency of your seamen. Is farfetched to think that maybe there is something we are eating or drinking that we are having a autoimmune reaction to that we get a massive concentrated exposure to once it is released from testes in the seamen?
 

Offline kurtosis

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15869 on: 25/03/2012 11:18:47 »
Ok so I had an interesting thought today I have heard that alergies to food like gluten, wheat, oats, dairy...siliacs disease things of this nature can make you very groggy and mind very unclear like pois does. I also know that eating or drinking certain things changes the color, content, and consistency of your seamen. Is farfetched to think that maybe there is something we are eating or drinking that we are having a autoimmune reaction to that we get a massive concentrated exposure to once it is released from testes in the seamen?
Hi,
I have the flattened vili of coeliacs disease which was confirmed by a colonoscopy. I'm also allergic to lactose, have painful IBS and get asthma like symptoms (although it's not specifically asthma). My conclusion is that POIS is just another facet of an auto-immune related condition. All I know is that when I get an amino acid and anti-oxidant rich diet I can function pretty well. That's without any extra niacin supplementation beyond what I get from spirulina & chlorella.

These help my POIS recovery and gets my brain back working quickly. But my "gut feeling" (ironically) is that my POIS is just another allergic reaction caused by some other problem. Now it turns out that other members of my family have been having trouble with chronic fatigue and respiratory allergies and the answer seems to be gut problems due to chronic fungal growth. Over the next few weeks I'm hopefully going to find out if my problems have a similar origin. Perhaps we're not all suffering from the same thing but it's possible that some of the forum members, who have allergic POIS, experience the worst symptoms around an O but have an underlying autoimmune disease anyway.

Women with autoimmune diseases including hashimotos have been known to experience sexual problems so perhaps there are women suffering from a variation of allergic POIS but they don't experience it with the same intensity or obvious correlation to O's as we do.

By the way, I saw an episode of House recently where some of the symptoms resonated with me. The firs time this has happened so I guess I'm free of hypochondria :) Episode 13 of Season 8. The eventual diagnosis was Silent thyroiditis secondary to polyglandular autoimmune syndrome type III.
 

Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15870 on: 25/03/2012 12:33:23 »
Guys, is there a similar medication to niacin? I have been taking it once a week before orgasm but recently I have not been able to obtain a flush. I had previously been able to successfully obtain flushes with about 150 to 200 mg for the few months i've been taking it. Recently I have not been able to get a flush even if I take over 300mg while fasting for 5 or 6 hours.

And the fast includes alcohol. I realized that even one drink within that fasting period can also stop the flush.

Victor and others of course have used injectible xanthiol nicotinate which might perhaps resolve your situation, but it is harder to get and requires injection. I guess there's a tablet form as well, but, perhaps if something in the digestive tract is blocking the flush, the injectible might make the difference. Also I understand that "compounding labs can make up injecible versions of "niacin".

I have a feeling that it is the liver that influences the "flush" susceptibility threshold and so perhaps even the injectible type may not even get you past the problem.

 

Offline Mr.Cool

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15871 on: 25/03/2012 16:59:33 »
Thank you Vincent Marcus and daveman for your quick responses. So essentially the best remedies that we know up until now for POIS symtoms are taking an anti-histamine like claritin, niacin (flush kind), adequate sleep and cardio?
Please confirm or add other remedies.
Thanks and God bless.
 

Offline daveman

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15872 on: 25/03/2012 20:54:56 »
Have a look at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=319.0 and  http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=174.0 for niacin, it's not quite as simple as just taking it, although when taken right it can be very effective.

And we are all a bit different, so it may not be as cut an dried as suggested, but at least a good start.

Meantime as you try those things, take your time and read through all our stuff on this site and the other to see if anything might fit your case better.
 

Offline jferr

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15873 on: 25/03/2012 23:23:30 »
Guys, is there a similar medication to niacin? I have been taking it once a week before orgasm but recently I have not been able to obtain a flush. I had previously been able to successfully obtain flushes with about 150 to 200 mg for the few months i've been taking it. Recently I have not been able to get a flush even if I take over 300mg while fasting for 5 or 6 hours.

And the fast includes alcohol. I realized that even one drink within that fasting period can also stop the flush.

Victor and others of course have used injectible xanthiol nicotinate which might perhaps resolve your situation, but it is harder to get and requires injection. I guess there's a tablet form as well, but, perhaps if something in the digestive tract is blocking the flush, the injectible might make the difference. Also I understand that "compounding labs can make up injecible versions of "niacin".

I have a feeling that it is the liver that influences the "flush" susceptibility threshold and so perhaps even the injectible type may not even get you past the problem.

Very interesting, Daveman. I would imagine the lfush would also be more instant with an injection. Would you happen to know where I could obtain niacin in injection form?
 

Offline demografx

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Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
« Reply #15874 on: 25/03/2012 23:28:42 »
Thank you Vincent Marcus and daveman for your quick responses. So essentially the best remedies that we know up until now for POIS symtoms are taking an anti-histamine like claritin, niacin (flush kind), adequate sleep and cardio?
Please confirm or add other remedies.
Thanks and God bless.


Also, TRT (Testosterone Replacement Therapy) helps me and a few others.
« Last Edit: 26/03/2012 01:53:29 by demografx »
 

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