The Naked Scientists

The Naked Scientists Forum

Author Topic: Does consciousness exist after death?  (Read 11292 times)

Offline kasparovitch

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 58
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #75 on: 27/06/2016 22:06:20 »
This topic is about consciousness and death, not about evolution. I hope you both understand.
 

Offline Alan McDougall

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1285
  • Thanked: 14 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #76 on: 27/06/2016 22:15:46 »
This topic is about consciousness and death, not about evolution. I hope you both understand.

I told IAMREALTY that more than twice but he refused to listen and persisted in posting about evolution in an attempt to annoy me with evolution which was also an attempt by him to hijack your thread.

Thus I am baffled as to why you include me in this, because 100% of what I wrote had to do with consciousness, until he invaded your tread with evolution.
 

Offline kasparovitch

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 58
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #77 on: 27/06/2016 22:23:55 »
You're right, Alan, but I think that by answering his off-topic post perhaps you're fueling him and this becomes a never ending story about everything except consciousness and death as it's supposed to be.
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #78 on: 27/06/2016 22:35:28 »

This topic if you can read the title of the thread "is about consciousness" and you are high jacking it with questions about evolution!

And it seems you think are far to intelligent  to ever consider there are other beings infinitely more intelligent than you, including the Intelligent Designer of which you are closer to a cockroach than it/him etc !

It's all tied together.  Please avoid personal attacks and reply to context only.  I noticed you didn't address the actual valid points of the post.  And it's a bit confusing how you're objecting to my veering off topic considering the things you had posted on the previous page; one of which directly references intelligent design evolution, from the all powerful creator or whatever.  In fact, in a sign of irony, you're even still pushing the concept in this very reply of yours!

Quote
"The universe then began to weave, dance, and vibrate flux and vortex into one colossal maelstrom, spiral in perfect order from the mind of the eternal one The Universe danced and sang with joy. The dancer danced and sang along with his new creation.

I am life giver. Back before anything was conceived , I am  Infinite pure "mind" and "thought" there is  no dark only light within my infinite domain, so I moved upon the great void of dark and said "let there be" light' and there was light. From the light came love and life.
 
I am all Life
 
I am Light
 
I am emotion"

For example, this addresses whether consciousness scientifically exists after death how exactly? 


This topic is about consciousness and death, not about evolution. I hope you both understand.

I told IAMREALTY that more than twice but he refused to listen and persisted in posting about evolution in an attempt to annoy me with evolution which was also an attempt by him to hijack your thread.

Thus I am baffled as to why you include me in this, because 100% of what I wrote had to do with consciousness, until he invaded your tread with evolution.

What I posted was fine, and technically wasn't even addressed to you.  Furthermore, you asked me zero times to not talk about evolution.  Zero.  I mean, the history's all there.  Third of all, my question on evolution originally on page 3 was a perfectly valid question pertaining to the larger topic.  There was nothing wrong with it at all.  Fourth of all, I'm merely discussing things on a discussion forum.  Same as anyone.  And lastly, you accuse me of hijacking the thread yet I'm not the one who posted the religious stuff and long winded poetry on page 3.  Between your replying to a valid question of mine previously with the concept of intelligent design evolution, you posting that long winded religious screed, and after my seeing that (what I consider to be) nonsensical book that's coming out in my news feed and learning about it, it caused me to reply here with my thoughts, since that's where I first heard it from you to begin with.  I freely admit now in retrospect, that the post was reactive to my utter disgust at reading about the book, and since this thread is where I initially heard the concept, it's where I felt the need to vent my thoughts and very, VERY logical points against the concept.  But even if reactionary and impulsive, it was still merely one post. One. A simple paragraph.  Big deal.  Move on.  But now it needs to devolve into needless bickering and personal attacks why exactly?

If you don't appreciate my posts no one is forcing you to reply to them nor even read them.  If you feel they break the rules feel free to report them.  But please, for the love of the flying spaghetti monster, stop making it personal and attacking me.  You said you were gonna ignore me, so ignore me.  No one is forcing you to reply.  Please just stop the attacks already.

(last thing I'll add:  I have zero interest in going round and round here.  It's been addressed now.  Any future personal attacks in this thread will be ignored, as will posts addressing me in any personal way.  Let's discuss context.  I had some very valid points in my intelligent design rant on page 3, and if you feel the need to rebutt them feel free, and we can discuss it.  Any other contextual replies can be discussed.  But I have no desire in any personal type communication.  Context only.  Thanks)
« Last Edit: 27/06/2016 23:33:43 by IAMREALITY »
 

Offline Alan McDougall

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1285
  • Thanked: 14 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #79 on: 28/06/2016 00:28:51 »
You're right, Alan, but I think that by answering his off-topic post perhaps you're fueling him and this becomes a never ending story about everything except consciousness and death as it's supposed to be.

He is on my ignore list "the only member in fact, but I can still look at his posts if I want to. I randomly opened his one about evolution and fell into his trap of debating evolution instead of consciousness . His only purpose was to irritate me which he did, so from now on I will never again look at anything he says of the forum , he is a disruptive influence on the forum better left alone.

From now on I promise you that I will keep to the topic of your thread and not wander off in other directions "Sorry for that!"
 

Offline Alex Siqueira

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 149
  • Thanked: 4 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #80 on: 28/06/2016 10:13:19 »
I dont want to disturb anyone here, but the conscious come from evolution, now hold one, it is related from being alive, conscious is born from the time concept, an observer does not need a universe in order to observe, he need a universe in order to exist, to observe someone need a mind that is subjected to some sort of time cocnept, but universe is only based on speed of things, heat and cold, energy and that's it, the rest are properties provinient from the combination of those foor...

  Now the brain needs to measure thing, it need to have a pyshical way to tell the boddy to know when to eat, when to hunt, when to sleep. when is going to rain, and for that the brain need exterior references, and he also needs a conscious state of mind, a small portion of the brain which can be easly accesed by the body when the body needs to meassure, when the body needs to think...
 Not strong enought that the brain would loose control, not too weak that the body reflexes would be compromised, so it give us 10%...
   Does consciousness exist after death? Most probably, no!
 Liefe and evolution must be related with death or you end up loosing all the chemistry process that born the brain, and with this ignoring the necessity of why is there a conscious state of mind in the firt place, missing the begining one can't possible expect to understand the end...
  and thank god it most likely ends, humans are not build for eternity, we need to die, witch should be like fall asleep, do you have fear to sleep, or can you do racional psysical task while sliping? See thats my awnser for you, brain creates conscious to observe, tht creates time to measure anything, so the anwser is no, it doesn't...
 

Offline Thebox

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 3162
  • Thanked: 45 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #81 on: 28/06/2016 10:30:59 »
Rock asked the Naked Scientists:
   Does consciousness continue exist after death so that we can think something? Please if you will phone me speak legibly and easy English (better to say just yes or no).
What do you think?

My answer would be an outright no, my reason is that consciousness is the processing of information by the Brains neural network and ''CPU'', once any ''electrical'' energy has left the body the ''CPU'' has no function and is similar to a computer being shut down.
 

Offline tkadm30

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 922
  • Thanked: 7 times
    • View Profile
    • IsotopeSoftware
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #82 on: 28/06/2016 11:07:04 »
Rock asked the Naked Scientists:
   Does consciousness continue exist after death so that we can think something? Please if you will phone me speak legibly and easy English (better to say just yes or no).
What do you think?

I would say Yes, its possible that consciousness survives death, given that the brain may not be the source of consciousness. There's simply no physical evidences that consciousness could not exist without the brain.

Quote
The scientific confirmation of the existence of consciousness in unicellular organisms and plants certainly establishes that the brain is not the source of consciousness. Several decades back, research in medical science has also proven that the brain is not the source of consciousness. In 1970, Robert White and his team successfully transferred the head of a rhesus monkey to the headless body of another monkey. The monkey survived for 8 days.

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/19420889.2015.1085138

 

Offline Alan McDougall

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1285
  • Thanked: 14 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #83 on: 28/06/2016 12:46:21 »
Rock asked the Naked Scientists:
   Does consciousness continue exist after death so that we can think something? Please if you will phone me speak legibly and easy English (better to say just yes or no).
What do you think?

My answer would be an outright no, my reason is that consciousness is the processing of information by the Brains neural network and ''CPU'', once any ''electrical'' energy has left the body the ''CPU'' has no function and is similar to a computer being shut down.


Consciousness cannot be equated to the CPU it is equated to the software which is non-material.

At least for the first time, in this post I got what you meant although what you said is was back to front as usual!
 

Offline Alan McDougall

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1285
  • Thanked: 14 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #84 on: 28/06/2016 13:16:08 »
"As we debate consciousness maybe we should reflect on what the truth is relative to each of us".

Whatever, I believe or you believe it makes no difference to the what the real actual truth of the matter is, the truth is the truth regardless of belief or speculation, although we might have actually latched onto the truth without knowing it.

Science then becomes the best tool, but not the only tool to prove the truth of our thought beliefs or speculations

Thus; the universe might have needed consciousness to exist, which is the belief of some, or that consciousness was not a prerequisite to the existence of the universe , or the universe created consciousness. Whatever, the truth of those questions will be the truth even if we debate it for an eternity .

But as thinking beings why not debate, both within the confines of our own minds and with others, who know things we do not, in an eternal effort to find ultimate truth?

The actual real truth of this question is a mystery, no one knows the answer, so all is just speculation or belief based systems.

Henry Fords consciousness led to the creation of his Model T car and the totally new unique idea of mass production in his factories. In his case consciousness came before creation so it a too far a stretch to suggest that something similar was the cause of the universes existence?

Thus our options are?

1) Consciousness caused the universe to exist?
2) The universe created consciousnesses?
3) None of the above?
4) There is a primordial consciousness that existed before the big bang that contemplated existence and created our universe?
5) Add your own?

(My preference is number 4)

« Last Edit: 28/06/2016 13:28:14 by Alan McDougall »
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #85 on: 28/06/2016 15:19:58 »
Rock asked the Naked Scientists:
   Does consciousness continue exist after death so that we can think something? Please if you will phone me speak legibly and easy English (better to say just yes or no).
What do you think?

My answer would be an outright no, my reason is that consciousness is the processing of information by the Brains neural network and ''CPU'', once any ''electrical'' energy has left the body the ''CPU'' has no function and is similar to a computer being shut down.

Pretty much exactly.
 

Offline Alan McDougall

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1285
  • Thanked: 14 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #86 on: 28/06/2016 15:28:51 »
IAMREALITY

You are on my ignore list and I do not look at anything you post, just thought I would let you know!

Best Regards?

Alan
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #87 on: 28/06/2016 15:50:34 »
Rock asked the Naked Scientists:
   Does consciousness continue exist after death so that we can think something? Please if you will phone me speak legibly and easy English (better to say just yes or no).
What do you think?

I would say Yes, its possible that consciousness survives death, given that the brain may not be the source of consciousness. There's simply no physical evidences that consciousness could not exist without the brain.

Quote
The scientific confirmation of the existence of consciousness in unicellular organisms and plants certainly establishes that the brain is not the source of consciousness. Several decades back, research in medical science has also proven that the brain is not the source of consciousness. In 1970, Robert White and his team successfully transferred the head of a rhesus monkey to the headless body of another monkey. The monkey survived for 8 days.
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/19420889.2015.1085138

First of all, Every bit of evidence there is suggests that consciousness could not exist without the brain.  On the other hand, there is ZERO evidence that it could.

Second of all, that paper was based on philosophy not science.  It uses an extremely loose definition of sentience, defining every living cell as sentient.  Based on that paper, every living cell that exists would have sentience that survives death.  Are we to assume you believe every cell of every plant, bacteria, animal and otherwise, every cell goes to heaven in your view?

But that's another issue in the paper, it doesn't believe in God, or heaven:
Quote
Even though the attempt toward mechanization of nature served as an important driving force behind the scientific revolution, it also created an image of a clockwork universe set in motion by an intelligent first cause. Such machine analogy is also applied to living organisms. However, the view that a supernatural being, God,54 is external to living organisms and that He imposes form on matter from the outside (intelligent design) is also reductionistic, and shows a logical fallacy.

No, instead the paper is all about reincarnation.  That upon death, the soul enters a new body.  Is that what you believe?
And would that really be consciousness surviving?  I've always said that if reincarnation existed, but our new mind had no memory whatsoever of our old, then isn't it really a distinction without a difference?  Would it matter that it was the 'same' soul, if as far as it was concerned it was 'new'? Would that really be consciousness surviving at all??
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #88 on: 28/06/2016 15:51:40 »
IAMREALITY

You are on my ignore list and I do not look at anything you post, just thought I would let you know!

Best Regards?

Alan

Alan,

No one cares.  Just thought you should know.
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #89 on: 28/06/2016 15:57:33 »
Henry Fords consciousness led to the creation of his Model T car and the totally new unique idea of mass production in his factories. In his case consciousness came before creation so it a too far a stretch to suggest that something similar was the cause of the universes existence?
100% absolutely it is too far.

Quote
Thus our options are?

1) Consciousness caused the universe to exist?
2) The universe created consciousnesses?
3) None of the above?
4) There is a primordial consciousness that existed before the big bang that contemplated existence and created our universe?
5) Add your own?

The answer is 3, with a 5 thrown in.  The universe didn't create consciousness.  The universe created spacetime, which contained raw energy, which condensed into matter, which formed into structures, which eventually harbored organic chemicals, which eventually over millions or billions of years organized into rna, which over millions or billions of years became dna, which led to living cells, which over billions of years evolved into complex beings capable of consciousness.
 

Offline tkadm30

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 922
  • Thanked: 7 times
    • View Profile
    • IsotopeSoftware
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #90 on: 28/06/2016 17:54:36 »
First of all, Every bit of evidence there is suggests that consciousness could not exist without the brain.  On the other hand, there is ZERO evidence that it could.

NDE is an evidence that consciousness may survives death.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2783030/Research-near-death-experiences-reveals-awareness-continue-brain-shut-down.html

Quote from: IAMREALITY
Second of all, that paper was based on philosophy not science.  It uses an extremely loose definition of sentience, defining every living cell as sentient.  Based on that paper, every living cell that exists would have sentience that survives death.  Are we to assume you believe every cell of every plant, bacteria, animal and otherwise, every cell goes to heaven in your view?

I believe consciousness is beyond the material realm of existence. Life and consciousness are deeply interconnected. No consciousness, no life...

Quote from: IAMREALITY
No, instead the paper is all about reincarnation.  That upon death, the soul enters a new body.  Is that what you believe?
And would that really be consciousness surviving?  I've always said that if reincarnation existed, but our new mind had no memory whatsoever of our old, then isn't it really a distinction without a difference?  Would it matter that it was the 'same' soul, if as far as it was concerned it was 'new'? Would that really be consciousness surviving at all??

Assuming consciousness originates from quantum interactions in living organisms, I believe consciousness could happens in creating reality through entanglement of space and time. The universe could therefore be a product of our consciousness and death an illusion humans have adopted through religions and culture. What must be researched is how life occurs in immortal organisms.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2503370/Quantum-physics-proves-IS-afterlife-claims-scientist.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_immortality#Organisms
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biocentric_universe
 
The following users thanked this post: Alan McDougall

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #91 on: 28/06/2016 18:27:16 »
First of all, Every bit of evidence there is suggests that consciousness could not exist without the brain.  On the other hand, there is ZERO evidence that it could.

NDE is an evidence that consciousness may survives death.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2783030/Research-near-death-experiences-reveals-awareness-continue-brain-shut-down.html


NDE's most certainly are not.  They're merely evidence that the brain is capable of masterful perceptive manipulation.  It's fascinating what it's capable of. 

In relation to your 'study':

http://doubtfulnews.com/2014/10/one-not-too-impressive-study-does-not-prove-life-after-death/
 

Offline Thebox

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 3162
  • Thanked: 45 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #92 on: 28/06/2016 22:54:46 »


1) Consciousness caused the universe to exist?
2) The universe created consciousnesses?
3) None of the above?
4) There is a primordial consciousness that existed before the big bang that contemplated existence and created our universe?
5) Add your own?

(My preference is number 4)

1) The Universe exists without consciousness, consciousness is not something that create an Universe although consciousness can create illusions.

2)I prefer consciousness was created in the Universe ,

4)  Doubtful,

5)Consciousness is energies state of being self aware in 3 dimensional form .

Do not make the mistake of thinking consciousness exists after death, information exists after death but not your consciousness, Antoine Lavoisier discovered nothing is ever lost, but he never accounted for consciousness, the ''energies'' that are within you contain information, this information is you but is processed by the brain and called the consciousness, when you pass away your energies return to join the cosmos whole, information of you fragmented all over the cosmos, it is quite beautiful to consider we retain ourselves in information form and the information can never be lost, a bit transferring from consciousness to the ''master boot record'', retrieving the information is however complex with the instant fragmentation.

 

Offline kasparovitch

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 58
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #93 on: 28/06/2016 23:51:33 »
First of all, Every bit of evidence there is suggests that consciousness could not exist without the brain.  On the other hand, there is ZERO evidence that it could.

There's absolutely no evidence that conscience couldn't exist without a brain, unless perhaps theoretically, which here is a very weak evidence at most. Empirically, to demonstrate it, you had to know what's consciousness in the first instance and then know how to detect and record it's existence. Thus, you could prove that there's no consciousness  remaining after removing or destroying a brain or that part or all of consciousness remained after that. There's no such experiment in the whole history of humanity (at least recorded).

There's only evidence that by losing parts of the brain by disease or accident you lose mental functions, and this is might be as strong a proof that consciousness is a physical substance as observing that by cutting a nerve you lose muscular action or sensitivity.

As I told before, I'm preparing a mental experiment, something like the Chinese box by Searle, to demonstrate it.
« Last Edit: 29/06/2016 07:57:24 by kasparovitch »
 
The following users thanked this post: Alan McDougall

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #94 on: 29/06/2016 00:25:36 »
First of all, Every bit of evidence there is suggests that consciousness could not exist without the brain.  On the other hand, there is ZERO evidence that it could.

There's absolutely no evidence that conscience couldn't exist without a brain, unless perhaps theoretically, which here is a very weak evidence at most. Empirically, to demonstrate it, you had to know what's consciousness in the first instance and then know how to detect and record it's existence. Thus, you could prove that there's no consciousness  remaining after removing or destroying a brain or that part or all of consciousness remained after that. There's no such experiment in the whole history of humanity (at least recorded).

There's only evidence that by losing parts of the brain by disease or accident you lose mental functions, and this is as strong a proof that consciousness is a physical substance as observing that by cutting a nerve you lose muscular action or sensitivity.

As I told before, I'm preparing a mental experiment, something like the Chinese box by Searle, to demonstrate it.

Lol
 

Offline Alan McDougall

  • Neilep Level Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1285
  • Thanked: 14 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #95 on: 29/06/2016 11:26:33 »
First of all, Every bit of evidence there is suggests that consciousness could not exist without the brain.  On the other hand, there is ZERO evidence that it could.

There's absolutely no evidence that conscience couldn't exist without a brain, unless perhaps theoretically, which here is a very weak evidence at most. Empirically, to demonstrate it, you had to know what's consciousness in the first instance and then know how to detect and record it's existence. Thus, you could prove that there's no consciousness  remaining after removing or destroying a brain or that part or all of consciousness remained after that. There's no such experiment in the whole history of humanity (at least recorded).

There's only evidence that by losing parts of the brain by disease or accident you lose mental functions, and this is might be as strong a proof that consciousness is a physical substance as observing that by cutting a nerve you lose muscular action or sensitivity.

As I told before, I'm preparing a mental experiment, something like the Chinese box by Searle, to demonstrate it.

Here is another Poem I wrote sometime ago, about death and what I think happens in the moments after we die and leave our mortal bodies.

Emmanuel's Light (Emmanuel is God)
 
A poem by Alan McDougall 2001

Come fly towards majestic Orion with me
At great speed to our majestic god we flee
Through a wide river at last we fly
Reaching out to a great light beyond the sky

Towards the sides of the north nearer and nearer we flew
Arrayed in spotless white robes given to you
Across a vast space of infinite night
Together clothed in glory we continued our flight

Oh great heavenly cavern so measureless to man
See before majestic Emmanuel gather all who can
By mighty angels through glorious clouds we are driven
Closer and closer to gods mighty throne in the midst of heaven

At last to those mighty gates of heaven we came
Baptized by El Shaddias light all were the same (El Shaddia is another name of God)
In joyful luminous glory all creation did sing
By that stupendous realm of the holy king

A mighty voice shook all creation and rang through the air
Saying loud gather all around great EL Shaddais colossal chair
Look at god’s right a wonder is seen to rise
“Oh my beloved son at last I can give you your PRIZE”

Bathed in beautiful grandeur of the one who had atoned
Countless multitudes stood quiet before Emmanuel enthroned
Joyfully before Emmanuel at last
Faces glowing by lakes colored by golden riven glass
Rejoicing at a life that would now never pass

« Last Edit: 29/06/2016 11:28:34 by Alan McDougall »
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #96 on: 29/06/2016 14:22:26 »
 ::)
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #97 on: 29/06/2016 14:26:19 »
Here's my own :

Nothing happens when you die
For God is nothing but a Lie
Your mind will turn to only dust
Your theory Alan, is a bust...
 

Offline phyti

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 36
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #98 on: 29/06/2016 16:11:36 »
I will use the book authored by one who would know.

 consciousness:
eccl. 9:5
the living are conscious they will die,  the dead are conscious of nothing
ps. 146:4
his spirit goes out, he returns to the ground, his thoughts perish
eccl. 3:19
There is the same eventuality for man and beast. They come from the dust and return to the dust.

soul (synonym for living creature):
gen. 2:7
the man formed from the dust and with the breath of life became a living soul
gen. 1:21
animals referred to as souls
ezek. 18:4
the soul that is sinning will die
____________________________________________________________________

Personal knowledge

 near death experience:
These events are rare exceptions to typical deaths, and if actual recovery from death would be equivalent to a resurrection. The explanation is more likely an incomplete and inaccurate clinical definition of death. Medical science is relatively new to humanity.
The experiences of the subjects involved are real, but confined to the mind. The fact that they have any awareness of bright lights, departed family members, etc. is proof they are not dead. Their visions are conditioned by past testimonials and ignorance concerning death. There is a parallel regarding mass suggestion with victims of alien abductions. The immortality of the soul was one (false) idea to circumvent death.
 

Offline IAMREALITY

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
  • Thanked: 10 times
    • View Profile
Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #99 on: 29/06/2016 16:35:10 »
I will use the book authored by one who would know.

 consciousness:
eccl. 9:5
the living are conscious they will die,  the dead are conscious of nothing
ps. 146:4
his spirit goes out, he returns to the ground, his thoughts perish
eccl. 3:19
There is the same eventuality for man and beast. They come from the dust and return to the dust.

soul (synonym for living creature):
gen. 2:7
the man formed from the dust and with the breath of life became a living soul
gen. 1:21
animals referred to as souls
ezek. 18:4
the soul that is sinning will die
____________________________________________________________________

Personal knowledge

 near death experience:
These events are rare exceptions to typical deaths, and if actual recovery from death would be equivalent to a resurrection. The explanation is more likely an incomplete and inaccurate clinical definition of death. Medical science is relatively new to humanity.
The experiences of the subjects involved are real, but confined to the mind. The fact that they have any awareness of bright lights, departed family members, etc. is proof they are not dead. Their visions are conditioned by past testimonials and ignorance concerning death. There is a parallel regarding mass suggestion with victims of alien abductions. The immortality of the soul was one (false) idea to circumvent death.

Hey, I know that book!  It's a good work of fiction!

As far as your thoughts on NDE's, I couldn't agree more.  You pretty much nailed it.
 

The Naked Scientists Forum

Re: Does consciousness exist after death?
« Reply #99 on: 29/06/2016 16:35:10 »

 

SMF 2.0.10 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
SMFAds for Free Forums