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Author Topic: Does free will exist?  (Read 515 times)

Offline thedoc

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Does free will exist?
« on: 10/06/2016 09:15:04 »
What do two separate fields of science say regarding the existence of free will?

Read the article then tell us what you think...
« Last Edit: 10/06/2016 09:15:04 by _system »


 

Offline A.l. Green

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Re: Does free will exist?
« Reply #1 on: 20/06/2016 21:49:45 »
You rightly point out the problems which would arise if free will proves to be illusory. If we are not responsible for any action, then  concepts such as sin, criminal liability and punishment are nugatory. But if that were so, anarchy would result and to protect itself and its members, society would, instead of punishing wrongdoers, be obliged to seclude, or even kill, persons deemed to present a danger. I think I would rather stick with the idea of free will.
 

Offline hamdani yusuf

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Re: Does free will exist?
« Reply #2 on: 21/06/2016 03:43:20 »
You rightly point out the problems which would arise if free will proves to be illusory. If we are not responsible for any action, then  concepts such as sin, criminal liability and punishment are nugatory. But if that were so, anarchy would result and to protect itself and its members, society would, instead of punishing wrongdoers, be obliged to seclude, or even kill, persons deemed to present a danger. I think I would rather stick with the idea of free will.
What if the law and its implementation are seen as preventive action to bad things threatening the society? Instead of punishment, the law merely seek to prevent the wrongdoers from repeating their action, and deter others from copying the wrongdoing?
 

Offline A.Carter

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Re: Does free will exist?
« Reply #3 on: 23/06/2016 11:22:02 »
I disagree that a lack of direct responsibility would lead to anarchy. Even if we are not responsible for our actions in a religious sense where we are equally able to choose between different actions, our actions are still, to whatever degree, molded by our environment. It would then be perfectly reasonable to continue to exercise justice. However, I think the nature of this justice would have to be adjusted. If we have no free will, then applying justice in a punitive manner would make no sense. Justice would have to be applied with the aim of rehabilitation.
 

Offline jeffreyH

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Re: Does free will exist?
« Reply #4 on: 23/06/2016 12:57:17 »
If the universe was deterministic and it was demonstrated that free will did not exist then every persons decision on what to do about that information would have to be pre-determined. The decision of those providing the truth as to whether or not to publish would also be predetermined so that the conversation about consequences is then irrelevant. So what prompted this thread? A choice.
 

Online puppypower

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Re: Does free will exist?
« Reply #5 on: 24/06/2016 12:10:45 »
Free will was originally connected to making choices apart from natural instinct; will of God. If you use the premise, God created the universe, then life and natural instinct is predetermined, so the entire creation can integrate. Free will meant humans were now able to make choices apart from natural instinct. Modern humans extrapolate free will from here, since we take the loss of natural instincts for granted.

The way this is possible is the human psyche has two centers of consciousness, one for the conscious mind and one for the unconscious mind. The center of the unconscious mind is called the inner self and this is connected to DNA and natural instincts. It is very conservative and therefore mostly predetermined by instinct. The center of the conscious mind is the ego and it can make choices apart from the DNA and instincts, since it has a level of autonomy. People with drugs habits, that harm the body is not motived  by the inner self or the DNA. This is connected to the ego and subroutines it can  creates via habits; pleasure centers.

If a person became predetermined by the mass mind of culture; super ego, via ego conformity, free will might appear to come from the inner self, since the super ego may not be integrated with natural instinct. For example, the concept of PC or politically correct is not natural, because it requires one detach from evolution based on natural selection. If you believe that evolution properly reflects the natural reality of life, the inner self would be connected to that, and not to choices that are unnatural selection. The urge for natural selection may appear like will power and free will apart from the herd.

This creates the irony of a return to determinism, in the biblical sense of natural, becomes a source of free choice, relative to the mass mind of herd thinking. However, this is not free will in the sense since it is already predetermined by the DNA and natural instincts. While the ego conforming to the mass mind required will power to depart from instinct.
 

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Re: Does free will exist?
« Reply #5 on: 24/06/2016 12:10:45 »

 

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