[coberst (OP)]

Internet Forum as Verbal Video Game

I claim that when we make an Internet discussion into a “debate” we are often trying to derive the same titillation as we receive from a video game.  We are transforming the forum into a ‘verbal video game’.  This gives us the pleasure similar to that received by playing a video game; but has the detrimental effect of inhibiting learning. 

I once took acting lessons and our professor taught us “method acting”, which is founded upon the premise that, as Stella Adler said “We are what we do, not what we say”.  This means that when I make the bodily actions of conflict I will feel conflict. 

In the ordinary code of “debate” one must develop an anti-thesis in order for there to be a contest.  We do this because it is this contest that brings to us the titillation similar to that derived by the video game.

This ant-thesis acts as a means for conflict and thus an inhibiting fashion for our ability to learn.

“One’s experience of doubt is a fully embodied experience of hesitation, withholding of assent, felt bodily tension, and general bodily restriction.  Such felt bodily experiences are not merely accomplishments of doubt; rather, they are your doubt…Doubt retards or stops the harmonious flow of experience that preceded the doubt.  You feel the restriction and tension of your diaphragm, your breathing, and perhaps in your gut.  The meaning of doubt is precisely this bodily experience of holding back assent and feeling a blockage of the free flow of experience toward new thoughts, feelings, and experiences”

We must learn to entertain a new idea without either accepting it or rejecting it until we have prepared our self to form a considered opinion of the matter. 

“It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.”
Aristotle

Quotations from “The Meaning of the Body” by Mark Johnson

[DoctorBeaver]

Coberst – you raise some interesting points.

Internet Forum as Verbal Video Game

I claim that when we make an Internet discussion into a “debate” we are often trying to derive the same titillation as we receive from a video game.  We are transforming the forum into a ‘verbal video game’.  This gives us the pleasure similar to that received by playing a video game; but has the detrimental effect of inhibiting learning.

Not really being a video game player, I can't comment too much on that. However, what I can say is that I do not enter into debates for “titillation”. I would also like to know where the justification for claiming that debates have “ the detrimental effect of inhibiting learning”. That is certainly not true for me and I fail to understand how moving an imaginary character around on a screen shooting other imaginary characters promotes learning in the academic sense.

I once took acting lessons and our professor taught us “method acting”, which is founded upon the premise that, as Stella Adler said “We are what we do, not what we say”.  This means that when I make the bodily actions of conflict I will feel conflict. 

As my acting ability is probably surpassed by the average squashed snail I shall accept what you say.

In the ordinary code of “debate” one must develop an anti-thesis in order for there to be a contest.  We do this because it is this contest that brings to us the titillation similar to that derived by the video game.

This ant-thesis acts as a means for conflict and thus an inhibiting fashion for our ability to learn.

No – one does not need to develop an anti-thesis. One develops & explains one's own point of view and it is up to one's opponent to counter one's arguments, and vice versa. To “develop an anti-thesis” sounds, to me, like a contrived argument. True, that is indeed how some debates are run; but they are normally either for practice or fun.

“One’s experience of doubt is a fully embodied experience of hesitation, withholding of assent, felt bodily tension, and general bodily restriction.  Such felt bodily experiences are not merely accomplishments of doubt; rather, they are your doubt…Doubt retards or stops the harmonious flow of experience that preceded the doubt.  You feel the restriction and tension of your diaphragm, your breathing, and perhaps in your gut.  The meaning of doubt is precisely this bodily experience of holding back assent and feeling a blockage of the free flow of experience toward new thoughts, feelings, and experiences”

That description of doubt does not fit with how I have ever experienced it. “ You feel the restriction and tension of your diaphragm, your breathing, and perhaps in your gut” - erm, no I don't.
I do agree, though, that doubt can interfere with the “ harmonious flow of experience that preceded the doubt” assuming, of course, that the flow of experience was, in fact, harmonious. That sounds a bit idealised and, may I say, a tad Zen.

We must learn to entertain a new idea without either accepting it or rejecting it until we have prepared our self to form a considered opinion of the matter. 

“It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.”
Aristotle

Totally agree.

[lightarrow]

Internet Forum as Verbal Video Game
I claim that when we make an Internet discussion into a “debate” we are often trying to derive the same titillation as we receive from a video game.  We are transforming the forum into a ‘verbal video game’.  This gives us the pleasure similar to that received by playing a video game; but has the detrimental effect of inhibiting learning. 

It depends on the level of the “debate”; we should also consider that a “debate” can have the effect of stimulating our hidden resources and add something interesting we wouldn't have thought about, in "standard" conditions.

I once took acting lessons and our professor taught us “method acting”, which is founded upon the premise that, as Stella Adler said “We are what we do, not what we say”.  This means that when I make the bodily actions of conflict I will feel conflict. 

We are neither what we say nor what we do, sorry.

[DoctorBeaver]

We are what we think. What we say or do merely allows others to form opinions of us which may, or may not, be correct.

[DoctorBeaver]

we should also consider that a “debate” can have the effect of stimulating our hidden resources and add something interesting we wouldn't have thought about, in "standard" conditions.

Very true.

[LeeE]

<pedant-mode>
Umm...  "verbal video game" is an oxymoron.  And um, verbal is aural, whereas we read each other's posts.
</pedant-mode>

[DoctorBeaver]

<bigger-pedant-mode>
Aural is to do with hearing. Verbal would be oral
</bigger-pedant-mode>

[lyner]

There is a huge difference.
Video games are pure fantasy, whereas out Scientific discussions . . . .



I'll get my coat.

[LeeE]

<correction-mode>
Oops - yes.
</correction-mode>

<on-second-thought-mode>
...but shouldn't it be audile?  Oral isn't much use without aural (in this context - and stop that childish sniggering at the back).
</on-second-thought-mode>

[lyner]

Oral isn't much use without aural

Oh God - he likes to listen as well as watch!

[DoctorBeaver]

Voyeur et écouteur!

[psikeyhackr]

But messing with JREFers is so much FUN!

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=128940&page=3

Whose fault is it that there are so many dummies on the internet that can't acknowledge their intellectual inadequacies?

The educational system?  I have had a college graduate tell me there were 12 continents.

psik

[yor_on]

That's soo wrong.
Atlantis...
Ur...

They are all there waiting for us.

True story's from real mens experiences.
And with their women 'stargazed' just behind them:)
Jules knew all about them.
Ah, Verne.

[Blossomoo]

Not really being a video game player, I can't comment too much on that. However, what I can say is that I do not enter into debates for “titillation”. I would also like to know where the justification for claiming that debates have “ the detrimental effect of inhibiting learning”. That is certainly not true for me and I fail to understand how moving an imaginary character around on a screen shooting other imaginary characters promotes learning in the academic sense.
Yes,i thisk so!

______________________________________________________
spammy links removed

[damocles]

<correction-mode>
Oops - yes.
</correction-mode>

<on-second-thought-mode>
...but shouldn't it be audile?  Oral isn't much use without aural (in this context - and stop that childish sniggering at the back).
</on-second-thought-mode>

<even more pedantic correction mode>

"verbal" = word-related.

On input "verbal" = "aural" or "text visual"
On output "verbal" = "oral" or "text tactile"

</even more pedantic correction mode>

[Airthumbs]

Games are just that, a game, a forum as I understand it is a place of intellectual gathering and in this context a forum underpinned by a scientific genre.  The so called "titillation" as you call it, is as I see it human nature to discover, explore, investigate. 

Is there a link between games and academia?  You might as well add all the other traits of human behavior too like gambling, sports, fighting, alcoholism, genocide and so on........ 

As a game player I know that some games such as simulators can improve hand eye co-ordination, and spatial awareness.  How this might be beneficial to academia is someone else's guess.

I put it all down to the release of endorphin.  Games "highjack" a human trait that stimulates the release of endorphin as a reward, but in my opinion the interaction within a forum exploits other innate behavioral reward stimuli. Learning for one...