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  4. Does light consist of both waves and photons?
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Does light consist of both waves and photons?

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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« on: 27/09/2018 15:35:09 »
Why not light to be consisted of electromagnetic waves and particles represented by photons If it has  characteristics of both a wave and a particle?
Each part of light gives observations for its own characteristics.
That to be said when light is emitted from a source there should be a photons emission as well as electromagnetic waves emission from the same source.And both travel with the same speed of light.
And there is a relation between Electromagnetic wave frequency and photon energy the more frequency the more photon energy making photon and waves a unified collection, but the two are separate entities so that we can apply Maxwell's equations and quantum mechanics equations separately.
« Last Edit: 27/09/2018 15:46:50 by Yahya »
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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #1 on: 27/09/2018 16:03:49 »
For each photon emitted there is a wave is produced in the Electromagnetic Field.
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Offline Kryptid

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #2 on: 27/09/2018 16:50:51 »
Last time I checked, you didn't believe in atoms, atomic nuclei or quantum mechanics. So why bother believing in something like photons?
« Last Edit: 27/09/2018 17:07:39 by Kryptid »
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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #3 on: 27/09/2018 17:24:16 »
Quote from: Kryptid on 27/09/2018 16:50:51
Last time I checked, you didn't believe in atoms, atomic nuclei or quantum mechanics. So why bother believing in something like photons?
I changed my mind ,so I thought of thinking of ideas based on current knowledge instead of denying the basics
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #4 on: 27/09/2018 22:07:55 »
Quote from: Yahya on 27/09/2018 15:35:09
Each part of light gives observations for its own characteristics.
That idea doesn't work.
If I shine a beam of light through a diffraction grating it all gets split into diffracted beams- so it must all have wave properties.
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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #5 on: 28/09/2018 08:25:41 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 27/09/2018 22:07:55
Quote from: Yahya on 27/09/2018 15:35:09
Each part of light gives observations for its own characteristics.
That idea doesn't work.
If I shine a beam of light through a diffraction grating it all gets split into diffracted beams- so it must all have wave properties.

I meant if we thought of light as particles the part of light"photons" gives the idea light is particles , and if we thought of light as electromagnetic waves , the part of light"waves" gives the idea that light is electromagnetic waves.
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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #6 on: 28/09/2018 08:44:08 »
An electron absorbs a photon and a vibrating electron produces photons, at the same time this electron produces independent EM waves since the electron is electrically charged.
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guest45734

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #7 on: 28/09/2018 09:43:43 »
Quote from: Yahya on 27/09/2018 15:35:09
Why not light to be consisted of electromagnetic waves and particles represented by photons If it has  characteristics of both a wave and a particle?
Each part of light gives observations for its own characteristics.
That to be said when light is emitted from a source there should be a photons emission as well as electromagnetic waves emission from the same source.And both travel with the same speed of light.
And there is a relation between Electromagnetic wave frequency and photon energy the more frequency the more photon energy making photon and waves a unified collection, but the two are separate entities so that we can apply Maxwell's equations and quantum mechanics equations separately.
You can think of the photon as being both a wave and a particle, traveling as a wave with its energy instantly absorbed on contact just like a particle.
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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #8 on: 28/09/2018 10:06:39 »
Quote from: dead cat on 28/09/2018 09:43:43
Quote from: Yahya on 27/09/2018 15:35:09
Why not light to be consisted of electromagnetic waves and particles represented by photons If it has  characteristics of both a wave and a particle?
Each part of light gives observations for its own characteristics.
That to be said when light is emitted from a source there should be a photons emission as well as electromagnetic waves emission from the same source.And both travel with the same speed of light.
And there is a relation between Electromagnetic wave frequency and photon energy the more frequency the more photon energy making photon and waves a unified collection, but the two are separate entities so that we can apply Maxwell's equations and quantum mechanics equations separately.
You can think of the photon as being both a wave and a particle, traveling as a wave with its energy instantly absorbed on contact just like a particle.
Photon is neutrally charged.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #9 on: 28/09/2018 18:54:26 »
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 10:06:39
Photon is neutrally charged.
Nobody said (or implied) that it isn't.
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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #10 on: 28/09/2018 20:04:30 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 28/09/2018 18:54:26
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 10:06:39
Photon is neutrally charged.
Nobody said (or implied) that it isn't.
If the two are one thing how does a neutrally charged photon gives electric properties to the EM waves?
« Last Edit: 28/09/2018 20:11:02 by Yahya »
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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #11 on: 28/09/2018 20:32:18 »
How light is both photons and EM waves if the two are completely different ?
Photons are neutrally charged , EM waves are electric field perpendicular to magnetic fields.
photons are particles , EM waves are waves and vibrations.
Photon is absolute energy , EM waves are fields.
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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #12 on: 28/09/2018 20:36:55 »
Quote from: Yahya on 27/09/2018 15:35:09
Why not light to be consisted of electromagnetic waves and particles represented by photons If it has  characteristics of both a wave and a particle?
Each part of light gives observations for its own characteristics.
That to be said when light is emitted from a source there should be a photons emission as well as electromagnetic waves emission from the same source.And both travel with the same speed of light.
And there is a relation between Electromagnetic wave frequency and photon energy the more frequency the more photon energy making photon and waves a unified collection, but the two are separate entities so that we can apply Maxwell's equations and quantum mechanics equations separately.
Hello, are you referring to visible light or the '''light'' that traverses through the space between objects?

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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #13 on: 28/09/2018 20:42:21 »
Quote from: Thebox on 28/09/2018 20:36:55
Quote from: Yahya on 27/09/2018 15:35:09
Why not light to be consisted of electromagnetic waves and particles represented by photons If it has  characteristics of both a wave and a particle?
Each part of light gives observations for its own characteristics.
That to be said when light is emitted from a source there should be a photons emission as well as electromagnetic waves emission from the same source.And both travel with the same speed of light.
And there is a relation between Electromagnetic wave frequency and photon energy the more frequency the more photon energy making photon and waves a unified collection, but the two are separate entities so that we can apply Maxwell's equations and quantum mechanics equations separately.
Hello, are you referring to visible light or the '''light'' that traverses through the space between objects?


Hi, all kinds of EM waves including visible light.
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guest39538

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #14 on: 28/09/2018 21:08:56 »
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 20:42:21

Hi, all kinds of EM waves including visible light.

When we consider light, I personally like to define it as two categories, namely visible light and invisible light.

Visible light :

Quote
The frequency of visible light is referred to as color, and ranges from 430 trillion hertz, seen as red, to 750 trillion hertz,


 Invisible light is outside of those frequencies and cannot be observed/seen directly by human sight although some animals can observe/see some frequencies outside of that range,  such as infra red .  Additionally , our own ingenuity has allowed us to produce technology that can detect some of these unseen frequencies.

I consider a wave may possibly be  a field fluctuation caused by photons traversing  through that field. Otherwise, a field would have no causality to fluctuate to be wave like , a waves ''characteristics'' are flowing energy. 












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Offline Yahya (OP)

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #15 on: 28/09/2018 22:52:11 »
Quote from: Thebox on 28/09/2018 21:08:56
a waves ''characteristics'' are flowing energy. 
A wave occur in continuous field , however photons are discrete
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #16 on: 29/09/2018 00:10:31 »
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 20:04:30
Quote from: Bored chemist on 28/09/2018 18:54:26
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 10:06:39
Photon is neutrally charged.
Nobody said (or implied) that it isn't.
If the two are one thing how does a neutrally charged photon gives electric properties to the EM waves?
Thanks for pinpointing the limits of your understanding.
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 20:32:18
How light is both photons and EM waves if the two are completely different ?
They are not different.
They are the same thing.
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 20:32:18
Photon is absolute energy ,
What do you consider that phrase to mean?
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Online Colin2B

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Re: Does light consist of both waves and photons?
« Reply #17 on: 29/09/2018 22:27:11 »
Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 20:32:18
... absolute energy
Doesn’t exist, except in the minds of those who do not understand basic physics.

Quote from: Yahya on 28/09/2018 22:52:11
A wave occur in continuous field
Tell that to a bat!
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