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  1. Naked Science Forum
  2. On the Lighter Side
  3. That CAN'T be true!
  4. How can academia tolerate such error?
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How can academia tolerate such error?

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Offline paul cotter (OP)

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How can academia tolerate such error?
« on: 23/12/2022 16:01:14 »
A tenured professor of electrical engineering in  Germany applies ∇Χ∇Χ to the electric field, E and arrives at the following vector identity: grad div E -∇sqE. He then states that the term grad div E represents the "scalar wave" and proceeds to sell expensive but basic kits that supposedly demonstrate these "scalar waves". However div E=0 in a charge free zone( ie free space ) so grad0 is also 0. This individual also states that an ice can be run on water as fuel if ozone is added. I am dumbfounded. PS I apologise for alternating between the del operator and grad, div as I cannot get consistent use of symbols on this computer/operating system.
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Offline Zer0

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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #1 on: 19/01/2023 17:37:54 »
It That Gentleman still in Business?
(Current Professor or long retired)

Are We referring to a considerably Old Senior Citizen?
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Offline paul cotter (OP)

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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #2 on: 27/02/2023 11:40:18 »
ZerO, apologies, I missed your reply( I have been in my hibernation phase ). As far as I know he is still active, ie not an emeritus prof.
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Offline Bored chemist

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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #3 on: 27/02/2023 18:19:34 »
Academia has to tolerate people who make absurd errors.
Sometimes they turn out to be right. :-)
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Offline Eternal Student

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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #4 on: 28/02/2023 02:59:16 »
Hi.

Quote from: paul cotter on 23/12/2022 16:01:14
He then states that the term grad div E represents the "scalar wave"
   Grad  (of a thing) is always a vector not a scalar.   So on the face of it I would be concerned about it being called the "scalar wave"  - but I haven't looked at exactly what this professor did.

Quote from: paul cotter on 23/12/2022 16:01:14
PS I apologise for alternating between the del operator and grad, div as I cannot get consistent use of symbols on this computer/operating system.
   Obviously what you have done is OK anyway.    However, if you ever really wanted some mathematical notation then it can be done on any computer with any keyboard (e.g. a mobile phone)  if you use  LaTeX coding.   I'll put all of this under a pull-down spoiler, since it's not essential for the original post or reply.

Spoiler: show

You have probably noticed already that this forum software places something you want to appear in BOLD  inside  tags.   One very useful set of tags is the start and end     tex    tags because everything between those will be processed as LaTex.

This code produces  some usefull stuff:

Code: [Select]
"Del" or "nabla"  symbols are called with a "backslash" \  and the text "nabla" written straight after it   like this   [tex]  \nabla    [/tex]
Most special LaTex sybols are called with the backslash \ in front but note that a forward slash / MUST be used in the end tex tag.

Vectors with the arrow over the top   [tex] \vec{A}   [/tex].      Vectors as underlined characters    [tex] \underline{A}  [/tex]

The times symbol [tex] \times [/tex]  looks neater than using a letter  [tex] X [/tex]  for multiplication or vector cross products.

Write the curl of a vector like this  [tex] \nabla \times \vec{A}  [/tex]    but I prefer underlined vectors [tex] \nabla \times \underline{A} [/tex]

Exponentials can be done with the ^ character. So the Laplacian operator is written as   [tex] \nabla^2  [/tex]
   
Just type that directly into the forum reply box and you will get this produced when you hit  "preview" or "post":

                - - - - - - - - - -
"Del" or "nabla"  symbols are called with a "backslash" \  and the text "nabla" written straight after it   like this   b37b7040ed4e4327c6fa4caf45cd78b3.gif
Most special LaTex sybols are called with the backslash \ in front but note that a forward slash / MUST be used in the end tex tag.

Vectors with the arrow over the top   d38c9970e1e7e9972031f58542c2f2dc.gif.      Vectors as underlined characters    02cfce931baac09a6357dca0b8a41aff.gif

The times symbol 19af21bb9b4b023be42204a69025e8bd.gif  looks neater than using a letter  1d453013429955e91f67836f27a9b9f8.gif  for multiplication or vector cross products.

Write the curl of a vector like this  b86242f1ecd11a5be188296acab13928.gif    but I prefer underlined vectors 9e333c376188d98f6d7f7b8c34cb2ba2.gif

Exponentials can be done with the ^ character. So the Laplacian operator is written as   12edd046f6088b908ccf89e4c0acae8a.gif
 - - - - - - -  - -  -


   Back to your original post:

   The identity   3b61fdee0eafb3fe45b9c368aeb5f836.gif      will hold for any sensible  vector  E.
   See half-way down the page here:   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vector_calculus_identities#Second_derivative_identities

By sensible vector, I mean it's smooth enough - all the derivatives you would want actually do exist.   You could have deliberately chosen a vector that had some discontinuity in some first derivatives if you wanted to invalidate that identity.
Note also that the operator ∇2 on the right hand side is understood to be the vector Laplacian  (it acts on a vector to produce another vector).   Assuming E is the electric field and satisfies Maxwell's equations then you automatically have most of what you'll need to be confident the vector function is smooth enough for that identity to hold.   I haven't spent too long looking at it but it seems you would have to be deliberately trying hard to find a most unusual E field if you wanted to defeat that vector identity - so we'll just go along with the assumption the vector identity will hold.

   So nothing much is wrong with what that professor said to this point.   The only bit, as I said previously, that concerns me is the terminology "scalar wave".   That's not terminology I'm familiar with and the thing isn't a scalar, it would be a vector.

   Just from Maxwell's equations,  we have Grad(E) = 0 in free space without any charges exactly as you stated,  so yes  all of what he/she is calling the "scalar wave" would become a 0 vector there.    I'm going to assume the professor knows that and their  "scalar wave" idea is only interesting in regions where there are charges.   Overall impression  --->  I wouldn't be rushing off to find out what the professor was trying to say (or sell) based on what you have written.   

    As regards the fuel thing.   "An ice" can have a meaning other than the usual solid water ice.   Here's an example:
     In astrophysics and planetary science the term "ices" refers to volatile chemical compounds with freezing points above about 100 K, such as water, ammonia, or methane, with freezing points of 273 K (0°C), 195 K (−78°C), and 91 K (−182°C), respectively (see Volatiles).           [Extract from Wikipedia:     https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_giant ]
     Without reading the full details,  maybe their ice thing could work.

Best Wishes.
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Offline paul cotter (OP)

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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #5 on: 28/02/2023 12:37:57 »
Internal combustion engine=ice. I am sorry for any confusion, I should not be using abbreviations that may be misunderstood. PS, as explained to ZerO I haven't fully emerged from my annual hibernation phase.
« Last Edit: 28/02/2023 12:42:36 by paul cotter »
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Offline Zer0

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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #6 on: 02/03/2023 22:44:43 »
Quote from: Bored chemist on 27/02/2023 18:19:34
Academia has to tolerate people who make absurd errors.
Sometimes they turn out to be right. :-)

You got any fun or entertaining Evidences?
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Offline paul cotter (OP)

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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #7 on: 04/03/2023 10:59:12 »
ZerO, check out dr Dolores Cahill, one of our own academics who fell down the rabbit hole and has not been able to extricate herself yet. 
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Re: How can academia tolerate such error?
« Reply #8 on: 04/03/2023 20:46:47 »
What if an Expert who suffered thru Serious Covid - 19 & never truly recovered from it's negative mental side effects goes onto make illogical statements...

Should people suffering thru Brain Fog be held accountable for what they say & do?

I'm observing something similar with Senior Citizens lately, they say absurd stuff n act crazy.
But undecided on whether i should view Them as Culprits or Victims?
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