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On the Lighter Side => New Theories => Topic started by: nitshar on 10/07/2020 07:30:43

Title: Brief Idea: Proof that Time travel proved a massive misconception.
Post by: nitshar on 10/07/2020 07:30:43

I am starting with inertial reference frames, i.e, that do not accelerate and they move at a constant rate to one another as described in special theory of relativity. In this paper, I will start with the most basic equation which is misunderstood.
I am taking Resnick and Halliday, the very basic book that a large number of physicists and students start their understanding of relativity because as the concept is misunderstood, if you won’t start from the start, you won’t be able to understand the misunderstanding at all.
The chapter on relativity in this book is the base of theory of relativity and it is from here that the misconception spread so wide that physicists waste their precious time in finding new theories, like parallel dimensions, etc to find the ways of time travel.
So, if you started your research and studies with a WRONG UNDERSTANDING OF THE BASE, which is proved in this explanation. And if you started with a wrong understanding of the base, I can DOUBT THE CLAIMS OF YOUR FURTHER THEORIES.

Δ𝑡'=Δ𝑡/√1−(𝑣/𝑐)²  or,
Δ𝑡=γΔ𝑡, where γ is Lorentz factor.

Einstein’s time equation as depicted above, was given to accurately measure the differences in clocks as observed during relative motion of flights and GPS, so that we can understand how much actual time difference occurred and we can adjust the time in our clocks accordingly to perform our experiments.
This is the actual purpose of this equation.
However, physicists misunderstood and mistook the difference in time in devices during motion for time travel in future and past.

In this example, I will prove that the experiment used to derive this equation is misunderstood.
Note: I am not saying Einstein’s calculations are wrong. I am saying they are misunderstood and misinterpreted to give a false idea to humans that they can travel in time.

Problem Based on Misunderstanding of the Equation. (Resnick, Halliday, Page 928)
Your spaceship passes Earth with a relative speed of 0.9990c. After travelling 10.0 y (your time), you stop at lookout post LP13, turn and then travel back to earth with the same relative speed. The trip back takes another 10.0 y (your time). How long does the round trip take according to measurements made on Earth?
Misinterpreted Solution: (As Explained in the Book)
Key Ideas:
1. This problem involves measurements made from two (inertial) reference frames, one attached to Earth and the other attached to your ship.
2. The outward trip involves two events: the start of the trip at Earth and the end of the trip at LP13.
3. Your measurement of 10 y for the outward trip is the proper time Δ𝑡 between those two events, because the events occurred at the same location in your reference frame, namely on your ship.
4. The Earth frame measurement of the time interval Δ𝑡' for the outward trip must be greater than Δ𝑡, according to the basic equation of time dilation.
Using the basic equation of time dilation, Δ𝑡'=Δ𝑡/√1−(𝑣/𝑐)²
Δ𝑡=10.0𝑦/√1−(0.9990𝑐/𝑐)² = 22.37 x 10.0 y = 224 y
On the return trip, we have the same situation and the same data. Thus the round trip requires 20 y of your time,
Δ𝑡' (total) =2 x 224 𝑦 = 448 𝑦
Of Earth time. In other words, you have aged 20 y while the Earth has aged 448 y. Although you cannot travel into the past, you can travel into the future of, say, Earth, by using high speed relative motion to adjust the rate at which time passes.
Now, you may be wondering where is the glitch?
How is the time equation misunderstood?
To understand this, let’s have a look at the experiment to understand the meaning of this equation again.

In this experiment, look at the use of time and what is moving?
In the first diagram, the light signal is sent to the mirrors at rest.
In the second diagram, a light signal is sent from a moving object and received after a certain time.
So, here is the misunderstanding.
In the second diagram, the light takes a longer route while reaching the mirror and after a certain time Δ𝑡′ the signal is received by the object (say, spaceship).
Now, this means that the spaceship will have to cover a distance for the same time interval Δ𝑡′ in order to receive the signal and therefore, it is used in calculation to make a perfect Pythagorean triangle.
However, it is highly unlikely that a spaceship will be able to reach the point to receive the light signal because of its reduced speed limit.
Now, what is misunderstood is that it is not the human age which is increasing or decreasing. But it is the time taken by the light signal to receive by the object.

If you will look another time at the experiment, you will find that this is the very first and basic experiment of time dilation. In this experiment, suppose B is the Earth and A is the spaceship.
Now if the spaceship will send a signal at rest position, perpendicularly, the light signal will take time interval Δ𝑡.
Now when the ship is moving in a certain direction and it sends a signal to earth, it will receive the signal after Δ𝑡′.
If we take the data from the example problem above, the spaceship which sent signals to earth according to the clocks in its reference frames,
1. If it would have sent the light signal from a rest position, the signal would have been received by it in 20 years.
2. If it would have sent the light signal from a moving position, it would receive the signal after 448 years because the signal took a longer path to reach it

It doesn’t mean that men will age 20 or 448 years will pass on earth.
It means that the light signal will take different time to receive at the spaceship.
And I can say in these 448 years, many generations of man will pass away in the spaceship irrespective of their biological and atomic clocks being affected due to acceleration (if we ignore the effect of gravity in this case).


When a massive scale misconception occurs, humans do not accept it. For example,
1. Geocentric theory was once very popular among humans. And we know that earlier philosophers claiming Heliocentric theory were condemned. It took around many hundred years to correct human psychology.
2. Gods and Ghosts do not exist but every human is instilled with the concept since their childhood, and also, this concept is also a massive scale misconception that even people will take your life away if you speak against them.

If we look into the origin, we will find that the concept of time travel is instilled in the human mind from ancient stories in religious texts (religion is instilled in human mind since childhood) and from the 1895 novel of HG Wells.
Whereas, there is a pattern in old religious stories that humans travelled ahead in time and during their time travel they were either away from earth or they were unconscious.
HG Wells popularized the idea during the surge of science fiction novels during the eighteenth century. It was a time when people even believed such stories. For example, multiple letters landed at Bakers Street, London for Sherlock Holmes. So a fiction idea popularized during a hundred years and a misunderstood equation of Modern Physics instilled and firmed the idea in human psychology.

After a comatose person wakes up, he is often unaware of the time passed and he often expresses his surprise that month or years have passed.
Similarly, if ancient people felt unconscious due to toxic or denser air (atmospheric pressure) of a cave and woke up after a certain period of time, he would feel that he was only sleeping for a night when a month passed in the outside world. So, he would claim that he had travelled in time instead of saying that he was unconscious for a month.

No, but understand what is time and time travel.
Time is not what the clock reads. The clock reads quantitative time which can delay under the effect of gravity and acceleration and even can stop.
Time is the collective motion of all the elementary particles in the entire universe. A second timeline can only be created if you stop the motion of all the particles in the universe.
And when you talk of time travel, you actually talk of stopping or slowing down the motion of these Particles WHICH IS POSSIBLE UNDER HEAVY GRAVITY ZONES OR IN ACCELERATED MOTION.
So, for people under high gravity zones or acceleration, the clocks, mechanical, digital, atomic and even biological clocks will move slower.
This can help in hibernation for Astronauts during long space journeys without aging.

As I have proved above that the very basic equation is misunderstood by the physics community and has gained the status of massive misconception among humans and instilled in their minds so firmly that they gave multiple theories without even researching the origin and psychology of human minds.
But hope now you will understand why there are so many paradoxes in the concept of reverse time travel.
Real physical and natural phenomena don’t have paradoxes.

And with this, I bet that even after a million years, a hundred minds like Einstein would not be able to find the way of reverse travel, no matter how advanced they become in science and technology.

And as the idea is already a misconception, there is no need to research further in theories, yet I would like to describe a few paradoxes for your understanding.

Physicists think that faster than light travel can help them to send signals to the past. But suppose, you schedule a signal to be sent at 10 o’ clock and the signal is received 15 minutes earlier at 9:45 am, and then, you do not send the signal as it was scheduled. How will you justify the signal received?

The major goal of reverse time travel is to reverse the disasters, like world wars, Titanic, pandemics. But even today, we can see that these disasters exist in our history.
If time travel is discovered in the future in the next centuries, why are they not reversing the disasters?
Because future doesn't exist already. What we move on in time becomes the future.
You can give reasons of déjà vu that future exists, but déjà vu itself is proved to be a glitch in human brain.

You will give an excuse of another timeline, but as I have already proved that the whole idea is misunderstood so the next theories arising for this idea are baseless.

It is not time that is illusive, but it is the human mind.
Humans will not accept a long existing misconception even if they are shown the proof. And it will take them another hundred years to accept the content of this paper of mine. But I fear that by then a hundred of good physicists, like RL Mallet, Brain Green etc. will waste their precious time and life running after a Mirror of Erised, instead of spending their time on human welfare.

Nitish Sharma
Vernal Books
Delhi, India.
Title: Re: Brief Idea: Proof that Time travel proved a massive misconception.
Post by: Alex Dullius Siqueira on 11/07/2020 22:02:02
Time is but a tool humans invented to comprehend, a concept. Obviously it can be used and interpreted, tough I usually consider time, outside of my living consciousness, as a non existent thing from anyone observing from outside in the universe or any experiment with time...
Title: Re: Brief Idea: Proof that Time travel proved a massive misconception.
Post by: Alex Dullius Siqueira on 11/07/2020 22:09:26
time "feels" more like a monitor framerate, a frame subjected to the next frame, always adapting the screen to match the conditions of the next would be frame... The speed or rate being determinate by gravity in correlation with photon, C.
  For what matters, again, feeling, that for time travel to the past one has to find a way to be away from C as possible, stooped and frozen in time... I imagine it would require a field to mess with micro and macro scale, some device able to involve itself away from the tick, and by doing so kind of instantly emerge at one of the previous C frames...
Title: Re: Brief Idea: Proof that Time travel proved a massive misconception.
Post by: Alex Dullius Siqueira on 11/07/2020 22:47:19
for what my perception of time tells me, travel back in time in a universe where every frame is erased and updated at C tick, would mean probably move to space and perhaps hit the face on Jupiter, or emptiness, meaning time traveling back in time = Re surging where earth was on that period in time... Universe seems to have everything but absolutely no memory... turn of the C tick and all that is instantly cease to exist... it would be required multiple dimensions for universe have memory and the rules would be much more flexible... The laws are unbreakable fro a reason.... One would need to jump outside the universe and it's influence.. out there could be a possible universal frame frozen in time from the exterior, and then reenter back or forwards on it... that's why I suggested that one need to be apart of C as possible, not speeding up but slowing down by hiding or masking your mass with energy field, negative energy... or by getting out of it... both scenarios would require universe to have memory for it's energy, it seems only to have instant memory of it's mass, planets, straight lines only, always moving forward towards the beginning, much as any planet orbiting a sun, always a straight line, only messed up by gravity elongating it, delaying it, reshaping C into motion, that seems to be local when in fact is but a well twisted still straight lines, so twisted, that it starts to make possible the occurrence of so many straight lines, leading to the formation of different particles, all of them based on conditions and derivation from the same original one, pre-gravity... gravity seems to be related with mass and caused by BHs, so often that is easy to guess that the universe is but a ever unfolding black hole on a ring shape, compressing height as it expands width... and inside of it, every local mass providing a sub category, a replica of that patterns, creating sub versions of the main singularity at the edge... I don't think it's changing or anything, only breathing like a lung,compressing, twisting, expanding, always one in accordance to the other... there's got to be a exterior dimension, that would be just as the local solar system or a black hole, or the universe itself... Leading always to the gut feeling that we are inside a massive universal black hole, so large that it was forced to delay it's center so many "frames" away from C that the interior calmed down and reformed, and also everything in it was patterned with it's signature motion, energy, the length of the C frame "time"... Still point is, traveling in time from earth with Jupiter on the past, would mean crash into Jupiter, if Jupiter was occurring on that location in time, at that instant, on that future frame... meaning traveling, useful, has meaning, can be measure, but not so much different than a rocket... and even if ll that was possible, one would need to have a fixed reference to do so, a A beacon would have to be left there under almost the same conditions as te traveling device, stooped outside of C, coming in just long enough to send signals and fading out again... if one could track that immobile beacon, you could move instantly to that frame in tie or very close to it...  if mass would not be a problem, planets would serve as stations for the jumps...nothing would age faster or slower, only the traveler would not age... and I guess it would take as much time to travel stooped at minus C that would take to speed up at C plus... if you could jump to outside of C, could also be the case that distances would be something different, the correct engine could propel the device as a personal would be universe in behavior, with different speed, ahead on the now observable (calculable) universal YXZ and perhaps reenter from another spot... on this scenario alone one could travel in time for it would be away from C influence observing a frozen universal frame... Happens that I consider being away from C as being stopped and negative speed of C... that would instantly let you travel trough space at C on the opposite direction of the flow. the same way you could come back to earth t the correct period on... as for the question:  Time can't exist on the past, for universe has no memory, max one would be able to go back in time is "1 C frame" and even that would be compensated by the laws, perhaps increasing or decreasing your energy, don't sound pleasant, pretty certain to escape forcefully C influence for a fraction of C, without a protective field... would make your cease to exist due the lack of gravity...
Title: Re: Brief Idea: Proof that Time travel proved a massive misconception.
Post by: Halc on 11/07/2020 23:55:08
Not quite a word-salad.  More of a word-fruitcake I think, dense and impenetrable.
I'll opt to re-gift it rather than attempt to digest it.
Title: Re: Brief Idea: Proof that Time travel proved a massive misconception.
Post by: evan_au on 12/07/2020 00:02:59
Even in New Theories, we ask that all threads be titled as a question.

Please update the title using the "Actions -> modify" menu - what question are you trying to answer?

Evan - moderator
Title: Re: Brief Idea: Proof that Time travel proved a massive misconception.
Post by: Alex Dullius Siqueira on 12/07/2020 06:54:30
Well, not my native language, but the short version would be:
  Time traveling into the past on our universe is like:
1-Stand over a moving car that is moving at C.
2-Turning the device on, would mean to start to slow down yourself.
3-You would find yourself standing in the middle of nowhere, on a physical place on space were the car did pass, still, the frame were you arrived there is a future frame of that physical location on space.
  There couldn't possible be the past, it would have to be stored somewhere, it isn't.
 We are tied to a self updating present frame, there's no time outside this frame, only the next frame.
 One could say tat the universe exist and doesn't exist for a fraction of C it simple cease, still space has energy enough to drag the whole along with it into the next frame, so it must perpetuate, and that seems to be granted by mass and gravity... without both we are just what we are anyway, a frozen frame of energy moving on a straight line, tied to a ever moving car that only exist on that moment, and once it has passed the marker, nothing have ever existed, the road, the car, the marker, nor you and or I.

4-Time traveling machine = A fancy ship to travel(stay still/suspended), conveniently, at minus C.
 Not as a negative speed, but as long as you don't have enough energy to drag the car, the road, and the whole local frame with you, they will keep going along with the universe, while you stay still...

 As for my point of view, Even the frames that took to type this never existed, as this one is instantly erased as long as gravity is out there.

 The daily time travel example is way shorter:
1- Standing over the moving car.
2- Jump, and as you do borrow the atmosphere to reduce your speed till you are slower than the moving car.
3-Crash into the asphalt, now, see that moving car? That's the future you traveled away from...
 You did traveled back in space, to a future frame of time, were you are, also future frame in time where the car is..
Close your eyes for 3 seconds and open them:
 See that bird that you would have seeing if your eyes were open?
 Happens that your sight "traveled back in time".

 I suspect that if Jupiter was to flyby near earth right now, earth would travel back in time.
 Earth takes 24 hours to travel back in time around the sun...

 See where I'm going with this?

 Turn off all gravity and consequentially all mass: Banggggg...* (now elongate the g endlessly inside a frozen frame the size of the universe) there would be no universe, no particles fading on directions away, there would be no away from... Gravity would simple slowly be again, collapse everything and reset...