Naked Science Forum

Life Sciences => Physiology & Medicine => Topic started by: thedoc on 13/09/2013 23:39:48

Title: Why do head injuries make us "see stars"?
Post by: thedoc on 13/09/2013 23:39:48

What causes us to "see stars" when we bash our heads? I also notice the same phenomenon when I stand up suddenly and feel light-headed when blood pools in my legs. This is especially confusing, since the two "stimuli" operate by different mechanisms: a blow to the head versus a brief episode of hypotension. I'm embarrassed to admit that I don't know the answer, even though I've been a professor of ophthalmology for 35 years! It would be better to ask a neurologist or neuro-scientist.
Asked by John Gamel


                                        Visit the webpage for the podcast in which this question is answered. (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/podcasts/naked-scientists/show/20120617/)

[chapter podcast=4007 track=12.06.17/Naked_Scientists_Show_12.06.17_10338.mp3](https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenakedscientists.com%2FHTML%2Ftypo3conf%2Fext%2Fnaksci_podcast%2Fgnome-settings-sound.gif&hash=f2b0d108dc173aeaa367f8db2e2171bd)  ...or Listen to the Answer[/chapter] or [download as MP3] (http://nakeddiscovery.com/downloads/split_individual/12.06.17/Naked_Scientists_Show_12.06.17_10338.mp3)

Title: Why do head injuries make us "see stars"?
Post by: thedoc on 13/09/2013 23:39:48

We answered this question on the show...

I think both of [these situations] are basically artificial phenomena in a sense that in one case; the [img float=right]/forum/copies/RTEmagicC_NASA-WMAP-first-stars_02.jpg.jpg[/img]standing up too quickly, this is an entoptic phenomenon – something going on inside the eyeball.  The retina, as you'll know as an ophthalmologist, has one of the highest metabolic rates of any tissue in the body. 
The brain and central nervous system tissue burns off about 20% of the energy that you consume in any given moment in time and it contributes only a fraction of body mass.  So it’s very metabolically hungry. 
And if you stand up too quickly then you have what's called a postural drop.  The blood that's coming up from your legs into your heart to then get pumped around the body, the perfusion pressure drops just briefly when you're standing up and before your heart compensates, and that causes there to be a momentary reduction in perfusion to your retina.  That slightly reduces the supply of oxygen and sugar to the retina from the blood, and that causes the retina to start to fire off abnormal signals.  When you deprive the retina of the right blood flow then it starts to fire off these abnormal sparkly light signals, fooling the brain into thinking you're seeing light when it’s not there.
 Now conversely, when you bash your head, what's probably going on there is that because the brain is bobbing around inside your head in a fluid – the cerebrospinal fluid, and has a very wishy-washy consistency, a bit like blancmange.  If you have a sudden interruption of movement to your head – so you hit your head very hard against the wall or pavement, the brain then cannons inside the head into the front of your skull and then can rebound and hit the back of your skull as well.  And if you irritate the part of the brain that decodes what you're seeing – the visual cortex which is right at the back of your head – then it’s possible that in the same way that irritating the nerve cells in the retina by not having enough blood flow makes you see funny stars, it’s possible that you can also affect the brain cells directly at the back of the head.  I think probably that is responsible for triggering these funny stars that you see when you suffer a head injury.  But it’s an excellent question and thank you very much for asking it.

Title: Re: Why do head injuries make us
Post by: evan_au on 20/06/2012 10:44:15

Apart from the effects of oxygen deficit on the retina, phosphenes can also be caused by pressure such as rubbing your eyes, and some disease conditions.

Title: Re: Why do head injuries make us
Post by: chris on 21/06/2012 10:37:03

Agreed; but is this because, when you press on the eye, you raise the intra-ocular pressure and thus transiently alter perfusion, or because direct pressure triggers retinal discharges corresponding to the lights you experience?

Title: None
Post by: Mark on 31/08/2013 21:20:31

Pressure on the eyeball similar to glaucoma.  I didn't hit my head and I didn't stand up suddenly but have seen stars/areas where vision is gone. Could this be onset of glaucoma?  It goes away but I plan to have it checked out.

Title: None
Post by: Steve on 23/09/2013 23:21:01

You should try smoking some weed. I prefer bong hits.

Title: None
Post by: Bill Kilrain on 27/09/2013 18:39:35

I see stars when I blow my nose sometimes. Which category of the 2 described does this fall under?

Title: None
Post by: Amar Waheed on 18/10/2013 04:00:54

I think this happens with every one with different situations but one thing is confirm it doesnt happen frequently.I feel my self in such condition after very long interavals.

Title: None
Post by: Anonymous Friend on 19/11/2013 14:50:14

Can someone tell me why they call the brain stem the reptilian brain plz

Title: None
Post by: Bugguner on 14/03/2014 11:21:15

And if you jibber jab your optical seeres the it will cause blood tentionitis which will make your seekers see blinky jinkies, trust me I've been to the eye doctor once

Title: None
Post by: Naf on 04/02/2016 21:11:43

Low blood pressure due to dehydration or low cardio output can cause a person to get light headed or black out when standing suddenly.  Are you drinking 8 glasses of water per day or 1920 ml?  If you are drinking enough water per day, I would suggest an eye exam and a visit to the doc for a blood pressure exam.  (It is always good to get a check up once a year anyways. )   Now, the blowing nose and seeing stars issue makes me wonder about Inter Cranial Pressures and or Inter Ocular Pressure.  Which would still make me suggest an eye check up with dilation and a general practitioner appointment.

Title: None
Post by: Jon on 15/02/2016 21:32:08

http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/podcasts/show/20120617/

Title: None
Post by: WonderKid on 18/02/2016 02:12:49

I can see them all the time. They move around and bounce off of each other leaving trails of light. They even seem to be absorbed when we breath and by plants as well. The little dots of light come out when we dont breath deeply. I also see them when I look at the clear blue sky. Some people say I  can see the white globules moving around in my eye. I feel it is more than that.

Title: None
Post by: Joanne wareing on 27/02/2016 18:28:36

Why, when I was twelve weeks pregnant did my doc correctly diagnose anaemia then?

Title: None
Post by: StveH on 02/03/2016 13:18:25

Is it not like the Arthur c Clarke prediction that when people see ghosts they project a vision on the eye ball from the brain? I know that seems farfetched but could the stars be neurons in the brain being projected on to the eye ball, as they seem to be following a path as neurons seem to do so.

Title: None
Post by: Grant on 08/03/2016 15:08:09

This explains the paths the spots move along https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_field_entoptic_phenomenon

Title: None
Post by: Toker on 18/05/2016 17:28:27

Smoke weed everyday.

Title: None
Post by: Wile E Coyote on 29/05/2016 14:12:35

I saw stars when I fell off a cliff.

Title: None
Post by: 27-5555 on 10/06/2016 10:25:44

I see them when I do cartwheels sometimes, but also when I'm just sitting still and have been for a while. I find that when I stand up my vision blacks out, I get dizzy and sometimes fall over and I sometimes can't feel things properly.