Naked Science Forum

Non Life Sciences => Chemistry => Topic started by: Geezer on 29/05/2012 18:56:16

Title: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: Geezer on 29/05/2012 18:56:16
What can I use to remove the cloudy deposit on the inside of my "sealed pane" windows when the seal has failed and moisture gets in? I will drill two holes at opposite corners of the outer pane so that I can flush and vent the space.

I was thinking a mixture of vinegar and distilled water, possibly followed by an alcohol flush to dry it out. Would that work?
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: imatfaal on 29/05/2012 19:21:48
First off check there is no "lifetime guarantee".  I had to buy my father a bottle of wine on this problem  - his patio doors were misted inside sealed pane, he said he was gonna claim on the warranty (at least 15 maybe 20 years after installation), big mouth here said that I would buy him a bottle if he got anywhere with the manufacturer.  Two weeks later they had replaced them free gratis and for nuffink!
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: Geezer on 29/05/2012 19:45:38
Alas! They were installed in 1995 when the house was built, so it's unlikely. I'm not even sure who made them, but I'll do a bit of digging.

I already vented one soon after it started leaking and before the deposit formed, and it works fine, although I did notice some really small insects got inside, so I ought to plug the holes with something.
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: CliffordK on 29/05/2012 23:06:48
I believe the blue stuff is a mix of water and ammonia, and some colorant, so that might be worth trying.  If you can fill with an inert (dry) gas and reseal, that might be preferable.  Do you have a MIG/TIG welding outfit?

In Mom & Dad's house, several windows had cracked and leaked shortly after the install.  I believe about 10+ years after the installation they decided to get them repaired.  Some of the windows apparently had obvious signs of nails from the manufacturing process of the window frame striking the glass (original manufacturing, not installation).  I believe those were replaced under warranty.  I don't know if the other windows were also replaced.  They eventually upgraded some of the Southern exposure windows to aluminum clad wood frame windows.
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: Geezer on 29/05/2012 23:19:40
They appear to be Jenweld - made in Oregon!

I have contacted Jenweld customer support - they didn't burst out laughing, so that's an encouraging sign at least.

No *IG welders I'm afraid. Just oxyacetelene, wire feed and, coincidentally, I just received today a big red Lincoln AC/DC stick welder from Home Depot via UPS. Unfortunately, it had been dropped (which isn't exactly surprising 'cos it's blinking heavy). I think the damage is all cosmetic, so I called HD customer support and negotiated a 20% discount. That brought the price down to $320, which ain't too shabby!
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: imatfaal on 30/05/2012 15:17:01
Good Luck with Jenweld - look on it as a challenge! 
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: CZARCAR on 02/06/2012 19:52:38
windex MAKES A chemical that seems somewhat self cleaning, 4 exterior surfaces via sprayer/hose
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: CZARCAR on 02/06/2012 19:57:22
blow steam into the lower hole? WITH DISTILLED WATER
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: chris on 13/01/2018 10:13:33
What are the white deposits that form on the insides of double glazing? It's a sort of bloom; I've had some windows with it. I assumed that they "blown" (leaked) and it must be some sort of microbial / fungal growth. Am I right?
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: wolfekeeper on 13/01/2018 16:41:02
You're generally better off replacing them; the gas in them acts as an insulator, when they've degassed the insulation value drops enormously and you'd often be spending more on heating than the cost of the window.
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: evan_au on 13/01/2018 21:40:19
Quote from: wolfekeeper
the gas in them acts as an insulator
Apparently they often use Argon for this purpose (a bit of trivia I picked up from reading my Christmas present - a book on the periodic table...)
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: Bored chemist on 13/01/2018 22:36:15
You're generally better off replacing them; the gas in them acts as an insulator, when they've degassed the insulation value drops enormously and you'd often be spending more on heating than the cost of the window.
Air is about 45% better at conducting heat than argon.
It's not a huge effect.
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: evan_au on 14/01/2018 07:25:27
Quote from: BoredChemist
Air is about 45% better at conducting heat than argon.
Could you explain why this occurs, please?

Is it to do with the additional degrees of freedom for motion of a diatomic molecule (Oxygen & Nitrogen), compared to monatomic Argon?
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: Bored chemist on 14/01/2018 10:50:33
Quote from: BoredChemist
Air is about 45% better at conducting heat than argon.
Could you explain why this occurs, please?

Is it to do with the additional degrees of freedom for motion of a diatomic molecule (Oxygen & Nitrogen), compared to monatomic Argon?
The short answers are
I can explain it, but not as well as, for example, this
http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/tong/kintheory/kt.pdf
and the simple answer is yes, each diatomic molecule carries more heat and they also move more quickly.
Xenon would be even better than argon but it's eye-wateringly expensive.
A vacuum would be really good, but the forces on the window panes would be enormous.

There's probably a limit where radiative heat transfer dominates.
Title: Re: How can I remove the cloudy deposits on the insides of my sealed pane windows?
Post by: glot on 10/02/2018 01:02:49
Most likely caused by silicone sealants used during manufacture and not enough time allowed for curing before assembly. If they are a quality product, the manufacturer will know about the issue and if reputable, replace or rectify them. Your local laws may also require them to do so.