[Slickscientist (OP)]

Dear all,
I am not sure if this topic belongs here, but I will give it a try.

There was a post on https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=81038.0 that asked if there were any religious past predictions that have been fulfilled. I searced up on this and found two examples. Are these just chance, or deeper?

1) The Prophet ﷺ is reported to have said, ‘Verily you shall conquer Constantinople. What a wonderful leader will her leader be, and what a wonderful army will that army be!’ [Musnad Ahmad, Al-Hakim, al Jami’ al Saghir]¹ This has happened in 1453, but it could also be referring to the predicted future 'takeover'.

2)Michele de Nostredame, better known as Nostradamus, was the 16th-century physician and supposed seer, who has fascinated conspiracy theorists with his predictions for decades. Nostradamus' followers believe the French mystic predicted the rise of Adolf Hitler to power in 1933 as well as the Great Fire of London in 1666. Many also believe Nostradamus predicted the outbreak of the coronavirus pandemic.² He wrote,
“Near the gates and within two cities
“There will be two scourges the like of which was never seen,
“Famine within plague, people put out by steel,
“Crying to the great immortal God for relief.”

What do you think about these predictions? Can you shed some light on them? Do you have any other examples?

[Colin2B]

From what I’ve seen of Nostradamus’s writings they are so vague you could apply them to many happenings and that is true of the ones you have quoted.

[Slickscientist (OP)]

From what I’ve seen of Nostradamus’s writings they are so vague you could apply them to many happenings and that is true of the ones you have quoted.

Very true. This is used as a time filler for online gossipers/tabloids. What do you think of the other prediction?

Forgotten to list references:
¹= https://seekersguidance.org/answers/hadith/has-the-hadith-regarding-the-muslims-conquest-of-constantinople-been-fulfilled/, ²= https://www.express.co.uk/news/weird/1260158/Nostradamus-2020-predictions-true-coronavirus-COVID19-l

[Bored chemist]

Verily you shall conquer Constantinople.

Eventually, someone was bound to do so.
City leaders come and go.

“Near the gates and within two cities

If it had affected only 2 cities the rest of us would be a lot happier. The "gates" make even less sense

“Famine within plague,

There isn't really a famine.
Some people have effectively stolen more than their fair share of what is available.
This was happening long before this latest pandemic. It will (alas)  continue after the pandemic has finished.

, people put out by steel,

That hardly means anything.

“Crying to the great immortal God for relief.”

That's what people do when they are in trouble.
It's hardly a mystical prediction.
It's like "predicting" that people will drink when they are thirsty.


Essentially, what you have there is a  nice example of what's sometimes called "The canals on Mars effect"

There are no canals on Mars.
But with a fuzzy picture through a primitive telescope, your brain takes the limited information available and tries to fit it to some sort of pattern. The problem is that the brain does this, even when there is no pattern there.

Much of the time, this is a valuable skill- because we seldom have perfect information, but we need to be able to work out wat is going on in the world. And we live in a world where things often follow patterns.

Sometimes it goes wrong and we see patterns that are not there.

The commonest of these is that we see things happening which we do not understand.
Often, when we see things happening  it is because someone (or some animal) is making them happen.
So, when we see something we wonder if some "invisible" someone is responsible for making it happen.
Obviously, the "invisible someone" is mysterious and powerful.

Did you ever wonder where God came from?
Well, perhaps  you now know.

[Slickscientist (OP)]

Now that's what I call analysis. Well done!

[Bored chemist]

Now that's what I call analysis. Well done!

Thanks, but I will make a couple of observations.
It's not original- I read it somewhere.
There was nothing to stop you working it out for yourself.

[Colin2B]

, people put out by steel,

That hardly means anything.

I suspect it means driven out of the cities using swords

[alancalverd]

Or railways.

[Slickscientist (OP)]

Now that's what I call analysis. Well done!

Thanks, but I will make a couple of observations.
It's not original- I read it somewhere.
There was nothing to stop you working it out for yourself.

I know, I just want to see peoples' reactions.

I think Muhammed said that because many(23 off the top of my head) armies tried to conquer Constantinople, but only one will succeed. He had a vision that Constantinople will be conquered by the Muslims. Also, the Quraan indirectly talks about the conquest of the city. I advise you to read this book about the religious history of the city from an Islamic view. It also talks about how it was a Christian city.
http://imranhosein.org/n/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/Constantinople-in-the-Quran.pdf

[Bored chemist]

If someone wanted to make an interesting prediction about Constantinople, why not predict that it would cease to exist in 1922?

He had a vision that Constantinople will be conquered by the Muslims.

This is like selling nuclear bomb shelters.
If it doesn't work, they customers don't come and complain.

As long as there are Muslims in the world, there is a possibility of them taking over Istanbul; so the prediction may still come true.
If there are no Muslims in the world, then nobody will remember what the Profit said.

[alancalverd]

Old story of the doctor who would confirm a pregnancy very early and say "and it will be a boy" long before ultrasound imaging. But he wrote""girl" in his diary against the due date. If it was a boy, mum would be delighted. If it was a girl, she would complain that she'd made her preparations on the doctor's prediction, whereupon he would produce his diary and say "you clearly misunderstood me".

[Bored chemist]

Old story of the doctor who would confirm a pregnancy very early and say "and it will be a boy" long before ultrasound imaging. But he wrote""girl" in his diary against the due date. If it was a boy, mum would be delighted. If it was a girl, she would complain that she'd made her preparations on the doctor's prediction, whereupon he would produce his diary and say "you clearly misunderstood me".

I knew of a similar one.
He would charge a fee for his "prediction". If he got it wrong, he gave a full refund...

[RD]

Essentially, what you have there is a  nice example of what's sometimes called "The canals on Mars effect"

There are no canals on Mars.
But with a fuzzy picture through a primitive telescope, your brain takes the limited information available and tries to fit it to some sort of pattern. The problem is that the brain does this, even when there is no pattern there ...

"Canals on Mars" may have been blood vessels on Percy's retina, rather than true pareidolia.

[Bored chemist]

"Canals on Mars" may have been blood vessels on Percy's retina, rather than true pareidolia.

Interesting, but the point is that whatever they were, they were not canals on Mars.

[Petrochemicals]

I predict that in the year 2999 there will be great trepidation of the time and any event may be construed as the end of the world. But it will just be like most other times in history, except for things like the black death ~1350ad~ or Tambora 1815.

[Slickscientist (OP)]

Good for you.

[Colin2B]

I also predict a change of US president. End of an error.

[Slickscientist (OP)]

Wow! So magical

[Yahya A.Sharif]

So why if Nostradamus is right he didn't write clear sentences than writing puzzles? Because nobody will understand his puzzles and he will fool his followers forever.

[evan_au]

Famine within plague

In the days when many cities were captured by siege, these two things often went together.
- Cut off from food supplies, there was a famine in the city
- With no fresh food, vitamin intake was too low, and diseases like scurvy took over
- So it may not have been an infectious plague (eg virus or bacterium), but it may have been a dietary problem

Of course, it could also go the other way - even without a siege, a plague could decimate the rural workforce, producing a famine.