Naked Science Forum

Non Life Sciences => Physics, Astronomy & Cosmology => Topic started by: Just thinking on 05/07/2021 11:47:25

Title: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 05/07/2021 11:47:25
If sound could travel through space would we hear the universe would the sun be so loud that I couldn't hear myself think? What would it sound like maybe an atomic explosion what do you think.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Eternal Student on 05/07/2021 12:45:37
Hi.

Obviously this can only be discussed in general terms.  There is no transmission of sound through a vaccum.

1.   Sound intensity falls off as the square of the distance from the source.   This is much the same as the way light intensity, or radioactivity or most other things lose intensity with distance.
   We cope with the light created by our sun when we are on earth, so we can assume that life would cope with the noise from the sun.

2.  Evolution plays a part.  Life should adapt to the background noise from the galaxy.  If it couldn't (perhaps because the sound pressure was just too high and would damage hearing structures) then hearing would not have evolved.

3.   We know that some mediums tend to carry sound of certain frequencies better than other frequencies.  For example, underwater things sound very different and the low frequency (bass) notes tend to be lost entirely.  Therefore, what the sun would sound like depends on the material where the noise is created and what it travels through to reach earth.  I can't really comment on this in any objective way since space is a vaccum.  I reckon if the space through which the sound travelled was like a thick syrup or honey then the sound would be pretty sweet.

Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 05/07/2021 12:55:04
I reckon if the space through which the sound travelled was like a thick syrup or honey then the sound would be pretty sweet.
Or if it travelled throw vinegar it would sound like my motherinlaw. Thanks for your reply.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Bored chemist on 05/07/2021 13:05:14
If sound could travel throw space
Well, sound can certainly travel.
How far do you want us to throw space?
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 05/07/2021 13:10:28
How far do you want us to throw spcae?
Thanks for that I fixed it.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Kryptid on 05/07/2021 20:35:15
The question doesn't really have a set answer. How sound travels depends upon the properties of the medium it is moving through. So the answer depends on what sound-transmitting properties you assign to your hypothetical version of space.

However, this website says that Sun would produce about 100 decibels at the distance of the Earth if you could hear it: https://www.audiology.org/how-loud-is-the-sun/

I'm not sure what assumptions were made in this calculation. Did they assume that space contains air at 1 atmosphere of pressure? Did they assume perfect energy transmission?
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: evan_au on 05/07/2021 23:05:02
One of those links at Stanford has recordings of sound from the Sun.
- Since sound doesn't travel through a vacuum, they were derived from Doppler shift of the light from the Sun's surface.
http://solar-center.stanford.edu/singing/SOUNDS/

When a gas has a lower density, the higher frequencies are more strongly attenuated.
- This is because the gas molecules collide less often, so they can't transfer high-frequency changes so quickly
- As I understand it, sounds are strongly attenuated if the sound wavelength is shorter than the Mean Free Path of molecules

What does reach us is the Solar wind, which is a pretty good vacuum, and yet it has swirls and eddies that are visible in the majestic changes of the aurora. But the frequency of these changes is far too low to be audible to humans - we really can't hear anything much below about 50Hz.

If you were actually on the Sun, in the vicinity of a Coronal Mass Ejection, I am sure that the sound would be like the sound of an atomic bomb going off... (ignoring little details like being instantly evaporated by the temperature, crushed by the surface gravity, squashed by the gas pressure and asphyxiated by the lack of oxygen...)
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 06/07/2021 00:09:56
I'm not sure what assumptions were made in this calculation. Did they assume that space contains air at 1 atmosphere of pressure? Did they assume perfect energy transmission?
They most probably calculated that as we hear sound in our atmosphere.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 06/07/2021 00:15:04
instantly evaporated by the temperature, crushed by the surface gravity, squashed by the gas pressure and asphyxiated by the lack of oxygen...)
There is one plus side you would get a real good suntan.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: geordief on 06/07/2021 00:48:04
I think Janus once  explained to me** that the wave motions of galaxies reverberating through space might be considered a form of extremely ,extremely long wavelength sound transmission.

I can't find that thread now .It was a good 5 years ago that I asked that question.

The phenomenon had a name,I think.

**It was perhaps at another science forum...
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 06/07/2021 01:05:00
I think that if the sound of the universe could traverse space at the same rate that sound travels in our atmosphere we would only hear at a distance of our very closest stars as the sound would not have had time to reach us. Having said that all we would hear is the sun as it would be so loud nothing else could be heard over it.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Eternal Student on 06/07/2021 01:17:27
I think Janus once  explained to me** that the wave motions of galaxies reverberating through space might be considered a form of extremely ,extremely long wavelength sound transmission.
   I'm not Janus but might they have been talking about   the Baryon Oscillation Spectroscopic Survey?
See "Ancient Sound Waves sculpted galaxy formation."  https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn21653-ancient-sound-waves-sculpted-galaxy-formation/
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: geordief on 06/07/2021 02:12:39
I think Janus once  explained to me** that the wave motions of galaxies reverberating through space might be considered a form of extremely ,extremely long wavelength sound transmission.
   I'm not Janus but might they have been talking about   the Baryon Oscillation Spectroscopic Survey?
See "Ancient Sound Waves sculpted galaxy formation."  https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn21653-ancient-sound-waves-sculpted-galaxy-formation/
Maybe that is a related phenomenon but as I recall ,and hopefully understand it was just that galaxies interacted (=ran into) each other  and the effect was some extremely ,extremely  low frequency waves that might be termed "acoustic" were formed (that propagated through the vacuum)

If I find the thread I will update you on what was actually said  but I hope others here might  know about this effect (if it exists)

Or ,maybe Janus will drop by and explain (if it was indeed  he who pointed this out in the past -and if he is not under too much duress in the  heatwave on the Pacific North West at present)


EDIT:This is more or less what I had in mind

https://www.sciencealert.com/sound-can-travel-through-space-after-all-but-we-can-t-hear-it

Still can't find that old thread but that link seems to broadly cover the idea.

Basically no 100% vacuums exist on a large scale and so sound can travel ,albeit  at enormous wavelengths.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Eternal Student on 06/07/2021 16:52:25
Hi geordief.

I think you've explained the general idea quite adequately yourself.  Well done.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: yor_on on 22/07/2021 17:57:25
waving

https://faculty.washington.edu/jcramer/BBSound.html
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Europa on 23/07/2021 00:46:52
waving

https://faculty.washington.edu/jcramer/BBSound.html

No one knows what the CMB is............................
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Colin2B on 23/07/2021 09:20:38
No one knows what the CMB is............................
Please do not post incorrect information in the main sections of this forum. You will be considered to be trolling and will be banned.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Europa on 23/07/2021 13:13:01
No one knows what the CMB is............................
Please do not post incorrect information in the main sections of this forum. You will be considered to be trolling and will be banned.

CMB is attributed to the big bang THEORY.  Since a theory by nature is unproven and subject to change it is not proven.  So if you disagree can you explain what you disagree about?

PS I have some great current pictures of the radio ear that first detected the CMB in it's current state on the platform where it currently sits at Holmdel NJ, in AMERICA.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Origin on 23/07/2021 13:14:32
CMB is attributed to the big bang THEORY.  Since a theory by nature is unproven and subject to change it is not proven.  So if you disagree can you explain what you disagree about?
Stop trolling.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: TommyJ on 27/07/2021 16:37:07
Human can perceive sound in a range 20 Hz to 20 kHz. Even in the air, great that we are not able to hear all the sounds (e.g. bats communicate out of human ear range and at power over 140 decibel, about air jet just right near to you).
Definitely, the sound propagation is different in different media, even in the rare atmosphere. And the Space is not as much vacuum as it is usually thought to be. Neutrinos, dark matter? Just we cannot hear those sounds without transformation and cannot produce such frequencies.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 16/08/2021 12:41:56
Human can perceive sound in a range 20 Hz to 20 kHz. Even in the air, great that we are not able to hear all the sounds (e.g. bats communicate out of human ear range and at power over 140 decibel, about air jet just right near to you).
Definitely, the sound propagation is different in different media, even in the rare atmosphere. And the Space is not as much vacuum as it is usually thought to be. Neutrinos, dark matter? Just we cannot hear those sounds without transformation and cannot produce such frequencies.
Just we cannot hear those sounds without transformation and cannot produce such frequencies.
So what is the sound frequency of the sun?
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: TommyJ on 16/08/2021 16:43:07
So what is the sound frequency of the sun?
Sun is vibrating at different frequencies, measured about 3 mHz for observation purposes.

40 days of the recording squeezed into seconds get the sound. These are vibrations of the matter moving inside the Sun, moving upwards and downwards, turbilating,  stirring on the surface.
Soundwaves, crashing through the plasma, create ripples in the Sunís surface.

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/2018/sounds-of-the-sun
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 16/08/2021 17:12:21
Sun is vibrating at different frequencies, measured about 3 mHz for observation purposes.

40 days of the recording squeezed into seconds get the sound. These are vibrations of the matter moving inside the Sun, moving upwards and downwards, turbilating,  stirring on the surface.
Soundwaves, crashing through the plasma, create ripples in the Sunís surface.
How is the sound detected and collected and is the sound that is heard a simulation or the actual sound of the sun?
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: TommyJ on 16/08/2021 18:47:38
How is the sound detected and collected and is the sound that is heard a simulation or the actual sound of the sun?
The Sunís internal and external plasma movement create the turbulence vibrations, which are captured by Solar and Heliospheric Observatory (SOHO). Data from SOHO, sonified by the Stanford Experimental Physics Lab.
Columns of gases swirl, rise and fall (same way as gases and liquids on Earth), these processes are being tracked inside the Sun.

When we hear sound in the air, we hear vibrations of turbulence (in audible range).
Under water detected sounds are also sped up in order to come to audible range.
Title: Re: If sound could travel through space, what would the Sun sound like?
Post by: Just thinking on 16/08/2021 18:56:17
The Sunís internal and external plasma movement create the turbulence vibrations, which are captured by Solar and Heliospheric Observatory (SOHO). Data from SOHO, sonified by the Stanford Experimental Physics Lab.
Thanks for that info Tommy J.