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Quote from: SteveD on 13/01/2009 11:46:00The point of this exposition is... if it is true that POIS is harmful to all of us, and if POIS has at least five stages, then perhaps stopping the illness at an earlier stage would be easier, more effective and could alleviate some of our very real suffering....Just a thought Steve--I think you've made an interesting point about your POIS beginning with the "thought" of sex. Then the "thrill of the thought," followed by the "ritual" (of masturbation OR possibly intercourse, too--why not include that?), and then the genital contact, and then the actual orgasm with the "catastrophic collapse" of emotions--of hopelessness and negativity and despair, etc. This is an insightful description.The "desperately driven" feeling to have sex is one kind. But there's also another, which I prefer. I would describe it as a sleepy-relaxed-cuddly sexual feeling. Only after I feel completely relaxed, do the the sexual feelings begin to predominate, but the urge is not a driven feeling, but more like a sensual bonding feeling.... The only apprehension I've felt revolves around question-"how tired am I going to be, if I go through to the orgasm?" Though that is something I have now trained myself (quite successfully) to avoid.
The point of this exposition is... if it is true that POIS is harmful to all of us, and if POIS has at least five stages, then perhaps stopping the illness at an earlier stage would be easier, more effective and could alleviate some of our very real suffering....Just a thought
masturbation OR possibly intercourse, too--why not include that?
As for these heart palpitations, after some quick googling, it seems high cortisol is a cheif cause of palpiations. This is consisent with the theory that excessive cortisol is responsible in part for POIS. But if cortisol is too high, blood pressure should also be elevated above normal, I think I'll start monitoring my blood pressure during POIS and after the symptoms pass.
Hi all,I'd like to share my input and experience here.
DemoThank You, Thank you for the clarifications--I thought I was losing my memory and descending further into senility--
I read that a possible side effect from your new treatment is gynecomastia.
Quote from: martin88 on 14/01/2009 03:50:21Demo, about occasional hostility, rage and even blind fanaticism when sexually abstinent, here is the best I can say that has been helpful:.........Martin, perhaps you missed my point: I simply believe that sexual/orgasmic repression is unhealthy at some point. It is different for everyone. I don't wish to "fix" that, I simply will respect it. For me, that means to not be chaste beyond 6 weeks or so. I also don't believe that is abnormal; just the opposite: it proves that we are sexually expressive beings! Suppresssion of natural desires can make one become ill (e.g., hostile, aggressive, depressed, etc.). For example, and I know this is very controversial, but I believe that the problem shows very clearly in some (but not all!) celibate clergy. I'm absolutely sure not everyone agrees with me. []
Demo, about occasional hostility, rage and even blind fanaticism when sexually abstinent, here is the best I can say that has been helpful:.........
One could go crazy trying to "play doctor" when one is not a doctor.
My input to him will be extremely selective.
Routines and patternsLooking back, I find that my POIS has been least significant when I am deeply involved in several routines:1) Time intervals between orgasms are almost identical (e.g. hypothetically: 1 every 3 days at 10 pm)2) Time intervals between meals are the same, and the same number of meals a day.3) Waking up and going to sleep happens at the same times every day4) Routines such as exercise take place every day, and at the same timesHas anyone else found this?
It's very hard to say if abstinence is unhealthy or not, I think it depends the case.
We are on a forum about medicine, and nobody is a doctor here.
Medicine is not an exact science. Even your endo said that your precedent MD gave you the bad type of testosterone.
It's always possible to do the test for estrogen beside to dismiss this possibility for our personal research.
UNIVERSITY ENDOCRINOLOGISTMy appointment today went well, it exceeded my expectations. Thanks to everyone for their well wishes and especially to Girlwind for her advice on my preparation, which came in very handy. I also agree with Girlwind's premise that someone can have fantastic, impeccable medical credentials, but what kind of human being is s/he? As it turned out, I lucked out in both departments (as far as first impressions go, of course). We also had a few things in common, which helped the "schmoozing" factor.He took a definite interest in Dr Waldinger's POIS study (I handed him a copy) and also our POIS forum and its hard experiences. That was greatly encouraging. But keep in mind that my primary objective was to get his help - for me - as a patient, and then, only if comfortable, to see what I can pursue to possibly get his help for the forum, if and as the relationship progresses. The two objectives intermingled nicely this afternoon.He was comfortable with the concept of POIS and the medical/therapeutic fools that I - and other forum members - had to suffer over the years. He asked questions about my sexual history, medical history, POIS history, lab tests (I brought him standard lab results and a typed list of meds which Girlwind suggested. I even impressed the nurse!). He asked about the forum's POIS experiences with masturbation vs. intercourse. I said there was no difference that I could see. He wanted to know if there was "a female variable" for men []. I added that NE also causes POIS. Again, the prime focus was my symptoms, not the forum's, so I didn't go into NE differences, such as John21 reports (better garlic results). I mentioned theories regarding oxytocin, cortisol, nitrous oxide, prolactin and "more". I also mentioned experiments with Levitra, relora, fenugreek, maca, and "more". At this point he was more interested in getting on with the labwork, as Girlwind warned. So I didn't scream theories and experiments at him even louder [].OK.....For a POIS forum research study: he suggested I contact his colleague, with permission to use his good name, and he gave me his colleague's email address and directline phone! I asked if his colleague could help find funding. He quickly said to me:"He gets grants." (in an emphatic inflection that implied 'yes, bigtime')Very nice! I will contact his colleague asap. To give you an idea of their size, just one of their medical research facilities is a fairly new $1.5 billion complex.A question for us from the Dr.: "Does anyone have experience with tricyclic antidepressants, such as Tofranil, and POIS?"He also wished to convey to the forum that beta-blockers may help POIS, but can also cause ED.Blood tests were immediately ordered this afternoon, and will include most of everything that we discussed here, DHEA-S, Cortisol, Free Testosterone, Prolactin, Thyroid (most of Girlwind's, Counterpoints and B_Jim's list), and others. If it's not 100% comprehensive, I'm not concerned right now. I just want to see how he operates.Hypogonadism was placed in the chart as an initial blood-test study for the lab technicians (I didn't see POIS on the forms []). Results this Thursday, with follow up discussion the same day on the phone.Well, as usual, I make no promises. To me or you. All I can do is try! Thanks again, everyone. The forum strengthened my ability to have a more successful POIS doctor visit than ever before.
Quote from: Counterpoints on 14/01/2009 07:14:37Routines and patternsLooking back, I find that my POIS has been least significant when I am deeply involved in several routines:1) Time intervals between orgasms are almost identical (e.g. hypothetically: 1 every 3 days at 10 pm)2) Time intervals between meals are the same, and the same number of meals a day.3) Waking up and going to sleep happens at the same times every day4) Routines such as exercise take place every day, and at the same timesHas anyone else found this?If this is true, I'm in trouble: my patterns are very erratic. I avoid routines like the plague. Not saying it's smart, it's just my personality.
If left to myself, I am totally undisciplined. But when I am forced into routines -- work, school, etc. -- I often start to feel better. So I'm trying to force some routines on myself.