Naked Science Forum
Non Life Sciences => Geology, Palaeontology & Archaeology => Topic started by: erich on 14/08/2005 16:15:43
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Dear Folks,
What do ya'll think of the talk of the 6 billion barrel claims of Eden Energy?
They have contracted three wells this fall to 15000 feet on their Noah prospect in Nevada.
Eden Energy Corp.
http://www.edenenergycorp.com/
Ely Times- Eden Energy seeks oil near Ely
http://www.elynews.com/archive/2005/07/15/LocalNews/324444.html
Erich J. Knight
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From a geological standpoint, all the right ingredients are present:
good source rocks
geologic structures to transport and trap hydrocarbon deposits
younger cap rocks
The only thing missing at this point is... OIL
Sounds like a great place to look for the stuff, but other promising spots in the US overthrust belt have not panned out as expected. Wait for some positive results from the drill holes before investing. There may be a reason why Exxon pulled out the area years ago.
Prediction is difficult, especially the future. -Niels Bohr
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I believe I read tha exxon only went to 8000 feet, and pulled out at the time of the Valdese spill.
Erich J. Knight
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And I found this today, they are talking trillions of barrels for the whole structure
:ELEPHANT HUNTING IN NEVADA
SPEAKER
Alan K. Chamberlain, Cedar Strat Corp.
DATE
11:30 am, Tuesday, June 29, 2004
LOCATION
TELUS CONVENTION CENTRE, CALGARY, ALBERTA - MACLEOD HALL BCD*
PLEASE NOTE:
The cutoff date for ticket sales is 1:00 pm, Thursday, June 24th. Ticket price is $28.00 + GST. (For ticket purchasing information CLICK HERE.)
The central Nevada thrust belt provides an opportunity to explore for giant oil and gas fields. Thick, thermally mature, organic-rich, lacustrine oil shales deposited in the Mississippian Antler basin flood plains are the source beds for the fifty million barrels of oil already produced in Nevada. Karsted unconformities, stromatoporoid reefs, impact breccias, and sandstones make Nevada's Devonian reservoir rocks most favorable for giant accumulations. Late Cretaceous thrusting created the compressional features of the prolific Canadian foothills, Utah/Wyoming thrust belt and the central Nevada thrust belt.
Typically, oil seeps are associated with oilbearing thrust belts worldwide. However, a blanket of Tertiary volcanics sealed in many of Nevada's oil seeps and concealed Nevada's thrust belt. Some of these seeps, including Grant Canyon, Blackburn, Trap Spring, and Eagle Springs oil fields, built up enough oil to become commercial. So far, all of Nevada's crude has been produced from these commercial oil seeps. Little effort has been expended to identify the source of these commercial oil seeps because of the lack of an accurate geologic map and model. In contrast to other states, the State of Nevada has never surveyed its mineral potential. The cursory geologic mapping by the federal government is not adequate for exploration purposes. Old depositional and deformational models, based on insufficient data, have been entrenched into the literature, thus impeding exploration. An old model championed by the United States Geological Survey is the theory that the Mississippian Antler Basin siliciclastics were deposited as flysch turbidites into a deep foreland basin between the Antler highlands in central Nevada and the Utah hingeline in central Utah. However, new field data indicates regressive sequences containing vascular plant roots (Stigmaria) penetrating bedding planes and lacustrine palynomorph assemblages. This new data dispels the old model and supports a new depositional environment model. The new model shows that the richest and most oilprone Mississippian source rocks are lacustrine oil shales. Lacustrine oil shales make oil exploration in the Antler Basin very attractive. Cumulative thicknesses of these world-class lacustrine oil source rocks are measured in thousands of feet in outcrops and wells. They are thick enough and rich enough to generate trillions of barrels of oil.
Until the early 1980s the typical exploration practice in Nevada was to drill just the Tertiary valley fill in synclines.Therefore, most of the eight hundred wells drilled in Nevada penetrate only syncline Tertiary valley fill. Few wells have penetrated any Paleozoic section. However, two significant fields were found by drilling "too deep" and penetrating Devonian rocks below the Tertiary unconformity. Oil flows from Devonian reservoirs in the Blackburn and Grant Canyon oil fields. One well in Grant Canyon flowed 4,000 barrels a day for ten years. It has now produced more than 15,000,000 barrels of oil since its discovery in 1983. The Grant Canyon reservoir consists of 200 to 400 feet of karst breccia at the top of the Middle Devonian Simonson Formation. This karst interval is found in wells and measured sections throughout the eastern Great Basin. In addition to the karst interval, stromatoporoid reefs, impact breccia, quartz sandstones, and other intervals provide world-class reservoir rocks within the eastern Great Basin Devonian sequences.An isopach of all the Devonian sequences reveals a structurally compressed basin –the Sunnyside Basin – and can be used to predict the spacial distribution of potential Devonian reservoir rocks. The Simonson karst breccia interval alone has the capacity to store billions of barrels of oil in certain structures.A careful analysis of logs from the few wells that penetrated other significant portions of Paleozoic rocks shows that, contrary to preconceived notions, many intervals contain similar reservoir rocks. Another deeply entrenched notion that discouraged exploration investment is that the north-south structural grain of the eastern Great Basin was caused by Tertiary extension which could have compromised seals on older, compressional structures. However, new mapping is revealing many uncharted compressional features and a lack of extensional features. The new maps demonstrate that the region underwent much more compression than previously thought. Furthermore, some of these features show no evidence of being broken by major Tertiary extensional faults. Several unbroken compressional structures in the Timpahute Range, 50 miles south of the prolific Grant Canyon field, are exposed. Another example of an intact compressional feature is the Golden Gate fault fold 40 miles south southeast of the prolific Grant Canyon field and ten miles north of the Timpahute Range.The Golden Gate fault fold is ten miles long and five miles wide and has more than five thousand feet of closure. It may have trapped billions of barrels of oil before it was breached by headward erosion of the Colorado River.New mapping reveals that no Tertiary extensional faults compromise the structure. Similar structures, along strike that have escaped erosion, likely contain billions of barrels of oil and trillions of cubic feet of gas. Oil seeping from these giant fields is probably the source for the commercial oil seep fields in Nevada.However, old opinion and theories based on little or poor geologic mapping have obscured the true understanding of Nevada geology for at least five decades. As a result, past oil exploration efforts in Nevada based on old tectonic and depositional models have been disappointing.
BIOGRAPHY
Alan K. Chamberlain received his B.A. and M.S. from Brigham Young University and his Ph.D. from Colorado School of Mines. His dissertation, Structural Geology and Devonian Stratigraphy of the Timpahute Range, Nevada, provides a new exploration model that could lead to significant discoveries in this frontier region. After he worked for Exxon, Gulf, Marathon, and Placid, he became president of Cedar Strat Corp. in 1984.
Cedar Strat was organized at the request of several major oil companies to fill a need for exploration data for Great Basin exploration. Alan conceived the idea of using a scintillation counter to create a surface gamma-ray log of measured sections while working for Gulf Oil after having worked for Exxon Minerals USA in uranium exploration. It was not until Placid hired him away from Marathon to head up their Great Basin program that he had the freedom to test the idea. At Placid, Alan had the unique opportunity to visit many of Shell Oil Company's staked measured sections by helicopter with former Shell geologists. They had been involved in measuring the sections in the 1950s and 1960s. Using the Shell measured sections he learned the Paleozoic stratigraphy of the Great Basin. As he remeasured many of the sections, he applied his new technique of surface gamma-ray logs. He earned the Best Poster of the Session Award at the 1983 National American Association of Petroleum Geologists when he presented his work on surface gamma-ray logs in the Wyoming thrust belt and in the Great Basin. His abstract and subsequent paper attracted the attention of national and international oil companies that have applied his surface gamma-ray log technique worldwide. Development of this successful technique resulted in the formation of Cedar Strat Corp. in 1984. A presentation to the American Association of Petroleum Geologists of the results of Alan's new, sequence stratigraphic model of the Mississippian Antler Basin including lacustrine source rocks secured him the Levorson Award in the late 1980s.
*Room location subject to change without notice
Erich J. Knight
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This is very interesting to me as I live in Nevada. I agree that the preponderance of revenue-producing geological exploration has been based in silver and gold mining, ignoring the potential for oil. The fact that this company already has wells planned is a good sign, as a lot of work is put in before they will make that kind of investment. I remember doing a lab in one of my geology courses when we had to essentially create our own oil company, bid on plots of land, do research, drill exploratory wells, etc. We had a certain amount of money and based on the oil we hit, we could make more...whoever ended up with the most money won. It was an expensive process, and drilling an exploratory well was still very risky. You could have all of the signs that this was a prime location for oil, drill, and find nothing.
The conditions have to be just right for oil production, and often, that oil can escape. Personally, I think that any oil discovery is just prolonging the inevitable. We are going to eventually run out of the fossil fuel (estimates on current reserves is 50-150 years), and will need something else to provide not only energy for our cars, but raw material for the production of many of our wonderful plastics. And you know how much we love plastic!
I like to lick rocks....
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Below a certain depth, you don't find oil, you find gas. But it is still useable energy. As far as plastics go, we can use vegatation to make any plastics we need. It is just more expensive. If we keep drilling real deep holes, hell, geothermal might just get back in the picture in some places...
David
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A post from Earth Science Forums http://www.scienceforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=45
Re: Saudi Size oil field Claim
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I wish them luck, but I don't see it as a good investment for oil or gas production given their posted data.
Quote:
Source rock is Mississippian lacustrine oil shales with organic content averaging between 3% and 6% and thousands of feet thickness.
Oil shale is not a good source rock for petroluem. It is way too hydrogen-deficient, and the organics are bound to the clay fraction of the rock. Diagenesis could give you pyrolysis and oil release, but that product would be highly unsaturated and prone to repolymerization. Much more severe conditions would give you cracking to natural gas, but they claim things were mild over time.
Pyrolysis of Colorado oil shale, in situ by combustion or mined and surface processed by heat exchange, gets you rivers of shale oil. It is the perfect refinery poison:
1) It is heavily unsaturated. Even refinery hydrogen costs a fortune.
2) It is rich with nitrogen. That kills the acid zeolite support in your reforming catalyst.
3) It has a nice arsenic content. That kills the noble metal in your reforming catalyst.
4) It has a pour point not much below room temp. That makes pipeline transportation somewhat interesting.
DO YOU WANT GUARANTEED CHEAP BIG OIL PRODUCTION FROM DOMESTIC FIELDS? Drown some Enviro-whiners and re-open the Santa Barbara Channel oil fields in Southern California. It's that simple and fool-proof. It's an ocean of oil sitting under the asses of a few sea otters.
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Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/qz.pdf
Erich J. Knight
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Dear Evie,
I agree totaly, all great points, and I hope at least one of these two companies will provide the energy cure and not just a band aid: Borealis and or Electron Power Systems
Big science has spent 10's of billions ,all tolled, and we are no closer to a break even fusion reactor. Just a few hundred thousand toward these alternative concepts may get us there, and in years, not decades.
I have posted these questions at many physics forums, and to academics in this field, with little response, I thought you all may be interested.
There are three companies pursuing hydrogen-boron plasma toroid fusion, Paul Koloc, Prometheus II, Eric Lerner, Focus Fusion and Clint Seward of Electron Power Systems. A resent DOD review of EPS technology reads as fallows:
"MIT considers these plasmas a revolutionary breakthrough, with Delphi's
chief scientist and senior manager for advanced technology both agreeing
that EST/SPT physics are repeatable and theoretically explainable. MIT and
EPS have jointly authored numerous professional papers describing their
work. (Delphi is a $33B company, the spun off Delco Division of General
Motors)."
and
"Cost: no cost data available. The complexity of reliable mini-toroid
formation and acceleration with compact, relatively low-cost equipment
remains to be determined. Yet the fact that the EPS/MIT STTR work this
technology has attracted interest from Delphi is very significant, as the
automotive electronics industry is considered to be extremely demanding of
functionality per dollar and pound (e.g., mil-spec performance at
Wal-Mart-class 'commodity' prices)."
EPS, Electron Power Systems seems the strongest and most advanced, and I love the scalability, They propose applications as varied as home power generation@ .ooo5 cents/KWhr, cars, distributed power, airplanes, space propulsion , power storage and kinetic weapons.
It also provides a theoretic base for ball lighting : Ball Lightning Explained as a Stable Plasma Toroid
The theoretics are all there in peer reviewed papers. It does sound to good to be true however with names like MIT, Delphi, STTR grants, NIST grants , etc., popping up all over, I have to keep investigating.
Recent support has also come from one of the top lightning researcher in the world, Joe Dwyer at FIT, when he got his Y-ray and X-ray research published in the may Scientific American,
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&colID=1&articleID=00032CE5-13B7-1264-8F9683414B7FFE9F
Dwyer's paper:
http://www.lightning.ece.ufl.edu/PDF/Gammarays.pdf
and according to Clint Seward it supports his lightning models and fusion work at EPS, Electron Power Systems
Clint sent Joe and I his new paper on a lightning charge transport model of cloud to ground lightning (If your interested I'll send it,he did not want me to post it to the web yet). Joe was supportive and suggested some other papers and Clint is now in re-write.
It may also explain Elves, blue jets, sprites and red sprites, plasmas that appear above thunder storms. After a little searching, this seemed to have the best hard numbers on the observations of sprites.
Dr. Mark A. Stanley's Dissertation
http://nis-www.lanl.gov/~stanleym/dissertation/main.html
And may also explain the spiral twist of fulgurites, hollow fused sand tubes found in the ground at lightning strikes.
Not to blow my own horn, but I got them talking with my E-mail inquires!
In my searches for efficient home technology I came across Electron Power Systems. I E-mailed EPS about the obvious synergies for their home generator with the power chips of Borealis. I also contacted Borealis. I have been mediating an argument between Clint Seward of Electron Power Systems with Rodney T. Cox of http://www.powerchips.gi/. Basically Rodney said they got the math wrong and NASA is right and Clint says MIT doesn't get their math wrong. I thought you may have an interest and be of help. Both companies are proposing very disruptive technologies, Borealis in Quantum Tunneling thermoelectrics and EPS in micro fusion.
Mediating, in this case, means in the middle of e-mail exchanges.
The issue seems to be Dr. Chen's paper and whether his assumptions of the aspect ratio for the plasma toroids, match the model of Clint Seward proposed device. Will the ion stability condition be satisfied to maintain equilibrium?
I'm in way over my head here and have been seeking help from interested parties, if you know any plasma physicist that may help that would be great. All pertinent papers are at EPS's web site.
(Also
Borealis has an interesting patent on a thermionic car that uses the companies quantum tunneling thermocouples and Chorus motor electric drives. I sent their president, Rodney Cox, the news of this new carbon storage technology using grafite, and asked him about the estimated over all well-to-wheel efficiency.
The Chorus motors produce 300% more torque by overcoming harmonic drag and the Power Chip thermocouples may be up to 80% efficient. This means that with a hydrogen storage system that has an equal energy density to an average gas tank, this car would have a range of 1500 miles!........... and Boeing just anounced it's plans to use Chorus drives in the nose gear of it's airliners : http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2005/q3/nr_050801a.ht )
After posting to several Science, physics and Energy forums I collected up comments and questions and asked Clint Seward , to respond:
"Your most important point was that others have suggested that I should be
able to demonstrate a collision of EST's and even a level of fusion with a
few hundred thousand dollars and about a year. I agree. Here is what I
need to do:
1. Capture the EST in a way that I can measure them. I have designed a
method in the last two months that will do this.
2. Measure the density of the EST. This requirement is something everyone
is asking for, and will enable me to get serious funding from sponsors.
3. Collide two EST's. I have found a simple way to do this based on the
TRISOPS work by Wells.
4. Consulting work by Chen to verify the physics I have outlined for the
density.
5. Make and measure an EST based on Deuterium.
6. Collide two Deuterium EST's.
Each of these requires some cash outlays, so I am working them as I can get
resources. Several people, including yourself, are considering helpful
investments of $5k to $10k to 25K to 50K to 100k. Work will progress with
any investment, no matter how small. Capturing an EST is a $5k investment.
Your second most important point is that more people want to see more data
and even a video. I have many of these, but have not published them yet. I
have concentrated on the physics, which I feel I now know completely, and
can get confirmed. This is a smaller effort, about $15k
Clint Seward"
This technology is so green (only by product helium) and solves such a panoply of world problems, if it is as viable as the Department of Defense feels it is, it is the fuel of the American dream.
Thank you for your Attention.
Erich J. Knight
Shenandoah Gardens
E-mail: shengar@aol.com
(540) 289-9750
Erich J. Knight
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Here's a reply to Uncle Al, from :Raging Bull: Eden Energy Corp Message Board
http://ragingbull.lycos.com/mboard/boards.cgi?board=EDNE&newpost=1
By: blanketpower
16 Aug 2005, 02:34 AM EDT Msg. 1112 of 1116
(Msg. is a reply to 1111 by erichknight.)
Re: scienceforum post
The guy's data is specific to the area and type of rock he is talking about (Colorado oil shales). Has nothing to do with EDEN. At EDEN we are NOT talking about the pyrolysis of oil shales (mining and "cracking" of oil-bearing shales, similar to mining Athabasca "tar sands"). Rather, we are talking about the pumping of trapped oil from dolomitic reservoir formations, with lacustrine shale as the original source rock.
Here are a couple of (the many available) examples of commercial oil derived from lacustrine shales as the source rock:
A large proportion of Oklahoma's oil resources are derived originally from shale (Woodford shale, for example) but are not extracted from the shale itself - the viable deposits are found in formations adjacent to the shale that have trapped oil that was squeezed (squozen?) out over time.
Equatorial Guinea is another example - world class oil and gas hosted in sandstone, but the source rock is underlying lacustrine shales from Kissenda and Melania formations.
These examples are the type of thing that EDEN is talking about - in our case, Mississippian lacustrine shales overlain by porous dolomites. If you drill into the shale itself you find the kind of hydrocarbon-bearing crap that poster is talking about (relatively common in eastern Nevada, and uneconomical), but if you have a sealed reservoir over the shale (in our case a very porous Devonian dolomite) you may be in business.
That is what makes EDEN attractive. We know the original source rock (shale) is all over the place, and is hydrocarbon rich. We also know that the source rock is overlain by a porous formation, and that the geological structures (anticlines) are in place that (a) show evidence of tectonic compression; and (b) have created generally enclosing structures. We also know that within the overall anticline several terminal structures are in place that would serve as specific trap-points for the oil.
(Note: Anticlines are sort of like railway tunnels in shape... long structures with big domed roofs, but open at the ends where the train enters and leaves. Open anticlines tend not to trap oil - when compressed it leaves via the ends of the tunnel. Terminal structures are analogous to roof collapses in the tunnel. They create "dead ends" within the tunnels where oil can accumulate. That's why the recent news was so significant - several of these terminal structures are present within our anticline). All of the pieces are in place for a world class deposit. Still not a guarantee, but a very good bet.
I have not been a geologist for over 20 years, and do not feel like getting into a p*ssing match with some new college grad with a shiny diploma and un-scuffed field boots who wants to show the world how brilliant he is. It has been too long a time - I would lose. I will gladly defer to a better explanation from a more recent practitioner of the art, but thought I would post this from what is left of my crusty, half-dead geological memory in an effort to put your mind at ease.
Good luck to all.
Erich J. Knight
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quote:
Originally posted by erich
Dear Folks,
What do ya'll think of the talk of the 6 billion barrel claims of Eden Energy?
They have contracted three wells this fall to 15000 feet on their Noah prospect in Nevada.
Eden Energy Corp.
http://www.edenenergycorp.com/
Ely Times- Eden Energy seeks oil near Ely
http://www.elynews.com/archive/2005/07/15/LocalNews/324444.html
Erich J. Knight
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If you haven't yet done it, play the following speech by Adam Chamberlain using Real Player to get the benefit of all the Powerpoint slides.
http://www.insinc.com/onlinetv/cspg29june2004/
I'm not a geologist but I've been in Oil and Gas since '76. In my book this is a legitimate wildcat oil and gas play, not a scam. I find it most interesting the amount of lease acreage acquired by Eden.... at least 293,000 acres including Noah (Diamond Mountain) and Railroad Valley before turning a bit.
Follow closely Tri-Valley's Midland Trail well being completed in Railroad Valley. Watch the Oil Springs Prospects 1 and 2 next to Diamond Mountain that Tri-Valley is preparing to drill. Tri-Valley appears to be using much of the geology that Eden. Tri-Valley drilled Midland Trail with only 3,000 acres.
Yes, Shell once owned Railroad valley and poked dry holes every six miles right down the middle of the valey. Subsequently, others drilled Grant Canyon, Midland Trail etc. right up close the mountain ranges.
Eden has a different problem for the investor. With only 10 mil shares in float, they've been trading 2 to 3 mil per day the last month up from 90 thou. Momentum traders and Short players are all over this thing. Buyins.net reports that brokers haven't covered short sales for 32 days and they must buy back shares in the open market at 13 days. This problem is insame volatility.... totally aside from any functional value.
Personally, I've been in and out of this one using 15% stop orders to the point that I'm playing only with house money. You need luck both on your stock trades and on the holes drilled on this one.
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I do not take a position on this Nevada oil exploration effort, because I am no geologist.
However, it is very clear that most of the recoverable petroleum in the lower 48 has already been pumped. And there are reasons to believe that the petroleum reserves of planet Earth are reaching their halfway point- an extremely significant event since the second half of such a resource is much more difficult and more expensive to locate than the first half was.
Do not try to tell me that we can drill our way out of our oil issues, because it just aint that way.
chris wiegard
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Originally posted by VAlibrarian
"I do not take a position on this Nevada oil exploration effort, because I am no geologist."
Oxymoron... If you are not a geologist how do you know that most of the petroleum in the lower 48 have been pumped??
Yes, the earths reserves are finite and alternatives such as nuclear will become cost effective as demand exceeds finite supply driving oil prices to a point that real alternatives are cost favorable.
The point you miss is that in 1950 it was beleived that there was onlly 7to 10 years reserves, ditto 1960, ditto 1970 etc. However, no one knows what the finite reserves really are.
If you are willing to write off proven reserves such as the Santa Barbara channel, areas where a toad might have to relocate or a tree hugger objects to the sight of a well head, dooms day will be sooner rather than later.
Among the arguements against your hypothosis are the changing technologies for recovery and the fact that in many of the older abandoned fields in OK and TX the mineral ownership is so fragmented that it is virtually impossible to obtain title to harvest oil revoerable under current methods.
For the time being you best be cheering the efforts and risk taking by companies like Eden and Tri-Valley Corp.
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watching a tv programme on scottish north sea oil last night (whos fields provide over half the oil and most of the gass used) i was surprised to learn that around seventy percent of the fields oil is still there but up till recently was too deep to be drilled. although like every one i would prefer to live without our dependance on fossil fuels if we have to continue to use oil would we not be better to use up all the oil in the fields already active before we violate and destroy the ecosystems of new fields?
Giggidy Giggidy Goo
The philosopher Q man
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okay, as stated i admit i am no geologist. However, mainstream thought of petroleum analysts is consistent with my position. Read Out of Gas, a recent book on the future of oil.
I like having a car as much as the next guy. However, it is hard for me to rejoice at the prolongation of our dependence on petroleum for transportation because the faster we pump the recoverable reserves, the worse the panic when the price suddenly goes up due to an imbalance between supply and demand. I watch the news.
The other problem with fossil fuels is that they cause global warming. The problem with global warming is that it promises severe climate change, but only after it is too late for us to take steps to prevent it. It's like HIV- nobody runs away from the guy spreading it because at first he still looks great.
chris wiegard
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Oil and gas reserves are finite but that doesn't mean that on some day in 2010 it's all suddenly gone. The cost of recovery becomes gradually more expensive as the fuels are recovered from deeper or more obsure and difficult loactions. And, the return economics are required to justify the risks of such recovery.
That is why oil production companies like Suncor and BP have become actively invested in alternatives such as wind. Oil and gas producers are risk takers and they are willing to go places and make investments while the left coast will only ring their hands about the unavailbility of hydrogen cars.
The transition to alternatives is driven by the economics of the options. Note the use of electricity generating solar panels that has quietly become common place for traffic signs and remote power needs. The economics has taken advantage over old hard wired sources that generally rely on fosil fuels.
Drive accros Wyoming and count the hundreds of wind turbines generating power. It is an evolution to alternatives and it is happening.
Unlike manufacturing of say cell phones where supply can be accelerated virtually immediately, there is a several year cycle to bring addtional hydrocarbon production on line once justified by commodity price. So in the short run supply is fixed while demand may fluctuate quickly due to weather, wars or warm winters leading to the only natural consequence in a free market of price fluctuation to sort out who needs it the most.
As for global warming... that has more political arguements than inteligent design.
Back to the original reason for this thread. If in fact Eden's 293,000 acres of lease provides 5% of the 6 billion barrels some have suggested it would likely be produced for far less than $20 a barrel because it is on shore and the discovery cost to the company is minimal. My point is that modest success could result in a a good return for investors. 6 billion barrels would be a lottery win.
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That is why oil production companies like Suncor and BP have become actively invested in alternatives such as wind.
that may be true mmagic but what about the rumours that have been circulating for forty years that large oil companies have been buying the patents for alternative enery for years simple so that they do not get on the market and spoil the oil industries stranglehold on energy are all of these thousands of rumours untrue?. bp and others are researching other energys im sure but only so that when the oil runs out they will hold all these patants too and if they are sitting on the next cold fusion or star in a jar you can be sure it wont come out till they have squeezed every last penny out of oil.
Giggidy Giggidy Goo
The philosopher Q man
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I think that is a bit harsh - I would have thought that oil companies are investing in alternatives for two reasons:
-Possibly to make money if conventional sources become more expensive
-To look cudley and not so evil...
There is no point in them investing in finding the next cold fusion if they don't patent it, and if they do patent it then we would hear about it...
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1) Mississippian "oil shales". There has not been a single outcrop of Miss. oil shales reported in the western U.S. Most of this purported source rock contains some coal, or is marine where deposited away from the Roberts overthrust.
2) The majority of oil found in Nevada is derived from Tertiary oil shales.
3) Buy Eden stock now and sell BEFORE they reach TD. Then you can make a little $$$. This thing is not the Zagros and it is not the Covenant discovery in Utah. It does, however, seem to be a bunch of hype.
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The old rule.... Buy on the rumor sell on the fact.
Even if the prospect is tremendous, it would take years to drill it out and turn potential into bottom line.
One must separate the underlying fundamentals from the stock momentum. That is not to say don't trade it. Just don't bet the farm and throw the stock in a dresser drawer. You must be on top of this one and/or have your trailing stops in place. When it starts to move in any direction it has on occasion moved like a dragster.
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One thing's for sure though. If Chamberlain is right and Eden finds a thrust trap for the Mississippian Chainman "oil shale", there will be a lot of small companies sitting pretty in Eastern Nevada with the land they have already leased for pennies.
Check out:
http://www.ewg.org/oil_and_gas/search.php , if you are interested in who is best positioned for a possible boom.
Cheers
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I'm also trying to figure out how to say this without being pompous- it is possible to "hype" an investment by praising its upside potential on the web. I think that is NOT the intent here, but it still makes me uneasy.
chris wiegard
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There are all kinds of laws to try to prevent fraud and deception in claims like these. But as far as I know, none of those laws pertain to the internet. Every day I get emails asking me to help some person in Africa move illegal money into my country by providing my bank information. Of coures that is a fraud which would quickly empty my bank account with no legal resource available to get my money back.
People trying to sell you a get rich scheme over the internet are in the great tradition of the scam artists of the 1800's before there were any laws restricting the craft.
Personally, my get rich scheme is hard work, and I can't afford "Free".
David
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yes David, I get some of those emails from Nigeria with somebody wanting to give me $200,000- they just need me to send along $500 first so that they can bribe somebody to open a bank vault. Somehow they also found out that I am a Rotary Club member so they always make sure to mention that up front.
Are there any people in Nigeria who do not make a living from scams?
There must be.
The "phishing" messages are annoying too. Those are the ones from my bank (not really from my bank) saying that I need to give them my bank account number so that they can make sure their records are correct. As if any bank anywhere would need the account holders to tell them the account #s! I'm sure that if I were dumb enough to go along with it and type my #, I would find out the next day that my checking account is suddenly empty.
I wish it were possible to catch these guys and give them some jail time, but apparently it is not.
chris wiegard
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Sorry, that was really departing from the original topic and I should not do that.
chris wiegard
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For the oil companies and claims of profits, it is best to have them send you a prospectus though the government mail system. Not by FedEx or UPS. Then, if they are committing fraud, they go to jail. An honest company exploring for energy is a risky enough proposition. A company who skirts the laws by avoiding a legal prospectus, and avoiding sending it though the federal mail system is telling you up front that he thinks that your money will quickly be his money. (This applies to US law, don't know what they have elsewhere.)
David
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In early August Eden sent me a prospectus. They will do so for anyone who asks.
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Hi Keyboard ,
welcome to my thread.
Here is interesting work going on that supports Alan K. Chamberlain's findings:
From: kennnthomas@...
Date: Mon Oct 10, 2005 6:21 pm
Subject: "bolstering the geothermal/oil/gold connection " kennnthomas2000
Offline
Send Email
Assessing the Role of Active and Ancient Geothermal Processes in
Oil-Reservoir Evolution in the Basin and Range Province
PERSON IN CHARGE: Jeffrey B. Hulen (801-581-8794; Fax 801-585-3540;
E-mail jhulen@...)
Objectives: The project is structured around investigation of the
premise that active and ancient moderate-temperature hydrothermal
systems, by various means, have been instrumental in the generation,
migration, and entrapment of oil in the Basin and Range province of the
western United States.
Project Description: The eastern Basin and Range encompasses several
shallow and hot (<2 km; up to 130°C) oil fields (for example Blackburn
and Grant Canyon/Bacon Flat) that geologically resemble the Carlin-type,
Paleozoic sediment-hosted gold deposits occurring in the same
region—in particular those of the southern Alligator Ridge mining
district about midway between the towns of Elko and Ely, Nevada. We are
investigating the distinct possibility that at least some of these gold
deposits are the exhumed and oxidized, paleogeothermal analogues of the
modern, exploited geothermal oil fields. Our approach is
multidisciplinary, involving (1) detailed geologic mapping, (2) logging
of drill cuttings and cores, with emphasis on alteration, porosity
characteristics, vein mineralization and paragenesis, and hydrocarbon
type and distribution, (3) three-dimensional stratigraphic/structural
analysis to allow reconstruction of fluid-flow paths used by both
thermal waters and hydrocarbons, (4) fluid-inclusion microthermometry,
to ascertain the compositions and temperatures of these fluids at
different times during the duration of the hydrothermal system, (5)
whole-rock and vein-mineral geochemistry, (6) hydrogeochemistry of
oil-field vs. regional
waters, and (7) stable-isotopic systematics of thermal waters and vein
and alteration minerals.
Results: During the past year, we have mapped several small, new
open-pit gold mines in the southern Alligator Ridge district, adding new
details to the stratigraphic/structural and hydrothermal picture
previously established for this area. All the new mines penetrate the
same oil-bearing, altered, and mineralized Paleozoic sedimentary
sequence encountered in prior excavations. The oil, freely-flowing and
in fluid inclusions, occurs within and around both low- and high-grade
gold ore bodies. From detailed petrographic and fluid-inclusion work
coupled with field relationships, the oil appears to have been
introduced in the same hydrothermal system responsible for the
precious-metal mineralization. The temperature of mineralization
apparently did not exceed 130°C. This surprising finding is confirmed
not only by pressure-corrected, fluid-inclusion homogenization
temperatures but also by temperature-dependent biomarker transformation
preserved by hydrocarbons in oil-rich fluid inclusions. There is a
distinct depletion in 1/16O of the oil-bearing ore bodies' wall rocks
relative to their unaltered and unmineralized counterparts. Two deep oil
wells completed in the immediate area penetrated neither intrusive rocks
nor sedimentary rocks hydrothermally altered at high temperatures. One
of these wells, just a mile from the ore bodies, bored through the
hydrocarbon source rocks, which at this location and depth were shown by
Rock-Eval pyrolysis to be near peak oil-gen
eration capacity. It now appears highly likely that the gold-depositing
hydrothermal system was directly responsible here for the generation,
migration, and entrapment of oil; however, we still do not know to what
extent, if any, the oil actually contributed to the mineralization
process. In other words, the formation of this particular fossil oil
reservoir may well have been just a beneficial side effect of the
ore-forming hydrothermal event. By contrast, at another oil-rich gold
deposit, Gold Point near Ely, we have determined that hydrocarbons were
crucial to mineralization, most likely providing highly adsorptive
substrates for electrum precipitation.
In huge Railroad Valley, about 25 km southwest of Gold Point and the
site of most of Nevada's oil production, our study of oil-well
drill-stem-test temperatures has indicated that the western side of this
fault-bounded valley is probably a major regional hydrologic downflow
zone, whereas the eastern side, along which the hottest oil fields
occur, is a region of localized geo
thermal upflow of the same waters. These geothermal plumes have fostered
the maturation of hydrocarbon source rocks as well as the migration and
entrapment of the newly generated oils. A pilot study of the regional
hydrocarbon-sealing mechanism in this valley has indicated that
volcanic-ash-rich beds at the base of the valley-fill sequence have been
widely altered to montmorillonite, thereby inhibiting the escape of oils
structurally entrapped in underlying Tertiary ignimbrites and brecciated
Paleozoic dolomites. At Kyle Hot Springs, near Winnemucca in western
Nevada, an active, moderate-temperature geothermal system has generated
paraffin-rich heavy crude oils from hypersaline-lacustrine Tertiary
source rocks, which are otherwise well below the favorable
oil-generation "window." The Kyle system, in a more energetic early
phase, also precipitated hydrocarbon- and gold-bearing siliceous sinter,
bolstering the geothermal/oil/gold connection we have been documenting
in the eastern part of the state.
GRANTEE: UNIVERSITY OF UTAH
Department of Geology and Geophysics
717 Browning Building
Salt Lake City, Utah 84112
GRANT: DE-FG03-93ER14313
TITLE: High Resolution Imaging of Electrical Conductivity Using Low
Frequency Electromagnetic Fields
PERSON IN CHARGE: Dr. Alan C. Tripp (801-462-2112 or 801-581-4664; Fax
801-581-7065; E-mail actripp@...)
Objectives: The project seeks to determine means of increasing the
resolution of low frequency electromagnetic techniques by means of an
optimal use of a priori information.
http://www.sc.doe.gov/production/bes/geo/Publications/FY96Summ/sect13.htm
And there is More company in Nevada:
Nevada
By OGJ editors
HOUSTON, Oct. 6 -- PetroWorld Nevada Corp., George Town, Grand Cayman, began acquiring 19 line-miles of 2D seismic data to verify closure on the Gabbs Valley prospect in western Nye County. Expected acquisition cost is $300,000.
PetroWorld has an exclusive agreement with Cortez Exploration LLC, holder of 90% equity interest in the 44,000-acre prospect, to acquire seismic data over the 12 by 7 mile surface anticline (OGJ Online, July 22, 2004). A well drilled by unrelated entities on the east side of the anticline established the presence of hydrocarbons in the Tertiary section.
Empire Petroleum Corp., Tulsa, Okla., holds the other 10%.
PetroWorld also holds oil and gas interests in Thailand.
Cheers,
Erich
Erich J. Knight
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Dear Folks:
How much oil is in Nevada?
Dr. Alan Chamberlain, this week, stated his estimates, that there is almost 1.9 TRILLION barrels of oil in the state. Mind you, since the 1850s, when the first oil was pumped in Pennsylvania, until now, total worldwide oil production is only 1 trillion barrels. Further, many experts (Deffeyes in Hubbert's Peak, for instance) believe that 2 trillion barrels is the total original world supply, meaning we only have 1 trillion left in the whole world. Chamberlain is now on the record as stating that he thinks there is roughly as much oil in Nevada as the rest of the world put together ever had. Any thoughts on this? If Eden Energy finds a couple of billion barrels, investors are rich beyond their collective imaginations; but a couple of trillion barrels?? That number just seems impossibly big. http://www.cedarstrat.com/index.html
I saw an article about Chevron having a nanotech process for
tar sand oil that's so efficient that $35 oil will be profitable. What if they could develope this tech for CO2 injection?......
http://www.foresight.org/nanodot/?p=2179
Erich J. Knight
-
Hi Erich,
Go to the Nevada Bureau of Mines and Geology website, (I've got it bookmarked - http://www.nbmg.unr.edu/lists/oil/oil.htm) - and download the source rock database for Oil and Gas Wells. You will note that the hydrocarbon available for pyrolosis is above 1.3% in some cases. I have studied this report and it seems to look good for Eden, and I also know of a comperable prospect to Eden with a private investor I know of. If you know anyone interested, let me know. It is 37,000+ acres. Depth of burial as well as hydrothemal pyrolosis makes it looks pretty darn good.
JimBob
If I only had a little humility, I'd be perfect.
----Ted Turner
-
quote:
Originally posted by Bass
From a geological standpoint, all the right ingredients are present:
good source rocks
geologic structures to transport and trap hydrocarbon deposits
younger cap rocks
The only thing missing at this point is... OIL
Sounds like a great place to look for the stuff, but other promising spots in the US overthrust belt have not panned out as expected. Wait for some positive results from the drill holes before investing. There may be a reason why Exxon pulled out the area years ago.
Prediction is difficult, especially the future. -Niels Bohr
It was because they abandoned all domestic oil exploration and focused solely on overseas.
If I only had a little humility, I'd be perfect.
----Ted Turner
-
RE the Eden web page,
where's the beef?
BS
Their stock symbol has a new marking ".ob" which typically=obituary.
As scientists, do you think the following list of insider buys and sells is statistically signficant in either direction?
7-Mar-06 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary 50,000 Direct Option Exercise at $1 per share. $50,000
16-Feb-06 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 10,000 Direct Option Exercise at $2.25 per share. $22,500
15-Feb-06 VANGUARD CAPITAL LTD
239,963 Direct Planned Sale $1,180,0001
15-Feb-06 CLEARWATERS MANAGEMENT LTD
200,000 Direct Planned Sale $636,0001
15-Feb-06 REID, KEITH
20,000 Direct Planned Sale $63,0001
15-Feb-06 FASTRACK CAPITAL PARTNERS
72,996 Direct Planned Sale $230,0001
10-Feb-06 FORT SCOTT ENERGY CORP
339,864 Direct Planned Sale $343,4301
4-Feb-06 PROFESSIONAL TRADING SERVICES SA
72,596 Direct Planned Sale $232,3071
31-Jan-06 DAIMLER CAPITAL PARTNERS LTD
77,300 Direct Planned Sale $227,2621
24-Jan-06 MITCHELL, PAUL
18,000 Direct Planned Sale $63,9001
22-Dec-05 MAC & CO
200,000 Direct Planned Sale $476,0001
13-Dec-05 KALLUR ENTERPRISES LTD.
300,000 Direct Planned Sale $651,0001
5-Dec-05 HOPE, EARL
339,863 Direct Planned Sale $350,0001
5-Dec-05 HOFER, ERICH
333,363 Direct Planned Sale $250,0001
1-Dec-05 128 INVESTMENTS LTD. (ERNEST HUI)
50,000 Direct Planned Sale $150,0001
1-Dec-05 BC LTD, 678540
20,000 Direct Planned Sale $50,0001
1-Dec-05 COOLIDGE, DAVE
30,000 Direct Planned Sale $75,0001
1-Dec-05 BRADAM FINANCIAL HOLDINGS
120,000 Direct Planned Sale $240,0001
1-Dec-05 CMK FINANCIAL HOLDINGS
40,000 Direct Planned Sale $80,0001
30-Nov-05 BANK JULIUS BAER & CO LTD.
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $188,0001
28-Nov-05 CHARTWELL INVESTMENT SVCS
210,000 Direct Planned Sale $420,0001
25-Nov-05 SPECKERT, ERWIN
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $370,0001
24-Nov-05 MITCHELL, PAUL
40,000 Direct Planned Sale $80,8001
23-Nov-05 MAYER, KAREN
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $200,0001
20-Nov-05 DHILLON, AVTAR
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $207,0001
17-Nov-05 COLWOOD ENTERPRISES LTD
40,000 Direct Planned Sale $82,8001
16-Nov-05 KING, PAUL J.
50,000 Direct Planned Sale $146,5001
16-Nov-05 MCCARROLL, JASON
50,000 Direct Planned Sale $146,5001
16-Nov-05 TURNER, BARB
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $293,0001
16-Nov-05 RYBINSKI, JOHN
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $293,0001
16-Nov-05 PRICE, DANA
50,000 Direct Planned Sale $5,146,5001
16-Nov-05 PEDROSA, MARIA
200,000 Direct Planned Sale $586,0001
16-Nov-05 EDWARDS, CHRISTA
50,000 Direct Planned Sale $146,5001
16-Nov-05 MAEDEL, BARRY
50,000 Direct Planned Sale $146,5001
16-Nov-05 TOGNETTI, JOHN
300,000 Direct Planned Sale $179,0001
15-Nov-05 SUBARACHI FOUNDATION
80,000 Direct Planned Sale $296,0001
15-Nov-05 INTERLOAN SA
60,000 Direct Planned Sale $222,0001
15-Nov-05 RIPPON, DONALD
40,000 Direct Planned Sale $80,0001
15-Nov-05 KAMENDA CAPITAL
75,000 Direct Planned Sale $208,5001
15-Nov-05 PESCOD, DAVE
Private or Shareholder 100,000 Direct Planned Sale $225,0001
10-Nov-05 BRIGADOON INVESTMENTS LTD
80,000 Direct Planned Sale $194,4001
9-Nov-05 SHALIMAR BUSINESS SA
90,000 Direct Planned Sale $169,2001
8-Nov-05 FASTRACK CAPITAL PARTNERS
327,404 Direct Planned Sale $959,2321
8-Nov-05 CASE, STANLEY
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $225,0001
7-Nov-05 WEISS, CONRAD
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $294,0001
4-Nov-05 PROFESSIONAL TRADING SERVICES SA
327,404 Direct Planned Sale $779,2211
2-Nov-05 HSU, TSENG HUI
50,000 Direct Planned Sale $100,0001
1-Nov-05 ROSS, THOMAS
100,000 Direct Planned Sale $258,0001
31-Oct-05 SUNDAR, JASON
40,000 Direct Planned Sale $155,0001
28-Oct-05 COLE, BRIAN
20,000 Direct Planned Sale $50,6001
10-Oct-05 MARTIN, JOHN
101,000 Direct Planned Sale $400,0001
6-Oct-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 38,000 Direct Planned Sale $195,0001
4-Oct-05 DAIMLER CAPITAL PTNS LTD
300,000 Direct Planned Sale $1,590,0001
27-Sep-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 36,200 Direct Sale at $5.20 - $5.33 per share. $191,0002
26-Sep-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 56,600 Direct Sale at $5.325 - $5.347 per share. $302,0002
23-Sep-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 7,200 Direct Sale at $5.28 per share. $38,016
22-Sep-05 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 26,200 Direct Sale at $5.32 - $5.4 per share. $140,0002
21-Sep-05 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 51,000 Direct Sale at $5.30 - $5.6 per share. $278,0002
20-Sep-05 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 22,800 Direct Sale at $5.35 - $5.4 per share. $123,0002
19-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 12,000 Direct Sale at $5.164 - $5.24 per share. $62,0002
16-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 10,000 Direct Sale at $4.84 per share. $48,400
15-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 100,000 Direct Option Exercise at $1 per share. $100,000
15-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 5,000 Direct Sale at $5.26 per share. $26,300
15-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 100,000 Direct Option Exercise at $1 per share. $100,000
15-Sep-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 100,000 Direct Option Exercise at $0.50 per share. $50,000
15-Sep-05 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 100,000 Direct Option Exercise at $0.50 per share. $50,000
14-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 20,000 Direct Sale at $5.58 - $5.62 per share. $112,0002
13-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 5,000 Direct Sale at $4.83 per share. $24,150
12-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 5,000 Direct Sale at $4.31 per share. $21,549
1-Sep-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 5,000 Direct Sale at $6.90 per share. $34,500
31-Aug-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 10,000 Direct Sale at $6.93 per share. $69,300
28-Aug-05 TIGER EYE HOLDINGS LTD.
300,000 Direct Planned Sale $1,950,0001
23-Aug-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 50,000 Direct Option Exercise at $1 per share. $50,000
27-Jul-05 BODINO, MICHAEL
Former Director 200,000 Direct Planned Sale $1,000,0001
22-Jul-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 9,600 Direct Sale at $5 per share. $48,000
20-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 7,000 Direct Sale at $4.378 - $4.42 per share. $31,0002
19-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 4,000 Direct Sale at $4.42 per share. $17,680
18-Jul-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 6,700 Direct Sale at $3.842 - $4.659 per share. $28,0002
18-Jul-05 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 25,000 Direct Sale at $4.90 - $4.99 per share. $124,0002
18-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 5,000 Direct Sale at $5.02 per share. $25,099
15-Jul-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 5,000 Direct Sale at $4 per share. $20,000
15-Jul-05 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 25,000 Direct Sale at $3.92 - $4.01 per share. $99,0002
14-Jul-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 3,700 Direct Sale at $3.40 per share. $12,580
14-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 3,000 Direct Purchase at $3.54 per share. $10,620
12-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 5,000 Direct Purchase at $4.26 per share. $21,300
11-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 1,000 Direct Purchase at $4.14 per share. $4,140
8-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 25,000 Direct Sale at $3.528 per share. $88,200
7-Jul-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 25,000 Direct Option Exercise at $0.50 per share. $12,500
7-Jul-05 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 50,000 Direct Option Exercise at $0.50 per share. $25,000
7-Jul-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 25,000 Direct Sale at $3.30 per share. $82,500
29-Jun-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 50,000 Direct Option Exercise at $1 per share. $50,000
23-Jun-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 2,000 Direct Purchase at $2.62 per share. $5,240
15-Jun-05 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 2,000 Direct Purchase at $2.45 per share. $4,900
28-Apr-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 5,000 Direct Sale at $2.70 per share. $13,500
25-Apr-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 20,000 Direct Sale at $2.70 per share. $54,000
7-Apr-05 BONNELL, DREW
Secretary/Treasurer 25,000 Direct Option Exercise at $0.50 per share. $12,500
31-Aug-04 MARTIN, JOHN
Director 3,000 Direct Statement of Ownership
-
?????????????
Michael
-
?????????????
Ariel
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copy cat :)
Michael
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Welcome JDG8R, Glad you here as the "J.D." are my initials as well and I have a niece, her husband and 4 grand-nephews and 1 grand-niece in St. Pete.
There is no "beef" from Eden. It is all from CederStrat, from whom the prospect was purchased. Eden has yet to post any info except this prospect. Chamberlain (CederStrat) is going around the country speaking at any geological meeting that will let him speak hyping his ideas. Until Wolverine's huge discovery in Utah, he was selling prospects in the basins, not the ranges. The project I know of was purchased before both Eden and the Utah discovery ever coame on the horizon. I have worked this area for a while and I think there is oil in Nevada - know where several wells with uneconomice reserves of 42 degree sweet crude are - so there is decent oil to be found in Nevada.
If I only had a little humility, I'd be perfect.
--Ted Turner
-
Let's discuss this in another fifty years. My prediction is that the United States will not be self-suffcient in petroleum in the year 2056. And if we somehow are, Florida will be gradually going underwater due to Global warming.
Looking back at this posting, it is quite cranky. But if you were as interested in global warming as a topic as I am, you might share my concern.
chris wiegard
-
quote:
Originally posted by VAlibrarian
Let's discuss this in another fifty years. My prediction is that the United States will not be self-suffcient in petroleum in the year 2056. And if we somehow are, Florida will be gradually going underwater due to Global warming.
If the US will be self sufficient in petroleum by 2056, it will probably be because petroleum is no longer a significant fuel, and so petroleum consumption has dropped to a level that the US is capable of supplying. That having been said, such a massive drop in petroleum consumption will cause such a drop in the price of crude that it will probably become uneconomic to extract oil in the US (that is essentially what has happened to the coal industry in the UK – there are huge untapped reserves of coal, but the demand for coal is so low that it is not worth paying UK wage rates for UK miners to go down and get it, so we still end up importing the coal we use).
As for Florida, even shutting off all the CO2 production we have will still not stop global warming, so the fate of Florida is down to investment in sea defences, or the absence of them – whichever the politicians will choose.
George
-
Dear Folks:
How much oil is in Nevada?
Dr. Alan Chamberlain, this week, stated his estimates, that there is almost 1.9 TRILLION barrels of oil in the state. Mind you, since the 1850s, when the first oil was pumped in Pennsylvania, until now, total worldwide oil production is only 1 trillion barrels. Further, many experts (Deffeyes in Hubbert's Peak, for instance) believe that 2 trillion barrels is the total original world supply, meaning we only have 1 trillion left in the whole world. Chamberlain is now on the record as stating that he thinks there is roughly as much oil in Nevada as the rest of the world put together ever had. Any thoughts on this? If Eden Energy finds a couple of billion barrels, investors are rich beyond their collective imaginations; but a couple of trillion barrels?? That number just seems impossibly big. http://www.cedarstrat.com/index.html
Also:
I saw an article about Chevron having a nanotech process for
tar sand oil that's so efficient that $35 oil will be profitable. What if they could develope this tech for CO2 injection?......
http://www.foresight.org/nanodot/?p=2179
Erich J. Knight
-
"If Eden Energy finds a couple of billion barrels, investors are rich beyond their collective imaginations; but a couple of trillion barrels?? That number just seems impossibly big. http://www.cedarstrat.com/index.html"
If Eden is really on to something, and it is very tempting to think and hope they are, then why would the insiders at the company and instituitonal investors be selling their stock?
That list I posted above is a list of insider buys and sells. I dont have the energy to add em up, but at a glance the $$ amount of sells hugely outweighs the $$amount of buys. This is not a good sign for small investors who paid for their shares (as opposed to company officers who are granted shares --or are given the option to purchase them at $1 when the stock is trading at $3-- AND recieve a very nice salary).
I really hope there are significant recoverable reserves in Nevada, I really really really do. But at this point I wouldn't gamble if the insiders aren't willing to.
Now investing in tar sand recovery, which is really happening, does seem legit.
I think the best way to play the energy thing is to invest in the big boys (XOM, CVX, etc). If this field proves out, they will get in on it in one way or another. And if alternative fuels are ever realized, they will swallow those companies up with their huge cash reserves.
Just my lay opinion.
Jim
Just found this, from Stocklemon.com which might be of interest:
********************************************************************
August 25, 2005
Stocklemon Reports on Eden Energy (EDNE)
Stocklemon Reports on Eden Energy (OTC:EDNE)
CAN YOU SMELL A MINI-ENRON HERE ??????
Outstanding Shares- 34,943,886
Market Cap- $200 million +
Revenues- 0
Mailboxes around the country have been stuffed with glossy mailers promoting Eden Energy Corp. (OTCBB:EDNE) These cheery promo pieces paint a rosy picture of huge oil and gas finds … but they will never disclose the self-dealings of its insiders, their track record with a similarly-promoted company they hyped less than two years ago, and the deceptions of which stock promotions are made.
The breathless prose describing the next great oil find in the US reminds us of a stock 2 years ago that portended the next great Natural Gas find in the US : that stock was Heartland Oil and Gas -- Wait, wait, don’t tell me -- these two companies share the same office !
Eden Energy and Heartland Oil and Gas
Eden Energy shares offices with another Vancouver stock promotion called Heartland Oil and Gas (HOGC) at 200 Burrard Street, Suite 1925 Vancouver, B.C. But these companies have a lot more in common than their address. HOGC had a similar trading pattern to Eden Energy back in late 2003. Much like Eden Energy, Heartland put out a slew of announcements that discussed the potential of great finds of natural gas in America’s heartland, and follow-on PR boasted of huge financial backing. A sampling of the releases can be found here:
http://www.heartlandoilandgas.com/news.html
Heartland stock currently trades at 45 cents on the OTC – down over 90% from where it was when its glossy mailers were bulk-mailed out -- and its revenues for last quarter were 0.
Meet “The Smartest Guys in the Room” -- The Sequel
The President and CEO of Heartland is Richard Coglon:
http://www.heartlandoilandgas.com/manage.html
Mr. Coglon has a “colorful” past -- he has been reprimanded for conflict of interest breaches in shady offshore dealings with public companies:
http://www.lawsociety.bc.ca/media/news/body_news_01-10-09(coglan).html
Mr. Coglon is also on the board of dormant OTCBB stock BNVLF:
http://www.otcbb.com/profiles/BNVLF.htm
The CEO of Eden Energy is Donald Sharpe. Mr. Sharpe was also the president of Nation Energy (OTCBB:NEGY), currently trading at .20 cents. (It was once $2.00.) He is also a director of Heartland.
But these two men are connected in more than just offices and penny stock oil companies as you will read below.
Eden Energy is supposed to be a company that is drilling for oil in the “fertile” oil fields on Nevada. They own the rights to drill on over 200,000 acres. How did they get these rights? They bought a company called Frontier Exploration that was owned by Fort Scott Energy. As stated in the last 10Q:
“The Company entered into an Assignment Agreement with Fort Scott Energy Corp. (“Fort Scott”) dated August 5, 2004 in which the Company acquired Fort Scott’s interest in a Participation Agreement dated April 26, 2004 with Cedar Strat Corporation (“Cedar Strat”). The Participation Agreement provides for the acquisition of certain oil and gas leases and rights located in eastern Nevada, USA, held by Frontier Exploration Ltd. ("Frontier”), which at the time was a wholly-owned subsidiary of Fort Scott.”
Here is a copy of the news release
http://www.edenenergycorp.com/news083104.htm
How much did the company pay for this assignment agreement?
The Company issued a Promissory Note and Convertible Debenture (“Debenture”) to Fort Scott in the principal amount of $500,000. The Debenture bears interest at a rate of 7% per annum, matures on August 31, 2006, and will entitle Fort Scott to convert the principal and accrued interest into units at $0.25 per unit. Each unit will consist of one share of common stock and one-half of one warrant. Each whole warrant will be exercisable into one additional common share at $0.50 per share on or before the later of August 31.
The company also issued 500,000 shares of EDNE stock to Fort Scott.
Wow, seems like quite a deal … In fact, at today’s prices it amounts to over $25 million worth of EDNE stock, which can be sold into the market at any time whether any oil is ever found on the property or not! We wonder who they gave such a good deal to??????? Answer:
THEMSELVES !
A simple search on Nevada Corporate Records show the sole officer of Fort Scott as none other than Richard Coglon, the CEO of Heartland Oil and Gas.
https://esos.state.nv.us/SOSServices/AnonymousAccess/CorpSearch/CorpDetails.aspx?CorpID=503912
The same search show the sole officer of Frontier Exploration as Donald Sharpe, the CEO of Eden Energy:
https://esos.state.nv.us/SOSServices/AnonymousAccess/CorpSearch/CorpDetails.aspx?CorpID=517445
So, it looks to Stocklemon as if the company bought the drilling rights from themselves in a sweetheart deal, issued a convertible debenture to themselves and NEVER DISCLOSED THAT INFORMATION TO SHAREHOLDERS. To convert that paper (EDNE shares) to greenbacks.
To add insult to injury, if they do happen to find any oil, it says on the Eden Website:
“For each 10 million barrels of proved reserves found, the company is obligated to issue 1 million shares to Fort Scott Energy, to a maximum of 10 million shares”
http://www.edenenergycorp.com/investor.html
…All this without disclosing that true beneficial sellers of the drilling rights are a the CEO of the company and a related party.
This is Fraud. This is an SEC Enforcement issue that must be addressed. Failure to disclose self-dealing violates every principle of corporate governance. It also intentionally misleads the public about the true value of this drilling prospect, which is essentially Eden’s only asset, because there is no process by which the fair value of the asset in this transaction was established.
Is there anything to show there might be oil in Nevada?
The company bases much of their credibility on the words of Dr. Alan Chamberlain. Chamberlain believes there is oil in them thar hills and he has become Eden’s “independent” expert – essentially their credibility. But he isn’t independent either. Eden is partners with Chamberlain through his Cedar Strat operation.
ARE WE SUPPOSED TO BE IMPRESSED ??
On June 14, 2005, the Company, through a newly formed Nevada subsidiary Southern Frontier Explorations Ltd., acquired 50,000 acres of ten-year federal BLM oil and gas leases located in the Great Basin of Nevada, at an average cost of $2.25 per acre. A prospect fee of $750,000 was paid to Cedar Strat in connection with the acquisition of the leases.
So lets get this straight, the company paid $125,000 to acquire the lease and then they paid Cedar Strat (Chamberlain) $750,000 in prospecting fees. And Chamberlain is supposed to be an “independent” expert. It does not take a genius to figure this one out.
Chamberlain also has experience with penny stocks. He is associated with pink sheet issue CLWXF that is trading at .09 cents. http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/050823/235304.html?.v=1
The Promotion
Eden Energy is currently the subject of many newsletter writers. The (in)famous Scott Fraser of the “Natural Contrarian” has sent out a glossy piece recommending Eden Energy. For those of you who do no know, here is Scott Fraser’s experience with SEC Enforcement:
http://www.sec.gov/litigation/admin/34-48544.htm
Meanwhile, the rest of the cast of characters running Eden’s stock promotion was best described in the August 20th article by David Baines of the Vancouver Sun, in which he identifies the other nefarious characters involved in this “scheme”:
http://www.stocklemon.com/files/824200531728PMedne.rtf
Conclusion
Stocklemon has covered numerous Vancouver-based natural resource stock promotions over the years. They all seem to have the same destiny. Stocklemon believes the best predictor of EDNE’s future is the performance of its roommate HOGC. Undisclosed self-dealings, newsletter writers, stock promoters, and 4-color “too-good-to-be-true” brochures of oil and gas finds are the bread and butter, rather than the heart, of Vancouver’s Burrard Street. If the pattern holds true, Stocklemon believes EDNE will separate unwary investors from 90% of their investment dollars.
Cautious investing to all.
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The REAL lemon is...
OTC STOCK SINKER HIDES ON THE WEB
By BEN SILVERMAN
http://www.stockhouse.ca/bullboards/viewmessage.asp?no=7256927&tableid=2
YP.Net Calls Upon Stocklemon.com to Reveal the Names of its Principals, and to Disclose Their Trades Involving YP.Net Stock
http://www.yp.com/press_release.php?releaseid=2004011301
also
http://www.yp.com/StocklemonLawsuit.doc
With respect to the next article below, the author cites Stocklemon's name and address. I cannot trace the phone number, but it might be unlisted or Stocklemon may have since changed the number (if it was ever accurate). However, anyone can go to http://www.reversephonedirectory.com, scroll down the page a little bit, and enter the address. It looks like an office complex with four tenants. I have no idea how the author came by this address or whether or not Stocklemon actually uses one of these spaces.
The Morning Sleuth...Naked Lunch, Served Cold
Aug. 18, 2005
http://www.pennysleuth.com/issues/08.18.05.html
Is Stocklemon a Lemon?
http://www.redherring.com/Article.aspx?a=11786
Erich J. Knight
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Here's the link citing Chamberlain saying there are 1.89 trillion
barrels of oil in Nevada --
Geologist says White Pine must keep public lands open for oil exploration
Claims undiscovered oil reserves are '10 times' Saudi Arabia's
http://www.elynews.com/articles/2006/03/10/news/news03.txt
And last Friday, 3/24, there was a follow-up article --
County modifies wilderness area recommendations to allow oil and gas
exploration
Chamberlain identified an area in the White Pine Range in the
vicinity of Treasure Hill as one of the most important spots to search
for oil. . . He said the shale south of Wheeler Mountain is some of the richest organic material we've found in the state.
http://www.elynews.com/articles/2006/03/24/news/news04.txt
Erich J. Knight
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Posted - 30 March 2006 : 22:49:03
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here's a post from http://forum.oilvoice.com/forum.asp?FORUM_ID=1
"Believe me, I have been a wellsite geologist for over 40 wells in that area, and the Mississippian Chainman is a loaded source rock. Everytime you drill through it you get massive oil shows from the shales. It is the primary source rock for what was at one time the largest producting well in the lower 48, Grant Canyon #3 (I believe it was at 4000 bbls a day for a number of years). The Blackburn field is also sourced by the Chainman, and some of the lower sands in the Chainman are also productive.
Paul Stiles "
Erich J. Knight
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EDEN CEO has been busy selling since I posted the list above. Here is an update of the last 10 days:
Date Insider Shares Type Transaction Value*
31-Mar-06 SPECKERT, ERWIN
98,500 Direct Planned Sale $248,0001
29-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 10,000 Direct Sale at $2.90 - $2.91 per share. $29,0002
28-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 9,613 Direct Sale at $2.98 - $3.08 per share. $29,0002
27-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 1,287 Direct Disposition (Non Open Market) at $2.97 per share. $3,822
27-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 8,000 Direct Sale at $2.95 - $2.96 per share. $24,0002
24-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 11,000 Direct Sale at $3 - $3.03 per share. $33,0002
23-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 10,000 Direct Sale at $3 - $3.03 per share. $30,0002
22-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 9,000 Direct Sale at $3 - $3.03 per share. $27,0002
21-Mar-06 SHARPE, DONALD A.
President 10,000 Direct Sale at $2.95 - $2.99 per share. $30,0002
Erich, you wouldn't happen to own any shares would you? If so, I'd dump them now.
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I smell some insider dealing hear!
What you do speaks so loudly that I cannot hear what you say.
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Here is a video of Alan Chamberlain's May 10 talk to Canada Oil Geologist, High lighting His 50 $million data set for the great basin:
Elephant Hunting Heating Up in the Great Basin
http://www.insinc.com/onlinetv/cspg09may2006/softvnetplayer.htm
Erich J. Knight
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From the way this guy is pushing this I believe that Mr. Knight is associated with CedarStrat or Eden Energy. Neil, Michael, Chris - why don't you put this with the other sales pitches that are posted to this site. There are a lot more attractive plaes to look for big oil besides Nevada. I know of some myself but I am not pushing them here.
Thge continual mention of the "worth" of the data base is a give-away. When this thread was started, the value quoted was MUCH less. Now it is rediculous.
Knight is a salesman.
The mind is like a parachute. It works best when open. -- A. Einstein
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The reason I started this thread was my ignorance of oil geology.
My fear that this large a find would under cut the main clean technologies I have been posting about in my "A New Manhattan Project for Clean Energy" postings.
I wanted to gather informed opinions on the possibility of seeing $25 oil again.
I have gained a much needed perspective on the scale of the Oil consumption and production problems, from this and several other oil forums.
And if this elephant comes to be, I now understand how all arguments have to become for the sake of our Biosphere to convince people not to burn $25 oil.
Erich J. Knight
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My apologies Eric, I made a hast assumption. I do not like the way Chaimberland does buisness. He has hurt a friend of mine severrly in his bank account. I just jumped to conclusions when I saw his name again.
I doubt your fears about $25 a bbl oil will come true. We are in the deilne of oil PRODUCTS avalability due to the lack of refining capacity to meet demand. This is driving the price up. As demand increases, refining capacity has not kept up. There is and will be - for at least 10 years - a lack of capacity and the price of oil will increase.
The mind is like a parachute. It works best when open. -- A. Einstein
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JimBob,
Do not feel bad. Your instinct was correct.
Erich, or Erich115 as he's known on the stock hype site RagingBull.com, has no curiosity, interest, or concern for science or conservation. He is a shill hyping this P.O.S. stock. As he brags on the following link, he is shilling it on all the "geology" forums. I had actually been thinking about trying a few shares of this lemon since I stumbled on this hypster about a month ago. He got me sniffing the bait. Your remark that you have a friend who lost big time with Chamberlain just cements my suspicions that he is a fraud.
http://ragingbull.lycos.com/mboard/boards.cgi?board=EDNE&read=3596
« EDNE Message list | Reply to msg. | Post new msg. « Older | Newer »
By: erich115
15 May 2006, 04:20 PM EDT
Msg. 3596 of 3600
(This msg. is a reply to 3595 by risingbull1.)
Jump to msg. #
Great Snow:I posted it to all the oil discussion and geology forms
A shame that sites hoping to talk pure science are spoiled by crap and jerks like this.
I watched the Chamberlain video and thought he was a creep. For what that is worth.
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Thank you JDG8R. I read some of the other posts on the Eden thread. They just confirm my suspicions. Eden and Chaimberlin are not the people they pretend to be.
The mind is like a parachute. It works best when open. -- A. Einstein
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Yes, of course that's (the secret way I spell my name) me , look at all my posts and you will find critical questions from forums like this, like from UncleAL, re-posted there. So far I have seen no geology question unanswered, at any of the 5 forums I've posted to.
I first posted these Saudi Claim threads maybe a year ago, based on the bulk of the reply's I bought $2000 of stock a few months ago. If I'm a shill,I am a pretty dam cheap one.
Google "Erich J. Knight" what I'm passionate about is an open book
Erich J. Knight
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Erich, you are disengenous at the very least.
"My fear that this large a find would under cut the main clean technologies I have been posting about in my "A New Manhattan Project for Clean Energy" postings." Erich, May 16, 2006
"... I bought $2000 of stock a few months ago. If I'm a shill,I am a pretty dam cheap one." Erich, May 18, 2006
Why wouldn't you tell us "folks" of your position prior to being called out?
You are a shill for yourself.
We feel your pain.
Weak, my friend.
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JimBob,
Can you please give some background info on your 16 May statement regarding Dr. Alan Chamberlain's business practices, and what he specifically did that caused financial damage to your friend? Could help some of us decide if we should invest based on his research or not.
Originally posted by JimBob
... I do not like the way Chaimberland does buisness. He has hurt a friend of mine severrly in his bank account.
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quote:
Originally posted by JimBob
quote:
Originally posted by Bass
From a geological standpoint, all the right ingredients are present:
good source rocks
geologic structures to transport and trap hydrocarbon deposits
younger cap rocks
The only thing missing at this point is... OIL
Sounds like a great place to look for the stuff, but other promising spots in the US overthrust belt have not panned out as expected. Wait for some positive results from the drill holes before investing. There may be a reason why Exxon pulled out the area years ago.
Prediction is difficult, especially the future. -Niels Bohr
It was because they abandoned all domestic oil exploration and focused solely on overseas.
If I only had a little humility, I'd be perfect.
----Ted Turner
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With 3 buck oil the USA needs more oil and will give tax breaks for drillers.Check this recent Maked Science news.
With over 260 billion barrels of proven oil reserves, a quarter of the world's total, Saudi Arabia is not only the top foreign supplier to the United States - the world's largest energy consumer - but also essentially the sole source of liquidity in the oil market. According to the Department of Energy's Energy Information Administration (EIA), the world will become more dependent on Arabian oil in the next two decades. To meet global demand for oil, Saudi Arabia will need to produce 13.6 million barrels a day (mbd) by 2010 and 19.5 mbd by 2020. Both the International Energy Agency and EIA assume Saudi oil output will double over the next 15 to 20 years. In a new study soon to be released, Matthew R. Simmons, president of Simmons and Company International, a specialized energy investment banking firm, contends that this is not likely to happen. He argues that Saudi Arabia's oil fields now are in decline, that the country will not be able to satisfy the world's thirst for oil in coming years and that its capacity will not climb much higher than its current capacity of 10mbd. Considering the growth in demand, this could easily spark a global energy crisis.
Without new USA/Canada oil we will be seeing 300 a barrel oil by 2011 since 22 to 72 in 6years will double with China.s added gas tanks.quote:
Originally posted by erich
Dear Folks,
What do ya'll think of the talk of the 6 billion barrel claims of Eden Energy?
They have contracted three wells this fall to 15000 feet on their Noah prospect in Nevada.
Eden Energy Corp.
http://www.edenenergycorp.com/
Ely Times- Eden Energy seeks oil near Ely
http://www.elynews.com/archive/2005/07/15/LocalNews/324444.html
Erich J. Knight