Naked Science Forum
Life Sciences => Plant Sciences, Zoology & Evolution => Topic started by: smart on 20/06/2018 00:06:16
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What do we know about the precognitive visual system of plants and does a plant can recognize someone looking into him/her?
Thanks bro!! :)
tk
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I'm going to say no.
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I'm going to say no.
Seriously bro, where do you think the human visual system comes from?
tk
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Seriously bro, where do you think the human visual system comes from?
tk
Not from a plant, so I don't know where you're going with this.
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Not from a plant, so I don't know where you're going with this.
It is well-known that humans do share many genes with plants bro... Anyways, I'm just suggesting that the human visual system doesn't come from the stars and probably is a evolutionary landmark of eukariotic organisms.
tk
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does a plant can recognize someone looking into him/her?
It's slightly off-topic, but studies have shown that plants know when herbivores are grazing in their direction.
Plants start to produce more bitter substances in their leaves, which discourages the herbivores.
Some have suggested that this information is conveyed through the wood-wide web!
See: http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20141111-plants-have-a-hidden-internet
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It's slightly off-topic, but studies have shown that plants know when herbivores are grazing in their direction.
Plants start to produce more bitter substances in their leaves, which discourages the herbivores.
Some have suggested that this information is conveyed through the wood-wide web!
See: http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20141111-plants-have-a-hidden-internet
Nice one @evan_au!
Thanks for sharing!
tk
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The more we learn about the communication skills of other species the less arrogant we should become as a species. However, we are nowhere near smart enough to appreciate the implications.
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To answer the top line question, no because the photoreceptors cannot distinguish enough detail to discriminate direction of gaze.
It is thought that the early animal eye was no more than a few light sensitive cells that could detect night & day + the shadow of a predator.
There is certainly a lot more going on in plants than you might imagine. Plants under attack by aphids appear to be able to communicate to nearby plants either by roots or scent.
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It is well-known that humans do share many genes with plants bro...
So what? They don't share the genes necessary to make eyes (or, at the very least, those genes are not expressed in a way that result in the creation of eyes).
Anyways, I'm just suggesting that the human visual system doesn't come from the stars
Who said that it did?
and probably is a evolutionary landmark of eukariotic organisms.
Only specific eukaryotes.
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... does a plant can recognize someone looking into him/her? ...
Don't tell me, let me guess, cannabis plants ?.
Some people claim they can feel if they are being stared at, but it's been tested & it's not true , see ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychic_staring_effect
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Don't tell me, let me guess, cannabis plants ?.
No comment...
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It is well-known that humans do share many genes with plants bro...
It's well known that the last common ancestor of humans and plants didn't have eyes, because eyes are a relatively recent development.
Have you been confused by people talking about potatoes having eyes?.
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To answer the top line question, no because the photoreceptors cannot distinguish enough detail to discriminate direction of gaze.
It is thought that the early animal eye was no more than a few light sensitive cells that could detect night & day + the shadow of a predator.
There is certainly a lot more going on in plants than you might imagine. Plants under attack by aphids appear to be able to communicate to nearby plants either by roots or scent.
Thanks @Colin2B for this highly informative comment!
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Deep inside plant cells there are microtubules which may be useful for regulation of precognitive pathways implicated in vision processing! https://medicalxpress.com/news/2015-06-microtubule-roadway-retina-energy-vision.html
Just saying... :)
tk
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Deep inside plant cells there are microtubules which may be useful for regulation of precognitive pathways implicated in vision processing! https://medicalxpress.com/news/2015-06-microtubule-roadway-retina-energy-vision.html
Just saying... :)
tk
First of all, I don't think you know what the word "precognitive" means (unless you really are suggesting that plants can see the future). Secondly, the article you linked simply says, and I quote, "The findings suggest that these previously unknown microtubule structures provide a "roadway" for the transport of mitochondria crucial to maintain energy supplies into the synaptic terminals of these highly active neurons associated with vision." This is not the same as saying that the presence of microtubules alone can create vision. Even some single-celled organisms have microtubules. Without the necessary tissue and organs to properly focus and resolve light into images, the most you could hope to achieve would be the recognition of the difference between light and dark.
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First of all, I don't think you know what the word "precognitive" means (unless you really are suggesting that plants can see the future).
That's not even what I meant to say bro...
Neurobiologist Provine believes that laughter emerges not from our conscious mind (in other words, the cortex) but from a more primitive part that he calls the “pre-cognitive brain.” He says, “We’re talking about something that’s very deep in our animal nature.” Panksepp, too, sees evidence that laughter is triggered by genetically older structures of the brain. He writes that “it is not exactly a cerebral activity. Then laughter must be an ancient response, part of our earliest evolution into mammals, and is triggered by brain regions that evolved from ancient times.”
http://www.cerebromente.org.br/n13/mente/laughter/page3.html
That quote is much more accurate to what I was trying to say!
tk
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First of all, I don't think you know what the word "precognitive" means (unless you really are suggesting that plants can see the future).
That's not even what I meant to say bro...
Neurobiologist Provine believes that laughter emerges not from our conscious mind (in other words, the cortex) but from a more primitive part that he calls the “pre-cognitive brain.” He says, “We’re talking about something that’s very deep in our animal nature.” Panksepp, too, sees evidence that laughter is triggered by genetically older structures of the brain. He writes that “it is not exactly a cerebral activity. Then laughter must be an ancient response, part of our earliest evolution into mammals, and is triggered by brain regions that evolved from ancient times.”
http://www.cerebromente.org.br/n13/mente/laughter/page3.html
That quote is much more accurate to what I was trying to say!
tk
You should have clarified that from the beginning, as that is an atypical definition of the word that your source gives.
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You should have clarified that from the beginning, as that is an atypical definition of the word that your source gives.
I agree with you on this one. Anyways, what is really interesting me in plant vision is how they could actually have real visual memory like humans. :)
tk
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Deep inside plant cells there are microtubules which may be useful for regulation of precognitive pathways implicated in vision processing!
Microtubules are universal across all the kingdoms of life on Earth, carrying out essential functions in the cell such as:
- Skeleton: Maintain the shape of the cell
- Muscles: The basis of cell movement
- Circulatory system: Moves nutrients around inside the cell
- Reproduction: Microtubules guide chromosome division
Two items missing from this extensive list is "vision" and "cognition".
- At the cellular level, cognition means detecting external stimuli (chemical, electrical, optical, etc), and responding to them (chemical, electrical, movement, etc). The cognitive aspects are managed by triggering gene expression in the nucleus. This then triggers changes in the cell, which may include lengthening or shortening microtubules.
- Light detection is managed by chloroplasts in plants, and specialist rod/cone cells in mammals. But image detection requires the coordination of light detection across many cells, which is handled in a central brain in animals, but appears to have no central coordination in plants - it is a distributed system.
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microtubule#Intracellular_organization
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Anyways, what is really interesting me in plant vision is how they could actually have real visual memory like humans.
How? They can't see. At the very most, they can only detect the different between light and dark.
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How? They can't see. At the very most, they can only detect the different between light and dark.
Not true bro. You should really try to do some research before always refuting my claims... :)
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/veggies-with-vision-do-plants-see-the-world-around-them/
Just saying...
tk
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Microtubules are universal across all the kingdoms of life on Earth, carrying out essential functions in the cell such as:
- Skeleton: Maintain the shape of the cell
- Muscles: The basis of cell movement
- Circulatory system: Moves nutrients around inside the cell
- Reproduction: Microtubules guide chromosome division
Two items missing from this extensive list is "vision" and "cognition".
- At the cellular level, cognition means detecting external stimuli (chemical, electrical, optical, etc), and responding to them (chemical, electrical, movement, etc). The cognitive aspects are managed by triggering gene expression in the nucleus. This then triggers changes in the cell, which may include lengthening or shortening microtubules.
- Light detection is managed by chloroplasts in plants, and specialist rod/cone cells in mammals. But image detection requires the coordination of light detection across many cells, which is handled in a central brain in animals, but appears to have no central coordination in plants - it is a distributed system.
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microtubule#Intracellular_organization
Yo @evan_au
I have thought about your comment for a while and I came to the conclusion that it is quite likely that this Wikipedia article could be seriously outdated!!
tk
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Not true bro. You should really try to do some research before always refuting my claims... :)
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/veggies-with-vision-do-plants-see-the-world-around-them/
Just saying...
tk
Nowhere in that article does it say that any plant has been demonstrated to have the ability to resolve images. It speaks of eyespots, but those are the kinds of things that tell light from dark (like I said before). Even the climbing wood vine they mentioned isn't very good evidence. They would need to rule out chemical signals or other stimuli before they can say with any conviction that it can "see" its host plant well enough to copy its appearance.