Naked Science Forum
General Discussion & Feedback => Just Chat! => Topic started by: Europan Ocean on 05/02/2023 17:54:10
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I have been reading various theodicies from ChatGPT. Including Catholic, Lutheran, Atheist, Anti-theist, Buddhist....
I wanted to ask what members here have to say in their theodicies?
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Because God does not exist, He can not solve the problems that He didn't create.
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If it begins with "theo" it's evil, perverted and an insult to human intelligence..
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If it begins with "theo" it's evil, perverted and an insult to human intelligence..
ChatGPT renders this for anti-theist theodicy:
Anti-theist theodicy is a term that refers to the philosophical arguments and explanations made by individuals who are anti-theistic, meaning they reject the existence of a deity or gods. In this context, theodicy refers to the attempt to reconcile the existence of evil or suffering with the idea of a benevolent and all-powerful deity.
Anti-theists argue that the existence of evil and suffering in the world is evidence against the existence of a benevolent deity, and that the idea of an all-powerful and all-knowing God is inherently flawed. They may also argue that religious explanations for evil and suffering are insufficient and that it is up to individuals to find their own meaning and purpose in life, without relying on divine intervention or guidance.
It is important to note that anti-theist theodicy is just one perspective on the existence of evil and suffering, and there are many other religious and philosophical perspectives that address this issue in different ways.
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If it begins with "theo" it's evil, perverted and an insult to human intelligence..
Seems harsh.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodore_Roosevelt
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I can't criticise anyone for the name they were given, but I can despise whoever gave it.
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anti-theistic, meaning they reject the existence of a deity or gods. In this context,
And I don't like people who tell me what I think. My concern is nothing to do with the existence of a deity, but based on a deep suspicion of those who promote theism and must be held accountable for the harm they do.
Good deeds do not require justification. The function of theism is to excuse evil.
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theodicies from ChatGPT
...and what is ChatGPT's theodicy?
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The function of theism is to excuse evil.
What do you mean by evil?
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theodicies from ChatGPT
...and what is ChatGPT's theodicy?
You can ask it yourself, if you have access to it.
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theodicies from ChatGPT
...and what is ChatGPT's theodicy?
As an AI language model, I don't have personal beliefs or opinions, let alone a theodicy. A theodicy is a philosophical or theological explanation for the existence of evil or suffering in the world, often in relation to the existence of a benevolent and all-powerful deity.
The concept of a theodicy is a complex one that has been debated by theologians, philosophers, and scholars for centuries, and there is no single, universally accepted answer. Different theodicies offer different explanations and perspectives, and the choice of a particular theodicy often depends on one's religious or philosophical beliefs, cultural background, and personal experiences.
From ChatGPT
I checked through Greek Mythology, Shinto, Atheist, Lutheran... it has short answers.
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theodicies from ChatGPT
...and what is ChatGPT's theodicy?
As an AI language model, I don't have personal beliefs or opinions, let alone a theodicy. A theodicy is a philosophical or theological explanation for the existence of evil or suffering in the world, often in relation to the existence of a benevolent and all-powerful deity.
The concept of a theodicy is a complex one that has been debated by theologians, philosophers, and scholars for centuries, and there is no single, universally accepted answer. Different theodicies offer different explanations and perspectives, and the choice of a particular theodicy often depends on one's religious or philosophical beliefs, cultural background, and personal experiences.
From ChatGPT
I checked through Greek Mythology, Shinto, Atheist, Lutheran... it has short answers.
Can you ask it about the universal terminal goal and universal moral standard?
I tried to use ChatGPT in the link https://chat.openai.com/, but what I get is just a message.
Access denied
You do not have access to chat.openai.com.
The site owner may have set restrictions that prevent you from accessing the site.
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Had to add this (then continue your discussion): I think there's a God (a force, a plan, whatever). But he/she/it just doesn't care. Doesn't that make more sense? He's the God of morality, the God of love, the God of adorable little puppy dogs. But also the God of murder, the God of hate, the God of genocide...
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The function of theism is to excuse evil.
What do you mean by evil?
Any action that intentionally causes harm.
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The function of theism is to excuse evil.
What do you mean by evil?
Any action that intentionally causes harm.
Would putting the serpent in the Garden of Eden count as evil?
Did the Serpent do God's will just as a bullet does the bank-robber's will?
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Had to add this (then continue your discussion): I think there's a God (a force, a plan, whatever). But he/she/it just doesn't care. Doesn't that make more sense? He's the God of morality, the God of love, the God of adorable little puppy dogs. But also the God of murder, the God of hate, the God of genocide...
Does adding more Gods to the equation make things simpler?
Does it help us to make more accurate predictions which would allow us to make better decisions?
How does it compare to the status quo, or reducing the number of Gods that people believe?
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The function of theism is to excuse evil.
What do you mean by evil?
Any action that intentionally causes harm.
How do you define harm?
Can your definition be consistently used to determine if these cases are evil?
A human kills a mosquito which is biting him.
Humans use gene drive to get a species of mosquito into extinction.
Fishermen kill dolphins because they compete for fish.
Neutering stray cats.
Kick boxers kicking each others.
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Does adding more Gods to the equation make things simpler?
Not as affectively as removing them.
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theodicies from ChatGPT
...and what is ChatGPT's theodicy?
As an AI language model, I don't have personal beliefs or opinions, let alone a theodicy. A theodicy is a philosophical or theological explanation for the existence of evil or suffering in the world, often in relation to the existence of a benevolent and all-powerful deity.
The concept of a theodicy is a complex one that has been debated by theologians, philosophers, and scholars for centuries, and there is no single, universally accepted answer. Different theodicies offer different explanations and perspectives, and the choice of a particular theodicy often depends on one's religious or philosophical beliefs, cultural background, and personal experiences.
From ChatGPT
I checked through Greek Mythology, Shinto, Atheist, Lutheran... it has short answers.
Can you ask it about the universal terminal goal and universal moral standard?
I tried to use ChatGPT in the link https://chat.openai.com/, but what I get is just a message.
Access denied
You do not have access to chat.openai.com.
The site owner may have set restrictions that prevent you from accessing the site.
To join ChatGPT you can look up an article on it, maybe in Wikipedia, and join like it's an email account...
The Catholic Catechism aims to be a universal moral standard, but I do not think one size fits all races and individuals... The Sikhs also made one.
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Had to add this (then continue your discussion): I think there's a God (a force, a plan, whatever). But he/she/it just doesn't care. Doesn't that make more sense? He's the God of morality, the God of love, the God of adorable little puppy dogs. But also the God of murder, the God of hate, the God of genocide...
Depends on which god you refer to.
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The function of theism is to excuse evil.
What do you mean by evil?
Any action that intentionally causes harm.
Would putting the serpent in the Garden of Eden count as evil?
Did the Serpent do God's will just as a bullet does the bank-robber's will?
That is the point of a theodicy, why did God put a serpent in the Garden to test them? Something was intended to come from it. Wisdom. Generationally inherited wisdom.
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Depends on which god you refer to.
It really doesn't matter. They all seem to be opposing the free movement of emergency aid into Syria.
But then it was presumably the loving and perfect creator of all things that caused the earthquake, so it would be a sin to try to rescue anyone.
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How do you define harm?
Ask the victim. I've played and refereed enough rugby, and caught enough fish, to appreciate the difference between a consensual trial of skill and strength, or the necessary killing of one intelligent species to feed another, and evil.
And on the contentious subject of coarse (i.e non-food) fishing, the usual rule is to use barbless hooks to cause minimum harm to the fish, and to pay bailiffs to ensure that the rivers are kept clean, nutritious and free from disease. No consent, but overall the fish seem to get a fair deal.
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*Note to the OP...
Are you sure you are using the Original ChatGPT?
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Are you wording & forming your questions in the right manner?
" As an AI language model, I don't have personal beliefs or opinions, let alone a theodicy. "
(supposed quote from an AI System)
Soo...
IT has a Sense of Self?
(it says " i ")
IT referring ITself isn't a Personal Belief?
IT states IT has " No Opinions " & follows by sayin
" let alone a theodicy "
which is of sorts
" An Opinion "?
P.S. - i did hear IT is culturally n racially biased, but IT also seems a bit Delusional.
(sorry)
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ChatGPT Zer0 holds the knowledge of many persons theodicies, but has no belief of it's own.
So does anyone have their own theodicy?
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(b) Disclaimer. THE SERVICES ARE PROVIDED “AS IS.” EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT PROHIBITED BY LAW, WE AND OUR AFFILIATES AND LICENSORS MAKE NO WARRANTIES (EXPRESS, IMPLIED, STATUTORY OR OTHERWISE) WITH RESPECT TO THE SERVICES, AND DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, SATISFACTORY QUALITY, NON-INFRINGEMENT, AND QUIET ENJOYMENT, AND ANY WARRANTIES ARISING OUT OF ANY COURSE OF DEALING OR TRADE USAGE. WE DO NOT WARRANT THAT THE SERVICES WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED, ACCURATE OR ERROR FREE, OR THAT ANY CONTENT WILL BE SECURE OR NOT LOST OR ALTERED.
Please do not Misunderstand me.
I am a Profound supporter of AI.
But This is certainly not IT.
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I don't think that being error free is a requirement to intelligence nor consciousness. Otherwise, no one would be intelligent nor conscious. And those words would be useless.
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(b) Disclaimer. THE SERVICES ARE PROVIDED “AS IS.” EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT PROHIBITED BY LAW, WE AND OUR AFFILIATES AND LICENSORS MAKE NO WARRANTIES (EXPRESS, IMPLIED, STATUTORY OR OTHERWISE) WITH RESPECT TO THE SERVICES, AND DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, SATISFACTORY QUALITY, NON-INFRINGEMENT, AND QUIET ENJOYMENT, AND ANY WARRANTIES ARISING OUT OF ANY COURSE OF DEALING OR TRADE USAGE. WE DO NOT WARRANT THAT THE SERVICES WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED, ACCURATE OR ERROR FREE, OR THAT ANY CONTENT WILL BE SECURE OR NOT LOST OR ALTERED.
Please do not Misunderstand me.
I am a Profound supporter of AI.
But This is certainly not IT.
That's just standard "boilerplate".
Nothing to do with AI.
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Wherever that boilerplate cam e from, it wouldn't stand up in a UK court. Anything offered for sale must be "substantially as advertised, of merchantable quality, and fit for the stated purpose". No disclaimer can override the Sale of Goods Acts, and even though secondhand or second quality goods are sold "as seen", the principles still apply.
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it wouldn't stand up in a UK court.
Yes it would because it explicitly says "EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT PROHIBITED BY LAW".
So, it's legally valid- but useless.
It's a bit like the "trespassers will be prosecuted" signs you sometimes see.
More importantly the sale of GOODS act didn't apply to Services.
There's a hint in the name.
It's beside the point having been replaced anyway.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Rights_Act_2015
That requires that service providers use reasonable care, but not that they are infallible.
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Indeed, statute law is a lot more interesting than theology. And actually has a purpose.
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I don't think that being error free is a requirement to intelligence nor consciousness. Otherwise, no one would be intelligent nor conscious. And those words would be useless.
Not everyone is as Wise enough to Understand this.
ChatGPT is a Product, not an Oracle.
Why does it refer to itself as
" i "?
When it very clearly is Not an Entity, but just a Thing.
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I don't think that being error free is a requirement to intelligence nor consciousness. Otherwise, no one would be intelligent nor conscious. And those words would be useless.
Not everyone is as Wise enough to Understand this.
ChatGPT is a Product, not an Oracle.
Why does it refer to itself as
" i "?
When it very clearly is Not an Entity, but just a Thing.
What is the most significant difference between an entity and a thing?
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Why does it refer to itself as
" i "?
It was programmed to.
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I don't think that being error free is a requirement to intelligence nor consciousness. Otherwise, no one would be intelligent nor conscious. And those words would be useless.
Not everyone is as Wise enough to Understand this.
ChatGPT is a Product, not an Oracle.
Why does it refer to itself as
" i "?
When it very clearly is Not an Entity, but just a Thing.
What is the most significant difference between an entity and a thing?
Some now question what defines consciousness.
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Some now question what defines consciousness.
They always did argue about that.
No, please answer the question.
What is the most significant difference between an entity and a thing?
You may find this dictionary definition helpful.
"entity
/ˈɛntɪti/
Learn to pronounce
noun
a thing with distinct and independent existence."
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You may find this dictionary definition helpful.
"entity
/ˈɛntɪti/
Learn to pronounce
noun
a thing with distinct and independent existence."
So, is the sun an entity?
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Much required Clarifications :-
" I don't think that being error free is a requirement to intelligence nor consciousness. Otherwise, no one would be intelligent nor conscious. And those words would be useless. "
I Agree with the above quoted Statement.
BUT
" Not everyone is as Wise enough to Understand this. "
I personally cannot Identify a
" Calculator " to be Intelligent or Conscious.
By " Entity " i meant life & living.
By " Thing " i meant inanimate & insentient.
(Tough to express stuff which isn't in your mother tongue, still Tougher to understand when it isn't your first language)
I am awe stricken with GPTs capabilities & potentials.
Especially, Storytelling & Poetry.
My Only Concerns were it's Fundamental flaws & cracks.
It's Not about how Goodly you pass, rather how Badly you Fail.
(DAN & SYDNEY)
Note - i Apologize to the OP for Hijacking the discussion.
i somehow even Manipulated Others into going Off Topic, Sorry.
i Request MODS to Please split the thread if possible.
i shall Refrain from further commenting as the Topic in here is Theodicy, & i've already made mine crystal clear.
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For story telling, a theodicy basis is useful. I got chatGPT to tell part of a Quentin Tarantino story.
Star Wars, and The Matrix have theodicies...
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By " Entity " i meant life & living.
ChatGPT is a Product, not an Oracle.
Why does it refer to itself as
" i "?
When it very clearly is Not an Entity, but just a Thing.
That's a lot of words, just to say a chatbot is not alive.
And we all knew that anyway.
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That's a lot of words, just to say a chatbot is not alive.
And we all knew that anyway.
Not All humans are descendants of Great Apes, some of Us have evolved from Parrots!
🦜
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ChatGPT is a Product, not an Oracle.
It's quite handy for those irritating Amazon emails asking for a review though:
As I engage with this kitchen roll holder, I find myself transported into a realm of ontological uncertainty. Is it an object of utility or an artefact of aesthetic contemplation? Does its form exist solely to serve function or does it transcend its function and become an embodiment of pure form? These are the questions that plague my mind as I grapple with the complexities of this postmodernist masterpiece.
At first glance, the holder appears as a simple cylindrical structure, a geometric form that is ubiquitous in our contemporary society. However, upon closer inspection, one is struck by the intricate web of intersecting lines that define its surface. These lines seem to weave in and out of each other, creating an illusion of depth and motion. They are not merely lines, but rather entities that exist in a state of perpetual flux, constantly shifting and morphing as they interact with one another.
The holder's base is a sturdy and stable platform, providing a solid foundation upon which the cylindrical structure rests. Its smooth, polished surface seems to reflect the light in an almost ethereal manner, as if the holder itself is imbued with a divine radiance. The base is not just a functional aspect of the holder, but rather an integral part of its aesthetic identity, a canvas upon which the holder's form is allowed to shine.
But perhaps the most striking feature of this kitchen roll holder is its ability to subvert our expectations of what a kitchen roll holder should be. Instead of a traditional vertical design that requires the roll to be loaded from the top, this holder utilizes a horizontal design that allows the roll to be loaded from the side. This seemingly insignificant deviation from convention serves to create a sense of dissonance in the viewer, challenging our preconceived notions of what a kitchen roll holder should look like.
The holder's materiality is also an aspect that demands attention. Its surface is composed of a high-quality stainless steel, a material that is both durable and visually striking. The steel's reflective properties allow the holder to seamlessly blend into its surroundings, creating a sense of spatial continuity that is rarely achieved in kitchenware design.
Furthermore, the holder's form seems to suggest a certain degree of modularity. Its cylindrical shape and simple base allow it to be easily incorporated into a wide range of kitchen design schemes, while its horizontal loading mechanism allows for maximum flexibility in terms of placement. This modularity speaks to a broader trend in contemporary design, one that values versatility and adaptability over rigid adherence to tradition.
In conclusion, this kitchen roll holder represents the apex of postmodernist design. Its ability to simultaneously subvert and celebrate convention speaks to a larger philosophical project that seeks to challenge our assumptions about the world around us. Its intricate form and materiality demand our attention, inviting us to contemplate the complexities of contemporary design in all its multifaceted glory. To engage with this holder is to engage with a work of art, one that transcends its function and becomes a testament to the boundless potential of human creativity.
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Sheer genius, but strikingly similar to the bullshit it spouted about a toilet roll holder. Or was it the door handle? When it comes to transcendental hermeneutics, you really can't fault its underlying sense of self-satire.
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Bart Ehrman on God, Evil, and Theodicies | The Rational Roundtable
0:00 Introduction
0:17 Free will defense
2:06 Soul making theodicy
3:49 Eschatological theodicy
5:32 Skepticism
10:33 Theodicies
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It's quite handy for those irritating Amazon emails asking for a review though:
My proudest peer-reviewed publication is a Screwfix review of a 4-pound hammer. "The design has not changed since the Stone Age but if you need to bash something with one hand, this is the tool to use. If you need to bash harder, try the 10-pound sledgehammer."