Naked Science Forum

Non Life Sciences => Physics, Astronomy & Cosmology => Topic started by: neilep on 27/02/2006 15:31:30

Title: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: neilep on 27/02/2006 15:31:30

Greets Peeps,

I would welcome your thoughts and speculations on how life would be here on Earth if we had no moon !..ie: the changes to planetary life (if any)..the effects on lunar cycles events etc etc

...

How would the space race had been affected by it ? ...would we have visited Mars by now ? and things like that.

Thanks

Neilykins xxxxx Mwah Mwah !!

Men are the same as women.... just inside out !!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Mystericon on 27/02/2006 16:31:31

The only thing I can think of off the top of my head it that we wouldn't have lunar influence on our waves... Is that right? I'm sure I heard somewhere that the moon effects wave patterns and their strength. Correct me if I'm wrong :)

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: neilep on 27/02/2006 16:35:29

You're right there Mystericon . The moon most certainly imposes tidal wave joy !

I am sure there are many other things which are also affected by the moon though.

thanks

Men are the same as women.... just inside out !!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Mystericon on 27/02/2006 16:40:55

http://www.hydro.linz.govt.nz/tides/info/tideinfo3.asp
Interesting article on Lunar effects on waves.

http://www.qppsupport.net/webhelp/index.html?tidesandthemoon.htm
Another great article with excellent diagrams.

Thought you might find these interesting I certainly did. Your post made me search for Lunar effects :P

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: ukmicky on 27/02/2006 20:15:49

A day wouldnt be 24 hrs long without the moon as the moon has been slowing down the earths rotation ever since it was created. just think without the moon a day could be 2 hours long

Michael

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: neilep on 27/02/2006 20:21:37

Cripes, that means I'd be ....no..the YEAR would still be the same length wouldn't it ?...or would it ?..when the earth is between the moon and the sun does it drag it back a little ?

Mystericon........Thanks for the links all good stuff!

Men are the same as women.... just inside out !!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: ukmicky on 27/02/2006 20:48:36

The earth wobbles a little bit, in the same way as jupiter wobble's the sun and the earth .
Wobbling is one of the two ways that we can find planets orbiting other stars , the other way is to measure for dimming of the star light reaching us due to a planet orbiting the distant star passing in between.

Michael

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: neilep on 27/02/2006 21:24:31

I like it when girlies bits wobble !

Men are the same as women.... just inside out !!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: ukmicky on 27/02/2006 21:32:49

i prefer it when they are hanging down in my ****. You nearly got me to divulge. naughty Neil

Michael

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Ray hinton on 28/02/2006 00:11:18

if our days were 2 hours long,you wouldnt have time to worry about girls "wobbly"bits,we would be spinning at 12000 mph and you would have to hang on for grim death. NB all the girlies bits would be pointing at the sky.   [:D][:0]

its the drugs,y-know.

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Dr B on 28/02/2006 03:54:07

The moon would also have shielded us from a lot of imapcts.  Stabilized our wobble, caused rapid tidal cycling in the early days  (see http://www.newscientistspace.com/article/dn4786)

No moon then no life on Earth ...

Dr B
Istanbul

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Mystericon on 28/02/2006 20:13:45

quote:

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Originally posted by Dr B

The moon would also have shielded us from a lot of imapcts.  

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Oh yeah! I mean look at all those craters... Nice little moony. [:D]

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: upton on 28/02/2006 20:21:45

Apparently the moon is moving away at us at the rate of 2-3cms a year. Eventually , albeit a long time, we will no longer enjoy total eclipses of the sun.

~~~I can't think of a signature~~~

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Mystericon on 28/02/2006 20:24:50

You say "apparentley" Where did you get the information from?

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: ukmicky on 28/02/2006 22:17:11

yes the moon is moving away from us and as the angular momentum of the earth and moon are conserved the moon has to rob some from the earth as it moves away,  which it does by slowing the rotational angular momentum of the Earth, which causes the days to get longer.
The orbits of the two bodies  would stabilize in 10 or so billion years but unfortunately the sun will have become a white dwarf by then and the process which the sun will go through to become a white dwarf will destroy the earth.

i will find some web links for you


http://curious.astro.cornell.edu/question.php?number=124
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_acceleration

Michael

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: upton on 28/02/2006 22:25:18

quote:

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Originally posted by Mystericon

You say "apparentley" Where did you get the information from?

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I can see that UKMicky has provided the answer but I saw it on Tv last night. A special programme about the moon.

Thanks UKMicky for clarifying it.

~~~I can't think of a signature~~~

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Mystericon on 01/03/2006 00:35:52

I read the info thanks Micky!
Thats really interesting to know its moving away... trouble is the further away it gets the less of a shield it'll become :(

But that would also mean it was closer millenia ago... So our first ancestors may have seen a huge moon. I bet they never dreamt they would walk its surface one day, well, their descendants... :)

"Oh yeah, I didn't think of that" - My Physics teacher

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: upton on 01/03/2006 01:06:59

Yes, that was the point of the program last night. When the moon was created , after the earth had had a collision with a large planetary object, the moon was created out of the debris. the earlier years saw the moon a lot lot closer to the earth until it settled where it is now,albeit moving away at a very slow pace.

They measure the distance by firing a laser at a reflective mirror/prism that was ,left up after the Apollo missions, and calculate the distance by the time it takes for the reflection to come back. It is one of the last remaining Apollo missions still going today.

~~~I can't think of a signature~~~

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Mystericon on 01/03/2006 03:14:16

Good to know. Thanks buddy. This will mean the moonlight will also dim as it becomes less and less concentrated on the earth :( No moonlit dinners, but also no big white lump, that your sister says is "a levitating football" [:D]

"Oh yeah, I didn't think of that" - My Physics teacher

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: neilep on 01/03/2006 11:28:48

I wouldn't be too concerned Mystericon...in a hundred years it would have only gone back a couple of meters or so....Hey !!..at least it's retreating rather than coming towards us !!...cos that could really ruin your day waking up one morning to find the moon in your garden  !..then your sister would say...thioe pesky kids from next door, always kicking their ball into our garden !!'

Men are the same as women.... just inside out !!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Mystericon on 01/03/2006 19:14:29

Lol Oh dear... But on the good side; Less tidal waves ;)

"Oh yeah, I didn't think of that" - My Physics teacher

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Ophiolite on 04/03/2006 01:43:41

quote:

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Originally posted by neilep
I would welcome your thoughts and speculations on how life would be here on Earth if we had no moon !

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Dr.B has already quoted the New Scientist review of the hypothesis that life could not have originated without the frequent, dramatic salinity fluctuations on the early Earth, as a consequence of a much closer moon and a six or seven hour day. Of course, if you suspect life originated around black smokers or via pan spermia, this would not be a limitation.

However, the move from the seas to land was undoubtedly facilitated by tidal range. Without the moon the tides raised by the sun would be paltry affairs, and it is doubtful if life would ever have made it onto land.

Dr.B also mentioned the stability of our axial tilt afforded by the moon. This deserves to be emphasised. Without the moon's stabilising influence the Earth's wobble would range from a few degrees to over forty. The effect upon climate would be dramatic and would arguably lead to frequent mass extinction events.

Another factor worth considering relates to plate tectonics. Life, certainly as we know it, could not exist on an Earth that lacked plate tectonics. The mobility of the plates is made possible because the quantity of sialic material (granite like) that makes up the contintents is small, and these can move around readily. If the proportion was higher is probable that the plates would long since have locked in place.
Much of the Earth's old sialic components are what make up the moon, having been thrown there by the collision with a Mar's sized planetoid, as mentioned by upton. So, without that collision and consequent loss of much of the original crust and upper mantle, plate tectonics may never have taken a hold on the Earth, and we would not be here to contemplate the monotony of moonless nights.

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: neilep on 04/03/2006 17:00:24

Ophiolite,

Thank you for your excellent response.

Men are the same as women.... just inside out !!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: DrPhil on 04/03/2006 18:34:01

If there were no Moon we wouldn't have any lunatics or werewolves.

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: neilep on 04/03/2006 18:57:56

quote:

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Originally posted by DrPhil

If there were no Moon we wouldn't have any lunatics or werewolves.

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[:D][:D]LOL !!...and there's plenty on this site right now !!

Men are the same as women.... just inside out !!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Hadrian on 04/03/2006 21:24:03

The tidal system on earth played a big part in how life evolved. No moon no us and therefore no loonies or werewolves!

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: deordiedaz on 05/05/2006 20:50:39

and i would never get myt leg over again cos that only happens once in a blue moon lmao

Title: Re: If the Earth had no moon !!
Post by: Hadrian on 05/05/2006 21:34:20

I would miss the moonlight
(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.activity4life.com%2Fphoto%2Fpuppy_dog_eyes.gif&hash=3e678a689ef04927bae34bacbb68f024)
 

What you do speaks so loudly that I cannot hear what you say.