Naked Science Forum

On the Lighter Side => New Theories => Topic started by: Thebox on 20/04/2017 12:28:31

Title: If the Universe is expanding, what it is expanding into?
Post by: Thebox on 20/04/2017 12:28:31
A balloon inflates, the  balloons surface passes through space and the space passes through the balloons surface.
Title: Re: Atoms have 0 permeability and 0 permitivity to space.
Post by: Colin2B on 20/04/2017 12:50:08
Ok, ignoring the fact that permeability and permitivity have specific meanings, I will take the sense of your comment and ask how do you know? What measurements have you taken to prove this?
If you push an object (ignoring friction) it has a resistance to acceleration. Just a thought.
Title: Re: Atoms have 0 permeability and 0 permitivity to space.
Post by: Thebox on 21/04/2017 12:14:26
Ok, ignoring the fact that permeability and permitivity have specific meanings, I will take the sense of your comment and ask how do you know? What measurements have you taken to prove this?
If you push an object (ignoring friction) it has a resistance to acceleration. Just a thought.

Ignoring friction there is still the ''drag'' of gravity.

However experiment,

Equipment :

Ruler
Balloon

Method:

Measure a length of space with the ruler

Place a deflated balloon in the middle of the measured length.

Inflate balloon.

Result:  The outer measured space of the deflated balloon, ends up inside the balloon, the space passing through the balloons surface and the surface passing through space.  We can also observe by using a transparent balloon, that light also passes through the balloons skin, but we also know that light does not pass through an opaque surface but the space still does.


Or simply :

you - There is no space in that box there is an inflated balloon

me- yes, but the space in the box is now inside the balloon.

you - how did the space get inside the balloon?

me - The space in the box passed through the balloon while it was inflating.

me- the balloon is air tight and even can hold water, but it cant hold space .
Title: Re: Atoms have 0 permeability and 0 permitivity to space.
Post by: Demolitiondaley on 21/04/2017 19:36:27
There is no space, the box is full of air which has been forced out by the balloon which in turn has been filled by other air. I don't think the air or space passes through the air tight rubber.
Title: Re: Atoms have 0 permeability and 0 permitivity to space.
Post by: nilak on 21/04/2017 20:55:01
I still don't get your point. You are only saying that in the end there is more space into the balloon which is obvious. Also, as the balloon expands the membrane of the balloon travels through space in all directions, with the result of more space inside the balloon. The pressure inside the balloon causes the membrane to travel in such a way,( supposing the balloon centre at rest).
Your thought experiment is equivalent to having n number of atoms disposed in a circle. While you blow some air in the middle then the atoms travel on radials from the centre expanding the circle.
But that has nothing to do with permeability and permittivity of free space. What do you want to prove? That space can pass through atoms? You can say that I suppose if you think of space as a medium. If you want you can think of inertia as a drag when accelerating through space. If space is a medium then you can also define a hypothetical free space that is not a medium for reference only.
 If space is not a medium then your experiment only says atoms or particles can travel through space by changing their position with time which we already know.
Title: Re: If the Universe is expanding, what it is expanding into?
Post by: Thebox on 22/04/2017 15:23:27
There is no space, the box is full of air which has been forced out by the balloon which in turn has been filled by other air. I don't think the air or space passes through the air tight rubber.
The box is full of air and the inflating surface of the balloon does force the air out of the box, however the space in the box is now inside the inflated balloon which was outside of the deflated  balloon. The space passes through the air tight , water tight rubber to get inside the balloon.
Title: Re: If the Universe is expanding, what it is expanding into?
Post by: Thebox on 22/04/2017 15:26:15
I still don't get your point. You are only saying that in the end there is more space into the balloon which is obvious. Also, as the balloon expands the membrane of the balloon travels through space in all directions, with the result of more space inside the balloon. The pressure inside the balloon causes the membrane to travel in such a way,( supposing the balloon centre at rest).
Your thought experiment is equivalent to having n number of atoms disposed in a circle. While you blow some air in the middle then the atoms travel on radials from the centre expanding the circle.
But that has nothing to do with permeability and permittivity of free space. What do you want to prove? That space can pass through atoms? You can say that I suppose if you think of space as a medium. If you want you can think of inertia as a drag when accelerating through space. If space is a medium then you can also define a hypothetical free space that is not a medium for reference only.
 If space is not a medium then your experiment only says atoms or particles can travel through space by changing their position with time which we already know.
Not permeability or permitivity of free space, permitivity and permeability of matter relative to space passing through the matter. It is quite apparent that space can pass through things and the things offer no opposing force to space in the way of permitivity or permeability.