Naked Science Forum

On the Lighter Side => New Theories => Topic started by: John21 on 18/02/2007 17:40:40

Title: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 18/02/2007 17:40:40
(After writing this post and registering I noticed that the forum rules specify no sexual content. I was going to stop, but I did a search and found another post about it. I hope this type of discussion won't be deemed inappropriate.)


Hi. I would like to relate my very personal story of an unusual condition that I have been plagued with. Ever since puberty I have had serious problems in the days immediately following ejaculation. My first symptom was acute back pain in the days following, at whatever age it was, perhaps around 14. After a few years it changed to an impaired cognitive condition, which I would describe as definite mental illness, in which thinking becomes very difficult, and it feels horrible in a way that can not be described. I'm sure specific neurotransmitters are depleted or something, but the cause of such a reaction is what I have never been able to understand. This has occurred following both nocturnal emissions and sexual activity. To minimize the problem I am not sexually active and try to avoid nocturnal emissions.


John 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: paul.fr on 18/02/2007 19:28:55
Hi John.

i personally have never heard or known of anyone with your symptoms. You may find some usefull information here:
http://www.issm.info/prod/system/main/index.asp

an example of their work:
Post-Orgasmic Cognitive Symptoms
Dr. John Dean presented a case of a man in his mid fifties complaining of lifelong transient loss of memory and irritability that occurs after every orgasm. Otherwise the patient has no other sexual complaints, and no neurological disorders diagnosed by a neurologist. Dr. Dean considered asking the patient to masturbate and to have an orgasm whilst he was having his EEG. Dr. Charles Moser reported seeing two similar cases and forwarded an abstract by Dr. Waldinger –published in J Sex Marital Therapy- describing a post-ejaculatory syndrome in two men with spontaneous ejaculations. The syndrome consists of severe fatigue, intense warmth, and a flu like state, with generalized myalgia.

Dr. Gorm Wagner advised in-depth technical and psychological evaluation and considering simple measures such as post-coital blood pressure evaluation. Dr. Giuseppe La Pera advised a 24-hour Holter test, and reported a similar case with post coital elevated blood pressure, where symptoms resolved with beta blockers.

Dr. David Rabinowitz advised a full battery of investigations, and raised the possibility of a dissociative state, or a variant of Transient Global Amnesia. Dr. Ganesh Adaikan forwarded an article from the lancet where a woman with similar symptoms was cured with the antiepileptic, carbamazepine. Dr. Broderick also advised ruling out arrhythmias and blood pressure disorders by an ambulatory halter monitor and Blood Pressure cuff, then proceeding with considering dissociative states.

Paul
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 18/02/2007 21:33:46
John,

Just acknowledging to you that your post is welcomed and definitely appropriate,

I sincerely hope that in addition to Pauls post above that some helpful comments arrive here soon.!!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 06/06/2007 09:55:17
Hi John,

I have the same problem.  I contacted Dr Waldinger and he told me that Post-Orgasmic Illness Syndrome is characterized by a general myalgia (that i don't have, only knee pains sometimes). Anyway most cases of POIS are about 40-50 years old. The auto-immmune hypothesis is possible(after orgasm the body release something and fight against it, as it was a virus or stranger => severe sweets, severe tiredness... )

EDIT 2011  : Some of my posts are obsolete after 2nd and 3rd paper of M.Waldinger. The auto-allergic hyposthesis was the good one. But we keep one eye on hormones theory because some of us have succes with testsosterone for example.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.storiedmind.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F04%2FIts-Not-All-in-Your-Head-150x150.jpg&hash=278589d9e3bf6d00515c9f529e9b2673)


Quote
Tired and sweaty after sex? A Dutch doctor said on Friday he is studying a rare new syndrome among middle-aged men who complain of flu-like symptoms for up to a week after having an orgasm.

Marcel Waldinger, head of the department of psychiatry and neurosexology at Leyenburg Hospital in the Hague said he planned to publish a report on "post-orgasmic illness syndrome" in the US Journal of Sex and Marital Therapy this month. Waldinger has seen five Dutch men in as many years in his surgery complaining of a range of flu-like symptoms, including a sore throat, sweating, extreme fatigue and eye irritation after sex.

"Men developed influenza-like symptoms within minutes of having an orgasm. It is like having a serious flu. This happens as soon as they have an orgasm," said Waldinger. "It is a new syndrome or a syndrome which is old but has not been looked at properly." The syndrome could be a physical disorder caused by an allergic reaction or the immune system in direct response to the release of chemicals in the body after sex. The symptoms lasted between three and seven days, he said. "We know that during orgasm and ejaculation very specific compounds like hormones are released into the nervous system. One hypothesis is that they might have had an allergic reaction to one of those compounds," Waldinger said.

http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=13719471

Quote
We describe the symptoms of a postejaculatory syndrome in two men with spontaneous ejaculations. The syndrome consists of severe fatigue, intense warmth, and a flulike state, with generalized myalgia. These symptoms occur rapidly after ejaculation and only disappear after 4 to 7 days. The symptoms are so severe that sexual activity is avoided. The cluster of symptoms is named postorgasmic illness syndrome (POIS). To date, no explanation has been offered for the etiology and pathogenesis of the symptoms, and the prevalence is unknown. Both cases are presented to draw attention to this syndrome for further research regarding etiology, pathogenesis, and treatment.

ISSM Links :
http://www.issm.info/prod/system/main/index.asp?page=/prod/data/issirlist/digest13.htm

http://www.issm.info/prod/system/main/index.asp?page=/prod/data/issirlist/digest16.htm#Post%20Orgasmic%20Illness%20Syndrome


Quote
Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome

Dr. Mulhall presented a case of a 48 year old man complaining of crashing upon ejaculation for 2 days. He feels flu like symptoms, extremely achy, heavy, very sluggish cognitively, and sometimes even sore throat. He avoids ejaculation. Apart from that he is cardiac free with normal testosterone and cortisol. He suffers from hypothyroidism. His libido is normal.
Dr. Mulhall found nothing in literature except a single paper (case report on 2 patients) by Dr. Marcel Waldinger and hence was asking about any ideas as regards the pathophysiology and management of this problem.
Dr. Kevan tried for such cases a number of analgesics including gabapentin and pregabalin as well as many of the classic treatments for 'prostatitis'. Distraction techniques and other non ejaculatory (but orgasmic) Taoist type sexual activity, he thought might be useful. He also added that for some cultures and many couples, there are a number of psychosomatic or relational factors to considered.
Dr. Moser suggested success with Buproprion having anti-anxiety properties with no negative effects on sexual functioning. Dr. Ashour had success with Tramal 50mg PRN. Dr.Dave wrote about a study which tried an opioid antagonist (Naloxone ) given to a group of atheletes having similar symptoms post exercising and questioned if this syndrome could be related to endorphin deficit.
Dr. Krishnamurti stated that in some countries some guys believe that loss of semen (vital fluid) causes weakness. Many of these develop post-ejaculatory symptoms to varying degrees, sometimes severe.
Detailed discussion

Dear ISSM Members:

Please read below an email from a man who seems to have
post-orgasmic illness syndrome. other than a single paper
(case report on 2 patients) by marcel waldinger I have not
found any other useful literature. I would value your thoughts
as to the pathophysiology and management of this problem.


"My symptoms became apparent about 8 years ago. They are
very simple really. Upon ejaculation I crash. By that I
mean, completely (and I mean completely) drained of energy
for about 2 days. I feel flu-ish, extremely achy, heavy,
very sluggish cognitively, sometimes even sore throat.
Needless to say, I avoid ejaculation. Other than that I am
(according to my doctor) a normal, healthy, 48 year old male
although I have hypothyroidism. I just had a physical and all
blood tests and heart are normal. I have had testosterone
and cortisol tested and those are normal. Also, libido is
normal."

I am currently seeing a client with the same syndrome. I
recommend contacting Marcel D. Waldinger,

He was able to give me some insights into my case. He is
currently
conducting another study on this topic but his results have
not been
published yet.
Annette Owens, MD PhD

Dear John & Annette

I am currently trying to help another man with these symptoms in my andrology clinic who avoids ejaculation at all costs. To date he has tried a number of analgesics including gabapentin and pregabalin after trails of many of the classic treatments for 'prostatitis'. Other men I have treated with similar symptoms are often resistant to medical interventions.

Distraction techniques and ‘prescribing’ non-ejaculatory (but orgasmic) Taoist type sexual activity may be useful but the aftermath of loss of ejaculatory control for many of these men is too overwhelming and they cannot be persuaded to become sexually active again.
Of course for some cultures and many couples there are a number of psychosomatic or relational factors to consider.Kevan.

Dear folks,
I have had several patients like this as well. I have also noted that they are resistant to medical interventions. My best success is with buproprion XL, but patients often choose to discontinue it, even after it has “helped.”
Take care,
Charles Moser, PhD, MD, FACP

Charles
what is the rational for Wellbutrin?????
Pierre Assalian

I saw this as an anxiety disorder, at least in my patient.
Buproprion does
have anti-anxiety properties (though many people do not
believe the data)and it has no negative effects on sexual functioning. It
also tends to energize people, so I thought it might help the feelings of
fatigue after orgasm.

The patient was seen back 2 in weeks; he took 150 mg QD for
a week then 300 mg QD for a week. He felt his fatigue was less severe
after orgasm and his girlfriend thought everything was better in their
relationship. He was seen after another month on 300 mg a day and reported that the
fatigue and other symptoms were better and were still improving, but were not
yet resolved. He then decided to travel for 6 months and did not want to
take the pills with him. Also of note, he broke up with his girlfriend.
Pt was lost to follow-up at that point. Take care, Charles Moser

Dear All:

Is it possible to prove that this syndrome is NOT functional in etiology ? What is the scientific explanation for this symptom complex ? In this part of the world, there are millions of guys who believe that loss of semen (vital fluid) causes weakness. Many of these develop post-ejaculatory symptoms to varying degrees, sometimes severe.
If there's conjecture about possible organic etiology, it has to be established unambiguously.

Sudhakar Krishnamurti

It is possible, but the patients I have seen did not seem preoccupied with semen loss or overly worried about it. They just noted this response.
See reference below.
Take care,

Charles Moser, PhD, MD, FACP
Dear Annette and all
i had one case of the same symptoms who failed any treatment but what found of geat help is to use Tramadol-Tramal 50 mg as PRN thrapy.
Shedeed Ashour Shedeed

Dear colleagues,
The syndrome described is reminiscent of a study I recall in which physically fit volunteers were given an opioid antagonist (Naloxone I think) and then asked to exercise. Rather than experiencing the "high" well known to exercisers after an aerobic session they experienced a response similar –it seems to me- to that described in the post-ejaculatory syndrome: fatigue, anhedonia, etc. So the question: could this be a syndrome of endorphin deficit??
Dave



"Composition of Semen
According to Sandor Gardos, Ph.D, the former About Sexuality Guide, it
contains very modest quantities of the following substances...

ascorbic acid, blood-group antigens, calcium, chlorine, cholesterol,
choline, citric acid, creatine, deoxyribonucleic acid, fructose,
glutathione, hyaluronidase, inositol, lactic acid, magnesium,
nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, purine, pyrimidine, pyruvic acid,
sodium, sorbitol, spermidine, spermine, urea, uric acid, vitamin B12,
and zinc."


440 POIS cases  (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149009#msg149009)

 Congratulation to Dr Waldinger's team : they have found the gene of premature ejaculation.  (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/10/081007132509.htm)

Very important doc : neuroendocrine response to orgasm (http://joe.endocrinology-journals.org/cgi/reprint/177/1/57.pdf)



Please answer the questionnaire :
http://pois.olympe-network.com
Ejaculation and testosterone (http://www.zju.edu.cn/jzus/2003/0302/030219.pdf)

New Pois Site ! :
http://sites.google.com/site/poiswebsite/

2nd scientific study : (february2010) !
http://casereports.bmj.com/content/2010/bcr.10.2009.2359.short
Thank you vey much Thisisme and CCconfucius for this excellent link.
Named as coital headaches but symptoms described in complete article are definitly Pois symptoms (3 days duration, cognitive, fatigue...).
The information was given just some days after publication and we really enjoyed this help.

3rd scientific study ! (Thanks Demo)
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/123304654/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0


News 2011 :

Dr Waldinger published 2 new papers :
- Confirmation of auto-immune cause.
- Experimental cure

Videos on Pois :


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 06/06/2007 10:05:06


6/ ISSM Update :
http://www.issm.info/v4/data/issmlist/digest21.asp#Post_Orgasmic_Illness_Syndrome

Quote
Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (Dr. Sarah Ashworth)

Dr. Ashworth had a case of an 18 years old male complaining of post orgasmic illness syndrome in the form of cognitive symptoms associated with anxiety and depression. Flouxetine was prescribed which had some effect with regard reducing the amount of nocturnal emissions he experiences but has had little effect regarding his other symptoms post orgasm. Dr. Moser had tried SSRI and Bupropion with limited success. Dr. Ashour suggested the trial of cymbalta or tramal. Dr. Boul thought it might be a form of General Anxiety Disorder (GAD) with the depersonalisation experienced in Panic Attacks which might be related to a past traumatic sexual experience.

I am wondering whether it would be possible to post a query on your list or if you could provide me with any further information - particularly practitioners who know something about Post-Orgasmic Illness Syndrome.

I am about to conduct a mental health assessment on an 18 year old young man who has given me prior information that he believes that he suffers from POIS. Certainly the symptoms he describes seems to fit with the examples I have just read on your forum. The symptoms he lists are as follows:

Lack of concentration
Lack of cognition
Disorientation
Brain fog <-- most important
Absentmindedness
Confusion
Shortened attention span
Depersonalization
De-realization
Exhaustion (physically and mentally)
Word finding difficulties
Tongue tied
Inability to comprehend/retain what is read
Impairment of speech and/or reasoning (forming thoughts into words)
Inability to calculate numbers
Depression
Anxiousness

Any advice I could give him about how to get help would be appreciated. He finds his symptoms so troublesome that he has abstained from sexual behavior including masturbation for some time and states, "If I did not have a single orgasm in the rest of my life I would be so happy."

He tells me he has seen two GPs, neither of whom had heard of the syndrome and has subsequently been prescribed Fluoxetine 20mg which has had some effect with regard reducing the amount of nocturnal emissions he experiences but has had little effect regarding his other symptoms post orgasm.

Hope you can help and best wishes, Sarah

Sarah Ashworth

I do believe POIS exists, but there is no data on what the underlying problem is or how to treat it. Many of the individuals are quite disturbed about it (understandably), but it is not clear how to help them. I have used SSRI’s to help decrease sexual urges. I have had some limited success with Bupropion. I am also interested in what others have tried.

Sincerely,

Charles Moser, PhD, MD, FACP

Dear all

Yes it exists But the symptoms vary beteen patients. I do believe its a sort of neurotransmitters depletion??? but regarding this case it points to an AD or ADHD background of the pt. Pls check and if not; trial of Dual action anti depressants may help Cymbalta 60 mg. or Tramal 50 mg PRN in very limited range.

Shedeed Ashour

Dear Sarah

The symptoms of post orgasmic illness syndrome, and the ones you describe for your young clients, sound very much like most of the symptoms of General Anxiety Disorder (GAD) with the depersonalisation experienced in Panic Attacks.

My immediate thoughts, particularly with a young inexperienced client, would be around potential past traumatic sexual experiences i.e., early masturbatory trauma - being caught in the act, being ridiculed by a partner, or abused. Indeed, it could be a form of PTSD but it would appear that there haven’t been any long term studies to identify if the episodes intensify or change. The client could also have fears of such things as losing control, sexually transmitted diseases, inadequacy, and there is also a possibility of confusion over sexual identity.

Medication for the physical symptoms will assist your client in engaging in therapy and exploring any underlying psychological issues.

Hope this is of assistance.

Lori Boul PhD



EDIT Some of my post are obsolete since 2011 and new papers on Pois.





Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: lyner on 08/06/2007 23:53:27
There  is also the risk of stress and depression due to lack of  sexual release. It seems you just can't win.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/06/2007 22:00:06
Hi John,

I'm really happy that you posted (and others replied).I've had POIS symptoms (no myalgia)for decades! I thought testosterone injections would help, but that turned out to only work very modestly (and exacerbating the need to have sex!).

I'm lost and extremely disappointed having this problem. I don't want to curtail sex, even though I know it creates this awful 4+ days misery.

Let's keep in touch!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 26/06/2007 09:43:50
sophiecentaur : Yes you right. Without sexual activities you feel more nervous and depressed, that's why i try to have it once a month. But the exhaustion is  so severe that you need to slow down the frequency.

You post is interesting. Yes, testosterone injections seems to have a low effect on our state. You talked about POIS : have you described these symptoms with a doctor ? Very very few doctors know what pois is. As i said,  POIS refer to myalgia. I don't have myalgias but cleraly intense muscle tremors  and nervous system agitated in the 15-20 hours following orgams and strange cold/hot sensations (ill state as POIS). Then severe fatigue and brain fog start.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/06/2007 19:07:05
Hello B_Jim!............MANY thanks for your reply, I've contacted numerous physicians, sex researchers and many others over the years with my symptoms....and I usually get blank stares..."Gee, I never heard of THAT!" Thank you, Dr. send me a bill. Sorry to be so sarcastic, but I'm beyond desperate! (I'm hunting a solution for 25+ years)

I tried to contact you, Jim_B, but I can't figure out those crazy codes to copy (I haven't a clue how I finally made it here to TNS!)

Getting in touch with Dr Waldinger has been enormously frustrating. I succeeded once, then the email kept changing.

As you asked me to note, my most recent post-orgasmic symptoms just ended, and included 4 days of extreme exhaustion, depression, foggy cognition, burning FINGERTIPS - all 10 (this has included dermatitis, numbness and heat).

JIM_B AND EVERYONE: Since I'm unable to contact you here because I can't copy those cryptic messages (UdHk?)I would love to start a correspondence: let's gang up on this crazy syndrome!!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/06/2007 19:08:51
B_Jim   not Jim_B    MY APOLOGIES.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: paul.fr on 27/06/2007 20:33:24

There is another similar discussion here: http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=2734.0
You may find it interesting.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Cox on 19/07/2007 11:13:32
Hi everone,

I was somewhat pleased to discover that I wasn't the only person to suffer from this infliction. I am a 30 year old male from the UK, who has suffered from this post ejaculation depression for a number of years. The main symptoms I get include extreme tiredness, depression "brain fog" and flushing. It has ruined a number of my relationships and has further increased my depressive state. I too have tried seeking medical advice to no avail.
Conversely, I am upset to see that this condition doesn't seem to be recognised. It is evidently a problem, which is more common than one might suspect.
Out of interest - do those of you who suffer from this also have (clinical) depression? And do you know if any of your family members suffered from the same condition (if you are like me you probably haven't asked)!
How is the medication working out by the way?
Keep in touch everyone - I really feel that we need to explore this further!!

TTFN

Rob  [:-\]

 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 19/07/2007 16:10:05
Rob, it seems to continue working (as I suspected not as good as the first time, but still significant improvement). Time will tell. The depression is there and it worsens post-org.

Rob, your problem seems like min..."blank stares" from professionals. It's because it is VERY rare (in my opinion) - I thinl Dr. Waldinger, who is the only one who seems to have studied it, said that as well.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Cox on 24/07/2007 12:56:10
That's sounds interesting keep us posted!!

Thanks 

Rob
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/08/2007 07:27:19
I'M CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC! First Day of POIS (less the myalgia) symptoms, popped a Levitra again as an experimental "cure." Also recently resumed testosterone therapy (for months the lab and the doctors had me labeled as "female" (what idiocy!) so naturally my T-readings looked high when they were in fact low.

Levitra (plus testosterone?) seemed to work again! Not the total "cure" that I hoped for, but a significant reduction of POIS symptoms, including reduced recovery time.

I AM NOT A PHYSICIAN...so don't rush out and replicate my experiment...also, I have one anxious eye on the Placebo Effect, although the very encouraging thing is that this is the 3rd try, and the placebo effect normally doesn't last on repeated trials.

It would be great if anyone can shed any theoretical light on this, i.e., why does Levitra seem to work, albeit imperfectly?
Perhaps it speeds up the replacement of lost sperm? Just a wild guess.

Fewer things than POIS have been as misery-making in my life. I hope, for me and others similarly afflicted, that this may be a modest breakthrough.

Can someone contact Dr Waldinger to see what he thinks?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/08/2007 18:38:55
I also find that keeping the mind O-F-F these symptoms of POIS helps. I tend to obsess quite a bit on the symptoms, especially the dry fingertips. Wish me luck, I just started another POIS cycle this morning and I'm not taking Levitra (I'm hoping that the peak testosterone level I'm on will help). But if I don't improve by tomorrow morning I'm taking L. Again, don't copy what I do, let me be the "guinea pig" !
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: mellivora on 22/08/2007 13:01:36
Hi all,
Probably like the rest of you guys I surf the net periodically looking for info about POIS from which I suffer. Well done for being brave enough to post about it. I too was in touch with Dr Waldinger, including filling out a questionaire for his research but have long since lost contact with him as he doesn't reply to emails anymore. My POIS started after I had treatment for an overactive thyroid which then went underactive following radioiodine treatment - I now take thyroxine to correct my underactive thyroid. A therapist I saw managed to actualy speak to Dr Waldinger and he apparently thought the thyroid treatment could possibly have set the condition off. Does that make sense to anyone else? Dr Waldinger said my symptoms do match POIS symptoms. However, I see there seem to be quite a variety of POIS symptoms and I don't have all of them. The most frustrating aspect is the mental fog, extreme tiredness and reduced capacity to think clearly. In the beginning (10+yrs ago) this could last as much as a month after orgasm! I also had a pressure in my head that made it feel like my eyes were bulging out. Over the years it has become less severe (or at least doesn't last as long) and now it takes  around a week to recover. Needless to say this has had a detrimental effect on my social life and my work. I don't get the muscle pain some people describe but I can get loose stools (used to be diarhoea but usually not that bad now) and severe sore throat though generally I don't get that so bad either now. It's mostly the tiredness and diminished mental abiity which decreases confidence when I'm affected. I haven't yet found anything that I can say reduces symptoms but have read all your commments and ideas on this with interest. Two things have helped me. The first was when I learned about Dr Waldinger's research and that there was actually a name for the condition and it was recognised (all be it by few doctors). That makes it easier to talk about and of course there's the knowledge you're not alone. One of the biggest things though has been just remembering that its not my fault I suffer from this and to recognise that I do a pretty amazing job of coping with it, incredibly frustrating as it is. I was used to being a high achiever in life, or at least academically, until POIS hit me. Naturally I get down about it as anyone would. But I also know its not my fault that I have POIS and recognising that has, for me, been an important thing. I'm not sure of the best way to make this condition of ours more widely recognised and researched but I think that is what it needs. Lets try and club together and work towards that.
I'll check back here regularly and post other relevant stuff as I think of it or come across it. Thanks again for starting and contributing to this thread. I hope others who suffer POIS will find it.
all the best to you guys,
stay in touch
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 25/08/2007 22:46:27
HELLO MELLIVORA,

Thank you for your post. Welcome. And let's keep up the mutual effort, everyone, maybe we'll yet conquer this most annoying syndrome! It was great to see someone else come forward, maybe we'll see more.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/08/2007 19:18:48
POIS symptom abatement progress. Levitra seems to have a continuing effect. Possibly the testosterone too, but in combination. In the first day or two of symptoms, to combat lethargy: I increased my caffeine consumption (btw, I am a caffeine addict FWIW; I'm also on ADD stimulants; and I just tried a vitamin supplement that seems to work, called "5-HOUR ENERGY" available at convenience stores such as 7-11. If unavailable, their distributor can be reached at 1-888-960-9495. No, this is not a commercial LOL.

Best wishes, everyone, for much success. Please keep posting, telling me you're alive and well!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: bobsie on 31/08/2007 22:41:32
I am a 57 yo male that has just experienced a very similar episode.

My last two ejaculations created a very strange experience for me.  I became very confused and "punch drunk", similar to what has been described above.  The confusion lasted 4 to 5 hours but eventually dissipated.

The first time this happened was four weeks ago, my wife thought I was having a stroke, and rushed me to the ER in a state of mental confusion.  They kept me overnight for tests; CT, MRI, EEG and Holter Monitor.  Nothing abnormal except my BP was sky high 156/117.  I seemed to come out after 4 or 5 hours. 

I didn't connect the problem with ejaculation until it happened to me again, last weekend.  Both times was I was masterbating.  I have never experienced anything like this before.  Now I'm afraid to have intercourse with my wife and began browsing and found this.  No sure what to do next.   
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: TracySt on 01/09/2007 03:34:01
Hello.

This is my first post, and I really want to thank you for your existence and your discussion. A 43 year old male, I have suffered from what appears to be POIS for the last 24 years (with the symptoms usually lasting 2 to 4 days). There is definite muscle tremor and weakness, along with fever, mental fog and anguish, exhaustion, heightened susceptibility to colds, and pronounced depression. Though I have been treated for depression for the last 23 years, the post-orgasmic depression is so acute that at times it has left me quite desperate and practically suicidal.

As with others who have posted above, this condition is so debilitating that I avoid sexual activity for the most part. And if I do find myself in the throes, I am painstakingly careful not to climax, for fear of facing the resultant condition. (Obviously, one can see how this can take its toll on a relationship.) This may sound strange, but I've even become vigilant in my sleep, avoiding sexual contact in my dreams if possible, so as to avoid the post-orgasmic condition. Further, I have a history of prostatitis and notice that if there is prostatic spillage, I sense the onset of POIS.

Thanks to your postings. I will copy this page (and others referenced here) and discuss this with my doctors. Though I have been on a variety of antidepressants and adjunct meds, I haven't had any relief.

Interestingly, recently my psychiatrist wanted to use an atypical anti-psychotic (Abilify) as an adjunct antidepressant. Unfortunately and apparently, my dopamine level was reduced which resulted in greatly exacerbating the depression. My motor skills were somewhat impaired and my mood plummeted radically to the point of despair. Actually, these symptoms echoed what I feel during the post-orgasmic period. Thus, I can see how dopamine (and other neurotransmitters) may play a role in all of this.

Again, I can't thank you enough for being here and sharing. Before I attributed the peculiar POIS to the general constellation of maladies that can be associated with clinical depression. I now know that this is a distinct condition, I am not alone, and perhaps there is hope.

Best wishes to everyone!

Tracy
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 04/09/2007 20:51:09
If someone wants to contact me, I'd be so grateful knowing I am not alone in this... my e-mail and MSN Messenger is jplewin@hotmail.com

The post above was an e-mail I sent to Dr Marcel Waldinger to several e-mail directions... if someone could help me contact him, I'd be so happy...

I'm very happy to have found this forum... I hope someone answers it jejeje.
I've suffered a lot because of this, nd I hope this can help us find a solution to our problem.

Saludos desde Chile
Juan Pablo
JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: mellivora on 06/09/2007 16:08:59
Welcome to the forum jplewin, TracySt, and bobsie. Thanks for sharing your stories with us, it’s good to hear from you.
B_Jim you seem to have spent a lot of time researching possible explanations for our syndrome and you have given me renewed inspiration to do the same. I have some scientific/biological  background but not medical. The internet is a wonderful tool for us all.

Demografx, thanks for your continued updates on your Levitra trials etc. Having read a bit about Levitra I can’t explain why it might work but I’m definitely no expert and if its  helping you then that’s great! I was interested to read that you are on ADD stimulants since low dopamine may underlie ADD/ADHD and B-Jim’s sources suggest dopamine may be at the heart of many of our problems.

I remember reading somewhere that someone suffering POIS or at least sexual exhaustion, had hormone level tests before and after orgasm and was found to have normal hormone levels except for elevated prolactin (permanently elevated not normal post-orgasm refractory period). (I thought it was a post on this forum but now it seems not as I can’t seem to find it again at the moment). Anyway this is also interesting because prolactin seems to inhibit dopamine release. Not just that but prolactin could be related to some autoimmune problems (something I’ve only read briefly about so far but there seem to be a lot of references on the internet). So whilst we have these two theories of dopamine/serotonin  deficiency and POIS (autoimmune reaction), they could very well go hand in hand. But I’m just speculating and don’t have enough knowledge (yet!).

Personally, I’ve always seen a resemblance between my symptoms and an allergic reaction in the way I get pressure in my head and sinuses  - it just feels like some sort of allergic reaction. So Dr Waldinger’s POIS seemed to fit when I found out about it. But I wouldn’t really say it feels like flu and  I don’t get sweats or muscle ache. One thing I have long noticed is that I feel worse in the mornings than later in afternoon and evening. Our biological clocks are regulated in part by melatonin which interestingly is synthesized from tryptophan via one of our suspects, serotonin. Melatonin also has effects on the immune system.
I’m not suggesting at all that melatonin has much or anything to do with our condition but clearly the roles, interactions and balances between all these things – the various neurotransmitters and hormones is complex and there seem to be all sorts of possible knock on effects which are doubtless different in different people.

I’ve just been suffering another episode these past few days which has affected my work. It’s so frustrating. But its great to be able to talk about these things with people who understand what its like so thanks for your continued posts

B_Jim, Coffee and tea don’t work for me either in terms of alleviating tiredness. Infact sleep doesn’t seem to help much when I’m in a post-orgasm phase– I wake up feeling tired regardless of how much sleep I have.
I’m interested in hearing all you are able to tell about this Zoloft case!

We now have eight people on this forum (including myself) who have come forward with POIS or seemingly related conditions and I think the forum is evolving into a persuasive tool toward gaining wider recognition for our syndrome. I suggest we start (if you haven't already!)to make any sexual medicine professionals that we are in contact with aware of this forum thread to raise awareness. I have included the link to this thread in emails to two doctors well respected in sexual medicine  and I hope you are all ok with me taking this step. It seems to be all of our aims to raise awareness and get our conditions more widely researched. I'll let you know if I hear of any developments.

Best to all,

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 07/09/2007 02:54:07
B_JIM I THINK IT IS A COMBINATION:  Levitra, Testosterone injections, ADD supplement (Adderall), Caffeine (B_Jim, instead of coffee/tea try No-Doz tablets?), and now also Cymbalta. Today, POIS DAY #1 but no Levitra. ** And feeling good! ** But yesterday I had an injection of testosterone, so it is fresh in my system. Today lots of caffeine. Plus the two other psych meds I mentioned in the morning. Best wishes to you again.

demografx, your symptoms :
"4 days of extreme exhaustion, depression, foggy cognition, burning FINGERTIPS"

You have effective results with levitra only for these symtoms then ?

What about your ADD supplement ?

Coffee/tea dont work for me (make me crazy and anxious)


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 07/09/2007 03:01:04
B_JIM, you stated "Coffee/tea dont work for me (make me crazy and anxious)"

In your case then, No_Doz is not a good idea; it is basically caffeine-in-a-tablet, so it will make you "crazy and anxious".

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 07/09/2007 04:31:24
When I explained Levitra to my psychiatrist, he suggested experimenting with Cialis, since it has a 36-hour effectiveness. Perhaps I will.

Quote from: mellivora
link=topic=6576.msg121786#msg121786 date=1189091339

Thanks for your continued updates on your Levitra trials etc. Having read a bit about Levitra I can’t explain why it might work but I’m definitely no expert and if its  helping you then that’s great!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 07/09/2007 04:45:55
DR WALDINGER: Several people (including myself) have been frustrated trying to reach Dr. Waldinger. Since he is the foremost POIS author/researcher, he could be an invaluable ally here. So please feel free to try to reach him! (I will try, too). If you reach him, tell him about this site! Below is one of 2 places he is listed at:

Dr. Marcel Waldinger
Associate Professor in Sexual Psychopharmacology,
Utrecht University,
Department of Psychopharmacology,
Faculty of Pharmaceutical Sciences and
Rudolf Magnus Institute for Neurosciences,
Utrecht, The Netherlands

Tel.: +31 30 253 91 11 (operator)
Tel.: +31 30 253 70 00 (information and advice on study programmes)
Fax: +31 30 253 33 88
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 07/09/2007 22:48:51
DOPAMINE
I saw my psychiatrist today and he reviewed this site. I mentioned to him that dopamine seems to be a narrowed-down suspect in our POIS-cure search. He replied that "[There is] no more [of a] powerful dopamine releaser than Adderall.  Would not suggest cocaine." As I mentioned, I am taking Adderall, which is basically an extended release amphetamine.

Yesterday, I posted that it was Day #1 and the timing coincided with the timing of my taking 60 mg Adderall XR. Interestingly, I did _NOT_ take Levitra yesterday or today, but was still relieved of a large degree of POIS sysmptoms! Which continues today, Day #2. Also, though, as I mentioned, I had my testosterone injection two days ago, so the fresh circulation of testosterone may also be a contributing factor. Perhaps the combination?

This doctor did not have great hopes for me with Zoloft, because he said that everyone reacts very uniquely to it (and to all antidepressants). I have now switched to Cymbalta, which seems to be alleviating depression better than the previous Effexor. But in 30-60 days I may try Zoloft, and the doctor said he would cooperate.

Perhaps the new Cymbalta in y system is yet another contributing factor to this current success? Placebo effect? We must consider everything.

This is a frustrating road for all of us. But with some successes already and future hopes which none of us have had before we banded together, we can think much more positively than the past.

Thanks everyone for the great support. I would of course, highly welcome any thoughts, questions or comments on what I just reported.

Best regards.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/09/2007 01:43:19
LEVITRA
Today is "Day Zero" and I took Levitra and the usual meds, PLUS a lot of coffee. When I feel my energy go down, I try to counter it with caffeine. That seems to work best during the day. Today is not as good as my last report above, but still better than most episodes in my life. JP mentioned that we could exchange our experiences in how POIS has disrupted our lives. In my case, it has been severe. Even when the symptoms go away after 3-4 days, it is ALWAYS hanging over my head because I know POIS is "just around the corner", whenever the release happens. But now there is new hope, especially with the 8 people here. For YEARS I denied there was a "POIS" - - I always thought - at first - the symptoms were "something else". I just couldn't believe that such a natural pleasure could cause such great harm! Another thought: today is not bad for "Day Zero". The frequency is way up, probably due to the testosterone. Hope this post is not rambling too much. Best to all.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/09/2007 18:38:03
POST ORGASMIC MENTAL ILLNESS?
I just now sent a request to the moderator to change our topic from POST ORGASMIC MENTAL ILLNESS to POST ORGASMIC ILLNESS SYNDROME (POIS). This would help more people to find us, I think.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/09/2007 18:49:31
LEVITRA, ADDERALL, CYMBALTA, TESTOSTERONE, CAFFEINE?
Today is Day 1 of POIS. Feeling pretty good, not perfect. Just a little sluggish. I just had 2 Starbucks cans of "double-shot espresso" - Anyway, I posted all the meds above because now I'm not sure which one - or which combination - is working! One theory is emerging: the closer I am to having taken the testoserone injection, the better I feel. And I do feel (intuitive only) that Levitra plays a role (I'm not sure it's the pivotal role I originally thought because I once did NOT take it and I still felt better!) Although MELLIVORA (a member of this group who posted above) and my psychiatrist as well, seem befuddled as to why Levitra should work. But as MELLIVORA says, if it works, be happy  : - )

Sorry, everyone, that I don't have EXACT answers, but I do see promise and hope. The most I have had in over 30 years of POIS!!

Best regards.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 11/09/2007 02:12:38
Hi everyone...
demografx... you seem to be very enthusiastic! I'am too since I 'met' you here.
I would give you an advise. Since you are testing medication with yourself, I'd do what it's done in some motorsports (I practice karting, jejeje). This is to test every change in the setup one at the time... because if you don't, you don't know what really improved your performance. Maybe that can help you/us get better results.

Greetings!
JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/09/2007 20:43:02
Thanks JP! Today is POIS Day 1 and I'm feeling good (not "perfect" but better than I have ever been in 30 years of POIS-misery!!!)


Hi everyone...
demografx... you seem to be very enthusiastic! I'am too since I 'met' you here.
I would give you an advise. Since you are testing medication with yourself, I'd do what it's done in some motorsports (I practice karting, jejeje). This is to test every change in the setup one at the time... because if you don't, you don't know what really improved your performance. Maybe that can help you/us get better results.

Greetings!
JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/09/2007 20:50:59
Your experience with testosterone is intersting. We have few infos on the release of testosterone and sperm regeneration.
For dopamine, the problem of taking stimulant is you will increasing adrenaline/noradrenaline too. That's probably why i have problem with coffee.   So, to keep a high serotonin level maybe it's better to work with inhibitors.  
I'm searching guys with zoloft experience but very few have tested it. I will probably test myself soon at low proportion. (25mg)
Cymbalta is inefective too ? It's the third inefective ssri too then. As effexor, it works on serotonin/noradrenalin.

B_Jim....no, I did not say Cymbalta is ineffective. It may be EFFECTIVE, because two trials ago, I did NOT take Levitra but still felt much better. I had JUST BEGUN Cymbalta, and I was also close to testosterone injection, so I do not know which helped the most. I suspect CYMBALTA helped most, because in the past when I was on Effexor - and also taking testosterone...it did NOT seem to help.

Best regards
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/09/2007 21:01:20
Hi everyone...
demografx... you seem to be very enthusiastic! I'am too since I 'met' you here.
I would give you an advise. Since you are testing medication with yourself, I'd do what it's done in some motorsports (I practice karting, jejeje). This is to test every change in the setup one at the time... because if you don't, you don't know what really improved your performance. Maybe that can help you/us get better results.

Greetings!
JP

THANK YOU JP FOR ADDING YOUR ENTHUSIASM!!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/09/2007 21:03:56
THANK YOU TO THE MODERATORS FOR CHANGING THE NAME OF THIS DISCUSSION TO POIS! (and not Mental Illness!)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/09/2007 21:15:47
Let me invite you all to a community dedicated to POIS.
It's a more interactive place where we can post our feelings and improvements.
Hope you all join in and maybe more people will come over and share their experiences.

The site is:

http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=39047985&refresh=1

(copy and paste)

Please don't be ashamed of joining in... I think it will benefit our comunication a lot.

Hope to see you in.

JP

THANK YOU JP I JUST JOINED THIS GROUP AND RECOMMEND IT TO OTHERS HERE>
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 12/09/2007 00:26:48
Hi guys, it has been a while since I initiated this thread, I really didn't expect to get any responses like yours so I haven't checked back. Today I received an email from Neil notifying me of your responses. Wow, it is nice to know I am not alone after all. I have only gleaned your messages so far, I will soon read them in more depth.

Personally I am chaste now and avoid the problem altogether. As I said in my first post, when I was sexually active I was convinced that avoiding all milk products produced the most marked reduction in symptoms. I am wondering, have any of you guys experimented with a dairy free diet?

...looking forward to discussing this syndrome with you all.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 15/09/2007 17:29:31
Remembering my symptoms: they were apparent in the morning following sex, whereas I instantly feel like I am altered mentally:  mentally drained (but not physically) and would feel intensely unwell (the fires of hades comes to mind) Perhaps it could even be described as still being "in" sex somehow.  After a few days it would subside and be replaced with a burnt out mental state that would continue for days. Overall the reaction would approximate a week in duration. During this time I have to work hard to hide this mental problem from others such that it does not affect my employment and relations with others. 

Another point that may be worth mentioning is that I have always had severe premature ejaculation. I'm talking about one or two strokes following penetration. I have tried many medications over the years, mainly SSRIs, and Paxil did somewhat reduce the PE, but not to a level that would seem normal. Neither the Paxil or any other SSRI ever helped me against the post orgasmic syndrome.

Around age 25-30 I was very active in going from doctor to doctor,explaining this very personal problem. It is very hard to talk about something that no one had ever heard of before, yet is plain as day to yourself. The most demoralizing part is that doctors seem to be inclined to not believe my adamant assertions that it is physical in nature, thinking that it's reality most likely has a psychological basis (such as guilty feelings toward sexual activity). Too bad a broken mind cannot be seen like a broken leg.

These days I feel loneliness, as the POIS/ insomina preclude me from entering in a real relationship, and I feel shame and loss of not having a family of my own.

I am interested in hearing if anyone has had any more success with medication.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 15/09/2007 22:55:29
Jim, hi. Zoloft was one of the medications I had tried, they all had an effect on my mental state, easing my anxiety but not the problem. By the way if any of you are on SSRIs and want to stop using them do it sloooowwwwly, especially Paxil. I stopped it suddenly and had quite bad consequences: hearing cutting out, the "zaps", pulsatile tinnitus. I still have the pulsatile tinnitus to this day, approx 15 years later. I think that doctors are more aware of this problem now.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 15/09/2007 23:52:30
JP,
I didn't want to say too much on your scrapbook, I don't know how private this issue is between you and your friends. I'm glad to hear you could discuss it with your parents, I can't imagine doing that! Your symptoms don't seem to match mine exactly, although reading yours brings back to mind minor aspects of the syndrome I have experienced such as flushing of the face, enhanced bowel movement ease, sore throat, somewhat swollen glands in the neck. At times during intense discomfort I have measured my blood pressure being far above normal, which I was able to demonstrate to my doctor. When I was not experiencing this condition I was otherwise healthy, blood pressure and all.

As you have searched the web you probably have come across the website actionlove.com, as I have. I don't think the author of this site "Dr Lin" is a real doctor, and I find his potions for sexual problems rather dubious. (Actually I tried them once, after reading testimonials)  But you might find it interesting to read the accounts of people listed there who have problems post-sex.  He will go into some longwinded technical analysis about what is causing the person's problem (which I suspect he truly believes yet is probably gibberish). Anyway you might wish to read it if you haven't already.

You mention you are taking schizophrenia medication, did you have schizophrenia before these post-sex problems developed? Or is this merely an attempt to cure this specific problem?

I'd love to hear more about your situation (and others here as well). Nice to hear from you.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 16/09/2007 00:04:38
Here are examples of "Dr" Lin's site:

http://www.actionlove.com/extra/adhd.htm
http://www.actionlove.com/extra/over.htm

As I said, I find his explanatins dubious, and consider that he is trying to sell wonder potions. But at the same time it is interesting to read the stories people relate.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/09/2007 19:06:00
LEVITRA CONTINUED
Yesterday was "Day Zero". Since I started feeling POIS symptoms,and I didn't want to rely on the "maybe" of Cymbalta, I proceeded to take Levitra......AFTERWARDS!

lol. That seems as funny as taking contraceptive-prevention the day after. So........today is "Day #1" and I DO FEEL BETTER!

Stay tuned  : - )
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/09/2007 19:32:35
Let me invite you all to a community dedicated to POIS.
It's a more interactive place where we can post our feelings and improvements.
Hope you all join in and maybe more people will come over and share their experiences.

The site is:

http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=39047985&refresh=1

(copy and paste)

Please don't be ashamed of joining in... I think it will benefit our comunication a lot.

Hope to see you in.

JP

THANK YOU JP I JUST JOINED THIS GROUP AND RECOMMEND IT TO OTHERS HERE>

JP, AS I MENTIONED IN MY EMAIL TO YOU I WISH TO RETRACT MY RECOMMENDATION TO JOIN http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=39047985&refresh=1
NO FAULT OF YOURS, JP, BUT BY LOGGING ON TO www.orkut.com IT VERY AGGRESSIVELY "FORCES" YOU INTO
A SUBSCRIBER STATUS WITH iGOOGLE.COM AND MAKES IT EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO UNSUBSCRIBE. SO I CANCELED MY JOINING THE "POIS COMMUNITY", WITH MUCH DIFFICULTY. JP, THANKS, THOUGH, FOR YOUR VERY GOOD INTENTIONS. SINCERELY, demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/09/2007 19:51:29
JP,
I didn't want to say too much on your scrapbook, I don't know how private this issue is between you and your friends. I'm glad to hear you could discuss it with your parents, I can't imagine doing that! Your symptoms don't seem to match mine exactly, although reading yours brings back to mind minor aspects of the syndrome I have experienced such as flushing of the face, enhanced bowel movement ease, sore throat, somewhat swollen glands in the neck. At times during intense discomfort I have measured my blood pressure being far above normal, which I was able to demonstrate to my doctor. When I was not experiencing this condition I was otherwise healthy, blood pressure and all.

As you have searched the web you probably have come across the website actionlove.com, as I have. I don't think the author of this site "Dr Lin" is a real doctor, and I find his potions for sexual problems rather dubious. (Actually I tried them once, after reading testimonials)  But you might find it interesting to read the accounts of people listed there who have problems post-sex.  He will go into some longwinded technical analysis about what is causing the person's problem (which I suspect he truly believes yet is probably gibberish). Anyway you might wish to read it if you haven't already.

You mention you are taking schizophrenia medication, did you have schizophrenia before these post-sex problems developed? Or is this merely an attempt to cure this specific problem?

I'd love to hear more about your situation (and others here as well). Nice to hear from you.

John

John, I spent many years following a "POIS CURE" by the Thailand Taoist Mantak Chia, based on achieving orgasm without ejaculation. It was a useless/worthless experience. But I was desperate.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/09/2007 20:58:54
Hello.

This is my first post, and I really want to thank you for your existence and your discussion. A 43 year old male, I have suffered from what appears to be POIS for the last 24 years (with the symptoms usually lasting 2 to 4 days). There is definite muscle tremor and weakness, along with fever, mental fog and anguish, exhaustion, heightened susceptibility to colds, and pronounced depression. Though I have been treated for depression for the last 23 years, the post-orgasmic depression is so acute that at times it has left me quite desperate and practically suicidal.

As with others who have posted above, this condition is so debilitating that I avoid sexual activity for the most part. And if I do find myself in the throes, I am painstakingly careful not to climax, for fear of facing the resultant condition. (Obviously, one can see how this can take its toll on a relationship.) This may sound strange, but I've even become vigilant in my sleep, avoiding sexual contact in my dreams if possible, so as to avoid the post-orgasmic condition. Further, I have a history of prostatitis and notice that if there is prostatic spillage, I sense the onset of POIS.

Thanks to your postings. I will copy this page (and others referenced here) and discuss this with my doctors. Though I have been on a variety of antidepressants and adjunct meds, I haven't had any relief.

Interestingly, recently my psychiatrist wanted to use an atypical anti-psychotic (Abilify) as an adjunct antidepressant. Unfortunately and apparently, my dopamine level was reduced which resulted in greatly exacerbating the depression. My motor skills were somewhat impaired and my mood plummeted radically to the point of despair. Actually, these symptoms echoed what I feel during the post-orgasmic period. Thus, I can see how dopamine (and other neurotransmitters) may play a role in all of this.

Again, I can't thank you enough for being here and sharing. Before I attributed the peculiar POIS to the general constellation of maladies that can be associated with clinical depression. I now know that this is a distinct condition, I am not alone, and perhaps there is hope.

Best wishes to everyone!

Tracy

TRACY,
I fully empathize with your condition and history. It is wonderful to have a place to share our feelings and not get blank stares ("Hmm...what are you talking about?") in return.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 18/09/2007 17:53:19
Hi everyone...
How are you doing...

Quote:
"You mention you are taking schizophrenia medication, did you have schizophrenia before these post-sex problems developed? Or is this merely an attempt to cure this specific problem?"

Answering John, I have never had schizofrenia in my life... my doctor gave that medication to me as a link between clonazepam and escitalopram. It worked to stop night eyaculations due to dreams...

Nevermind about Orkut... it's just an option if you want to visit, so it doesn't matter. Jejeje... it will still be open anyway if you want to take a look... maybe other people can join through that community.

Well... yesterday (monday) I started feeling bad out of nowhere. It was a very rough day, very emotional and sad because I was so dissapointed on a girl I was seeing. I don't know, but I was very angry and anxious... I went out at night (it's independence day today in Chile) and started feeling POIS symptoms: extreme cold and dry body. I knew it had come, so I knew today (tuesday) I would feel bad. As I said, today is holiday here, so I just masterbated because I was keen on doing it and it wouldn't affect my state today, because I had already started feeling like sh1t yesterday. As you know my POIS is short in extent compared to other cases, but it seems to be very hard during the day I feel bad. Today I'm feeling bad, but tomorrow I should be Ok.

In my mind I'm not feeling bad... I know that the anxiety that followed the sadness and dissapointment over that girl (if she can be called like that... I'm furious! jajaja) was the cause of the symptoms. The link between anxiety and POIS for me seems to be clear, at least in my case.

I was wondering the other day... what in common do we have otherwise than the symptoms? are we all anxious people? did we masterbated too much in our youth? does masterbation has something to do in us having this? is depression before or after POIS, is it the cause or the effect? What did we do in common after all... that's what I'm wondering.

Sorry if I am being too direct on my post... but I just think it's the way to discuss here, the only place where I really feel understood.

Yours sincerily

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 18/09/2007 20:40:33
Hi again...

Quote:
"But i think now it's better to block the excessive answer to orgasm."

Of course! Anyone having any progress must post it... but maybe knowing what was the cause of this we can get closer to a solution.

I would be more than happy to be able to block the answer to orgasm... I totally agree with you Jim. I can see know how blind I've been... I've never thought on a neurologist. I will start searching that road.

Hope to hear from you soon...

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 19/09/2007 02:12:58
POIS DAY ONE
Success! Not perfect, but I feel good today! Never happened before - this early - in the POIS symptom cycle.

Yesterday was POIS DAY ZERO: in all honesty, a very difficult day, all 10 fingertips were dry, hot, and "numb" and for some strange reason, coupled with the exhaustion, this drives me crazy. I went to bed at 7:30 PM, slept shortly thereafter.


I downed a lot of Starbucks double-shots (cans of espresso)today, and took a mid-day nap to regenerate energy.

The "cure" ingredients for me so far (in the order of what I see as important) : (1) Levitra prior to release** (2) Adderall XR, an extended-release amphetamine ADD stimulant treatment (releases dopamine) (3) Cymbalta (an SNRI, not SSRI) N = norepinephrine; similar to Effexor. My psychiatrist says SSRIs and SNRIs work DIFFERENTLY for different people. (4) Testosterone injections every 2 weeks (I will have one tomorrow)(5) Caffeine. Lots of it in intervals. Three doctors advised against excessive caffeine, but too bad for the doctors, they don't have POIS lol and (6) Napping. Taken as directed : - )

I am experimenting with "keeping the sexual energy going"  (Levitra seems to allow this), on the theory that "shriveling up" literally and figuratively worsens the POIS symptoms.

Continuing the cautious yet increasing optimism,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nathan on 19/09/2007 18:18:33
Hi guys,

I'm a male turing 50. I've had this problem for about 5 years.
At the time of release, I feel extremely high blood pressure in my head and around my neck,
which is kind of scary.
I get muscle pain all over, strange feelings in my fingers.
Slight diarrhea, and sometimes sore throat.
I recover after 2 nights sleep.
Sorry, I have no information to share, but just wanted to let you know there is one more like you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 19/09/2007 21:32:13
Hi Nathan... and welcome to the forum

My POIS seems to last the same time as yours... two nights sleep, not counting naps. Only nights sleep...

First time at 45... for me it has been all my life. I'm 26. I hope you find support here and share with us your experience, medical and personal...

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 21/09/2007 00:56:15
demografx, if I had to guess which medication was helping you I would suspect the stimulant/dopamine one. But of course thats a rather wild guess. Were you diagnosed with having attention deficit? I have not been, but I don't doubt that some doctors would diagnose my mental makeup as being in the "inattentive" group of ADD, being somewhat of a space cadet. I tried to persue diagnosis once but once the doctor knew that I wanted to experiment with stimulants the diagnosis is harder to achive due to bias, or so it seemed. It is a controlled substance and there has been some negativity towards dolling out stimulants to people who might just want to get high. I don't think the doc was really all that versed in ADD.


John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/09/2007 04:13:47
Hi guys,

I'm a male turing 50. I've had this problem for about 5 years.
At the time of release, I feel extremely high blood pressure in my head and around my neck,
which is kind of scary.
I get muscle pain all over, strange feelings in my fingers.
Slight diarrhea, and sometimes sore throat.
I recover after 2 nights sleep.
Sorry, I have no information to share, but just wanted to let you know there is one more like you.


Hi Nathan and welcome! I was very interested to see that your symptoms include strange feelings in the fingers, like mine. Best wishes, demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/09/2007 04:20:10
demografx, if I had to guess which medication was helping you I would suspect the stimulant/dopamine one. But of course thats a rather wild guess. Were you diagnosed with having attention deficit? I have not been, but I don't doubt that some doctors would diagnose my mental makeup as being in the "inattentive" group of ADD, being somewhat of a space cadet. I tried to persue diagnosis once but once the doctor knew that I wanted to experiment with stimulants the diagnosis is harder to achive due to bias, or so it seemed. It is a controlled substance and there has been some negativity towards dolling out stimulants to people who might just want to get high. I don't think the doc was really all that versed in ADD.


Yes, John, I was diagnosed with ADD. Before the testosterone and Levitra, I was on the stimulants and they didn't affect the POIS. But you may be right in that the COMBINATION of meds must include the stimulants. Very interesting point you made. Thanks a lot. demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/09/2007 22:06:55
CIALIS
Hi everyone. As I mentioned previously, Levitra, an ED medication, seems - for unknown reasons - to be a pivotal component in my combat against POIS symptoms. When I mentioned the POIS effect that Levitra has had to my psychiatrist, even though he didn't understand why, he suggested Cialis. Cialis, another ED med, claims to work for about 36 hours. If so, as a longer acting med, it has the potential to work even better than Levitra. He gave me a sample of 3 tablets, and I will try one and report here, so stay tuned  : - )   

Have a nice weekend, everyone,
demografx

ps - I'd like to propose that we all use the term "POIS" even though we don't all have the exact same symptoms as Dr. Waldinger studied. It just makes it easier for us to communicate. Besides, Dr Waldinger studied very few people and also, all of us here are really dealing with the same general malady, i.e., post....orgasmic....illness.....syndrome/symptoms...I use the term "POIS", even though I don't have myalgia or strictly, flulike symptoms...as Dr Waldinger studied. The main thing is that I suffer from extreme exhaustion, foggy cognition, and an unbearable length of time with symptoms, post-orgasm.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 21/09/2007 22:49:16
demografx, I would be more willing to believe that ONE of the medications is helping you vs a combination. You say you have tried stimulants alone and they did not help, okay. Have you tried testosterone alone without any other meds? Perhaps it is pivotal in the syndrome.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/09/2007 23:55:47
Hi John,

Before I tried Levitra, my hope was that testosterone - when I first started it -  would do the trick and it didn't (please see my earlier posts) except for the initial placebo effect.

If I had to pick one, and only one, prime contributor I would say Levitra. But I still wonder what Cymbalta is doing.

Thanks, demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/09/2007 23:59:26
TO JP on HIS Orkut POIS COMMUNITY
JP, I'm sorry that in an earlier post I "blamed" Orkut.com for forcing me into iGoogle. It happened again today on another site, so I think Google is simply trying to convert the world over to iGoogle. It doesn't seem to have anything to do with your Orkut site. I'm sorry if this kept anyone away from your POIS site.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 22/09/2007 02:10:30
Hi demografx...

Don't worry man... everything is OK.

I'm following your development with LEVITRA and the other thing. I think I'll try it myself, but I need a medical prescription to buy LEVITRA here in Chile, so I'll have to talk about it with my doctor.

Hoping to hear from you soon

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/09/2007 03:39:18
LEVITRA or CIALIS
JP, I would be very careful at your young age with Levitra or Cialis. In my case, it helps for what it was intended, i.e., erectile dysfunction (ED).

The POIS-help was an "accidental" side benefit of Levitra for me. When you DON'T need it for ED, I'm not sure what happens. A SMALL percent who take it do wind up with erections lasting a very long time and some even wind up in the hospital emergency room. I was afraid of that myself, but my doctor told me not to worry.

I'm not a doctor, so I'm being overcautious, I'm not trying to scare anyone. I just think this should be thoroughly discussed with one's doctor before experimenting.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/09/2007 20:14:02
II would be more willing to believe that ONE of the medications is helping you vs a combination. You say you have tried stimulants alone and they did not help, okay. Have you tried testosterone alone without any other meds? Perhaps it is pivotal in the syndrome.

John

just curious, John, why do you think a single med is more believable than a combination?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 23/09/2007 14:43:58
demografx, it just sounds more logical to me. Perhaps I'm wrong, but it seems like the odds of taking the right combination would be much lower than the odds that one of the meds is helping you.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/09/2007 21:00:26
JP's PROFILE QUESTION

I agree with JP that if we learn more about each others' shared traits and similarities, we may learn more about POIS contributing factors.

I won't lay out my life story here, but I'll try to check in time to time with tidbits that may be relevant.

I suffer terrible jet lag, almost like POIS. The most disturbing part is an incredibly intense feeling of disorientation, particularly after the return home. Like the proverbial fish out of water. It can last a week on both sides.

Depression and ADD have periodically been problems as I noted earlier.

POIS has ruined a good chunk of my life, either beause of active symptoms or "hanging over my head" like a curse.

Enough for now, thanks
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Dave23 on 24/09/2007 22:11:28
Hi,

Thank you all for this very helpful thread.

What is the most effective dose amount you have experienced on Levitra for treating POIS ?

Also does anyone know what was the effective dose
of taking Zoloft that cured the mans POIS ?

I have had POIS since around 19 and also P.D since 15-16.

At its worst the POIS
symptoms would last a week. Now not so bad, 1-3 days
post ejaculation.

Started TRT 7 weeks ago plus HCG and an AI in Aromasin to help balance my hormone levels.

Iam on :

Testosterone cypionate at 32mg E2D schedule and 250ius of HCG E2D.

Dostinex at 125mcg ED and on ejaculation days at 500mcg. I have high prolactin levels. Side effects for 2 weeks of brain fog.

Im also on Isocort for low morning cortisol levels and Armour for low T3+T4 levels. Have been on for 8 weeks.

Before :

Energy for physical exercises : 1-2x a week

Ejaculation frequenzy : Once every week/2

POIS period : 4-7 days

Now :

Energy for physical exercises : 3-4x a week

Ejaculation frequenzy : Once every 4-5 days.

POIS period : 1-3  days

Have already ordered Levitra and Zoloft. Will experiment with these and post results and side effects.




Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 25/09/2007 16:50:00
DISAPPOINTED

Yesterday was POIS Day 1. I took Cialis (after ejac.) on Day Zero. Cialis has a longer lasting effect than Levitra. My fervent hope was that Cialis would be "the silver bullet," the cure (for me and perhaps others) for this nasty POIS business.

Boy, was I wrong! It was a day of severe exhaustion. And moderate depression. I was at a coffee shop for most of the day with my computer, on and off socializing with patrons. I would've been better off in bed! Tons of coffee succeeded only in making me hyper and nauseous.

My wife suggested exercising. She just doesn't understand that I simply have no energy when I'm like this. Has anyone had positive results excercising during POIS symptoms?

I'm not giving up. I emailed my psychiatrist to ask if it's possible that Levitra has a basically different chemical makeup than Cialis that would make it less effective for POIS(he hasn't responded yet). I will see him day after tomorrow, Thursday.

Maybe Levitra is still the key, I don't know. I am typing this right now from bed - conserving energy - on Day Two. I do feel better than yesterday, though.

Sorry to post my setback. Hope to have better news next time.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 25/09/2007 16:55:18
Hi,

Thank you all for this very helpful thread.

demo, what is the most effective dose amount you have experienced on Levitra for treating POIS ?............

....I have had...P.D since 15-16.

....Started TRT 7 weeks ago plus HCG and an AI in Aromasin to help balance my hormone levels.......................

....Have already ordered Levitra and Zoloft. Will experiment with these and post results and side effects.


Hi DAVE, thank you for posting and welcome! I was prescribed Levitra 10 mg for ED. It wasn't prescribed for POIS. It just turned out to be an "accidental" side-benefit.

Would you kindly explain what "P.D....TRT 7...HCG...AI" mean?

Re. Levitra and Zoloft, I hope you will do that under doctor supervision. As I mentioned to JP, I have no idea if Levitra can be potentially harmful at a young age where ED is not an issue.

Thanks again,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 25/09/2007 18:02:07
Hi all... welcome Dave

Yesterday, fell asleep without taking my medication. Result, wet dream and POIS for today. What an idiot... another day of trash.
... I've tried working out in a gym. My mom used to insist, as your wife does, that I should do exercise. I can assure you it does not help in any way, only to distract your mind. At the best you will feel more tired and will sleep earlier so the day ends fast.
Hope that today goes fast so tomorrow I'd be Ok... hope so.

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 25/09/2007 22:26:20
JP

BEST WISHES FOR A SPEEDY POIS RECOVERY!!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 25/09/2007 22:32:27
EXPECT LESS OF YOURSELF DURING POIS

My psychiatrist suggested this and it's been helpful so I thought I'd pass it on to you all.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 25/09/2007 23:46:56
Day 0 today (had a nocturnal this morning before waking). I can definitely feel the difference, being blank minded, but it isn't too problematic. In my POIS I find it quite difficult to work alongside someone during the day, as the extra work of communication puts a huge load on my mind, I have to mentally work hard to try to keep up. Today I was able to work on my own so anxiety was kept low. I find it very important to keep anxiety low in this POIS state. I think it is the anxiety of dealing with it (working hard to appear mentally "there") that causes the second phase of my syndrome, the burnout phase.

My POIS is still present, but I am adamant that my experience is not nearly as severe as it used to be, before I stopped consuming milk. I have absolutely no explanation for this, just another weird piece of this puzzle that somehow goes together. Any ideas of what might cause this anyone? It may be an important clue to what is going on with all of us. I would suggest that anyone with POIS try going off dairy for a month or two. 

Hopefully tomorrow will go easy on me :o)

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Dave23 on 26/09/2007 00:04:55

[/quote]

Hi demografx, thank you for your welcome!

Would you kindly explain what "P.D....TRT 7...HCG...AI" mean?

P.D = Peyronies Disease

Penile Scarring, curvature, ED, Leakage, inflammation pain, penile dents all mixed in one.

TRT = Testosterone Replacement Therapy

Iam on 32mg (E2D) Every 2 days schedule to maintain consistant testosterone levels and to keep side effects(Mainly Aromatasing) low or non existant.

HCG = Human chorionic gonadotropin

250iu E2D.

Signals the brains LH hormone gland to keep naturally producing testosterone and sperm
so I dont become infertile and also to
prevent the boys from shrinking.


AI = Aromatase Inhibitor

Aromasin 10mg ED.

To Lower estrogen levels.

Have started 5htp (150mg) and Gaba (400mg) 3 times a week. Will post results if any.

Thanks again,
Dave
[/quote]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 26/09/2007 02:53:07

Personally I am chaste now and avoid the problem altogether.

I tried to be chaste many many times. It "works" but it is just too hard to STOP completely. Even though it relieves POIS, it creates another form of anxiety/depression as someone else pointed out here. Isn't this a kick in the head??? We can't "win" either way !!!!!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 26/09/2007 02:59:51
Day 0 today

I would suggest that anyone with POIS try going off dairy for a month or two. 

Hopefully tomorrow will go easy on me :o)

John

Best wishes for tomorrow, John!! (I'm also starting to "come back" from the dead myself LOL!)

My wife suggested cutting out milk, I hate to admit she's right!  [:)]  But you, John, have credibility so I have to find a way to try it!(wife or no wife haha)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 26/09/2007 17:21:36
MILK/DAIRY

Cutting it out, as John suggests. Starting last night.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/09/2007 21:23:55
CYMBALTA

My psychiatrist pointed out today that it looks like Cymbalta is NOT effective for my POIS, because in this last devastating round of POIS suffering - hoping that Cialis would work, but it didn't - the Cymbalta didn't work.

My hope is now with Levitra and/or quitting milk/dairy.
And perhaps other successful results by others here.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 28/09/2007 01:40:08
Frustrated...

Does anybody know someone who has recovered from this???

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/09/2007 17:06:23
Frustrated...

Does anybody know someone who has recovered from this???

JP

JP, I think B_Jim mentioned someone who was "cured" with Zoloft.

B_JIM: is what I just said correct?

Thanks,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/09/2007 17:18:25
TO JP

JP, I feel just like you do, very frustrated. I have had this for at least 25 years (!) and I STILL have a difficult time believing this is happening to me. In fact for many years, I REFUSED to believe this was happening to me, I was in such great denial - especially since one doctor/psychiatrist/psychologist/urologist after another had absolutely nothing to offer to alleviate the POIS suffering.

JP, the pain is somehow compounded I think when no one understands what you have!!!

The only thing we can do is be hopeful and not give up.

Although I am in shock over this last POIS episode (I just don't know why it was so BAD!, maybe it was the letdown after I had such great hopes for Cialis to work) I will go back to testing Levitra, which seemed to improve the condition.

Let's stay in touch, you have my address.

Best wishes,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/09/2007 20:41:43
Yes that's what i said but maybe "cured" is not the correct word. Zoloft has removed all his post orgasm symptoms.

Sorry, B_Jim, but I'm still just a little bit confused...can you please clarify: what is the difference between "cured" and "removed all his POIS symptoms"? To me, they both mean the same thing, i.e., with Zoloft, he no longer has post-orgasmic difficulties/problems.... Is that accurate?

Thanks again,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 28/09/2007 23:17:03
Listen guys I don't think that I am totally "cured" because at times I can still feel some of the effects in a minor way, but the severity has diminished from a 9.99 to a .9 on a scale from 1-10, and sometimes I experience no effect. As I repeat, I am convinced that milk is linked somehow. I'll let you all know how I arrived at this conclusion.

For many years I tried many things, every day of my life was focused around either coping with this problem (suffering, hiding it, trying to appear normal) and trying to find a solution. I went from doctor to doctor to doctor, test to test to test. One idea I had was that my horrible experience was due to a prostate infection. This idea had merit as PE can be caused by infection. So my doctor put me on antibiotics for months to experiment. And... it worked, so I thought for sure I had found the problem. Then, later I went off the medication and my symptoms came back. Honestly I can't remember what my thoughts were at that point, whether I wanted to go back on antibiotics, but I was aware that the only other thing that I had changed was that I quit drinking milk during the time I was taking the medication because milk would have reduced the amount of antibiotics absorbed. So, I did a trial of just quitting milk, and voila.

But still I can't understand it. As if my original problem wasn't strange enough, the "solution" was even stranger. I don't think that the problem is "gone", but just greatly diminished. When I started this thread I must have been going through a minor episode, I don't recall. As I said I am chaste now, but occasionally have NEs. I rarely have NEs if I keep my mind away from anything that would lead me to think of erotic images, not even prime time television dramas that would make me excited. This week I had one, and I have been feeling quite well. I definitely notice the change in my mind, but I suspect it to be what "normal" people experience, feeling more relaxed in the days following sex. I get the sense that my mind perhaps relaxes too much, but it is tolerable. I just makes me a little less quick on the draw mentally, which in turn causes anxiety. So I end up with a relaxed mind getting anxious, and a relaxed mind has more power somehow, so the anxiety can approach panic sometimes when I start to worry. Due to this having a good work environment is crucial to my well being.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/09/2007 00:52:08
Many thanks, John, you're a hero in this forum! (i'm on Day 2 No Dairy!)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 29/09/2007 11:51:34
Jim, sorry it didn't work for you. Heck, maybe it didn't even work for me, perhaps it was something else entirely totally unrelated to diet that coincided. But I'm not going to test it, I'm staying far away from milk, I'll get my calcium elsewhere. Thanks for mentioning this as it might temper any false hope others put in the idea.

Also, did you go completely off dairy? milk, cheese, ice cream, butter... A lot of grocery store packaged foods have milk components as well. Just curious.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/09/2007 18:16:35
B_Jim, is the "cured" (with Zoloft) POIS individual here in this Forum? Or someone you know or read about? Can you tell us more about this individual? Thank you, demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/09/2007 18:20:22
If someone credibly suggested wild poison berries at this stage I might try it  [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/10/2007 04:48:28
it would still help to know _something_ (anything) about this Zoloft "cure"...this is MAJOR, it would be the ONLY one ever successful that we know about! Can you tell us anything at all about him? Thank you, demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/10/2007 15:57:59
well, B_Jim, if you can't say any more about The Zoloft Cure, I can't help but wonder where your strong opinion of dopamine and/or serotonin comes from.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/10/2007 18:49:16
so why can't you say something about the guy who was cured with Zoloft?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/10/2007 21:10:07
B_Jim, thank you very much for sending me a great list of symptoms for dopamine and for serotonin. Can you post that here? Others may be interested! Many thanks again, demografx [:)]

ps - B_Jim, I'm very sorry if I was too anxious in finding out more. POIS is so frustrating as you know, it just makes me want to scream sometimes! So 100 years from now, people will be laughing at all of us saying something like "Don't those silly people know that they just need to eat more carrots for POIS?" [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 01/10/2007 21:25:15
LOL...wouldn't that be great about the carrots !!...try it !!


I just wanted to pop in and say hi peeps !..I wonder if there is something that you all have in common that might lead to a train of thought about it.....apart form the fact that you share the condition !

There may be a difference between a cure and the alleviation of symptoms. A cure would imply that the condition is gone and that no more meds is needed....whereas, alleviation may just suppress the condition but not cure it.

Anyway, It's nice to see everyone getting along so well and I can tell the passion for at least some way to control this horrible debilitating condition is strong. I truly wish you all well and hope that you are deriving some consolation from each other and also from the fact that others are reading in silence and are being helped by your openness and sharing.

hugs you all....

Neil
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 01/10/2007 21:33:05
B_Jim..may I ask you ?...are you saying that this person you know was 100% cured ?...with Zoloft ? !!......and now needs no further treatment and is enjoying an active sex life ?.......
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/10/2007 22:37:26

LOL...wouldn't that be great about the carrots !!...try it !!Neil


Neil, beware the deadly carrot correlation! Several very eminent researchers did a study long ago on 200 carrot eaters, and to everyone's shock, in the follow up, they discovered that they were all dead 150 years later! (I believe in sound scientific methodology such as this  [;D] )
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/10/2007 22:41:43
Neil, many thanks for your words of encouragement! We'll lick this thing yet! Who can stop this group????
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 02/10/2007 16:18:01
Neil, many thanks for your words of encouragement! We'll lick this thing yet! Who can stop this group????


LOL !!..Love the carrot expiremnt ...it's just the kind of empirical research that I would conduct !!

demografx..I am just happy that in the thread, you and the others have found a place to discuss and debate about this unsusual and rare condition.

The more you talk abut it here the more others will find out about it..in fact just googling "post orgasmic illness " brings this site to the top of the pile !!....let's hope a solution is found...soon !!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 02/10/2007 16:21:13
What really upsets me is the fact that the only course of action is to be chaste !!...this is no solution at all !!...and must severely have relationship implications too !
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/10/2007 16:42:40
What really upsets me is the fact that the only course of action is to be chaste !!...this is no solution at all !!...and must severely have relationship implications too !

Right you are, Neil, this last round of POIS suffering threw me for such a loop I'm trying hard as heck to stay away from the S-word for now. But LEVITRA holds promise!!! Perhaps someone here more gifted than I am in pharmacology can contribute why Levitra might work, then maybe we'll be on to something!

Multiple brains are better than one!!
Best regards,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/10/2007 16:02:31
What really upsets me is the fact that the only course of action is to be chaste !!...this is no solution at all !!...and must severely have relationship implications too !

It's ok, Neil, we all have the matter firmly in hand! [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 03/10/2007 16:06:39
What really upsets me is the fact that the only course of action is to be chaste !!...this is no solution at all !!...and must severely have relationship implications too !

It's ok, Neil, we all have the matter firmly in hand! [;D]

 [:o] [:o] [;D] [;D]

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/10/2007 16:50:52
TO B_JIM

B_Jim, Do you know if there is anything about Levitra that makes it potentially workable? Does it affect dopamine or serotonin?

Thanks,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/10/2007 05:05:07
CHASTITY

Hi all, well, I'm following the well-worn chaste route for just a little while. Perhaps part of my problem was too many experiments lately  [;)]

C'mon folks, step right up and post a little more of your experience. We can all relate to that.

And it's therapeutic!

Best regards,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nathan on 10/10/2007 19:04:20
Some time ago I thought to myself, the cause of all this might be
drinking alcohol (almost) everyday for several years.
I had been drinking about 1000 CC beer everyday for 8 years before
POIS got me. Anyone else who drinks too much or too often?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 19:05:02
Hi,

Post orgasmic illness syndrome seems to be the closest to what I have also experienced:

Is it anything like:

Severe pain after sex going on for two days.

Flew like symptoms:

* especially extreme warm feeling (like if you were outside at 0°C temperature you would not be able to be cold).

* the feeling like you are having a fever, including transpiration

* a headache that is very specific, not like anything else you might now

* the feeling like your body is alergic to the fluids it creates itself.

* exreme drop in IQ (I have lost jobs because of this).

* insomnia (like sleeping medication just plain simply does not work)

* I never heard the word myalgias before.(But wikipedia says it is related to repetitive stress injuries. I also have a problem with cubital tunnel syndrome that started exactly during one of my episodes. Maybe this is related?)

This is wat I have experienced for the last 5 years. It started when I was 24 and I now 30.

I thought at first that it might have been some very extreme case of benign coïtal headache, but that never fully described what I have.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 19:06:50
And an other note on chastity.

IT DOES NOT WORK, at least for me.

After two, three weeks I always get a wet dream.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 19:10:43
Joe,
There is another similar discussion here: http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=2734.0
You may find it interesting.

This is the textbook example of a benign coïtal headache.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 19:49:17
except my BP was sky high

Exactly what I also have
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 19:51:06
Oh, for those who might wonder.

Wait 10 years and I will be the 40 year old virgin.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 19:52:52
And I avoid all fat food. Because I know that this will cause me a wet dream and pain.

(sorry for overflooding this forum)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 19:58:13
Quote
For example, if I masturbated on monday at 15 o'clock, I would feel sick during the rest of the day, go to sleep, feel bad the entire next day (tuesday), sleep at night, and wake up well on wednesday.

EXACTLY, two days.

Except if I am suffering from insomnia. Then it lasts until I sleep at least 16 hours.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/10/2007 20:03:39
Quote
The only thing I have achieved in this years is that by having a trio of pills (1 for anxiety, 1 for depression, 1 for schizophrenia) I can control wet dreams, which were very frequent before taking them, and were ruining my life.

Thanks for the tip, if this works for me I will for ever be indepted to you.

If you are still here, mind telling us wich pills exactly?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/10/2007 20:37:59
Hi imre,

Thank you very much for posting and welcome to the POIS Forum!

I'm really glad you posted about other possible correlates in our lives - as they MAY relate to POIS. Here are some of mine:

-high blood pressure (now under control with meds)

-disorientation following even short weekend travel trips, i.e., any change of scenery

-I wonder about this one: severe corporal punishment for 4 years in Catholic elementary school (including grave warnings about sex, i.e., how dirty and filthy it all is [;D])

-severe jet lag (to the point where not traveling hurt my career)

-depression and ADD, affecting both career and home life

-periodic excess (although now abstinent for years) with beer and marijuana.

Let's get working on a pitchfork to dump Mr. POIS!!!!!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: chrisb on 23/10/2007 21:37:50
I just signed up and have read a whole bunch on this thread and I figured I would simply relate my own experience with POIS.

I first began to notice a tiredness after orgasm in my late teens. This was a few years after having been diagnosed with Crohn's disease (IBD), and at about the same time that I began taking 20mg Prozac daily for depression and an anxiety disorder.

As the years have passed (I'm now 30 years old) it has grown from a mild condition to and extremely sensitive one.

Typically, my POIS manifests itself thus:

After orgasm (either sex or masturbation) I feel lethargic, and suffer derealisation. Overall, I feel like my internal energy has disappeared. Hours later the IBD suddenly becomes worse. I cannpt properly digest the food I ingest, and food ingested before orgasm often slows down or stops its passage through the intestines. Upon waking the next day I feel shattered, bereft of any energy, and simply getting up is quite difficult. It will often take several days before I feel my energy return fully.

In severe cases, sometimes after several orgasms over a short period, or when low energy levels preceed one orgasm, digestion shuts down completely resulting in massive pain from bloating in the abdomen, fever, and sometimes the pain is so intense I become delerious.

TO summarise: The main effect of orgasm is to induce a state of low or very low body energy. The intestinal condition which I suffer is the main site where the effects of this lack of energy is felt most keenly.

Interestingly, my Crohn's disease has always been closely related to energy levels. I go through periods of very good cardiovascular fitness, and at these times, food intolerances drop in intensity and the robustness of my digestion / intestines increases. Also, when cardiovascularly fit and feeling 'great', I can have the occasional orgasm without inducing POIS.

Lifestyle: It's often only oral sex on the menu for my wife, whom I love dearly and am very attracted to, and it kills me that I can't have sex with her all the time! Often I have sex with her but avoid orgasm, which we both find frustrating. She understands the problem I have, but we are both at a loss of how to fix it. Like I say, the best I can do is try to remain as fit as possible, but that is not a cure, and it's still only has a mild positive effect.

Do most people who suffer POIS have other medical / psychological conditions? I'm off the Prozac but I've been on 40mg of Cipramil / Citalopram (a similar SSRI that is licensed for panic attacks and anxiety) for about 5 years now.

Thanks for listening!

Chris


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: chrisb on 23/10/2007 21:46:46
Get this: My brother is a world class athlete. He runs over 15 miles every other day. Sometimes twice on the weekend. He goes to the gym and so in additional to unbelievable cardio fitness he is pretty ripped. This is a man who can work all day, drink all night, have sex up to seven times (it is true - I heard them) in the early hours, get up wihtout having slept, go to work all day and feel 'just fine' (his own words).

Unbelievable isn't it?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 23/10/2007 22:00:15
Get this: My brother is a world class athlete. He runs over 15 miles every other day. Sometimes twice on the weekend. He goes to the gym and so in additional to unbelievable cardio fitness he is pretty ripped. This is a man who can work all day, drink all night, have sex up to seven times (it is true - I heard them) in the early hours, get up wihtout having slept, go to work all day and feel 'just fine' (his own words).

Unbelievable isn't it?

Hi Chris...I think (in the kindest possible way and to be taken in good spirits)..I hate your brother !! [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: chrisb on 23/10/2007 22:24:40
Neil, I hate him too!!

He came home (he lives with me at the moment) a little drunk at 4am on Sunday morning, packed his bags, said ruefully, "damn, I shouldn't have had those two wanks earlier because I'm supposed to have some serious sex tonight." Then he caught a plane to the USA at 6am. I think he was annoyed not because it makes him tired (far from it) but simply because he wanted to produce a prodigious amount of you know what. All about first impressions I think!

Ba@%$#d!!! [:(!]

Perhaps I should make it my mission to become super fit and then report back to the group?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 23/10/2007 22:40:04
Hi Chris,

LOL...well...if your bro is an incentive to get fit then it has to be a good thing !! [:)]







I am just reposting this (below) as I accidentally deleted it

welcome to the site Imre1 ( and now also to Chrisb).....good to see you...and good to see you again demografx.

demografx mentioned to me that if you search POIS on the net that TNS is the only place on the PLANET for sufferers to talk about it!! and that  Thus far, the world's chief investigator (and originator of the term POIS), Dr Marcel Waldinger, is now only #2 .....Perhaps on the strength of that...we can get Marcel Waldinger to post here too ??
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/10/2007 23:00:24
CHRIS, GREAT to hear from you!! I take Cymbalta for depression and Adderall for ADD.

I have gotten some POIS relief with Levitra, but I stopped my experiments lately because of...well, too much experimenting! [;D]

Let's all work together to fight this horrible, nauseating syndrome!!!!!!!!

Best wishes to everyone,
demografx,
25++ years suffering from POIS but now hopeful thanks to Waldinger's work, but especially this POIS Forum at The Naked Scientists (TNS) !
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 23/10/2007 23:06:04
I'm emailing Dr Marcel Waldinger.

You never know....he's probably far too busy to come here but I have extended him an invitation to read the thread !!....
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/10/2007 23:12:15
SIBLING RIVALRY

Sigh....CHRIS, I suffer from the same "Brotherly Love" syndrome...my counterattack is to simply be the best sloth I can be  [:0] [;D] [:0] [;D]

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/10/2007 23:13:12
I'm emailing Dr Marcel Waldinger.

You never know....he's probably far too busy to come here but I have extended him an invitation to read the thread !!....

JUST WONDERFUL, NEIL!!! WAY TO GO!!!!!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 23/10/2007 23:15:23
I'm emailing Dr Marcel Waldinger.

You never know....he's probably far too busy to come here but I have extended him an invitation to read the thread !!....

JUST WONDERFUL, NEIL!!! WAY TO GO!!!!!


I probably shouldn;t have mentioned it....I'm by nature a cynical pessimist and I suspect my email may be just dealt with as SPAM...but...hey !!...if you don't try you don't know eh ?



Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 24/10/2007 00:57:48
Hi everyone
Glad to hear from you again... thought this forum was dead. Welcome the new guys. I got in touch with Imre about the pills.

Mmmmm well, for me nothing has changed since the last post. Now I'm searching for something with a neurologyst. Maybe something comes arround.

See ya

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Karen W. on 24/10/2007 07:37:55
I just signed up and have read a whole bunch on this thread and I figured I would simply relate my own experience with POIS.

I first began to notice a tiredness after orgasm in my late teens. This was a few years after having been diagnosed with Crohn's disease (IBD), and at about the same time that I began taking 20mg Prozac daily for depression and an anxiety disorder.

As the years have passed (I'm now 30 years old) it has grown from a mild condition to and extremely sensitive one.

Typically, my POIS manifests itself thus:

After orgasm (either sex or masturbation) I feel lethargic, and suffer derealisation. Overall, I feel like my internal energy has disappeared. Hours later the IBD suddenly becomes worse. I cannpt properly digest the food I ingest, and food ingested before orgasm often slows down or stops its passage through the intestines. Upon waking the next day I feel shattered, bereft of any energy, and simply getting up is quite difficult. It will often take several days before I feel my energy return fully.

In severe cases, sometimes after several orgasms over a short period, or when low energy levels preceed one orgasm, digestion shuts down completely resulting in massive pain from bloating in the abdomen, fever, and sometimes the pain is so intense I become delerious.

TO summarise: The main effect of orgasm is to induce a state of low or very low body energy. The intestinal condition which I suffer is the main site where the effects of this lack of energy is felt most keenly.

Interestingly, my Crohn's disease has always been closely related to energy levels. I go through periods of very good cardiovascular fitness, and at these times, food intolerances drop in intensity and the robustness of my digestion / intestines increases. Also, when cardiovascularly fit and feeling 'great', I can have the occasional orgasm without inducing POIS.

Lifestyle: It's often only oral sex on the menu for my wife, whom I love dearly and am very attracted to, and it kills me that I can't have sex with her all the time! Often I have sex with her but avoid orgasm, which we both find frustrating. She understands the problem I have, but we are both at a loss of how to fix it. Like I say, the best I can do is try to remain as fit as possible, but that is not a cure, and it's still only has a mild positive effect.

Do most people who suffer POIS have other medical / psychological conditions? I'm off the Prozac but I've been on 40mg of Cipramil / Citalopram (a similar SSRI that is licensed for panic attacks and anxiety) for about 5 years now.

Thanks for listening!

Chris




Hi Chris.. You mentioned Citalopram, I am not a man , but have followed this thread for a long time. I have met many men with these problems and I sympathize. I was just drawn in by this med. I have been on it for quite awhile and just went off. It was making me extremely sick.. vomiting intense nausea more shortness of breath and the shakes.. it was not like that at first.. It was something that built up after long time usage,, I feel way better off them They were treating my Depression and anxiety also. I did notice a huge lack of interest in sex although I wasn't having any anyway, but...That was what was unusual.. it seemed to make me less interested altogether!  Has it decreased your desire to have sex??
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 24/10/2007 16:55:22
B_Jim

Who do we reply the questionaire... we post it here???

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: chrisb on 24/10/2007 19:36:45

Hi Chris.. You mentioned Citalopram, I am not a man , but have followed this thread for a long time. I have met many men with these problems and I sympathize. I was just drawn in by this med. I have been on it for quite awhile and just went off. It was making me extremely sick.. vomiting intense nausea more shortness of breath and the shakes.. it was not like that at first.. It was something that built up after long time usage,, I feel way better off them They were treating my Depression and anxiety also. I did notice a huge lack of interest in sex although I wasn't having any anyway, but...That was what was unusual.. it seemed to make me less interested altogether!  Has it decreased your desire to have sex??
[/quote]

Thanks Karen and all those who have replied to my initial postings. I find it interesting what you say about Citalopram. I have not suffered any of those side effects that you mention, but I do worry greatly about the long term use of SSRIs, given that there is no real data available (I guess we are the guinea pigs). I have a horrible feeling that it almost like a very very low level ecstasy trip, slowly rubbing your synapses raw through a constant exposure to higher than usual levels of whatever nt is being affected. Probably rubbish, but I would like to get off the Citalopram. I did try about 9 months ago, and had a very interesting experience that relates in part to POIS.

Approx Day 1-5: felt no change

Approx Day 6-10: began to feel physically powerful, energetic. I had sex about once a day for those days. Didn't suffer noticeable POIS. It was like waking from a long sleep into a fresh and crisp world , or a dying sun reigniting.

Approx Day 11-14: started to nose dive emotionally. Still felt physically strong, but paper-thin emotionally. Anxiety and depression hitting like a locomotive. Started taking the pills again! Soon after the levels of energy dropped off.

I'll happily answer those questions. I guess it would be a good idea to compare the medical, social and psychological histories of those who suffer from POIS. And I guess if we don't hear from that doctor, then we'll have to do it here ourselves.

On another note, someone else posted a previous topic on masturbation, specifically addressing the question of whether or not it may have some negative effects, due to either socio-psychological conditioning, or basic physiology. I think the first consideration is possible in some individuals, but the question of 'what's normal for the body' might bear thinking about: When I have great, bedbreaking, screaming and thrashing sex with my wife and my heart rate goes like I'm running a marathon and it takes a while to get my breath back and my orgasm was so strong I thought my head would fall off, I always suffer a lot less with POIS. I do get a drop in energy and my stomach goes a little funny and all the things I've described, but it's always a lot lot worse if I'm sitting quietly at home and have a quick **** that probably does not even raise my heart rate at all. After that I often feel like I've had all my energy drained away and I often go and lie down and sleep.

Thanks,

Chris

Like to try the zoloft but I guess I'd have to come off the citalopram first though.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: chrisb on 24/10/2007 19:55:20
sorry about the previous post. I will refer to masturbation as 'masturbation'. I just don't like the word. It seems to describe something furtive, as opposed to the brilliant and often only ray of hope in this blighted world.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/10/2007 20:28:46
ZOLOFT and DOPAMINE

I don't wish to spoil the party, but I think Zoloft or dopamine shouldn't be recommended until we have _some_ basis of understandng who it worked for and how. At this time, we hav no idea if it was from a newspaper article, a whisper in someone's ear or what. Of course, I would be DELIGHTED to try anything, even carrots, if someone just gave me a hint of reason why. For example, I have tried Levitra and got very positive POIS-alleviation results, but I only recommend it with caution - even experimentally; I am someone who legitimately needs Levitra for the original purpose intended (ED); others here are not, so I don't know what adverse reactions may ensue for people who do not have ED.

Thank you very much,
demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/10/2007 20:44:04
TO JP

Welcome back! Good to see you again.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/10/2007 20:49:11
CHRIS

Very interesting to read about the difference between spectacular sex vs. ho-hum orgasm and how it can affect POIS! I wish I had kept a diary.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: chrisb on 24/10/2007 22:02:02
CHRIS

Very interesting to read about the difference between spectacular sex vs. ho-hum orgasm and how it can affect POIS! I wish I had kept a diary.

demografx, I think it's right down to the cardio workout, which is generally agreed upon to produce a more energetic body.

I am trying to tear myself away from the PCs this afternoon and go outside for some exercise. I have a samll video production company at home so most of the time I'm sitting down editing stuff . . .
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Dave23 on 25/10/2007 14:22:10
Look at your privates messages, answer if you want and send it to me in a private message.

-------------------------------------------------

Very nice work Jim!

I would suggest everyone who experiences POIS to go for full hormonal blood tests. Try one 3-5 days after ejaculation and one 1-6 hours after ejaculation. If your healthy then your hormones like testosterone, prolactin, cortisol, estrogen shouldnt vary too much.

Usually after ejaculation for people who suffer POIS will have a drop in Test, a high increase in Prolactin, drop in cortisol and maybe an increase in estrogen.

Another test to try is for Thyroid free T3 and free T4. T3 is the important one.

If your like me and have gained weight 3 1/2 stones since the start of experiencing POIS then most likely your T3 is low and Armour would be required to try restart your Thyroid.

I have also found my IGF-1 levels are low Insulin Growth Factor. Im pretty sure this was from POSI as when younger i gained muscle and lost fat pretty well like it seems about much harder to do any.

Hope this helps.


Hi,
To make a summary of our symptoms you can answer to the followings questions if you want:

1)- Number of days after orgasm you have problems : 0.5-2
If lucky none.

-How many hours after orgasm start symptoms ? 1-6
- In the first jours after orgasm, how do you feel ?


Cold, Headaches, Nervous, Lack of Energy, Slow, Tense

2) Symptoms :
Give a mark for each symptom :
0=No   1=Very Low   2=Low    3=Average   4=Severe   5=Very Severe

-Physical tiredness 2-4
-Mental tiredness 3
-Lethargy/Derealisation (I cant wake up!) 3-4
-Lack of concentration/Brain fog 3
-Sweatings and heat feelings 1-2
-Cold feelings/cold hands/cold body 3
-Myalgias 3
-Anxiety 2
-Depression 2
-Agoraphobia/Social phobia 3-4
-Not motived 3
-Memory problems 2
-Difficult to speak/communication 3-4
-Insomnias/sleep porblems 1-3
-Headaches 4
-Stomachaches2
-Restless/agitation 2
-Blurred vision 2
-Buzzing ears 2
-Dizziness 2
-Muscle tremors3
-Diarrhea day1 2
-Hair problems 1
-Mouth problems  1
-Skin problems 1
-Eyes problems 3
-Short breathing Day1 2
-Premature Ejaculation 2
-Sexual pain after sex 2-3
-Erection problems 3-4
-Libido problems 3-4
Others Symptoms ?

3) What medical test you made ? In the days following orgasm ?

-Prolactine ? High Prolactin increases causes slow refractory time
amd an increase in Estrogen which lowers testosterone
and also Post orgasmic fatigue/headaches. High prolactin
lowers dopamine levels.

-Testosterone? Testosterone drops

Cortisol Drops causing an inabiity to deal with any stress


4)What meds did you test ? What effect on POIS ?

Testosterone Cyp : 32mg E2D = 128mg weekly IM Injection
HCG 200-250iu E2D Im Injection

Dostinex/Canbergoline : To lower Prolactin levels

Nolvadex/Letrozole/Aromasin : To lower Estrogen levels

Armour - To increase Free T3-T4 (Gained 3 1/2 stones since
start of POIS. Increase in Free T3 causes warmer body temperature
and faster metabolism which in turns creates better fat burning.

Cortisol : To increase Cortisol levels in the morning due to
tiredness/fatigue/headaches in the morning from low cortisol
levels.

Since staring the above protocol. POIS lasted from 4-7 days before
now usually 1day.

5)Others
-What about you diet ? Healthy to very healthy
Fish, Rice, Beef, Chicken, Fruits, Pork, 1 litre of Napao cabbage/lettuce/
celery blended juice a day or every 2nd day. Cheat meals maybe some Pizza
or some fried fish once a week.

-Sport ? Some weightlifting, bodyweight exercises, stand
up on punchbag, ground work on punchbag, skipping, biking.


-Heavy Computer user ? Yes due to internet business.

-Coffee user ? No, dont touch it.
others..

Thank you very much.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/10/2007 09:19:33
1)- Number of days after orgasm you have problems :
2+

-How many hours after orgasm start symptoms ? 0+
- In the first jours after orgasm, how do you feel ?

extremely tired, headache

2. sympoms

-Physical tiredness 3-4
-Mental tiredness 3-4
-Lethargy/Derealisation (I cant wake up!) 2
-Lack of concentration/Brain fog 3-4
-Sweatings and heat feelings 3-4 (especially today)
-Cold feelings/cold hands/cold body 1
-Myalgias 1?
-Anxiety 3
-Depression 3
-Agoraphobia/Social phobia 5
-Not motived 4
-Memory problems 4
-Difficult to speak/communication 3-4
-Insomnias/sleep porblems 3-4
-Headaches 4
-Stomachaches1
-Restless/agitation 4
-Blurred vision 3 (but then my eyes are naturally exceptionally bad)
-Buzzing ears 3
-Dizziness 3
-Muscle tremors 3
-Diarrhea day1 1
-Hair problems 0
-Mouth problems  0
-Skin problems 3 (Herpes zoster?)
-Eyes problems 3 (but then my eyes are naturally exceptionally bad)
-Short breathing Day1 4
-Premature Ejaculation 0
-Sexual pain after sex 4
-Erection problems 0
-Libido problems 0 (sadly enough)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/10/2007 09:26:31
Excercise?

If you have no idea how you are going to make it up the stairs. You are not exactly going to run a marathon.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/10/2007 09:30:20
What has helped me to overcome type 2 coïtal headache symptoms (severe explosion of headache right after orgasm) is relaxation.

I.e. when masturbation, you go on until you are close to orgasm. Then you go and do something else. This you repeat 3-4 times and eventually you orgasm.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/10/2007 09:36:04
Libido problems 0 (sadly enough)

I.e. I can go any time any place and I can naturaly have multiple orgasms through further stimulation, without taking pills.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/10/2007 16:28:49
Found online:

"The good news is that with or without treatment, benign sexual headaches tend to resolve all on their own."

Yes, when I am 70 I will be impotent and no longer have this problem. :-D
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/10/2007 16:35:35
And here is an other one:

"Vomiting, loss of consciousness, meningismus, focal neurological deficits, and headache persisting for more than 24 hours are not consistent with benign coital headache."

So we can all be assured not to have benign coïtal headaches.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/10/2007 19:17:08
After looking all day into the topic of hormones. I am quite confident about the results.

Especially social anxiety points into the direction of serotonin/dopamine insufficiency. This I am sure is related to sexual induced headache and fatigue. After orgasm these levels will drop even more, probably under some pain treshhold.

This is probably the reason why medication like SSRIs and SNRIs would work.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Karen W. on 27/10/2007 19:31:06

Hi Chris.. You mentioned Citalopram, I am not a man , but have followed this thread for a long time. I have met many men with these problems and I sympathize. I was just drawn in by this med. I have been on it for quite awhile and just went off. It was making me extremely sick.. vomiting intense nausea more shortness of breath and the shakes.. it was not like that at first.. It was something that built up after long time usage,, I feel way better off them They were treating my Depression and anxiety also. I did notice a huge lack of interest in sex although I wasn't having any anyway, but...That was what was unusual.. it seemed to make me less interested altogether!  Has it decreased your desire to have sex??

Thanks Karen and all those who have replied to my initial postings. I find it interesting what you say about Citalopram. I have not suffered any of those side effects that you mention, but I do worry greatly about the long term use of SSRIs, given that there is no real data available (I guess we are the guinea pigs). I have a horrible feeling that it almost like a very very low level ecstasy trip, slowly rubbing your synapses raw through a constant exposure to higher than usual levels of whatever nt is being affected. Probably rubbish, but I would like to get off the Citalopram. I did try about 9 months ago, and had a very interesting experience that relates in part to POIS.

Approx Day 1-5: felt no change

Approx Day 6-10: began to feel physically powerful, energetic. I had sex about once a day for those days. Didn't suffer noticeable POIS. It was like waking from a long sleep into a fresh and crisp world , or a dying sun reigniting.

Approx Day 11-14: started to nose dive emotionally. Still felt physically strong, but paper-thin emotionally. Anxiety and depression hitting like a locomotive. Started taking the pills again! Soon after the levels of energy dropped off.

I'll happily answer those questions. I guess it would be a good idea to compare the medical, social and psychological histories of those who suffer from POIS. And I guess if we don't hear from that doctor, then we'll have to do it here ourselves.

On another note, someone else posted a previous topic on masturbation, specifically addressing the question of whether or not it may have some negative effects, due to either socio-psychological conditioning, or basic physiology. I think the first consideration is possible in some individuals, but the question of 'what's normal for the body' might bear thinking about: When I have great, bedbreaking, screaming and thrashing sex with my wife and my heart rate goes like I'm running a marathon and it takes a while to get my breath back and my orgasm was so strong I thought my head would fall off, I always suffer a lot less with POIS. I do get a drop in energy and my stomach goes a little funny and all the things I've described, but it's always a lot lot worse if I'm sitting quietly at home and have a quick **** that probably does not even raise my heart rate at all. After that I often feel like I've had all my energy drained away and I often go and lie down and sleep.

Thanks,

Chris

Like to try the zoloft but I guess I'd have to come off the citalopram first though.


[/quote]

I noticed about the same symptoms of withdrawl from the antidepressant citalopram, I have been in down hill mode for about the same period, I have just had a heart procedure which is not helping the depression so am needing the doctor to help me again with a new one with less side effects..

Good luck to you Chris and any and all of the rest of you also..
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/10/2007 05:02:57
ANTIDEPRESSANTS/SSRI's/SNRI

I have taken, for long periods (Cymbalta is new)
-Lexapro
-Prozac
-Paxil
-Cymbalta
-Effexor
None of these seem to help my POIS
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: agjchs on 30/10/2007 19:25:36
Wow - this is a god-send to find out others suffer from the same thing. My post-orgasmic exhaustion began almost 22 years ago after I had a bad case of mononucleosis at the age of 20, and sent me into a long battle with depression (for which I have taken Prozac, Paxil, Paxil CR, Cymbalta, Selegiline, and stimulants). If I did it "too soon" after the last orgasm, the exhaustion and depression were worse than usual. I also have OCD, so if I waited "too long" between orgasms, the OCD would intensify (chalk it up to pent-up sexual tension). It has been a delicate balancing act, and I finally found it best to masturbate every four days (that way there's not an overdose of exhaustion or of OCD).

I finally got a break from the depression almost two years ago by taking 300mg Wellbutrin XL and 22.5mg Remeron, but the exhaustion remained, until a little over a month ago, when I started taking an over-the-counter DHEA supplement after masturbating. I haven't had any sexual exhaustion since. I started with 25mg DHEA, but it made the OCD worse, so I cut back to 12.5mg, and am still free of exhaustion, after almost 22 years of it!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 31/10/2007 05:06:03
Hello agjchs,

Welcome to the POIS Forum. And thank you for bringing much needed hope to others who now can possibly have similar success to yours. One question:
Are you "cured" with DHEA for POIS? Or are ther other symptoms related to post-orgasm that you still wish to alleviate?

Thank you!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/11/2007 21:04:19
POIS DAY ONE

Resisted the interest in a 2nd Round (Levitra can do that, it stays in your system about a day). I suspect it would have been a disaster if I gave in, Levitra or no. Somewhat tired, but very manageable and not "agony/anxiety-tinged exhaustion" as is so often the case. Will midday-nap now.

After the nap + rest:

Feeling much better. Rested a couple hours (dozed off briefly)- then had some caffeine. Hoping that tomorrow will continue the faster recovery cycle!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/11/2007 15:20:14
POIS DAY TWO

So far so good! Much stronger today but still resisting the urge for "a 2nd round". By the way, I quit milk/dairy products as someone (Dave23?) suggested.

Day Two Late Afternoon: continuing to recover to the point where I feel pretty normal. This is occurring at about HALF (1/2) the normal POIS recovery cycle without Levitra!

After 25+ years POIS struggles and experiments, I feel LEVITRA is working for me!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/11/2007 23:26:23
 Thank you!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/11/2007 23:36:17
POIS DAY THREE (Conclusion)

Not exhausted, but - on and off - still a little tired...it comes and goes, and because of sensations in all 10 fingertips (POIS is the ONLY time of my life I feel strange in my fingertips) - I still feel affected, albeit in a minor way, by POIS. Periodic naps/resting (twice today) help enormously. So this is by no means a perfect cure. My guess is that Levitra - for some strange reason - cuts the POIS symptoms in half or more - for me.

Keep in mind what my psychiatrist said: everyone is different. What works for me may or may not work for you. Best wishes to all, and thank you for being here, this Forum has helped me immensely! And I'm greedy...I want to continue to seek a 100% (not 50%+) solution to this lifelong misery!!! [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 05/11/2007 01:55:36
That is exactly what I was thinking, B_Jim !
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/11/2007 04:08:42
DHEA

I asked my psychiatrist about the possibility of DHEA and he replied that DHEA is a precursor to testosterone and if the latter didn't work, it's unlikely that DHEA would.

Sigh...I wonder if this is more difficult than criminal detective work?  [:)]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: varunn.kaushikk on 12/11/2007 11:41:59
http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=39047985&refresh=1  please join this community so we can easily interact and share our feelings i am so glad to find u all bcz no one understand what kind of disease we r facing only we can understand each other problem   god bless u all  and may god show us way to escape from this evil   please brothers be in touch   
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: varunn.kaushikk on 12/11/2007 11:50:49
or mail me on   varunn.kaushikk@gmail.com we have to unite first to fight this evil
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 12/11/2007 13:01:23
or mail me on   varunn.kaushikk@gmail.com we have to unite first to fight this evil

VARRUN Regarding your earlier posts I have created this thread for you as I felt at the time they were not related to this thread....http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=11348.0


Please go there and elaborate as best as you can...or are you now saying you do in fact suffer from POIS ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 15/11/2007 22:42:34
VARUNN: if your problem is with wet dreams and POIS, JP says in his post at the POIS Forum: "The only thing I have achieved in this years is that by having a trio of pills (1 for anxiety, 1 for depression, 1 for schizophrenia) I can control wet dreams, which were very frequent before taking them, and were ruining my life. At least now I have control over wet dreams, that were the worst... because I could not control them."

Try to contact JP to see if he can tell you what he takes, then TAKE THAT INFORMATION TO YOUR DOCTOR and see what he recommends. JPlewin's post is at
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.25
 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 19/11/2007 04:20:51
B_Jim, I hope you feel better by now.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: mellivora on 19/11/2007 11:45:39
Hi everyone, sorry I’ve not posted in a while. Welcome to all  who have joined the forum since my last post and thanks a lot for sharing. Chrisb I second Jim_B’s highlighting of your lethargy and derealisation -  it’s the biggest problem for me too. Imre you’re definitely not alone in having problems at work because of this. Its affected my work big time as well. B-Jim I also hope you’re feeling better now.

For me I think exercise definitely has a benefit. It doesn’t really help relieve symptoms but it can definitely help me purge the urge for a release and I recommend trying some exercise next time you really feel the need but can’t afford the after effects. That said, I’m on day one of POIS just now which is my first in a while.

I see that a couple of you are married. I know its not ideal but I find a little comfort in the fact you’re able to maintain a relationship even with POIS. I started seeing a great girl recently and told her about POIS from the start. She said she was willing to try and work around it. Its not the easiest thing to do but if you’re sure you’re getting involved with someone and you find out it’s a mutual thing then I definitely recommend being upfront about POIS from the beginning. Unfortunately now that relationship has ended all too quickly which is really hard just now, but I saw a glimmer of hope that things might just be possible, be positive if you find yourself in the same situation. Like me you may have put up some barriers to stop yourself getting hurt in these situations. At the end of the day I let down the barriers, perhaps too late and I’ve wound up hurting. But I still think its worth the risk if you find someone willing to try and understand POIS. For me, falling for a person like this is so so rare, I think you have to try. Believe there’s someone for you out there. If they find their way to you, I hope it works.

Best to everyone,
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 19/11/2007 15:26:54
Hi

I've done the same thing as mellivora... everytime i get involved seriously with some girl i just tell her. Some have not understood, others have felt pity for me, but most of the times i've had a good response. As mellivora says, i recommend being totally straight about our condition, because sooner or later it will reflect and harm the relationship.

I have no further news... nothing really interesting has happened.

Best to everyone...

JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 21/11/2007 00:07:10
Hi everyone, nice to see some new people posting.  I Thought I had my profile set to emial me when messages were posted…glad I came back to check.

Agjchs, that’s wonderful if DHEA worked to alleviate your POIS symptoms. I had once ordered DHEA but chickened out from experimenting with it due to the lack of information I could find. I finally threw it out with a couple dozen other supplements I had ordered to experiment with. Perhaps I will order it again, I’ll have to read up on it again.

Chris, at times I had noticed a similar thing, the times when I truly felt love for the woman is when I enjoyed it more and experienced better sexual performance…. and the least POIS.  I wondered if it might be connected to prolactin levels which have been found to be much higher following intercourse vs masturbation.  http://www.reuniting.info/download/pdf/Brody-2006-prolactin-bp.pdf  Perhaps it generates sufficient prolactin to shut off the sexual circuitry.

Dave, good idea with hormone levels post sex, although years ago I had this checked and apparently everything was good. I don’t know what the endocrinologist checked, but I got a thumbs up. I know you can order hormone testing kits online, perhaps it would provide some information.

Imre1, for me I can avoid wet dreams as long as I keep my mind completely  off sex, by avoiding anything that would make me think of it, including regular tv where people are making out. But I admit I do let the thoughts in eventually and bam, I wake at night as I did last night :o)

Jim, I’ll respond to the list soon

Hope you’re all doing well !

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 25/11/2007 22:46:33
Agjchs, can you tell me how long you have been on 12.5mg DHEA?

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 26/11/2007 02:03:26
POIS Day Zero

Hi John and everyone, thanks for keeping the ideas/thoughts flying!

Today, tired but not exhausted. Took Levitra 10mg + stimulants/caffeine.

Looking forward to more discussion about DHEA.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 26/11/2007 22:38:29
Here is some interesting info on DHEA being a possible co-regulator of sleep: http://www.anthropogeny.com/Sleep%20and%20SIDS.htm Considering my insomnia...I'm intrigued.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 30/11/2007 04:49:32
Thanks, John. Well, my last POIS symptoms (starting with Day Zero post right above John's) were pretty mild! I attribute that mostly to Levitra 10mg, but I also learned some very important "tricks" here at the POIS Forum, such as (1) to try to have a good, powerful, romantically-fueled vs. weak experience and (2) low frequency of sex. In my case it's been 3 weeks since. About right, it seems for me.

I owe a lot to this Forum. Even the Levitra might not have been noticed were it not for the focus on POIS and testing the effects of various chemicals and procedures that this Forum affords.

Thank you very much.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 30/11/2007 19:25:52
Thanks, John. Well, my last POIS symptoms (starting with Day Zero post right above John's) were pretty mild! I attribute that mostly to Levitra 10mg, but I also learned some very important "tricks" here at the POIS Forum, such as (1) to try to have a good, powerful, romantically-fueled vs. weak experience and (2) to not have "too many" releases close together, which varies from person to person. In my case it's been 3 weeks since the last release. About right, it seems for me.

I owe a lot to this Forum. Even the Levitra might not have been noticed were it not for the focus on POIS and testing the effects of various chemicals and procedures that this Forum affords.

Thank you very much.




This is wonderful demografx. ....it's so refreshing to hear of the positive consequences this forum exudes....

We also thank YOU and the participants of this thread for their valuable contributions.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 02/12/2007 14:27:10
I just wanted to remark that I have been getting some realy great benefits from a new technique inspired with what my sexologist said.

First of all it is needed to state that the problem realy is orgasm, not ejaculation. The reason this is so clear is because there are still some 20% of people with post orgasmic problems are female.

Also what men cannot live without is not actually orgasm, but ejaculation. If you are experiencing post orgasmic problems it is the direct result of orgasming too hard. So what is needed is a way to reduce orgasm while letting ejaculation proceed as normal.

The means of doing this is actually very simple. There is a natural time span in which orgasm is maximally. If you have premature ejaculation orgasm is very weak. If you hold on too long orgasm is again very weak.

It is this second phase of weak orgasm we would like to reliably reproduce. So getting into masturbation for an excessive amount of time, say 3-4 hours.

How on earth do you get masturbation for 3-4 hours?

This can only be done when stopping in between. So repeatedly going to the point of no return and then stopping to do something else. My sexologist called this sexual relaxation.

There are 3 reasons why this would work:
* the same reason why people do 10 minutes cardio training before doing power training (i.e. it acts as a warm-up phase)
* the natural decline of orgasmic feelings
* by stopping right before the point of no return, excessive amounts of pre-cum are released. Since you are not getting this during real ejaculation the time of ejaculation is kept down and orgasm will be much shorter.

If you are wondering wether this will not lead you to miss a feeling of orgasmic fullfilment. Try having more then one orgasm then. Each subsequent orgasm will be small, not strong enough to add to the origin of post orgasmic symptoms.

Also using this technique is very good for avoiding wet dreams. Since they will train the muscles in your lower abdomen area.

Almost all my post orgasmic symptoms have disappeared because of this technique (which I would like to call Sexual Relaxation Retraining Therapy).

Anyway do with it what you want.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 02/12/2007 14:31:10
Also if you want some medicin. Consider taking a seditive before engaging in sexual activity. In my country you can buy feeding supplements (sedixx) for people with ADHD to make them more relaxed.

With these kind of pills it should also be possible to keep your orgasm down.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/12/2007 18:31:16


This is wonderful demografx. ....it's so refreshing to hear of the positive consequences this forum exudes....

We also thank YOU and the participants of this thread for their valuable contributions.

Neil, thank you for caring! POIS - for most sufferers - has been a very lonely existence before this Forum. Physicians, therapists, psychiatrists, etc. look at us like we're crazy, they have no idea what we're talking about! Or they think it's because we weren't breast-fed properly or somesuch psychological nonsense. I THANK YOU - AND MY FELLOW SUFFERERS - FOR BEING HERE!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/12/2007 18:36:39
...some 20% of people with post orgasmic problems are female.

Your post is very interesting. Can you tell us where the above statistic was found? I would like to read more about it. Thanks!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 08:55:52
Actualy the figure is the well-known one for benign coital headache (including post coital headache).

Here is a case of a woman in Italy that had pretty much the same thing as me.

http://www.health24.com/medical/Condition_centres/777-792-1077-1714,18497.asp
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 09:16:35
"Waldinger has seen five Dutch men in as many years in his practice
complaining of flu-like symptoms including a sore throat, sweating, extreme
fatigue and eye irritation after sex."

This makes me believe that there realy is no such thing as POIS. The symptoms are too similar to post coïtal headache/migraine. (Which by the way nobody knows what causes it.)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 09:28:36
(1) to try to have a good, powerful, romantically-fueled vs. weak experience and (2) to not have "too many" releases close together, which varies from person to person.

There is a document on the web called "your brain on sex" (http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_in_the_brain) which pretty much explains the dynamics.

The interesting part is that lowering post orgasmic symptoms involves higher levels of sexual arousement (more dopamine). Which is the totaly opposite of what is usually said, by the medical society, about post orgasmic pain.

You can easily do this test by first masturbating to a picture of an old ugly woman. And then after some time again masturbating to a picture of a beautifull young girl.

In my experience the beautifull young girl causes significantly less pain.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 09:32:13
Also notice that Waldinger works in a department that treats men with problems involving erectile disfunction.

This alone may be the reason it is stated that he does not know wether post orgasmic symptoms also appear in women.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 09:46:25
Quote
When I have great, bedbreaking, screaming and thrashing sex with my wife and my heart rate goes like I'm running a marathon and it takes a while to get my breath back and my orgasm was so strong I thought my head would fall off, I always suffer a lot less with POIS. I do get a drop in energy and my stomach goes a little funny and all the things I've described, but it's always a lot lot worse if I'm sitting quietly at home and have a quick **** that probably does not even raise my heart rate at all. After that I often feel like I've had all my energy drained away and I often go and lie down and sleep.

I just noticed this was mentioned before.

It is pretty much what I have just been saying also. Higher levels of sexual arousement cause less symptoms. There may be something wrong with dopamine relase then. Maybe causing too high levels of prolactin. Which brings us back to the beginning. Starving yourself of prolactin in dairy products might have a very benificial result.

But then it is also possible that orgasm comes too quickly. And that you realy should be warmed up first.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 10:03:35
If you think this last part is contrary to what I called Sexual Relaxation Retraining Therapy consider the fact that it is important in this technique to get high levels of arousement prior to each stop. Because this ensures high releases of pre-cum.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 11:31:52
Maybe leading to the believe that the problem is realy related to what you could call "cold orgasms". Orgasming in a body that is not readily warmed up.

I.e. a condition very similar to muscle ache caused by not doing stretch excercises.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/12/2007 13:43:14
Also if POIS was a auto-imune desease you would be able to determine that with a PET-scan (or have I been watching too much House).
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 04/12/2007 03:48:57
"Waldinger has seen five Dutch men in as many years in his practice
complaining of flu-like symptoms including a sore throat, sweating, extreme
fatigue and eye irritation after sex."

This makes me believe that there realy is no such thing as POIS. The symptoms are too similar to post coïtal headache/migraine. (Which by the way nobody knows what causes it.)

imre1 - - do your symptoms last 3-5 days after sex? THAT (to me) plus extreme fatigue/exhaustion is the definition of POIS, of which there are many varieties on this Forum. But, again,  3 to 5 days of extreme exhaustion and perhaps some form of derealization, I think is the common thread here.

POIS differs from "post orgasmic fatigue" -- which lasts hours - not days, like POIS does.

Dr. Waldinger, as B_Jim pointed out, studied a very small sample. I think what Waldinger contributed most to all of us was DAYS (not hours) of symptoms, and flulike symptoms...which include fatigue/exhaustion.

I contend that anyone who comes to this Forum has POIS, because - although they may see differences in symptoms, the SIMILARITIES are more important.

So....we are all here, still in the process of defining POIS!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 04/12/2007 17:03:50
No, mine is more of a very excruciating pain lasting days.

That said I do think that there are a number of nasty things people can get from orgasm, none of them fun.

Still, by studying the problem at a personal level you can identify what causes more/less symptoms.

I just wanted to state that orgasmic problems realy are caused by orgasm and that there are ways of being in control of your orgasms.

Further more by exchanging information ir is possible to find out what is likely to work for other people.

And the red line that seems to run through this is that higher levels of arousal cause less symptoms. Maybe it's the body's way of saying that sex realy is meant to be done with partners whom we are in love with.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 05/12/2007 11:10:36
After looking somewhat further I have found that Chronic Fatigue Syndrome has many of the symptoms of post orgasmic symptoms.

CDC 1994 criteria (aka "Fukuda"):

The fatigue must be accompanied by a minimum of 4 of the following eight symptoms:

1 Impairment of short-term memory and concentration
2 Sore throat
3 Tender lymph nodes
4 Muscle pain
5 Multi-joint pain
6 Headaches of a new type, pattern, or severity
7 Unrefreshing sleep or insomnia
8 Post-exertional malaise or fatigue lasting more than 24 hours after exertion.


NICE (UK) 2007 criteria

* fatigue that is new, persistent and/or recurrent, not explained by other conditions and has has resulted in a substantial reduction in activity level characterised by post-exertional malaise and/or fatigue (typically delayed, for example by at least 24 hours, with slow recovery over several days) and
* one or more of the following list of symptoms: difficulty with sleeping, muscle and/or joint pain at multiple sites without evidence of inflammation, headaches, painful lymph nodes that are not pathologically enlarged, sore throat, cognitive dysfunction, worsening of symptoms by physical or mental exertion, general malaise, dizziness and/or nausea and palpitations with no identifiable heart problem.


Maybe post orgasmic symptoms are a manifestation, or a special form, of CFS?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/12/2007 15:58:48
My psychiatrist thought my POIS sounded like CFS, I disagreed don't remember why) but with imre1's post (thank you) it does seem a possibility.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: antman on 11/12/2007 10:20:45
Hi I have suffered in relative silence with some of the symptons you have all been discussing for over 20 years, I have other symptons not yet mentioned, and others which are not as bad as some of you are suffering from, this is the first time on this forum, and  feel I definately suffer with some form of POIS,fatigue lasting upto 2 days rarely more, like I have been tranquilised especially pronounced mid afternoon, shakes very first thing in morning, unable to wake up etc, depressive bouts,and paranoia, I went to the doctor last year,she was very patient with me but gave me no answers and said she Knew of no one else with prolonged symptoms but that it was normal to feel fatigue. I'm mid thirties white northern european, Im interested  to know if this is a genetic trate or induced from other things, I always felt it was hormonaly induced, but wonder if it is a mineral defficiency, one of my symptoms is clicking hips, which I also get after giving blood. My symptoms are not as bad as they used to be, but my sexual appetite, is not so great. I'll stay posted . ant.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: antman on 12/12/2007 19:50:38
Hi B Jim, thanks for your response,I have never taken any form of antidepressant, or any medication for my problems, even  trips to the doctor are very rare, my use of the word paranoia is perhaps a little casual, but I developed very irrational fears during adolescence, the doctors at the time putting this down to anxiety, I had shingles when I was 2l culminating eventually into what can only be described as a nervous breakdown. I don't want to lose the thread of why I'm here, but I find that POIS seems to amplify any negative doubts or fears (never positive thoughts)so I have to be careful if I'm in stressful periods, much of my stress is usually irrational,leading to the depression.  I don't think POIS is responsible for it, but it drains my energy, takes away my fight. I don't see my self as ill anymore,although I don't think I can handle stress as well as a "normal" person. I think I have suffered POIS ever since I was 13, although I didn't attribute it to sexual activity at the time, so POIS came before the depression caused by other factors. I think!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/12/2007 21:41:56
Hi antman, welcome to the POIS Forum. Great to have your input, sharing your experience.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: antman on 13/12/2007 22:57:21
High demografx I shall try to answer the questionaire over the weekend, Ive just composed a little essay based on the questionaire but when I posted it I'd timed out and everything was lost, so I'll start again over the weekend, I've had other symptoms beyond the questionaire, some of which I've grown out of so I'll compile what I can, maybe we can start correlating the info into a more structured form best wishes to all. antman
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Gonzo on 16/12/2007 06:47:57
Gentlemen,

This is the most awkward yet the most relieving of messages I have ever written. I suffer from many of the same symptoms with the exception to the muscle pains.

I wanted to write and encourage the members dedicated to this post as I know there are only a few who are experiencing this and searching for answers. I will be writing a more thorough survey about my case in particular with details and will be posting it soon.

Thank you for your hard work gentlemen. I have high hopes that we can come to conclusive information so that we can experience some sort of normalcy in spite of our condition. Carry on!

Gonzo
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Porke on 16/12/2007 18:28:40
WoW!

Im not the only one going thru this!!!

I have been researching this on the internet for a few months and all i could come up with was a few snippets of info here and there. Most websites just try sell you some bullcrap product (which is just a multivitamin anyways)

Ok

My experiences has been similar. After sex (alone or with a girl) i do experience a hangover effect. There is not difference to real sex or by yourself (how would your body know anyways). Sometimes its almost like a delayed effect... in that i feel worse only a day or two later... and this can persist for several days.

I experience: Tiredness, Pale looking, Eyes burning, More Edgy, Dont think as clearly... I dont get any backaches or muscle spams as some people talk about.

Frequency is definitely a contributing factor. Once a week seems fine, but a few sessions back to back KILLS ME. It takes about 3-5 days for me to 'feel normal' again.

I have tried every supplement out there that could POSSIBLY improve things. Zinc for testosterone, and some testo boosters (which didnt do squat) (I dont believe it has anything to do with testosterone levels). Then ive done multi vitamins.. B vitamins... DHEA (For apparently low DHEA levels... but that made me feel even worse)..

Now, after finding some article it describes two main brain chemicals... One being dopamine and one being prolactin. After sexy time, dopamine drops and prolactin rockets. It is from one of these (dopamine being too low or prolactin being too high) that apparently causes all these symptoms. Somehow... suffers of 'POIS' as you guys call it struggle to bring these two hormones back into balance.

Now, as i understand it, if dopamine goes up, prolactin goes down... its like a see saw. Ive seen some people discussing anti depressents and stuff... not sure how those are going to work.. As far as i know.. these things prevent re uptake of certain chemicals... hence SSRI (Reuptake Inhibitor) so its not actually boosting anything.

Here are some supplements that have some promise according to what ive researched:

Tyrosine:
Tyrosine may be useful in the treatment of Alzheimer’s Disease (Alzheimer’s Disease patients frequently exhibit lowered levels of Dopamine and Norepinephrine; Tyrosine may help to restore normal levels of these Neurotransmitters).

Phenylalanine-L:
Phenylalanine is metabolized within the body to form Catecholamine Neurotransmitters (usually via Tyrosine):
Phenylalanine is a precursor for the endogenous production of Dopamine.

L-Theanine :
Theanine may increase Dopamine levels in the Brain.  references
Theanine may increase Gamma Aminobutyric Acid (GABA) levels in the Brain.  references

I have tried tyrosine myself.. and i noticed a SLIGHT improvement in things. Im thinking maybe a combination of all 3 could do the trick. I dont like using supplements tho, as im quite sensitive to them... i always feel weird on them, or have some reaction....

So there it is... im hoping someone could give some more useful info... or maybe try any of these above and report back

Ciao
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 18/12/2007 16:16:12
Hi fellow POIS sufferers

Would you all post on whether you were victims of childhood abuse or trauma. I want to explore the possibility that childhood trauma maybe resposible for an adverse reaction to orgasm in later life.

( I will post about my 25 years of POIS sometime later )
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 18/12/2007 16:35:36
Well I'm pretty sure what causes my symptoms.

At the point of orgasm I get lines running in my head that feel like something is ripping up my brain. It would be like tearing of blood vessels in the head like with benign coital headache. But strangely those lines itself do not cause any pain (maybe a form of neurologically disorder in itself). 

Actually since I have been having these my entire live I always thought that they were just normal.

But when I pratice start/stops for a long time the same lines do not represent themselves any more. And I get no symptoms.

So it is as if my brain is being torn apart and I get temporal minor brain damage in the days following orgasm.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Gonzo on 19/12/2007 09:01:16
So here goes my story...

I'm 27 years old and have suffered from POIS for at least 10 years. I grew up a lethargic kid, recluse and introverted.  Often I would find myself with no motivation and completely drained in the likeness of the day after a sleepless night. Some moments weren't so bad though. I found that when I did have the ability to focus and had some energy, I was a pretty sociable guy and not too dull upstairs. It never occurred to me that my struggles were pointing at a problem. I began masturbating when I was about 14 or so but don't remember much about those days. I just know it happened often.

It wasn't until recently when an unfortunate and painful experience opened my eyes. I had made some bad decisions and bad judgment concerning some serious issues in my life. I found myself in deep depression and experienced a despair so dark and bitter that I would not wish it on my greatest enemy. I firmly believe that the side effects of POIS led me to make some bad judgment call, which are often in my experience of the condition. Its difficult to think and to put your thoughts in the right order. The brain fog is perpetually parked in my head and it seems like it will never leave. To my relief though, its gone after 3 days.

It wasn't until then that I started realizing that I needed help. I took care of myself. I ate right and lost some weight. I started taking St. John Wort which has done a wonderful job allowing me to have life again. By the way, St. John's has been known to help remedy depression symptoms. For some of you struggling with depression and associated mood problems, I recommend it but with the precaution that it effects everyone differently. I'm very thankful to report that these measures have helped me tremendously. There was still something wrong though. Something that had been true for so long began to prod at my curiosity and I began questioning it. As long as I can remember, an orgasm for me meant 3 days of downtime. I reasoned that it was a natural process that the body took to recuperate from an orgasm. But then I wondered what exactly it was recuperating from when I masturbated? Like I said, I never thought much of it, I never questioned it, but as i was recovering from depression, I noticed that when I did orgasm the symptoms would come back adding to the recuperation time I was familiar with. Here is a list of them:

1. Moodswings
2. Lack of concentration
3. Lack of cognitive function
4. Inability to communicate properly
5. Depression
6. Loss of confidence
7. Dream-like consciousness/surrealism
8. Desensitized(Unsociable/careless)
9. Extremely fatigued/ extreme heaviness
10. Headaches
11. Difficulty with visual focusing
12. Restless leg syndrome

As I came across this website, I was completely shocked and relieved to see all of my symptoms tied to this sexual event. Finally! Someone else was experience the same problem. I had researched this sort of problem often in the past but with little success. This thread is helping me to understand that I have a biological problem that needs attention and I wonder how much doctors can do. I've been reading up a lot on the bodies natural ability to heal itself and wonder if perhaps this can be a means for healing. If this is just some sort of neurological imbalance, involving Dopamine and Prolactin as some have suggested, then I think theres a hope for a cure rather than just a medical bandage for most if not all of us. I understand that each one of us is different yet similar in that we are a few who have just begun to receive confirmation that indeed something is wrong and we are not the only ones.

I hope to be a part of the solution as well. I hope to study the thread carefully for leads and begin some of my own sleuth work in hopes of finding some relief. I am particularly interested in the neurological study of the chemical events that surround an orgasm and finding a natural way, perhaps, to remedy this. I want to enjoy the great gift of sex, but I often hold back so much because of its implications. My plan is to space my sexual encounters to twice a month. I don't have a girlfriend to keep satisfied so this task will hopefully be a bit easier.

I hope one day we can enjoy sex without having to worry about the repercussions. Imagine that. No fatigue, no mental fog, no restless leg, no back pains, just beautiful uninhibited pleasure.

I am blessed to be a part of this community. May the good work continue!

Sincerely grateful,

Gonzo
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 19/12/2007 09:07:36
A supplement that might be benificial in treating post orgasmic symptoms is gingko biloba.

What it does is smooth out the blood flow to the brain. It is sold as a feeding supplement for minor brain difficulties. It is often sold as a memory aid for the over 40. And it also used to fight cataracts and glaucoma.

Actually it's workings seem to be similar to propranolol in that it causes lowered blood pressure. But unlike propranolol it does not make you physically dependent on a drug that might actually kill you. As bingko biloba is sold as simple feeding supplement it is very unlikely to do any harm.

If you are living somewhere in Europe there is a very big chance that you can just by that in the local drug store under some form or an other. In my country it is for example sold as memixx.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: antman on 19/12/2007 20:33:13
Hi everybody, just seen the new postings by bizzy,gonzo and porke, I am short for time but wanted to add a few comments tonight. Bizzy, I had a very good childhood, no abuse in my life, however you mentioned trauma,and on quick reflection remmembered that I had a minor operation at the age of thirteen, under a general anaesthetic,not sexually related!  However upon awaking, and being very sick I noticed that I had dandruff, it was like snow, I did not have it on entry to the hospital, but have suffered with it ever since, using a selenium based shampoo to keep it at bay now. I also had very bad acne, I know that both conditions are puberty related, however I believe to this day the dandruff was a result of the stress from the anaesthetic. For months after the operation I was very tearful, mildly depressed but again is this as a result of puberty? I remember at the time thinking the operation had affected my confidence .  Does acne indicate hormonal imbalances, it would be interesting to know if any or all of you were, or are sufferers.
Some of the symptoms not mentioned that I have had besides the fatigue are cramp, floaters in my eyes, I believe this to be dead nerve cells in the aqueous of the eye. Very pale white rings around my eyes like I have been skiing,dizziness, bad shakes when I wake up (the morning after) and a desperate need to sleep for at least 2 hours longer than if I've not had any sexual activity, with a need to sleep mid afternoon the next day sometimes 2. I'm interested to see any similarities between our history,genetic makeup and lifestyles, if any of you can relate to this I'd appreciate some comment.  Gonzo I read your story and symptoms and related to much of it.
keep the info coming. antman.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 20/12/2007 15:06:06
Hi folks

This is in response to antmans post. I too have suffered from terrible dandruff (like snowflakes) ever since my teens. I also have thought that this maybe related to my depression. I too have developed pale white rings around the iris of my eyes. I have never been under general anaesthesia. So I think your anaesthesia experience may have been a trigger or aggravator rather than something that created the condition.
I was physically abused (not sexual) as a child all the way into my teens. I thought that this may have been responsible for my depression and POIS. But there is also the possibility that a genetic disposition is purely responsible. From your post (antman) because you had a good childhood it seems that our condition may have genetic roots only.
Your prolonged depression after anaesthesia may have been caused by the anaesthetic and indicative of how drugs affect us in an abnormal and prolonged manner. I find that all kinds of drugs have an unsual and prolonged affect on my mental state including tea and coffee. Over the years I have formed the opinion that this prolonged affect is caused by 'sticking receptors' within the hypothalamus. When one has an orgasm there are hormonal and neuro-chemical changes within the hypothalamus. For example prolactin goes up and dopamine goes down. These changes in a specific area of the brain are probably responsibe for the post orgasmic fatigue in normal men. In POIS the brain chemistry of the hypothalamus fails to recover as it should. The person continues to feel fatigued and eventually starts to suffer from severe depression.
This is a condition that is not even recognized or known by the medical community. Research needs to be done to acknowledge its existance and cause. A protein that helps maintain receptor function within the hypothalamus maybe responsible for this illness.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 20/12/2007 19:19:40
Hi All,

It's wonderful to see you all posting here and I hope this forum serves to assist you......even if it's just as a sounding board !

Demografx has asked me to just point out something he has seen regarding Levitra.Unfortunately he can't post at the moment.

 It's a post he read elsewhere on the net and although the nature of the post can not be substantiated he felt it prudent to let you all know that it's possible that Levitra can cause strokes in people who do not need to take it.

I think the moot point here is to always ask the chemist/pharmacist or get advice from a medical practitioner before starting a treatment.



Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Gonzo on 23/12/2007 09:16:32
I just read a few articles, one of which includes the research conducted by Marnia Robinson, and found them very helpful and informative. It was recommended previously by someone on this thread and I would also entreat those who are trying to understand our condition to give it a read. You can find it here:

http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_in_the_brain

Its easy to correlate the low dopamine levels to our particular symptoms, and if they are connected, then as the article suggests, it is perhaps something we may only be able to partially assuage. However, something which I have yet to find a possible explanation for is the dreaded 'foggy head syndrome' (impaired cognition) that I heatedly and savagely despise, much like demografx feels of POIS in its entirety(I feel your frustation!). I don't know whether to attribute this to the depression or to some other cause.

I've been without an "O" for 7 days now and the urge is really starting to get to me. Partially, I like how I feel. I'm confident, driven, and have a very exciting desire for the sexual "hunt". This is something that I often don't experience because I live through lows about 95% of my time. ITS FRUSTRATING! I have good mental clarity, although I've been struggling to focus more than other times and I'm suspect of ADD symptoms(but that's another can of worms), and my memory and other cognitive functions seem to be in order. I have a case of mild fatigue but the explanation for that is finals and the intensity of Christmas shopping this last week. I took half the day to rest and do nothing and tomorrow I should feel a big difference.

I should add a bit more information about myself that may be helpful. I suffer from PE but have an unbelievably short refractory period. I used to be able to go 3-4 times in a row with my ex. I could go back at it in about a minute of so. I did something similar last week but it was only twice through. On another note, I'm lactose intolerant and the posts regarding dairy intake are intriguing. I think cutting out dairy would be beneficial to me, but its hard to let go of cheese pizza and cafe con leche! I wonder if that may have something to do with my particular case, or anyones at that. I don't take any medication, never have. I suffered emotional trauma only once, which was the event that brought me to realize I had a problem. I basically had some sort of manic-depressive episode with some "mild" psychosis. It was the strangest and darkest moments of my life. I was under an enormous amount of emotional stress and had to make some very weighty decisions about my life at that time. I've never had any operations and rarely do I get sick. Growing up I was unusually sexually curious at an early age. I'm talking about 7-8 years old making out with the baby-sitter's daughter. Would you say that's normal? I also had two experiences where I was molested by my "peers". I know that's vague but I don't like talking about it and I don't see a connection. I think this is biological/genetic, but who am I to assert this?

I hope this can help us. Blessings.

Gonzo
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 23/12/2007 21:21:28
I said I would do this, sorry it took so long.

1)- Number of days after:    

Typically a week, in two phases:

A:
The first phase is feeling very horrible in a way that I cannot describe, feels like a brain chemical is way out of whack. Social interaction is a nightmare during this, being socially impaired by having difficulty generating new thought. I learned how to “fake it” by relying on memories for content, hoping that at best I would appear distant, in an attempt to conceal a cognitive impairment. It is difficult to say exactly when it begins after orgasm.

B:
After a few days I the horrible feeling would end but it would take 3 or 4 more days to feel like myself, during which I felt very burnt out.

2)- Overall symptoms
-Physical tiredness : did not affect my physical stamina, only mental, but you don’t feel like being physical when you are mentally altered
-Mental tiredness 0 initially, then 4
-Lethargy/Derealisation (I cant wake up!) 4 ??
-Lack of concentration/Brain fog 5
-Sweating and heat feelings 0
-Cold feelings/cold hands/cold body 0
-Myalgias 0
-Anxiety 5
-Depression 0
-Agoraphobia/Social phobia 5
-Not motived 0
-Memory problems 5
-Difficult to speak/communication 5
-Insomnias/sleep problems : I have developed this…presumably due to many years of high anxiety, silently dealing with the problem
-Headaches 0
-Stomach aches 0 but it affects my digestive system, having a laxative effect
-Restless/agitation 0
-Blurred vision 0  but I have periodically had double vision, the onset of which coincided with an incident of POIS.
-Buzzing ears 0
-Dizziness 0
-Muscle tremors0  but definitely have muscle twitches after sex, even now when the POIS is not affecting me the way it used to.
-Diarrhoea day0 ; intestines are stimulated, but not that much
-Hair problems 0
-Mouth problems  0
-Skin problems 0
-Eyes problems 5 see above
-Short breathing 0
-Premature Ejaculation 150 :o)
-Sexual pain after sex 0
-Erection problems 0
-Libido problems 0
Others Symptoms ? High blood pressure was definitely present at times, as in the later days of my problem I thought of checking this. I forget the numbers but it was definitely high and demonstrated it to my doctor, who was alarmed but didn’t have any idea what could be the cause.


3) medical tests: many, so many.. but nothing was found. The only demonstrable effect was the high blood pressure mentioned above.

4) meds: I was on different types of  antidepressants, but nothing improved the POIS

5) I eat a good diet, better than I did when I suffered so much, but I wouldn’t say it was a bad diet. As y’all know I stay a mile from milk, not knowing definitely if it is the culprit but not willing to do any experimenting.

Welcome to the new arrivals.

John21


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 24/12/2007 10:21:37
Jim,
I was on various SSRIs. Paxil was the main one which I was on for years.  It did indeed help my PE but I continued to have it, only of less intensity. It didn't help the POIS so I discontinued it. I tried Paxil again to battle my insomnia, but I don't think it helped on that front either.

In general I find antidepressants rob me of myself somehow. Faith is my current drug of choice.

(Aside: I didn't know I shouldn't stop taking Paxil suddenly and had a severe reaction on withdrawl: "the zaps" and pulsatile tinnitus. Many years later I still have the tinnitus and occasionally get the zaps in my sleep)

John21
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: wowsawow on 25/12/2007 22:19:56
Wow - I'm in bed a feel like I have the flu. I'd come to accept that I was a fluke case where orgasm (especially a few times with a week) produced a sick run-down feeling.
I thought I'd give the Internet one more try - and found this forum.

On the one hand - I'm very happy. I'm not the only one.

On the other hand, what can be done?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/12/2007 02:39:59
Jim, I don't think there's a "typical POIS state," except as defined by Dr Waldinger and he only studied less than a handful of cases.

I suggest that we are in the process of RE-DEFINING POIS, since we have more "subjects" here than did Dr Waldinger. And far more richer depth of personal history, characteristics and correlating symptoms.

I think we have successfully determined, simply, that there is a rare incidence in the population of longterm, adverse effects post-orgasm. I propose that we be as INCLUSIVE as possible of many different forms and types of "post orgasmic illness".
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 29/12/2007 06:58:21
I think this forum is showing that the POIS symptoms as most people have described here are of a typical kind. My post orgasmic symptoms are fatigue, difficulty concentrating, mood swings, depression, flu like symptoms, depersonlization, derealization and muscular weakness. Thats amazingly similar symptoms to others on this forum. I believe the more obscure symptoms people have described here may either not be linked or only weakly linked.
Gonzo has created an excellent list of POIS symptoms.
Theres someone on this forum that keeps on talking about post orgasmic genital pain and not POIS. He also keeps on posting about long masturbation sessions to combat this condition. I think he is on the wrong forum and needs to see a urologist.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 29/12/2007 07:15:29
Hi fellow POIS sufferers

Would you all post on whether you were victims of childhood abuse or trauma. I want to explore the possibility that childhood trauma maybe resposible for an adverse reaction to orgasm in later life.

( I have posted this before but got a poor response )
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 29/12/2007 10:14:59
Bizzy,

I was not the victim of abuse or trauma. For many years it was my longstanding firm belief that what I have experienced ("POIS") was not of a physiological origin, I noticed no causal relationship with any emotional issues. But, there was a time I had a relationship with a woman who I felt very good about being with, like she was "the one". At the time that we had sex I had double vision and the next day it was gone suddenly and I had no POIS symptoms. This is the one piece of "evidence" that I have that POIS could partially be a consequence of sex outside of love, like skydiving without a parachute. But this is speculation on my part, and may be skewed by misreading this one experience in the light of my faith.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 30/12/2007 17:11:33
Theres someone on this forum that keeps on talking about post orgasmic genital pain and not POIS. He also keeps on posting about long masturbation sessions to combat this condition.

I think you have some persons mixed up. Not at all uncommon for a thread of this length.

I am suffering from a post orgasmic migraine which is unlike any of the standard forms of benign coital headache.

I think it is related to post orgasmic fatigue because fatigue causes headaches.

Further more I also have:
- mental fog
- heavy transpiration
- heat feelings
- ...

And I still think that this is caused by orgasm and that if you lower the orgasmic feeling, the symptoms disapppear.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 30/12/2007 23:29:15
Hi fellow POIS sufferers

Would you all post on whether you were victims of childhood abuse or trauma. I want to explore the possibility that childhood trauma maybe resposible for an adverse reaction to orgasm in later life.

( I have posted this before but got a poor response )

Hi Bizzy,

I definitely experienced childhood trauma: (1) attended 8 years of parochial school which utilized heavy corporal punishment, and I was maligned and singled out by teachers and students alike for being of a different faith from others and (2) parents survived the Holocaust - a well known trauma for children of survivors.

I hope this helps.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 30/12/2007 23:38:22
DRY FINGERTIPS

Does anyone else experience extremely "dried up" (hard to describe) _fingertips_ during POIS period? Thank you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 31/12/2007 09:29:03
HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!!

Wishing you all the best for 2008(including reduced or eliminated POIS symptoms for all of us!)

Just having this forum available has already helped me.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 01/01/2008 00:04:08
"just the simple fact that serotonin is released at a enormous rate during the act of love making and both partners experience a "low" of serotonin after the act (think of a drug user)."

This maybe true but we know that most men cope well afterwards, we dont. So we must have something going wrong. I propose that we have a fault within the hypothalamus. A fault that prevents the dopamine/prolactin balance from recovering normally. A fault that upsets a healthy immune response via the hypothalamus. A fault that causes a runaway stress response involving the CRF hormone via the pituitary. The CRF hormone lowers brain levels of serotonin and raises cortisol. The CRF hormone may underpin this whole illness.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: E J on 01/01/2008 00:07:08
What a relief ! --- Like most I thought I was alone with this problem. I have suffered a  dissociative, derealisation? type dream state since my first ejaculation. Now in my early 60's it has progressed to the full spectrum and lasts about 7 days or so. On top of the dream state I now get severe fatigue/weakness, significant generalised muscle aching/tenderness, sub acute sore throats, swollen lymph glands, inflamed sinuses. low grade night sweats, daytime "boiling" accompanies any activity and - just  recently- transient generalized joint pains ( actually, around the joint).
   What makes it all so difficult is that my sex drive remains very persuasive - it is difficult for me to resist sexual activity if in "proximity" and, after 3 - days or so the urge becomes overwhelming. Masturbation seems to produce less "trauma" but ,even so ,it's marginal.  Like others, I literally fear close relationships and for the first time in my life I am actively avoiding them. My irresistible urge and the consequences result in a state of existence that make living barely worth while. No, this is not a suicide note - but did I not have a couple of loving daughters it might well be. I have read most of the entrees and am surprised not to have noted similar sentiments of total desperation.

                  E J
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 01/01/2008 10:39:00
All POIS cases

TNS Forum :


Note : sometimes the indicated page has changed, please look the next or previous page. 

1 John21 1
2 Bjim 1   
3 Demografx 1 
4 Cox 1
5 Mellirova 1
6 Bobsie 2
7 TracyST 2
8 JPLewin 2
9 Nathan 3
10 Dave23 4 
11 Imre1 6
12 ChrisB 6
13 Agjchs 8 
14 Antman 9
15 Gonzo 10
16 Porke 10
17 Bizzy 10
18 Wowsawow 10
19 E.J. 11
20 Ultraka 11
21 Guthrie 11
22 Tate 12
23 Interested's bf 12
24 El Stonio 12   
25 Ender 13
26 Jo58 13
27 Nobody007 14
28 HK1979 15
29 Wikkid 16 
30 Bosseflambe 16
31 Living 30 16
32 Solution 17
33 Sokovan 17
34 Fiddlerpaul 17
35 Pdawg 19
36 Nopoison 19
37 Cdma77 19
38 Pyropeach 20
39 Netherlands2008 20
40 Curtis19786 22
41 Deloun p22
42 Uh-clem p23
43 Rapidgaming p23
44 Jerobam p24
45 Girlwind p25
46 Geo p26
47 Counterpoints p26
48 Rock27 p28
49 Jamie_wood888 p28
50 Martin88 p31
51 Sparx p33
52 Michael8028 p34
53 Yukka p40
54 Cookie87  p42
55 Bola-bola p42
56 ollecrev p43
57 Coreman p44
58 Nick_B_85 p45
59 goodoleboy55 p46
60 Longwalkhome p46
61 Questforlife p48
62 prosodye p48
63 Animus p49
65 Aloha p51
66 William p53
67 Stilkus p53
68 CCconfucius p54
69 DigitalMac p54
70 Hurray p55
71 tacabrighe p57
72 Chewbacca p69
73 Whoaa p71
74 Tarkington p62
75 Shahnameh p73
76 Reater p74
77 Limejuice p74
78 Andreas_F p88
79 Laroux's girlfriend p92
80 Gement p93
81 Underwater p99 
82 Phasian p10
83 MattJ p56
84 Davep007 p103
85 SteveD p106
86 Jasmine07 p121
87 SickLifeSaver p127
88 Pro p127
89 Fellow sufferer p127
90 Richargear p130
91 Londonchap p133
92 Jack D p134
93 mister_z p135
94 goingcrazy p140
95 Jiddu5 p139
96 Rob58 p143
97 Pantaloon 174
98 Nsf p150
99 Jidmiddleton p150
100 Ambient123 p152
101 Neverstop p159
102 Defsync p160
103 Aaronchi p161
104 Staystrong p168
105 Welness p169
106 nTonic p170
107 EDS p171
108 ajs p174
109 POIS-SUFFERER p174
110 Deniseamonalisa p175
111 RhythmSpring p177
112 antimorbit p178
113 Dean93 p181
114 zaaria p182
115 Jdubs p183
116 Pronobis p185
117 Botbot p190
118 beyondfrustrated p191
119 David_S p192
120 Langjahr p198
121 NakedDynamo p198
122 Chipdouglas p202
123 daisi_sufferer p203
124 Claret88 p206
125 Green p207
126 mat780 p214
127 helpimsad p217
128 Danny_Boy p217
129 THISFORUMROCKS! p217
130 lauracostis p220
131 Bill12 p220
132 johnl3 p220
133 sclover49 p221
134 tazdas  p222
135 JonJen99 p223
136 Pois_is_hell p226
137 CrazyFox p227
138 Wooder p227
139 Tom2009 p230
140 Pauliebaby61 p235
141 Taz p236
142 Z_One p236
143 Itsmebutwho? p236
144 devastated p238
145 bruxe p245
146 Looking_for_answer p246
147 ophicus1213 p248
148 Pablo445 p254
149 exponent p257
150 tazzy p258
151 Holden F. Anmar-Dey p261
152 PRZ p261
153 europe p261
154 greg44 p262
155 Mental p262
156 Mr_Canadian 263
157 daveyboy 267
158 Sweden 267
159 JJGuy 268
160 bright n clean 269
161 sports_fan 269
162 Ragnar 269
163 atlgreg 271
164 Alexia 272
165 eyestimuli08 277
166 hazey 278
167 Itsmebutwho? 278
168 ad75 278
169 pedro05
170 matsoda 282
171 georgesteve 283
172 Ironyman 288
173 ippo 290
174 Merrilee 291
175 missr 292
176 emanmern 293
177 Sick 294
178 ophicus1213 296
179 Poised 296
180 nbhopeful999 299
181 daveman 299
182 omerbasket 304
183 robb23 306
184 AXIS009 308
185 bm303 310
186 Bowdon 319
185 Dionysus 323
188 FinalPanic 327
189 lost1 330
190 horizon 333
191 nick2k222 334
192 mmac06 335
193 jjjackson 336
194 bokonon 342
195 Vandemolen3 352
196 Alices_wonder 357
197 Tim In San Francisco 358
198 my.delahaye 364
199 seminewt 363
200 strike333 364
201 opeth41 367
202 itsallgood 370
203 GreenWyvern 373
204 Daniel31 382
205 dutchie 387
206 r3dey3s 393
207 alices_wonder 394
208 Alky 402
209 pepboyz 402
210 gabin 407
211 DrewFive 410
212 nomadsack 412
213 victor.kons 413
214 Sig  414
215 yoplait 414
216 monkeyboy 422
217 WeEndThemAll 431
218 Habibou 432
219 dbfd588 435
220 Kingkong 436
221 Connor 437
222 spineguy 435
223 Lindsey 437
224 Zoop 441
225 baboo 446
226 Nightingale 448
227 nick2k22 448
228 afghan666 450
229 kristy 449
230 Rob99 455
231 one_of_akind 461
232 jivetalk 462
233 joyrex 469
234 gadhouse 470
233 valtak2610 470
234 ghunna 471
235 artist 474
236 masochist 478
237 HIPIE 478
238 apostate801 482
239 MrMoonJr 482
240 Vincent Marcus 483
241 carlitto 481
242 RAries 485
243 scooby 492
244 janiv 493
245 alphaq 494
246 cab771 501
247 KCsignman 501
248 Chrissi 501
249 Mer 506
250 Cornelius 512
251 Willem 534
252 emi_b 535
253 kaiser 537
254 spillway 537
255 eur79m 538
256 Sameer 540
257 dan-ireland 540
258 B_daniel 543
259 spence23 546
260 Jrd 547
261 a2g 554
262 bitu8489 554
263 Alui 553
264 Wibin 554
265 Pharaoh 556
266 theblade 566
267 patrick_pois 568
268 POIS1441 572
269 Quasar 586
270 pois_pois_go_away 587
271 Scotty9193 588
272 TIMRIL 590
273 BMX 595
274 traderwithpois 604
275 Ryuk 603
276 prister 606
277 pois1 606
278 pois 610
279 Alexander Russian 611
280 JimZ8532 612
281 scientoast 612
282 RemovePois 613
283 psonijackson 614
284 tatvamasi 615
285 bastianb 616
286 Suppertime 617
287 Enos 618
288 Guitarninja2 619
289 observercenter 620
290 badgerstripe 622
291 mrraba 638
292 HeyMonkey 644
293 ridohu 648
294 makaveli 650
295 mr cool 658
296 nathan660
297 Contributor 660
298 JackSparrow 660
299 l1_prior 666
300 meteo74 666
301 micro41 666
302 gdrtw 666
303 boobay 666
304 fidalgo 670
305 vasian1980 670
306 napkynbass 670
307 manutao 677
308 Robtabasco51



Relora and Fenugreek results for our forum  (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg201517#msg201517) [/b][/u][/size]

B]Cases found on the Web[/color] (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149350#msg149350)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: ultraka on 02/01/2008 01:48:17
hi. I am also suffering from this affliction, and have done for as long as i can remember. i look like death after I ejaculate and feel sick, tired, cant think, sweats, etc. i might as well write off the next day or so.
interestingly this is only after masturbation but not after sexual intercourse.

i always try to find the natural solution out of this and although nothing is 100%, the following help a little:

5htp
protein shakes
yoga
strenuous exercise(as difficult as this can be)
also mental effort to ignore symptoms
sometimes also strong tobacco.

 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/01/2008 03:04:04
WELCOME TO EJ AND ULTRAKA!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/01/2008 03:15:37
I have read most of the entrees and am surprised not to have noted similar sentiments of total desperation.

EJ, I suspect that some people, myself included, are not as willing and brave as you are to express these sentiments. I have certainly experienced them.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/01/2008 18:30:12
yoga

Have you tried tantra-yoga. I think yoga has a lot of very interesting things to say about sex.

Especially the technique of "Mula Bandha" seems to be interesting. On the same line you should realy look into Kegel excercises especially if you want to avoid wet dreams.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/01/2008 18:38:34
Go to www.semenloss.com for more information.

Can we please stick with reality.

Post Orgasmic Cognitive Symptoms are COGNITIVE symptoms which happen in the BRAIN.

The best explanation is that at the moment of orgasm the brain is overloaded by excessive blood pressure. This strikes a blow to the head which takes days to recover from. It may or it may not involve a heavy, thunderclap type headache.

But it does however create COGNITIVE symptoms, like memory loss, fatigue, ...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 03/01/2008 18:46:42
Actually looks like another one of those stupid catholic sites where they want to talk about how bad masturbation realy is.

Can somebody please explain to those idiots that ejaculation is a necessary process of the male reproductive cycle.

IT CAN *NOT* BE AVOIDED!!!

Also:

If semen would be stored in the blood why do you get more wet dreams from fat food then from actual pornography.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 03/01/2008 20:03:30
More POIS cases found on the web.

(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmembres.multimania.fr%2Fstefg1971%2Fattention.gif&hash=6a32e1ce7d2c6d6e356852d1515523db)
I'm adding each new case. But the list is long so I need several posts. Please read p11, p12, p13, p14.

1/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080116193517AAzlKbz

Do you feel exhausted for a whole week after ejaculation?
I just discovered that I have very rare syndrom (some call it Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome). After I ejaculate I have brain fog, I feel mentally and physically exhausted for a week or longer and if i don't prevent myself from masturbating I will constantly have brain fogness, low energy, tongue tied... How did I discover this? Ever since I started masturbating (5th grade) I've been living a life in confusion. Now I'm 22 and last spring I started experimenting - trying not to masturbate for as longer as possible. After 2 weeks without it, I felt that energy was built up and I had incredible drive to do things, think clearly, talk to ppl easily. I simply felt normal. And I can destroy that collected energy with 1or 2 masturbations. Later I heard that Eastern Philosophies talk about connection between energy and masturbation. The worst thing is that I'm an artist and I can't do good artwork after I masturbate. I think that my condition ruined my life and I've never had a girlfriend
Well now I don't have a problem to get a girlfriend because I know how to keep my mind clear, my energy level up - with keeping my hand off my penis. It's a strange condition and most of you are luck to not have it. For some time I used to think that this happens to everybody, but no, its very rare condition.

2/ http://medical.justanswer.com/questions/4hn6-everytime-orgasam-feel-ill-next

Everytime I have an orgasam, I feel ill for the next several days, longer if I have more of them. I get blood shot eyes, flu like symptoms, feel lehargtic, sometime I get a rash under my underarms, tense involluntary muscles on my scalp, ears popping, sweating increases, etc. I discovered it is called POIS (Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome) and others have it. )Check out Doctorbob.com seb site and others for confirmation. this is not an imaginary illness, and it is embarrassing to talk about. Anyone know knything more about it? Is it being allergic to one's own hormones or neurotransmitters? HELP!!


3/

http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic102000.html?sid=b4aae49c1f169d24a0e5d19d170fc48c

by means of a wet dream, masturbation, or anything else results in a lack of concentration. Basically, for 5 to 6 days it becomes extremely difficult to concentrate on anything, I simply cannot sustain a train of thought to think things through. I become extremly absent minded. This makes it difficult to read, hold conversations, follow lectures, take tests, remember things, and learn things. I feel extremly tired and jittery, both physically and mentally. I also become depressed during this time. Its like being totally burned out in the head; much like how people after an epileptic attack are. Also, I get strong headaches after masturbation. Allow me to repeat, these symptoms last 5 to 6 days! So its having a huge affect on my life. I've gone to a neurologist, but he doesn't seem to know whats wrong. He prescribed an ssri, but only because I mentioned I get depression after an orgasm.
If anyone has any idea of what I can do to fix this, or any information at all, please respond.
i asked this question many times at yahoo , but didnt get a solution , have been to nerologist , done all MRA + MRI all came normal !!
dont tell me stop masterbation !! pls
help me
SG

did they dignose me wrong ssri problem
I did Mri & MRA‘s every thing came normal they put me on ssri Antidepressant drugs.
At night I took it before sleep and I woke up terrible sick like mind was not with me, doing all stuff wrong cannot concentrate and think right.
May I know should I continue with the drug or stop it.
The drug is called Zoloft.
Does it means anything; does it mean that serotonin is not the problem what do u says???
Oh yes before Zoloft last 15 days back the doc prescribed me with cepram , but it was more terrible so I have to stop it , now I am on again getting the ride on a new roller coaster called ZOLOFT , how do I know that I am surely a SSRI patient.

Zoloft failure but only 15 days !! He should do another test it at least 1 month.

4/ http://www.yinyanghouse.com/node/1766

Depressed after masturbating & other stuff
Hello. I'm a 22 year old male. I have noticed that whenever I masturbate, I seem to be more anxious and tired the next day than normal. I feel like lacking in energy and just tend to be easily frustrated. What could cause this? I've been to acupunture several times because of restlessness&tiredness and general depressiveness. It has helped somewhat, but not that much that sometimes I don't feel very frustrated and hopeless about the way I am. Anybody want to offer insight? Oh, and I excercise regularly (lately astanga yoga and sometimes hiking)

5/

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=At6RrOSCDwT.c2VAZO3diM3sy6IX;_ylv=3?qid=20071123225112AAU76SR

Why do I feel like this after masturbation?
I'm 18 yr old, single & a virgin. Hav been masturbating for last 3-4 yrs. I feel dizzy & weak after masturbating; I feel like sleeping. Why does it happen? Since I don't hav sex I feel masturbation is necessary for me, I just need to do it. What do I do now? plz help!!


6/

http://asianfanatics.net/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t489406.html

Excessive masturbation = health problems?
Hi guys,
I have a serious question and I really hope you guys can help me out. This is for guys and I'm sure whatever we can contribute will be beneficial to all guys who masturbate or have sex a lot.
I've googled before and have gotten different answers like "not harmful" vs "excessive masturbation results in reduced concentration in the brain/feeling tired all the time etc."
I'm starting to think the latter is true because I've been masturbating for the past 7 years quite often. I've been known to do it everyday for months in a row, soemtiems twice a day. Rare times I will not do it for a week or so, but then it doesn't last long.
I have since noticed (about 4 years ago) that my mind can't concentrate as well as before, I feel more tired/fatigued usually..like usually if I end up sleeping over 10 hours I actually feel worse and "confused" in my mind as opposed to friends who say they feel "refreshed" after a nice sleep.
This fatigue/lack of concentration sometimes doesn't appear but most often does.
Also, there are times when after masturbation a few days in a row, my left chest hurts a lil. I get scared but just usually stop for a day or so and eventually resume...

Does anyone know if this is bad for the heart as well? ie. makes ur heart beat faster (which is not good as it's working harder than it should) or potentially cause any heart problems?

See this site seems to talk about the "fatigue" that I feel:
http://www.prostate-massage-and-health.com...sturbation.html

Please be honest and share what you know.
What I don't get is that masturbation/sex isn't really that different, so people who have sex a lot should be in the same boat as me so hmm...
I really will try my best to stop, it's just so hard!
Note: I have a girlfriend and she really doesn't mind me masturbating on my own times (not that this matters to anyone but I feel that someone's gonan be all "get a gf" on me)

7/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070511150235AA6JaJq

Why do i get REALLY tired after sex?
after sex i usually stay tired for at-least that whole day and now, more recently for a day and half. i feel like sleeping but when i try to sleep, i can't.
is there anything i can do maybe eat/drink something to get my energy back?
age 21.

"I feel like sleeping" : perfect expression to define what i feel too....


8/

http://www.byedr.com/Mens-Health/351-mens-health-2.html

Usually I feel drained the following day after having sex the night before.

9/

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071104031554AAjkbH2

What to do i feel lazy and weak after masturbation ?
i am a 16 year old boy
my height is 5"5inches
my weight is 45kgs
suggest me something
i tried to leave this but after 2 days or more
i get involed again
plzz help meeeeeeeeeeeeeee????????

10/

 http://www.steadyhealth.com/Feeling_tired_and_cant_concentrate_t110618.html

I feel soo tired and weak after ejaculation. I will have to take Vitamins to recover and it will take about 1 to 2 weeks to fully recover. If i dont take vitamin i dont know when i will recover. I will have diahrea, sweating feet, sweating nuts and my whole body is breaking down. So, right now im so afriad of ejaculating. What should i do ?

11/

http://www.ehealthforum.com/health/topic16511.html

this question concerns my boyfriend and his masturbation "problem". Frankly, i'm at the end of my tether on this and so i'm looking for anything that will point me in the right direction.
His problem is that he gets migraines, like clockwork, 2 days after masturbating.
But here's the thing; if he's having sexual relations (actual intercourse or me masturbating him) with me, he does not have these problems. Only when he is masturbating himself. Only solo does he get migraines.
I found out about this because of his insistance to stop masturbating altogether (with varying amounts of success). Without having any religious convictions (he was raised agnostic) or any specific phobias (no feelings of guilt, sin, or wrongness...Or fears of making messes), he has decided to quit completely. He says that he had no migraines in the month that he managed it, and only gets them after masturbating.
My question is twofold, so here it is:
has anyone heard of this before, and/or does anyone have any theories or suppositions about what this might be? If I get ideas for questions to ask him, I bounce them off of him. Any thoughts whatsoever would be appreciated...
And 2) should I just, you know, drop the issue? I mean, it's not as if he needs "permission from [his] girlfriend to masturbate or not" (his words). But it's not the do or don't, it's the reason behind it that concerns me. The choice itself is fine. The grounds on which it is done need some looking into.

12/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic84137.html
(Pyropeach joined TNS forum  (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg166874#msg166874))
'm 20, light (124lbs), and extremely fit. The problem is after ejaculation by means of a wet dream, masturbation, or anything else results in a lack of concentration. Basically, for 5 to 6 days it becomes extremely difficult to concentrate on anything, I simply cannot sustain a train of thought to think things through. I become extremly absent minded. This makes it difficult to read, hold conversations, follow lectures, take tests, remember things, and learn things. I feel extremly tired and jittery, both physically and mentally. I also become depressed during this time. Its like being totally burned out in the head; much like how people after an epileptic attack are. Also, I get strong headaches after masturbation. Allow me to repeat, these symptoms last 5 to 6 days! So its having a huge affect on my life. I've gone to a neurologist, but he doesn't seem to know whats wrong. He prescribed an ssri, but only because I mentioned I get depression after an orgasm.

13/

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AhPvD1yr1GODusSdIvHD2xgjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20070420151943AAcpYhX

Guys - do you lose a lot of energy from ejaculation?
I know we all feel wiped temporarily right afterward. But I have personally found that for the next day at least I am a lot more tired, sleepy at work, and have much less energy to work with. Also, if I am sick, and I ejaculate, I always get significantly sicker. I would like to hear from other guys. Do you lose significant energy for a more extended time than the next hour or so? If so, for how long before you feel "normal," and how much energy would you say you lose (%) ? Thanks.

14/

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Al3U6FT8A3ihU_UGBjD82h4jzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20060817095003AAO9zdd

 Ejaculation frequency and depression?
It seems like my mood is connected to the frequency at which I ejaculate. I know ejaculation takes away lot of energy from a man. I'm 26 male and single, and it I go two weeks or so without ejaculating I'm pretty upbeat and my moods are generally good. But, if I ejaculate once or twice a day, everyday for a week or two I feel low on energy, irritable, and feel very depressed about myself and things in my life.

Anyone else dealt with something similar? Any ideas on how to respond to this? I'm very concerned about how frequent sexual activity causes me to feel depressed.

15/

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AtJKxtVGR7WJOyBcog1SAS0jzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20070916153312AAcSBMa

What can cause a man to be extremely tired after ejaculation?
My husband is 40 years old, we have sex about once a month- He is extremely exhausted after ejaculation- even if little other physical exertion is used. I would prefer sexual relations, but he is so tired after relations that I don't bring it up often (no pun intended) I love my husband very much, but our sexual life is not what I would like it to be and I am worried about him also. I don't think all men, age 40, have this problem, but I don't have experience with other men and don't know who else to ask about this somewhat delicate situation. Any advice for me/us? Any other men have this problem? And yes, it is a problem for me also.

More (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149814#msg149814) cases
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 05/01/2008 01:25:00
On the same line you should realy look into Kegel excercises especially if you want to avoid wet dreams.

When has an excercise ever shown to prevent wet dreams. What utter nonsense.


The best explanation is that at the moment of orgasm the brain is overloaded by excessive blood pressure. This strikes a blow to the head which takes days to recover from.

How can you possibly assert that all people with POIS are victims of high brain blood pressure. How do you know this and how can you become an authority for best explanation on this subject.

Actually looks like another one of those stupid catholic sites where they want to talk about how bad masturbation realy is.
IT CAN *NOT* BE AVOIDED!!!

Hold on, ive known people who did avoid masturbation as part of their faith. Not saying they never did but they did avoid it.

If semen would be stored in the blood why do you get more wet dreams from fat food then from actual pornography.

Semen stored in blood ???
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 05/01/2008 08:49:46
When has an excercise ever shown to prevent wet dreams. What utter nonsense.

http://www.coolnurse.com/wet_dreams.htm
http://www.coolnurse.com/kegel_exercises.htm

How can you possibly assert that all people with POIS are victims of high brain blood pressure. How do you know this and how can you become an authority for best explanation on this subject.

Possible not. But I have spoken with both sexologists and neurologists.

Hold on, ive known people who did avoid masturbation as part of their faith. Not saying they never did but they did avoid it.

The subject of the sentence was ejaculation, not masturbation.

Semen stored in blood ???

See www.semenloss.com

PS. I wouldn't try a flame war if I were you. I have been through anough to know you are going to loose!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 05/01/2008 09:27:32
So I just realized that live is to short to be in a fight with any bulies so I will just give in to what bizzy wants and leave. Altough I haven't seen him come up with any bright ideas.

Just wanted to add that you (except for buzzy who for I care can spent the next 50 years feeling miserable) should realy have to look into gingko biloba.

The full description on the bottle states:

"Gingko has the ability to promote circulatory perfusion, particularly in cerebreal tissue. Gingko is neurosupportive, promotes cognition and memory function, and is good for occasional mild memory problems associated with aging. In addition, Gingko contains antioxidant properties that help fight free radicals in the body."

Well I don't know what you are talking about, but I am talking about post orgasmic cognitive symptoms.

After trying it out there are some pros and cons:

+ it realy does work. The pressure in the body is not as high as what it used to be
- as it reduces blood pressure you might get some very mild form of erectile dysfunction

But if I have to choose between days of pain and having to put some extra effort into it. I know what I would choose.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 05/01/2008 15:19:49
Hello EJ and Ultraka

EJ, I know how bad it can be, believe me I know... feels like the fires of hell.

imre,
Quote
Actually looks like another one of those stupid catholic sites where they want to talk about how bad masturbation really is.

Can somebody please explain to those idiots that ejaculation is a necessary process of the male reproductive cycle.

IT CAN *NOT* BE AVOIDED!!!

I am of the Catholic faith I believe ejaculation can indeed be avoided although not entirely. I avoid any media content that would lead me to think erotically, and this usually keeps me chaste. I still have the the occasional wet dream and even more infrequently the temptation to masturbate. But in my case the incidence has gone from frequent to infrequent, which is very good for a guy with POIS.  [:)]

John21
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/01/2008 03:22:23
I quit testosterone, no effect on POIS. But now my libido is waaaaaaaaaay down. I feel that my approach of taking Levitra works well on POIS. I need Levitra for ED; I suggest you DON'T try it if you don't need it, it may cause a stroke if you don't need it for ED, according to one source. Levitra works successfully on POIS (qualifiedly: for me)  - and, you know what? Even though I finally have a "solution" to POIS 25 years later, I'm EXHAUSTED, it's become anti-climactic (yes, I know it's immature, but I'm pissed off at the world for giving me this pathetic syndrome - it's ruined a good chunk of my life) - so, for now, I'm not even bothering to take the steps necessary to improve my libido, either short term or longterm.

Sorry, everyone, to be so negative, but I suspect some of you might understand firsthand what I'm going and have gone through. Maybe my mood will improve. Just for now I'd like to throw the whole sex business in the garbage.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 06/01/2008 05:39:28
Hello everybody,

This is my first time posting to this thread, although I have been reading it for a couple of months now.  Although it has taken some time to overcome my hesitancy about publicly discussing my POIS symptoms, I have been very encouraged by everybody's ideas and supportive messages.  I will begin by describing some of my symptoms--most of them are pretty similar to what other people have said, although I've listed a couple at the end which I haven't seen mentioned before.

History: I am currently 28 years old.  I first started noticing POIS symptoms around age 23.  Before that age, I don't recall noticing any significant after-effects following orgasm.

Duration: The symptoms usually last around 24 hours after an orgasm.  Typically, if an orgasm occurs in the evening/night, I'd feel drained the next day, but I'd have recovered by the day after that.

Physical:  I feel physically fatigued and drained.  When I wake up in the morning after having had an orgasm the night before, I feel extremely drained and find it difficult to get out of bed.  The extreme fatigue and heaviness-feeling lessens a little once I do get up, but it still remains significantly impairing throughout the day.  I am also physically sensitive during the POIS period: I don't like to be touched.

Cognitive: Concentrating as well as verbalizing and communicating with others are much more difficult.  There is definitely a strong feeling of brain fog/derealization.

Emotional: I find that I am more sensitive than usual: things will upset me more easily and I get irritated with other people more easily.  This makes interactions with others during the POIS period more challenging.

Other symptoms: a somewhat strange symptom of mine, which I haven't seen mentioned by anyone else, is that during the POIS period, my eyes are involuntarily drawn towards women, much more than during non-POIS periods.  It doesn't even seem to be a matter of typical sexual desire, since the POIS  normally leaves me lower sexual energy than usual.  It is hard to explain, but somehow it seems more like a matter of visual attraction to the shape/appearance of women's bodies as opposed to sexual attraction.  Has anyone else experienced something like this?

Also, apart from the POIS, I suffer from premature ejaculation, which (since it is also a sexual problem) could be connected to the POIS symptoms.  Do others also experience PE?

OK, I will post more soon, describing my attempts at treatment thus far. 

Again, I'm very grateful for everyone's contributions to this thread.  Let's keep up the ideas and the mutual support and encouragement!

best,
Guthrie
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 06/01/2008 08:10:16
More cases :

16/  http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AkuYeRLHvLVorgGkeUM1KeIjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20060713182235AANHC0z

Does ejaculation make us tired?
I feel tired for about three or four days whenever I ejaculate, so I should sleep more during this period, is this normal? if so is there anyway to prevent such tiredness?
I feel tired for about three or four days whenever I ejaculate, so I should sleep more during this period, is this normal? if so is there anyway to prevent such tiredness? (I can experience very energetic moments when I haven't had ejaculation for a week or so) --------- Why champion sportsmen (like football players) stop having ejaculation before and during contest period? does it make them to have more energy for playin?

17/  http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Air.yHwZYWnJgBcgKqHc.C4jzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20070621210406AAWMgye

Why is it that i get tired, no energy for 1 week, afraid of cold, cant concentrate, sweating all over the body, sore back, need multi-vitamins to gain back the strength for 1 week, stomach hurts, after ejaculation while i was sleeping ? What kinda of doctor should i go see? I'm so afraid of it right now because its been bothering my life.

18/  http://www.soc.ucsb.edu/sexinfo/?article=faq&refid=029

am a 27 year old male with good physical health. However, i feel that after masterbation, i really feel very tired and my body hurts like i am
suffering with fever specially my back. Would u tell me what could be the cause of this tiredness which remain sometimes for more than on day after masterbation??? In addition, my penis also hurts sometimes??

Update : the link has been deleted. I certify it was a real case. I just make a copy of what i found, no modification. All cases here are real.

19/ http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/Archives/Archive-000011/HTML/20030420-107-000294.html

Okay... I don't just get sleepy immediately after I masturbate, I actually feel more tired like the whole next day if I don't get a good nights sleep.
Or to put it more clearly, unless I have time to sleep sleep sleep (like 9 hours instead of 6-7 I guess), I will feel more tired in general if I jack off every single day.
I also noticed that if I jack off without being aroused I feel more tired... ie. it's harder on the body.
Does anyone else notice this? I think I do a lot better when I listen to my body and see if I feel I need to masturbate. Or usually wait a day or two in between.
I don't know if it's different with sex cause I haven't gotten laid much.... Is this just ME? Anyone care to comment on the above?

20/  http://www.sexinfo101.com/forum/sexual_health_men/18603-tired_second_day_after_sex.html

Tired the second day after sex
In the next day after making love, I feel very tired...even more tired than in the day when it was - I don't have the same concentration power I used to have if nothing had been happened a few days ago.
What can be done to regain the energy?
Can you recommend any diet to speed up this process?
I'm a male!
This happens only if ejaculation occured, whether is sex, wet dream or smth else.
________
"the 2nd day" : evidence is we have the same problem...

21/ http://www.yinyanghouse.com/node/1766

Hello. I'm a 22 year old male. I have noticed that whenever I masturbate, I seem to be more anxious and tired the next day than normal. I feel like lacking in energy and just tend to be easily frustrated. What could cause this? I've been to acupunture several times because of restlessness&tiredness and general depressiveness. It has helped somewhat, but not that much that sometimes I don't feel very frustrated and hopeless about the way I am. Anybody want to offer insight? Oh, and I excercise regularly (lately astanga yoga and sometimes hiking)

22/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic116973.html

What could be causing extreme fatigue and muscle weakness after orgasm?

I understand that men are always tired after sex, but it is more than being tired... It is not a feeling of wanting to go to sleep but feeling physically weak, continuing into the next day or longer. It impairs other cherished activities such as going for a run or working out the next day. This occurs after masturbation and sexual activities with a partner.

Is this abnormal and what could be causing it?

Any answers would be great... this has been very bothersome.

23/ http://tperkins.com/board/viewtopic.php?p=1520&sid=19452c0c56d3aa44f65012567bfa87fe

Recently, I have gotten a problem after ejaculation. It seems I loose too much energy after ejaculation that I feel too weak even to do a simple job. I have to take multivitamins and food supplement pills to feel better. This feeling continues till one or two days and then I become normal again. I have ejaculation once a week and that seems to be too much for me. I don’t know what to do. I do sports and feel healthy during the normal days and I have had ejaculations since I was 11. It is a terrible thing for a 26 year old guy. It’s really affecting my normal life I am very worried. Do you have any idea what I should do? Besides I have examined to take food supplement pills for some continuous time but it didn’t cure it.
Exactly, I had depression and anxiety problems three years ago and it took me a lot of time to get over it. As a matter of fact, it’s not finished yet but I am feeling very much better but I didn’t have such problems until 2 or 3 months ago. I thought maybe it’s good for me to use your male energy work to feel better. I don’t have any sex partners or even a girlfriend at this moment. My life is like, working a lot, study to get my masters at the same time, doing a little sport. I am a successful guy outer side but inner side, I don’t seem to enjoy life very much Crying or Very sad .

24/  http://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Av9wbbzp1NUICmJ6Fwm2o07pFQx.;_ylv=3?qid=20070420151943AAcpYhX

Guys - do you lose a lot of energy from ejaculation?
I know we all feel wiped temporarily right afterward. But I have personally found that for the next day at least I am a lot more tired, sleepy at work, and have much less energy to work with. Also, if I am sick, and I ejaculate, I always get significantly sicker. I would like to hear from other guys. Do you lose significant energy for a more extended time than the next hour or so? If so, for how long before you feel "normal," and how much energy would you say you lose (%) ? Thanks.

25/ http://www.whfhhc.com/Depression/21062.htm

Ejaculation frequency and depression?
It seems like my mood is connected to the frequency at which I ejaculate. I know ejaculation takes away lot of energy from a man. I'm 26 male and single, and it I go two weeks or so without ejaculating I'm pretty upbeat and my moods are generally good. But, if I ejaculate once or twice a day, everyday for a week or two I feel low on energy, irritable, and feel very depressed about myself and things in my life.
Anyone else dealt with something similar? Any ideas on how to respond to this? I'm very concerned about how frequent sexual activity causes me to feel depressed.

26/ (Rare : a woman)
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AgS6NjTmJUcE3VHCz5dGJhAjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20070920060204AAPn2nO

After I do masturbation, I feel myself very tired. If I do it twice in a day, a day later I feel myself?
very tired too. As a result, I am scared to have sex because if I do it with a male, I think I wll become more tired. So I dont want to get married.
Do people who have sex feel tired after sex during the day?
I am 35/female
I am virgin. I believe sex after marriage. Moreover, I have a very busy job.

27/  http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AlPP988oeapWvWY0AXCUBgYjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080129152024AAJ6ZNi

Does ejaculation actually have any negative effects?
I'm in an on-going debate with someone so I'm trying to find some proof that ejaculation (specifically losing sperm) doesn't lower your life span or make you less intelligent or able to focus. I already know that after men ejaculate that they get tired, but I have serious doubts about it shortening their life or making them unable to focus for days after (as this person is implying). I really believe that it's due to other reasons and an unhealthy life style, not losing sperm.

I haven't found any articles supporting the idea yet. If anyone can find one that proves this as a myth or not that'd be a great way to answer my question.

28/ http://www.youqa.com/mens-health-5/737-mens-health-6.html

everytime I have sex with gf I feel a little sick afterwards for a few days then I feel fine again. I had myself tested and her tested for STD's and she has none. Maybe I just am getting use to her germs? How sick I get aftewards seems less and less each time.
The first time we had sex her STD status was unknown and I got scared when I had slight symptoms of the flu. So I got her tested and she was clean. I got myself tested and no pressence of STD's either. I had myself tested 3 months later and still clean.
The first couple sexual encounters I experienced slight stomach pains within 1 hour hour afterwards, a slight fever I think, tired, and just not myself. Now with many sexual encounters this feeling has gone away and I no longer get that anymore, but I still feel a very slight illness everytime I have sex with her or even when I masturbate.

29/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/Feeling_weak_and_dizzy_after_sex_t77221.html

For the past 6 months or so my boyfriend has been feeling very weak, dizzy and faint after he ejaculates from having sex, he complains of an almost out of body experience. It seems to be more of a problem if he does all the "work" and gets exhausted. He doesnt have any other sexual problems, altho he was preliminary diagnosed with pre-cordial catch (i think thats the correct term). I dont think this problem occurs if he maturbates.

Once again : "out of body experience" refers to me to "DEPERSONNALISATION"
when my "i feel like sleeping" refers to "DEREALISATION" (most advanced state)

30/ http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?showtopic=3631

I also was dating, and had normal regular sex with my girlfriend, as well as "self stimulation". Well I was doing this for about four years out of high school, then I noticed I was feeling tired alot. Then one evening, I was out a a local beach party, I had a couple of beers, when I went home that night I "self stimulated" twice finishing off both times. The second time something very weird happened, I felt something like a mental energy drain, like some kind of vitality exited my body and/or mind. I immediately felt exhausted and felt strange bodily/nerve pain sensations. To make a long story short these continued for years after this, resulting in problems sleeping, fatigue on and off all the time, and pains in what felt like the nerves on and off.
The one I am most concerned about is that after I ejaculate, be it with a girl, "self stimulation", or a wet dream i am physically drained for days, and I experience aching under the ribs on the sides-alleviated most of the time when I urinate.

31/ http://www.bodybuilding-tips.net/s20/t9005.html

I tend to believe that ejeculating will lead to less test as I've nnotcied after ejaculation I feel tired amd lazy and lack energy.

32/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080220023808AAVslYH

Weak after sex...help?
my and my boyfriend had sex 2 days ago..he is feeling very weak and also very hungry...i know that men feel weak a few hours after sex...but 2 days straight is too much...btw we have had sex for the first time..what is the cause?

More cases (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg149987#msg149987)

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Gonzo on 06/01/2008 09:06:57
First of all, a big welcome to all of the new voices around here sharing their experiences with POIS. I find that sharing the smallest of details about our particular situations helps keep us thinking and searching. No thought is too small or irrelevant. We have a very very troublesome enigma before us and we must be willing to take some exploratory steps in order gain some new ground. I thank all of you for your thoughts.

I must comment concerning what imre1 has provided, one method in particular. It's subject to further testing, but I had a successful run with the start/stop method he previously suggested. Originally, he mentioned a 3-4 hour "exercise" but really, who has the time to masturbate for 3-4 hours? I had tried this some years ago to help remedy my premature ejaculation (Guthrie, this answers your question) but I was never able to endure such a build-up without relief. I always gave in! I decided to try this again, this time consciously aware that if I let off too early I would have to pay the piper severely. I held out for about 30 minutes and to my surprise the next day was almost normal. I felt a little fatigue but experience a sexual relaxation I hadn't had in a while. I experienced no mental fog or debilities, I was just a little tired. The day after that it was as if I had not ejaculated at all. Interesting huh?  I would say my person was at about 85%. I tried it again a week later but did not follow the same procedures and it didn't work. I just finished a recuperation cycle and am getting reading to try this again by the end of next week to somewhat conclusively determine if the start/stop method actually works. I will be sure to keep all of you posted. By the way, has anyone else tried this?

This method has not been my only ray of hope. I am also taking a some important and detrimental supplements. As I mentioned before, I credit St. John's Wort with alleviating my depression and mood swings, especially during POIS. I've also been experimenting with Spirulina with considerable success. You see, I sometimes feel that all of this POIS causes some sort of brain damage, I just don't feel right even after I'm back to normal. Its almost as if my brain is atrophied or anemic from the all of the trauma it has undergone during POIS. Spirulina has helped me put those broken pieces back together, I feel. From what I've read, it provides the brain with essential nutrients for mental function. I can share the specificity of the bio/neuro science at work at another time. All I know is that it has brought mental clarity and focus back into my life and I can set my eyes on something else besides myself for longer periods of time. For now I have to conclude that it has helped me tremendously. Spirulina has not only provides my brain with what it needs to function properly, I can tell it has had a reparative effect on my cognitive functions. Let me know what you think.

These three in particular have produced the greatest success for me and I hope it helps. Try them and tell me if you have experienced some of the relief that I have been enjoying. I'll be checking in and will make sure to post further results as soon as they are available. Until then, I wish you all milder symptoms and speedy recoveries. Its a catch-22 gentlemen, but we have to keep searching. Keep up the good work!

Sincerely yours,

Gonzo
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 06/01/2008 12:54:08
Guthrie,
Your symptoms sound similar to mine except you recover quicker and I don't have the physical symptoms, only mental (although it's hard to find ambition to get physical in that state). I understand your hesitancy to post, it's a very private subject.

John21
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 06/01/2008 15:58:51
Hi everybody,

Thanks for your words of welcome.  I'll now talk about some of my efforts to combat POIS.
 
Starting around 12-15 months ago, I began researching different supplements.  For a while, I supplemented with soy lecithin, and then with zinc, but these didn't seem to have much of an effect. 

However, starting this past July, I started supplementing with Vitex/Chasteberry, using “The Vitamin Shoppe Chasteberry (Vitex) Extract” capsules.  The label says that each capsule contains 200 mg Chasteberry Extract and 300 mg Chasteberry, and it recommends taking 1 to 3 capsules per day.  For 3 months, I took one capsule every morning.  Then, for one month, I took two capsules every morning.  For the past two months, I've been taking two capsules in the morning, and one at night.  (Since July, I have also been taking Omega-3 supplements: flax oil, as well as DHA/EPA supplements.  However, I think that it is the Vitex, rather than these, that have been the crucial agents.)

From what I've read about Vitex, it can take a number of months to start having an affect.  I feel like taking more than one capsule per day has been more effective, but it could also be that the Vitex only starting kicking more once I'd been taking it for longer.

The POIS symptoms have not gone away entirely, but they have definitely improved.  Now, if I've had an orgasm the night before, I am still affected the next day, but the degree of the symptoms is lessened: I don't feel as emotionally sensitive, and the brain fog and verbalization symptoms are not as severe.  I think I tend to feel a little less physically fatigued.  Overall, I certainly still don't feel 'good', but I can get through my day more successfully.  So that has been positive. 

Interestingly, I've also noticed that, in a typical post-orgasm day, the symptoms are lessened throughout most of the day, but they increase sharply in the evening, starting around 6 to 8 p.m.  But when this happens, this more severe stage often only lasts for an hour or two, so that I am feeling better again before I go to sleep.  I find it strange that the symptoms would increase after having been less severe—-I have two theories as to why this might occur: 1) the Vitex is helping to combat the POIS symptoms, but it “runs out of steam” after a certain number of hours, allowing the normal POIS severity to return.  Or, 2) Whatever hormone/neurotransmitter imbalances are causing POIS naturally increase in the evening as a result of circadian rhythm changes.  In this case, the Vitex continues to work at the same level, but it has more to fight against, and so is less effective overall.

I'm not sure of the next step to take.  I will continue taking the Vitex, and I'll see if the symptoms get progressively better, but the improvement may have plateaued.  In different scientific studies, Vitex has been shown to lower prolactin, and it's possible that the POIS is in part caused by overproduction of prolactin after orgasm, which in turn inhibits dopamine and causes the fatigue/cognitive effects.  I had my prolactin level tested a year ago (during a non-POIS period), and it was normal.  I may go back and have it tested in the middle of a POIS period, to see if there is elevated prolactin.  If this turned out to be the case, it could be that POIS is linked to a form of latent hyperprolactinemia.  But, again, this is speculation, and I don't have any hard data at this point.

Along these same lines, I noticed that, on the link posted by B_Jim to discussion on the ISSM (http://www.issm.info/prod/system/main/index.asp?page=/prod/data/issirlist/digest16.htm#Post%20Orgasmic%20Illness%20Syndrome), one doctor says that Wellbutrin XL (Bupropion) helped one of his patients.  That doctor doesn't mention the prolactin/dopamine dynamic (he only talks about Bupropion's anti-anxiety and energizing qualities), but Bupropion is a dopamine reuptake inhibitor, so it could have the effect of correcting for a dopamine deficiency caused by too much prolactin.  I have been thinking about asking my doctor about prescribing Wellbutrin, but I am hesitant to do so, since I am somewhat concerned about the potential adverse side affects of psychoactive antidepressants (even though Wellbutrin is different from SSRI's, which, from what I've read, have much greater side effects).  In contrast, almost all studies of Vitex that I saw reported that it had an extremely low level of side effects, so that's why I decided to try it first.

B_Jim, in your response to my symptoms, you thought that serotonin could be the main problem.  From what I had read, it struck me as similar to the induced dopamine deficiency described here.
http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/162/9/1755
But, your serotonin hypothesis could also be correct: I wonder if there is a clear way to determine between the two based only on the symptoms.


Also, in terms of getting in touch with other POIS sufferers, when I was searching the web, I found a blog in France devoted to POIS, which has a pretty large number of postings:
http://fatigueapresorgasme.over-blog.com/
If you read French, you can check it out, or you can use online translation tools such as Altavista-Babel Fish or Google Translate.  Most people who have posted there have not reported success in alleviating the problems, but there is one person (Témoignage #12) who reported that his POIS symptoms disappeared entirely after taking the SSRI Sertraline (in the same drug-class as Zoloft).
I think I will write to that blog, and let them know about this Naked Scientist discussion thread.


I'd be interested in hearing anyone's insights or responses to all of this!

Guthrie

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 06/01/2008 16:33:15
My responses to B_Jim's survey:

1)- Number of days after orgasm you have problems : 1,2,3,4...: 1 day
-How many hours after orgasm start symptoms ? The symptoms do not start in their full severity right away—I would say, about 2-3 hours.
- In the first hours after orgasm, how do you feel ?
(well, happy, cold, nervous, headaches ,agitated ....  ?)  After orgasm, I feel strange, and somewhat disconnected from things, but not 'bad' per se—-the 'bad' parts (painful brain fog, fatigue) start a little later.

2) Symptoms :
Give a mark for each symptom :
0=No   1=Very Low   2=Low    3=Average   4=Severe   5=Very Severe

-Physical tiredness
-Mental tiredness:4
-Lethargy/Derealisation (I cant wake up!):4
-Lack of concentration/Brain fog:4
-Sweatings and heat feelings:0
-Cold feelings/cold hands/cold body:0
-Myalgias:0
-Anxiety:4
-Depression:3
-Agoraphobia/Social phobia:3
-Not motived:3
-Memory problems:4
-Difficult to speak/communication:4
-Insomnias/sleep problems:1
-Headaches:1
-Stomachaches:0
-Restless/agitation:3
-Blurred vision:0
-Buzzing ears:0
-Dizziness:0
-Muscle tremors:0
-Diarrhea day1:2
-Hair problems:0
-Mouth problems:0
-Skin problems:0
-Eyes problems:0
-Short breathing Day1:3
-Premature Ejaculation:5
-Sexual pain after sex :0
-Erection problems:0
-Libido problems:0
Others Symptoms ?  My eyes are 'drawn' towards women, but almost as a visual rather than a normal sexual attraction.  Also, I find I can get sucked into surfing the web and find it harder to break away.

3) What medical test you made ? In the days following orgasm ?
-Thyroid ?
-Prolactine ?
-Testosterone?
-Blood pression?
-Others..
I have had my prolactin and testosterone tested, but only during a non-POIS period.  My prolactin was 7.6 ng/mL and my testosterone was 555 ng/dL, both of which were within the normal range, according to the doctor.


4)What meds did you test ? What effect on POIS ?
-Ssri ?
-Stimulants? Dopaminergic ?
-Benzodiazepine ?
-Piracetam ?

I have not taken any prescribed medications so far.  Only Vitex, whose effects I described in my most recent post.


5)Others
-What about you diet ?  I don't eat meat, dairy, or eggs (vegan).
-Sport ? Some aerobic activity; I walk a lot.
-Heavy Computer user ?  I use the computer a fair amount, but not excessively.
-Coffee user ? No.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 07/01/2008 10:50:15
More POIS cases :

33/ A woman : http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070607163708AAUIu19

Why do i feel so weak after sex especially the next day?
im only 20 years old but after sex i feel like i have the flu and then the next day i feel like i got into a fight or somthing and i notice i bruise easily too. like the guy im with will squeeze my -b-r-e-a-s-t and i dont feel bad at that time but today i noticed i have a bruise now is it normal to feel this weak? ive noticed also that when he f--i-n-g-e-r-e-d- me i bled also then it stopped .im going to get that checked out by a doctor but i am not a virgin but i know that its been a year since ive been penatrated since when i m-a-s-t-e-r-b-a-t-e i dont hardly finger myself or use somthing for insersion but is it normal to bleed somewhat since i havent been penatrated in a while and it was kinda vigarous ? it didnt hurt when he did anything really he noticed that i bled and then told me . i have no problem with lubracation and incersion is much easier now then it has ever been but i am worried though

34/ http://www.youqa.com/generic-health-2/722-9-youqa.html

Man feel weakness after sex?

Question:
Is it normal for man to feel weakness after sex? especially when he does more than 1 round every-day, or twice a day for 2-3 days. He is only 25.
How he can improve his health? or any other advice related to this?

35/ http://www.doctorndtv.com/faq/detailfaq.asp?id=2331

 What causes fever after sex?
Q. I got married 2 years ago. I have a problem for the last 6 to 7 months. During sexual contact with my wife, as the semen comes out I become very weak. I feel pain in all my veins, bones of legs and hands, a headache and then my body temperature becomes very low so that I have to cover myself with 2 to 3 blankets. After some time i got heavy fever. When I see any sexual things like movies, photos then the semen comes out slowly from the penis. After some time I feel some coolness in my underwear only then I realise it. Please comment.

A : "There is no disease like" ...
=> Your disease does not exist in my medicine book : it's psychologic ...  [::)]

36/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/328183

FEVER AFTER SEX
i had sex nights ago for the first time in about 6 months, next day  afternoon i developed a fever and i feel weak  fever is the only problem i have..can it be hiv or any other im very scared .!:(


37/  http://www.medhelp.org/forums/urology/messages/32047.html

I am a 28 year old male and since last once month I have been experiencing extreme lower thigh and limb muscular weakness and fatigue after ejaculation. Since then i have deteriorating muscle strenght in my legs and increasing fatigue. Earlier I used to feel weak after ejaculation but i guess that is normal. But these days after ejaculation or masturbation, eel my mind not being at ease and after a few minutes I start to expericence severe muscular painsand stiffness in my limbs. I'm suffering from extreme fatigue these days. Could it be some kind of harmonal imbalances? I have checked up with my GP for possible causes(any viral infections, thyroid, rheumatoid disorders, gravis, muscle wstage, anxiety and depression disorder). and so far everything has come out normal. I am at loss to find out what is causing this muscular pains in my legs triggered a month ago by ejaculation. The pain is quite similar to being as if I have run on a treadmill all day long. I will be meeting a neurologist next week.

38/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AkxiHqxIgXnOm.deI3yfdbHsy6IX;_ylv=3?qid=20071221163832AAmpKe4

What causes tiredness and low energy after masturbation?
I feel very tired most of the time and have very little energy. I find that i have more energy if i go without masturbating for a while, but as soon as i do it again i feel quite bad again and not just afterwards but for days. I know i had low hormones at one stage, but they arn't supposed to be affected by it. Does this happen to anyone else and what is it that causes it?

39/ http://www.thebody.com/Forums/AIDS/Fatigue/Archive/FatigueCause/Q166244.html
http://www.thebody.com/Forums/AIDS/Fatigue/Archive/FatigueCause/Q90074.html
(aids forum, but intersting)

Dr. Frascino, I am a 50 year old male, positive, officially, for 18 years, but probably longer. I have responded well to drug therapies (mostly HAART) and have had zero viral loads and T4 counts in the 800s for years. I exercise regularly and have mostly perfect lab results (done 4 - 5 times a year--even got my lipid profile down to normal by diet). I have LOTS of sexual desire, but unfortunately have a problem with severe post-ejaculation fatigue and insomnia. It really ruins a good night sleep and limits the spontanaity of sex for me. I have an excellant Dr. in Miami that I trust implicitly, but he claims to have never heard of this problem in other patients and has no ideas as to why I get so completely drained after ejaculation.Even after 8 hours sleep, I wake up exhausted and my eyeballs ache all day. I used to think that maybe it was a protein drain, and sometimes drink alot of milk before bed, but it only partially works. Can you help me, PLEASE?

Dear Dr.F: I have noticed a change in my "recovery time" after orgasm (specifically as my health started to decline in the late 90's). After orgasm I am wiped out often for days afterward and my mood is no picnic either. I am often moody and irritable with a capital I. I am presently taking testerone supplements and I still experience a surprising level of fatigue after orgasm. I am baffled at the level of fatigue I experience given the relatively short and sweet nature of this event. Do you have any suggestions about this?

40/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080427142640AAjfMwh

Headache/migrane ? lack of concentration ? after sex?
by means of a wet dream, masturbation, or anything else results in a lack of concentration. Basically, for 5 to 6 days it becomes extremely difficult to concentrate on anything, I simply cannot sustain a train of thought to think things through. I become extremly absent minded. This makes it difficult to read, hold conversations, follow lectures, take tests, remember things, and learn things. I feel extremly tired and jittery, both physically and mentally. I also become depressed during this time. Its like being totally burned out in the head; much like how people after an epileptic attack are. Also, I get strong headaches after masturbation. Allow me to repeat, these symptoms last 5 to 6 days! So its having a huge affect on my life. I've gone to a neurologist, but he doesn't seem to know whats wrong. He prescribed an ssri, but only because I mentioned I get depression after an orgasm.
If anyone has any idea of what I can do to fix this, or any information at all, please respond

41/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080623054957AAoc5Iy

I Feel Tired and Sleepy After Sex?
I get too tired after halving sex. It makes me feels as if i have gone for a long walk or excersie for a very long hours. My whole body becomes weak, I feel like i have taken some stress out of my body. I feel happy and relaxed but my body becomes very weak and makes me feel sleepy. Because of that i cant go many rounds. sometimes i end up going only one b,cos i feel tired and sleepy.

How can i go many rounds like the way others do, am a young guy of 25 years. and is it normal to get tired and sleepy?

42/ http://anabolicminds.com/forum/male-anti-aging/98429-post-orgasmic-illness.html

Symptoms are high intense brain fog, headaches/migraines, memory problems, impaired thinking, flu and fever like symptoms, sore joints/muscles, fatigue/exhaustion,
anxiety, tension, sensitivty too light and many more.

These symptoms can last from 1 - 7 days after an ejaculation from either
Sex or Masturbation. Females have also reported these.

Does anyone know any good practioners that could help me and many others with this rare but serious illness?

I do have high Prog, Estrone levels, low cort and dhea but a few other people have good healthy hormone levels yet suffer from POIS too,

I notice that the following hours after ejaculation blood pressure increases for 12-24 hours, shortness of breath, strong anxiety issues, face, neck and shoulder cramp also.

43/ (woman)  http://malaysia.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070920060204AAPn2nO

After I do masturbation, I feel myself very tired. If I do it twice in a day, a day later I feel myself?
very tired too. As a result, I am scared to have sex because if I do it with a male, I think I wll become more tired. So I dont want to get married
Do people who have sex feel tired after sex during the day? I am 35/female

44/ http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=173788

 fact or fiction: frequent masturbation causes lethargy?
over like, i dont know, since the 9th grade (4 years ago), ive been combatting constant lethargy. I eventually got used to it though.
I recently heard from a friend that frequent masturbation causes lethargy. Now, this sounded like a myth, but now im thinking maybe it's true.
In middle school, i woud only masturbate a few times a week. Since highschool, it's been around 6-7 times a day.
Is this why ive suddenly become more lethargic throughout highschool?

45/ http://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080123033115AApdikY

Very frequent masturbation - a cause for poor memory and concentration?
Hey ppl.....Things were going the right way till i entered my college. I was a 'weekend masturbator' during my school days. But, for the past 2 years i'm very frequently masturbating ( say about 1 or 2 times per day i.e about 7 - 10 times per week).
I feel lethargic. I lack concentration and have very poor memory. Sometimes i fear public speaking or looking at a ferson face to face. Anxiety & depression reduced me to the extent i kept 3 arrears in my college I year(contradictory to my 90% when i passed out from school).
Is it correct to relate these symptoms to masturbation. All over the internet, internet is always said as a habit which is good. But i experience these problems....pls leave your suggestions for me.

46/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/viewtopic.php?p=609156#609156

  I had the same experience but mine just last only about a day to recuperate. I'm 47 yrs old but it's my first time to experience these, last year. I suspect that I've been consuming a lot of fluoride. My periodontist gave me 5000ppm tooth paste after my gum surgery. I used it and never miss. I believed the accumulation of this toothpaste by not rinsing out the fluoride mess up my system, health, etc. You would not believed how many of the foods we eat that are loaded of fluorides. I suggest check your consumption of fluoride, it might be poisoning you. Hope this help!!!

47/ http://forums.menshealth.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/216109121/m/692107331

"Here's my problem, i'm 25, i feel soo tired, no energy( whole bosy is soo weak), after ejaculation and it takes 4 days to recover. if i take vitamines, it takes 2 days. also, my hands and feet feel sweaty, cold and my stomach digesting soo fast. The amount was very little too. now these dyas, i cant drink cold water.My joints have cracking sounds. What's the problem anybody know? i cant focus during work or anything. It has stoping me from getting to know girls. What shoudl i do?"

48/ http://tperkins.com/board/viewtopic.php?p=1520&sid=19452c0c56d3aa44f65012567bfa87fe

"Recently, I have gotten a problem after ejaculation. It seems I loose too much energy after ejaculation that I feel too weak even to do a simple job. I have to take multivitamins and food supplement pills to feel better. This feeling continues till one or two days and then I become normal again. I have ejaculation once a week and that seems to be too much for me. I don’t know what to do. I do sports and feel healthy during the normal days and I have had ejaculations since I was 11. It is a terrible thing for a 26 year old guy. It’s really affecting my normal life I am very worried. Do you have any idea what I should do? Besides I have examined to take food supplement pills for some continuous time but it didn’t cure it."

49/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071104031554AAjkbH2

"What to do i feel lazy and weak after masturbation ?
i am a 16 year old boy
my height is 5"5inches
my weight is 45kgs
suggest me something
i tried to leave this but after 2 days or more
i get involed again "

50/ http://www.doctorndtv.com/FAQ/detailfaq.asp?id=8422

" I am 25 years old and have been masturbating for the past 10 years. After masturbation my head starts paining and this pain lasts for 5 days. I become physically very weak and cannot concentrate on anything be it my work, reading or even driving. My shoulder blades start paining and I cannot sleep sideways. The semen that comes out after masturbation is passed along with stool in the subsequent days. I experience pain in knee joints, hip joints after masturbation. My girth increases by half an inch after every time I masturbate and I also get temporary relief from constipation. My frequency of urination also increases. Please advise."

51/ http://www.youqa.com/mens-health-5/502-mens-health-6.html

"Do masturbation leads to weakness?
i m 15.whenever i masturbate(twice in a month),i feel weakness in my body for 2-3 days.i become staminaless.
my friends also says that masturbation decreases the stamina.is it true?then what should i do? "

more (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg151289#msg151289) cases
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 07/01/2008 13:05:14
DRY FINGERTIPS

Does anyone else experience extremely "dried up" (hard to describe) _fingertips_ during POIS period? Thank you.

I have an extremely dry flakey scalp during POIS period.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/01/2008 00:01:05
Thanks, Bizzy, your drying scalp during POIS period tells me I'm not alone/crazy. I even went so far as to consult a dermatologist, who confirmed that, indeed, I sometimes get dermatitis on my fingertips during POIS!

Maybe we should change the name to POISon [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/01/2008 00:35:24
...I've also noticed that, in a typical post-orgasm day, the symptoms are lessened throughout most of the day, but they increase sharply in the evening, starting around 6 to 8 p.m.

I find the same pattern of increased POIS symptoms late afternoon to early evening.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/01/2008 23:28:43
Much has been said here about serotonin and dopamine, and it makes sense. Does anyone have a theory why Levitra works for me? Is there any relationship? As far as I know, Levitra simply improves blood flow. Thank you!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Tate on 09/01/2008 06:20:28
I'm glad to have found this post. I have a condition that definately involves the orgasm. Every since I started masturbating as a teenager I've been depressed and been a shy introvert. Before that I was an A student and very active in sports and had alot of friends. I just all of a sudden changed. As I've gotten older (I'm 32 now) I've developed alot of other problems like insomnia, social phobia, nervous ticks around people (like eye burning sensations or light sensitivity sensations in my eyes), nervous talking, neck muscle pain and stiffness, etc. The thing is I find that when I haven't had an orgasm for a while I seem to snap out of it and become happy again and socialable and most of those symptoms just vanish. When I mean for a while like not having an orgasm for about four of five days usually. I'll feel good and confident around people and usually sleep good. I also workout daily and jog so to keep me feeling good and improve my health and physique. However after a few days of no orgasms I become horny (naturally) and eventually start to play with myself until I come and the whole cycle starts over again. The good thing is I can usually have a single orgasm in about a four or five day stretch without much of the symptoms coming back. But often when I give in to masturbate once the horniness lingers on later in the day or night and I masturbate again a couple more times and until all the need is gone. I then develop all these symptons again and it takes days for me to recoup. I definately think that the orgasm combined with my brain chemistry can be proven detrimental in excess or even what is considered the norm in todays world and I really wish there were doctors that could diagnose and treat these problems. SSRI's have again and again proven unsuccesful with me. Seems like serotonin has nothing to do with my problem and only seem to make some of my symptons like insomnia and anxiety even worse.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 09/01/2008 16:33:08
Welcome Tate. I send you the questionnaire. If everyone is ok, maybe should i post our results in a jpeg file ? Clearly some case seems to have no benefits with serotonin rebalance. Which ssri did you test ? Look at agjchs post (page8). Wellbutrin (blocked depression after 4 or 5 ssri failiure ) and DHEA blocked pois symptoms. Compared to ISSM (http://www.issm.info/prod/system/main/index.asp?page=/prod/data/issirlist/digest16.htm#Post%20Orgasmic%20Illness%20Syndrome) article :
"Dr. Moser suggested success with Buproprion having anti-anxiety properties with no negative effects on sexual functioning."
(Bupropion = Wellbutrin).

Can the moderation send a private message to agjchs ? We really need to know how his recovery is progressing and the role of DHEA on his symptoms.

Hi B_Jim...

No problem at all about posting as a jpeg.

Though there may be an issue if it's a large file depending on how you post it. If you upload it directly then your limited to 128k....if you do it via a photo hosting site then there should be no problem with larger files. We do have cases though where some people access the site from work...in some of these cases the pictures posted as links from photo host sites do not display properly.

Just thought I'd let you know.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 10/01/2008 16:12:34
Much has been said here about serotonin and dopamine, and it makes sense. Does anyone have a theory why Levitra works for me? Is there any relationship? As far as I know, Levitra simply improves blood flow. Thank you!

I think levitra may work by exerting an effect on the pituitary via the hypothalamus. Levitra tells the hypothalamus to send instructions for the manufacture of oxytocin at the pituitary. If the pituitary is busy making oxytocin then it may make less prolactin soon after orgasm. Reduced prolactin means more dopamine and serotonin and so a better brain chemistry.
The so called prolactin inhibitors such as bromocriptine are useless. These medications are of the dopamine agonist class. They keep dopamine receptors switched on with the affect of stopping prolactin. Keeping dopamine receptors switched on can eventually cause serious mental illness such as depression and psychosis.
In my mind theres little doubt that the POIS problem originates at the hypothalamus. A medication that helps better regulate the hypothalamus may provide excellent treatment.
What I have written here needs more research.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/01/2008 23:53:11
Much has been said here about serotonin and dopamine, and it makes sense. Does anyone have a theory why Levitra works for me? Is there any relationship? As far as I know, Levitra simply improves blood flow. Thank you!

I think levitra may work by exerting an effect on the pituitary via the hypothalamus. Levitra tells the hypothalamus to send intructions for the manufacture of oxytocin at the pituitary. If the pituitary is busy making oxytocin then it may make less prolactin soon after orgasm. Reduced prolactin means more dopamine and serotonin and so a better brain chemistry.
The so called prolactin inhibitors such as bromocriptine are useless. These medications are of the dopamine agonist class. They keep dopamine receptors switched on with the affect of stopping prolactin. Keeping dopamine receptors switched on can eventually cause serious mental illness such as depression and psychosis.
In my mind theres little doubt that the POIS problem originates at the hypothalamus. A medication that helps better regulate the hypothalamus may provide excellent treatment.
What I have written here needs more research.

FASCINATING, BIZZY! THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THAT.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/01/2008 00:32:55
DENIAL

Just curious if anyone else has "been in denial" about POIS? For me, even continuing to now, the present - - I could somehow "never believe" this was happening to me. I know it's crazy to do this for 25+ years! But I somehow could never accept/believe it and continued to go through POIS, at many times when it was unecessary to have a release. Each time, I would think "this time it will not happen".....and it does! Always! (except for the current success with Levitra).

Who else here has experienced this?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 12/01/2008 01:26:30
I was never in denial about any POIS. It was more a matter of not knowing that the symptoms were linked and caused by the orgasm. Sure I felt very weak, depressed, psychotic, OCD went through the roof, awarness dropped and muscular weakness. All after an orgasm. But for a large part of my life I didnt know that the orgasm was causing it. The symptoms of POIS, for me, take anything from a few hours to a day to emerge. Over a period of two decades I came to the slow realization that I had a post orgasmic illness. If I not had this illness my life would have been very different. This is a very bad illness and has taken so much away from me. In particular because it affects your mood and changes your personality. You change from a normal person into something else. The simplest way to put it is that you become mentally ill.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 12/01/2008 21:35:48
hi folks.... is it ok for a woman to ask some questions of you men out there...? thanks!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 13/01/2008 00:00:13
Interested, of course, ask away!

Bizzy I agree, mentally ill is a good description.

Denial: I'm sure that accepting that you are mentally ill is difficult for anyone to accept, so denial can be present at times especially when the doctors you are complaining to don't accept that it is real. Much of my life I didn't have a clue what was wrong with me, but when I was in the intensity of the illness there was no denying it, I KNEW. At those (many) times denial would be like cutting your hand off and pretending it is still there. Yet later on when I had "healed" I would once again entertain the idea that it was all in my head somehow, after all how could something so unique and horrible be unheard of? How could there be no tests that would demonstrate what was so obvious to me? So over the years I would flip back and forth, always returning to the firm resolve that there was something seriously wrong with me.

John
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 13/01/2008 07:22:23
More cases :

52/ http://au.answers.yahoo.com/answers2/frontend.php/question?qid=20071220140056AAdnyjE

Why does sex cause tiredness and lightheadedness in men....?
After having sex i usually feel dead tired, and my i usually can't think straight for atleast 2 days afterward, but girand going.I also notice that if i have sex too often it decreases energy level, staminals can just keep going , ability to focus and concentrate, memory etc. Do other guys also experiance this, i find i think best during periods where i have abstained from sex or "autoeroticism" for atleast a month.
has anyone else noticed this...it obviously does not apply to women.
why am i sharing this information on the internet, wtf...who cares.
 think some of you have missunderstood me, i am quite fit, i could easily have sex up tp 10 times per night, but it affects my ability to think clearly and seems to zap my stamina substantially.
 
53/ http://www.luckhealth.com/html/mens-health/20071104/mens-health-3757.html

"How do u feel after you masturbate up to 24-48 hours.
what is your behavior after masturbation up to 24-48 hours.
your mental, physical, behavioral changes please put now only.
I always feel very weak 24-48 hours after masturbation, mentally and physically, which is why I stopped masturbating. This is some information I have gathered on my own:
Loss of semen drastically lowers testosterone levels and slows the metabolism."

54/ http://www.medhelp.org/forums/MensHealth/messages/659.html

Why Do I Feel Drained After Sex?
For at least 1 or 2 days after i ejaculate (sex or masturbation) i feel very drained and tired, and may even get a headache. Is it beacause i'm loosing some important fluids ? what's in ***)? s there a way to replenish quickly or beforehand so I don't feel so bad?
wish I didn't have to limit the number of times I go at it.

55/ http://www.mindandmuscle.net/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t24607.html

I came across this forum looking for selegiline experiences and stumbled onto this thread. I had seen that website and many others and have tried several therapies to this phenomenon. The most effective has been abstinence.
My situation may be unique in that I do not need a two-week period of abstinence to feel good/confident/affable and waiting that long does nothing for me. I am normally this way but immediately after ejaculation and for about 24 (give or take about 6) hours afterwards I fall into a deep depression. I can orgasm multiple times without ejaculation but have always ended up ejaculating so I can't say for sure which is responsible for the depression. Working out heavily, increasing my calories and sleeping seems to help me cope to some degree but it is really debilitating. I have found over the years that it is best to stay away from social contact during these times. ......

56/ http://www.pherolibrary.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-5016.html

Well, this is very personal and I feel since i am pretty anonymous i can talk about this.
I have masturbated since i was 15, everyday at least, up to 3 times a day. the longest i had gone without doing this was like ,2-3 days. That \'addiction\' continued to dec. 30th (i am 18 now) when i made a new years resolution to quit until college resumed on jan. 6th.
I want to do an experiment to see if masturbation has made me shy and withdrawn. I think this could be a possibility and its been 3 days... one side effect i am noticing is depression, and slight anxiety, more than usual. I usually do get those though.
I also am wondering if masturbation has stunted my physical growth... i am 18 and look 16, physically too (hair growth), maybe younger.
But, I have smoked pot occasionally during ages 15-now, so maybe that has something to do with it. I doubt that, though.
I also wonder if masturbation lowers or raises testosterone?
Thanks in advance for informative replys.
i agree with druid
btw... i felt weird, depressed and anxious when i went without doing it for 4 days... thats all i could take. I will now limit myself to 3 times a week.

57/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic116973.html

What could be causing extreme fatigue and muscle weakness after orgasm?
I understand that men are always tired after sex, but it is more than being tired... It is not a feeling of wanting to go to sleep but feeling physically weak, continuing into the next day or longer. It impairs other cherished activities such as going for a run or working out the next day. This occurs after masturbation and sexual activities with a partner.
Is this abnormal and what could be causing it?
Any answers would be great... this has been very bothersome.

58/ http://au.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080625162212AAUOWg0

After ejaculation I feel sick and dizzy and hot?
More after sex....is there any reasoning to this? ifeel very faint, sick, and dizzy... any help??

59/ http://www.propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1727&sid=5c9a9eef35d73b81660668a435aa42c6

been off fin for over a year.

I feel good but when i ejaculate then for about 3 days i have very bad brain fog.


day 3 it lifts and i am fine. if i Ejaculate again same thing happens.
I can plan this over and over and over.,

what the hell??

60/ same website

I have the same problem. Every time I start to feel good/normal I think I can have sex like before. Then when I ejaculate and I hit a wall and the brainfog/bad feelings come back and lasts for about a week.

61/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AhlE0K.Xg4MFu1adnTW2Lg4jzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080328150941AAsdtUl

How do I get my energy back after mastubating? I masturbate excessively (more than twice each day sometimes).?
I am 100% sure that masturbating two or more times a day will make me extremely extremely tired, and this tiredness will last for at least 36-48 hours after the 2nd or 3rd masturbation. I'm in my early 20's. Sometimes I take a break for 3 or more days and the energy ALWAYS comes back after 36-48 hours.

This tiredness causes come back pain, and sometimes my thighs get so tired that it's very hard to stand up, and I don't feel like thinking. I read that others on the net have this problem. (And the energy decrease is extremely significant, and occurs as a direct result of maturbation.)

MY QUESTION: I don't want people to tell me not to masturbate...but what can I do to either "prevent" future decreases of energy after masturbating ... OR ... what can I do to get my energy back quickly afterwards?

(ps. Sleeping 1 to 2 hours helps sometimes, but I don't have much time. Other answers would be appreciated.)

62/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Al.lzyluzMP17IlmiIsUZ_gjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080129152024AAJ6ZNi

Does ejaculation actually have any negative effects?
I'm in an on-going debate with someone so I'm trying to find some proof that ejaculation (specifically losing sperm) doesn't lower your life span or make you less intelligent or able to focus. I already know that after men ejaculate that they get tired, but I have serious doubts about it shortening their life or making them unable to focus for days after (as this person is implying). I really believe that it's due to other reasons and an unhealthy life style, not losing sperm.

I haven't found any articles supporting the idea yet. If anyone can find one that proves this as a myth or not that'd be a great way to answer my question.

63/   http://www.mathrubhumi.info/static/health/showAnswer.php?id=417&cat=2&cat_name=

 Dear Doctor My problem is getting very tired next two days after ejaculation or intercourse (after discharging). I feel very tired, lazy, feel sleepy and no interest in my work or sex for few days. But no problem in erection or ejaculation again next day or after. This problem was started from my teenage and I was masterbating very occassionaly only. But it was discharging during night time after every ten or 15 days in my sleep. Now I got married and facing the tiredness problem. I am afraid that I may not be able to satisfy my partner. She is co-operative and giving me strength by words. But how long she can suffer me........please help me doctor......... Why this tiredness comes? Is any problem by discharging semen? Which specialist I have to consult? Is it common phenomena? My friend says that he masterbate allmost all the days. But I can't even think about it............! Malik, U.A.E
Malik Aazam

64/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic43417.html

Hi, i'm new here. I got a couple of masturbation problems. For the past few years, my masturbation sessions are very bland. My orgasms are only enjoyable, if i'm doing it in the shower, have to pee really bad, or horny out of my mind (which is rare), for some strange reasons. Most of the time, my orgasms are very bland, nothing special.

Next problem, just about every time I masturbate, after I come, I feel burnt-out for days, sometimes weeks. Like if I plan on doing something, it wears me down, and I lack motivation. In addition, a lot of times after I masturbate, it takes me days, sometimes weeks to even get back into the mood, to masturbate. I don't mean it takes that long to get turned on again, I mean turned enough to want to mastubate.

Can anyone explain why, or relate, or thoughts? Thanks.

65/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081002063819AAvfb7R

How to remain feeling good and not tired after masturbation?
I always feel guilty after masturbation,but sometimes I do not feel guilty but I'm so tired and lose concentration. How can I prevent from all of this feeling?

66/ https://abchomeopathy.com/forum2.php/152725/

Ejaculation/ tired for 5 days
   From bronte   on 2008-08-11
4 replies   328 views
i am 18 year old male. My problem is that when ever i seem to ejaculate i feel tired not juss on that perticular time buh the effects last for about 5-7 days. What i feel is extreme tiredness unmotivation brain fog, untalkitivness, lazy, as if brain not working properly meaning cant answer people correctly (conversation problems). This is how the cycle goes of these problems .The day of ejaculation after which next day feel ok juss a lil tired, lazy and brain fog day 2 it gets worse, day 3 gets better, day 4 gets worse again, day 5starts to get better and about on day 6 i am feeling great i get all my personality back brain fog goes away , iget my sense of humor back i becom social... i have noticed all these rollercoster effects every time i ejacualte ... i ha ve stopped masterbating because of it and now i get wet dreams which i dont wanna have because of this problem.. so plz help me thnx in advance

67/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AkOSaTgjWNWsRN1pWGPfXm8jzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20081129104042AAeIuta

Does orgasm have a negative effect on concentration?
Whenever I masturbate and orgasm, I always feel as though I cannot concentrate afterwards - pretty much for the entire day.
My eyes become tired and have difficulty focusing when reading, and just overall, I become easily distracted.
I have no guilt with masturbation, so it's not psychological like that. However, everytime that I do orgasm, I do notice a significant difficulty in working, that is not present when I do not.

68/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AhGf_YM0S4767tN269KlEcwjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080427142640AAjfMwh

Headache/migrane ? lack of concentration ? after sex?
by means of a wet dream, masturbation, or anything else results in a lack of concentration. Basically, for 5 to 6 days it becomes extremely difficult to concentrate on anything, I simply cannot sustain a train of thought to think things through. I become extremly absent minded. This makes it difficult to read, hold conversations, follow lectures, take tests, remember things, and learn things. I feel extremly tired and jittery, both physically and mentally. I also become depressed during this time. Its like being totally burned out in the head; much like how people after an epileptic attack are. Also, I get strong headaches after masturbation. Allow me to repeat, these symptoms last 5 to 6 days! So its having a huge affect on my life. I've gone to a neurologist, but he doesn't seem to know whats wrong. He prescribed an ssri, but only because I mentioned I get depression after an orgasm.
If anyone has any idea of what I can do to fix this, or any information at all, please respond

69/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/628280

I am a 37 year old male, have had a complete blood work up and all checked out normal.  Here is my problem...every time I have sex after orgasm I get severe cold chill and diarrheas that comes on within minutes of having sex and can last all night.  I have been to doctors and been given stomach pills, viagra etc and nothing works.  It has gotten to the point that my wife and I seldom have sex because it's not worth a night of being sick omeone please tell me I'm not insane and that there is a name for this and better yet a cure!

70/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/653913

extreme tiredness after ejaculation
When having intercourse I hold back because if I ejaculate I am basically exhausted all week. Obviously this is affecting my performance. This happens even if I masturbate however if I ever have a wet dream the same response doesnt happen. Help please.

71/ http://www.doctorndtv.com/faq/detailfaq.asp?id=2331

 What causes fever after sex?     
Q. I got married 2 years ago. I have a problem for the last 6 to 7 months. During sexual contact with my wife, as the semen comes out I become very weak. I feel pain in all my veins, bones of legs and hands, a headache and then my body temperature becomes very low so that I have to cover myself with 2 to 3 blankets. After some time i got heavy fever. When I see any sexual things like movies, photos then the semen comes out slowly from the penis. After some time I feel some coolness in my underwear only then I realise it. Please comment.

72/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/472100
fever 2 days after having sex
I am 43 years. I always having fever and pains days after have sex with my wife.

73/ http://forums.about.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?tsn=1&nav=messages&webtag=ab-menopause&tid=1448

Hi, I am 30 years old.  liked to ask, after having sex, I always got a fever, seems like I'm not feeling well. My boyfriend likes to having sex more than an hour, he is quiet hard to get orgasm. What's wrong with my body? Is it normal to having sex as long as we had? ( I was too tired after that:( ). Somebody help me please???

74/ http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/1072748

 Is heavy fever,chill,body and leg pain after sex normal?After cuddling  him i feel heavy fever,chill,body,hands or leg pain is this normal?Maybe after some days or next day it happens why?He is alright but i am not why?

75/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/viewtopic.php?p=650970#650970

My boyfriend and I have been together for some time now and decided about a month ago it was time to do some more sexual things since we both felt ready. We have been doing things for about a month now and everything was fine until last night. He felt fine before I started to **** him off but after we had finished, he was really unwell. He felt extremely sick though at the time, he was really enjoying it but afterwards, things just weren't right. He was extremely hot, which is understandable and this can lead to sickness but is that what was wrong? Opinions please....

[The thread has been banned because too old  [:(!]
You can read the google cached link  (http://66.102.9.132/search?q=cache:ap-QCPLx16cJ:www.steadyhealth.com/sickness_after_male_ejaculation_t98517.html+%22My+boyfriend+and+I+have+been+together+for+some+time+now+and+decided%22&hl=fr&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=fr&client=firefox-a) for few time ]

76/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/viewtopic.php?p=650972#650972

sickness after male ejaculation
I feel sick for 8 weeks off and on after ejaculation. It drives me nuts. Any ideas?

77/ http://www.medhelp.org/forums/urology/messages/32047.html

I am a 28 year old male and since last once month I have been experiencing extreme lower thigh and limb muscular weakness and fatigue after ejaculation. Since then I have had deteriorating muscle strength in my legs and increasing fatigue. Earlier I used to feel weak after ejaculation, but I guess that is normal. But these days after ejaculation or masturbation, I feel my mind not being at ease and after a few minutes I start to expericence severe muscular pains and stiffness in my limbs. I'm suffering from extreme fatigue these days. Could it be some kind of harmonal imbalances? I have checked up with my GP for possible causes(any viral infections, thyroid, rheumatoid disorders, gravis, muscle wastage, anxiety & depression disorders) and so far everything has come out normal. I am at loss to find out what is causing this muscular pains in my legs triggered a month ago by ejaculation. The pain is quite similar to being as if I have run on a treadmill all day long. I will be meeting a neurologist next week.

78/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AuxHDMraxQV_xHCcXJUy3l8jzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20070223023352AA45FsQ

Is it healthy or normal?
I'm in the mid 30 yrs old. I feel exhausted and lost my desire for sex for the couple of days after ejaculation. Regardless the ejaculation is from sex or masturbation. Is that normal? When I was younger, I never feel this way.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 13/01/2008 10:29:05
hi john21, b-jim...

thanks! it isn't actually about me, I do not suffer from this. it is about a friend of mine (male),

not sure how to put this since i am interpreting something that i haven't actually experienced. please bear with me, here goes...

the symptoms seem to be similar to many of the ones described in the various posts. it comes on immediately following orgasm - within a matter of minutes. and lasts for anything up to two weeks, in which time he is really down, and any thoughts about sex fill him with disgust... self-disgust. so he doesn't think about it. avoids any mention of it. he feels really depressed during this time, and has really negative thoughts. over this time it gradually "improves" and he is back to "normal", then the cycle starts again... the only way he has been able to describe it / explain it is like a release of hormones... which seems to correspond to the dompamine, etc. theory.

he has had this for ever, each time, to a greater or less degree. his this self-disgust something others experience? any tips about avoiding it?

thanks a lot!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 13/01/2008 11:32:47
More cases :

79/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Anp9mxZbdqFss4H07fFmhOcjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20070921011149AA9L41I

My girlfriend gets too tired after intercourse ???
my girlfriend feels very exhausted and tired after having sex ?? she reach orgasm then I have to leave the intercourse and start massaging her back and shoulder??? I am going to be NUT
ANY BODY HELPS ME

80/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AnH1a3b85wQvPs.8uEIbpSgjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080723132933AA9Bop9

Masturbation drain body wellness?
I am 34, not married and everytime I do masturbation after that my physique becomes extremely exhausted and my head aches and I experiences brain fatigue. I ended up sleeping for hours to recover and my mood is totally ruined for the day, Why is this?

81/ moderate case, no fatigue (or they don't say)

http://www.steadyhealth.com/Constant_stomach_bloat__headache__abnormal_stool_after_masturbation_t82069.html

Constant stomach bloat, headache, abnormal stool after masturbation

I am 26 year old male and i am having this problem for the last 5 or 6 months.
Well, i am having a constant bloat in my lower abdomen. I have to go to restroom twice daily. Even after that my lower abdomen feels bloated, like something is blocking. If i try harder, my whole head starts to ache a lot. One more thing is, whenever i masturbate, after 15 minutes, the bloating increases a lot, my head fells like its about to burst, and for 2 to 3 days i suffer from diarrohea(its not loose motions, but abnormal stool thats not solid or loose).
Does anyone suffer from the same symptoms. It would really help me if u have suggestions, since this is driving me crazy for a while now. Thanks a lot.

82/ same website

I have these same problems. I feel bloated and have stomach pain
a few days after masturbating and sometimes feel sharp pain near the left kidney (sometimes right). I also sometimes feel pain above (usually left) testicle. This situation started suddenly about a year ago after a day of excessive masturbation (don't laugh;)). From that day I also get similar symptoms after drinking coffee. Is it possible that my bowel got irritable in only 1 day? Because I couldn't find on web any connection between Irritable Bowel Syndrome and sex/masturbation. Can anyone help?

83/  http://www.justanswer.com/questions/177qx-male-masturbate-feel

I am a male and after I masturbate, I feel like I have the flu the next morning, sore throat and tiredness.... (typical flulike POIS)

84/ http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=332030

I believe I have a medical problem related to sexual activity. I feel
awfully tired and unmotivated after I have masturbated. I also feel
more thirsty and hungry on days when I masturbate. And the story
doesn't end there. I have noticed that I become increasingly
vulnerable to disease after I've masturbated. I don't remember a time
when I caught a cold or a flu and I had not masturbated just before
catching it. So Doctor, please let me know how to get rid of this
problem. I have tried stop masturbating but without success. Since I
can't stop it, I would like to have some other remedy for my problem.
Thanks for your time.

Orgasm and Immunity :
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/319070.stm


85/ same website

I am very sympathsized with you... as I suffered similar problems +
lower back pain. Went to Urologist and got several check up. Doc
initially think I have prostate enlargement problem, but nothing shown
up at the report. I told my Doc about my problems with excessive
masturbation which I started at 13. My Doc shown signs of disbelif and
laugh it over.

86/ http://www.physicsforums.com/archive/index.php/t-183491.html

Well, when I masturbate, lets say twice before the day I have a tournament(and I havn't done it in 2 weeks), my stamina and focus is decreased. I tried searching about it internet, and found that although, physical stamina remains, mental enthusiasm drains. Some say it is b/c of unneccesary guilt. What do you think?
I guess you are right....but why do we feel weak after ejaculation?

87/ Very light case (or he din't say all symptoms ).
http://forum.santabanta.com/showthread.htm?t=98341

Hello Dear Aunty...
I have read many topics about Masturbation and in every topic i came to know that masturbation has no effect on Health. But i want to Ask a Question that whenever i Masturbate twice a day or after a long Interval i feel Pain in my Back and Knees, so what does it Indicates..

88/ Same case. Maybe shouldn't i add such a light case in our database ? Dunno.
http://www.revolutionhealth.com/forums/relationships/sex-intimacy/109678

    what causes weak knees after sex?

89/ http://doctor.ndtv.com/faq/detailfaq.asp?id=356

After sex I feel very weak resulting in a headache. I do not like to work after having sex because of weakness. I am otherwise healthy.

(i don't copy the answer of the "doctor" because it make me crazy... )

90/ http://askville.amazon.com/Hey-guys-men-making-love-orgasm-make-feel-tired-day-days/DiscussionBoard.do?requestId=17540383&page=1
      
"Hey you guys and men out there, can making love and having an orgasm make men feel really tired the next day... or days?"
I know it's a dumb question. But I'm really naive and clueless regarding this matter. My husband gets really tired the next couple of days. And may I add; his job is really physical!

91/ http://www.justanswer.com/questions/1n64p-really-sick-orgasim-sorry

I get really sick after an orgasim(sorry for the spelling) sometimes after intercourse./ I get dizzy, sick headache what could cause this?

92/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/711645


Medical or psychological? Fatigue after ejacluation
Hello Doctor,
I will have him schedule an appt. with a doctor when he has time, but I wonder if this is normal, or physical or psychological ?I am asking on behalf of my boyfriend. Whether masturbating or having intercourse my boyfriend only allows himself to ejaculate only about once a week. He will have an erection, but always stops short of an orgasm. Even daily or semi-daily, but never to the point of  orgasm. The reason for this is that he says that if he has a full orgasm he's extremely tired for days, and he has a demanding job so he needs to be awake for work. To me, it seems strange and unhealthy. He also has depression and fatigue that last days; he has headaches,and it's almost as though he is sickSick sinus syndrome, etc. He is nearly forty years old. I suggest that he practice orgasm more often so that his body is more acclamated to them, such as if he tries masturbating more regularly so that his body doesn't act as though it's going through trauma afterwards. Have you heard of this, or does it sound like a problem? I always thought that men needed to ejaculate more, and that it's even healthy for their prostate gland...

93/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/663286

fatigue after ejaculation
hello! i am 17 and i want to clear some confusions. we all feel fatigue after ejaculation, after how many days does one restore his normal body state? over masturbation is not good, if i masturbate today, after how many days is it advisable to masturbate again? thanks

94/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/662368

fatigue after ejaculation
hello i am 19,
for about the last 6 mounths every time i have sex or masterbate it seems that my body just collapse. It is almost like my become very week mostly my arms and neak. during sex is when i collapse on top of my partner and dont have the strength to push my self up off her.
i am a very fit person, i weight train 4 days a week for close to 2 hours.

95/ http://www.aznlover.com/vbulletin/mens-issues-topics/25149-does-ejaculation-make-you-feel-shitty.html

Does anyone else feel shitty after they've ejaculated? I mean physically. I don't know how to describe it. I usually start to feel it about 20 minutes after ejaculation and then it gradually increases intensity for about an hour and then gradually an equilibrium is restored and I feel normal again. It's not a religious thing either since I didn't grow up with religion. I'm horny all the time like anyone else and experience the pleasure of orgasm like anyone else but there's something about that weird shitty feeling that holds me back from actually wanting to engage in sex (or masturbation) all the time. I'm in my 40's now and I've felt this way ever since my first ejaculation at 12 years old. But I've never talked about it because no one else ever mentioned it. It's not like an intolerable shittiness either - just a vague discomfort and a gray moodiness (bleh, whatever that means)

I think xqzmi described it perfectly - it is flu like. As a matter of fact about 8 years ago I began noticing getting flu like symptoms the next day - sore throat, fatigue, headaches, etc. I hope it's as simple as vitamin deficiency. I'm going to try taking the B complex and Omega 3 for awhile and see what happens. Thanks xqzmi - you don't know how relieved I am!

96/ http://www.thebody.com/Forums/AIDS/Fatigue/Archive/FatigueCause/Q90074.html
fatigue and orgasm
Dear Dr.F: I have noticed a change in my "recovery time" after orgasm (specifically as my health started to decline in the late 90's). After orgasm I am wiped out often for days afterward and my mood is no picnic either. I am often moody and irritable with a capital I. I am presently taking testerone supplements and I still experience a surprising level of fatigue after orgasm. I am baffled at the level of fatigue I experience given the relatively short and sweet nature of this event. Do you have any suggestions about this?

97/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic61692.html

Over Masturbating Damage
Hi. I've stimulated myself since I was 12/13 and now i'm almost 20. I havent had a specific patter though it was many times a day in the earlier years. Then I would stop for awhile and go back to it. As of a year or so now i've been trying to quit but have had little success. It's affecting my life and with the college work i'm finding this extremely difficult. I can't focus on my work, I cant remember things, and the easiest of tasks have become extremely hard. I exercise regularly and it doesnt help. Infact I head that its bad to masturbate and exrcise.
I really need to stop damaging my body and find a way to fix what i've done. How bad is the damage from what i've explained? What should my diet be? What can I do? I hate this addiction and want it to go away! My life is in ruins and falling apart more and more each day b/c of it. :(

98/ http://en.allexperts.com/q/Masturbation-1658/2008/8/Masturbation-problems-2.htm

I am a 14 year old male 5 foot 9 inches, 120 pounds. Since I was 11, I have been masturbating about once every day. I'm not sure when, but some time into it, I started to experience constant fatigue and impairment of my concentration and memory skills and developed dark bags under my eyes. At age 13, I cut it down to only about 4-6 times a week but the problems still remained. I'm at 14 now which is 3 years later and I'm wondering what I can do to get back to my normal mental and physical states without involving my parents. Do I need to stop for a few months or what?

99/ http://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090101222819AAZEP8Y

After masturbation, what damage of body ?
After masturbation , i felt some sick and tired so much .. What happen after masturbation .. please explain me or advise me ..

100/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/577660

masturbation and back ache and weakness

This is Rahul here.I am a 24 year old boy and I have completed graduation and will start working in three months time from now.I'm sorry my mail is lengthy but i think I need to describe my problem in detail.

          At an age of 12 or 13 I started masturbating occasionally.As I grew older ,without knowing its ill effects i started doing it more frequently.In the early stages I used to do it thinking that it would stop my nocturnal emissions.When I was 16,17 & 18 I started feeling very weak after regular masturbation.As a consequence the frequency of nocturnal semen emissions increased further.I was a shy kind of a guy so I could not discuss the problem with my friends.By this time I lost concentration and started performing badly in studies and simultaneously i got used to watching adult fims.This addiction has grown ever since .In the mean time I have consulted various ayurvedic doctors and learnt about the ill effects of masturbating and i have also taken various ayurvedic medicines.The medicines have helped me and i have stopped masturbating but once I watch an adult movie I invariably feel weak and give into masturbation. My physical condition is such that I feel weak all the time and my knees eels weak.I have a lower back ache which increases when i masturbate.My energy level is very low.There is a weakness in my legs also.I have also developed an uneasyness in my head im not sure if its relevant.I want to become a good man and want to be fit when i start working.kindly suggest how will i be able to rejuvenate my body ache and sexual health and gain my childhood energy.will

101/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic8464.html

Can masturbation be source of any kind of sexual weakness.I am 23 and masturbating since I was 15 now I have pain in my back along with stiffness, also I feel I dont get hard-on as I used to


102/ http://doctor.ndtv.com/faq/detailfaq.asp?id=11046
( Only joint pains )

Why do I get knee pain after ejaculation?
I am a 20-year-old bodybuilder. My knee joints hurt usually after I ejaculate. Why is that so? I hear strange cracking noises when I squat. Does ejaculating a lot affect knee joint lubrication? Do heavy weights affect squatting? What can I do to make these sounds and pain go away? Should I limit my masturbation to a month or week? Should I take any joint supplements, even though the doctor has told me that I am too young for Glucosamine? I do need to use heavy weights when training my legs. Please advise.

Doc's answer : The only probable connection between your ejaculation and knee pains might be that the strong muscular contractions of ejaculation can cause some musculoskeletal pains. There is NO other connection.
 [;D] Funny non-scientific answer.

103/ http://www.healthask.net/html/Diseases___Conditions/20070724/I_get_ill_after_sex__Everytime___Itchy_eyes__fatigued__achy_muscles__flushed_ski_11456.html

I get ill after sex. Everytime. Itchy eyes, fatigued, achy muscles, flushed ski


I get ill after sex. Everytime. Itchy eyes, fatigued, achy muscles, flushed ski
It lasts for about 3 days. Sore throat, tight head muscles, oh and right after orgasim, I can tell you exactly where a canker sore will break open in my mouth. Go figure that one out. Its NOT psycological AT ALL, its physiological. Its been going on It lasts for about 3 days. Sore throat, tight head muscles, oh and right after orgasim, I can tell you exactly where a canker sore will break open in my mouth. Go figure that one out. It

104/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic38502.html

Loss of Energy From Ejaculation
I had a question for anyone who can help. I'm a healthy 23yr old male and when I have sex too much with my girlfriend I lose all my energy. I was wondering what I can do to counter that. I eat healthy and I excercise and I don't drink or smoke. What gives? Am I not getting enough of something in my diet that helps make more sperm? I'm lost with this and I love to have sex all the time so this serves to be a considerable problem. Thanks

105/ http://www.healthboards.com/boards/archive/index.php/t-365753.html

Masturbation, feeling sick
Hi! Im an 21 year old boy, and it seems ive got a problem with masturbation:
After doing it, i feel really bad for days, i feel week, have a lot of headaches! and my libido is at 0. Also, the days after ive got a lot more of PVC's (heart related).
Then, if i don't masturbate at all for about a whole week, then i start feeling good, energetic and my libido is up again, and i suffer from much less PVC's.
On Friday ive got an appointment for an Echocardiogram...
Do you think is heart related? or maybe hormones?

106/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic16571.html
Always Feeling Weak After Sex
I've been a married housewife for over 10 yrs now and everytime after sex, my body becomes weak leaving me forced to lay down in bed resting.
If I have sex at night and go to sleep after, the following morning I would be generally weak. I've seen a doctor and had blood tests done and results was all good. I take multivitamins everyday but problem still persists.
My question is, what is this condition called and what can I do about it ?

107/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/feeling-sick-after-orgasm-t137390-a1.html

feeling sick after orgasm
Whenever I have an orgasm, I have issues having a b.m. and I feel sick to my stomach. I also have trouble peeing most of the time. Followed by a migraine. It has been happening for years, I dont have an STD but I am just worried that it may be something more serious, that I have never heard of..

108/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AtAdSzb0D.A8opvlyU4yDkgjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080730093253AAYXjHH

Is it normal to feel sick after sex? And to even have bowel problems?
Sometimes my stomach is upset after sex. Usually after I eat so I sometimes have to wait a long time after I eat to have sex. And recently after sex I had bowel problems and even had to miss work. Does this happen to other people or should I see a doctor or is it no big deal?

109/ http://www.problempages.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5067&start=0&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

Feeling sick after sex
I know this is going to sound really strange. I 've been with my partner for over 3 years and recently everytime after sex i feel really ill and sometimes even physically sick. :(

As you can imagine this is worrying both me and my partner, i've been to the doctors and so has he and we're both healthy in all parts of the body. But i cant help but feel absolutely terrible after sex, its really getting me down and i feel as though he might end up getting really annoyed with me and go off with someone else.

Please has anyone ever experienced this? :cry: Or can anyone offer me any advice?

110/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AkKZJ_ROhdoGFPkHwkXishsjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20070703053619AAALQ12

Masturbation sucks energy out of you?
I don't know why everywhere on the internet they say it is healthy,natural,normal......blablabla......
my personal experience taught me that it makes me feel tired, unbalanced, acne, dark spot under the eyes, affects sports....etc.
and it takes so much time to recover to normal full health, i think it takes over 2 months....
the occurrence of wet dreams takes more than 2 months after stop masturbation.
i prefer to forget about it and do something else when i feel horny
aren't wet dreams the natural way instead of masturbation?

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 13/01/2008 12:07:45
thanks for getting back so quickly!

no he is on no meds, never has been. he has a major aversion to all things prescribed by doctors or even bought over the counter.

really down as in, the world is a big black hole, he cannot concentrate, cannot work properly, cannot communicate properly, his speech is even slurred now that i come to think of it. certainly cognitively impaired... one time he even forgot his own name! he goes about his daily activities as if in a dream... brain fog i suppose. he really hates himself during this period, I guess. and is paranoid, thinking the world is out to get him, trusting no-one. he is woken at night by these thoughts.

never put it in these terms before, so concisely... seems to make for some kind of mental illness. he is otherwise an intelligent, creative person, although he is immensely insecure, especially during these "pois" episodes if that is what they are.

he has never seen a doctor about it. 

even just writing all this down helps!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 13/01/2008 13:06:06
This does sound similar, perhaps it is POIS. It might do him some good to get involved here and post about his experience. By the way I understand his aversion to meds, I am the same way.  It's great that you are being supportive.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 13/01/2008 13:23:31
hi john

i'll try! thanks.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/01/2008 15:39:47
DENIAL

Bizzy and John21, thank you very much for sharing your experiences with denial. It is amazing to read everyone's posts about POIS; it's like reading your own thoughts, feelings and actions!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 19/01/2008 07:47:26
thanks for getting back so quickly!

no he is on no meds, never has been. he has a major aversion to all things prescribed by doctors or even bought over the counter.

really down as in, the world is a big black hole, he cannot concentrate, cannot work properly, cannot communicate properly, his speech is even slurred now that i come to think of it. certainly cognitively impaired... one time he even forgot his own name! he goes about his daily activities as if in a dream... brain fog i suppose. he really hates himself during this period, I guess. and is paranoid, thinking the world is out to get him, trusting no-one. he is woken at night by these thoughts.

never put it in these terms before, so concisely... seems to make for some kind of mental illness. he is otherwise an intelligent, creative person, although he is immensely insecure, especially during these "pois" episodes if that is what they are.

he has never seen a doctor about it. 

even just writing all this down helps!

Classifies as POIS for me.

For externally noticing things wrong. Does he drop things like glasses? Does he fall down the stairs? Does he bump or cut himself more easily?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 19/01/2008 17:15:17
Classifies as POIS for me.

For externally noticing things wrong. Does he drop things like glasses? Does he fall down the stairs? Does he bump or cut himself more easily?

hi imre1

good questions! shall have to observe that... not sure off the top of my head...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: El Stonio on 21/01/2008 17:04:56
Thank god.  I can't believe I found this thread.  For the last few years I've had the EXACT same symptoms described here. 

After orgasm;
fatigue especially in legs, flushing, depression, fuzzy thinking, tired to point of feeling fluish, insomnia, sore throat, emotionally sensitive... that improves after a day or two.  Protein bars seem to help but it may just be the sugar content?   I also drink lots of organic milk and I thought I read in a post that someone improved after cutting out milk. 

I few years ago I took amino acids for thyroid support, way too much, and that is when my POIS started.  I probably burned out my thyroid by accident.  I also masturbated lots when younger.  Hmmm.  My symptoms are much worse when I masturbate as opposed to wet dreams...could be emotional response then to being alone??

10mgs Paxil nightly to help sleep.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nickthegr8 on 21/01/2008 21:10:08
HELLO EVERYBODY! I'M 22 AND I HAVE SIMILAR CONDITION LIKE YOU GUYS, I DISCOVERED IT LAST SPRING BUT NOW I KNOW HOW TO MANAGE IT. WE "FORGET" TO BREATHE PEOPLE. WE NEED TO BREATHE PROPERLY TO CREATE ENERGY FOR LIFE. AFTER YOU HAVE AN ORGASM, TRY TO MAINTAIN YOUR BRATHING RYTHM, BREATHE WITH YOUR STOMACH, AND MAKE IT A HABBIT TO BREATHE ALL THE TIME PROPERLY, NOT WITH SHORT BRATHS, AND YOU'LL SEE HOW MUCH MORE ALIVE YOU'LL FEEL. GOOD LUCK EVERYBODY!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: agjchs on 21/01/2008 21:24:59
El Stonio,

Did you get my reply to your PM? I hit "Send message" and nothing seemed to happen, so I tried it again and got the same result. You had asked me if DHEA still helps - yes, it does.  It's funny that I got your message today because just this morning I was reading articles on the 'net about studies showing that people are being treated for depression with 30mg-90mg daily doses of DHEA (an endocrinologist I consulted said I could safely take 25mg-50mg daily).
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 21/01/2008 22:09:58
111/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Am31DyM_OlhLgQFwvOZXlOQjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=1006053019202

Does masturbation make the body weak?
My 17 year old friend told me that before he would masturbate up to 4 times a day. He would do it when he felt the need to do it. After masturbating, his body would feel with weak. When he would go out to do a workout (he's in track) his body would feel tired even before the real workout started . At school he would be very sleepy since according to him he masturbated in the morning. Now he stopped and his body never feels weak anymore and he feels with more enery and feels great on those workouts for track. He also doesn't get sleepy during school. I kinda agree with him because i feel the same way as well but I don't know.I feel better when I don't masturbate my body is just more energized for some reason. Any comments or ideas on if this could be true.

112/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AjK58MBKtxY1hEIkuEC.g7UjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080520173114AAFmrkS

Masturbation vs dark circles?
is there a relation between masturbation and forming dark circles? i am 29, male and i am not married. i am masturbating nowadays so frequently. i have been observing that if i masturbate once in a day and 3 days continously, i am seeing that my eyes going inside and looking awful and feel tired. is there anything suggested to do after masturbation so that it doesnt give bad effects like said above. just for the confirmation if i stop masturbating for 10 days, my eyes tend to look normal and energetic. any advice?

113/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AkX7qPmE1ciu1pMKmKSGcTcjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20060622121310AA4DQoq

Im 21, im masturbating frm 18 at 5days/week, is there any sexual disorder in doing so, often i feel tired.....
im male, often i feel tired after doing masturbation....
because of this im not able to concentrate my studies....
whenever i switch on my computer or tv my mind intend to watch on some porn movies.... and finally i masturbate and sleep...

Pls help me how to get rid of this problem....

114/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic20055.html

Can a Person Be Allergic to Orgams? I Know, Sounds Wierd..

Just wondering if i'm alone in this experience. I feel like a freak.
None of my girlfriends have this problem.
Do any of you get red sore eyes and blue black circles under your eyes after an orgasm?
I always do and it can last the entire day. Its just like an allergy!
This has happened with past lovers, and my hubby.
My eyes are in good health otherwise, I just had them checked, I don't need glasses, i've lived in both dry and humid climates.
It doesn't matter what kind of orgasm I have either, you know, hard, easy, multiple, light, mind-blowing, ho- hum, etc.
Also does anyone have any remedies to this problem?
I literally have to wear 2 different types of eye concealers to hide, what looks like a black eye, (people have actually asked me who decked me can you believe it!) and after an orgasm I have to wear sunglasses due to the soreness.
Please, if you know anything or if you have this too, please let me know.

115/ http://en.allexperts.com/q/Male-Masturbation-3326/2008/2/Masturbation-10.htm

I've been masturbating since I was 13 and now nearly 20. I now masturbate more than usual. I think the max I've pulled off this year is 7-8 orgasms in a day. I masturbate around 4 times a day otherwise. I've been having a problem where I get very tired after masturbating. Get big circles under my eyes straight away after the high and everyone says I look tired all the time. I feel tired also. I get headaches all the time and feel lower back pain. I am very short something I've found with people who overmasturbate. Is there any way to reverse the effects of overmasturbation? I know it definitely has done damage to my body. Is there anything that can relieve my body of overmasturbation? Vitamin pills....etc?? I see that masturbation changes your body chemical/hormonal balance completely and depletes your testosterone levels so when you try build muscle  you can't. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Back pain, tired and the black circles... :) Signs of adrenal weakness ?

116/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/690376

not feel good after masturbation
I am 29 years old male and our culture is not to have a girl friend before marriage. But i enjoyed through masturbation but i feel pain in my body specially in my knee and very tired. What should I do to be healthy, active and get rid of pain in my body after masturbation. Some special diet or some medicine.
I shall be very thankful to you for your kind reply.????

117/ http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/1070456

What r the reasons of feeling fatigue,chill,fever,leg pain after sex and during sex i feel pain also why?Do i have germs or bacteria?Headache and leg pain is very common.Next day or after some days of sex i feel very heavy fever and pain.

118/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070721002307AA7toXq

What is the relation between sex orgasm & the knee/leg pain after sex?
* I feel pain in my knees & thighs (like I waked for 10 miles) after having sex.
** I think the amount of pain is proportional to the amount or degree of orgasm gained!

119/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/pain_in_knees_and_legs_during_after_masturbating_t75976.html

pain in knees and legs during/after masturbating
My legs start paining after 15-20 mins of being erect while stroking lightly. After ejaculating my legs keep paining and I feel week all night and a day. I tend to masturbate ~5 nights/week. Could this be due to a little to much masturbation or should I see a doc for some tests?

120/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/pain_in_legs_after_sex_t102906.html

Hi, i'm married man and 37 years old. now if i have sex with my partner after 1 week only 1 time then i feel ok but if i have sex next day then i feel stress and pain in my both legs. it's like i have some kind of weakness in my legs. this pain goes after some hours. Don't know , what treatment i need? please help me for any kind of medication. Also i can perform sex more then 1 time in one section.
Kind Regards

121/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/show/608428

Knee and lower leg pain after Sex
I am 34 years old man for the last one year i was feeling pain and dryness on my lower knee and legs ,when ever i have sex  and even normal ejaculation I  experienced  rashes on my lower under knee , i have not STD history and my entire health is ok ,but i have sever allargic to some medcines and feel when it is cold  itches on  some parts of my body specially on the abdomen.
what i am wodering is what is this pain and dryness after sex and ejaculation and alos lack of sleep may happpen some nights and headaches

122/ http://en.allexperts.com/q/Urology-Male-issues-989/post-ejaculatory-symptoms.htm

post ejaculatory symptoms
I am a 52 yr old male. At age 32, I had left epididymitis, which resulted in atrophy of the L testicle. The testicle does not seem to have changed recently.I have been treated for prostatis periodically since that episode.

My current issue involves post- ejaculatory pain & other symptoms. For the past 8 months, I have experienced the following Sx for 5-7 days after ejaculation:
- frequency, dysuria, hesitancy, nocturia
- low grade pain in pelvic area & left testicle.(3-5 on
 a scale of 10)
- low grade nausea
- night sweats, low grade fever
- malaise
- urethral and bladder tenderness to palpation
- at times, the whole pelvis area feels "on fire"

The symptoms seem to resolve after 7-10 days.
I have been through a 30 day course of Levaquin, as well as Flomax. The symptoms resolved by 80% while on the antibiotic, but have since returned. I remain on the Flomax.

This may not be related, but (through a process of elimination) I have found that the symptoms are exacerbated by NSAIDS and aspirin. I have L3-S2 epidural injections for lower back pain q 4-6 months.

CBC is normal, TSH is normal, PSA is low, UA shows a few WBCs, significant RBCs, and epithelial cells. I have been monogamous for 35 years, and RPR/VDRL are neg.

123/  http://ehealthforum.com/health/uneasy-after-masturbating-t170796.html

hi doctor
every night i will do masturbating /shagging/self-satisfaction.

next day when i wake up, for entire day, i feel uneasy, laziness and some kind unhealthy condition, i do not feel to work because of this...what is the reason for this?

124/ http://boards.webmd.com/webx?THD@@.89751933!thdchild=.89751933

Lower back pain after ejaculation
Hello. I am a 25 year old male. My girlfriend left me a few months ago , so I have been masturbating a lot recently. Anyways, I have been ejaculating 2-3 times a week. And my lower back tends to ache afterwards. Anyone know why this is? Am I not getting enough exercise? This has never happened before. My penis gets sore after ejaculating a lot, but never my back. Thanks for your help.

125/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081209220515AARNK1M

Does Ejaculation Reduce The Immune System?
I notice that everytime I ejaculate more than twice a day I tend to get flu in the next morning. So is there any medical explanation for this? I mean you know the sperm contains substances such as protein so if we throw them away a lot then maybe ... you get my point.
Additional Details
Im not saying it slowly kills you. All Im saying is that if we ejaculate too often without some time to replenish it then it will have some effect on our immune system.

126/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080523201037AAEEGLp

My knees and feet go cold after ejaculation?
i always feel something(maybe its cartillege)is coming up from my knees and at the point of ejaculation......i also have a problem of series of cracking sounds from my knees when they r bent..and sometimes when i was about to ejaculate my knees and feet go cold after the release and relaxation.what does that mean...?

127/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AqNNW0.TsPAlCxTeD_XqZTYjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20080913105952AAUObey

 Hi, why do i always feel so cold and weak after ejaculation and so often end up catching a cold ?? ?
tks for replies, i only feel cold and even sometimes close to shivering after i ejaculate, i have went without ejaculating for a period of time and during this i never got a cold so allergies is not the problem, any help much appreciated tks

128/ http://www.consultation.ayurvediccure.com/what-are-the-natural-treatments-for-the-weakness-after-masturbation-or-sex/comment-page-1/

What are the natural treatments for the weakness after masturbation or sex?
Sir, I am 21 and I wanted to know that whenever I feel sex  , I take out sperm from my penis or I masturbate. After some time of this, I feel very weak and my head and eye began to pain.Sometimes I suffer from cold. So please help me!

129/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/pain-in-knee-after-ejaculation-t175020.html
(knee pain only)

Pain in knee after ejaculation
every time after ejaculation by the other day I begin feelin a horrible pain in my lwft knee. by the way I masterbate aproximetly every 3 days or more

I need consultation.

130/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090201211153AAjUMe0

I ejaculate alot/too much..... knee pain bladder pain stomach pain?
hello im 19 years old and i have been ejaculating ever since i was 15. and from 15 up until 18 i ejaculated mostly everyday or atleast every other day... now its 3 times a week... and now i have aot of pains like bladder pain stomach pain and ive gotten so skinny... and also i get sick after ejculating now.... so my question is- is all this happening bcause of ejacultating? and will i not be abe to father children later on in life? and will i not erect anymore?

131/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/masturbation-side-effects-t173398.html

I think i also feel weak after the wet dream or masturbation. I also feel mental weakness, concentration weakness, lack of confidence, lack of energy.
Please tell me how to stop wet dreams without masturbating. I don't want wet dreams as these affect my work and want to get rid of them.
Please help.
Any suggestion would be helpful.
Thanks.

132/ same page

Masturbation side effects ?
asked by: DoctorQuestion on March 8th, 2009
Due to too much Masterbation, I feeling memory weakness,Concentration weakness,depression,low energy level and lack of confidance.
plz tell me the solution.

133/  http://ehealthforum.com/health/damage-of-masterbation-t175159.html

I have been masterbating regularly since the age of 12. The frequency at which I was masterbating on some days was 4 - 5 times. As I reached the age of 18 this slowed down but I was still masterbating every few days.
I am now 26 and for the last few years I have noticed physical weakness in my legs. At times I feel weakness when I clench my fists. There is also rapid muscle movement in my thigh, fingers, big toes etc - not all the time, every so often. My semen has lightened so much and I have noticed that my Penis whilst resting is becoming more and more floppy. I can still get a full erection but I end up ejaculating within a minute or so. I cannot seem to last a long time. After masterbation I get a burning sensation which lasts a long time on either side of my abdomen and this is becoming the norm. I am trying really hard to stop to the point where I go on for a couple of weeks and then give in to masterbation again.
I've had a general checkup with my GP and all seems fine. I've told GP of the symptoms (but did not mention the masterbation) and after thoroughly checking me out as well as referring me to a neurologist - they could not find anything wrong with me. This then leads me to think it has to be the masterbation. I just don't know what to make of this anymore!

134/  http://boards.webmd.com/webx?THDX@@.89b8d214!thdchild=.89b8d214
 Foggy Headed after ejaculation
After I ejaculate I feel foggy headed and a loss of energy for about day. I feel normal again after a good night sleep. I have had this condition for many years. I am now 45. Right after I ejaculate I feel as if a chemical being released in my body that travels and pools in my brain, thus causing my foggy head. I feel tired, irritable, and a lack of desire to do anything for that day. Any idea as to my condition and cure?

135/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090225090149AASvHmT
Why do orgasms make me sneeze?
Lately, every time I ejaculate, I get stuffy headed and start sneezing. My nose gets stopped up, and I have all the symptoms of allergy or hay fever. This lasts maybe 30 min. to an hour, basically a/b the same amount of time it otherwise takes me to get sexually stimulated again, after an orgasm. I've heard that male ejaculation promotes histamine release, but have never seen any evidence that it was sufficient to cause this. Ideas?

136/ http://www.medhelp.org/posts/Undiagnosed-Symptoms/Contiunes-Fever-acne-headache-and-fatigue-after-sexual-activity/show/770679

Contiunes Fever,acne,headache and fatigue after sexual activity

Sir,i am experiencing heavy fever, fatigue,pain,acne on face problem from many months atleast from 6 to 20 months.
I think that i may have std or sti What do u think that i may have std's or not?This
fever nd fatigue remains constant 24 hours a day and it's very difficult to work and learn.Acne which returns within some days if i do not eat tablets.Actually,i had gay boy friend and we had sex alot.i have ****** him alot and i'm telling u all this so that it will be easily to know that what is my problem?whenever i ****** him my problem increases but he's alright.He has no problem and i have many problems.Do u think that i should not do more sex as my condition is bad?My eyesight has also become more weak then previous times.How can i get rid from this fever and fatigue?is this general disease or std's?What's this?

137/ http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/1096067

Is heavy fever,chill,pain normal after sex?I'm feeling daily fever,chill,pain after cuddling  him.When i had fucked him 4 times i was all right but now i have fucked him 7 to 13 times and i have fever or chill or pain problem.He is all right but i'm not why


138/ http://boards.webmd.com/webx?THDX@@.89b8d214!thdchild=.89b8d214

Foggy Headed after ejaculation
After I ejaculate I feel foggy headed and a loss of energy for about day. I feel normal again after a good night sleep. I have had this condition for many years. I am now 45. Right after I ejaculate I feel as if a chemical being released in my body that travels and pools in my brain, thus causing my foggy head. I feel tired, irritable, and a lack of desire to do anything for that day. Any idea as to my condition and cure?

139/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/back-pain-after-intercourse-t185725.html

Hi I am a married 52m, I get a back pain after a couple of hours after intercourse, which does not affect my appetitute at time, but when I do to sleep I get teeth clenching with no noise and I wake up with my chins hurting me. I also wake up with bad appetite and i rather not eat, if i did eat something i will nearly throw up,I feel tired and internal muscles contracted.The situation continues througout the day and I hardly eat, the next day i am normal again.Pls explain what is going on and advise.
Many thanks in advance.

140/  http://boards.webmd.com/webx?THDX@@.89dc7ab9!thdchild=.89dc7ab9

I have a rare problem after ejaculation. For several days after I have a sort of allergy attack to my own body chemistry. Ejaculation is fine with the normal stress relief and pleasure for about an hour. Then I begin to have muscle tightness throughout my entire body, especially my neck. I do not sleep well for several days, have night seats and am very irritable during the days. I do have fibromyalgia and this makes the symptoms 5 times worse. My ex wife had severe PMS and I've got to say my mood swings are similar. This problem is getting worse with time to the point where I am abstaining from giving myself pleasure of ejaculation because I feel awful for as long as 8 days. I have been to several specialists but with no answer. My hormone level is normal. I treat these side effects with nitrazapam but that just allows me to function. This problem also gives me high anxiety and confusion. Does anyone else have a similar problem and does anyone have suggestions.

141/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080605153144AAsPPeM

Fever after Sex?
After having sex with my girlfriend she always get a fever after 2 days
I did all STD tests And Nothing came up
She did too Any ideas??
 
142/ http://answers.eyje.com/infectious-diseases-open-question-constant-low-grade-fever-after-sex/

Constant low grade fever after sex?

Hi I am 24 year male. I am facing very serious problem. I had a constant low grade fever after sex and also having right side testicle pain. I did sex with a girl before 6 months ago and i had a low grade fever from last 6 months. Any body can tell me plz what infection I have?? Doctors not able to help me..
and i am also having sole burning problem.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 21/01/2008 22:23:24
agjchs, I am curious to know how old you are. I have read that you shouldn't take DHEA under a certain age.

nickthegr8, I have heard that breating properly can assist greatly with anxiety problems, as some people get so anxious they lock up and unknowingly stop breathing easy. I can't see any connection to POIS though. Are you saying that your POIS symptoms went away after learning how to maintain your breathing?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/01/2008 21:54:38
Thank god.  I can't believe I found this thread.  For the last few years I've had the EXACT same symptoms described here. 

El Stonio, welcome and thank you for sharing your experience. I agree, THIS PLACE IS A MIRACLE!!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/01/2008 22:04:45
TESTOSTERONE SUBSTITUTE?

I recently stopped testosterone injections, 1) it didn't help POIS and 2) it's a pain in the neck running to nurses every 2 weeks and 3) it's controversial - some say it's dangerous, can lead to prostate cancer, so constant monitoring is not fun.

Does anyone have any suggestions about helping a flagging libido without testosterone? Thanks!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Ender on 23/01/2008 21:25:06
Found this thread when I was trying to search for more info on the matter. Still at a loss though to figure out what it is exactly that I'm losing after orgasm and what I can do to regain it, or, at the very least, to minimize some of the side-effects.

For a few days after orgasm, I usually find myself mentally fogged up and rather unmotivated. And worse, as a result I usually find myself extra introverted since I have an impossible time trying to talk to people due to these effects. I end up not really having much to say and sometimes having difficulty following what the other person is saying. At its worst it gets to depression and just feeling grim/gloomy.

However, when some of the effects begin to wear off I usually feel extra confident, motivated, energetic, and... a fair bit horny as well. Which usually leads to a restart of the cycle.

Caffeine sometimes helps with this, as does some food (some makes it worse). Usually it gets at its worst later in the evening. I've been thinking that it's likely dopamine related for a while now, but unfortunately... I'm still completely clueless on neurochemistry

Oh, and also. I regularly take two fish oil, one in the morning and one at night, and I take a small dose of an SSRI at night.

Anyone have some ideas or suggestions?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 24/01/2008 00:40:38
Welcome Ender,
We're all searching... read through the posts and you'll get a few ideas, but it is currently a mysterious condition. What foods makes your problem worse for you? Do you think that the worsening in the evenings could be due to fighting with it all day, exhausting you?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Ender on 24/01/2008 07:09:15
I think that it's usually worse at night simply because... I'm naturally more tired at night.

As for food, I've found that foods heavier in raw fat will usually make matters worse, yet at the same time, small bits of meat or nuts sometimes make things feel a bit better for a while. Same with spaghetti tonight. Nutrigrain bars usually help for a short bit as well. Popcorn, potato chips, and anything with a lot of salt often-times make things worse though.

Probably has to do with nutritional value and such in that. However, what I find strange is that drinking lots of water makes it a lot worse. Especially at night. Coca Cola on the other hand sometimes works really well, but other times puts me to sleep.

The biggest thing I've found that helps however is just getting out and forcing myself to talk to people I'm comfortable with. Moving around a bit and motivating myself inspite of the pain and discomfort does tons more than anything else.

Oh, and trying not to concentrate too hard on things helps as well. Both mentally and physically.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jo58 on 24/01/2008 21:29:58
Hi everybody. Thank you so much for this topic, it's such a relief to discover I'm not the only one with this strange disease.

Let me describe my symptoms; as you will see they are not strictly identical to those posted here before. However, they are so strongly correlated to orgasm that for me POIS is the best explanation for my disorder.

First some personal details : male, age 49, computer scientist, living in France. I'm suffering from this condition for probably at least three years, and probably much more. It has worsened recently - at first it occurred occasionally, but not systematically as is the case now. To be precise, I'm now in the situation that having an orgasm during intercourse (not masturbation) leaves me sick the following days, in a systematic way. Actually my latest observations lead me to think that intensity of my symptoms are proportional to the actual length and intensity of the orgasm.

I understand those who speak of denial. I still have difficulty coming to terms with the facts. Speaking to others helps a lot - in my case I spoke to it with my wife first, and now this forum. The best explanation for this denial is that until recently I suffered from sleep apnea. Since I had mandibulary surgery this summer the apnea disappeared completely, but not the symptoms that I had attributed to it.

Here are my latest observations, starting last Sunday at about 9 PM, just after sex (I wrote everything like in a diary actually).

H =0
Everything normal.

H+1 to H+1:30
Feeling of anxiety.
I feel a strange burning/oppressed feeling when breathing, like I've just been bathing in cold seawater (I must say it's very hard to describe).
My temperature rises to about 37.5°C. I feel great warmth over all my body.
My breathing gets heavier.

H+3
I awake with the same symptoms as above, only worse. Anxiety is close to panic. I realize that this episode is probably the most severe I've ever had - probably because the orgasm I experienced was sensibly longer and more intense than usual.
My temperature has dropped to 37.5°C.
Nausea.

D+1 (morning)
I have a hard time getting up - I wake up and fall back to sleep repeatedly.
The oppressed feeling during breathing is still there. I feel like a weight on my chest.
My face in general and mouth in particular feel very tense, almost making it difficult to talk.
I feel terribly tired during breakfast, exhausted actually.

D+1 (rest of the day)
Physical activity seems to be highly demanding. I avoid the staircases, even walking is difficult.
I can do my work, but it's a very, very, uncomfortable day. I lose my concentration now and then.
Back home in the evening, my temperature is back to normal (slightly below 37°)

D+2
Like D+1, it's hard to get out of bed, and even harder to get wide awake.
I feel terribly tired, exhausted, making me irritable, hardly sociable.
However, I don't feel even half as bad as on D+1, although breathing still feels difficult.

D+3
Same as D+2, just slightly better

D+4 (today)
Things are almost back to normal, except that I'm really, really tired.

Well that's it... Just before I finish this long post (I hope you don't mind), I'd like to ask just one question: in your opinion, which field of medicine is most concerned by this syndrome: neurology, sexology, endocrinology, urology,..., psychiatry (just joking...) ? My problem is I just don't know which doctor I should consult...

Thank you in advance for your reactions, and sorry again for being so long.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jplewin on 25/01/2008 01:02:48
Hi everyone... posting again.
I have not followed the thread for a while, but I see a lot of guys joining in...
My condition has not improved... nothing really has changed.
But I'm here if I can help someone sharing my experience...
For the new guys, if you are interested... read my previous posts.

I'll try to catch the thread again...

Greetings.
JP
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 25/01/2008 07:37:37
143/  http://www.imminst.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=31468&pid=336198&st=0&#entry336198

I've noticed this for years. Shortly after ejaculating, my immune system becomes depressed and I start to catch a sore throat. Sometimes it sticks, sometimes not. Since getting a chipped molar, the effect is even more noticeable. I'm more prone to infection in that tooth and can literally feel the left tonsil starting to swell after ejaculating. It's only ever a problem after ejaculation

Another thing is that for a few days afterwards, I'm less intelligent, less coordinated, have a slower reaction time and feel tired in general. I understand this can be attributed to abnormally high levels of prolactin, but is there another piece of story missing? Could it have something to do with dopamine too?

Does anyone here understand what's going on? Can anyone relate? Any solutions?

144/  http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic95403.html

that was my question... i kinda feel that masterbation is a drug to me... i have to do it to feel free and relaxed. it surely tires me out and since i'm a teen i do this after school.. i find that i can't concentrate after maturbating and i can't focus at all. pls help...


145/ http://www.consultation.ayurvediccure.com/why-do-i-get-fever-after-i-masturbate/#comments

Why do I get fever after I masturbate?
I am a 19 y/old male from the Philippines. I never had this problem before but it seems like its always happening now. What could be the indications of this? What should I do? should I stop masturbating? I hope you could take time to answer my question.. Thank you…

[Answer :  Long term over masturbation not only decreases the immunity of urogenital system but it causes weakness and loss of immunity in whole body ....
So we recommend you to use Shilajit /i]... ]

Shilajit informations :
http://www.wordpress.rudramani.com/2009/01/04/shilajit/

146/  http://forums.about.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?tsn=1&nav=messages&webtag=ab-menopause&tid=1448

Hi, I am 30 years old.  liked to ask, after having sex, I always got a fever, seems like I'm not feeling well. My boyfriend likes to having sex more than an hour, he is quiet hard to get orgasm. What's wrong with my body? Is it normal to having sex as long as we had? ( I was too tired after that:( ). Somebody help me please???


147/ http://ehealthforum.com/health/topic76466.html

Nausea After Orgasm
It used to happen only once in awhile, but it seems recently that everytime I achieve orgasm I feel nauseated. It doesn't matter if I orgasm because of sex or masturbation--still the same result. Also a new recent thing is after orgasming I instantly become really depressed and feel like i'm going to cry. Has anyone come across this problem or knows what it is?

148/ same link


I've had the same thing for 3 years, ever since I had surgery for an ovarian cyst. I've been to so many doctors about this and no one will help. I feel very depressed. But here's what I found out works for me.

I take an advil[ an hour before sexual activity /color], then, right after having an orgasm, I take an antacid.

This leaves me with absolutely no pain or nausea. Unfortunately, if I forget, or take the pain reliever too soon before sex, or too early, I feel sick for the next few days.

Does anybody know what kind of a doctor could treat this? I'd rather not take painkillers for the rest of my life.

ADVIL = ANTI-INLAMMATORY ,


149/ same link


the same....
i have the same problem! well i am only 17. but every time that i hit orgasm, i feel sick to my stomach, i get lightheaded (and a couple times i have actually passed out), i get weak, i sometimes get depressed, but heres the really strange thing.... it takes almost 4 days for me to feel a little better! i dont know what the heck this is! i want to find out....

some people have told me that it could be my blood pressure, some told me that it is my adrenaline still racing.... i dont know! i just want to find an answer so my boyfriend and i can have some sence of relief if it isnt something that i was born with, etc..

150/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/feeling_sick_after_masterbating_t129093.html

feeling sick after masterbating
few weeks ago i masterbated and felt sick afterwards , like dizzy weak,lightheaded ,heart was beating very fast,fekt very hot inside, what do you think it was, i do get panic attacks sometimes, could i have had that ,what was it


151/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/viewtopic.php?p=735482#735482

Exact same problem, and I have suggestions and leads.

I am now 47, condition started after abstaining from sex for 3 years at age of 34. I read a complete article about 5-6 hormones that are released during orgasm, one of which induces fatigue ... but, mine lasts for 3-4 days!! To me, more satisfying experiences create LESS fatigue. I am also a pre-mature ejaculator, so it is not the physical effort. The frequency of ejaculation does not matter, I often sleep 12 hours after ejaculation. I also discovered that ginger reduces the effect. Also SSRI depression drugs minimize the effect. I have also noticed that encounters which do not result in ejaculation do not cause this fatigue ... at all!!! so I am sure it is due to the hormons released during ejaculation.

GINGER

152/ http://www.justanswer.com/questions/2jdb3-ejaculate-during-sex-feverish?r=billbob393

Question
after I ejaculate during sex I have feverish symptom, prolong tiredness and weekness to the point that If ihave sex and ejaculate within the next 24 hrs the feelings worsen and I begin to experience some runny nose. A year ago my urine test revealed light trace of blood but a subsequent prostate exam was negative. I also have also been having some recurring low back pain on the left side ( moves from the bottom of the lung area to my hip bones) although xray , an endoscopy and a colonoscopy) have not found anything. I believe that all the symptoms are related.Please help.

153/ http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/mens-health-forum/cortisol-4x-saliva-testosterone-134262256.html

The strange thing about my adrenal fatigue symptoms is that it only happens 1-2 days after an orgasm.

The 3-7 days after orgasm I feel good(No chronic fatigue) and can train intensely in hard combat sport in boxing and can manage 2 hours np and socialise but the 1-2 days after orgasm I experience :

Muscle & joint pain
Overall body inflammation
Digestive problems
overall exhaustion
migraines
hot & cold symptoms
depression
Feel like sleeping all day dispite having 9-10 hour sleep

Its impossible for me to do the boxing training the 1-2 days after orgasm but walking is ok.

At one point I was sleeping in for 12-14 hours the night after orgasm. This was when POIS was at its worst and the symptoms would last 5-7 days.

154/ http://forums.wrongdiagnosis.com/showthread.php?p=192944

I am experiencing the same problem. To get to the point, these are some symptoms that I have had for more than 1 year:

1. I had a fever about 2 days after sex
2. On my third time having sex with the same woman, I could immediatley feel burning/tingling sensation in my thighs, even when I am not sitting down.
3. For first several days, it felt like something was swimming inside my body from my waist to my mid body, my neck, and my head. I also had tingling sensation in my throat.
4. I took antibiotics several times, but it only reduced the fever.
5. I continued to have burning/tingling sensation in my thighs and buttocks, but only when I am sitting down.
6. I tried jock itch spray but it only reduced the symptoms for several days, then the symptoms came back full force.
7. I tried taking salt bath but it only offered brief relief.
8. My infectious disease doctor prescribed me Flagyl, but it only reduced the symptoms for 2-3 days, then the symptoms came back full force.
9. During this time, it felt like some feather duster organism was swimming inside my body. I continued to have burning/tingling sensation in my thighs and buttock.
10. My doctor then prescribed my Acyclovir. I think this was after testing positive for Type I herpes. I tried it for a week then I started having tingling sensation in my upper lip, then a blister came out. Several days later, I started having throbbing nerve pain in my heart, left eye, top of my brain. Eventually, the nerve pain progressed to other parts of body, such as leg, hand, etc.
11. I endured much pain before calling my health insurance directly to have a spinal tap done. I had a very comprehensive blood test and spinal test. I even paid for my own semen test and stool test. Out of all the tests done, ONLY the blood test showed up as being positive for Type 1 Herpes. Spinal tap, stool test, semen test all showed up as negative.
12. My neurologist gave me Indomethacin but it almost killed me so quit taking it after 2 days.
13. I went to a herbal specialist and he prescribed me Ling Zhi. Three days later, all the nerver pains and swimming sensation in my upper body disappeared, even the severe headache.
14. The symptoms came back after a month on Ling Zhi. The headache reduced about 90%.
15. My doctor then prescribed me Nystatin. After two weeks on Nystatin, all prickly nerve pain in my upper body disappeared. My doctor finally concluded that I did not have Herpes because there was no physcial signs of it. I went to many doctors! He also explained that Herpes does not have signs of persistent tingling/burning mucles/nerve pain in the groin, thigh and buttock. Furthermore, if I had herpes in my central nervous system, I would be dead.

16. ***Here are some tests that I have done***
a. eat candy or food with high sugar or cafine
b. eat fruits with high sugar
c. self masturbate
(What do you get when you try the above tests?)

17. Now, all the doctors have sent me home saying that I have NOTHING. On one beautiful day, I made a self discovery which has lead me closer to a cure. The intense and persistent buring/tingling sensation in my thighs and buttock are 85% gone. It has now been 1 1/2 years.

Do you want to know the answer?

155/ (woman) http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090709175518AArlS9a

After you have sex, are you supposed to feel sick?
I'm a female and me and me bf didnt use proctection but we didnt insert his you know wat into my you know wat. Like one minute after i felt immediatly sick and the days after im still feeling very tired, dizzy, not able too eat, backache, ect. Does this mean i'm pregnant? And could have the pre-ejaculation made its way up there? I'm very worried and were not emotionally ready for a child.

1min => step 1
several days => step 2

156/ http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?showtopic=12093

On the other hand, for 3-5 days after ejaculating, i would feel so weak, so vulnerable around other people, and get into these funks where, i felt i had no purpose in life, just utter lack of motivation. So, after some searching around i found this site, and the concept of retention.


157/ http://kinseyconfidential.org/fatigue-day-after-sex/

What Might Cause Fatigue The Day After Sex?
QUESTION: My wife and I have sex once or twice a week. For the past few years, we’ve both been getting extremely tired after sex. It makes us feel as though we’re unable to carry out our daily work efficiently the next day. What can we do to overcome this?

158/ http://forums.obgyn.net/womens-health/WHF.9904/0311.html

pain the day after orgasm
I am asking this question on behalf of my daughter. She is 33, and has had 2 children. A year ago she had a laparoscopic examination for abdominal pain and an adhesion was cut which solved the problem. For the last 6 months she has had pain in her legs and abdominal area the day after experiencing orgasm. This happens whether or not there is intercourse. There is no pain at the time. 3 Ibuprofen can alleviate the pain, but she is concerned at this level of medication. Her gynecologist has recommended a hysterectomy as the only cure as he believes the problem is in stretched ligaments. We hope that someone may have an alternative suggestion.

159/ http://www.psychforums.com/sexuality/topic26287.html

Hi, I'm 26 years old and believe I have a major problem when it comes to masterbating and sex which I hope someone here can help me with.

As long as I can remember back right after masterbation I've become overly tired, grumpy, emotional, even depressed to the point where I cannot function properly and I become a different person. I've found it to take generally 3 to 4 days before I can get my physical energy level back to normal. This also happens when I have sex. Normally, it happens 20 minutes after I ejaculate. I fall into this routine over and over again. Ejaculation equals over all bodily weakness for me for a few days.
It affects my body and screws up my emotions for a few days... My energy, how I'm able to focus and I also become slower and much weaker PHYSICALLY.

Now, I love sex as much as the next fella, but sometimes I've had to put it off knowing I need to focus the next day and be on top of my game, so I better not have sex or masterbate Because I know that I will have to pay the price if I do.

160/ Same topic

Hi i experience exactly the same thing as what you described. have you found any solutions??

161/ Same topic

I'm so glad I found this topic. Finally, someone who can relate to my own problem instead of convincing me that I'm just having trouble to accept my sexuality! This information is really helpful to me.

162/ http://www.justanswer.com/questions/2u79r-i-am-67-years-of-age-and-female-i-have-a-history-of-diabetes

I am 67 years of age and female. I have a history of diabete. and high blood pressure. When I have sex with my husband, I have this burning pain in my feet. It is unbearable and sometime I have to stop the action. It does not hurt in the vagina, but the motion causes that reaction in my feet. Afterwards the sensation has been in feet for several days. Is it that something is wrong with my vagina or is a nervous condition? Please help me I don't know how much longer I can take this. Thank you. Dorothy

163/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20091224182816AADvpID

Tired after ejaculation and the day after?
I am 15year old boy. I started masturbating 6months ago.I feel very tired after masturbating.I really want to know if it is normal to feel tired and sleepy the DAY AFTER!!! masturbating.See this is my big problem because i masturbate everyday Only once before going to bed and i feel extremley tired and weak at school and i would want to go to sleep. Could you guys tell me if i need medical treatment or is there something wrong with me???? This is very important to me because my friends keep telling me that i look really tired.

164/ http://veryrarestuff.com/tag/exhausted

I just discovered that I have very rare syndrom (some call it Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome). After I ejaculate I have brain fog, I feel mentally and physically exhausted for a week or longer and if i don’t prevent myself from masturbating I will constantly have brain fogness, low energy, tongue tied… How did I discover this? Ever since I started masturbating (5th grade) I’ve been living a life in confusion. Now I’m 22 and last spring I started experimenting – trying not to masturbate for as longer as possible. After 2 weeks without it, I felt that energy was built up and I had incredible drive to do things, think clearly, talk to ppl easily. I simply felt normal. And I can destroy that collected energy with 1or 2 masturbations. Later I heard that Eastern Philosophies talk about connection between energy and masturbation. The worst thing is that I’m an artist and I can’t do good artwork after I masturbate. I think that my condition ruined my life and I’ve never had a girlfriend.

165/ http://forums.plentyoffish.com/datingPosts13714168.aspx

About two hours after I have an orgasm, I get a stuffy nose and a headache. I then feel like I'm living in a haze for the next week or so. I have problems concentrating and remembering things, and I get real irritable, until in about two weeks I'm back to normal again. The doctor says I have "Post-Orgasmic Illness Syndrome". Her solution to my problem is for me to abstain from sex.
She says that I shouldn't engage in any form of sexual activity to avoid any form of arousal unless I just want to deal with the "hangover" afterwards. This hangover can be quite debilitating, especially if I need my brain to be halfway reliable.
Anyone else heard of this and know of anything I can do to curtail these symptoms and have a normal sex-life?

166/ http://www.empowher.com/community/ask/pain-back-legs-knees-after-sex?page=2

I have severe pain running down the backs of both legs (from my sitting bones down hamstrings) & knees after having sex. When I sit, it's dull & not as bad, but when I'm up it is awful! It starts within minutes of finishing sex and lasts at least half a day. Have never had this problem before. I am pregnant if that makes any difference, but haven't had this issue with past pregnancies. It's taking the fun out of having sex with my husband. Is there anything I can do to avoid or at least ease the pain?

167/ http://www.steadyhealth.com/Tired_after_ejaculation_t106407_st20.html

I am 22 and I also have this problem where I feel tired/weak/lazy/down/upset/sad for about 1 week after sex and this definately affects my workout routines, the way I talk to people, the way I dress, and the way I act around people. It's horrible especially when your gf wants sex all the time. It also sucks b/c as you people said, it feels like you're missing out on life. Like I want to sleep around with other girls too you know.
I have not found out what works. The only thing I found out is abstaining from both masterbation and sex, that's all. That's the only thing which makes me happy, feel strong, active, smart, dress well, look good, etc.

168/ http://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100402131524AAcSyP0

Weakness after masturbation?
i am 18, i feel week after masturbation and feel tired and feverish for 2 days after that i find it difficult 2 concentrate and have a boggeled mind
how 2 recover ? is it normal?

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jo58 on 25/01/2008 22:16:00
Hi Jim. I haven't tested any meds yet, I would like to get medical advice first (I have an appointment in a few days). Same answer for bloodtests.

You don't mention beta blockers, although they are quoted in page one of this thread. Has anybody tested these?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 26/01/2008 08:39:52
My problem is I just don't know which doctor I should consult...

I guess that is the real problem after all. I think there are no doctors that specialise in our deficiency.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 26/01/2008 08:43:11
You don't mention beta blockers, although they are quoted in page one of this thread. Has anybody tested these?

Very dangerous. They make you physicaly dependent on drugs that may actually kill you. My doctor (neurologist) did not want to give them to me.

Without clear indication that it would work I would stay away from these as fas as I can.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 26/01/2008 08:44:51
H =0
Everything normal.

H+1 to H+1:30
Feeling of anxiety.
I feel a strange burning/oppressed feeling when breathing, like I've just been bathing in cold seawater (I must say it's very hard to describe).
My temperature rises to about 37.5°C. I feel great warmth over all my body.
My breathing gets heavier.

H+3
I awake with the same symptoms as above, only worse. Anxiety is close to panic. I realize that this episode is probably the most severe I've ever had - probably because the orgasm I experienced was sensibly longer and more intense than usual.
My temperature has dropped to 37.5°C.
Nausea.

D+1 (morning)
I have a hard time getting up - I wake up and fall back to sleep repeatedly.
The oppressed feeling during breathing is still there. I feel like a weight on my chest.
My face in general and mouth in particular feel very tense, almost making it difficult to talk.
I feel terribly tired during breakfast, exhausted actually.

D+1 (rest of the day)
Physical activity seems to be highly demanding. I avoid the staircases, even walking is difficult.
I can do my work, but it's a very, very, uncomfortable day. I lose my concentration now and then.
Back home in the evening, my temperature is back to normal (slightly below 37°)

D+2
Like D+1, it's hard to get out of bed, and even harder to get wide awake.
I feel terribly tired, exhausted, making me irritable, hardly sociable.
However, I don't feel even half as bad as on D+1, although breathing still feels difficult.

D+3
Same as D+2, just slightly better

D+4 (today)
Things are almost back to normal, except that I'm really, really tired.


By the way seems like a good description of POIS. Especially the fact that the second day is the hardest is very indicative.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 26/01/2008 08:54:48
I few years ago I took amino acids for thyroid support, way too much, and that is when my POIS started.  I probably burned out my thyroid by accident. 

A further indication that POIS is related to thyroid disfunction.

How are your eyes? According to the "program for better vision" glaucoma is also caused by thyroid disfunction.

Anyway there is supposed to be a simple test you can use to determine wether you have a thyroid disfunction. The "Cambridge Institute" seems to have more information about it (http://www.program-for-better-vision.com/).
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 26/01/2008 16:30:39
as you will see they are not strictly identical to those posted here before.

Yes POIS seems to be like the show "heroes". At first the symptoms seem to be somewhat unrelated. But after you read some more up on it, and you know what to look out for, the red line through the story becomes clear.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 27/01/2008 17:20:52
hi folks

interested here again: I am still interested! I have a question - actually a few questions! - for all you men out there, would love honest answers if possible. 

Do you project - subconsciously or consciously - your suffering on your partner after orgasm? Do you have negative feelings towards this person afterwards? Somehow feel that this person is to blame for the suffering? Avoid this person? And if so, how long / to what extent?

I am trying desperately to understand this horrible phenomenon: being a woman, I am sort of on the receiving end of it and am a bit baffled at the moment.

Thanks a lot!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jo58 on 27/01/2008 20:40:17
My problem is I just don't know which doctor I should consult...

I guess that is the real problem after all. I think there are no doctors that specialise in our deficiency.

I'll be seeing a sexologist in a few days. I'll keep you updated...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 27/01/2008 22:12:08
Interested, I don't recall having negative feelings like this, my reaction was fear not anger. But the distance created when I couldn't discuss the truth about what was happening was definately a wedge.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 28/01/2008 11:14:00
hi John

a wedge that drives people apart?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: B_Jim on 28/01/2008 13:51:50
169/  http://forums.plentyoffish.com/datingPosts13714168.aspx

About two hours after I have an orgasm, I get a stuffy nose and a headache. I then feel like I'm living in a haze for the next week or so. I have problems concentrating and remembering things, and I get real irritable, until in about two weeks I'm back to normal again. The doctor says I have "Post-Orgasmic Illness Syndrome". Her solution to my problem is for me to abstain from sex.

She says that I shouldn't engage in any form of sexual activity to avoid any form of arousal unless I just want to deal with the "hangover" afterwards. This hangover can be quite debilitating, especially if I need my brain to be halfway reliable.

170/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100509230933AA3tQmS

I feel weak and tired for 2-3 days after ejaculation?
If I have sexual activity without ejaculation I feel fine so it has nothing to do with position or the energy expended in the sex act.

What should I do? I take a general vitamin everyday but it doesn't help.

171/ http://www.healthboards.com/boards/archive/index.php/t-89433.html

Fariha ... your symptoms are really right... i am really not able to concentrate on my studies and my life is becoming miserable day by day.. absent mindedness is killing me and i am suffering a lot.. can u suggest me something to come out this mess tht i have made out of myself

172/ http://www.girlsaskguys.com/Sexuality-Questions/60702-question-about-being-feverish-after-an-orgasm.html

Question about being feverish after an orgasm
I've been in a serious relationship for a while and we've recently started having sex. The problem is I feel really sick afterwards (not 'disgusting' sick) but I feel like a switch has been turned on somewhere and I suddenly develop a flu immediately after getting an orgasm. I get muscle aches, my joints ache and I get high fever which won't go away until days afterwards. It doesn't happen every single time I orgasm but it's happened 3 times already and it has me worried. I enjoy sex but sometimes knowing that I'd possibly feel horrible afterwards makes me not want to do it. Does anyone else feel the same way I do after sex?

173/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20060909201832AAOR1qb

I get sick when I masturbate.?
Plz only answer if youre going to serious and KNOW WHAT YOURE TALKING ABOUT!!! Every time I masturbate I get gas, aches, diarrhea, somtimes I get hot, headaches and sweaty. I'm 15.

174/ http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100725230005AALfL3g

Sick feeling after masturbating?
Almost every time I masturbate I feel sick afterwards. I will get a headache and feel really nauseous. I thought maybe I was doing it too fast so I started making it last longer before I came but it didn't help any. It isn't EVERY time, but about 80% of the time it happens. Does this happen to anyone else? or do you know why it would be happening?

175/ http://cure-erectile-dysfunction.org/tired-after-ejaculation-or-sex/105#comment-652

Tired after ejaculation or sex
hi,
i've been masturbating since i was 10 and i'm 23 now so that makes 13 years straight. i started having problems lately, whenever i ejaculate or have sex i will get extremely tired and weak, i mean really really weak - my joints will ache all day and it is like the ejaculating ruins my whole day and even the days after when i will feel also somehow weak. it only betters after a weak of abstinence but when i ejaculate i feel anxious and disharmoniously unhappy so that makes me masturbate even more it's so ugly! i am not a doctor but i consider myself smart enough to understand that there is something wrong with my hormones, perhaps i'm testosterone defficient ? i don't suffer weak erections but i ejaculate very fast.
thank you in advance
   
176/ http://www.boost-your-low-testosterone.com/tired-weak-after-ejaculation.html

I have found your information great, thanks. I have also been getting some benefit from maca powder.
However, I notice that after sex and I ejaculate, I feel really weak and tired.
I lose my sexual power for days, and my genitals get cold.
Also my heart feels weak, and it races.
I am 46 years old.
Are these symptoms of deficient testosterone and elevated estrogen levels?

177/ http://en.allexperts.com/q/Urology-Male-issues-989/post-ejaculatory-symptoms.htm

Joint Pain & Fever After Ejaculation
Thank you for taking the time to read and answer my question.  For the past few years, when I ejaculate (whether through intercourse or masturbation), I have been noticing some pain in my knees and lower back.  I am relatively sure it doesn't happen each time but it happens more than enough for it to be a problem.  The pain isn't enough to prevent me from any activity but it is definitely uncomfortable.  The pain lasts anywhere from 30 minutes to around an hour.
A few weeks back, a light bulb went off in my head and I realized the pain felt similar to the body aches I had when I was sick.  I decided to take my temperature and it was 99.6 degrees.  This appears to be a trend as I have taken my temperature several other times when I'm feeling these aches after ejaculation and it is always in the 99-100 degree range.
Is it normal for someone to experience a fever and the body aches associated with a fever after ejaculation?  I have searched around the Internet and I haven't seen any other postings about these symptoms.  If it is not normal, could it be a possible sign of something more serious?  What do you suggest I do?

178/ http://en.allexperts.com/q/Urology-Male-issues-989/post-ejaculatory-symptoms.htm

post ejaculatory symptoms
am a 52 yr old male. At age 32, I had left epididymitis, which resulted in atrophy of the L testicle. The testicle does not seem to have changed recently.I have been treated for prostatis periodically since that episode.

My current issue involves post- ejaculatory pain & other symptoms. For the past 8 months, I have experienced the following Sx for 5-7 days after ejaculation:
- frequency, dysuria, hesitancy, nocturia
- low grade pain in pelvic area & left testicle.(3-5 on
 a scale of 10)
- low grade nausea
- night sweats, low grade fever
- malaise
- urethral and bladder tenderness to palpation
- at times, the whole pelvis area feels "on fire"

The symptoms seem to resolve after 7-10 days.
I have been through a 30 day course of Levaquin, as well as Flomax. The symptoms resolved by 80% while on the antibiotic, but have since returned. I remain on the Flomax.

This may not be related, but (through a process of elimination) I have found that the symptoms are exacerbated by NSAIDS and aspirin. I have L3-S2 epidural injections for lower back pain q 4-6 months.

CBC is normal, TSH is normal, PSA is low, UA shows a few WBCs, significant RBCs, and epithelial cells. I have been monogamous for 35 years, and RPR/VDRL are neg.

179/ http://www.cafemom.com/group/416/forums/read/12259161/Postorgasmic_illness_syndrome?next=1#replies

My husband swears he has this.. or hes allergic to me.. He gets sick every time we have sex. also when he jacks off.. he gets a coongested head and gets very very snotty... and drained of energy... Any one elese???? Or am i the only 1 with a weird husband?? If it helps my husband is bipolar
___________________________________________________________________


High concentration of catecholamines is present in sperm :

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1046/j.1439-0272.2001.00461.x

"In conclusion, noradrenaline and DOPA are present in human semen at concentrations that are much higher than maximal normal values in plasma."

Noradrenaline : 19 times more than concentration in plasma
Dopa : 2 times

180/ http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/post_orgasmic_illness_syndrome

Ever since those days, though, I've suffered from post-orgasmic illness syndrome. It is a living hell. After ejaculating, I feel hot, have hot flashes, feel nearly retarded, have flulike chills and body aches and break out in a terrible rash. Oh, and extreme, extreme fatigue.

Now, even before I ever did a cycle, I experienced symptoms after orgasm, but most of them were mental, like fatigue and foggy head. Some hot flashes. But nothing like this.

I'm not even blaming the roads, but I do notice that my symptoms seem to have gotten worse after doing them.

Bud, that's part of the problem, I've gone to multiple docs and they all act like I'm crazy. They've tested my test levels and they're normal, and simply want to put me on an antidepressant, even though I'm not depressed, only very fatigued after sex. I've recently decided I have to find a solution to this on my own because I get no help elsewhere.


181/  http://www.dpselfhelp.com/forum/index.php?/topic/28657-i-enter-depersonalizationdepressionanxiety-for-days-after-ejaculating-what-the-hell-is-wrong-with-me/

I enter depersonalization/depression/anxiety for days after ejaculating. What the hell is wrong with me?

Who would I go to see about this specifically? What is this indicative of (maybe low testosterone and my body can't make enough to keep up/replace it? but I don't have a squeaky high voice, I do have body hair, etc. Or perhaps something dealing with the dopamine/serotonin/other chemicals that are released...)? I'm not sure how ejaculating from frequent sex would turn out, as I quite frankly haven't gotten any lately, but this is honestly ruining my life at this point. I don't want to have to live my life like a neutered monk or only ejaculate once every week or two weeks tops (it doesn't seem AS bad at that frequency) to ensure I don't have a meltdown. I can hold off in the meantime, but that seems neither like a happy nor long-term solution with a partner in the future.

I know it's normal to feel a little tired or low after ejaculating, but this is far from that. I literally get horrendous depersonalization, social anxiety, clouded thoughts, incoherent speech that does not feel like my own, lack of motivation, warped judgment, emptiness, you name it -- for DAYS. In short, I totally lose my "self." Is there a such thing as a sex doctor who can treat this kind of crap? Any serious replies are welcome. I'm desperate because I've now realized it's a serious, life-altering problem that fundamentally changes who I am and makes it a hell of a job to function and socialize at even a basic level.

P.S. As far as "talk to a doctor," I actually have no health insurance currently (getting it in October) so I was coming here for starters to see if anyone knew what this specifically sounded like. Also, I'm not religious or anything that would make this merely some sort of severe guilt issue with watching porn. I've additionally tried masturbating (to porn, yes) WITHOUT climaxing, and none of this happens, suggesting it may strictly be an issue with ejaculation and its associated chemicals.

I know the relationship with sex and DP has probably been discussed, but I will love you forever if you have any specific leads, info, or personal experiences with the specific problem I'm talking about. Thank you all in advance.


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/01/2008 22:14:51
Demografx : You should ask your doctor more infos for Levitra.


Why? Levitra has cured 50%+ of my POIS !
And it helps libido. But not enough, as testosterone did.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/01/2008 22:28:27
SEXUAL/RELIGIOUS UPBRINGING

I may be going far afield, but since no one has complete answers yet (except for Levitra - for me), I'll try another avenue to POIS.

I was taught for years in parochial school how "sex is dirty" and "sinful".

Does anyone else think it's worth pursuing this possibility? i.e., that early sex teachings can contribute to POIS?

Also, this was coupled with years of corporal punishment. Maybe the combination of physical abuse plus poor sex education?

I'd like to hear from others.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/01/2008 22:30:41
WELCOME to all the newcomers!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/01/2008 22:38:23
My problem is I just don't know which doctor I should consult...

I guess that is the real problem after all. I think there are no doctors that specialise in our deficiency.

It would be great to find ANY doctor who has even HEARD of our symptoms before!! Aside from one European doctor, there is no documentation of POIS.

Unfortunately, it seems to be a very rare malady.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 29/01/2008 08:04:22
Do you project - subconsciously or consciously - your suffering on your partner after orgasm? Do you have negative feelings towards this person afterwards?

I believe there is a condition called post orgasmic anger disorder POAD (termed by me). This is a condition where a man gets very angry after orgasm. He feels he wants to hurt someone and often this anger is directed at the woman he is with. We have all heard of the man who kills his partner after sex. Historically these men have just been seen as bad people but neuro biologist need to look into this phenomena. These men need their own forum but many are probably in denial and dont want to talk about it.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 29/01/2008 21:29:14
hi bizzy

maybe
Do you project - subconsciously or consciously - your suffering on your partner after orgasm? Do you have negative feelings towards this person afterwards?

I believe there is a condition called post orgasmic anger disorder POAD (termed by me). This is a condition where a man gets very angry after orgasm. He feels he wants to hurt someone and often this anger is directed at the woman he is with. We have all heard of the man who kills his partner after sex. Historically these men have just been seen as bad people but neuro biologist need to look into this phenomena. These men need their own forum but many are probably in denial and dont want to talk about it.


hi bizzy

First of all, I would like to say that your posts are extremely interesting. Thanks!

Regarding the above: sorry, maybe I didn't express myself very well. It isn't a type of anger, or a feeling of violence. I don't feel threatened by it. It is more a lack of communication, sort of being ignored, since I am implicated in the suffering. I am told I am not to blame, which I essentially believe, and try to be supportive. Despite this, I find it hard to deal with, being on the receiving end of it. It passes, within a week or two, I am aware of that, but during the "episode" itself, I feel as if I am suffering almost as much as the actual sufferer.

Is there anything at all that can be done apart from waiting for it to pass? How do you men out there deal with your partners during these episodes?

Thanks a lot! I appreciate your honest views.

Interested.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 30/01/2008 06:13:16
Hi Interested

It seems your partner has POIS symptoms as described by others on this forum. Women tend to feel comfortable with attention so it is understandable why you feel like a victim.
I think this is a condition that somewhat responds to antidepressants. There are many different antidepressants on the market with many different side-effects. I recommend a tricyclic antidepressant called nortriptyline prescribed by your healthcare professional.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 31/01/2008 04:01:33


Hi all,

wonderful to see this thread so buoyant. I do hope that discusssion here somewhat leads to a resolution for you.

It's worth mentioning of course that any recommendation for a drug of any sorts requires discussion with your Doctor, whom I imagine would be the one to prescribe it anyway.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: antman on 31/01/2008 20:00:13
Hi everybody I'm just touching base to see if anything new has developed, I feel relatively lucky reading some of your stories, I noticed a thread relating to food earlier, and just wanted to mention that if I binge on carbohydrates in the 48 hours after sex, then this tends to increase the fatigue, however, I'm unsure if this is just the digestive process.  Whilst I'm still suffering with some of my symptoms my lifestyle has changed radically in the last 2 years, depression and anxiety is radically reduced, I've put this down to removing my self from stressful environments, trying not to mix with other depressives and removing my self from the doom and gloom of the media, however the fatigue still persists, but I now drink lots of coffee, which kick starts me in the afternoon. I find that if frequency is more than once every 5 days other symptoms seem to kick in. I suffered very badly with this illness through out my teens and twenty's, due to, I think a libido that required sex a lot more than once a week but as I've gotten older this has reduced and its symptoms have become more subtle, although my joints still crack the 48 hours after sex and the fatigue slows me down. Hope this helps the cause. Best wishes to you all antman.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nobody007 on 04/02/2008 22:01:05
Looks like not only me having this kinda of problems.  For me, after ejaculation which occurs while sleeping: my eyes are tired, the body feels weak, afraid of cold, cold feet, sore back and spinal cord, diarrhea, gets hungry fast, can't concentrate, white tongue,  don't feel like moving around or get bothered and it goes on for 1 to 2 weeks. Even I take Multi-vitamins,still no help. It's been so many years and I start to hating this thing. I went to see so many doctors and they said, don't worry its normal and you will be fine, but mean while I feel like ....  Its stopping me from getting a g/f, go out talk to people, rejecting others and social. I tired to a void everything and not to think about it, but still some how it always comes back. mt life is screwed. Is there any solutions for this?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 04/02/2008 23:58:07
Hi Nobody007, I know where you are at my friend and it sucks. All I can suggest is keep your mind clean of sexual imagry and try to stay chaste. You could try abstaining from milk products, I believe that it helps me although I don't know why. I hope you get some more ideas here, but as you can tell it is a unusual condition.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 05/02/2008 03:19:05
TO NOBODY007

I empathize with you greatly, it is a dastardly malady! Re-read all the posts here and you might find something to talk to your doctor about trying.

There is no uniform solution yet. This Forum is probably the most advanced "solution" but has no specific treatment. I feel fortunate though, that there is at least a place to go and be part of a vanguard for POIS.

Best wishes to you going forward. I "stumbled" on Levitra for myself. It cures 50% of my POIS sysmptoms but this treatment should be tested carefully with a doctor. Someone on the internet pointed out that Levitra may be harmful to the heart if you don't actually need it for what it's primarily prescribed for: ED (erectile dysfunction).

If I were not actively involved in this Forum, I might not have paid close attention to the difference in my POIS symptoms upon taking Levitra.

So perhaps much more relief will be found by you and others simply by reading posts here and becoming more acutely aware of what can help or eliminate YOUR POIS symptoms!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nobody007 on 05/02/2008 05:10:24
Another thing I have notice is that after ejaculation and few hours later my testicles sweats and cold. My mouth dries so fast and the heat keeps coming up. then, the next day, feeling cold and hot. so weird.  By the way, If I don't ejaculate everything, then i will be fine. So, I guess I the recovery time is too slow ? In addition, all my body joints are making sounds, its like theirs no fluid. Is there a way to increase the recovery time? it seems maybe there's not enough sperm or whatever that thing is in the testicles. I'm just so freaking depressed right now.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 06/02/2008 17:21:56
I recently stopped testosterone injections, 1) it didn't help POIS and 2) it's a pain in the neck running to nurses every 2 weeks and 3) it's controversial - some say it's dangerous, can lead to prostate cancer, so constant monitoring is not fun.

I agree testosterone injections do not work for either POIS or major depression. In my experience the very first injection of testosterone does relieve POIS and major depression. But only for about a week before tolerance settles in. I think this happens because the hypothalamus wants to restore the higher stress hormone balance. This act to compensate for the increased testosterone takes about a week.
Testosterone therapy for mild to medium depression is controversial and variable. Some people will gain great benefit and some people only some. Some people will worsen and become more poorly. Also the long term adverse effects are variable too. Some people will become more healthy and some people not. Some people will loose health they already have.
It appears that the benefits of supplementary testosterone with regards to mental health depend greatly on your genetic preposition.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/02/2008 00:35:39
Bizzy, it does wonders for my libido, but it's just too much effort/risk.

Besides, more libido = more POIS!!!!!

(even with my 50% cure, "who needs it?" is my current attitude)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/02/2008 00:44:16
NOBODY007, I hope you're feeling less depressed by now! If less amount of sperm released helps your POIS, there is a technique that I tried. A  book written by Mantak Chia, "Taoist Secrets of Love: Cultivating Male Sexual Energy" has the technique. But lowering sperm release didn't work for me. A doctor told me it's not the sperm but what the ejaculation effect has on the nervous system. Amazon link to the book (you can buy it used for $6.74)
http://www.amazon.com/Taoist-Secrets-Love-Cultivating-Sexual/dp/0943358191/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1202431233&sr=1-2

ps - for several years I believed Mantak Chia was describing POIS and it's cure! (5,000 year old Asian Taoist philosophy: Loss of sperm (chi) = energy depletion. Cure = no sperm loss) But it just didn't work for me.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: interested on 08/02/2008 20:22:12
hi nobody

sorry to hear you are feeling so miserable right now, i have no answers: indeed i only have questions, in the hope of understanding this horrible thing.

what do you mean by "if i don't ejaculate everything"? can you / do you have any influence over this? if i remember correctly, you talked about nocturnal emissions only. could you explain this to me please? thank you! interested.

Another thing I have notice is that after ejaculation and few hours later my testicles sweats and cold. My mouth dries so fast and the heat keeps coming up. then, the next day, feeling cold and hot. so weird.  By the way, If I don't ejaculate everything, then i will be fine. So, I guess I the recovery time is too slow ? In addition, all my body joints are making sounds, its like theirs no fluid. Is there a way to increase the recovery time? it seems maybe there's not enough sperm or whatever that thing is in the testicles. I'm just so freaking depressed right now.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 09/02/2008 14:46:38
Bizzy, it does wonders for my libido, but it's just too much effort/risk.

Testosterone does have the effect of boosting libido soon after injection. But continued use of testosterone makes your testicles shrink and destroys your libido. You may think this is strange as testosterone is a sex hormone but you have to bare in my mind that it is supplementary. Supplementary injected testosterone has the affect of suppressing the bodys own testosterone production.
There are drugs that raise your bodies own testosterone production but they carry a risk of depression.
Testosterone withdrawl carries a risk of depression.

Are you sure the testosterone did wonders for your libido over the long-term ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 09/02/2008 22:19:16
Bizzy, very interesting! I didn't stick around for the longterm, maybe 3-4 months at most before I quit. But now I feel better that I quit. And maybe that explains why my libido is even lower than before...the suppression effect. You sound like you are in the medical field, are you?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 10/02/2008 01:11:20
Bizzy, very interesting! I didn't stick around for the longterm, maybe 3-4 months at most before I quit. But now I feel better that I quit. And maybe that explains why my libido is even lower than before...the suppression effect. You sound like you are in the medical field, are you?

I would say that 3-4 months is quite a long time. It will take some while before your body fully restores its own testosterone production
My posts may make it seem that I am in the medical field but I am not. I have been reading about depression and steroids for over 15 years. My posts will hopefully bring about more posts leading to an even more understanding in this area.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: El Stonio on 10/02/2008 04:43:18
Hi Everyone,
I have good news.  I have been masturbating for at least 20 mins everyday without ejaculating and my symptoms have almost disappeared.  Now I"m just naturally tired like anyone after orgasming.  I am also using Remeron (7.5 mgs) for sleep and tapering down to less than 5 mgs of paxil.  Very good decision.  Sleep much improved.  Happy glad handing everyone.  I hope it works for you.  Oh, I'm also eating high protein either before or after, which helps me too.
El Stonio
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 10/02/2008 16:38:56
If your problem is post ejaculation how could refraining from ejaculating possibly help?

Glad to hear you are lowering your Paxil, I hope you get off it like I did. If you do stop taking it DO IT GRADUALLY!! I still have pulsatile tinnitus and the occasional "zaps" many years later because I withdrew too quickly from this drug. There are many personal accounts on the web about adverse Paxil withdrawl.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/02/2008 18:41:26
Hi Everyone,
I have good news.  I have been masturbating for at least 20 mins everyday without ejaculating and my symptoms have almost disappeared.  Now I"m just naturally tired like anyone after orgasming.  I am also using Remeron (7.5 mgs) for sleep and tapering down to less than 5 mgs of paxil.  Very good decision.  Sleep much improved.  Happy glad handing everyone.  I hope it works for you.  Oh, I'm also eating high protein either before or after, which helps me too.
El Stonio

Do you prevent ejaculating with your fingers pressing the area below?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/02/2008 18:45:58
Bizzy, very interesting! I didn't stick around for the longterm, maybe 3-4 months at most before I quit. But now I feel better that I quit. And maybe that explains why my libido is even lower than before...the suppression effect. You sound like you are in the medical field, are you?

I would say that 3-4 months is quite a long time. It will take some while before your body fully restores its own testosterone production
My posts may make it seem that I am in the medical field but I am not. I have been reading about depression and steroids for over 15 years. My posts will hopefully bring about more posts leading to an even more understanding in this area.

Bizzy, thank you very much, your posts are very helpful! I hope my testosterone production comes back ok. My urologist says it could take 6-12 months.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/02/2008 18:49:38
Well, I just took Levitra and had a release. Even though Levitra works with at least 50% improvement for my POIS, I'm dreading the other 50%. I'm going to take my psychiatrist's advice and expect very little of myself over the next few days.

POIS is a scourge! A cruel malady! Let's all keep working together and wipe it off the planet!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/02/2008 19:03:45
Testosterone withdrawl carries a risk of depression.

BIZZY, would it make sense for me to go back to injections and taper off? I think I am feeling the withdrawal depression as you described.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 11/02/2008 13:07:33
BIZZY, would it make sense for me to go back to injections and taper off? I think I am feeling the withdrawal depression as you described.

I think you were taking clinical doses of testosterone rather than bodybuilding doses so tapering is not that important. I recommend an antidepressant to counter-act the depression.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/02/2008 18:12:27
Thank you very much [:)]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 12/02/2008 00:37:53
Hello my fellow POIS patients. I live in South Africa and masturbated a lot since age 9, and by age 12 it really became a problem. I had a lot of acne, and after ejaculation will have an almost oily skin texture. I was an athlete and found that orgasms also made me tired and short of breath. I became sexually active with partners at age 19.

I could not keep up with the demands of my girlfriends, and could never understand when I read in magazines that some couples do it a few times a day and a few days a week, plus they are feeling great.

I also did a lot of research, and found it has to do with hormonal imbalances.

Specifically the deficiency of DHEA is causing the problems. I found that by taking 50mg of DHEA after sex, and also a protein supplement called L-Tyrosine in the mornings, significantly reduces the symptoms.

Please consult your doctors about this, try it for yourselves and get back to me.

You will find that DHEA production is at its peak during puberty (when we start to masturbate), and decline rapidly after age 20 (when we really feel the effects of POIS).

I assume ejaculation / orgasm has something to do with blocking DHEA.

Cheers and good luck!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/02/2008 04:01:52
It's been 2 days since release and POIS is gone. Completely. Before Levitra, it was 3-4 days agony. And the symptoms are also not as severe. Besides the Levitra, I also rested heavily, alternating with caffeine and stimulants. All in all, not terrible at all as I feared in my last post. I can't say I'm happy/thrilled, but it's a  _great_ improvement over my lifetime history of POIS suffering.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/02/2008 04:10:13
ORGASM RESEARCH

Interesting article in the news yesterday

http://www.latimes.com/news/custom/scimedemail/la-he-orgasm11feb11,0,7196643.story

about nervous system/brain research on orgasm. They said it's just now starting to be understood. Some names in the article: Barry Komisaruk, Prof/author, Rutgers; Dr. Gert Holstege, Univ. of Groningen, Netherlands; Beverly Whipple, retired Rutgers, author of "Science of Orgasm".

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 14/02/2008 00:29:53
ORGASM RESEARCH

Interesting article in the news yesterday

http://www.latimes.com/news/custom/scimedemail/la-he-orgasm11feb11,0,7196643.story

about nervous system/brain research on orgasm. They said it's just now starting to be understood. Some names in the article: Barry Komisaruk, Prof/author, Rutgers; Dr. Gert Holstege, Univ. of Groningen, Netherlands; Beverly Whipple, retired Rutgers, author of "Science of Orgasm".






That's a fascinating article.

THANK YOU for posting the link.

I might actually incorporate it into a Science News Of the Day post in another thread here on the site.

THANKS for your ongoing support here.

Great Link


Neil
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 14/02/2008 15:57:02
Hi Demografx

I have a few questions regarding your Levitra therapy.
What dose are you using and when do you take it ?
Also are you getting any side-effects ?
Would you say it lessens depression ?

Also you mentioned that you take caffiene and stimulants to help you through POIS.
Caffiene has a very nasty neurosis type effect on me if I take it during POIS. I also avoid any stimulants as they have a similarly negative effect on my  mind.
I use an antidepressant to help me through the POIS period. It also lessens the duration of POIS for me.
The antidepressant I use is nortriptyline.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 15/02/2008 20:57:37
First of all, blood tests was done a day after orgasm. Doctor said I was fine. I thought "how the hell?" if I am feeling so tired but everything seems fine. Then after the doctor could not help me anymore, he suggested seeing a biofeedback scientist. Now those of you not familiar with biofeedback, it is a method to check your toxicity, hormones, pains and a lot of different things. They found staggering results. Everytime after an orgasm my "pathogen" level will rise. That is the things that attack your body when your immune system goes low. That includes worms, bacteria, bad enzymes etc. What makes you weak is actually the pathogens eating your proteien. That is the reason why we feel so tired on day 2.

OK, now the reason for the immune system going down has got to do with 3 main factors, all related. They are hormones, thyriod gland and endocrines.

If you have too much orgasms, your hormone levels go unstable. If you think about it, at puberty you start to get hormones. Hormones is very important for the full body development into adolescent > adult. With development I mean everything, from muscles, to nervous system, to blood pressure etc.

Now if you have masturebared as much as I did, then you have messed up the production of DHEA, which is the precursor prohormone to all other hormones, including testosterone, estrogen etc. DHEA is produced at the highest levels from age 9-20, and then steadily declines, and from age 25 onwards it is almost 25% of what it used to be.

Older men from age 40 have found DHEA supplements gave them a new found strength for life.

When you have an orgasm, you overstimulate the sex hormones to react to the adrenal gland, and also the dopamine neurotransmitter. 

It is like a drug, and if you have done it too much chances are you need help with drugs to bring things back to the same levels.

It has been proven than stimulants will make you feel better, or at least different, but it is still toxic. Caffeine, Methamphetamine, all those things will help you now, but you are going to it rock bottom some time again (just like a heroine addict > endocrine > dopamine).

The best is to first detox to get rid of pathogens. Take MSM each day, and a dewormer for startes. Then start drinking Tyrosine in the mornings, to rebuild the adrenal gland. And when you have an orgasm, take DHEA afterwards. It is very important to take it afterwards, as your hormone levels decline after an orgasm. There is really no use taking testosterone or DHEA before sex, it just changes the orgasm and depeletes the hormone levels again afterwards. 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 17/02/2008 23:14:14
Hi Demografx

I have a few questions regarding your Levitra therapy.
What dose are you using and when do you take it ?
Also are you getting any side-effects ?
Would you say it lessens depression ?

Also you mentioned that you take caffiene and stimulants to help you through POIS.
Caffiene has a very nasty neurosis type effect on me if I take it during POIS. I also avoid any stimulants as they have a similarly negative effect on my  mind.
I use an antidepressant to help me through the POIS period. It also lessens the duration of POIS for me.
The antidepressant I use is nortriptyline.

Bizzy, I take 10mg 1/2 hour before engaging in any sexual activity that can lead to orgasm (I'd like to take a higher dose but afraid of heart consequences I've read about, even though the source was a popular/general internet post about ED - I should repeat again here for everyone that if Levitra is NOT needed for ED then ask your doctor about possible heart complications - I don't have any medical credentials).

It has worked accidentally, after a lifetime of misery searching for a cure, I simply took it for the reason prescribed (ED). 50-60% of the POIS symptoms go away and the length of POIS time-to-recovery is dramatically reduced (about the same %).

I credit this Forum with a lot of the Levitra success, because after numerous activities here, posting and reading, it simply made me more acutely AWARE of symptoms, onset, improvements, etc.

To the extent that POIS symptoms cause depression (and they do with me) yes, the Levitra helps that as well. In addition, I'm on antidepressants and stimulants. They have worked well, after years of heavy, heavy down periods.

Our bodies may be different, because stimulants, including coffee, are key for me. Unfortunately, I tend to abuse caffeine, but better with than without. I don't understand how antidepressants can be used for POIS shorterm vs. on an ongoing basis, because they usually take weeks to build up in our systems to have an effect. But maybe yours is short-acting?

Again, Levitra was a bit of an "accidental miracle" bolstered by my active involvement in the POIS Forum. What a place! Don't know about you, but I can't tell you how many doctors, shrinks, therapists, onandon I've seen over the years - - they just don't have a CLUE what we're dealing with! But EVERYONE here does! Thanks for writing, Bizzy. Hope I answered your questions, and you've been very helpful here.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 18/02/2008 14:35:54
Isn't Levitra almost the same as Viagra?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vardenafil

Well you can drug and toxicate yourself with antidepressants, stimulants and erectile dysfunction pills for the rest of your life, definitely causing even more imbalances, or you can try to detox and come clean, try to stablise your nutrition.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 18/02/2008 17:43:42
Hallo

Just a quick questionaire to my fellow sufferers. If you can answer to the below symptoms please do so, I would like to narrow down the symptoms to possible diseases that I have read up about:


1)  lipodystrophy (fatty deposits like acne on face, back of neck, on collarbone area, between legs

2)   an asthma like breathless feeling after an orgasm

3)   inflammation

4)   blocked nose

5)   itchy skin, especially hands

6)   turn very red colour on chest after orgasm

7)   proximal muscle weakness (hips, shoulders)

8)   no urge for orgasm for the next hour, unless taken a stimulant

Please reply "yes" or "now" to the above symptoms to narrow down the disease.

Thanks
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 18/02/2008 23:00:34
HK1979, the only thing I relate to is "itchy hands" although mine are "dried up" especially FINGERTIPS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 20/02/2008 04:57:21
Well you can drug and toxicate yourself with antidepressants, stimulants and erectile dysfunction pills for the rest of your life, definitely causing even more imbalances, or you can try to detox and come clean, try to stablise your nutrition.

I'll stick to the former for now, but thanks anyway [;D]

hk1979, just curious, where did you get your medical degree?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 20/02/2008 16:21:43
Well here I go again, the urge hit one week later. So Levitra time again plus the usual (about an hour ago). This time I'll wait and see if anyone wants to know how I'm doing. Don't want to bore you silly with my diary LOL.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/02/2008 16:31:43
FIGHT POIS BY DOING NOTHING!

Yesterday (Day Zero POIS) I worked from bed. Right now, same thing. I know it's hard to do for most of us, but I wanted to post that, because if you CAN rest....conserving energy helps! I'm much better now than I would've been otherwise, following a busier routine. My psychiatrist said, "just don't expect much of yourself during POIS!"
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/02/2008 20:46:57
MY 75% CURE

As simple as it sounds, bedrest (but active: TV, computer, telephone, breaks at the piano, etc., plus the meds/coffee routine I described in detail in earlier posts) seems to bring my POIS "cure" up to 75%.

I stress this is just FOR ME, not necessarily for anyone else. And bedrest isn't practical for most of the world. However, CONSERVING ENERGY is necessary for POIS, which can induce lethargy and severe exhaustion. Unless your job is marathon running 24/7, I'm sure you can find ways to reduce the energy consumption level. I just want to share this news. And this Forum has been a most powerful ally.

This is the first excitement I've had in the 25+ YEARS of extreme frustration chasing the POIS cure in the vast "POIS desert" (I'm sure you all know what THAT means [;D] )

Best wishes to all. I wish a 100% cure for everyone.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 22/02/2008 13:19:18
MY 75% CURE
As simple as it sounds, bedrest (but active: TV, computer, telephone, breaks at the piano, etc., plus the meds/coffee routine I described in detail in earlier posts) seems to bring my POIS "cure" up to 75%.

HI Demografx

Thats exactly what ive been doing for many years, sitting and doing very little during POIS period. I think its indicative of this illness.
I think there are two reasons why I do nothing during POIS period :
1) My performance and mind function is very poor during POIS. So whatever I do, I dont do it well at all.
2) Doing nothing helps because if I do anything it causes a great deal of stress. The stress occurs partly because my mind doesnt work and partly because its just there after orgasm. By this I mean that there is a high level of stress feeling after orgasm and this in itself compounds the stress.

Demografx do continue with your diary when there are few posts because it helps this forum move along. Also what antidepressants and stimulants do you use ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/02/2008 18:27:30
Thanks again, Bizzy. So many years I wasted trying (and failing) to be "normal" during POIS. All I succeeded in doing was to make it worse, as you can appreciate. I JUST DIDN'T/WOULDN'T/COULDN'T BELIEVE THIS WAS HAPPENING TO ME!(I still can't! [;D])... A 5-SECOND release bringing on so many DAYS of misery....doctors had no clue...I hope you and others can relate to this.

Whoops, Bizzy, almost forgot: antidepressant is Cymbalta, 60mg 1X/day,  and stimulant (prescribed for ADD) is Adderall, a longacting time-release amphetamine. I also tried Concerta (again, the longacting kind) and it was equally effective as Adderall.

I supplement, as I mentioned earlier, with caffeine, sometimes too much though. Because of my caffeine addiction, I was afraid of the addictive potential of Adderall, but for 2 years now I have been on a moderate dose (40mg 1X/day). Both Rx's taken in the morning.

To be further candid, I resisted all meds for a LONG time, finally relented with wife and therapist screaming (exagg.) at me to see prescribing-shrink. I "succumbed" and now grateful, the regimen pulled me out of a suicidal depression: I was on the couch, no reading, no TV, nearly catatonic, for nearly 2 years prior to taking the meds.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/02/2008 18:41:11

2) Doing nothing helps... The stress occurs partly because my mind doesnt work and partly because its just there after orgasm.

Bizzy, kindly clarify "...because it's just there after orgasm." Thank you!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 23/02/2008 01:47:18
Hi Demografx

Im glad you are doing good on the adderall and hope you do not encounter any complications.
I would have serious reservations with the use of an amphetamine based drug because of the dangers of psychosis and depression.
I would suspect that if you came off adderall 'cold turkey' then you will face very serious mental symptoms. If this is true then it means that you are on a medication that requires serious consideration. Maybe oneday you will need to come off the medication.

I am more positive about cymbalta. I understand its a dual re-uptake inhibitor similar to venlafaxine but with a more balanced affect on the two neuro-transmitters.  If this medicine is doing you good then you should stay with it. I may try this medicine myself at some point.
There are a few antidepressants with a stimulant effect. I wonder if you have tried any of them ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/02/2008 08:49:17
FIGHT POIS BY DOING NOTHING!

Yesterday (Day Zero POIS) I worked from bed. Right now, same thing. I know it's hard to do for most of us, but I wanted to post that, because if you CAN rest....conserving energy helps! I'm much better now than I would've been otherwise, following a busier routine. My psychiatrist said, "just don't expect much of yourself during POIS!"

The problem I have with this is that if I rest during the day. I can't get any deep sleep during the night. So the symptoms remain for more days.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 23/02/2008 08:52:35
CONSERVING ENERGY is necessary for POIS, which can induce lethargy and severe exhaustion. Unless your job is marathon running 24/7,

Wel at least I never work during hight POIS days. I absolutely can't work. The way that I absolutely avoid having to work during POIS is by explicitely and expressely inflicting pain on myself on friday night so that I can go back to work on monday.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/02/2008 10:46:10
Hi Demografx

Im glad you are doing good on the adderall and hope you do not encounter any complications.
I would have serious reservations with the use of an amphetamine based drug because of the dangers of psychosis and depression.
I would suspect that if you came off adderall 'cold turkey' then you will face very serious mental symptoms. If this is true then it means that you are on a medication that requires serious consideration. Maybe oneday you will need to come off the medication.

I am more positive about cymbalta. I understand its a dual re-uptake inhibitor similar to venlafaxine but with a more balanced affect on the two neuro-transmitters.  If this medicine is doing you good then you should stay with it. I may try this medicine myself at some point.
There are a few antidepressants with a stimulant effect. I wonder if you have tried any of them ?

Psychosis and depression are not problematic at this dose, spread out time-release mode over 5-8 hours. I have been doing just fine with this regimen for 2 years. I periodically stop "cold turkey" without adverse effects.

Bizzy, I think it's extremely difficult for you to recommend anything from a distance, not really knowing my particulars at all (including ADD, which reacts very differently to amphetamine compared to the population at large. The very first dose, for example, put me to sleep! This is common amongst ADD's but not for most people, who become energized). I have a team of doctors who know me for years, plus I very carefully work with them in a partnership mode, based on my own research and my BEST feeling for what is right for me, based on a lifetime of understanding my body and mind, which even the best doctors don't know. This patient-doctor partnership, I think, should be true for everyone. Actually, I resisted the ADD/stimulant route for months, for a number of reasons, until I was eventually comfortable trying it.

My bottom line is that everyone is different. What works well for one person can be disastrous for another. But thank you very much for your considerate comments and suggestions.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/02/2008 10:55:06
The problem I have...is that if I rest during the day. I can't get any deep sleep during the night. So the symptoms remain for more days.

imre1, yes, very good point! I'm finding the same problem. It is Saturday 3:00 AM right now that I am typing this! But at least the high-anxiety (for me) of POIS doesn't stay; and the quality of the fatigue is still better than POIS: I think far more clearly.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 23/02/2008 11:53:28
My bottom line is that everyone is different. What works well for one person can be disastrous for another. But thank you very much for your considerate comments and suggestions.

I was being cautious with my previous post about adderall and understand that different people do react differently to medications. I may at some point want to try adderall myself.
I once went nuts for several months after taking a single dose of ecstasy.
How does cymbalta compare to other antidepressant medication you may have taken in the past ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/02/2008 20:32:43
I am skeptical about what Cymbalta is doing for me, as I am with Effexor, its predecessor for me (it feels like Adderall is doing 'the whole job') But the psychiatrist makes a point that "it got me off the couch," where I was nearly catatonic for almost 2 years. So...hard to say, but I keep taking it ("if it's not broken don't fix it").

When I first took Prozac in 1989, it had an astonishingly positive effect, an earthshaking, lifechanging impact from a lifetime of periodically going into a snakepit of severe depression (Prozac eliminated that devastatingly low-low). But since then, I haven't felt much with antidepressants and I've tried just about every one of them.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: wikkid on 24/02/2008 17:36:15
Hello!  I am a 25 year old male who has diarrhea and gas 5-10 minutes after orgasm (induced by intercourse or masturbation).  I also have a problem orgasming on "round two" if it's been less than an hour after my last orgasm (I would chalk this up to the basic male refractory period, however).  I've been all over the net and have found this thread.  I'd start to seek out a doctor for POIS right away, but I'm not sure if I have the same thing.  All of you describe these symptoms lasting for a few days, while mine happens right after and usually goes away a few hours later.  Does this sound like the same thing to you?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jo58 on 24/02/2008 21:34:45
Hallo

Just a quick questionaire to my fellow sufferers. If you can answer to the below symptoms please do so, I would like to narrow down the symptoms to possible diseases that I have read up about:


1)  lipodystrophy (fatty deposits like acne on face, back of neck, on collarbone area, between legs

2)   an asthma like breathless feeling after an orgasm

3)   inflammation

4)   blocked nose

5)   itchy skin, especially hands

6)   turn very red colour on chest after orgasm

7)   proximal muscle weakness (hips, shoulders)

8)   no urge for orgasm for the next hour, unless taken a stimulant

Please reply "yes" or "now" to the above symptoms to narrow down the disease.

Thanks

I posted my list of symptoms a few weeks ago, but they included none of the above, except #2. I also have #8 of course but in my opinion that is just the normal refractory period.

Referring to your previous posts, how do you actually take L-Tyrosine? I mean brand name and such...

Anyway I will soon be testing your DHEA treatment - I'll be having some from someone returning from the US. I'll keep all of you informed.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 24/02/2008 22:23:19
Careful with DHEA, there are many warnings about taking it, especially for younger people. I remember reading an account of one bad experience. That said, I would like to cautiously try it myself in a small dose, perhaps 5 mg initially. I am close to 40 years old.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 25/02/2008 11:01:14
Day 0

I would like to mention something else that I experience post sexually. Immediately after I have always experienced a weakness in the knees. I remember this as being quite common throughout my life. I never thought to mention it as it isn't a bad experience, but I am curious about it. Does anyone else with POIS experience this, or is this a common occurrence for all people? I have heard the expression "weak in the knees" but my understanding is that it is a figure of speech for an emotional state, not a physical state.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 26/02/2008 01:18:09
Hi Demografx

Your life experience has been very much like mine. I too have struggled with depression eventually cycling through almost all the antidepressants. I too suffered early life childhood trauma which might have something to do with all this.
I think your psychiatrist is right about the cymbalta. It is probably playing a key-role in your recovery. I know that the nortriptyline is playing a key-role in my somewhat recovery. When I wasnt taking the medicine I was mentally very ill.
My experience with prozac in 1995 was the same as yours. It did something for me for about a week and then the side-effects got me. I couldnt continue the medicine.
I think the adderall is probably giving you an antidepressant effect using a mechanism with which you have to be careful.

Have you ever taken a low-dose tricylic antidepressant ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/02/2008 01:04:16
Hello!  I am a 25 year old male who has diarrhea and gas 5-10 minutes after orgasm (induced by intercourse or masturbation).  I also have a problem orgasming on "round two" if it's been less than an hour after my last orgasm (I would chalk this up to the basic male refractory period, however).  I've been all over the net and have found this thread.  I'd start to seek out a doctor for POIS right away, but I'm not sure if I have the same thing.  All of you describe these symptoms lasting for a few days, while mine happens right after and usually goes away a few hours later.  Does this sound like the same thing to you?

Hi wikkid, this sometimes happens to me, and goes away like yours, but it's followed by full blown POIS symptoms as described here - - - for DAYS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/02/2008 01:13:07
Hi Demografx

Your life experience has been very much like mine. I too have struggled with depression eventually cycling through almost all the antidepressants. I too suffered early life childhood trauma which might have something to do with all this.
I think your psychiatrist is right about the cymbalta. It is probably playing a key-role in your recovery. I know that the nortriptyline is playing a key-role in my somewhat recovery. When I wasnt taking the medicine I was mentally very ill.
My experience with prozac in 1995 was the same as yours. It did something for me for about a week and then the side-effects got me. I couldnt continue the medicine.
I think the adderall is probably giving you an antidepressant effect using a mechanism with which you have to be careful.

Have you ever taken a low-dose tricylic antidepressant ?

Hi Bizzy,

Thanks for sharing your sensitive info with me. Never took a low dose tricyclic (I assume that's stuff like Tofranil, which worked for my dad back in the stone age of psychiatric meds).

You seem determined to warn/deter me from the Adderall. But I know you mean well. What can I say, it feels like my "savior". And once again, maybe with my depression and ADD (the latter is what it has been prescribed for) perhaps I need not worry about adverse effects? Also, the dose seems reasonable, I was only slightly euphoric (and fell asleep!) the first night I took it. I'll ask my new shrink this week.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/02/2008 01:37:12
Hi All,

It's wonderful to see you all posting here and I hope this forum serves to assist you......even if it's just as a sounding board !

Demografx has asked me to just point out something he has seen regarding Levitra.Unfortunately he can't post at the moment.

 It's a post he read elsewhere on the net and although the nature of the post can not be substantiated he felt it prudent to let you all know that it's possible that Levitra can cause strokes in people who do not need to take it.

I think the moot point here is to always ask the chemist/pharmacist or get advice from a medical practitioner before starting a treatment.





Hi, everybody. I'm a bit concerned about people here at the POIS Forum possibly taking medicine into their own hands.

Such as DHEA. Or Levitra. And others.

So I think it worthwhile to post Neil's caveat once again, because it is worth repeating.

POIS can be a desperate condition. But let's not make it worse by going off the deep end and "borrowing" someone else's solution (including mine!) that may or may not be appropriate for your particular chemistry.

Best wishes, everyone!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 27/02/2008 04:28:44
Thanks for sharing your sensitive info with me. Never took a low dose tricyclic (I assume that's stuff like Tofranil, which worked for my dad back in the stone age of psychiatric meds).
You seem determined to warn/deter me from the Adderall. But I know you mean well. What can I say, it feels like my "savior". And once again, maybe with my depression and ADD (the latter is what it has been prescribed for) perhaps I need not worry about adverse effects? Also, the dose seems reasonable, I was only slightly euphoric (and fell asleep!) the first night I took it. I'll ask my new shrink this week.

I am not trying to deter you from adderall at all. I think it is doing you good for the time being, just as you have explained. I was just stating that its a medicine that requires consideration. My advice would be not to stop it but use the minimum dose required.
Imipramine (tofranil) is not a stoneage medicine, though imipramine would not be my tricyclic of choice.
I think doctors and patients have been tricked by the pharmaceutical industry into thinking that the newer SSRI and SNRI class of antidepressants are an advancement in depression drug therapy.
I think cymbalta and venlafaxine might be slightly better than the SSRI's but not as good as low-dose tricyclic therapy.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: moresex on 27/02/2008 09:39:15
Hello, I'm new in this forum and I'm very interested in this topic.
I wish to know if a supplementary integration of L-Tyrosine in the morning and of DHEA after sex can effectively reduce the post orgasimic refractory period.What are the recommended doses ?thanks
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/02/2008 18:30:20

I am not trying to deter you from adderall at all. I think it is doing you good for the time being, just as you have explained. I was just stating that its a medicine that requires consideration. My advice would be not to stop it but use the minimum dose required.
Imipramine (tofranil) is not a stoneage medicine, though imipramine would not be my tricyclic of choice.
I think doctors and patients have been tricked by the pharmaceutical industry into thinking that the newer SSRI and SNRI class of antidepressants are an advancement in depression drug therapy.
I think cymbalta and venlafaxine might be slightly better than the SSRI's but not as good as low-dose tricyclic therapy.

I said "warn/deter" and you were really more on the warning (CAUTION) side, which is good. I may have misinterpreted the caveats for something stronger, too.

I agree completely with you about "advancements," sometimes the "old" tricyclics work better than SSRI's. I shouldn't have said "stone age," what I meant is that drugs like Tofranil go way back in time when SSRI's weren't even on the drawing board.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: bossflambe on 28/02/2008 19:40:23
Hi all, I want to thank everyone for telling of their experiences. It was very reassuring to find information about this.
I am a female. My boyfriend is a man I love dearly and he has some of these symptoms...it apparently is more like extreme sadness for him and other mental symptoms which lasts for days. He has been having a lot of the flu symptoms and we have assumed he keeps getting bugs but I am wondering if its related to the possible pois. Also I am wondering if there are several versions of this problem depending on an individuals brain chemistry.

 He said he has had this problem ever since he could remember but it has gotten worse over the years.  we are in our 40's. There are some physical symptoms as well. We are investigating ways to manage the condition.
 
If a male goes without orgasm for more than several weeks at a time on a regular basis isn't there a concern about prostate health.  There is a technique that proctologists use called prostate massage or milking which is supposed to produce an event sort of like an orgasm but more of a calm draining of the prostate. We are still learning about it. Has anyone heard of this or had experience with it? I guess its something that can be done by oneself as well.

Also are there some safer herbs or supplements that are known to affect this in a positive way? he is currently on wellbutrin and prozac. thanks in advance for any feedback.   
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Living30 on 28/02/2008 19:46:57
There is so much useful information being discussed here. I suffer from the same symptoms and these symptoms have seriously marred my personal and professional life for the past 20 years. Thanks to this forum, I'm now beginning to do something about it.

Would it be profitable for visitors to this topic to have a frequently asked questions (FAQ) document? I was thinking it would be helpful to crystallize all this useful information discussed on this board into an easy to use reference document. How do you guys feel about this? Would anyone be interested to help put this together?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/02/2008 17:08:12
There is so much useful information being discussed here. I suffer from the same symptoms and these symptoms have seriously marred my personal and professional life for the past 20 years. Thanks to this forum, I'm now beginning to do something about it.

Would it be profitable for visitors to this topic to have a frequently asked questions (FAQ) document? I was thinking it would be helpful to crystallize all this useful information discussed on this board into an easy to use reference document. How do you guys feel about this? Would anyone be interested to help put this together?


EXCELLENT IDEA, Living30 !!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 29/02/2008 18:13:43
Hello!  I am a 25 year old male who has diarrhea and gas 5-10 minutes after orgasm (induced by intercourse or masturbation).  I also have a problem orgasming on "round two" if it's been less than an hour after my last orgasm (I would chalk this up to the basic male refractory period, however).  I've been all over the net and have found this thread.  I'd start to seek out a doctor for POIS right away, but I'm not sure if I have the same thing.  All of you describe these symptoms lasting for a few days, while mine happens right after and usually goes away a few hours later.  Does this sound like the same thing to you?

What you are describing most certainly is not POIS. It is most likely very normal and I would advise you to see a urologist.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 29/02/2008 18:29:07
There is so much useful information being discussed here. I suffer from the same symptoms and these symptoms have seriously marred my personal and professional life for the past 20 years. Thanks to this forum, I'm now beginning to do something about it.

Would it be profitable for visitors to this topic to have a frequently asked questions (FAQ) document? I was thinking it would be helpful to crystallize all this useful information discussed on this board into an easy to use reference document. How do you guys feel about this? Would anyone be interested to help put this together?


EXCELLENT IDEA, Living30 !!

1. What is POIS?

POIS is a post orgasmic state of overall ill feeling. POIS take days to recover from. The second day however is always the heaviest.

The most charactistic symptom is the inability to think (brain fog). This may be described as fatigue, or feeling tired. Important to notice is that feeling tired and being tired are two different things. Some people during POIS feel tired and still have insomnia.

Secondary symptoms may include a tension type headache, difficulty concentrating, sometimes to the point of getting out of body experiences. Some people report feeling extremely hot or cold. Most often with transpiration. Also problems around the eyes have been reported.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/03/2008 01:51:40

1. What is POIS?

POIS is a post orgasmic state of overall ill feeling. POIS take days to recover from. The second day however is always the heaviest.

The most charactistic symptom is the inability to think (brain fog). This may be described as fatigue, or feeling tired. Important to notice is that feeling tired and being tired are two different things. Some people during POIS feel tired and still have insomnia.

Secondary symptoms may include a tension type headache, difficulty concentrating, sometimes to the point of getting out of body experiences. Some people report feeling extremely hot or cold. Most often with transpiration. Also problems around the eyes have been reported.


imre1, THANK YOU FOR INITIATING!!!! [:)]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/03/2008 02:11:29
(A) For the answer to 1. What is POIS?

I would suggest adding to the very first POIS in the answer: [ POIS (Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome] is a post orgasmic state...)

(B) In the 3rd paragraph, I would suggest to change "getting" to "having" (an out of body experience)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 01/03/2008 08:25:30
Hi all, I want to thank everyone for telling of their experiences. It was very reassuring to find information about this.
I am a female. My boyfriend is a man I love dearly and he has some of these symptoms...it apparently is more like extreme sadness for him and other mental symptoms which lasts for days. He has been having a lot of the flu symptoms and we have assumed he keeps getting bugs but I am wondering if its related to the possible pois. Also I am wondering if there are several versions of this problem depending on an individuals brain chemistry.

 He said he has had this problem ever since he could remember but it has gotten worse over the years.  we are in our 40's. There are some physical symptoms as well. We are investigating ways to manage the condition.
 
If a male goes without orgasm for more than several weeks at a time on a regular basis isn't there a concern about prostate health.  There is a technique that proctologists use called prostate massage or milking which is supposed to produce an event sort of like an orgasm but more of a calm draining of the prostate. We are still learning about it. Has anyone heard of this or had experience with it? I guess its something that can be done by oneself as well.

Also are there some safer herbs or supplements that are known to affect this in a positive way? he is currently on wellbutrin and prozac. thanks in advance for any feedback.   

Hi Bossflambe

I think it is highly likely that his persistant flu symptoms are part of a POIS. I have learned from experience that POIS weakens and redirects the immune system.
There are slight variations of the POIS we are defining here but on the whole its very distinct. In other words the symptoms are very similar. I believe its an immune system and mood regulating protein thats causing the problem.
I dont know if there is a prostate risk if one avoids an orgasm. But what I do know is that many people world-wide do not orgasm for very long periods without any problems.
There are many herbs and supplements that can help improve the mood. Helping the mood is an important step forward. I dont think any of these herbs will make POIS go away.
Bupropion and Fluoxetine is a potent and potentially hazardous mix. I wonder how he is doing on that combination ?

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/03/2008 05:21:44
imre1

FAQ: perhaps we should state that POIS has only been observed in men so far?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 03/03/2008 00:49:48
Hallo it is me again, the guy with the DHEA formula. Fist of all, I am completely against strong pills that interfere with body processes and are completely for health supplements.

Prescription pills like Prozac, Ritalin has helped me in the past, but it just messed up other systems in my body.

I am not a doctor, so I cannot give you the details of the dosages that you should use, but I will let you in on ecactly what I did in order to recover from this bloody problem after orgasms.

First of all, I was smoking cigarettes. I stopped last year August. That was done. Then I stopped drinking coffee at work, as our coffee at work is quite strong, and it messed up my sleep cycle. I basically did a detox of two weeks, to get rid of pathogens in the body like worms and stuff. You stop eating protein rich things for 2 weeks, and drink 1000mg MSM Methylsulfonylmethane each day. I drank a lot of water, and drank tea instead of coffee. It was a very bad 2 weeks, but not as bad as the decades of POIS!

Then the DHEA treatment started. The docter prescribed 90 25mg pills of DHEA to me. 2 pills (50mg) each morning I wake up with 1000mg L-Tyrosine on an empty stomach. I also take one pill of DHEA directly after sex, and only if it is 6 hours after the first dosage of the day (It has something to do with the hormonal cycles). Meaning if you wake up in the morning, and you take your DHEA dose, if you have sex after that, don't take DHEA immediately again.

It is South African branded I don't know if you get it in your country:
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=5161
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=74
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=119

After one month I switched to a safer DHEA supplement:
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=6

I also added two more health supplements in the morning to the tyrisone and herbal DHEA 7-Keto to further help me get rid of POIS:

-Siberian Ginseng (not called like this in the USA anymore)
-Phosphatidylserine (PS)
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=93

The whole trick of getting rid of POIS, is to decrease the constant release of Cortisol (Stress Hormone) and increase the release of DHEA (Sex Hormone). And then to take herbal supplements to maintain the correct balance. It takes time and patience, and although there are drugs out there like Ephedrine and Stimulants that immediately reduces cortisol, it is not the solution only part of a bigger problem being that you have a big hormonal imbalance problem.

Good luck and I hope I can make a change in your lives.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 03/03/2008 01:57:46
Hi hk1979,

Could you say a little more about how your DHEA, etc. program has improved your symptoms?  Are your POIS symptoms completely gone?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Dave23 on 03/03/2008 22:06:38
Hallo it is me again, the guy with the DHEA formula. Fist of all, I am completely against strong pills that interfere with body processes and are completely for health supplements.

Prescription pills like Prozac, Ritalin has helped me in the past, but it just messed up other systems in my body.

I am not a doctor, so I cannot give you the details of the dosages that you should use, but I will let you in on ecactly what I did in order to recover from this bloody problem after orgasms.

First of all, I was smoking cigarettes. I stopped last year August. That was done. Then I stopped drinking coffee at work, as our coffee at work is quite strong, and it messed up my sleep cycle. I basically did a detox of two weeks, to get rid of pathogens in the body like worms and stuff. You stop eating protein rich things for 2 weeks, and drink 1000mg MSM Methylsulfonylmethane each day. I drank a lot of water, and drank tea instead of coffee. It was a very bad 2 weeks, but not as bad as the decades of POIS!

Then the DHEA treatment started. The docter prescribed 90 25mg pills of DHEA to me. 2 pills (50mg) each morning I wake up with 1000mg L-Tyrosine on an empty stomach. I also take one pill of DHEA directly after sex, and only if it is 6 hours after the first dosage of the day (It has something to do with the hormonal cycles). Meaning if you wake up in the morning, and you take your DHEA dose, if you have sex after that, don't take DHEA immediately again.

It is South African branded I don't know if you get it in your country:
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=5161
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=74
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=119

After one month I switched to a safer DHEA supplement:
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=6

I also added two more health supplements in the morning to the tyrisone and herbal DHEA 7-Keto to further help me get rid of POIS:

-Siberian Ginseng (not called like this in the USA anymore)
-Phosphatidylserine (PS)
http://www.solaltech.com/new/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=93

The whole trick of getting rid of POIS, is to decrease the constant release of Cortisol (Stress Hormone) and increase the release of DHEA (Sex Hormone). And then to take herbal supplements to maintain the correct balance. It takes time and patience, and although there are drugs out there like Ephedrine and Stimulants that immediately reduces cortisol, it is not the solution only part of a bigger problem being that you have a big hormonal imbalance problem.

Good luck and I hope I can make a change in your lives.

If you want to lower / regulate cortisol levels take a supplement called Relora/Retain 2. The herb in it reduces cortisol levels and increases dhea levels up too 200% via natural pathways.(Take blood test before and after too check the levels)

Anabolicminds.com is a great forum for people who have tried Relora/Retain too increase dhea levels and lower/regulate cortisol levels.


Some good news.

Ive been on H.R.T and having hormone and neurotransmitter blood tests since July/August last year.

My H.R.T protocol is  :

Testosterone cypionate at 28mg E2D schedule and 250ius of HCG E2D.

Dostinex 500mcg-1000mcg same day of release(Now Iam begining too taper off dostinex as I read before there has been studies that uses of dostinex can lead too heart valve problems but the study tested for doses at above 20000mcg taking every day non stop for parkinson disease patients.

I take only 500mcg-1000mcg 3-4 times a week so should be ok and so far no side effects.

Aromasin 10mgs E2D

5Htp 200-400mg ED 300mg after release due to Serotonin drop

Relora 750-1500mg ED too regulate cortisol levels especially the day after release and too keep Dhea levels at healthy range for my age 23

Gaba at 200-300mg a day due to low levels and drop after release

I take a supplement called Powerfull too increase hgh/igf-1 levels.It has been scientifically proven too increase hgh levels up too 221% in one dose.

I cycle on 1 month/1month off and then I inject Igf-1 20mcg E4D
for same cycle 1 month on 1 month off too increase my IGF-1 levels as it was low before but now it is in the healthy range :0)

I also take Reset Ad for adrenal fatigue due too years of taking simulants since age 16. This has really helped my energy levels and adrenal fatigue. You can check on anabolicminds.com forum and just about everyone who has taking this supplement has helped with their adrenal fatigue.

I take 200mg of Dim ED to convert the bad estrogens too good estrogen
(Improve Estrogen Bad - good ratio levels)

Its been around 4 weeks of constant no POSI symptoms and the following results :

Lost around 9 pounds in 4 weeks due to increase energy to train more. Body is much more muscular and lost around 3 inches of fat from my waist in 4 weeks. People have noticed it big time.

Training boxing, mma, circuit training twice a day. As active as i was
when aged 16 competing in Amateur boxing. Was also doing weights for a couple of weeks 5 times a week too see if my body would recover like it would when i was 16-18 when I had no POIS/adrenal fatigue/hormone imbalance problems. My body recovered no problem and thats when i knew my health was improving.

(Ive always training boxing workouts/drills since 16 but when POIS, adrenal fatigue and hormone imbalnce problems were at their worst I did not have much energy but still pushed myself too train at least twice a week but it was so dificult, felt like passing out sometimes and got really dizzy then would hit a big low after each training session. So I would question myself if training was really doing me any good but still kept pushing.

Libido gradually went from one release every 2 weeks
too 1 release every 2nd day now. I could easily have a release Ed if I wanted but I do train 2-3 hours every day too the point of fatigue and constantly trying too push myself. I want too improve my boxing/mma skills and also cardio, explosiveness etc Lastly too get ripped like when I was aged 16-18. I miss that build.

A POIS symptom :

I might get some slight inflamation to my eyes the day after release
but nothing major and only lasts 2-3 hours.

No more flu like symptoms, fatigue, migraines, sore bones, joints, back, legs muscles etc No more anxiety and overall nervousness. I Can socialise much better, seemed to have found my ole personailty back ie sense of humor, eye contact , poise, laughter/smile, timing, flirting/ wittiness etc

I waited around 4 weeks of constant results before posting too confirm consistency of my POIS.

Sometimes if i push myself abit too much the same day in training, say i do 30mins running/skipping or 15min sprinting drills and 60mins of mma in the morning then I do another 30mins of running/skipping  and say another 60mins of
boxing/mma in the evening and then if I have a release, I might notice the next day my energy isnt the same or its a little tougher too wake up :) but quickly picks up once I get into my morning training.

The best way too find out what hormones/neurotransmitters are imbalanced is go for a hormone/neurotransmitter blood test 2 days after release and then another test say 4-6 hours after just releasing.

You should see your test/dhea levels are lower, prolactin cortisol levels much higher. Also serotonin/dopamine/gaba levels should be much lower
4-6 hours after release or whenever it is when you feel the POIS are at its worst.

Any questions feel free to ask me. I know how hard it is too wake up everyday since aged only 21 with POIS symptoms and no matter who you are it effects your life big time so iam happy to help :0)


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 06/03/2008 14:51:40
Yes Dave23 is right on track. When you have POIS, the best thing to do is to check hormones and cortisol, and your doctor should direct you to the right prescriptions. Things like stimulants (coffee, ephedrine, ecstacy) might feel like it helps but it worsens.

To answer Guthrie's question, my POIS symptoms have not completely disappeared, but at least, if I measure myself on a weekly basis, I am getting better than I am getting worse (like it has been last year).

When I was a student in my early twenties I used to get a hold of ecstasy and viagra, and I could just have 5-10 orgasms overnight and it was fun, and things were going fine until I slept and woke up again. I felt horribly tired and exhausted.

But yes I will also look at Dave23's advise, and maybe we can put together a general treatment that will be able to help everyone. But don't expect relief from POIS within a month. Your body has to stabilise and it doesn't happen overnight if you are older than 30.

Have Faith.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/03/2008 20:03:47
Do you think hormones and cortisol are affected by Levitra? It definitely works.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 06/03/2008 20:29:02
Yes Levitra helps for cholestrol, high blood pressure and diabetes, but it is a drug that causes chemical reactions in your body, to relief the symptoms of POIS but disturbs something else, meaning you can't take Levitra forever. On the other hand you can take supplements into your 80's.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/03/2008 20:56:34
I see no disturbance with Levitra, and only take a mild dose to aid dysfunction, which coincides with POIS timing. No reason to ever quit doing that. I think I simply got lucky.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/03/2008 21:03:55
hk1979, are we talking about Levitra? The primary thing it's prescribed for is ED (erectile dysfunction), not as you say "cholesterol, high blood pressure and diabetes," although it works even for people with those conditions.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 09/03/2008 05:30:12
It is like the intestine gets irritated because an abnormal mucus secretion on it. That produces a high constipation of the intestine, until almost get blocked. That intestine disorder make arise all other discomforts like to sweat, gases, acne, nervousism, tension, constipation, fatigue, depresion, irritation, alergic like sensation, pain in the shoulder muscles, appetite, bad breath, dilated pupils, watery eyes, headaches and hemorroides among others.
Emptying everything, cleaning as much as possible the whole bowel should get a big relief to all those inconveniences.
I don´t know why that abnormal mucus secretion occurs, but I am certain that mucus on the bowel and gases originates all the discomforts, in some way irritating the intestine walls, and this is reflected in the whole body.
The interesting thing would be encounter a cure to avoid that abnormal secretion.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 09/03/2008 15:24:27
B_Jim: I have pois symthoms and investigating with my body found those statements. Im not a doctor or medic of any type, I am just one more POS affected and interested in the cure of those problems.
What I´ve been tested was with the help of bathroom bidet evacuating out the fecal matter as much  as possible. The improvements are striking.
But would be wonderfull find a solution to the roots of the problem, this is why there is a lack of something when POS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: sokovan on 11/03/2008 17:09:14
i was thinking that i am the only male in the world who have this problem,
until today, by luck i have found this thread.
the bad think about this P.O.I.S  is that doctors do not know what you are talking about, i am now 54 years old, who suffer too much from this problem, but this problem does not appear until i was about 30 years old, i remember that when i was a young that sometimes i masturbate three times or more in a one day without suffering from any illness.
but at 30 years old my suffering last only a one day, and after many years it is extended to two days after orgasm, and after many years it is extended to 3 days, and now i need 4 days to resort to a normal.
my main suffering is from the black halo around my eyes, and it is very clear, and this is a very embarrassing , as i am wearing a long Hat with a flag on it; hello people look at me. very annoying state.
i have found that any calming medicine such as the valium like medicine will reduce the illness symptoms, but as a law i must live a whole 4 days until i reliefed completely. the worst black halos around the eyes is in the third day, and not the first day.
i think that ejaculating the sperm is as making a wound in the body, most the people will be reliefed within hours, since they will compensate what they lose, but the miserable people like me will wait 3-4 days until some strange cells (may be in the brain ) will cooking the chemicals neccessary for the new formation of sperm, what a fuckin life!!, sometimes i be very very angry from this status.
for you the people with this bad luck, do not go to doctors, they will not benefit you in this case, you have no big stone in your kidney, nor an evident blood clot, so keep your money, until some medical researcher who will by chance suffer from this syndrome, will focus his research to solve the most annoying illness in the world. i hope this thread will continue to live as an unofficial site for the "Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome", so we can continue to look at what the other people do to this problem.
by the way i have no tonsils, no uvula, due to a surgery when i was 4 years old. when i was thinking that i am the only person in the world who have this illness i was convinced that the lacking of uvula and tonsils may be somehow the case of my problem, but now, and in reality exactly today i have changed my mind unless half the people who suffer from this illness have no tonsils.
and an advice to the medicine factories, why not manufaturing a medicine to relief the symptoms of this illness, i am sure that millions will consume that medicine, even the normal people.
and to the doctors who said that this is normal: yes this is normal if the symptoms last at most one day , but not 3 to 4 days or more.
and to a brave writer who want to make million dollars, just write a public book with a title: "Post Orgasmic Illness"  without the word "Syndrome" and you will see if a 5 million copies will be sold. especially if the book have pictures like my eyes before orgasm, and my eyes after 3 days.
to "solution" : your research deserve respect, but it is very hard to clean out completely the intestine, the best solution is to invent some medicine which will dissolved such a mucus secretion, and if that mucus secretion is the case of the illness then a study to its chemical structure may pave the way to a cure. or may be this mucus secretion prohibit the manufacturing of neurotransmitters in the brain?? so needs a more experiments with multiview points in diverse directions.
personally i think it is from the brain, the brain lose neurotransmitters or can't manufacturing it due to strange factor happened after losing sperm and other liquids during orgasm, this is because all my illness in my brain neighborhood:
halos around the eyes, deep sleep, can't focus, memory problems... .
happy living for all

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 11/03/2008 20:57:43
The stress in the bowell does the whole body get too much tired and stressed.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 11/03/2008 22:02:45
this is great "solution" we are getting closer...  my doctor just phoned me the other day and he thinks it is because I psychologically don't have "stress-less" sex. He is kind of right because I stress that I will get POIS again! But yes my ass gets itchy as well as some digestive problems. I started taking probiotics as well, lets see if that will help.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: sokovan on 12/03/2008 08:53:06
hi
to "solution" , from the beginning of my problem at age 30 to the age of about 50 i have no problems with digestive tracts, whether before or after orgasm.
and from 50 years old to nowadays (54) i have  constipation in general, i have noticed that after orgasm the constipation are released sometimes.
before an hour i have taken two table spoon of castor oil, i am waiting its effect. i want to test your theory, but washing the intestine with water, this is something hard, i prefer to wait the 4 days util my symptoms disappear.
regards
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 12/03/2008 18:53:17
hk1979 good idea, let us know!


sokovan it is normal that sometimes  that after orgasm the constipation are released sometimes. Normally when the bowell is full an orgasm triggers go to bath.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 12/03/2008 19:29:14
demografx

You are right, Levitra is marketed mainnly for ED, but also the others, check http://www.levitra.com/

Why I am getting at is that maybe the others are related to ED.

Just a quick summary of things that we discussed might cause POIS:

- Low Testosterone
- Low DHEA
- High Cortisol
- Cholestrol, Blood Pressure, Diabetes
- Unhealthy Intestine

And a summary of cures that I can remember reading throug the thread:

- Stimulants like coffee, ephedrine
- Hormone Replacement Therapy like DHEA, Testosterone
- Erectile Dysfunction pills like Levitra
- Cortisol blockers like Lerora
- Blood Sugar Stabillizers like CLA (Conjugated Linolic Acid)
- Probiotics and Prebiotics for Intestine Health

If there is anything left out please add to the list. I think we are all a little bit different with treatment reacting to POIS, but I am sure if all of the above is shown to your doctor he might give you a daily prescription to fit your specific situation.



Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 12/03/2008 21:01:58
Hi everyone.  After a lot of futile searches I finally found your forum with the magic combo of search words. 
I really had felt alone with this POIS thing, as many of you I see. 

I've read some but not all of your posts and am pursuing some suggestions.

Here's my situation:

I'm 54 and have had this POIS thing since around 20 or so.  I masturbated almost daily in my teens but don't remember having any real problem with it though I didn't feel really good about the way I felt after doing it.

My general symptoms haven't changed much over the years, but it has got worse with age. As I've aged I've found myself more prone to anxiety and even had a run in with severe depression 6 years ago which took a few years to rise out of.  I associate this with age and lower testosterone. My general drive and motivation has dropped a fair bit in the last 10-15 years.
My more serious POIS symptoms don't really kick in until about 12-24 hours after ejaculation.  It seems there's some kind of energy rush created in my body that sustains me a while until the big letdown.  The hormones are flowing in the veins so to speak, so I feel ok for a bit, though I know things are shifted and can feel a little off.

-the worst thing is a feeling just above my belly button in what I believe to be the solar plexus chakra area (for those who understand that stuff).  It's kind of like an open emotional vulnerability and my nerves in general are jangled a bit.  I have a very weakened ability to deal with noise and people, though I can still function if I have to.  Everything just seems to bother me, especially having to be very active or deal with any kind of stress.

-definitely weakened immune system
-lower energy
-a tendency to be despondent and feel life's kind of meaningless.  This comes in the second day after and doesn't usually last more than the one day or two at most.
-difficulty concentrating

It can really vary in intensity and duration.  I am convinced there is some psychological aspect as I have breezed through it some times.

I did once experience 3 months where I felt great after orgasms but this was because I had an experience of spiritual detachment for that whole time.  (this would take a long time to explain how it happened and why it ended, but I'll save that for another time.  Suffice to say I experienced myself as separate and beyond the effects of the world, which allowed me to have a much higher level of energy and well being...I was very sad to see it go but had no choice)

As has been mentioned,  part of what can make it much easier to get through is to have no responsibilities for the two days after...not something I can managed all the time.  I do try to time my orgasms at the beginning of my days off.

One other thing I'm really excited about, though I am not convinced it can be a long term solution, is this new way of masturbating that I think I discovered on this forum. The guy calls it Energy Work.
Wow, just was going to post the link and the guy has taken down the site for good!

I'll go into what I learned from this fellow if you guys would like. Have any others tried this?  It's pretty simple and has really changed my approach to my sex drive and given me way better orgasms over my whole body without ejaculation.  It's also kind of diverted my sexual energy out of the lust area (genitals only) and spread it over my whole body, which feels healthier and more balanced.
The reason I'm skeptical for the long term is I've always experienced myself getting to that point of needing a sexual release after 2-3 weeks...so far it's only been about 12 days, so I'm not sure yet where this will go.

I've also just got an order of DHEA and have started an L-Tyrosine supplement. 
I did read a site with cautions about DHEA so I'm going to start pretty slow with it.

I should add that my wife seems to have lost her sex drive the last few years, so that part of my life is lukewarm at best.  I've always been sensitive to energy and have developed the ability to experience sexual energy in other ways besides ejaculation, but the body being built the way it is, it inevitably seems to work itself to that point, just like hunger for food.

Look forward to more discussion...
Paul
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/03/2008 21:17:13
WELCOME TO ALL THE NEWCOMERS!

It is great to see this growing "family" of people here, most who thought no one else in the world suffers from POIS! This Forum has been a GREAT help in finding remedies. Who knows? In a short time we may have answers for everyone!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 12/03/2008 23:49:00
Hi all,

Fiddlerpaul just mentioned that he had to get lucky with the right combination of search terms in order to find this thread.  I wonder if there is a way to make it easier for people who do a google search to find us.  In other words, could we come up with a list of the different possible searches people might do ("post orgasmic fatigue," "tired after ejaculation," etc.), and attach it to this thread somehow, so that it would come up near the top of a google search?

Perhaps neilep or one of the other administrators could figure out a way to do this. 


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 13/03/2008 12:49:44
tired after sex
fatigue after sex
tired after orgasm
fatigue after orgasm
illness after orgasm
illness after sex
sex problems orgasm problems
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 13/03/2008 13:40:08
   
Someone may try rye bread? I have tried and I have been greatly affected during a pois. It would be interesting if someone test to see whether the effects are the same.
The bread in question is it`s  known as Pumpernickel
It should be consumed during the week opened, and it is very sensitive to moisture
check this images

http://www.recipetips.com/kitchen/images/refimages/bread/types/bread_pumpernickel2_500.jpg

http://gerech.net/images/pumpernickel.jpg
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: sokovan on 14/03/2008 09:37:50
i wonder if there is an after ejaculation illness in animalls , may be a veterinarian can tell us.
 also we can propose that every male has this phenomena, the "minor P.O.I.S" in normal people, and the "major P.O.I.S" as in our's
 i am sure there are thousands of people who have this illness in its major form. also there may be something in the literature of the ancient people, this is a long history, may be someone have mentioned it.
years ago i have tried chamomile flowers in boiling water, beleive me that the dark halos around my eyes which is the major annoying sysmptoms in my case have disappeared completely, but i can't reproduce that effect again.
also the tona fish have some small effect, you can try.
  this P.O.I.S has the same situation as in the U.F.O phenomena (Unidentified Flying Objects), most if not ALL doctors believes it is a hoax, but sadly the only people who believe in its reality are who suffer too much from it.



Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 14/03/2008 14:34:33

Well, in terms of animals, there is a famous phrase whose origin is disputed, but which may trace back to antiquity: “Post coitum omne animal triste est,” “Every animal is sad after sex.”  There is also another version, attributed to the ancient Greek physician Galen: “Triste est omne animal post coitum, praeter mulierem gallumque,” “Every animal is sad after sex, except for women and roosters.”

There are also a number of websites that mention past historical awareness of symptoms similar to POIS.  Their approach often come from Eastern religious traditions.   I don't necessarily agree with the their explanations for the causes of the symptoms, but I think they are useful in showing that it is not a new problem.

Here is one site that collects a number of articles on the idea that post-orgasm symptoms are prevalent among many people, but perhaps in more subtle forms: http://www.reuniting.info/introduction

Also, in terms of  recent Western figures,this website mentions Charlie Chaplin, Honore de Balzac, and Miles Davis as apparently suffering from some form of POIS-like symptoms:
http://www.hps-online.com/tsy1.htm
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 14/03/2008 16:17:55

There are also a number of websites that mention past historical awareness of symptoms similar to POIS.  Their approach often come from Eastern religious traditions.   I don't necessarily agree with the their explanations for the causes of the symptoms, but I think they are useful in showing that it is not a new problem.

Here is one site that collects a number of articles on the idea that post-orgasm symptoms are prevalent among many people, but perhaps in more subtle forms: http://www.reuniting.info/introduction


Guthrie,

thanks for this link.   I had no idea that there was a whole body of understanding that connected my post coital feelings with general disharmony and poor mental/physical health.  It makes a lot of sense.
I remember so much how an early passion based relationship I had kept leading me into these states where I wanted to push her away and I didn't understand why I felt that way and experienced much guilt for it.  That was in the early days of my POIS symptoms.  Now many years later with my wife I see the same tendency to push each other away after orgasm.  Thankfully my marriage was initiated by a much deeper spiritual connection and not lustful passion so we have survived these many years without having too many of these problems.

I think there really is a sliding scale on how much orgasm affects us all.  From reading others' posts, I can see some have it much worse than me and I know I have it much worse than the average guy.

From reading on that website, they say the solution is to get off the biological roller coaster of highs and lows connected to the orgasm process.  I have struggled with that for years.  There's the 2-3 week build up of sexual energy and suddenly it rears its head and my body starts screaming for it again.  I see there's a book on this site about how to get beyond that...wonder if I should get it.  I feel pretty hopeless in avoiding orgasm and heck, I don't even have the sex drive I had ten years ago.  Heck I tried installing adult content filters on my computer that my wife had the password to and that really didn't keep me from feeling 'the need'.
Seems the key is to get off the dopamine addictive track and into something called the oxytocin track which is a different chemical process in the body. In physical terms its moving from a genital centred sexuality to a heart centred one.
How to do that?
I have a book credit at a store that says they have the book here, so I probably will get it.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 14/03/2008 19:57:19
Well, like I said, I'm not sure how scientific/substantiated their explanation is.  That website seems to think the negative feelings are a natural effect of orgasm, whereas it could also be linked to digestive issues or hormone imbalances, as has been suggested on this thread.  Basically, they didn't seem to see the negative symptoms as something abnormal to be cured, but instead saw them as a reason for people to avoid orgasm in general.  Hopefully, though, we can find some kind of treatment/cure!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 14/03/2008 23:48:52
I am doubtful that POIS is of intestinal oregin, but I applaud your speculation and experimentation. My POIS state does sometimes engage my elimination system, but it definitely seems like just another reaction to another root cause.

Relora sounds interesting, assuming it's claims are valid and not mere wonder supplement BS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 15/03/2008 01:23:58
John,

News of a new stress reliever was too good to pass up.  I just went and bought some Relora and popped one....
I'm not too good a guinea pig for everyone though because I tend to overreact and get weird effects from many anti anxiety herbal supplements.  The two that I do still take work fairly well..holy basil by New Chapters, which is good but does make me a little drowsy so its not great during the day, and L-theanine by Natural Factors, which works all the time, but is pretty mild.
I've tried just about every other one, I think, but this Relora is new to me and it has two ingredients I'd never tried before, Magnolia officinalis and Phellodenron amurense.

This is timely, as well, as I had an orgasm yesterday and have been feeling somewhat off since.  Here's hoping...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 15/03/2008 01:27:34
I think I made a mini breakthrough. I was speaking to a pharmacist about Relora and its effects, and what he told me linked up with our discussions about POIS. Relora basically helps for mental and physical stress, normalising cortisol and hormone levels. He mentioned also it helps for a healthy HPA axis. Well I didn't know what that was, so I went to Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal_axis

In summary i want to quote this part from the link above:

"The fine, homeostatic interactions between these three organs constitute the HPA axis, a major part of the neuroendocrine system that controls reactions to stress and regulates various body processes including digestion, the immune system, mood and sexuality, and energy usage"

Therefor I can only simply ask... is POIS not directly link to a damaged HPA axis? Your thoughts please.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 15/03/2008 01:35:21
@fiddlerpaul

I read that you should take Relora 3 times a day, and it being a patented herbal supplement, it should not work straight away like a chemical such as Levitra. I suggest continue taking it for about 2 weeks (loyally) and then monitor your POIS again.

I haven't bought Relora yet for myself, but I consider stopping the DHEA after 2 months usage, and just taking Relora and L-Tyrosine in future.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 15/03/2008 09:41:18
Infrequently while in the POIS state I have had a pain in my gut, like a pinching in the general area of the appendix. I was so concerned at the time I looked into paying to get an MRI, but I discovered that the test isn't good for diagnostic purposes. So I saw my doctor and she allowed me to be booked for a test, it might have been ultrasonic. When the time came for the test I hadn't had any similar episode in a long while, so I cancelled it. As well as the pain I also was concerned that my stools seem narrow (all the time). I have come to accept this as merely being my physiology. Every morinig when I go to the washroom I usually have to go twice, about 10-15 min apart, sometimes even 3 times. I eat a somewhat high fiber low saturated fat diet, perhaps this plays into it.

Solution, what effect did you find rye bread had on your POIS?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 15/03/2008 15:40:05
The rye bread makes me very well go to the bathroom. When the next day as well I feces large. And I realized that the symptoms disappear, there is a great relaxation.
After a time (5 months) I had to stop eating because occurred sinusitis.
Apparently a fungus that regularizes the intestine but has a very powerful effect that can be harmful to me.
It would be interesting to see what effect upon you, to discover the properties of rye in healing POIS
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 15/03/2008 16:46:47
Thanks for the advice hk

I'm noticing the effects of the Relora right away. It hits me about a half hour after taking.
This morning second day after, I am feeling much better.  I am on my 3rd day of DHEA as well and 5th of L-tyrosine, so I have a lot of things in the mix.  I also decided to take theanine with the Relora and I think that is a good choice. 
I'm sensing that the Relora is relaxing (cortisol lowering) and that I am feeling the vitality coming from the DHEA more and more, though I'm not positive on this yet.

Much more time before I can say for sure, but I'm encouraged by the combination of these. 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 15/03/2008 23:14:47
@fiddlerpaul

It seems that you and I have the a similar POIS type. You will find that horrible feeling after an orgasm almost completely disappears when you take 50mg of DHEA after the orgasm and wait 30 min.

I am also a bit scared of taking these hormone supplements, but hopefully my body will repair soon and I hope never to take DHEA supplements again. I am only still 29 years old. What gives me hope that I can recover, is the fact that I stopped smoking, drinking coffee, taking designer drugs here and there, and only drink/eat sugars when I take in a lot of protein, as protein also need energy / carbohydrates to be taken up in the digestive system. I drink a lot of water, is cautious about drinking my weekend glass of wine/beer/whiskey. I used to overdo everything : sex, eating, partying, masturbating. And now I am just cautious and rebuilding my system.

I am glad if that I could help make some people feel better and have some hope that what is broken can always be fixed.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/03/2008 00:51:28
REACTION TO PLEASURE?

Many societies and religions teach a twisted warning about pleasure, so that pleasure can result in intense guilt. I was brought up in such a belief system through parochial schooling, with heavy doses of corporal punishment to enforce that notion.

I sometimes wonder if the pleasure of orgasm leading to guilt because of early conditioning can somehow "train" the body to create POIS?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/03/2008 00:58:03
DHEA DANGERS

I would suggest that before embarking on a DHEA regimen, you consult a physician and/or Google "DHEA dangers"
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 16/03/2008 01:43:40

REACTION TO PLEASURE?

Many societies and religions teach a twisted warning about pleasure, so that pleasure can result in intense guilt. I was brought up in such a belief system through parochial schooling, with heavy doses of corporal punishment to enforce that notion.

I sometimes wonder if the pleasure of orgasm leading to guilt because of early conditioning can somehow "train" the body to create POIS?

Whoa, that's a heavy thought.
As I mentioned in my first post, I did enter a very different spiritual state for 3 months once where I experienced myself as a pure unentangled consciousness.  It allowed me for that time to be really free inside from most unhealthy fear that had previously been a normal part of my life. 
In THAT state when I had an orgasm, I actually felt great by doing it, no letdown or physical issues but really better than before.  It was amazing. Of course, my feeling during the sexual experience was more positively oriented as well.  I was more plugged into the joy of 'being'. That showed me that there is something in my spiritual/psychological makeup that contributes to the sex release being kind of like blowing up my solar plexus chakra area instead of being a great experience from beginning to end.  From this, I just have to believe that in some, if not all cases, it's an energetic kind of thing, kind of like trying to run a strong current through a weak wiring system.
I have continued in a number of ways to pursue higher knowing/being in my life but have never come back to that place where I could say POIS was no longer a problem.  I have nothing really to offer anyone to achieve that state either, having come upon it and fallen back again without any conscious knowing of how or why.  But that experience did inform my perspective greatly.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 16/03/2008 08:33:01
REACTION TO PLEASURE?

Many societies and religions teach a twisted warning about pleasure, so that pleasure can result in intense guilt. I was brought up in such a belief system through parochial schooling, with heavy doses of corporal punishment to enforce that notion.

I sometimes wonder if the pleasure of orgasm leading to guilt because of early conditioning can somehow "train" the body to create POIS?

I have thought about this too. I think its a possibility. I too was under the impression as a child that masturbation was bad. I wonder how one would go about testing the hypothesis that this could create POIS ?
I am pretty certain that there are people who suffer from POIS who were not exposed to early adverse sentiments though.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 16/03/2008 20:51:10
Quote
Many societies and religions teach a twisted warning about pleasure, so that pleasure can result in intense guilt. I was brought up in such a belief system through parochial schooling, with heavy doses of corporal punishment to enforce that notion.

Demografx,
I am curious, what was the belief system you were brought up in? Also, what punishment was inflicted and what was the stated reason for it?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 16/03/2008 21:02:52
I tried a 500mg Tyrosine last week after another NE, and I didn't have any POIS symptoms but I don't know if it was due to the Tyrosine for sure.  I definitely felt the effects of the Tyrosine, it made me feel rather rather mentally off (different than the horrible POIS)... perhaps I am unusually sensitive to it. I tried one 250mg Relora today, and it didn't seem to affect me at all. I will be curious it try 3 a day in the POIS state. If it helps me by increasing DHEA I would rather take it than a DHEA supplement.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 17/03/2008 00:38:25
I first tried DHEA and pregnenolone for POIS and depression about 5 years ago. I found that they both helped reduce symptoms but caused chest pains. So I stopped their use. I think both of these supplements are cardiotoxic.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 17/03/2008 03:03:56
From John21:
"Demografx,
I am curious, what was the belief system you were brought up in? Also, what punishment was inflicted and what was the stated reason for it?"

John, the Roman Catholic school system in the 1950s, paddling rear ends or (less often) hands with a large shilally (large bat) for just about any "mistake" - it is very well known how the RC teachings - especially back then - try to instill fear of the "evil" of sex, that "sex is dirty."

It was difficult for me to post about this, but I feel that it needs to be explored. So I was glad to see the responses.
Thank you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 17/03/2008 09:29:48
I am younger than you are, I am not as familiar with abuses that have occured in the past... I am sorry to hear you had to live through this. The belief that fornication is wrong is definately an RC tenent.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 17/03/2008 18:18:43
REACTION TO PLEASURE?

Many societies and religions teach a twisted warning about pleasure, so that pleasure can result in intense guilt. I was brought up in such a belief system through parochial schooling, with heavy doses of corporal punishment to enforce that notion.

I sometimes wonder if the pleasure of orgasm leading to guilt because of early conditioning can somehow "train" the body to create POIS?

I think your idea/theory has merit . Certainly, it has been shown that emotions can indeed have an effect on the body too and if such guilt is of such a degree........ then it doesn't seem that untoward.............. and that it could well have a psychosomatic response on the body. It could well be that in your case this may be true. Whether the theory bodes well with others situations will be very interesting to find out.

Does this mean that you do in fact feel and overwhelming intensity of guilt  after release ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 17/03/2008 21:15:21
I am younger than you are, I am not as familiar with abuses that have occured in the past... I am sorry to hear you had to live through this. The belief that fornication is wrong is definately an RC tenent.
John, thank you for the sentiments. And for the confirmation.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 17/03/2008 21:24:22
NEILEP POST

Neil, thank you very much for writing.

No, I don't think I feel that way today after sex (but who knows what lurks in the unconscious mind?) My theory is that PERHAPS (I'm not totally convinced) my early conditioning - and some other people's - created intense post-orgasmic guilt in my early years.

I frankly don't remember it clearly but it is well known, as John21 affirms that one of the Church tenets is that "fornication is wrong", that RC teachings try to instill frightful guilt about sex in youngsters and so it's reasonable to think that I was affected.

My quasi-theory (call it a super-hunch [;D])goes on to hypothesize that the early frightful guilt set in motion some psychosomatic symptoms that, as an adult, now express themselves as POIS.

But this may all be secondary to the fact that, however POIS was set in motion for me and other people, the prime emphasis now should be on the cure.

Neil, thanks again for your thoughtful post.

It would be great to hear about this from others on the POIS Forum!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 17/03/2008 21:38:21
I first tried DHEA and pregnenolone for POIS and depression about 5 years ago. I found that they both helped reduce symptoms but caused chest pains. So I stopped their use. I think both of these supplements are cardiotoxic.
Bizzy, thank you for adding to my "warning" about DHEA. As everyone knows, I'm also concerned about my own "cure" of Levitra...concerned that others should be very careful in trying to replicate someone else's success.

Everyone has different body/brain chemistry. And different interactions with other medicines/supplements.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 17/03/2008 22:25:56
FROM BIZZY March 16:
"I too was under the impression as a child that masturbation was bad. I wonder how one would go about testing the hypothesis that this could create POIS ?
I am pretty certain that there are people who suffer from POIS who were not exposed to early adverse sentiments though."

I haven't a clue either how to test the hypothesis. But I agree with you that there are POIS sufferers who were not exposed to early adverse sentiments. Heck, I'm not even sure my early adversity has anything to do with my POIS! Just an idea I'm throwing out there that's been sitting with me for a few decades [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 18/03/2008 13:31:15

Neil, thanks again for your thoughtful post.

It would be great to hear about this from others on the POIS Forum!

You're welcome.....thank YOU for your supportive, productive, informative and insightful posts.........this thread has become a fantastic resource and nerve center for people to come and discuss this condition/illness.

I hope all who visit here benefit from just being able to share.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 18/03/2008 21:41:02
I don´t think in the guilt idea. My symtoms start inmediately PO and decrease after four days so so, always.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 18/03/2008 23:56:51
I feel the same as solution. Due to the severity of the contition that I have experienced I do not believe that it could possibly be due to conditioning. In my early childhood I did not have any warnings about the dangers of sex, I wish I had. I was raised in a Protestant home and sex was not discussed, it was basically taboo.

I became Catholic a few years ago and I accept and love it's teachings, as I believe they come from God. It saddens me to hear of people in the Church that don't live up to it's primary value of love. Love doesn't force people to do anything, which parallels God's gift of free will. I believe in teaching children what we believe to be the truth: that God thinks we shouldn't fornicate, and allowing them to make their own decisions.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/03/2008 19:40:47
I'm only guessing when I say that some, not all, people may have had early negative sexual conditioning (including taboos) that could have set POIS in motion. I could be dead wrong. But let's not rule it out.

As I mentioned earlier, I'm not sure that the conditioning started my POIS. Even with the old teachings that were harsh and brutal. And "taboos" are implicitly negative.

In any case, I agree that with adults, it is now a mostly or complete physical reaction.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 24/03/2008 10:26:08
I took one Relora before bed last night. I had a poor sleep but I'm hoping it was from drinking a wee bit of alcohol yesterday. Alcohol always affects my sleep severely but the amount I had was so little I didn't think it was going to affect me (It was the Eucharist at morning Mass). I am somewhat hopeful of Relora because I had a sexually explicit dream yet did not have an NE, which is quite amazing for me. I'm going to wait for my sleep to regulate back to "normal" and try it again.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 24/03/2008 23:31:56
John,

I would maybe recommend taking the Relora a little while before bed and not right before.  I've been noticing generally that taking some stuff right before bed messes with my sleep more than helps it.  I found this with both Theanine and holy basil, both of which I like generally.  Like maybe an hour before.

I'm encouraged generally by Relora over many other herbal relaxing substances, and I've tried them all.  From a lot of my reading of how these things work, many of them rely on playing with either serotonin or dopamine levels and this is a slippery slope I believe to getting unbalanced mentally/emotionally/physically.  The reason is I think its hard to play with those levels and keep yourself in your right mind as these are very sensitive alterations in the brain chemistry.  Get a little out of balance and you get depressed, lose your sex drive, generally get out of whack. It's easy to throw things out, I find.
 
Relora on the other hand, seems to work specifically on reducing cortisol levels which is the chemical produced when the body gets stressed.   So its less likely to play around with your brain, which is a good thing.  And stress is most definitely a direct result of POIS for me.
I'm really speaking for myself here, as I am very sensitive to these various anti anxiety, calming products.  Some people seem to swear by them.

As for POIS effectiveness, I only got modest help my last time, but that may be because I had just started taking it, PLUS I was mixing it with a lot of other stuff. 
I have felt very good taking it the last few days, but its now been 11 days since my last orgasm.  I still wouldn't recommend taking it all the time.  I am just using it for times when I'm under extra stress.

I still don't think I've found the magic pill for POIS yet but I never give up.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/03/2008 01:15:39
hk1979, and B_Jim, you sound like you've had some scientific training or studying. If I may ask, in what field?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pdawg on 28/03/2008 06:23:54
First of all, wanna say that I'm extremely glad to find a supportive forum on this topic.
I've been trying to search for this for a while but couldn't find anything.
Guys, I read many of the posts and some of the symptoms are just outrageously unfair.
Why do we get this weird condition?
So annoying..
I don't think I saw someone with the exact condition as mine.

I'm 20 and have a very annoying condition.
After orgasm (sex or masturbation) I have diarrhea.
The first time was about 5 years ago when I was 15-16
Back then it happened very rarely.
It was like this,
for about 1 month of the year, it would happen maybe half of the time.
So I didn't give much thought and ignored it.
As time went by, it got worse and worse.
Every year, the rate and the period grew slowly.
Now I'm 20, and the rate is worse than ever.
Even last year, it was like half of the time for maybe 3-4 months a year.
Since this year, it's been like 80% of the time so far for almost 4 months..
I'm so sad guys..help me out
Diarrhea comes within 20-60 minutes, but most likely around 30 minutes.
When it comes, it comes in a form of hurricane.
It's just once and the next day after a day or a day and half, I poop normal.
if I have sex right after the diarrhea, the second time around I don't have diarrhea (nothing to come out I guess)

Some other symptoms that I experience (5-10% of the time) are weird noise in my ears, headache and dizziness.

Is there something I can do to make these symptoms go away?
Has anyone here had similar symptoms and got rid of them?

Thanks guys
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/03/2008 16:47:56
Welcome, pdawg, sorry I don't have any silver bullet for you. We're all still struggling for answers. But I do have very mild symptoms that are similar to yours. Best wishes.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Onanist on 28/03/2008 17:21:40
wow.

just wow.

i can't even imagine what it must be like to have to refrain from sexual activity, and even avoid sexual stimuli in case of nocturnal emissions.

i hope things improve.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nopoison on 28/03/2008 17:39:52
Hi everyone, I followed this post for more than 6 months and finally decided to show up, generally I have a 10yrs experience of POIS, suffering from most of the symptoms you describe here.

I suppose its very difficult for newcomers (as well as people who just drop by from time to time, to check whether you know some sort of a cure for that syndrome) to follow the information supplied by members of that thread - profiles, medicines, protocols, diets, exercise routines and other backgrounds that could definitely help to identify some - maybe common - variables.

Thats why I founded a ning social network - where you can support this group in hopefully - more meaningful way.

Tell me what you think, and if you are interested we can create that network together to fight for our health. I am absolutely open to share administrators privileges with anyone interested.


the address of that forum/network is http://nopoison.ning.com/

I shall successively transfer content to that place adding more structure and meaning to it.

Hope to meet you there, feel free to comment it here or there.

Good night and good luck.

James






Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nopoison on 28/03/2008 17:42:55
Ah, and one more thing - english is not my first language, so forgive me my spelling or syntax mistakes ;)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 28/03/2008 19:07:46
Nopoison

I joined your network.

Welcome Pdawg,
I am amazed at how varied the symptoms are among everyone. 

Found out one thing that may help re DHEA.  Chromium picolinate.  My wife had a whole book on it and one thing it does is make DHEA naturally in the body.  It's very cheap too.  I've started taking it regularly, so we'll see.

Been feeling very dopey lately..don't know if its related to the Relora or the L-tyrosine I've been taking..or something else altogether.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 28/03/2008 20:14:27
Ah, and one more thing - english is not my first language, so forgive me my spelling or syntax mistakes ;)


Hi nopoison.

I do wish you well with your network.

Please forgive me if I have misunderstood your meaning of "I shall successively transfer content to that place adding more structure and meaning to it.".........but...it would be nice once you've copied and pasted all the info from here that perhaps some form of reciprocation in the way of a link back here would be nice..............maybe I misunderstood though, but I took that to mean that you'll transfer all the info from this site to yours....if I have got it wrong then I sincerely apologize |!

Good luck

neil

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/03/2008 20:29:13
LEVITRA Continued

I took Levitra _after_ release this morning, and I feel my usual 75% cure of POIS symptoms. And just knowing I have a place to report this (here!) helps a lot.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pdawg on 28/03/2008 22:40:29
thank you all for the welcome!
after looking at the symptoms, I realized mine is not that bad at all..
I really feel for John..
it's so weird, this condition..right?
embarrassing too..but good thing we have each other :)
let's help each other and come up with solutions
since my symptoms are getting worse (wasn't annoying enough for me to really look for solutions until now), I will try to look for solutions and try different stuff too.
if I succeed, or fail, I will let you guys know..
One more thing, if you have similar symptoms like mine (mainly diarrhea 30-60 minutes after sex) please let me know..I wanna know who has this particular condition so we can help each other out..I know I saw it somewhere a couple of times.
be healthy
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 29/03/2008 10:06:17
My conclusions
Diarrhea or strong desire to empty bowel
It happens only if the bowel has been filled
Very likely caused by an imbalance of bacteria in the bowel suddenly
An imbalance that could be because some part of the bowel bacteria is attacked by any substance segregated in the gut during an orgasm
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nopoison on 29/03/2008 16:53:23
Hey Neil, sorry for any misunderstanding. I`ve already added a link back to this thread - The only thing I`d like to do is to create a place where people can provide info on POIS and look for it easier than on this forum. my only intention is to help myself and people who suffer from POIS! :)

I think, that this thread is so vivid that it could be quite valuable to create some kind of archive that would collect most important data.

If I can do anything to integrate more seamlessly with this place - just let me know.

Cheers,
James  [O8)]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 30/03/2008 03:13:06
It is such a relief! Once again, my Levitra worked....even taking it after the release. 25+++ year-struggle. Giant, giant effect on my whole life.

But even with only 25% of the POIS intensity, it is still agonizing.

It seems like such a cruel malady, to always have the dark cloud of release - which is natural and universal in man - hanging over our heads.

The posting and reading here, though, has really helped a great deal.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 30/03/2008 09:06:58
Some other symptoms that I experience (5-10% of the time) are weird noise in my ears, headache and dizziness.

Well, I have been having it very bad lately. And the idea that it is all caused by problems in the stomach area is beginning to make a lot of sense now.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 31/03/2008 21:26:37
I suggest the people with diarhea start taking Prebiotics, Probiotics supplements as soon as they can. It is to cause healthy intestine. Also the Rye Bread is great! thanks solution I tried it, been taking one each day now.

demografx: no I am not a scientist I am a telecommunications engineer, but in the last year and a half I decided I will not rest until I find a cure, because things were getting worse, not better, and I had to make plans.

BTW you say you take Levitra only afterwards? So you are taking it not for the erection but only for POIS. But do you still get a healthy erection?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 31/03/2008 23:25:13
demografx: you can also sound like a scientist if you read through this site: http://www.nutros.com/ :-)  best site i've seen on the net regarding health.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: cdma77 on 01/04/2008 18:21:21
Hi,

I suffer some a lot of the same problems.  I am 41 yrs old and I have had this in some form for 19 yrs. I get:

Night sweats
Fatigue
Confusion
Insommonia
Nausea, lack of appititte
No drive to do anything
Irritable
Depression
Flu like symtoms

I take Androgel because of my low testosterone level, but it doesn't help this problem.  I also suffred form a bout of Prostitis.  My doctor said it may due to my lack of ejaculations.  His solution was for me to ejaculate more !:(

I see some people using Levitra, but why ?  I don't suffer from ED, but I tempted to lie just to get a sample if it helps.

I also suffer from nocturnal emissions once a weak which makes this problem worse.

I am tempted to try DHEA and get some Levitra.

Jeff
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/04/2008 02:45:26
LEVITRA

Jeff, I'd like to repeat the warning that Levitra can _posibly_ cause heart problems for those who don't have ED! (unverified source but worth checking out and working closely with your doctor...not only for this but ANY "recommendation" on this Forum - we don't all have the same chemical reactions!). Levitra affects blood flow.

Jeff, don't lie to your doctor! It's not worth the risk! Look at www.levitra.com and do some Google work with "risks".

hk1979, NO, I began taking Levitra strictly for ED (the POIS "cure" was an accidental discovery - which I might not have noticed were it not for being involved in this Forum...I might have simply thought I found a "reprieve" for unknown reasons) _before sex_, but this last time I forgot, so yes the erection was weak but i released anyway (boy, does this feel personal! [;D]) - and then took Levitra afterwards in the hope that it would work on POIS anyway. It did. One other time previously the same thing occurred and it worked by taking it afterwards again. Not as well as taking it beforehand but still very powerful. Don't ask me why!

By the way, my psychiatrist then suggested Cialis (he gave me a sample), a similar drug but longer lasting so he thought it might help POIS even more...but it was a DISASTER! (It didn't work at all, so the disapointment was very intense).

hk1979, congratulations on your persistence and determination! This POIS-garbage is an evil anomaly. It's hurt a big chunk of my life for 25+++ years that's for sure. And, I'm sure, the lives of many others.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: cdma77 on 02/04/2008 20:20:43
Demografx,

I was wondering what meds you take in addition to Levitra?  I am taking Effexor for depression, however it doesn't do much plus that fact in raised my bp now I have to take bp medication.  You said something like Addderal and Symbalta.  I am wondering if I should try something else if it is really like serotonin re uptake that needs to be blocked.  Any ideas?  I have talked to my doctor about the POIS since I am sure they would say that this problem is nonsense.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/04/2008 22:52:01
I'm on Cymbalta and Adderall, for depression and adhd respectively, but the Adderall has done wonders for my depression. From what I understand, everyone is different and it might take several tries before the right formula is found for you. Be as patient as possible, I know it's hard. I'm impatient myself.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 04/04/2008 01:28:48
Hi Demografx

How did you find the Cialis for erections. Can you explain in more detail how it was a disaster for POIS ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 04/04/2008 02:13:39
Bizzy,


It just didn't work. At all. The "disaster" was my expectation that it would work BETTER than Levitra and the resulting disappointment on top of the usual POIS agony.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 07/04/2008 01:04:29
demografx thanks for explaining :-) we need to get to the bottom of the fact that Levitra works. I do not have ED, but it doesn't go as large as it used to be :-) but it is not a good enough reason for the doctor to give me Levitra. So we need to find out what Levitra has that helps with this problem after sex.

B_Jim and solution > altough this is a link more related to muscle building, it is a really good read about what all the things are that can help resuce cortisol:

http://www.leehayward.com/cortisol.htm

I still strongly believe that POIS is related to cortisol, and by following a diet where cortisol is eliminated, I am sure the effects of POIS will be dampened.

If anyone knows if there is a relationship with cortisol to Levitra, please let me know.

Thanks
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 08/04/2008 07:12:21
Hello all,

I don't wish to be rude and bud in unexpectedly, but I was referred to this forum because it seems I have a particular version of POIS.  After so many years of hell with this problem, I'm willing to do almost anything to find a solution.

I'm 21, light (124lbs), and extremely fit. The problem is after ejaculation by means of a wet dream or masturbation results in a lack of concentration (brain fog), poor memory, confusion, and fatigue. Basically, for 5 to 6 days it becomes extremely difficult to concentrate on anything, I simply cannot sustain a train of thought to think things through. I become extremely absent minded to the point where I forget I'm holding something in my hand causing me to drop it. Its extremely difficult to read, hold conversations, follow lectures, take tests, remember things, and learn things. I feel extremely tired and jittery, both physically and mentally. I also become depressed during this time. Its like being totally burned out in the head; much like how people after an epileptic attack are. Also, I get strong headaches after masturbation. Allow me to repeat, these symptoms last 5 to 6 days! So its having a huge affect on my life. I've gone to a neurologist, but he doesn't seem to know whats wrong. He prescribed an ssri, but only because I mentioned I get depression after an orgasm.  I've gone through extensive blood tests for neurotransmitter levels, hormone levels, and so forth, but all results showed up normal, with the exception of prolactin being slightly high.  Overall, it doesn't seem like the doctors around me are willing help.  All five doctors I've seen are totally baffled.

So far L-phenylalanine and L-tyrosine supplements help a little bit with recovering quicker, as well as using sleeping pills to get as much energy as I can out of sleeping.

These supplements are, as I've come to discover, the precursors of dophamine, which may be being inhibited for an extended period of time by a small growth on my pituitary that secretes an excess of prolactin.  My guess is artificially increasing dophamin will inhibit the excess prolactin and restore some of my concentration.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 08/04/2008 23:12:40
Pyropeach, welcome. Your condition sounds similar to mine and many others here. I tried l-tyrosine recently and I did not have any POIS symptoms at all, but I did feel mentally off in a non-POIS way, perhaps 500mg was too much I don't know. I hope you can get off sleeping pills soon, as they are not good to take, as your body will get dependent on them. I have chronic insomnia and I am glad that I was able to stop sleeping pills, which I was on for years. I was also on Paxil, same story as you my doc thought my problems were based on a depression. I am glad I am off those meds as well.

Relora has been suggested in this forum based on the theory of a PIOS/cortisol connection. I tried Relora last week, I had two 250mg pills on Saturday and one on Sunday and man did I feel drugged... it had a profound effect on me, way too powerful. I'm not sure if it can be beneficial to me yet, it I ever try it again I will use big time caution (small amounts). I am still waiting for my sleep to re-regulate after trying the Relora, it messed it up pretty good.

Excessive prolactin, interesting theory. I once considered that low levels might be of influence... I will have to learn more about this hormone.

 

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pdawg on 09/04/2008 22:42:55
Guys, I have good news..
as hk1979 (thanks again) said,
people with diarrhea symptom after ejaculation need to take probiotics ASAP!
there are many and consult your pharmacist for better answer but there is one on amazon

http://www.amazon.com/Primadophilus-Bifidus-Adult-90-Caps/dp/B00068G5OG/ref=pd_bbs_1?ie=UTF8&s=hpc&qid=1207776873&sr=8-1

might not be the best one out there so go to your local pharmacy

no more diarrhea after orgasm!
the cause was weak intestines and i guess not enough bacteria in my gut flora
i still get a mild irritation in my bowels, farts and stuff, but still
also got a light headache once in like 6 times, so that's good
go to the pharmacy, gogogo
ask for bifidobacterium (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bifidus)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: nopoison on 10/04/2008 00:02:46
hello, while searching for more info on POIS I came across many sites that treat about 'sexual exhaustion' - which I believe is something very similar (if not itself) to POIS.

check out this forum and share your opinion, most symptoms seems very familiar: http://recover.forumup.org/

you are always welcome to check http://nopoison.ning.com for more info,

stay tuned - work in progress ;)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Netherlands2008 on 10/04/2008 20:23:08
I am from the Netherlands, so my english is not perfect! I have also POIS. I also visited Dr Waldinger in Leyenburg in Den Haag Netherlands. He told me i had POIS. We made an appointment that he would send me to an other Doctor to do a test. You had to give sperm and then you could see the results. Afer this visit i never hearded about this anymore. I tried to call him, but he was always away (seminars netherlands/other countries). He did not have a secretary in hospital Leyenburg, but i spoke some other secretary. They said he did not have a secretary so she would drop a note in his box. You understand i never heard anything! So i did call again....same story and again she would drop a note. Again i did not hear anything.
But anyhow i know now what i have....POIS. I did have it from my 17 till now mid 40! Because i did have it so early i did get used to it and i managed to have normal sex live (boys do not ejaculate always...only when it is so special that.... :) for me it is working!) Nevertheless i have periods ..month's that i am extreme sensible to POIS, but many other month's, because of my new way of seeing to have sex and ejaculations, i can have normal sex live.
About Dr Waldinger i still think he is a serious guy ! but i think he is also teacher at an University and neuropsychiater, always searching for new sexual deseases to explore..... He is always on his way ..travelling/seminars etc etc. I do not think he has solutions! and we who have POIS are here not many on earth, so we are not commercial interesting!
best regards from Holland.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 11/04/2008 01:56:41
Heres an interesting idea I came up with whilst day-dreaming. I believe that most men experience a downturn in mood after orgasm ( remember the man who turns over and goes to sleep ). This post orgasmic depression is natures way of keeping the man around the woman he has just impregnated. This downturn is usually not severe and recovery soon occurs. With POIS the men do not recover because of a fault within the hypothalamus. There can be a number of reasons for this fault from genetics to childhood trauma. The recovery system does not function and the man remains depressed.
It is important to elucidate what hormone or neuro-peptide is resposible for this recovery system.
Too much cortisol or CRF might be responsible for the failure.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/04/2008 18:40:20

demografx thanks for explaining :-) we need to get to the bottom of the fact that Levitra works. I do not have ED, but it doesn't go as large as it used to be :-) but it is not a good enough reason for the doctor to give me Levitra. So we need to find out what Levitra has that helps with this problem after sex.

...If anyone knows if there is a relationship with cortisol to Levitra, please let me know.

Thanks

hk1979, I absolutely agree: we need to get to the bottom of this. Along those lines, I have been wondering now for a long time:

WOULD IT BE BENEFICIAL FOR THIS POIS FORUM TO HIRE A UROLOGIST OR CHEMIST OR OTHER PROFESSIONAL/SCIENTIST TO HELP US SORT THIS OUT? (not just Levitra, but cortisol, dopamine, relora, serotonin, DHEA, i.e., all the credible ideas presented here)

I don't think any of us here have the credentials needed to take this seriously to the next step, that is, to come up with solid recommendations to combat POIS that can be implemented by the POIS-sufferer and his doctor based on the patient's individual needs!

And it wouldn't cost us much if the consulting fees were spread out over all the willing members here. We could even agree on a budget _beforehand_ (e.g., let's have this consultant review all the POIS FORUM posts and see what we get for US$100,$200, or $300 etc.)

EVERYONE: PLEASE TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK OF THIS IDEA!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/04/2008 20:56:43
B_Jim, Thank you! I'm all for any way to take this to the next step.

I have a feeling that somewhere within all the POIS Forum posts here - and with a trained, medical/scientific eye - lies an answer to relieve much suffering!

B_Jim, can you write to ISSM? Or tell me what should go in the letter and I'll write/send it?

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/04/2008 21:04:41
TO EVERYONE:

If you are interested in our finding an outside consultant to study all our POIS posts and formulate concrete medical testing recommendations that you can share with your doctor, please indicate your interest by: I suggest a date of APRIL 20 (for your yes or no) - so far, it's me and B_Jim.

We need more than 2 people to hire/pay for POIS medical/consulting services. BUT YOUR "YES" WILL NOT COMMIT YOU TO ANY SPECIFIC AMOUNT OF MONEY. Just an indication of willingness to participate. We can then decide amongst us how much we are willing to invest.

Thank you very much for your consideration of this effort.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 13/04/2008 22:51:29
Yes, I would be interested in the outside consultant idea.  Of course, I guess one tricky part could be figuring out what area of expertise the consultant should have...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 14/04/2008 02:03:37
If it has to do with hormones and glands, I suppose an endocrinologist  would be the right type of consultant to get. Diabetes is the main type of disorder they usually deal with, but I firmly believe POIS is almost the same reaction to sex as diabetes is to sugar. Both also are closely related to cortisol hormone. Please read this link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocrinologist

BTW I am also in, but remember I am in South Africa, our currency is very weak against the US Dollar (8/1), so my contribution will not be so high.

But I suppose our Endocrinologists will also be the cheapest to hire? I'll find out what they charge for research....
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 14/04/2008 04:47:06
Yes, I agree that endicrinology seems like the closest field to POIS-issues.  However, I went to see an endocrinologist recently, who said that given his training, he had no ideas and no suggestions for me.  That was discouraging, but I suppose that other endocrinologists could have more insight.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 14/04/2008 07:25:19
Can anyone recommend a top endocrinologist?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 14/04/2008 22:57:51
Jim, I would not say my experience with Relora was bad, only that it affected me a lot. My insomnia is very sensitive to substances, even a wee bit of alcohol will throw me off. If anything my experience is positive in that it demonstrates that it actually has a real effect, perhaps not beneficial for POIS, that's undetermined as of yet.

Demografx I do not think it is profitable to invest hiring a consultant. Many years of strange looks from doctors and test after test unable to find a problem or at least demonstrate it...I have given up spending time or money on it, other than perhaps the occasional supplement. I do much better to just avoid it. I think any consultant would be very expensive and I am very doubtful of any success. Any researcher would need data to analyze. Perhaps someone with an in depth knowledge of human physiology could listen to our experiences and give some suggestions, but I am doubtful that it would be worthwile.


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 15/04/2008 04:29:27
My experience with doctors have been the same-even my endocrinologist who just looked at me funny.  Suffice it to say, they've given up because they simply can't find anything wrong no matter how many tests they run.

Though I'd like to mention a method that has greatly helped reduce the symptoms in intensity and duration; I get better in a matter of a single day as opposed to an entire week.  The way it works is a little weird and people tend to ignore it whenever I try to discuss it.  Basically it is prolonged masturbation without ejaculation.  I came across it in my own research about POIS - apparently its an ancient Chinese tradition of Taoism where they believed prolonged masturbation without ejaculation enhances wellbeing and health.  To my surprise, it does have a noticeable affect on me...its not perfect, but its better than nothing.

There's also some scientific evidence that seems to support this found here if anyone is interested:
http://joe.endocrinology-journals.org/cgi/reprint/177/1/57

It seems just before orgasm, levels of epinephrine and norepinephrine reach a peak.  I think its possible that if ejaculation is avoided, no orgasm occurs and these chemicals are not allowed to drop from their peaks.  Likewise, levels of dopamine would also stay at its peak that would inhibit any excess prolactin present (which in my case is unusually high, which is said to inhibit dopamine).  I think its possible that its the replenishment of dopamine that restores concentration and the feeling of well being.  Of course anything could be happening.  One thing I know for sure is that this is probably the most direct method I know of how to change the levels of chemicals in our body, and somehow these changes trigger these levels to reset at a quicker pace than having to wait for an entire week.  This method has worked better than any of the medications and supplements I have tried...or should I say endured...

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 15/04/2008 14:35:45
Pyropeach,

That method sounds interesting--when did you first discover it?  Do you find that it makes a difference whether the masturbation-without-orgasm session goes on for an extended period of time, repeatedly getting close to orgasm and then stopping, or does it work just as well if you simply get close to orgasm once and then stop?

Also, how soon after you have the POIS-inducing orgasm do you employ this 'reset' method?  Right away? Within a couple hours? Or the next day?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 15/04/2008 17:47:44
Discovered it about 3 years ago, but only started trying it in the recent year.  At least for me, the method works pretty well by getting close to orgasm only once and then stopping.  Repeated this method an additional time did not seem to have any additional affect that felt significant.  I've been able to successfully use this method in as little as within a few hours after getting the symptoms.  In a matter of minutes, the symptoms start to diminish and by the next day the symptoms are still there, but to the point where they're almost gone and I can get on with the day.  It sounds pretty good, but I'm not jumping for joy because it is a very inconvenient and frustrating thing to do,

My main worry about this is it being a placebo affect, which I doubt, but still consider it a possibility.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 15/04/2008 21:48:00
pyropeach

thanks for sharing, as it explains also why smoking a cigarette after sex also helps a bit... nicotine elevates epinephrine and norepinephrine levels.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 16/04/2008 02:39:47
Can anyone recommend a top endocrinologist?

I dont think just an endocrinologist will be able to shed any more light. A research endocrinologist tied to a university would be the best way forward. Ill leave it up to you guys to find and presuade one.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 16/04/2008 02:43:22
Yes, I agree with Bizzy that a research endocrinologist, rather than simply a clinical endocrinologist, would be more likely to be of help.  It seems that many clinical endocrinologists are only trained to diagnose things that are already 'in the books.'
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 16/04/2008 11:49:58
exactly Guthrie! our doctors always refer to the books, and then find nothing related, therefor the reason why we are all monitoring this site.... waiting for a solution. it should be somebody thats more than a doctor. somebody that is a professor in endocrinology at a university. and I think he would not even charge us if it will make him famous!

I think we can contact the University of Oxford. Below is the link:

http://www.medsci.ox.ac.uk/gazette/previousissues/54vol2/Part19
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/04/2008 19:42:49
POIS FORUM ADVISOR - NEXT STEP

hk1979, excellent point about "POIS fame" AND "...more than a doctor needed"! - now, would someone please volunteer to initiate the contact with Oxford? (I'm a musician, and there are people here better qualified to write to a scientist than me, plus I have a bias with 75% POIS cure with Levitra). It should be mentioned that there is only one paper out on POIS, but that this is a critical cure mission, surely to be covered by the media, as was Dr Waldinger's POIS study/article). If Oxford doesn't cooperate there are many other prospects, and the same letter can be used.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/04/2008 20:48:58
For John21 and those of you who mentioned "blank stares" from doctors, I've been there!!! But maybe, just MAYBE, the 21 pages on this Forum reveal that POIS is............R E A L !!!!!!!! We also have some success to show, e.g., Levitra. But now we need to find out (just as an example here) what makes Levitra work for POIS, and how can everyone benefit whether they have ED or not?

I'm sure that if today we approached those same doctors who gave us blank stares in the past, and SHOWED them the 21 Pages here, that some of the doctors (not all, because after all - -  lazy is lazy [:)]) might sit up and take notice. And then actually DO something about our POIS [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 17/04/2008 11:12:16
I would collect and put in this forum keyboards like Bayer, Novartis, Merck, Pfizer, Roche, Glaxo, Quintiles and POIS.
The target is to attract people and scientists to get here and learn about this uncovered illness that affect many men in this world.
Why not all of us write an request to  clinical.info@quintiles.com requiring an investigation about POIS as well?

Hi Solution,


May I ask if you are in any way affiliated with Quintiles ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 17/04/2008 22:58:05
Quote
Solution:
... is well known that too much masturbation sucked the life force of a man.

B_Jim: Be careful with a such statement. We have a problem after ejaculation, but that's not a general rule. We can't afford to lose the little credibility that we have.

It may be possible that the phenomenon is more universal, but that only certain people are more affected in such a direct, extreme manner. I have wondered if many common everyday mental disturbances such as depression, bipolar, schizophrenia, emotional disturbances etc were partially born of "sex abuse", the product of lust in adolescence.

Unmentionable, unrecognized... unsolvable.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 18/04/2008 14:56:37
or what is the consequences of having TOO MUCH ORGASMS over a spread of 20 years?...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 18/04/2008 19:33:56
B_Jim, an Oriental acupuncturist/herbal medicine practitioner years ago - when I trusted her, then told her about my POIS - was _convinced_ that my POIS was because I had (too) small adrenal glands.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 18/04/2008 19:37:29
Yes I am the owner..  just kidding...

I'm not sure if you're kidding about commercialism or not, but one serious point I have: the pharmaceutical giants have no interest in anything this small of a population. My guess is that POIS suffering is limited to a tiny, tiny percentage. Big Pharma only makes money on problems affecting large segments of the population.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 18/04/2008 20:04:16
Just out of curiosity, how many of us are there on this forum with POIS?

B_Jim, an Oriental acupuncturist/herbal medicine practitioner years ago - when I trusted her, then told her about my POIS - was _convinced_ that my POIS was because I had (too) small adrenal glands.

The last doctor I saw also thought the problems were in the adrenals.  However, they found no abnormalities from blood and urine tests.  I used to use DHEA thinking it would help with adrenal fatigue, but it always quickly wore off probably because it was acting more as neuralsteroid, and only masking the symptoms.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 19/04/2008 17:24:26
It may be possible that the phenomenon is more universal, but that only certain people are more affected in such a direct, extreme manner. I have wondered if many common everyday mental disturbances such as depression, bipolar, schizophrenia, emotional disturbances etc were partially born of "sex abuse", the product of lust in adolescence.

Unmentionable, unrecognized... unsolvable. Unthinkable in today's world.


I think you make a valid point about "sex abuse", too much sex. I think it is true for some people and for people who mix sex with drugs such as cocaine. But I can remember feeling confused, depressed and depersonalized from my very first few orgasms, "sex abuse" had not taken place yet. So I know POIS is not exclusively tied to "sex abuse", its a lot more complex.
As for other mental conditions becomming worse after orgasm, im sure that happens for some people. Why that happens is not known. The condition or underlying mechanism has not been studied.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/04/2008 04:09:46
SUGAR

I must admit that I'm guilty of excessive sugar intake for most of my life. Wonder if that's why I have POIS?? If so, I wonder what connection Levitra has...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 21/04/2008 15:54:57
Me too. I even used to prepare and enjoy a drink made only with water sugar and ice. Eating bread with butter and sugar I ve used to do so when younger.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 22/04/2008 01:37:56
Heres some science that I worked out that may help explain why too much sugar is bad for the mind.
High sugar makes your insulin levels go up, which makes your growth hormone levels go down. Lower growth hormone levels is bad news because it allows for relatively higher CRF levels within the hypothalamus. Higher CRF levels at the hypothalamus maybe the cause of some mental illness.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/04/2008 05:36:41
Well, when Levitra works it's 75% magic for my POIS, but I continue my excess with sugar (no, I'm not proud of it). I wonder if I quit sugar and continue with Levitra if it would be a 100% cure? But sugar is soooooooooooooooo hard for me to quit!!! I'll just wait for B_Jim's experiment! [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 22/04/2008 14:46:40
I love sugar, it makes me feel better. Every cell in your body, including your brain cells, need sugar to function normally. I just dont think low to moderate amount of sugar is bad for you. I dont think you will achieve anything from quitting sugar.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 22/04/2008 21:47:53
Bizzy, do you ever have a sugar crash? I do. But then again, I'm not exactly moderate with it!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 23/04/2008 01:04:27
What is a sugar crash ?. How do you get it and what does it feel like ?. Ive never heard of it.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 23/04/2008 02:12:55
I think you're definitely close to something when you talk about adrenals, but I won't agree it's the whole picture.  I've been taking tyrosine for what its worth. 

I'd like to share my recent experiences.
Like many of us, I dread POIS so I avoid ejaculation.  This time around, I was more determined than ever to avoid it and I went almost 4 weeks without one...sort of.
What happened for me which had never happened before is that I just masturbated to 'the edge' and would then stop.  But what was interesting this time was that one time I went slightly past that point of no return but then with absolute focus, I stopped the orgasm just as it was starting, just leaking out a little semen and suffering no ill effects.  Had to make sure all contact with the penis was ceased at that moment (you knw how it is).  I had never done this before.   I then proceeded to experience the same thing twice more in the following week, leaking out just a little semen each time.  So I had developed a new skill.
But then of course, the pressure builds and one day you just want to come, damn it, and so I let myself start to come, but then decided, hey I'll try stopping it again because I'm not so sure about this, and lo and behold, I even managed to turn off the semen after a few good squirts.
Now the significance of this to you all and myself, is that after this particular episode, I had satisfied enough my need for release BUT to my amazement, no POIS!
It's like I can handle losing some semen, especially after a more lengthy period, with no effects.
Now I know this may be useless if you actually are with a woman (I am but my wife has lost interest in sex..we're 55) because it's hard to focus enough to turn it off if you're inside her and also if you use condoms they are stimulating by themselves on the penis head.
But for me this is progress and I'll take it.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 23/04/2008 11:49:35
Hallo just to answer the question on sugar:

You get Glucose, Sucrose and Fructose.

Sugar as we know it, is purely Sucrose.

Our bodies convert them into Glucose and Fructose through some processes.
For some people sugar is very sensitive in the endocrine system, causing a chronic disease called Diabetes. Other people tends to get this "sugar crash", similar to POIS, after a "sugar rush". It is because sugar spikes the hormones, just like a drug, and you get high on energy for a short while, until you go down, which is called the crash (what goes up must come down).

Always remember the following:

Carbohydrate Energy Lifetime:
High GI carbohydrates like glucose (Glycemic Index) - Energy from 10-30 minutes.
Low GI carbohydrates like pasta and rice - Energy from 60 - 240 minutes
Protein - energy after 3 hours going on for more than a day.

Remember to mix in minerals, vitamins, fatty acids and water into your diet, as they work together with energy (protein and carbohydrates).

Like B_Jim said, always use 2:1 Carbohydrate:Protein ratio, as you will become fat otherwise.

Important Vitamins: C, B, E
Important Minerals: Magnesium, Calcium, Zinc, Iron.
Imortant Fatty Acids: Omega 3 and 6.

The amount/portion of protein you take in at one time frame of 3 hours, should not be more than a fist size, and remember to take in double the amount of carbohydrates at the same time (not more than double and not too much sugar!!!), because protein also needs quick energy to be digested properly, otherwise you get tired and sleepy.

AND... if you take carbohydrates, especially High GI, and especially sugar, without any protein, you can expect a Sugar Crash, unless you are exercising afterwards.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/04/2008 19:27:11
ABOUT FIDDLERPAUL'S EXPERIENCE

For some time, I practiced a Taoist technique of withholding semen yet still having an orgasm. (For those of you curious, the author of the book is Mantak Chia, he has a couple books out). But, for me, the orgasm still resulted in full-blown POIS. Someone else I asked said that the orgasm affects the central nervous system, and that orgasm leads to POIS, and that it has nothing to do with the semen release.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 23/04/2008 19:32:11
VOLUNTEER NEEDED

Would someone be willing to initiate contact with a research endocrinologist to study the posts here?

Someone mentioned Oxford. And possibly to do this at no charge since the results can make them famous!

As I mentioned earlier, I think others here are better qualified than me, with more of a scientific orientation.

THANK YOU!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 23/04/2008 20:33:45
Jim,
I think its a case of if you affect one aspect you can affect the other.
I don't know if you read my original story, but I once had 3 months where I had no POIS and on the contrary felt BETTER afterwards.  The reason was I had been spiritually transformed on some energetic level of my being and it turned the sexual release into an energy building process somehow.  My whole life was that way. 
But no doubt now x amount of semen release equals more likelihood of POIS as somehow the system is stressed.  I'm just glad that I have something after, what is it now, 42 years of sexual activity. 
I am fairly skeptical of a chemical solution after trying a number of things over my life, but then, I'm way too sensitive to a lot of substances and for every good effect there always seems to be a price to pay.

Congratulations but once again you avoid the problem with this trick but you don't resolve it. :)
But it seems to prove POIS is mainly hormonal and maybe not/less neurologic as i originally thought. With the semen retention trick you avoid to start the hormonal cycle engaged by ejaculation (DHEA, testosterone). We probably have a temporary difficult to produce theses hormones (Adrenal glands tired ? Lazy ? ... ).


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 23/04/2008 23:07:29
Quote
I had been spiritually transformed on some energetic level of my being

huh?!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/04/2008 02:23:04
...i have contacted on my side an endocrinologist to ask infos about adrenal glands.I hope he will give me new elements. And I wait final results of a case who is testing the low carbs diet.His first results are encouraging.  Then, I will write to ISSM to ask if we can have acces to the study they have.

Excellent, B_Jim, thank you!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/04/2008 02:43:09

(1)
...But no doubt now x amount of semen release equals more likelihood of POIS...

(2) 
...I am fairly skeptical of a chemical solution after trying a number of things over my life...

(1)
In my experience, semen release has no connection to POIS. "Taoist-technique" orgasms (without semen release) have still led to very strong bouts of POIS for me.

(2)
Levitra cures 50-75% of my POIS now. The lower % occurs when there is not enough time lapsed between releases. For me, that means weeks.

As always, please note that using Levitra without ED may possibly lead to heart problems. Always consult a physician.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 24/04/2008 06:47:22
OK, I know it sounds weird, but its a long story and involved being involved with a 'guru' kind of guy that I somehow picked up on his energy and became conscious of myself as separate from everything, but only for 3 months, I don't know why only that long.  It was very liberating and also depressing when it ended.  I could elaborate but...well, if you really want to know, let me know and I can go into it.

Quote
I had been spiritually transformed on some energetic level of my being

huh?!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 24/04/2008 06:50:51
Ok, I'll grant you it may not be that, but the stopping of the full orgasm to its conclusion accomplished something...then what?  We are energetic beings and there is nothing more extreme energetically than an orgasm taken to its conclusion.  The shifting of energies has effects which ripple throughout ones emotional/physical/spiritual being in ways we cannot fully understand. 
If I was once in a state where I could feel good from orgasm based on my spiritual alignment within, and experience POIS when not in as good an alignment, then it begs the question...


(1)
...But no doubt now x amount of semen release equals more likelihood of POIS...

(2) 
...I am fairly skeptical of a chemical solution after trying a number of things over my life...

(1)
In my experience, semen release has no connection to POIS. "Taoist-technique" orgasms (without semen release) have still led to very strong bouts of POIS for me.

(2)
Levitra cures 50-75% of my POIS now. The lower % occurs when there is not enough time lapsed between releases. For me, that means weeks.

As always, please note that using Levitra without ED may possibly lead to heart problems. Always consult a physician.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 24/04/2008 13:30:05
Hi fellow POIS sufferers

Do you folks find that POIS seriously affects every aspect of your life everyday ?.
I find this a very powerful illness which affects me everyday. This is because the mental symptoms linger for so long after an orgasm.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 25/04/2008 01:43:47
but the stopping of the full orgasm to its conclusion accomplished something...


fiddlerpaul, does this technique relieve your POIS symptoms if you do it while you're symptomatic?  I ask because right after doing this technique, my POIS symptoms are greatly diminished when I have them.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 25/04/2008 06:23:02
Hi fellow POIS sufferers

Do you folks find that POIS seriously affects every aspect of your life everyday ?.
I find this a very powerful illness which affects me everyday. This is because the mental symptoms linger for so long after an orgasm.


Not only do they linger, but the constant THREAT of the NEXT orgasm>>POIS cycle hanging over our heads surely affects our daily living as well.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 25/04/2008 18:24:22
too much sugar is very very bad!!! if you feel you drank something with too much sugar, like a Coke, try to find something with protein to balance it, like fish or meat, but within 30 minutes.

the worst POIS that I ever had was after 5 orgasms within 3 hours. I fell asleep, and after I woke up, I was so tired, and during the day I got a  fever and I was notious. I ended up in the clinic. I was too scared to tell them what I did, but they took me up and put me on a drip with electrolytes. I felt much better after two hours of this treatment.

It made me think that POIS is directly link to complete depletion of energy levels, and in South Africa there is a drink that helps with this called Lucozade:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucozade

It consist primarily of Glucose.

Like I said before, don't take DHEA more than a month. Try to follow the correct diet, but it is very easy. Don't take Protein alone and when you take carbohydrate alone, not too much, otherwise search for some protein to add.

And if you take carbohydrate, try to avoid SUCROSE (sugar). Look for products with Glucose and even better, Fructose. You will feel so much better!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 26/04/2008 01:23:07
OK, I know it sounds weird, but its a long story and involved being involved with a 'guru' kind of guy that I somehow picked up on his energy and became conscious of myself as separate from everything, but only for 3 months, I don't know why only that long.  It was very liberating and also depressing when it ended.  I could elaborate but...well, if you really want to know, let me know and I can go into it.

Please elaborate....was he a sex guru....
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: curtis19786 on 26/04/2008 20:34:45
Hi everybody. I also suffer from most of the symptoms ever since I began ejaculating.. I am 30 years old.. Similar to the experience of most of you, these rare symptoms have been attributed to psychological factors by the doctors I contacted, which is really disappointing.. By chance, during my efforts to find something through the web, I found the abstract of thearticle published by M. Waldinger and it has been good to learn at least that I am not crazy :) and there are others like me..

I am living in Turkey, therefore I did not have the chance to talk to Mr. Waldinger face to face, I only contacted him through e-mail and received a few messages (I received the latest one a few years ago) that indicated they have still been working on this issue but could not come up with a final solution.. Later on, I could not reach him even through his e-mail. I have no clue about their progress.

With this e-mail I just wanted to say hi to you all. I hope finally we will have a solution for this really annoying and disappointing set of symptoms..
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 27/04/2008 16:18:22
I haven't tried it while suffering symptoms because SO far I've managed to avoid another full orgasm.
Can't believe how good I'm getting at this.  At first it happened just because I was desperate not to have orgasm but now I can turn it off pretty easily. 
The only explanation I can think for why it would help in your situation is that the rush of endorphin chemicals from getting to orgasm might counterattack your symptoms.

but the stopping of the full orgasm to its conclusion accomplished something...


fiddlerpaul, does this technique relieve your POIS symptoms if you do it while you're symptomatic?  I ask because right after doing this technique, my POIS symptoms are greatly diminished when I have them.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: fiddlerpaul on 27/04/2008 16:23:11
No.  He was connected to a popular meditation group but had experienced 'enlightenment' and had broken off from their group.  He had a powerful presence about him and I learned some meditation techniques from him.  The problem was I had already been doing another spiritual practise and at one point I decided his was not what I wanted, so I had actually quit going to him and doing his practise when this experience came to me. 
I experienced a sense of myself that was separate from everything else and this freed me to not be threatened by anyone or anything.  I had/have been prone to insecurity and fear through my life, so this was quite an experience and I found myself able to love others and have a very rich experience, and most significantly had more overall energy.  One day after 3 months, it just broke up and left me back where I had been.  During that time orgasms were a gas and I would just keep on truckin after them.
OK, I know it sounds weird, but its a long story and involved being involved with a 'guru' kind of guy that I somehow picked up on his energy and became conscious of myself as separate from everything, but only for 3 months, I don't know why only that long.  It was very liberating and also depressing when it ended.  I could elaborate but...well, if you really want to know, let me know and I can go into it.

Please elaborate....was he a sex guru....
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/04/2008 20:24:01

(1) too much sugar is very very bad!!!

(2) in South Africa there is a drink that helps with this called Lucozade:

It consist primarily of Glucose.



hk1979: I thought Glucose _is_ sugar!!!???
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 27/04/2008 20:28:10
Hi everybody. I also suffer from most of the symptoms ever since I began ejaculating.. I am 30 years old.. Similar to the experience of most of you, these rare symptoms have been attributed to psychological factors by the doctors I contacted, which is really disappointing.. By chance, during my efforts to find something through the web, I found the abstract of thearticle published by M. Waldinger and it has been good to learn at least that I am not crazy :) and there are others like me..

I am living in Turkey, therefore I did not have the chance to talk to Mr. Waldinger face to face, I only contacted him through e-mail and received a few messages (I received the latest one a few years ago) that indicated they have still been working on this issue but could not come up with a final solution.. Later on, I could not reach him even through his e-mail. I have no clue about their progress.

With this e-mail I just wanted to say hi to you all. I hope finally we will have a solution for this really annoying and disappointing set of symptoms..

Welcome, Curtis!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: cdma77 on 28/04/2008 05:10:30
Hi,

I haven't posted in a while.  I have noticed that if I masturbate WITHOUT ejaculation I still feel bad.  I am wondering if the loss of prejaculation fluid from the prostate, etc., maybe part of the problem, or all of it.  Has anybody noticed this?  I also notice REALLY vivid dreams and I could sleep for 10 hours!

Jeff
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 29/04/2008 16:55:27
I get POIS only after a full release, a partial release does'nt do it. I think POIS is triggered only after a signal is sent from the testicles to the hypothalamus for the manufacture of GnRH. So in some people this signal might be occuring without a full release, as I have read on this forum.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 30/04/2008 23:27:10

(1) too much sugar is very very bad!!!

(2) in South Africa there is a drink that helps with this called Lucozade:

It consist primarily of Glucose.



hk1979: I thought Glucose _is_ sugar!!!???

You are right that glucose is in sugar, but not 100%. Sugar as we know it, is called Sucrose.

Your body still need to change it into Glucose. Glucose and Fructose is better to take directly. They are used for body electrolyte recharge.

Diabetes will fall ill when taking sugar, but it is OK for them to take Fructose, as Fructose is called the LOW GI sugar. It doesn't give that spike, therefor it also doesn't have that sugar crash :-)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 02/05/2008 05:41:55
I believe that there are 2 groups of individuals with pois.
1st those with diarrhea after an orgasm and 2nd those with constipation after an orgasm.
In my case I am in the second group.
What are your views on you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: deloun on 02/05/2008 12:43:31
Hi, I'm new on this forum, I discovered this thread recently while I was searching the internet for the post orgasmic illness syndrome, to see if there's already more to find about POIS. To my surprise I found this thread about POIS which is a real support to me after I've read through all the posts and I all the nasty symptoms and huge struggles recognised that this disease brings with it.

I have POIS ever since I became sexually active, though for a long time I didn't know that my complaints occur after sexual activity, because they appear very gradually and last for at least two weeks.
I suffer from complaints like severe to extreme tension (physically and mentally), nervousness, depression, anxiety, insecurity, concentration problems, cognitive memory problems, tiredness, frequently occuring diarrhea and other complaints ever since before my teen years.

I've tried many therapies and tried many ways and searches to find a solution to my complaints and always suspected that I might suffer from them because of difficult and traumatic experiences that I experienced in my youth (not sexually related).
Only until many years later I began suspecting that my complaints might be linked to sexual activity. Although before that I already had the feeling that sexual activity might have some influence on my complaints but at first I didn't believe it was the main source where they came from and part of me wanted to deny the possibility that my complaints might be linked to sexual activity. Also the fact that the symptoms after sexual activity appear very gradually and last for at least two weeks or more for me, made it less obvious to recognise where they come from.
At some point I began tracking the link to sexual activity and my complaints and it became actually very obvious that all my complaints occur after sexual activity.

Some time later I searched for quite some time and discovered about POIS on the internet, about 1½ years ago and read about dr. Waldinger and his research about POIS. I made an appointment with him and he confirmed that I have POIS. He told me that he thinks that POIS might be caused by an allergy to your own sperm and he referred me to an allergologist who did a test and found a reaction to my sperm.
Though I don't think that POIS is caused by an allergy to my own sperm. I discovered that the complaints also occur after sexual activity without having an ejaculation/orgasm.

Since before I knew of POIS, I always suspected that the symptoms that occur after sexual activity might be caused by excessive amounts/deficiencies of neurotransmitters/hormones/other substances.

So after some time now, I decide to go look again if I can find out why I'm suffering from POIS, I'll post about that later.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: deloun on 02/05/2008 14:08:35
Welcome Deloun. You have probably the orginal form of POIS described by Dr Waldinger. My opinion is that the auto-immune reaction after orgasm theory is only possible for long case ( at least 5-6 days).
But lot of guys here have symptoms during 3 days.
If orginal POIS is compared to a normal flu, i think it's impossible to get the virus, be ill and be healed in only 3 days.

Dr. Waldinger told me that there are also patients with symptoms that occur for only a few days and that there are patients which suffer for a longer duration. I don't think it's an auto-immune reaction in the form of an allergy to my own sperm causing the symptoms in my case (or maybe any case), but caused by excessive ammounts/deficiencies of neurotransmitters/hormones/other substances instead. Because the symptoms also occur after sexual activity while I don't have an ejaculation/orgasm. Maybe an auto-immune reaction can be an additional consequence of POIS and not the cause. I do believe that there are different variations in the complaints that people suffer from and likewise that there are different variations of the causes.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: deloun on 02/05/2008 19:00:00
I've had a bloodtest done about 2 years ago, but only for some vitamins and minerals. It indicated deficiencies of the vitamins B6, folic acid (B9/B11), B12, E and of selenium.

This is the result of the test for vitamins of 2 years ago:
(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstatic3.filefront.com%2Fimages%2Fpersonal%2Fd%2Fdeloun%2F119321%2Fjdayjtdgmh.jpg&hash=a58ac0a36e4da211718b15c211e5c64d)

And this is the result of the test for minerals of 2 years ago:
(https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstatic3.filefront.com%2Fimages%2Fpersonal%2Fd%2Fdeloun%2F119321%2Fhyzvhdbiom.jpg&hash=fa8a16aff6b74be62e9686495c85a837)

Does anyone else here with POIS symptoms have such deficiencies?

I'm planning to go to an endocrinologist and have a more extensive bloodtest done, this time besides for vitamins and minerals also for neurotransmitters and hormones.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/05/2008 21:28:10

(1) too much sugar is very very bad!!!

(2) in South Africa there is a drink that helps with this called Lucozade:

It consist primarily of Glucose.



hk1979: I thought Glucose _is_ sugar!!!???

You are right that glucose is in sugar, but not 100%. Sugar as we know it, is called Sucrose.

Your body still need to change it into Glucose. Glucose and Fructose is better to take directly. They are used for body electrolyte recharge.

Diabetes will fall ill when taking sugar, but it is OK for them to take Fructose, as Fructose is called the LOW GI sugar. It doesn't give that spike, therefor it also doesn't have that sugar crash :-)

My psychotherapist, who has worked in hospitals with dying patients, insists that sugar, even in excess, is fine for most people. Can I give her any EVIDENCE that this is wrong?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/05/2008 22:33:29
Did your dr have you do a blood test ? Particularly after an ejaculation when  you have the worst symptoms ?

You can see page 11 all the cases of POIS. Agjchs is healed with DHEA, Demografx feels much better with dopaminergic Levitra. That's why I think now that the main problem is adrenal glands. The first thing to do for adrenal glands is correct blood sugar. Then make a blood test after ejaculation to check cortisol and DHEA/hormones.


B_Jim, several years ago, my acupuncturist/Oriental therapy advisor thought my POIS was caused by TOO SMALL adrenal glands. Does this make sense to you? Thanks.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/05/2008 22:37:44
Did your dr have you do a blood test ? Particularly after an ejaculation when  you have the worst symptoms ?

You can see page 11 all the cases of POIS. Agjchs is healed with DHEA, Demografx feels much better with dopaminergic Levitra. That's why I think now that the main problem is adrenal glands. The first thing to do for adrenal glands is correct blood sugar. Then make a blood test after ejaculation to check cortisol and DHEA/hormones.


Do you think this would also apply if POIS comes from orgasm WITHOUT ejaculation? (I tried it - hoping to avoid POIS - and successfully had orgasm without ejaculation...but still developed full-blown POIS!)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: deloun on 02/05/2008 23:29:49
I suppose that you took vitamins/minerals supplement after this, without real  effect on POIS. Anyway a good diet is an essential starting point.
  I'm looking now cortisol and flu-like and other POIS symptom link. 

Yes, I took supplements after that, though that doesn't necessarily mean that I didn't have those deficiencies anymore. Because my diet is good, so the reason for the deficiencies is not my diet, it has a different reason like often can be the case in general that it isn't ones diet causing deficiencies but like for instance that the body doesn't take the vitamins/minerals up well or that something isn't functioning correctly in the body and simply taking supplements doesn't always help.
 
Many vitamins and minerals like those B-vitamins play a vital role in the making and regulating of neurotransmitters and hormones. So it's important to also look at vitamins and minerals besides neurotransmitters and hormones.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 04/05/2008 22:34:51
Over the past 15 years I have tried many different vitamins, minerals and amino-acids to see if a supplementation can help reduce POIS symptoms. I have found this a difficult process because the illness cycles and its onset is so subtle. I found this form of nutrient supplementation to be largely useless with the exception of Magnesium. I have found that Magnesium 200mg once daily has excellent stress and depression lowering properties.

During a summer several years back I went on a high protein diet using protein powders made for body-builders. I felt that maybe a high protein diet might restore my hormonal balance and lessen my depression. I had no idea if this would work but after a month it did work, I felt a lot better. I had to stop this therapy though because the powder shakes were causing kidney pains. Afterwards I tried different brands of powder but didnt achieve the same benefit.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: deloun on 05/05/2008 12:06:39
I think it could be the high amount of amino acids that are present in the protein powder that relieved your symptoms. Maybe l-phenylananine, l-tyrosine and tryptophan could help, they are converted in the body to a few neurotransmitters which may be linked to POIS symptoms:

l-phenylalanine -> l-tyrosine -> l-dopa -> dopamine, epinephrine (adrenaline), norepinephrine (noradrenaline)

tryptophan -> 5-HTP -> serotonin

Like I mentioned earlier, I've always suspected that excessive amounts/deficiencies of neurotransmitters and other substances that have a relation with neurotransmitters could be causing my POIS symptoms.

In my opinion it seems to me the best thing to do is to get an extensive blood/urine test done.

I'm having an appointment with an endocrinologist and I'll request an extensive blood and urine test for at least neurotransmitters, hormones, amino acids, vitamins and minerals.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: deloun on 05/05/2008 12:10:14
Oh and enough vitamin B6 available in the body is also necessary to convert the amino acids to neurotransmitters.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 05/05/2008 15:11:46
I found out this month that l-phenylalanine works better than l-tyrosine. The body can absorbs it better, and it is a better form of supplement to reap the benefits that l-tyrosine would essentially give.

@deloun: you are correct, but also include Vitamin B12. I prefer to take the B-complex and Vitamin C with lunch. Other people take the multivitamin but I feel B-complex and C works out better for me when I take it seperate.

At the end of the day you find yourself taking about 10 pills a day and you feel like "Oh my God this doesn't feel normal/natural". But I think with POIS if you can get your carb/protein ration in balance, and take only neccesary supplements, you should be fine. My new "daily diet" is:

1)Wake up and take l-phenylalanine or l-tyrosine, and ginseng with water on empty stomach.
2)Protein rich (bacon and eggs) Breakfast with Omega 3 and 6, orange juice and a banana.
3)Midmorning (10h00) I drink a cup of soup (usually tomato). I used to take coffee but I feel the soup is better in the long term.
4)Lunch again something with protein the size of my fist, together with either rice or pasta, and an extra veg. Afterwards I take Vitamin B Complex and Vitamin C with Zinc with a juice or cordial.
5)Midafternoon (15h00) I drink a cup of soup again.
6)For dinner/supper, it is similar to lunch, but I take Magnesium and Calsium afterwards.

I always have a protein meal replacement in my cupboard, and also at work, just in case I miss a meal, then I drink a chocolate shake. There are a lot on the market. The one I prefer is Pro-Plex from Muscle Science. But I must drink carbohydrates with it otherwise I can very tired in the next 2 hours. I also don' take as much as the recommended dose, as it is formulated for muscle builders:

http://www.musclescience.co.za/products/pro-plex.htm
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 05/05/2008 20:24:10
I insist on believing that fatigue in the period pois arises as a result of changes in the digestive.
In my case does not appear diarrhea, I immediately want to go to the bathroom but then comes a great constipation who fervently believe that is what produces fatigue throughout the body and mind.
Another symptom that I get is that I get a lot of heat in the body especially in the face to the point that I put the red cheeks and sweat a lot, feelings of shame that may arise are increased so as well when I get nervous.
Someone has the same symptoms?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: uh-clem on 05/05/2008 21:30:56
hi folks. just found this site. first post.

some Q's/thoughts:

re: Levitra - are people taking it before or after ejaculation? and are you taking it regularly (daily/weekly) or just before after exaculation?

re: mantak chia: i was experimenting with non-ejaculation for a while, which helped a bit, but not enough. (what i mean here is "in-jaculation, where there's orgasm while pressing on the perenium. the ejaculate stays "in." wierd, but doable.)

my symptoms sound like less than many posting here (no diarrea, or constipation) but i find that post ejaculation, i feel slow, but not tired first 2 days, then, most tired after 3-4 days.

takes me about a month before i feel energetically back to normal.

I have experimented for years with not ejaculating for 3 months at a time. my energy would build amazingly well. tiredness was not as bad after ejaculating, but still dispointing.

i've actually had pretty good improvement from going to an accupuncturist and taking a custom blend of herbs she made up for me. (don't know what's in it, it's all in chinese.)

i've often found that after ejaculating, i get a cold, which i have now, which came on about a week after ejaculating. not saying the ejaculation gave me the cold, but likely lowered my immune system and then after exposure to someone elses cold.

i eat very little sugar, mostly animal protein and veges. (grains make me sleepy.)

was on topical testosterone (gel that i would rub onto skin, need perscription, of course) for a long time, which had a little bit of impact on energy. i recommend it for many reasons, but can't say it was the "magic bullet" for energy loss.

that's all for now. read you soon.

-clem
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 06/05/2008 00:22:02
Can you give more details of you diet with protein powder ? (alone or you kept a normal diet ? carbohydrates ? ) Protein powder is not really dangerous for kidneys if you don't abuse it and if you drink a lot of water.
Now, it's intersting to understand why you feel better. Protein/Carbs ratio ? Or maybe there is specificly an amino acid in this powder (and not/less the other you took later), effective for sexual hormones cycle ? Can you give the name of this powder ?

It was summertime and I decided to replace most of my meals with protein shakes, although I did eat a normal meal. I was taking a lot of shakes during a day along with water to help.
I was taking powders made by a company called bio-hazard, no longer available. But they were getting a proper company to make it for them to their specifications. They boasted that the composition of the powder, in terms of amino-acid profile, was the same as found in real muscle. I tried two types of powders from them. One was protein only and the other protein with lots of glucose mixed in, so very high carb. They both worked equally well. So I think it was the protein composition that was important. I dont have any of the containers left against which I could check the composition levels.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 06/05/2008 00:22:34
welcome uh-clem!!

How often you go to defecate after pois? my theory indicates that intestine defecation may occur (depending on the individual and the circumstances) from once every two or three days to several times a day but after Pois even going to defecate  some feces and gases still remain generating discomfort This makes one more tired and low defenses.
 I've noticed the opposite effect when I go to defecate, the body relaxes to the point where I run a chills through the body that restores vitality at least for a moment, this happens until the feces and gas remnants again placed inside bowel and that generate discomfort and fatigue until the next defecation.
  I've tried that I feel much better by accelerating the process of eating and defecating, I mean by this that eating foods such as broccoli, cauliflower and rye bread with another meals are much help to make this happen.
   
In the case of those with diarrhea after pois (is not my case) would have to see if it is only in the first defecation. In my case I do not have diarrhea but I can always say that I have a terrible desire to defecate immediately after pois.
The first days after pois realize that I have very bad breath and gas that fuels the theory that not all feces go to the bathroom

May be all this sounds funny but I would like to know your views and experience about that. thanks
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: uh-clem on 06/05/2008 01:00:12
welcome uh-clem!!

How often you go to defecate after pois? my theory indicates that intestine defecation may occur (depending on the individual and the circumstances) from once every two or three days to several times a day but after Pois even going to defecate  some feces and gases still remain generating discomfort This makes one more tired and low defenses.

--ejaculation has no impact on my stool. i crap once a day, in the morning, regardless of whether i've ejaculated recently. i've done a lot of work on my digestion etc. however. i take digestive enzymes and occasional pro-biotics when i have any diarrea like symptoms. which i highly recemmend for anyone with diarrea problems regardless of POIS!

also, eat more salad and less sugar and less wheat!



 
In the case of those with diarrhea after pois (is not my case) would have to see if it is only in the first defecation. In my case I do not have diarrhea but I can always say that I have a terrible desire to defecate immediately after pois.

--

any of you with diarreaa ( sorry i can't spell it, but i do feel your pain.)

get a colonic or do an emema. they will clean out whatever crap is in there that doesn't belong there.

my intuition is that those of you with diarrea symptoms are most likely already experiencing digestive problems and the lack of strength and energy post ejaculation are making this worse.

i'm not a doctor, but i would run and get a good probiotic (should be stored in the refrigerater, when you buy it in the store!) and get a colonic or two (once a month) and see what happens.



The first days after pois realize that I have very bad breath and gas that fuels the theory that not all feces go to the bathroom

--interesting. never heard this. it makes sense that post orgasm all sorts of things in the body are moving and are stimulated. you might also try a digestive enzyme.

May be all this sounds funny but I would like to know your views and experience about that. thanks
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 07/05/2008 16:23:51
FOR B_JIM

Hi, B_Jim, in your posts, you mentioned two properties of Levitra: (1) dopaminergic and (2) stimulant. This is very interesting, can you explain a little bit more? Thank you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 07/05/2008 16:29:07
re: Levitra - are people taking it before or after ejaculation? and are you taking it regularly (daily/weekly) or just before after exaculation?

I think I'm the only one here taking Levitra. I think it should only be taken for ED, which I have, but it also works for me and my POIS (75% cure).

It is to be taken before sex, but I experimented after sex as well and it works, but not as good as before sex. I have NEVER taken it "regularly", outside indicated times.

I strongly urge anyone considering this to consult with a physician, because Levitra may possibly have an effect on the heart if one does not have ED.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: msl on 07/05/2008 19:38:25
Ive started a POIS cycle again, but for me it takes over a week to recover properly and to get to the point to where I can think right again, and i have exams coming up. I am so close to suicide right now
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 07/05/2008 23:13:47
Rapidgaming: I can only presume you are serious, as I have been in the depths with this problem and can understand such a sentiment, but please, it is a horrible feeling but IT WILL PASS. And I know what it's like to feel like dirt because you are afflicted with something so awful yet nobody really knows or understands, I have been there for so long... it erodes you, your self image declines. My best defence is to avoid anything that would lead to the situation, I avoid erotic images or even TV with mild sexual content, to keep nocturnal emissions to a minimum.

Doing poorly on your exams would be a stressful event, but if it happens IT IS NOT THE END. You might have to put your aspirations in life on hold and find an environment that you can survive in, employment that will accommodate the problem that isn't too stressful or taxing on you... focus on finding a way to just get by, give yourself time to work on this problem. Forgive yourself because YOU KNOW what it is you are going through. Nobody blames a man with a broken leg for not being able to run a marathon. In this condition we are broken, don't blame yourself because you can't "run". 

There are many ideas to try floating around here, just be cautious whatever you decide and research it for yourself. I tried a little tyrosine one episode and I didn't have POIS symptoms, yet I was mentally off from it, I think perhaps the amount was too much. Any experiment like this is of interest, but of course is only valuable with repeated success, and is complicated by the shifty nature of this condition.

I had an episode this prior week and I wasn't affected too much, I was capable enough. I think that because I have few POIS events, the severity is perhaps lessened. Later on in the week I caught a cold and I wondered about what I read somewhere above here, that the immune system might be lessened in this state. I am considering taking the supplement Cold FX to see the effects on my next event. It is purported to enhance the immune system. I believe it is actually a type of ginsing.

Please let us know how you are doing.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 08/05/2008 01:09:30
hallo rapidgaming... you say you have exams and this tiredness is killing you? if you don't have diabetes, try something that should be harmless in medical terms: i suggest get some energy drink with mostly only glucose and a flavour, not with all these funny things, maybe if it has vitamins and minerals it is ok. drink 500ml every 2 hours until you feel better, and drink some ginseng and ginkgo biloba on an empty stomach before you start studying. don't drink too much glucose, you musn't feel all the sweetness too much. if you think you drank too much just drink some water also. if you can find a electrolyte refuel drink, even better. In Southa Africa we have something called REHIDRATE, it has a mixture of glucose, magnesium, calcium and bicarbonate of soda.

it will be perfect if you can find the original lucozade flavour somewhere, plus the ginseng and ginkgo biloba for the mind energy

you can only try it maybe it will help, i guess it is better than killing yourself :-) whatever you decide to do please let me know, all the best!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 08/05/2008 01:39:23
uh-clem

thanks for your input, i also take digestive enzymes now and then, it is crazy that you can sometimes eat something, but is not always digested properly. the probiotics is also brilliant to take! i also totally agree on the sugar thing, but sometimes it is necessary to get your body blood sugar index back to normal, and I suspect it falls rapidly after orgasms.

IS THERE ANYBODY THAT HAVE TAKEN THEIR BLOOD SUGAR INDEX DIRECTLY AFTER AN ORGASM, PLEASE INFORM ME THE RESULT ???

Please read this:

http://diabetes.webmd.com/tc/hypoglycemia-low-blood-sugar-symptoms
http://www.nutrimed.com/news_sugar.html

I found that pure sugar is not the answer it makes me nauseas. Like I mentioned previously i replaced all my pure sugar with fructose and glucose in the house, it works much better for me! But not too much of the fructose also, just when needed.

must be careful with too much carbohydrates. everybody must find their own balance of protein/carb/minerals/vitamins that works best for them.

hopefully an endocrinoligist will give us the perfect diet for POIS oneday.....
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: cdma77 on 08/05/2008 03:09:44
Guys,

I am going to see my endro doc next week.  I am going to have him check my cortisol levels and my HGH levels.  I wouldn't be surprised if my HGH level is low.  I have a sneaking suspicion that  a lot of us have low HGH levels.  The problem is if my level is low insurance may not pay for it and I can't afford it at $800-$1,000 per month.  Has anbody had this checked?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/05/2008 05:20:01

I am so close to suicide right now


RAPIDGAMING IF YOU ARE SERIOUS AND IN THE USA PLEASE CALL
***1-800-SUICIDE***, OR PLEASE CALL AND GET SOME HELP FROM A SIMILAR COUNSELING ORGANIZATION. OR GO TO THE EMERGENCY ROOM OF YOUR LOCAL HOSPITAL. AT LEAST YOU KNOW YOU'RE IN TOUCH WITH FELLOW POIS SUFFERERS.

RAPIDGAMING, WE ARE ALL WITH YOU IN OUR THOUGHTS WISHING YOU THE VERY BEST!!!!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 09/05/2008 01:11:16
After full ejaculation or orgasm a signal is sent from the testicles to the hypothalamus for the release of GnRH. The GnRH hormone travels from the hypothalamus to the pituitary and stimulates gonadotropin release. Gonadotropins travel to the testicles and stimulate testosterone production. This system is known as the HPG axis ( hypothalmic-pituitary-gonadal axis ).
Maybe in POIS, after ejaculation, rather than the HPG axis, the HPA axis gets activated. The HPA axis ( hypothalmic-pituitary-adrenal axis ) is responsible for releasing stress hormones including cortisol. This would mean that the end result after ejaculation would be more stress rather than more testosterone.

Research needs to be done as to why this axis crossover occurs.
Do you see how the adrenals are downstream from the true source of the problem, which is the hypothalamus ?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 10/05/2008 06:45:55
Brain DHEA levels were significantly decreased by vitamin E deficiency in rats.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/05/2008 18:16:02
After full ejaculation or orgasm a signal is sent from the testicles to the hypothalamus for the release of GnRH. The GnRH hormone travels from the hypothalamus to the pituitary and stimulates gonadotropin release. Gonadotropins travel to the testicles and stimulate testosterone production. This system is known as the HPG axis ( hypothalmic-pituitary-gonadal axis ).
Maybe in POIS, after ejaculation, rather than the HPG axis, the HPA axis gets activated. The HPA axis ( hypothalmic-pituitary-adrenal axis ) is responsible for releasing stress hormones including cortisol. This would mean that the end result after ejaculation would be more stress rather than more testosterone.

Research needs to be done as to why this axis crossover occurs.
Do you see how the adrenals are downstream from the true source of the problem, which is the hypothalamus ?


Bizzy, this is excellent. Now, do you have any suggestions as to how we can take this to the next step? Recruit a research scientist for this Forum? Thank you!

ps - I wouldn't wish POIS on a poor rat [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: msl on 11/05/2008 09:19:32
Hi guys, Thank you very much for replies, they mean a lot. Its reassuring to know there are people out there who understand. I had another nocturnal emission last night :/ but as you can see.. Im still here...

I do not know if this has already been posted but i found this article:
http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_and_addiction
particularly go down to sex's hidden hangover
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 11/05/2008 11:50:58
... sex outside of love (oxytocin) is dangerous.

This glove fits perfectly on the hand of Christian theology.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/05/2008 21:13:42
TO RAPIDGAMING

Welcome back!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/05/2008 21:25:28

Demografx feels much better with dopaminergic Levitra.


B_JIM,

I don't know if you saw my previous question. I'm sorry if I missed your reply.

(1) I asked if you can please explain what you mean by "dopaminergic Levitra"

(2) And you also referred to Levitra in another post as a "stimulant".

Would you kindly explain?

Thank you!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/05/2008 21:30:29
Hi guys, Thank you very much for replies, they mean a lot. Its reassuring to know there are people out there who understand. I had another nocturnal emission last night :/ but as you can see.. Im still here...

I do not know if this has already been posted but i found this article:
http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_and_addiction
particularly go down to sex's hidden hangover

RAPIDGAMING,

Very interesting article! I think it agrees with B_JIM's theories.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/05/2008 21:36:46
QUESTION TO ALL

Does anyone else feel this way: For me, POIS symptoms feel like NOTHING ELSE I experience, either when I'm sick or well. They are unique. The drain of energy is different. My fingertips feeling drained are so unusual, there is nothing else like that feeling in my life. How does everyone else feel with POIS symptoms? Are they similar to any other symptoms in your life? Please let me know.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 13/05/2008 01:00:34
Demografx, I agree the symptoms are very unique. There is a huge lack of physical and mental energy. Severe depression is the most significant illness I experience. I wonder if this is true for others ?

Demografx, you asked me above what the next step should be. I think a letter should be sent to the head of research endocrinology directed at several universities. Within the letter outline a discription of the illness and call it POIS. Make a reference to this forum with its URL.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 13/05/2008 19:31:05
my POIS is similar to things I do that deplete my adrenaline, like playing soccer or rugby for more than 2 hours, I get very tired and sometimes nauseas, dehydrated. if anyone plays tennis or squash or does very physical extreme sport for more than 3 hours, tell us if your feelin the day afterwards is similar to POIS. I guess if you are fit, then your POIS is also not as bad as the days when you were unfit? With fit I mean trained to endure long physical activity, and good lung pump to muscular and nervous system.

A good indication may be: does POIS make your legs and arms stiff. Like you feel you cannot stretch them easily?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: msl on 14/05/2008 09:21:42
My POIS symptoms are unique, different to when I have done lots of sport. Mine include

Mental Fog, Can't concentrate or think logically, work things out or recall necessary things.
Severe Depression
a little physical fatigue and headache
Large pupils

Actually to mention on that stretching thing i did find it harder to stretch in a pois cycle, and I used to do lots of  hard stretching. I also have pretty bad OCD

And guess what, i had another wet dream last night! and I have an A2 Module tomorrow! Doesn't it just make you glad to feel alive..
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 14/05/2008 19:15:54
Demografx, I agree the symptoms are very unique. There is a huge lack of physical and mental energy. Severe depression is the most significant illness I experience. I wonder if this is true for others ?

Demografx, you asked me above what the next step should be. I think a letter should be sent to the head of research endocrinology directed at several universities. Within the letter outline a discription of the illness and call it POIS. Make a reference to this forum with its URL.

This is an excellent idea, Bizzy! I can help research the universities' email addresses, but would anyone here be willing to step forward and draft a letter? I don't feel that my writing is scientific enough.

HELLO FELLOW POIS SUFFERERS! **ANY VOLUNTEERS?**
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 14/05/2008 19:30:59
TO B_JIM

B_Jim, thank you very much! That is a fascinating explanation of what happens with Levitra.

Calm?  [;D] Not me! Haha.

Even with a 75% POIS-cure with Levitra, I am so sick and tired of the POIS symptoms - even "only" one day - that I still avoid sex these days.

B_Jim, maybe we can work together? Maybe you can help to begin a draft of a letter - as Bizzy suggested - to universities and I can help to edit it? Your scientific understanding is much better than mine and I can help with grammar, punctuation, spelling, etc. If you agree, either post here or feel free to email me.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 14/05/2008 19:34:45
My POIS symptoms are unique, different to when I have done lots of sport. Mine include

Mental Fog, Can't concentrate or think logically, work things out or recall necessary things.
Severe Depression
a little physical fatigue and headache
Large pupils

Actually to mention on that stretching thing i did find it harder to stretch in a pois cycle, and I used to do lots of  hard stretching. I also have pretty bad OCD

And guess what, i had another wet dream last night! and I have an A2 Module tomorrow! Doesn't it just make you glad to feel alive..


RAPIDGAMING, I'm sorry to hear about the dream again, but at least your spirits and sense of humor have improved! ("doesn't it just make you glad to feel alive"---haha)

Best wishes, RAPIDGAMING !
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 15/05/2008 15:32:46
rapidgaming

thank you very much for the article you posted, it made very interesting reading, and also changed my perception on dopamine! I always felt without ambition with POIS but never guessed it is dopamine.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jeroboam on 15/05/2008 16:03:42


I do not know if this has already been posted but i found this article:
http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_and_addiction
particularly go down to sex's hidden hangover

RAPIDGAMING,

Very interesting article! I think it agrees with B_JIM's theories.
Quote for the truth! I've read about this dopamine-dropping phenomen before.


I think the better way of solving the problems this "Syndrome" is causing, is to prevent it from happening. Everytime a man ejaculates he loses valuable semen. And obviously it also has an effect on various complex regulating systems for varieble substances in the mind and body. This causes us to feel tired, sexually not interested, etc.. for quite a while.


My view on the situation is that everyone suffering from this should learn to have an orgasm withouth ejaculation. I think the ejaculation and not the orgasm itself triggers all these "bad" things to happen.
There's only advantages to come from learning this. This way you can also experience the good effects off having sex with a partner. (i.e. longevity instead of dying sooner by wasting valuable semen)

It all comes down on training your PC-muscle. But be careful! This muscle is easy strained, and this works contraproductive.
For all who wants to learn this, I've uploaded a book at this place (http://rapidshare.com/files/115102010/allnight.zip.html). This book is about learning this.

Also the book of Mantak Chia "Mantak Chia - Taoist Secrets of love - Cultivating male sexual energy.pdf" is an interesting read, and gives insight why Ejaculation even isn't good at all.

I'm hoping to master this myself. Anyone who succeeds at mastering this technique, please post your results regarding the POIS.

If anyone has comments or questions.. Please don't hesitate to ask or say.

Greetz from europe
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: cdma77 on 15/05/2008 17:53:59
I just had an idea.  If someone is suffering from nocturnal emissions they may want to try kegal muscle exercises.  It may help, since it helps with PE.  I have had a recent problem with getting a bit of semen coming out once I finish urinating.  It may not be semen but fluid from my prosate since I haven't been having sex or masturbating.  When I loose this fluid I get a lot of the same symptoms as POIS, but not as bad.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 15/05/2008 20:09:49
TO JEROBOAM

jeroboam, I tried Mantak Chia's techniques on and off for years, with no improvement in POIS. Ejaculation is not the key, it's the orgasm. The orgasm apparently sets off numerous bodily activities that affect POIS directly. I was very disappointed. I even spoke with Mantak Chia and his assistants in Thailand.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jeroboam on 15/05/2008 22:44:27
So you were able to have an orgasm without ejaculation and you'd still have the POIS?

I don't understand, because the link rapidgaming provided stated that with those techniques the dopamine-hangover is avoided...
Or she uses another technique? Does anyone know?


for others that don't know: Kegel-excercises are to strengthen the PC-muscle
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 17/05/2008 03:25:24
So you were able to have an orgasm without ejaculation and you'd still have the POIS?

I don't understand, because the link rapidgaming provided stated that with those techniques the dopamine-hangover is avoided...
Or she uses another technique? Does anyone know?


for others that don't know: Kegel-excercises are to strengthen the PC-muscle

Yes, I practiced Mantak Chia's techniques and sucessfully avoided release at orgasm. No effect on POIS. As for the link,  there are as many "theories" as the number of people on the planet. I was very disapointed.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jeroboam on 17/05/2008 09:54:44
So the link off Rapidgaming about the dopamine-hangover... is correct? And this is causing the POIS?

So the techniques they are learning in the book they advertise on the site (book named "peace between the sheets"), is about having sex without having orgasm?
To me that seems the only way to avoid the dopamine-hangover, if what I posted above is all correct.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 18/05/2008 00:59:21
What if you can recover quickly that dopamine released? I suppose watching porno movies...or getting very excited again after an orgasm, could be a solution? let´s try...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 19/05/2008 06:02:30
...During the "hangover," or "low-dopamine" portion of the cycle, you may feel abandoned, or as if someone is demanding things from you in ways that you cannot tolerate. Or you may desperately seek new highs (alcohol, sweets, new partners, pornography, and so forth) to raise your dopamine levels again...

...Dopamine is behind a lot of the desire we associate with eating and sexual intercourse. Similarly, all addictive drugs trigger dopamine (the "craving neurochemical") to stimulate the pleasure/reward center. So do gambling, shopping, overeating and other, seemingly unrelated, activities. Go shopping: dopamine. Smoke a cigarette: dopamine. Computer games: dopamine. Heroin: dopamine. Orgasm: dopamine. They all work somewhat differently on the brain, but all raise your dopamine.

You get a bigger blast of dopamine eating high-calorie, high-fat foods than eating low-calorie vegetables. You may believe that you love ice cream, but you really love your blast of dopamine. You're genetically programmed to seek out high-calorie foods over others. Similarly, dopamine drives you to have sex over most other activities. With dopamine as the driving force, biology has designed you to engage in fertilization behavior to make more babies, and urges you to move on to new partners to create greater genetic variety among your offspring...




http://www.entelechyjournal.com/pulling_away_after_sex1.htm
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 19/05/2008 06:32:01
...Now Apomorphine HCl, a dopamine agonist that stimulates erection, is being approved, and is already for sale in Europe...
...A dopamine agonist drug, therefore, produces effects similar to dopamine in the brain...


Maybe is Levitra acting as dopamine agonist?


http://edlogs.blogspot.com/2007/12/super-size-orgasms.html
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 20/05/2008 00:06:47
...Now Apomorphine HCl, a dopamine agonist that stimulates erection, is being approved, and is already for sale in Europe...
...A dopamine agonist drug, therefore, produces effects similar to dopamine in the brain...


Maybe is Levitra acting as dopamine agonist?


http://edlogs.blogspot.com/2007/12/super-size-orgasms.html

solution, thank you for that very interesting info. I think B_Jim believes that to be the case, i.e., a Levitra-dopamine connection.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 20/05/2008 00:30:51

Demografx, I will send you a beginning of letter next week.


Thanks, B_Jim! Meanwile, I have asked The Naked Scientists people here if they can provide any university contacts.

Someone else said they had a contact name or suggestion at Oxford? Please let me know! Thanks.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 20/05/2008 14:35:46
If a research team does decide to look into this condition, I wonder how many of you will be willing to travel and participate ??
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 20/05/2008 19:37:30
I'd be willing to participate, HANDS DOWN.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 20/05/2008 20:56:51
If a research team does decide to look into this condition, I wonder how many of you will be willing to travel and participate ??

Interesting, I didn't think of this as personal study, but sure, it could take that route. I see this Forum as a completely democratic process, so you decide. I was thinking we would start by having a research endocrinologist study the hundreds of posts here at POIS Forum and then giving us recommendations as to the next step.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 20/05/2008 20:58:08
I'd be willing to participate, HANDS DOWN.

Thanks, pyropeach!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 20/05/2008 23:24:23
demografx

I think the problem of this research will be that everybody would like to stay anonymous. Even if this eventful discovery of the solution to POIS is groundbreaking, nobody would like to be named as subjects with POIS....

Therefor the endocrinologists should treat all test subjects and control subjects as anonymous.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 21/05/2008 12:44:47
solution thanks for the article:

http://edlogs.blogspot.com/2007/12/super-size-orgasms.html

very interesting. the question is how to cut out all the highs of life, and the solution will probably very boring!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/05/2008 19:50:13
demografx

I think the problem of this research will be that everybody would like to stay anonymous. Even if this eventful discovery of the solution to POIS is groundbreaking, nobody would like to be named as subjects with POIS....

Therefor the endocrinologists should treat all test subjects and control subjects as anonymous.

Thank you, HK, I agree 100%. As everyone else, I certainly wish to remain anonymous! But I don't think we're anywhere near that point. If anyone thinks differently, please post: I see this first phase simply as a review of all the posts on this POIS Forum, and a recommendation from, an endocrinologist. Then we can decide what we might do next. So, no names needed, just the posted usernames here, but more importantly: the posted information, which contains a wealth of history, experience, solid theories, etc.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/05/2008 20:10:49
QUESTION, POIS STUDY

Is everyone agreed that the specialist we wish to help us research a cure for POIS is: a research endocrinologist? If anyone disagrees, please post your thoughts within a week, by May 28. Thank you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 23/05/2008 01:35:13
Demografx

This is certainly an endocrinology and neurology area.
The neurological aspect of POIS will be complex and so it would be difficult to persuade a doctor that anything is wrong. A lot of doctors are dismissive and love to cry placebo.
So it is better to take the endocrinology path, which may show hormonal abnormalities.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 23/05/2008 18:15:39
I can't possibly be the only woman who has this syndrome? I see only men chatting on this website, and in my google search I didn't
find any POIS referring to women. But I must say that it comes as a relief to hear that there is a name for this bizarre post-orgasmic
exhaustion, and that other people are also attempting to find answers and remedies. I have had many of the symptoms described here
after engaging in orgasmic sex--the physical, mental and mood exhaustion, brain fog and flu-like symptoms that last for 3-10 days
after the "event."

For me this all started with a bigger problem back 30 years ago, when I collapsed with Chronic Fatigue Immune Deficiency Syndrome,
(CFIDS) also known as Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. Since then, the fatigue I feel after orgasm has not gone away, despite the fact that
my overall health has generally improved. Some of you have addressed the issue of neurotransmitters, as well as the auto-immune
part of the equation, both of which are KEY factors in dealing with CFIDS, so this is something that I have some experience with.

One thing that has helped me to recover from the overall exhaustion of CFIDS, and to somewhat remedy the orgasmic exhaustion has
been adrenal boosting herbal remedies and vitamins, like Siberian ginseng, schizandra, and large doses of pantothenic acid (up to
5000 mg) in 1000 mg doses, spread out throughout the day with 2000 mg. of Vitamin C per pop. Also important has been managing
stress and avoiding anything close to burn-out, which drains the adrenals and makes the fatigue worse. And getting deep sleep has
been really important too. The amino acid L-Tryptopan has been most beneficial for sleep, and since it is a precursor for serotonin
production, this goes back to the issue of improved neurotransmitter availability in assisting overall recovery from fatigue. Repairing
adrenal exhaustion also has helped my immune system functioning, as there is a direct link between being overly tired/drained and
the tendency to become ill with colds and flus.

But unfortunately, the best remedy has been to omit the orgasm from my sexual repertoire. Which truly sucks. Many women do not
even have orgasms, and so it feels disappointing to forgo what happens naturally for the sake of my overall health. Although I have
noticed over the years, that when I repress the urge to cum for too long, my body will rebel against this eventually and give me an
orgasmic dream in compensation to the enforced repression.

Still, my main question has to do women with this syndrome... How many other woman out there have this?  Is POIS mostly a male
syndrome? Or are many women in the dark about this, as I was, until I found this website?  What are the stats on this? Has anyone
taken the time to do research? And where are they?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 24/05/2008 03:49:46
Hi girlwind,

Yes, it seems that you are the only woman so far on this site who has reported having POIS symptoms.  It is interesting to know that it affects women also--perhaps that can help in figuring out causes/cures.  Since there may be some things that differ between male and female sexual response, the fact that POIS seems to affect both men and women may indicate that with regard to POIS, the causal factor is something common to both male and female orgasm.  For instance, there was some debate in this forum whether orgasm without ejaculation could prevent POIS--but if women get it too, then it probably is something related to orgasm itself, not to ejaculation.

Perhaps other women will write in, now that you have written!

The link to Chronic Fatigue Syndrome is also interesting--perhaps some CFS treatments could work for POIS (although they don't seem to have fully done so in your case).
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 24/05/2008 04:31:40
In fact, the list of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome symptoms at this site:
http://www.cfids.org/about-cfids/symptoms.asp
almost make it seem as though POIS could be a 'short-term' or 'specific-occasion-induced' form of CFS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/05/2008 04:38:35
In fact, the list of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome symptoms at this site:
http://www.cfids.org/about-cfids/symptoms.asp
almost make it seem as though POIS could be a 'short-term' or 'specific-occasion-induced' form of CFS.

Guthrie, that's exactly what my psychiatrist thought!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 24/05/2008 04:57:24
WELCOME GIRLWIND!

Since only men have come around, I assumed it was strictly a male problem! Thank you for enlightening us, girlwind.

Guthrie, I agree, now other women can find us and post, too. And as I mentioned earlier, from personal experience, I'm convinced that orgasm, not ejaculation, is the key to POIS.

Girlwind, as you can see from earlier posts, Levitra "cures" 75% of my symptoms, a combination cure of POIS-cycle length and severity. If it's a potential cure, I wonder what that implies for women since it's a male ED drug? Some people here have posted ideas that it's just a part of Levitra that does the trick for POIS. I agree.

I hope you read the posts relevant to our looking for a research endocrinologist to study all the posts here and make some sense of it all. Your input is most welcome. I suspect that somewhere in all the information revealed in this POIS Forum lies a cure for this horrible malady. I think I can safely say "horrible" for all afflicted because it has ruined a chunk of our lives. Even when we are not actively suffering POIS symptoms, they can feel like they're "just around the corner" waiting to happen!

Girlwind, you ask great questions. Almost no research has been done to date. If you Google Marcel Waldinger, a Dutch MD, he is the only published POIS researcher known, and he first described the name Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome, or POIS. The number of subjects he studied is very small, so this POIS Forum is probably the largest single repository of POIS knowledge!

Girlwind, a question for you: do your orgasmic dreams also create POIS? Welcome again.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jeroboam on 24/05/2008 18:18:02
Have any other persons also noticed the corelation between the quality of the orgasm (the feel good feeling (=amount of dopamine released when orgasming?)) and the bad after-effects? That they are worse when you have a 'better' orgasm?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 24/05/2008 18:59:31
Hello guys! It is feels somewhat weird to be the only woman in the discussion so far, but hopefully I will inspire other women to come forward. I actually wrote
one of the Berman sisters a few weeks ago about my symptoms--Jennifer Berman, who is a MD gynecologist in LA specializing in women's sexual issues. When
I described my symptoms to her, she responded in her email back to me that I had "orgasmic disorder," and that I "wasn't alone." But when I looked up orgasmic
disorder, it was all about women who were NOT orgasmic, not about women who had post orgasmic exhaustion. I'm going to email her the link to this discussion
today, so she can get some education about POIS. Unfortunately, in my way-too-long experience with both CFIDS and POIS, medical doctors have too often proven themselves to be over-rated and under-qualified to deal with the mysterious and complex intricacies of the immune and endocrine systems. And after what I have
read here and experienced in my own body, I totally agree that any research about POIS should be focused in large part on the endocrine system. Though I also
think there's a significant link to the immune system, due to the fact that POIS for many of us includes the onset of cold or flu-like symptoms.

Even if my orgasm happens in my sleep, in a dream state which I awaken from mid-orgasm, I experience POIS. However, I have found that those orgasms that
happen spontaneously in a dream state have shorter lasting negative effects than the ones I have "consciously." I've actually kept track of when the dream state
orgasms occur, and over 90% of them have happened mid-cycle, right around the time of ovulation. I've speculated that the exhaustion I feel is less just because
of that. At mid cycle is when progesterone peaks in women... and progesterone is one of the top of the chain steroid hormones. I think this means that I have
enough of an "excess" of steroid hormones to spare at those times, and maybe that's why the POIS symptoms aren't as bad then. Also, because it's the adrenal
cortex that produces the steroid hormones, I think that's why adrenal boosting supplements have helped me to sometimes remedy the POIS symptoms.

demografx: I googled Levitra and read up a bit about it. It's known as a PDE5 inhibitor--does anybody know what that means? I know Levitra increases blood
flow, but HOW exactly it works in the body might be a clue as to why it helps the symptoms of POIS. Because there are some potentially very risky side effects
from taking Levitra, especially prolonged use--like "serious cardiac events" (as in heart attacks), penile tissue damage, and potential loss of vision, due to a
decrease of blood flow to the optic nerve--that isn't something I would want to experiment with. In general I am more inclined to using vitamin supplements,
herbal remedies and hormonal cremes. (I've had far too many side effects and allergic reactions to pharmaceuticals.)  But I'd like to know more details about
how the chemistry of Levitra affects steroid hormone production, or if there is a link along those lines.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 25/05/2008 08:06:41
The process in my view is: orgasm generates something in the brain that generates something in the stomach that generates all ills.
So I think that not finding a remedy for the brain we should tackle the problem in the stomach that produces so many ills
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 25/05/2008 20:47:59
It's been a while since i last posted anything in this thread.

I was just wondering if anybody would be willing to meet other people with this condition in second life?

I would like to create such a place but I have no idea wether people would come.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 25/05/2008 20:58:32
It's known as a PDE5 inhibitor--does anybody know what that means?

PDE5 is an enzyme that is within the pathway of muscle contraction for smooth muscle tissue.  If this enzyme is inhibited, the smooth muscle cannot contract and remains relaxed causing blood to remain in the penis to prolong erections.  PDE5 is also found in lung tissue.

I was just wondering if anybody would be willing to meet other people with this condition in second life?
 

What do you mean by second life?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 26/05/2008 02:13:16
What do you mean by second life?

The metaverse: http://secondlife.com/

Where people can meet almost face to face. In a level that very closely resembles real live communication.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 27/05/2008 08:58:47
Hi fellow POIS sufferers

Do you folks find that POIS seriously affects every aspect of your life everyday ?.
I find this a very powerful illness which affects me everyday. This is because the mental symptoms linger for so long after an orgasm.


Here is my story thay I recently sent to an emotional support group:

I have had an illness my entire live that makes me allergic to sex. This means that I often have very heavy pain. On top I have fear for everything that has to do with sex and I am often afraid to go to sleep (because of the chance on wet dreams).

For this illnesss there is currently no treatment and I know no doctor who can help me. All doctors that I have visited send me away without answer. Only since shortly I know what is wrong with me. Before that there was only pain, a lot of pain.

On a relational level I can not handle relationships. Because of this illness I am locked up at home and I have a lot of problems to leave home. I have also a lot of fear to handle girls. Therefore I also don't have any friends.

Since shortly I am on second life. I find second life very fun because it allows me to at least virtualy go out.

But when I look around me in second life I see everywhere people that have found other people. This is very hard for me because it reminds me of what I will never have.

I have been in many places in second life and I have met a lot of people. Among which a lot of gay people. Most people have problems with gay people but I find them to be the nicest people.

With my illness I am also a little jealous of them. They at least have people that are like them. Like me there is nobody. I am staying alone and I don't belong anywhere. With hetero people I don't have so much a connection. They are always too much busy with sex.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: chris on 27/05/2008 22:33:15
It's been a while since i last posted anything in this thread.

I was just wondering if anybody would be willing to meet other people with this condition in second life?

I would like to create such a place but I have no idea wether people would come.

Why don't you come to the Naked Scientists broadcast in second life on Sunday (10am SL Time / 6pm UK Time) and then you can meet after the show and chat...?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 28/05/2008 02:09:55
Imre1 thanks for your previous post. It lets us know that this condition can be part of a greater complex for many POIS sufferers. The greater complex can come in different flavours and some people have it pretty bad.
I think most of us have some core POIS symptoms such as tiredness, brain fog, speech difficulty, depression and flu like symptoms. Some of us have a few odd-ball symptoms as well that noone else seems to have. We can be sure that these are part of POIS too because they happen everytime post orgasm for that person.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 28/05/2008 07:33:13
I am about to go insane.  If I talk about this to anyone else, they won't understand and I don't want to see their confused expression and hear their useless advice.  At least you guys understand.  I simply have to talk about this somewhere...I am in hell.  I just had a few orgasms in the past few days, even writing this is taking me forever.  I simply can't function. I have homework and exams coming at me from left and right.  The brain fog, lack of concentration, speech difficulty, depression, headache,  and utter exhaustion has completely ruined my hopes of everything I seek for in the future.  It hurts so damn much - knowing I can never be in an intimate relationship, where I have to turn down opportunities with girls despite my desperation, let alone go to graduate school and achieve the goals important to me, and knowing my future is pretty much screwed. I have to drag myself through each agonizing day trying to avoid people and struggle to act normal until the symptoms stop while in constant fear of getting a wet dream.  I cannot live like this.  It feels like my scalp is sore from overexertion.  Does anyone else get this symptom? Where it feels like the muscles of your scalp are constantly tightened around your skull and it feels sore almost like a burning feeling?

We need more data.  These tests we get from the doctors who look at us funny are a joke; we need a group of some sort to research this in a laboratory setting...I've had it with doctors.  And all these supplements I've been taking don't really seem to do much.

Well, I think I've vented enough. 

I was just wondering if anybody would be willing to meet other people with this condition in second life?
I would like to create such a place but I have no idea wether people would come.

I'd be willing; in fact I'm about to make an account on second life.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jeroboam on 28/05/2008 17:54:51
First time I measured my temperature when suffering from POIS: 5 hours after my temperature was 37,5°C .. So i've got a fever. Is this so with everyone?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jeroboam on 28/05/2008 19:06:13
Is there any chance this could be related to sexual transferable diseases?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/05/2008 20:37:32
Have any other persons also noticed the corelation between the quality of the orgasm (the feel good feeling (=amount of dopamine released when orgasming?)) and the bad after-effects? That they are worse when you have a 'better' orgasm?

I have wondered about this too. But I only noticed the reverse, i.e., with VERY low intensity orgasm, the POIS symptoms can still be excruciatingly negative, i.e., very bad. I have also noticed that MULTIPLE orgasms can lead to horrific POIS compared to single-orgasm.

Now that you brought it up, maybe we can all take a closer look. Thanks.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/05/2008 20:39:51
Is there any chance this could be related to sexual transferable diseases?

In my case, I don't think so. My POIS goes back steadily to at least 25 years ago, and probably longer.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/05/2008 20:51:36
demografx: I googled Levitra and read up a bit about it. It's known as a PDE5 inhibitor--does anybody know what that means? I know Levitra increases blood
flow, but HOW exactly it works in the body might be a clue as to why it helps the symptoms of POIS. Because there are some potentially very risky side effects
from taking Levitra, especially prolonged use--like "serious cardiac events" (as in heart attacks), penile tissue damage, and potential loss of vision, due to a
decrease of blood flow to the optic nerve--that isn't something I would want to experiment with. In general I am more inclined to using vitamin supplements,
herbal remedies and hormonal cremes. (I've had far too many side effects and allergic reactions to pharmaceuticals.)  But I'd like to know more details about
how the chemistry of Levitra affects steroid hormone production, or if there is a link along those lines.

Girlwind, thanks for the WARNINGS about Levitra, especially as it relates to the heart. I have posted that caveat often, and it needs to be repeated.

I know that we often get desperate enough to try anything!! So the word of caution.................

Our listmember B_Jim has good ideas about Levitra having a dopaminergic and stimulant component. Also, if we can get an endocrinologist as a POIS Advisor - which we're in the process/trying to do - maybe we'll all learn more about a "safer" cure than Levitra.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 28/05/2008 21:59:22
I am about to go insane.  If I talk about this to anyone else, they won't understand and I don't want to see their confused expression and hear their useless advice.  At least you guys understand.  I simply have to talk about this somewhere...I am in hell.  I just had a few orgasms in the past few days, even writing this is taking me forever.  I simply can't function. I have homework and exams coming at me from left and right.  The brain fog, lack of concentration, speech difficulty, depression, headache,  and utter exhaustion has completely ruined my hopes of everything I seek for in the future.  It hurts so damn much - knowing I can never be in an intimate relationship, where I have to turn down opportunities with girls despite my desperation, let alone go to graduate school and achieve the goals important to me, and knowing my future is pretty much screwed. I have to drag myself through each agonizing day trying to avoid people and struggle to act normal until the symptoms stop while in constant fear of getting a wet dream.  I cannot live like this.  It feels like my scalp is sore from overexertion.  Does anyone else get this symptom? Where it feels like the muscles of your scalp are constantly tightened around your skull and it feels sore almost like a burning feeling?

We need more data.  These tests we get from the doctors who look at us funny are a joke; we need a group of some sort to research this in a laboratory setting...I've had it with doctors.  And all these supplements I've been taking don't really seem to do much.

Well, I think I've vented enough. 

I was just wondering if anybody would be willing to meet other people with this condition in second life?
I would like to create such a place but I have no idea wether people would come.

I'd be willing; in fact I'm about to make an account on second life.


PYROPEACH, hold on to your hat! We're looking for a research endocrinologist. I BELIEVE THAT A CURE EXISTS IN THE POSTS OF THIS FORUM! After 25+ years of my own misery, I have personally experienced the "miracle" of a 75% cure! I'm so angry and greedy right now that I want the other 25% as badly as I wanted a cure before.

Sore scalp? I get burning fingertips which drive me insane. I suspect they're different manifestations of the same problem.

We're all here with you, pyro.

I will consider second life, but it sounds complicated.
(I complicate things easily [;D] )
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 29/05/2008 02:44:26
Is there any chance this could be related to sexual transferable diseases?

It can't be because I'm a virgin and have POIS full blast.


As for secondlife, I'm named Pyropeach Paule if you want to locate me.

Demografx, thanks for the reassurance, I need every bit of slack I can get these days...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/05/2008 04:15:40
First time I measured my temperature when suffering from POIS: 5 hours after my temperature was 37,5°C .. So i've got a fever. Is this so with everyone?

I don't get a fever, but this is consistent, in my opinion, with Dr Marcel Waldinger (pioneer POIS researcher)and his description of "flu-like symptoms".
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 29/05/2008 04:37:20
We're looking for a research endocrinologist.

How is this being done? And is there anyway I can help?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 29/05/2008 04:52:42
We're looking for a research endocrinologist.

How is this being done? And is there anyway I can help?

Absolutely! We need to find a research endocrinologist, someone who can go through all these POIS Forum posts and make some recommendations for us to test low-risk cures. I'm asking Chris if he knows someone at Cambridge U.

CAN YOU HELP?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 29/05/2008 08:31:36
CAN YOU HELP?

I may be able to find someone at OHSU - one of the top ten med. schools/research facilities in the US.  It might be tricky because I have to go around all the red tape with the help of a friend who's dad is a stomach doctor who may have some connections up at OHSU. 

I'm also planning on seeing a research doctor in neurology in California if I can somehow get an appointment and get insurance to pay the bill (I hear it could reach up to a 1000 bucks).  If I do see him, I'll definitely show him this forum and try to convince him to join our discussions.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 29/05/2008 15:55:31
Demografx--I spoke with a friend who is a nutritional researcher and he said arginine (an amino acid) has the same basic effect as
Levitra, which is to raise the nitric acid levels in the blood, with no risk of heart attack or potential blindness. Just to let you know.

And.... here's some evidence of an endocrine connection to this POIS problem. I had my blood levels of various hormones tested and
got the results that my DHEA and my testosterone levels were low, my DHEA being ONLY HALF of what is considered "normal" for my
age. But weirdly enough, I am having a hard time tolerating DHEA. It's making me feel jittery and agitated in even small doses, as if my
body is rebelling against that which it's obviously deficient in.  I am going to try 7 Keto DHEA which is a metabolite of DHEA and see if
that is more tolerable. Still, it was very validating to see that there is an actual measurable hormonal deficiency in my case.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 30/05/2008 15:08:08
congratulations girlwind you are one step closer to freedom.....

i found the best way for me to get out of the situation is to try and limit my orgasms... i will have sex but I will not EXPLODE...

it makes sends that if dopamine is you ambition hormone, and sex increases dopamine, but orgasms cuts it off, i would rather be left hanging with the ambition hormone..... but an orgasm feels so GOOD, especially in my case. But why would God make such terrible feeling after a satisfying feeling... Science calls it "the moderater that keeps us from multiplying at a high rate"... I call it "the empty feeling of nothingness and willingless"
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 30/05/2008 20:35:11
CAN YOU HELP?

I may be able to find someone at OHSU - one of the top ten med. schools/research facilities in the US.  It might be tricky because I have to go around all the red tape with the help of a friend who's dad is a stomach doctor who may have some connections up at OHSU. 

I'm also planning on seeing a research doctor in neurology in California if I can somehow get an appointment and get insurance to pay the bill (I hear it could reach up to a 1000 bucks).  If I do see him, I'll definitely show him this forum and try to convince him to join our discussions.

$1,000? Ouch! pyropeach, it would be terrific if you can get OHSU on board, but it sounds difficult (red tape, etc.). Chris/TNS is looking into Cambridge Univ., but we don't know if that will work. I think we need to try as many angles as possible, especially since it doesn't seem like we have much money to throw around (only 2-3 people here I think indicated a willingness to fund this very modestly - hopefully an altruist/endocrinologist will come forward and help us develop without charge the POIS Cure Of The Century! Maybe win a Nobel Prize?  [;D] )

So, up to you, pyropeach. THANK YOU for coming forward to help!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 30/05/2008 20:54:49
TO EVERYONE: FINDING A RESEARCH ENDOCRINOLOGIST TO ASSIST US

B_Jim and I have worked together and we now have a letter that summarizes who we are and what we are looking for (a cure for POIS!)

We now need some email contacts at Universities or Medical Centers.

Your help is needed.

We have 2 prospects so far: Chris/TNS for Cambridge University and pyropeach for OHSU. But we don't have any contact names yet, so if you can post an email contact here or send to me by email it would be greatly appreciated! Thank you in advance!

Best wishes to all!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 30/05/2008 23:11:04
At http://slurl.com/secondlife/Midas/172/213/24 I put a mansion that can be used by people suffering from POIS for anything.

There is a conference room, a bar and a living room where topics regarding POIS can be discussed.

Allowing you to question any specialist from anywhere in the world.

There is also a group you can join called POIS. This is a group for people suffering from post orgasmic illness syndrome. If you give me your second life name, I can add you to the group.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 30/05/2008 23:32:43
It can't be because I'm a virgin and have POIS full blast.

Me too.

Yes you don't have to have sex to suffer from it.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 31/05/2008 00:07:47
Sore scalp?

Exactly! That is what I often refer to as my pain. First you get a tension type headache, which lasts longer then 24h (so has nothing to do with benign coital headache) and then the headache settles and what you get is a tension for a couple of more days.

Of course I am also burning up from the inside out at the same time.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 31/05/2008 10:27:19
Well, Pyropeach and i have met.

If you want to join, but don't find anybody at the location. Please add yourself to the group. When I see that there is somebody new I will peronally send them a hallo.

To join the group:

Menu: edit, search

Then find: POIS

In the group for POIS, Join (L$0)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 31/05/2008 21:01:34
I came across this page last night, and since then I have read most of this 27 page discussion.  First, it's comforting to know that there is a group effort towards trying to alleviate these symptoms. But I sense that the discussion has lost some of its direction, and it's critical that we stay focused.  For instance, in a very short period of time (months) we can learn what otherwise would have taken us a lifetime of dedicated experimentation and other research.  As a collective, we are also likely to get the serious attention of physicians who would otherwise have brushed off our concerns.  We can't let this potential go to waste by losing our focus.

It seems that most here suffer vaguely from similar symptoms, but we are all rather confident that these symptoms are caused by orgasm.  I suggest we do two things that will help our research progress.  First, make a point form list of every drug we have tried, every test we have taken, and the results.  We should then write a succinct, cogent letter in the interests of this group, and have it sent to as many physicians and influential researchers as possible.

I have had a regular MRI brain scan, an ECG of the heart, and B12 an thyroid blood tests.  None of these indicated any problems.
I have tried Ritalin and Ativan (a benzodiazaprine).  The Ritalin helped me feel a little more focused, and the Ativan helped me feel a little more relaxed.  I still felt the symptoms lingering the background though; much like if you were to feel quite hungry, and then took a drug that would make you care less about your hunger. 

I have experienced "POIS" since I was 14, about 8 months since I began to have orgasms.  My symptoms included feeling cloudy minded, light-headed, disoriented, and anxious.  These symptoms followed within about 10 minutes of orgasm. The duration and intensity of the different symptoms has varied quite a bit since I was 14.

I am now in my mid 20s, and last year I discovered something quite phenomenal.  Orgasm was not only the cause of these problems but also the potential CURE.  Of course, when something makes you feel so bad, your impulse is not to do it again.  For most of the time since I was 14, I would not masturbate, and would periodically have nocturnal emissions.  If I were masturbating, it happened at most about once a week.  I noticed now and then, that sometimes, when I had a wet dream while I was feeling quite afflicted by these symptoms, I would actually feel relieved and mildly euphoric when I woke up.  The symptoms had cleared away, and I actually felt the good sensations I hear about people having after orgasm.

For most of the year, I had completely treated "POIS" by having orgasm to sexually stimulating images when feeling affected.  If I felt bad, I would have another orgasm; I would try again and again until the "good orgasm" undid the affects of the other ones.  On average, I masturbated once a day to sexually stimulating images.  Sometimes I would do it twice if the first one didn't work.

This worked reasonably well for about a year.  After awhile, I found I needed to do it more and more often to relieve the symptoms.  Eventually I was up to 5 times a day.  This was exhausting, and cutting back had strong withdrawal effects.  I believe going back to a regimen of 1/day for a period of time may restore me again.  I also share the experience that a more powerful orgasm and *decreased anxiety while masturbating* reduces the chance of after-effects.

As far as possible psychological influences go:
- I have never been sexually abused
- When I was in my teens I felt quite guilty about anything sexually related.  Some of that carries through now, even though I feel that this guilt is irrational -- there is no fair-minded, logical argument that masturbation is 'wrong'.
- Around the time when I started feeling these symptoms, I had a school-mate who frequently harassed me, which I found quite devastating at times.

Also:
- Sometimes a hot shower with high water pressure applied to my head results in similar symptoms.
- Certain foods can cause similar symptoms.  I have felt quite unusual after several glasses of tropicana orange juice or other sugary foods.  I have measured my blood sugar though on several occasions, and it is normal.
- Caffeine can cause some of the anxiety symptoms. 

I hope I've helped by sharing some information about my particular situation, and I hope we can get things organized and start sharing a lot of succinct and specific information about what we've tried, and what tests we've had, etc.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 01/06/2008 00:15:26
I agree with Counterpoints' suggestion that we try to organize and focus our efforts.  The current setup, with one long continuous conversation, has some advantages, but it can make it difficult to filter out the different topics and ideas that we have come up with. 

Perhaps we could set up a blog, or some other sort of forum, which we could all post to and which could be divided into different sections, such as "Symptoms/personal history" "Bloodwork/tests done," "Attempted treatments and their results," "Theories of causation," etc. 

Would the Naked Scientist site be able to provide something like that?  Or would we need to set up  something else? 

What do you all think?  Any suggestions?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Geo on 01/06/2008 01:16:40
I have been searching to find out what was wrong with me and I believe that I suffer from POIS. I have always believed that having a orgasm and my problem was connected.

I am 24 now but it started at 19 I woke up one day and had a sever headache that would not go away for mouths I went to the doctors and they could not find anything wrong with me (blood test,MRI) I felt like at the back of my head liquid was running down the side but on the inside of my body. After mouths I took sinus medication and it went away. I never got the pain in my head again. I then started to feel,physical tiredness,mental tiredness,lethargy/derealisation,lack of concentration/brain fog,sweating and heat feelings (in fact I was sweating last night woke up and came to the internet to see what was wrong I thought that I was dying)anxiety,depression,memory problems,difficult to speak/communication,insomnia/sleep problems,stomachaches,restless/agitation,dizziness,
muscle tremors,hair problems,mouth problems,skin problems,eye problems,short. breathing,sexual pain after sex.     
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 01/06/2008 02:34:15
I think Guthrie has a good suggestion.  With enough data about symptoms, tests, and attempted treatments, I would be willing to write a powerful letter summarizing our situation to researchers.  I am a medical physicist, so I have close connections to a scientific community that includes leading researchers in both neurology and psychiatry.  I can't make promises, but I think with enough data from a large group of people I could convince these researchers to commit a significant fraction of their time towards investigating our condition.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 02:49:30
TO COUNTERPOINTS AND GUTHRIE

We have started a path toward getting a research endocrinologist on board this POIS Forum to take us to the next level. Are you opposed or thinking differently about this? If so, do you propose separate paths here? I'm not sure what you're implying with your suggestions as they relate to the path we already started.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 01/06/2008 02:58:49
TO COUNTERPOINTS AND GUTHRIE

We have started a path toward getting a research endocrinologist on board this POIS Forum to take us to the next level. Are you opposed or thinking differently about this? If so, do you propose separate paths here? I'm not sure what you're implying with your suggestions as they relate to the path we already started.

I got the sense from reading the posts that this thread was losing some direction; people were discontinuing to post, or simply re-iterating what had already been posted.  It was also hard to go through the posts and precisely tabulate what had been tried, and what the results were: for the most part people were talking about what their symptoms were, and how long they had been affected.  This is useful, and therapeutic, but in order to learn more about the problem, and even just to eliminate some tests or medications I had been considering, it would be nice to have some more organization.

A forum with subsections -- "tests or medications taken", "symptoms, duration, history", etc would probably help with this.  This way we could come up with a comprehensive list of tests and medications attempted to match the symptoms.  The more precise and organized we are the better chance we have of finding a solution.

That's great you are working towards getting the attention of an endocrinologist! And thanks so much for continuing this discussion. 

Also, you might find this article interesting: http://www.reuniting.info/science/articles/acute_dopamine_depletion_causes_psychological_distress

I suffer from many of the symptoms described there.  I also have developed OCD tendencies. 

One last comment: I saw a researcher in both neurology and psychiatry a couple years ago.  At the time, I did not know nearly as much about my condition, but he suggested busperone.  It is a non-addictive anti-anxiety medication.  I have not yet tried it, because my orgasm solution appeared to start working, and I had already tried Ativan with limited success.  Busperone may be worth considering, however.  It appears to have no serious side effects and no potential for addiction.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 03:16:02
Counterpoints, we have 2 paths in motion (there's a couple posts on this) for a research endocrinologist: 1) Cambridge University through TNS and 2) OHSU (Oregon) a top medical facility.

If you have any contacts that will help further the effort, please let me know. Thanks for your support of the effort.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 03:19:34
BUSPAR

Buspar as (the only?) non-addictive anti-anxiety agent is controversial. I had very negative effects personally.

Is this the same as busperone?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 03:22:55
Counterpoints, since you read the posts, what do you think of the Levitra and DHEA solutions?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 01/06/2008 03:52:18
I'm sorry, I mis-spelled the drug. I meant "Buspirone".  More information can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buspirone     

It looks like this is the same as a drug called "BuSpar".

In early June I will discuss Levitra and DHEA with a specialist friend.  I will need to do some more research to form my own opinions on these solutions. I am a physicist who collaborates with physicians who are interested in applying my work in their clinical studies.  I am not an expert in human physiology. Is there anything else you would like me to bring up in particular?  If you PM me the letter you wrote I could review it and maybe add something to it.  I am used to writing scientific papers.

In reviewing some of these posts -- I did miss a few -- I found the fact that someone independently mentioned sugar as very interesting, since I have discovered that correlation accidentally.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 01/06/2008 04:14:31
Demografx,

No, I didn't mean to indicate any opposition to getting a research endocrinologist involved.  I just thought it could be helpful to have a different format of organizing the material we have already compiled and that we continue to compile. 

For instance, it would be good if we had a way of subdividing the different messages we post into different categories, so that if someone wanted to see all posts relating to, for example "bloodwork and results", they could have them all pulled up, without having to search through the entire 27 pages of the thread. 

This French POIS blog is like ours, in that you can read all the posts in chronological order--but you can also use the "Categories" sidebar on the left to select out different categories of posts.  http://fatigueapresorgasme.over-blog.com

Or, another option is a forum that is divided into different threads, each with its own sub-topic, such as this one: http://recover.forumup.org/

It seems that finding a way of organizing our posts would also make things easier for a researcher to read through.

Anyway, I don't know what the best way of doing this would be, but it seems like something that could be helpful.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 01/06/2008 04:24:29
I also noticed that our POIS thread is over three times longer than the next-longest thread in the "Physiology and Medicine" section of the Naked Scientists forum (664 posts vs. 215 posts)!  This adds further weight to the sense that our thread might be getting a bit unwieldy.   

Is there a way for the Naked Scientist moderators to allow us to mark our different posts with different category-labels?  Or is that impossible, given the way the website is set up?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 01/06/2008 09:23:27
Pyropeach and I have found that we are physically the same height and body build. Also we have the same temperament.

This would indicate that POIS is genetically determined at birth.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 01/06/2008 11:43:47
Also, you might find this article interesting: http://www.reuniting.info/science/articles/acute_dopamine_depletion_causes_psychological_distress

I have read this text and I can not find any symptoms described that would match POIS symptoms.

This is absolutely not the cause of POIS.

Actually if you can identify with this text you are not even close to having POIS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 01/06/2008 17:20:22
Also, you might find this article interesting: http://www.reuniting.info/science/articles/acute_dopamine_depletion_causes_psychological_distress

I have read this text and I can not find any symptoms described that would match POIS symptoms.

This is absolutely not the cause of POIS.

Actually if you can identify with this text you are not even close to having POIS.

Anxiety, loss of fluency of speech, confusion, difficulty concentrating, dizziness, etc. 
following orgasm?  From what I've read, that seems to fall under the symptoms that people have described here.  Not that I would WANT to have POIS -- you act as though you are some kind of authority who is excluding me from his precious group.  Grow up.  POIS at this stage is not particularly well defined, and I would be glad not to have any unusual anxiety symptoms following orgasm.  In fact, POIS was initially defined as a condition that affects middle aged men.  I suppose if you are not middle aged, you absolutely do not have POIS: you are just one of the very few people who has an unusual reaction to orgasm, but you have something different entirely *rolls eyes*.  I get the sense the motivation for your post was quite malicious; it makes me not want to help you.

My symptoms do match most of the ones described in that article.  Perhaps what I and others are feeling is partly a result of dopamine depletion following orgasm.  Who else identifies with this?
http://www.reuniting.info/science/articles/acute_dopamine_depletion_causes_psychological_distress
The only symptoms that *don't* describe how I feel are "visual and audible stimuli were less sharp", and "he felt a loss of control over his ideas", "maskface and tremor".
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 01/06/2008 17:21:42
Pyropeach and I have found that we are physically the same height and body build. Also we have the same temperament.

That indicates absolutely nothing as far as POIS being genetic.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 01/06/2008 17:34:25
I'm more inclined to submitting our data to a research endocrinologist than a neurologist or psychiatrist. I'd like to know
the CAUSE of this condition and to treat that, rather than to treat it symptomatically with psychiatric drugs or other exper-
mental medications. In my case specifically the only imbalances found in my blood work and other tests throughout the
years have pointed to hormonal imbalances. These have included thyroid, cortisol, and DHEA levels.

I think it's a great idea for all of us to submit our personal histories with POIS to a data sheet that includes:
1) Sex, current age, current medical status and medical conditions (diabetes, heart disease, CFS, etc.)
2) Age of onset of POIS symptoms, (including whether it was a sudden or gradual onset);
3) Inventory of POIS symptoms specific to each of us (including severity of debilitation and duration);
4) Personal history relevant to POIS symptoms (Total number of years afflicted/how that's affected our lives);
5) Diagnostic tests done in attempt to find cause (blood work, MRI's, etc);
6) Any significant abnormalities discovered in those tests;
7) Attempted treatments, duration of treatments and their results;
8) Personal observations and theories about our experience with POIS.

We really do need a place to post this info in an organized way, and we need someone to compile it all for a study.
Does anyone have a concrete plan about that yet?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 01/06/2008 20:16:11
I dont think there is a need to create a new forum with better compiled subsections, although anyone who feels the need can do so. We dont have a large volume of novel information. All the details listed so far can easily be incorporated into a letter. A comprehensive record of member details can be created but we should first try and get the attention of some research group or professional.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 01/06/2008 22:24:51
Does anyone have a concrete plan about that yet?

It would be very easy to write an online data form like you suggest, that people could fill out and submit.  One of the entries could be the internet handle used on this forum, so the data could be associated with a post history in this thread.

I could write the code for the form, although I would need someone else to host it.  The application would obviously take up negligible bandwidth and data space.  Of course, I couldn't guarantee this information would be kept private, though it would likely be associated with whatever internet name you choose to submit it under, not your real name.  We could have the forms available for browsing as they are submitted, and then also continue the discussion we're having in this thread.  And we could make the form available in French as well, and have the contents translated into English and vice versa, in order to combine resources with the other French effort.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 22:48:04
I'm more inclined to submitting our data to a research endocrinologist than a neurologist or psychiatrist. I'd like to know
the CAUSE of this condition and to treat that, rather than to treat it symptomatically with psychiatric drugs or other exper-
mental medications. In my case specifically the only imbalances found in my blood work and other tests throughout the
years have pointed to hormonal imbalances. These have included thyroid, cortisol, and DHEA levels.

I think it's a great idea for all of us to submit our personal histories with POIS to a data sheet that includes:
1) Sex, current age, current medical status and medical conditions (diabetes, heart disease, CFS, etc.)
2) Age of onset of POIS symptoms, (including whether it was a sudden or gradual onset);
3) Inventory of POIS symptoms specific to each of us (including severity of debilitation and duration);
4) Personal history relevant to POIS symptoms (Total number of years afflicted/how that's affected our lives);
5) Diagnostic tests done in attempt to find cause (blood work, MRI's, etc);
6) Any significant abnormalities discovered in those tests;
7) Attempted treatments, duration of treatments and their results;
8) Personal observations and theories about our experience with POIS.

We really do need a place to post this info in an organized way, and we need someone to compile it all for a study.
Does anyone have a concrete plan about that yet?

Girlwind, I have already initiated contacts for a research endocrinologist through Chris/TNS and pyropeach here, for Cambridge University and Oregon Health - OHSU - respectively.

If you have ideas for a University or other contact, please let me know and I can send an email invitation.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 22:55:39
I dont think there is a need to create a new forum with better compiled subsections, although anyone who feels the need can do so. We dont have a large volume of novel information. All the details listed so far can easily be incorporated into a letter. A comprehensive record of member details can be created but we should first try and get the attention of some research group or professional.

Thank you, Bizzy, I agree. I think at this stage of the game it would be a bit confusing to carry on multiple efforts. But I am not opposed to ANYTHING that will bring us closer to a universal cure. So let's not shoot ourselves in the foot with confusion.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 23:04:41
ATTENTION EVERYONE PLEASE: RESEARCH ENDOCRINOLOGIST

Since this effort is underway for some time, yet ideas have been formulated only recently for other directions, I should ask the question: is anyone here opposed to the track I'm on? i.e., B_Jim and I have created a letter to find a research endocrinologist who will go through these 27 pages of posts and make concrete recommendations for low-risk cures to test. We are already in progress with Cambridge University and Oregon Health (OHSU) - per pyropeach, a top-10 rated medical research facility.

Please post your "Yes" (agreed) or "No" (opposed) here by June 8. This will also tell me who is "on board" with this project.

Thank you very much. I look forward to hearing from you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 01/06/2008 23:18:05
Anxiety, loss of fluency of speech, confusion, difficulty concentrating, dizziness, etc. 
following orgasm?  From what I've read, that seems to fall under the symptoms that people have described here...

MULTIPLE DAYS of severe physical/psychological/emotional EXHAUSTION following orgasm is the key, most common underlying trait for POIS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 02/06/2008 00:08:42
ATTENTION EVERYONE PLEASE: RESEARCH ENDOCRINOLOGIST

Since this effort is underway for some time, yet ideas have been formulated only recently for other directions, I should ask the question: is anyone here opposed to the track I'm on? i.e., B_Jim and I have created a letter to find a research endocrinologist who will go through these 27 pages of posts and make concrete recommendations for low-risk cures to test. We are already in progress with Cambridge University and Oregon Health (OHSU) - per pyropeach, a top-10 rated medical research facility.

Please post your "Yes" (agreed) or "No" (opposed) here by June 8. This will also tell me who is "on board" with this project.

Thank you very much. I look forward to hearing from you.

"Yes".  Though an online data form would serve to organize whatever track you're currently on, not change it entirely.  It could only help.  Why don't you post your letter?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 02/06/2008 00:28:04
And, by the way, I think it was extremely out of line for someone to say, "Actually if you can identify with this text you are not even close to having POIS", given that the symptoms in the article are ANXIETY, DIFFICULTY CONCENTRATING, EXHAUSTION, etc -- pretty much EXACTLY what people have repeatedly described in this thread.  Not to mention that people in this thread have also said that doctors have suggested dopamine depletion may be the cause of their symptoms. 

I have read the posts here too.  You are no more of an authority on this condition than anyone else who has read the posts and suffered from significant post-orgasmic symptoms for several years.

I would also guess that the intensity and duration of symptoms not only greatly vary from person to person, but from year to year.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 02/06/2008 01:24:44
Demografx--"Yes" to the Research Endocrinologist direction.

Counterpoints--I think you're right that the symptoms in that article are similar to what has been posted by people on this POIS thread.  Imre1--if you had specific reasons for thinking that that article was not similar to POIS, perhaps you can state what you had in mind.  In any case, further open discussion will probably be a more productive and scientific path than will exclusionary or absolute claims. 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 02/06/2008 02:33:12
Demografx--"Yes" to the Research Endocrinologist direction.

I would'nt worry about Imre1 folks. I find that he is a good guy but often confused, probably POIS overdrive and the valium he is taking.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 02/06/2008 04:36:10
ATTENTION EVERYONE PLEASE: RESEARCH ENDOCRINOLOGIST

Since this effort is underway for some time, yet ideas have been formulated only recently for other directions, I should ask the question: is anyone here opposed to the track I'm on? i.e., B_Jim and I have created a letter to find a research endocrinologist who will go through these 27 pages of posts and make concrete recommendations for low-risk cures to test. We are already in progress with Cambridge University and Oregon Health (OHSU) - per pyropeach, a top-10 rated medical research facility.

Please post your "Yes" (agreed) or "No" (opposed) here by June 8. This will also tell me who is "on board" with this project.

Thank you very much. I look forward to hearing from you.

Demografx -- "Hellz yes to the Research Endocrinologist Direction"

Posting that letter would be helpful too because I will soon be putting together a concise description of what we're going through and what we require for someone I know who has connection to OHSU.  Reading your letter would help me do this.  I will try to do this ASAP, its just hard because its dead week for me now and tons of HW and projects + POIS = X_X
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/06/2008 06:46:45
LETTER TO ATTRACT A RESEARCH ENDOCRINOLOGIST

The following letter to Chris at TNS (after reading it, he agreed to inquire at Cambridge U.) can be used as a template to send to other contacts. The bold type is B_Jim's addition, which B_Jim created after the letter was sent to Chris.

Everyone: feel free to initiate a contact! But please let me know who/where so we don't duplicate efforts!
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Chris,
 
Many thanks for coming by and telling us about the second life broadcast.
 
I recently became moderator at the POIS Forum, with 200+ postings and a very strong desire to see a cure for everyone of this vicious malady (average 4 days' severe exhaustion, brain fog and other nasty symptoms following orgasm) - It has ruined a chunk of my life, and I daresay most listmembers at TNS/POIS.
 
Chris, with your connections to Cambridge University, would it be at all possible to refer us to a research endocrinologist there? Someone who could go through all the postings and make recommendations leading to  a low-risk cure. I have already cured myself 75% with Levitra, but that is risky for those who don't have ED.

We also have a case of someone who has been totally cured after taking a small dose of DHEA just after ejaculation. That's why some of us think that perhaps the adrenal glands are the main source of the problem. Our adrenals may be "slowest" to restore the normal levels of hormone cycles induced by ejaculation (cholesterol => Pregnenolone => DHEA => testosterone) in the mitochondrial adrenal glands cells. We think stress (cortisol) is probably an increasing factor of the problem.

Maybe in my case, Levitra could have an effect on dopamine and it may have a stimulation effect on the adrenal glands, as a side effect.
 

It seems to me that finding a cure through this research would be an incredible medical breakthrough that could be published. There was much fanfare when Dr Marcel Waldinger, a European medical researcher, completed his pioneering study of this ailment some years back, but since then he has not been very responsive to the next step. Dr Waldinger formulated a hypothesis that POIS could be an auto-immune problem. But we don't think it's the only explanation. There are different forms of POIS. The cases described by Dr. Waldinger are extreme (7 days flu-like state)and his experience is with only a very few patients.  

Chris, your help would be greatly appreciated!
 
Thank you very much,
 
Demografx
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 02/06/2008 06:57:56
ATTENTION EVERYONE PLEASE: RESEARCH ENDOCRINOLOGIST

Since this effort is underway for some time, yet ideas have been formulated only recently for other directions, I should ask the question: is anyone here opposed to the track I'm on? i.e., B_Jim and I have created a letter to find a research endocrinologist who will go through these 27 pages of posts and make concrete recommendations for low-risk cures to test. We are already in progress with Cambridge University and Oregon Health (OHSU) - per pyropeach, a top-10 rated medical research facility.

Please post your "Yes" (agreed) or "No" (opposed) here by June 8. This will also tell me who is "on board" with this project.

Thank you very much. I look forward to hearing from you.

"Yes".  Though an online data form would serve to organize whatever track you're currently on, not change it entirely.  It could only help.  Why don't you post your letter?

Have you seen the posted results of the data form B_Jim compiled? Also, I posted the letter. As I mentioned previously, anything that can help would be most welcome!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 02/06/2008 07:29:51
Perhaps I misunderstood an earlier post, but do you have POIS? I only ask because you said something about a contact at another Forum, so I wasn't sure if you are interested as a researcher, a sufferer or both. Thank you.

I found this forum because for most of 9 years I have suffered from severe and unusual symptoms following orgasm; like usual, I was looking on google to see if anyone else had suffered from similar symptoms.  My symptoms include anxiety, exhaustion, and difficulty focusing following orgasm.  I am also a physicist who works with medical researchers, so I have some contacts who might help me and others here. 

The other forum is a French forum that Guthrie mentioned.  I thought I could make a simple HTML form with text boxes like "Treatments attempted", "Symptoms", "Duration of symptoms", "Test history", etc.  This way people could fill out a "form", and it could easily be done in both French and English, so we could combine our efforts with the French website and have a very organized database of information to accompany our posts in this thread.  We could could provide a link to this "form" in our thread here, and continue our discussion here without starting any new forum, etc.

So "both" is probably the best answer to your question.

The most phenomenal aspect of my case of "POIS", is that orgasm was not only the source of some of the problems, but also the cure.  It took me 8 years of experimentation to find this out.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 02/06/2008 08:23:19
Here is a letter I wrote, similar to demografx, that people here are free to use or combine with demografx' and B_jim's thoughtful letter.  I *strongly recommend* we compile everything in an organized manner though; we will want to do it sooner or later, so we should probably do it before we talk to very many researchers.  If anyone can provide some modest web-hosting, I will put up my form for this.


To whom this concerns,

I am writing on behalf of a group of a least a hundred people who suffer from crippling symptoms following orgasm.  We are referring to it as Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS).  These symptoms include exhaustion, difficulty concentrating, anxiety, loss of speech fluency, and cloudy mindedness; they are often severe, and can take up to a week to dissipate. 

These symptoms are preventing a large group of otherwise intelligent and motivated people from functioning properly.  We are desperately hoping that you would be interested in studying our condition.  Each of us have written about our medical history, which medications we have attempted, which tests we have taken, and our particular symptoms. 

Could you please read this information and provide us with some feedback?  We could discuss re-reimbursement although we do not have a great deal of money.  However, your research into these cases would certainly provide for interesting journal publications.  There was much interest when Dr. Marcel Waldinger published some research in regards to this ailment (unfortunately he is no longer available for contact). Further, any insights you have into our condition could likely lead to groundbreaking developments towards treating connected but more well known conditions that are the focus of much current research.  And any time you invest in helping us will collectively salvage hundreds of years worth of our time, which would otherwise be spent conducting amateur investigations and suffering alongside our families who are also deeply affected by association.

Thanks, and please give this some sincere consideration; we are all desperately hoping for your help.



Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 02/06/2008 15:17:37
Demografx--a definite yes to the research endocrinologist.

I'm not finding the "posted results of the data form B_Jim compiled." Where is that?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: imre1 on 02/06/2008 20:33:44
I would'nt worry about Imre1 folks. I find that he is a good guy but often confused, probably POIS overdrive and the valium he is taking.

Yes. I seem to pissing more people then usualy of these days. Maybe I should be seeing a psychologist.

Anyway the stuff in second life has been removed.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: rock27 on 02/06/2008 20:53:04
Good on you! Let's find a solution!

I have this "fatigue, brain fog, can't concentrate, irritable, weird feeling in stomach, dry skin, pale, feel like sleep" after orgasm for several days too. I'm in my late 20's. Regular doctors say it's psychological, so can't help me. I am from Holland. I believe the whole thing has something to do with an imbalance of hormones or stuff.

So I say "yes" to an endocrinologist. I think putting data together does not combat this idea. Instead it adds value. We make it easier for the researcher to get an idea of what's going on, so increasing chances he will go for it.

I don't have a website to host your form, Counterpoints. Anyone? We might have to create a free site somewhere. I haven't found B_Jim's form either.

I would like to add to the questions on the list: "do the symptoms occur after a wet dream as well? (so to exclude the possibility of psychological causes).
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/06/2008 06:02:47
Demografx--a definite yes to the research endocrinologist.

I'm not finding the "posted results of the data form B_Jim compiled." Where is that?


Girlwind, and rock27, there is a search function at the top of this page. If it didn't work for you...

B_JIM, CAN YOU PLEASE POINT US TO THE POSTS? Thanks!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/06/2008 06:06:46
Counterpoints writes, "The most phenomenal aspect of my case of "POIS", is that orgasm was not only the source of some of the problems, but also the cure.  It took me 8 years of experimentation to find this out."

CP, sorry if you already wrote about this, if so, could you point me to "the cure"? Was it repeated orgasms? I recall seeing something about that. Thanks.
 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/06/2008 06:10:35

If anyone can provide some modest web-hosting, I will put up my form for this.


Counterpoints, I just asked one of the TNS moderators.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/06/2008 06:39:22
I would like to add to the questions on the list: "do the symptoms occur after a wet dream as well? (so to exclude the possibility of psychological causes).

rock27, very interesting, I never thought of that objectivity/psychological link.

In earlier years, wet dreams ALWAYS resulted in POIS for me. Later years the dreams eventually stopped (thankfully!!)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/06/2008 06:45:09
Here is a letter I wrote, similar to demografx, that people here are free to use or combine with demografx' and B_jim's thoughtful letter.  I *strongly recommend* we compile everything in an organized manner though; we will want to do it sooner or later, so we should probably do it before we talk to very many researchers.  If anyone can provide some modest web-hosting, I will put up my form for this.


To whom this concerns,

I am writing on behalf of a group of a least a hundred people who suffer from crippling symptoms following orgasm.  We are referring to it as Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS).  These symptoms include exhaustion, difficulty concentrating, anxiety, loss of speech fluency, and cloudy mindedness; they are often severe, and can take up to a week to dissipate. 

These symptoms are preventing a large group of otherwise intelligent and motivated people from functioning properly.  We are desperately hoping that you would be interested in studying our condition.  Each of us have written about our medical history, which medications we have attempted, which tests we have taken, and our particular symptoms. 

Could you please read this information and provide us with some feedback?  We could discuss re-reimbursement although we do not have a great deal of money.  However, your research into these cases would certainly provide for interesting journal publications.  There was much interest when Dr. Marcel Waldinger published some research in regards to this ailment (unfortunately he is no longer available for contact). Further, any insights you have into our condition could likely lead to groundbreaking developments towards treating connected but more well known conditions that are the focus of much current research.  And any time you invest in helping us will collectively salvage hundreds of years worth of our time, which would otherwise be spent conducting amateur investigations and suffering alongside our families who are also deeply affected by association.

Thanks, and please give this some sincere consideration; we are all desperately hoping for your help.


Counterpoints, terrific letter!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 03/06/2008 07:06:11
You want the posts related to what i wrote in letter ?
- agjchs and DHEA  (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg136593#msg136593)


other good posts :

-Bizzy's theory  (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg172366#msg172366)
- Dave23 protocol (http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.msg159372#msg159372)


B_Jim, you did a survey of all the people at POIS Forum, symptoms, and then posted the results of those who responded. It was a few months ago? Then you tabulated the results, showing for example, my work with Levitra and someone else for DHEA, but with ALL your survey questions, and it showed everyone who replied, not just the DHEA and Levitra results.

Many thanks, if you can find the relevant post(s) would you kindly "Quote" them here again? THANKS!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 03/06/2008 16:40:11
For most of the year, I had completely treated "POIS" by having orgasm to sexually stimulating images when feeling affected.  If I felt bad, I would have another orgasm; I would try again and again until the "good orgasm" undid the affects of the other ones.  On average, I masturbated once a day to sexually stimulating images.  Sometimes I would do it twice if the first one didn't work.

It seems that in your case you are able to lock in a 'good orgasm' by using sexually stimulating content and having further orgasms if things didnt work. So it seems you have found a partial solution that works for you. The fact that you can go back and correct the condition means that you are rather more fortunate than others.
I know that this routine does not work for me and probably many other people. The content I focus on makes no difference to the outcome and having more orgasms brings about even more severe symptoms.
We can see that there are variations in the way POIS affects us but the core symptoms seem to be the same.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 03/06/2008 19:16:47
I am in a rush right now, so I will respond to some of your questions tonight.
Tonight I will also post my questionnaire here to see if there is anything anyone would like added before I write the code and put it up on a website.  Suggestions for questions are welcome.  I will look at B_jim's questionnaire and some of the responses to it as a guide for designing some of the questions.

Basically, there will be a bunch of text boxes you can fill out in response to questions.  Once finished, you would press a 'submit' button.  This would then save a text (or HTML) file of your answers, associated with whatever identity you chose for yourself when filling out the form;  (e.g. 'Counterpoints.txt' could be generated).  These text files would automatically be viewable on a website.  You would have the option to add information to your file afterwards, though it is generally best if you be as detailed and thorough as possible on the first time you fill it out.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jamie_wood888 on 03/06/2008 22:23:07
Does anyone still post on this forum, i know the last post was a while ago but could do with some advise  or information

I have problems with what i think is pois, i have a few symptoms that arnt really listed. If anyone has any comments please feel free to chat to me about this.
1/ Tiredness, ie in the morning finding it hard to awake propely, not wanting to get up
2/ After orgasm my sweat smells very sweet and distinctively salty. literally strait after orgasm, it lasts for several days.
3/ I work out in the gym but find it hard to keep focused and though i dont feel sleep tired i feel letharigic, i just want to lie down and rest. Im more focused after a week without orgasm but tend not to last more than a week so cant tell if it will be better if i dont orgasm after a week.
4/ If im not mentally or physically stimulated i find my eyes wanting to close and sleep, espeacially while driving or in meetings. I literally have to hold my eyes open, even with great concerntration i find it so hard to stay awake.
5/ Testcles ache, feel drained if thats a sensation that ppl are aware of.

Any posts to this would be grateful. thanks.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 03/06/2008 23:19:32
Jamie,

With an unexplained condition such as POIS it is hard to nail down how dynamic the underlying problem might be, for example is it possible for a person have it slightly? That being said your experience does not sound to be of the same nature as mine: serious mental "change" that feels awful in an indescribable way and thinking is more difficult. There have been other "symptoms" but the cognitive problem is the worst offender. An odd thing about my POIS is that I have no memory of what it "feels" like until I am back in it again, it is that elusive to description.

The fact that your testicles ache might be indicative of a problem, I suggest you talk to a doctor about it if you have not done so already.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: jamie_wood888 on 03/06/2008 23:32:02
yes seen a doctor about the aching, ive had several ultrasound and nothing there, its only wen i emitt. for a few days after. i dont change in a mental way, but do feel as if somethingisnt right, unableto fully think and even keep awake. are u aware of any of my symptoms?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 04/06/2008 00:21:52
If the symptoms occur after orgasm then they correlate to the POIS condition we are talking about here. The core symptoms are :

Confusion, tiredness, inability to concentrate, sleepiness, difficulty of speech, depression, muscular weakness, depersonalization and derealization
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 04/06/2008 02:58:32
Girlwind responses to B_Jim's survey:

1)- Number of days after orgasm you have problems : It varies a lot depending on how healthy I am at
the time. (I have Chronic Fatigue Syndrome in addition.) The POIS symptoms can last a minimum of 1 to 2 days,
if I'm successful at "treating" them with my vitamin/herb mixes. But if I'm low energy already, then orgasms can
trigger a draining fatigue that brings on a month long flu or infection.
 
-- How many hours after orgasm start symptoms ?  Usually after 4-5 hours, I really begin to feel it.
-- In the first hours after orgasm, how do you feel ? I feel okay for the first 2 hours, pleasantly relaxed and
comfortable in my body. The POIS symptom peak of discomfort comes during the next 24-48 hours. At first
I feel agitated, jittery and spaced out (day 1); then I feel the exhaustion on day 2 on.

2) Symptoms :
Give a mark for each symptom :
0=No   1=Very Low   2=Low    3=Average   4=Severe   5=Very Severe

-Physical tiredness 4
-Mental tiredness: 4
-Lethargy/Derealisation 3
-Lack of concentration/Brain fog: 4
-Sweatings and heat feelings:4
-Cold feelings/cold hands/cold body:0
-Myalgias:0
-Anxiety: 3-4
-Depression:3-4
-Agoraphobia/Social phobia: 3
-Not motived:3
-Memory problems:4
-Difficult to speak/communication:4
-Insomnias/sleep problems: 4
-Headaches:0
-Stomachaches:0
-Restless/agitation: 4
-Blurred vision: 2
-Buzzing ears:0
-Dizziness: 3
-Muscle tremors:0
-Diarrhea day1: 0
-Hair problems:0
-Mouth problems:0
-Skin problems:0
-Eyes problems:0
-Short breathing Day1:2
-Premature Ejaculation: 0
-Sexual pain after sex :0
-Erection problems:0
-Libido problems: 4 (in general my libido is low already, POIS makes it worse)

Others Symptoms ?  I get so worn down that I sometimes end up with a cold or sinus infection for 2-4 weeks after.
(CFS is most likely a contributing factor.) My immune system can't handle the drain of orgasm.

3) What medical test you made ? In the days following orgasm ?
-Thyroid ?
-Prolactine ?
-Testosterone?
-Blood pression?
-Others..
I've never had bloodwork on a POIS day. I have had tests in the last 2 years that indicated a thyroid on the low end
of normal, low testosterone, and low DHEA--less than half of normal. My blood pressure has always been low. (110/65)


4)What meds did you test ? What effect on POIS ?
-Ssri ?
-Stimulants? Dopaminergic ?
-Benzodiazepine ?
-Piracetam ?

I avoid prescription medications, as I have had many severe drug reactions in the past, even to aspirin and novacaine.
I have found that adrenal boosting herbs and supplements have helped to somewhat alleviate my POIS symptoms,if
I take them before sex or immediately after orgasm. Schizandra adrenal support by Planetary Formulas and Siberian
Ginseng have been the most helpful, along with a big dose of sublingual B vitamins and large doses of B5 with Vit. C.
Recently I have begun taking DHEA and will see if this works to help the POIS problem.


5)Others
-What about you diet ? I eat all organic foods--meat, vegetables, whole grains, goat dairy products (allergic to cow dairy),
fruit in season, salads. No sugar, coffee or alcohol. And I drink only filtered water.
-Sport ? I do yoga, walk, ride my bike and kayak in summer. It all depends on where my energy is at.
-Heavy Computer user ?  I can use the computer up to 6 hours/day. It is draining after 4 hours.
-Coffee user ? No.

I want to add that before I got Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, I never had POIS symptoms. I have now lived with CFS for 30
years and I notice the POIS symptoms are worst when CFS is at its worst. There is a connection between how much energy
I have and how much sexual energy I can afford to burn. I also notice that when I have spontaneous orgasms in dreams, the
exhaustion level is never as great or as long lasting as when I have a "conscious" orgasms. I am fairly sure that this is
due to the fact that my mid-sleep orgasms only happen in mid-cycle, when progesterone is peaking. (I must have an
abundance of hormones to spare at those moments and this must have some EXTRA to burn.)

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 04/06/2008 03:03:43

having more orgasms brings about even more severe symptoms.


This is absolutely and painfully true for me. I shudder to think of those multiple orgasm occasions!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 04/06/2008 04:53:05
The Orgasm Cure


Counterpoints writes, "The most phenomenal aspect of my case of "POIS", is that orgasm was not only the source of some of the problems, but also the cure.  It took me 8 years of experimentation to find this out."

Here is my story explaining the "cure" and how I came about finding it.  I don't think I can do justice to this discovery with a short description, so here goes:

I have had this problem for about 10 years.  For 9 of those years, I would be absolutely terrified to follow the "multiple orgasm" suggestion: orgasm always made me feel very cloudy-minded, anxious, like I couldn't express myself, etc.  Like I've heard a few times now, there's not much I can relate the experience to.  When I am not feeling POIS symptoms, the anxiety I might feel about talking to a certain person, or taking a test, or whatever, is very different than the anxiety I constantly feel during POIS.  I obviously didn't have many "multiple orgasm" moments, since the first one usually made me feel so bad I wouldn't want to repeat something like that.  And when I did have several orgasms, they didn't seem to make me feel better - either I would feel roughly the same or worse.  Of the people here, John's experience is the one I most relate to.

However, in the last few years, I noticed there were odd times when I would go to bed feeling very affected by POIS, and then I would wake up feeling very relieved and mildly euphoric; all of the POIS symptoms had quickly disappeared: I was my old self again.  I then realized I had had a wet dream.   But when I had orgasms through masturbation, I usually felt horrible.  And I usually felt horrible after wet dreams too (though sometimes not as bad). So there didn't seem to be much I could do other than hope for the very rare occasion I would have a good wet dream; this happened about every 10 to 20 wet dreams... so I would have to wait months, and it wasn't particularly something that would help me function on a day to day basis.

At this point, I was quite terrified of orgasm, or really anything too sexually provocative.  I felt as though I was doing something "wrong" by looking at any sexually explicit material, or by masturbating.  Needless to say, I was never comfortable about masturbation because I was always waiting for the horrible after-symptoms to follow.

I began to talk about this problem with a friend, and after awhile I felt slightly more comfortable towards these activities.  I had an orgasm after looking at some sexually explicit material, and I didn't feel pronounced side effects; I'm sure a person without POIS would still think that whatever I was feeling was pretty dramatic, but after being used to completely intolerable and long lasting (days, weeks, ..) symptoms, this was a relief.

I began to fall into a pattern of an orgasm every 3 days or so.  Then every 2 days.  These patterns usually lasted for months.  I noticed the more frequently I had orgasms/week (during these month long patterns), generally the faster my recovery from POIS was.  For example, if I were having an orgasm a month, it would take me a week to recover.  If I were having an orgasm a week, it would take me 3 days to recover, etc.  Of course this only applies to long term patterns; if I was in a pattern of 1 orgasm/month, then if I quickly shifted to an orgasm a week, I would not notice my POIS symptoms getting better more quickly.

One day, I was feeling very affected by POIS.  I got home, I was totally fed up, and I masturbated -- sort of like someone who is upset that he was foolish while drunk, so out of frustration for life he decides to drink more.  20 minutes later, I realized that I felt great.  I felt a huge relief, and again, I was mildly euphoric. Eventually, I got into a pattern of having an orgasm to alleviate myself from POIS.  This is something I had to break myself into over a couple years.  I imagine if I had told myself this 4-5 years ago, perhaps I could begin to benefit from it within about 6-8 months.

This is also not a cure.  It is not reliable -- I don't know when I'll have a "good orgasm", and when I'll have a POIS one, and there is a limit on how many orgasms are safe to try in one day.  Even if they aren't making me feel worse, it is not safe to have my body adjust to something I can't sustain given POIS symptoms.

The only vague ideas I have about what increases the likelihood of a "good orgasm" is
1) Stimulating images
2) "stimulate" yourself for at least 5 mins.  do not have a "quickie".
3) RELAX.  It is sometimes best to try this after having had a beer.

Finally, I'm sure this description makes POIS sound completely psychological.  I don't think this is the case.  When I have a "good orgasm", it alleviates my symptoms, whereas alcohol, ativan, tranquilizers, etc. only make me care less about my symptoms -- they are still there, and will still be there when the effects of the drugs wear off.  Also, I can't will POIS symptoms to take effect, and I can't will them away either.  And even feeling quite comfortable with masturbation, sex, etc., I still have POIS.  I've just found a way to help me manage it somewhat better.

If anything, perhaps this 'good orgasm' effect will help us learn more about the underlying cause of this problem: how could the *severe* symptoms that follow one orgasm be alleviated by a subsequent orgasm? 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 04/06/2008 05:12:17
I am wondering if anyone has had a functional MRI scan, or a PET scan?  I am very worried about damage.  My guess is that there is very little damage, although I find even when POIS free my lexical recall (my ability to remember the words I want to use in a description) is getting worse.  For example, the word for 'bench' might slip my mind, or 'shelf', or other simple words I obviously know, but just can't recall. 

I am a pianist, and I have noticed that while POIS affects the quality of my playing, it does not affect my motor control.  So I am not 'impaired' in the same sense I would be after drinking or taking most drugs, for example.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 04/06/2008 06:51:45
I am wondering if anyone has had a functional MRI scan, or a PET scan? 

I've had an MRI of my brain.  Everything checked out except for a very small growth (about 2mm) on my pituitary was found.  It seemed to coincide with my prolactin levels being slightly too high.  But no damage was reported.  Difficulty in recalling words is defiantly one of my top symptoms; in fact it is only now, a few days after my last orgasm, I can finally think and find words to finally write my term papers X_X

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 04/06/2008 06:56:50
I am wondering if anyone has had a functional MRI scan, or a PET scan? 

I've had an MRI of my brain.  Everything checked out except for a very small growth (about 2mm) on my pituitary was found.  It seemed to coincide with my prolactin levels being slightly too high.  But no damage was reported.  Difficulty in recalling words is defiantly one of my top symptoms; in fact it is only now, a few days after my last orgasm, I can finally think and find words to finally write my term papers X_X



Good luck on your papers! I hope you continue to feel well.

I meant "functional" MRI (abbreviated as fMRI).  Rather than producing anatomical pictures, this type of MRI allows one to see functional activity.  So we could see which parts of the brain are active, for example.  This could also show damage.  And Positron Emission Tomography (PET) also gives us these kinds of pictures. 

These types of scans can even be used to diagnose schizophrenia, alzheimers, bipolar disorder, and other psychiatric conditions, based on pictures of brain metabolism.

Regardless of what specific type of condition POIS is (even if it is completely psychological, which I find very very unlikely), I think a PET scan would point us in the right direction, so long as it were taken while we were feeling POIS symptoms.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 04/06/2008 10:39:16
Counterpoints, often times on the initial day of POIS I would feel mildly euphoric, perhaps closer to what is typical of "normal" people post orgasm, but these mental states could not be held for long and any positive sensation would eventually nosedive as I had to deal with the "mental change" that had occurred.  In my POIS state the difficulty in communicating verbally with others in this state was most distressing. I don't recall ever having an improvement from further ejaculation, rather it would amplify the problem. 

I have had only a basic MRI and nothing was found.  [:D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 04/06/2008 22:37:30
Counterpoints, often times on the initial day of POIS I would feel mildly euphoric, perhaps closer to what is typical of "normal" people post orgasm, but these mental states could not be held for long and any positive sensation would eventually nosedive as I had to deal with the "mental change" that had occurred.  In my POIS state the difficulty in communicating verbally with others in this state was most distressing. I don't recall ever having an improvement from further ejaculation, rather it would amplify the problem. 

I have had only a basic MRI and nothing was found.  [:D]

No MRI here, but you reminded me of my earlier years' POIS, in which the first day's mild euphoria eventually nosedives. In recent years, I seem to go directly to nosedive [;D] - "do not pass GO, do not collect $200"

How did we all end up with this crazy, cruel malady????

By the way, I noticed that eating pasta or piza sometimes provides minor POIS relief. Anyone else experience certain foods/drink helping? (Caffeine helped, and now I'm quitting that, I simply can't moderate it successfully which leads to all sorts of probs)
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 04/06/2008 22:58:23

...how could the *severe* symptoms that follow one orgasm be alleviated by a subsequent orgasm? 


When successful, is it permanent (for the current POIS cycle only) or temporary relief?

Our outside researcher will certainly have some interesting work cut out for him/her! Too bad it's unlikely we'll ever find an endocrinologist  _with_  POIS  [:D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 05/06/2008 05:04:24
demografx--You mentioned carbos (like pizza and pasta) being helpful. In my case I find that it's something rich
and oily like avocados or coconut creme or almond butter on a cracker that helps calm my system down, along with
my handful of vitamins--post orgasm. I'm glad my partner has a sense of humor about that. He teases me about my
orgasmic "supplementation," and also sympathizes with the issue. He has no POIS problems, but supports and partici-
pates in a non orgasmic sex life, that he calls "riding the pleasure peak." He's happy I found a name for this weird
exhausting condition, but I know he can't comprehend the level of exhaustion that comes with it. You have to have it
to really understand how debilitating it is. I'm very relieved that this group exists and that we are all so determined
to find answers.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 05/06/2008 05:25:46
When successful, is it permanent (for the current POIS cycle only) or temporary relief?

It is permanent.  I also notice that when I have a "bad" orgasm, I feel it within 10 to 40 minutes -- the symptoms hit pretty quickly.  Likewise, a "good" orgasm alleviates symptoms within the same time frame (10 to 40 minutes). 

Also, in general, I don't seem to be continously "improving" when I wait out POIS.  I will have POIS for a certain number of days, and then the symptoms improve to the point where I am POIS free within a relatively short time period (hours..).

One thing I've noticed, that I haven't seen mentioned here, is that during POIS physical exertion appears to aggravate my symptoms.

fMRI and PET are very expensive tests, so doctors are hesitant to order them without what appears to be a very strong justification.  Unfortunately our symptoms are unknown and vague enough that most doctors would not order these tests.  I think the case to have them conducted is VERY strong, however, especially with this number of people complaining of similar symptoms and the degree to which these symptoms affect us.
 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 05/06/2008 16:41:23
I second Counterpoints' observation that the POIS period often ends relatively 'suddenly.'  I'll be feeling pretty bad throughout it, but then often I'll just be walking along and feel the symptoms draining away pretty much all of a sudden (maybe over a period of twenty minutes or so), and then I have a feeling of relief, with a bit of a lingering aftereffect--sort of similar to what it feel like when a headache or a fever 'breaks'.  It definitely seems to be a non-continuous, non-linear recovery gradient.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 05/06/2008 17:36:32

You have to have it [POIS] to really understand how debilitating it is.


Right, girlwind! And what drives me nuts, and probably most of you as well, is that DOCTORS, who should be our knights in shining armor, fail us miserably with their blank stares and "Gee, never heard that one before...next patient, please!"
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 05/06/2008 17:42:17
SUGGESTION

If anyone is in contact with a University or Medical/Research facility, if you can just obtain an EMAIL ADDRESS of "Chief of Endocrinology" or somesuch, please post it here and we can get going with an email letter from Counterpoints, B_Jim and my templates! Thank you! Or just send it yourself and post the contact here so we don't overlap one another! Thanks again!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 05/06/2008 17:49:05

...I think the case to have them [fMRI/PET scans]conducted is VERY strong, however, especially with this number of people complaining of similar symptoms and the degree to which these symptoms affect us.


Do you think that pointing to this forum + 30 pages is also good evidence? Maybe it would help to document our case with a complaint submitted to doctors and/or health plan?

Why, oh why, does our life have to be so complicated??Arrrggghhh! [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 05/06/2008 18:10:44
Do you think that pointing to this forum + 30 pages is also good evidence? Maybe it would help to document our case with a complaint submitted to doctors and/or health plan?

I think it is OK, although it would be most effective to have a bunch of viewable files for each of us, which could be generated by an online submission form.  I'll work on it this weekend; I've been pretty busy at work this week.   I'll look into hosting (I have some friends who could host a web-page), but I am still hoping that someone here might be able to host it.


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/06/2008 00:07:11
Do you think that pointing to this forum + 30 pages is also good evidence? Maybe it would help to document our case with a complaint submitted to doctors and/or health plan?

I think it is OK, although it would be most effective to have a bunch of viewable files for each of us, which could be generated by an online submission form.  I'll work on it this weekend; I've been pretty busy at work this week.   I'll look into hosting (I have some friends who could host a web-page), but I am still hoping that someone here might be able to host it.




Counterpoints, I passed along your post above to TNS as well as sending in my earlier email request. Hopefully they will host.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Porke on 06/06/2008 06:25:52
Seems we havent really made much progress

I have posted here before

What does seem interesting to me is that alot of members also describe CFS. I find this interesting because ive been suffering from CFS for some time now as well. I think somehow adrenal fatigue / Chronic Fatigue Syndrome / Heavy Metals tie into this. The symptoms for all of these problems overlap in many areas, and are difficult to tell apart

Recently ive been doing some reading on adrenal fatigue and mercury (heavy metal) poisoning or overload. It seems they are linked. My question for those with POIS is this: Have any of you had dental fillings(amalgams) with mercury in them (they are usually silver / shiny)

Im just trying to see a common pattern here....

On a side note, I have had limited success with herbal/vitamin supplements. Last weekend i tried a handful of whatever I could find in the cupboard (B vitamins, Zinc, Rhodiola... etc etc etc) and although recovery was shortened to a day or two less, I felt very weird on all stuff.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 06/06/2008 07:03:04
Seems we havent really made much progress

I have posted here before

What does seem interesting to me is that alot of members also describe CFS. I find this interesting because ive been suffering from CFS for some time now as well. I think somehow adrenal fatigue / Chronic Fatigue Syndrome / Heavy Metals tie into this. The symptoms for all of these problems overlap in many areas, and are difficult to tell apart

Recently ive been doing some reading on adrenal fatigue and mercury (heavy metal) poisoning or overload. It seems they are linked. My question for those with POIS is this: Have any of you had dental fillings(amalgams) with mercury in them (they are usually silver / shiny)

Im just trying to see a common pattern here....

On a side note, I have had limited success with herbal/vitamin supplements. Last weekend i tried a handful of whatever I could find in the cupboard (B vitamins, Zinc, Rhodiola... etc etc etc) and although recovery was shortened to a day or two less, I felt very weird on all stuff.

A day or two less without POIS symptoms seems like a *really* good thing..  It definitely seems worth any side effects from vitamins you might be feeling.  I am guessing that whatever you are feeling (from vitamins) is psychological: you are taking something that is, in almost all cases, good for you.  However, I have a few suggestions.  Be extra careful with Zinc and certain elements -- it can be quite dangerous to take too much of these.  The same goes for vitamins which are stored in fat (e.g. vitamins A and D).

I am confident that POIS has very little to do with mercury poisoning.  You can get a blood test for mercury if you are worried, but my guess is that nothing worrying would show up in the results.  As far as I know, the symptoms described here are not indicative of heavy-metal poisoning.  And I can't see why orgasm would aggravate heavy metal poisoning either.  (To answer your question, I have no mercury fillings).

I also don't think POIS has any connection to chronic fatigue syndrome.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 06/06/2008 10:52:28
Porke, a couple of years ago I had all my amalgams replaced with white filling on the fear that it might be responsible. It cost me thousands and lots of physical pain as well. The anti-amalgam theories sounded plausible at the time, but now I'm doubting that mercury is the culprit, as I have had POIS symptoms since then.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 06/06/2008 16:56:14
Quote
I also don't think POIS has any connection to chronic fatigue syndrome.

In my situation, CFS and POIS are CLEARLY related. I also know of several other people with CFS (all men) who have both low libido and POIS symptoms.
I don't assume that everyone who has POIS has CFS, but I have read and witnessed that CFS usually does affect both hormonal levels and libido.

As for the heavy metals, I have had several toxic metals show up at very high levels in hair analysis. After a round of oral chelation last year, the levels were
much lower, but not completely gone. I was planning on doing another round of chelation next month and will keep you posted on that.

Heavy metals have definite well documented adverse affects on neurological functioning, especially for the significant percentage of us who are genetically
deficient in the enzymes to effectively eliminate them from our systems. Lead poisoning in children is one cause of learning disabilities, and mercury removal
via chelation has helped some children recover from autism. In addition, heavy metal toxins are considered hormonal disruptors, and since we've all been
subjected to the "wonders of modern chemistry" since the 1950's (via exposure to pesticides, PCB's, dioxin, heavy metals, etc.), it shouldn't be a big surprise
that we've been seriously hormonal disrupted. The xeno-estrogenic effects of these substances have reeked havoc on our entire environment--from fish to
frogs to humans, from huge increases in breast and prostate cancer to astronomical increases in autism. It seems absolutely logical and highly likely for there
to be some correlation between the effects of heavy metal toxins and POIS, and I don't think we should dismiss that possibility.   

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 06/06/2008 17:16:00
Quote
I also don't think POIS has any connection to chronic fatigue syndrome.

In my situation, CFS and POIS are CLEARLY related. I also know of several other people with CFS (all men) who have both low libido and POIS symptoms.

Where are these people?  I don't think they are generally connected.  A majority of POIS cases do not involve CFS.

Again, I am quite confident heavy metal poisoning has little to do with POIS.  If we were to have mercury poisoning, for instance, there is no good reason the symptoms would be aggravated by orgasm, and there is also no good reason the people here would fully recover after several days.  Also, even if we  ignore both stimuli and recovery, I don't think the symptoms quite fit what have been described here.  In any case, it is quite easy to test for these things, and I would guess that a large majority of people here would not have toxic heavy metal levels.

There are a lot of things like CFS, heavy metal poisoning, diet, exercise, and so on, which affect how we feel in a way that concerns POIS symptoms, but they are not causes or cures.

In any case, I'll let the data speak for itself.  But my scientific background and intuition suggests that these things are mostly separate issues from POIS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Porke on 06/06/2008 18:42:05
You cant view these issues separately. The reason why I brought up the mercury issue is because ive done tons of research where it not only ties in with adrenal fatigue, but ESPECIALLY with brain chemicals. Mercury accumulates in the brain. Here it disrupts neuro chemicals such as dopamine, seratonin etc etc. So my thought was everyone mentioning dopamine being too low or too high with POIS for several days. The connection comes with mercury then delaying these chemicals replenishing to their 'normal' levels.

Im no doctor, but the adrenal/pituitary/hormonal systems are all linked. If one is out of whack, it affects a bunch of other systems. I keep coming back to CFS and adrenal issues because the side effects of POIS very closely mirror the side effects of when im really under stress / not much sleep, and my adrenals are taking a whack.

Somehow I do think there is a link between these (maybe not even directly, but indirectly) and Mercury could very definitely tie into all of this

Someone on the board mentioned seeing a endocrinologist and ask him about all of this. I think its an excellent idea. Maybe just mention these other issues to him and see what he says. The body is a complex machine... 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 06/06/2008 21:43:12

Someone on the board mentioned seeing a endocrinologist and ask him about all of this. I think its an excellent idea.


Porke, we are in the process of recruiting an endocrinologist to read these posts and suggest low-risk trial cures to this POIS Forum. We have 3 letter templates and progress. Please refer to previous, recent posts. If you can help, that would be great.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 07:27:14
Investigating what Porke said about mercury poisoning, concludes that the POIS is directly related to the intestines. According to what I read about bacteria and fungi that live there, their behavior can cause fatigue. The theory I have is that in the intestines after a POIS is poured a kind of natural antibiotic that acts like mercury and that attacks the normal flora present in the intestines. This effect is related to the investigation that made Jeff Clark on Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and Chronic Mercury Poisoning. That bacterial imbalance produces chronic fatigue. Reading what it is said there an exess of antibiotic kills bacteria and produces diarrhea, in short. Similar to POIS symptom in many cases but not mine, in my case the antibiotic produces quite the opposite, a bacterial imbalance that produces constipation. Wherever, in both cases fatigue arise.
Somewhere in the web page mentions that a cleansing of the bowel as a good measure. Something that I come to experience a long time and the results are consistent, it is there something in the intestines that makes appear fatigue in the brain. I think it needs to be investigated by that side. I will recomend to try farma antibiotics effects on POIS to see what happens next.

Please read this very interesting
The Chronic Candidiasis Syndrome:     http://www.cfs-recovery.org/docdarren2.html


http://perso.wanadoo.es/salud_armonia/articulo32.htm        translate
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 07/06/2008 07:56:22
Okay, I will modify my previous statement.  This seems like a very far fetched theory, and before taking antibiotics I strongly suggest you consult with a physician.  Also, as far as the other discussion goes, I am quite positive that POIS is not a result of heavy metal poisoning; I say this as someone with a very rigorous and extensive scientific background, who also knows about this subject.  I'd bet that if you were to ask any physician if mercury poisoning were likely connected to POIS the answer would be "no".  Get a test.  I make these comments not to be argumentative, but sincerely hoping for an effective investigation towards treating POIS.



Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 08:13:32
I think you are wrong! you must read I am not saying that mercury is affected. What I am saying is there is a substance poured in the intestine that acts "like" mercury or "like" antibiotic. Investigators said that Chronic Fatigue Syndrome is because that antibiotic effect that mercury has. Please read this The Chronic Candidiasis Syndrome:     http://www.cfs-recovery.org/docdarren2.html
The bacterial unbalance is temporary, that substance poured during the orgasm slowly dissapear letting the bacterial balance recovery again.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 08:21:33
Why diarreas is a common symthom?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 08:26:27
...If you suffer from CFS, you should avoid sugar and sweet foods...Chronic Fatigue Syndrome http://www.naturaltherapypages.com.au/article/Chronic_Fatigue_Syndrome
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 08:36:07
...Routine blood tests usually don't reveal anything unusual...There are many factors that may contribute to Candida proliferation in the intestines. The primary contributing factor is the use of oral antibiotics ...intestinal Candida proliferation is becoming an ever increasing problem. (Have you ever wondered why so many people recently seem to be suffering from Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and Irritable Bowel Syndrome?) The treatment of teenage acne with such drugs as tetracycline has been implicated as one of the most important factors in the Chronic ...Candidiasis Syndrome



The Chronic Candidiasis Syndrome:     http://www.cfs-recovery.org/docdarren2.html
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 08:42:19
I think is because intestinal Candida proliferation when an orgasm occurs
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 08:46:09
Candida has also been suggested to play a part in creating what is called a "leaky gut," an unfavorable increase in intestinal permeability. Undigested macromolecule food particles and toxins are allowed to pass directly into the body creating a host of problems. This creates havoc with the immune system when these particles trigger an immune response sensitizing the individual to normally harmless molecules
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 07/06/2008 08:50:06
Symptoms of The Chronic Candidiasis Syndrome
Fatigue or lethargy
Feeling of being drained
Depression or manic depression
Numbness, burning, or tingling
Headaches
Muscle Aches
Muscle weakness or paralysis
Pain and/or swelling in joints
Abdominal Pain
Constipation and/or diarrhea
Bloating, belching or intestinal gas
Women - Troublesome vaginal burning, itching or discharge
Prostatitis
Impotence
Loss of sexual desire or feeling
Endometriosis or infertility
Cramps and/or other menstrual irregularities
Premenstrual tension
Attacks of anxiety or crying
Cold hands or feet, low body temperature
Hypothroidism
Shaking or irritable when hungry
Cystitis or interstitial cystitis
Other
Drowsiness
Ittitability
Incoordination
Frequent mood swings
Insomnia
Dizziness/loss of balance
Pressure above ears...feeling of head swelling
Sinus problems...tenderness of cheekbones or forehead
Tendency to bruise easy
Eczema, itching eyes
Psoriasis
Chronic hives (urticaria)
Indigestion or heartburn
Sensitivity to milk, wheat, corn or other common foods
Mucous in stools
Rectal itching
Dry mouth or throat
Mouth rashes including :white" tongue
Bad breath
Foot, hair, or body odor not relieved by washing
Nasal congestion or post nasal drip
Nasal itching
Sore throat
Laryngitis, loss of voice
Cough or recurrent bronchitis
Pain or tightness in chest
Wheezing or shortness of breath
Urinary frequency or urgency
Burning on urination
Spots in front of eyes or erratic vision
Burning or tearing eyes
Recurrent infections or fluid in ears
Ear pain or deafness

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
More
Inability to concentrate
Skin problems (hives, athlete's foot, fungous infection of the nails, jock itch, psoriasis (including of the scalp) or other chronic skin rashes)
Gastrointestinal symptoms (constipation, abdominal pain, diarrhea, gas, or bloating)
Symptoms involving your reproductive organs
Muscular and nervous system symptoms (including aching or swelling in your muscles and joints, numbness, burning or tingling, muscle weakness or paralysis)
Recurrent ear problems resulting in antibiotic therapy
Respiratory symptoms
Lupus
Hyperactivity/Attention Deficit Disorder
Recurrent yeast infections in women
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Bizzy on 07/06/2008 11:24:43
I also don't think POIS has any connection to chronic fatigue syndrome.

Its not possible for you to say that because you simply dont know. There might be a connection with an underlying mechanism for both POIS and CFS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 07/06/2008 21:35:58
"The low activity of adrenal glands is for me the best theory."

This makes total sense to me, based on my very long experience with both CFS and POIS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/06/2008 00:24:13
SMALL adrenal gland: years ago, my Oriental massage/accupuncturist was convinced that was my POIS cause.

CFS and POIS: My psychiatrist a couple years back thought my POIS could actually be CFS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/06/2008 00:42:05
I just want to make a summary of our solutions :

-Demografx : 75% healed with Levitra.

- Agjchs : healed with only 10mg of DHEA after orgasm.

-Dave23 : healed with
Testosterone
Dostinex (inhibitor prolactin). 500 to 1000mg 4 days a week
Aromasin (blocking aromatase enzyme => aromasin decrease estrogens)
5Htp (serotonin precursor)
Relora (cortisol inhibitor, supposed to increase DHEA), phytotherapy supplement
GABA (neurotransmitter)
Powerfull (musculation supplement) , supposed to increase Growth hormon.
Reset AD (musculation supplement), supposed to heal adrenal fatigue
DIM (di-indole methane) phytotherapy supplement, supposed to balance estrogens
 


B_Jim, thank you for summarizing the concrete "cures" we have found. If I weren't involved in the POIS Forum, I might have not connected the Levitra with POIS, I might have just thought the symptom abatement was just a "fluke".
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/06/2008 00:52:01
The number of POIS-cure ideas and detail floating around here is staggering. I can't wait to get some help from the outside (like the endocrinologist) otherwise I'll surely develop COIS! (Curative Overload Information Syndrome  [;D] )
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 08/06/2008 06:02:22
...Many infectious agents can affect adrenal gland function and cause adrenal insufficiency. These agents, which are listed in Table 1, include mycobacterial, bacterial, viral, and fungal etiologies...
Infectious Causes of Adrenal Insufficiency Fungal Agents
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/462327_5
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 08/06/2008 06:09:48
...Americans are the most fungally infected in the world.  Americans eat more sugar than any other country.  This is no coincidence that the largest sugar consumer is also the most fungally infected group of people.  Sugar disrupts metabolism and damages glands, which repress the immune system.  This opens a door to allow fungi to proliferate throughout the body.  In addition to immune suppression, the sugar fuels the fungi and allows it to thrive...Anti-biotics kill the good bacteria within us.  Not only that, but they are themselves mycotoxins. This allows fungal infections to grow like wildfire. 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 08/06/2008 06:12:13
They now have low cellular sugar, a perfect playground for fungus to feed. However, now the cells do not have enough sugar to burn for energy so we become weak if we do not eat often and we surely do not have enough sugar to keep us alive during the night!

The brain now signals the adrenal gland to send out adrenal hormones to keep the body functioning during the night, which it does. But the side effect is that during the night the person may get hot or they may even have night sweats!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 08/06/2008 06:16:05
The next is very interesting: This helps explain why there is no simple solution to 'Chronic Fatigue, diabetes or heart disease, cancer, Fibromyalgia, and many more diseases.’ A host of some of these disorders are called a syndrome, in other words they are your fault. And where do the great scientists of our time say all these diseases come from? No one knows.

But fatigue is associated with all of them.

There appears to be not one but many failing systems also associated with these disorders. In most cases there are some common causes of the system failures. The most common cause seems to be a faulty immune system that allows Candida Overgrowth! Observation strongly points in that direction.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 08/06/2008 20:17:28
I also don't think POIS has any connection to chronic fatigue syndrome.

Its not possible for you to say that because you simply dont know. There might be a connection with an underlying mechanism for both POIS and CFS.

Excuse me, it is very possible for me to say "I think...".  I am not making any definitive statements.  I am assigning a low probability to the event that CFS and POIS are closely connected, based on my background and what I have read about each.

B_Jim, I notice my treatment has not been included in the "summary".  Also, I think there was a case where Zoloft was used as a 100% cure?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: poisONoUS on 08/06/2008 20:35:55
Hi Everyone,
So, I have been following this thread for quite a while now, but just now I decided to describe some of my symptons and share some of my ideas.

I am in my low 20’s and even though I feel like I have always had POIS, I only noticed it ~2 years ago. I share many of the symptoms mentioned here before; the main ones being: brain fogginess, low energy, anxiety, mind numbness and lost of care towards the outside world. Brain fogginess (and lost of train of thought) might be the most noticeable symptom for me, specially because I am constantly put into mental challenges due to school/work and can always tell the difference when I am having a POIS. So, tasks that would usually take me a short period of time to execute can sometimes take twice as long when having POIS. Actually everything seems harder to do: even communicating to other people (as mentioned here before) is harder. And, followed by that, comes loss of confidence and depersonalization. 

From my own research and readings from the posts here, dopamine seems to be the most plausible influence on all this. To make story short and from what I understand, dopamine is one of the neurotransmitters responsible for facilitating synapses and also has a big role in motivation/reward (among other functions). When I am having POIS, I tend to feel unmotivated and lose interest on the things that happen around me. It happens because I do not get as much hormonal reward (no good feeling) after doing things. For instance, an ice cream does not taste as good when I am having POIS. However, (hah, and now it gets tricky) my body was desperately asking for that ice cream. It was doing so, because it noticed I was down and needed to give an uplift to the system and put me in a better mood (fight that cortisol). That also explains why I am always craving sweets and junk food when in POIS. And, about the brain fogginess now, that would probably happen because dopamine is related in accelerating synapses and responsible for cognition. People with Alzheimer’s (who not only have memory loss but also problems with abstract thinking) are constantly found to have very low dopamine level.

So, basically I have just been trying to sort stuff in my head and trying to make some sense out of all this. I have no medical background, but the dopamine explanation seems to be the most logical to me so far. I am aware that our body is incredibly complex (specially our brain) and that there are many things going on, so it is hard to blame it all on a single neurotransmitter. Especially since there has been variations of POIS seen on this website. Some people for instance, like solution, has intestinal problems which does not happen to me at all. Anyways, I am really in favor of finding professionals to do some research about all this so then people like us don’t have to crack our heads trying to figure all this out without the equipment and knowledge necessary for that.

I have gone to an endocrinologist and an urologist. Like many of us here, I got nothing but blank stares and lack of understanding. I was asked to have a hormonal test checking for: testosterone, prolactin, FSH and LH. I haven’t done them yet. One of the reasons is because they are not cheap and I am not sure they will tell anything. Perhaps by the end of the summer I will. I hope to have them done before and after orgasm. Anyways, that’s all for now. I am really glad to have found this website and been able read about your problems and relate them to mine.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: poisONoUS on 08/06/2008 21:07:15
I forgot to mention on my last post that POIS usually lasts 1-2 days for me. I can say that I feel totally recovered after
two good nights of sleep. I feel like taking naps in the middle of the day also helps. I have tried many different things like changing my diet and use vitamin supplements, but so far sleep has been the only remedy.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 08/06/2008 21:31:23
poisONoUS,

Welcome! Really glad to read your story and to see the similarities. It really helps me to read confirmations of POIS after so many YEARS of blank stares from "professionals"!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 09/06/2008 02:32:19
B_Jim, I think Counterpoints also has successfully developed a "cure" - albeit inconsistent - with "good orgasm" and "bad orgasm"
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 09/06/2008 03:03:02
It is important to mention that Candida Syndrome include many Gastrointestinal symptoms, constipation, abdominal pain, diarrhea, gas, or bloating, and not necessarily one has to suffer all the symptoms, for example I do not suffer diarrhoea whereas  I suffer constipation and of course fatigue
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 09/06/2008 22:03:23
demografx: "It really helps me to read confirmations of POIS after so many YEARS of blank stares from "professionals"!"

Not just blank stares, but also ridicule. I was laughed at by several health professionals who told me that "Only GUYS get tired
after orgasm. This doesn't happen to women." They could not comprehend that POIS was not just about "being tired," or that women
could actually have a bad experience with orgasm. I never mention it any more to any health professional I see. I just stick to the
basic CFS fatigue and leave it at that. I feel like I am on my own in finding the answer. And when I do, I can charge a fee for it.  [;D]

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 10/06/2008 04:18:00
GIRLWIND, I love your spirit/sense of humor. Great reminder for us to not fall into pit of depression over POIS!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: msl on 10/06/2008 11:24:12
and the discussion continues xD Man i sure had a lot to catch up on since my last posts. It seems as though this page is getting a bit more precidence in the search results as there seems to be a lot more members joining lately =) I just thought id mention, i tend to have wet dreams in the morning, about 04:00? if thats any help, i heard this is because testosterone is highest in the morning "morning glory" and all that.. but its nice to communicate with people who know what we are talking about. One of the hardest things with this is not being able to talk to people about it!

-hey how are you?
er...good..

And so it happens again and i have 5 exams tomorrow and the academic aspirations for the future become ever more distant =) I liken it to getting beaten down to the floor, picking oneself up only for it to happen again. Each time it gets a little harder to stand up..
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: reuniting on 10/06/2008 23:56:33
Hi everyone. My husband and I just found your fascinating thread. If we repeat information that was already discussed, please excuse us. We read a lot of the posts, but didn't have time to read them all.

We have been collecting information about post-sexual satiation "let down" for over a decade, although we did not know it had a name (POIS). In our experience, it affects both sexes, and actually most people. The reason most people don't notice is that the effects can be quite subtle: irritability, malaise, flatness - and most of us simply conclude that our mate is to blame, one way or the other. [:)]

Our theory is that it is a mammalian mating program, the purpose of which is to push us on to additional mates. After all, no mammals are monogamous (at least in the sense of "sexually exclusive").

After sexual satiation most mammals get restless and move on to their next dance partners. This is known as the Coolidge Effect. The Coolidge Effect refers to the fact that a sexually satiated animal loses interest in a mate, but will perk up (surge of dopamine?) for a novel partner. It would be interesting to know if any of you have noticed your symptoms ease if, during your malaise, you are offered a novel, willing partner.... [;)]

Unlike most mammals, humans also have a pair-bonding program (or have adapted the mammalian parent-child bond). It keeps us together for a while...ideally long enough to get a kid on its feet. But we also have this old mammalian program, which makes union less and less rewarding. (Marriage studies show that marriages grow increasingly unhappy over time.)

In short, we can defy our mammalian program and stay married, but apparently many of us can't prevent the subconscious feelings after sexual satiation. Those feelings, when projected onto each other, can make our unions seem less rewarding. We believe that these post-satiation feelings, weak or strong, are a vestige of this old program - there to urge us to stray. Sex that causes malaise can obviously result in uneasiness about ongoing intimacy.

This brings me back to the neurochemical cycle behind this mammalian program. In rats, both female and male, scientists have observed predictable effects for two weeks after sexual satiation (male), or after vigorous intercourse (female). Scientists have tracked post orgasmic changes in human males out for at least a week. In short, the orgasm cycle is far longer than we've realized. We'd be happy to share abstracts, if anyone is interested.

The biggest player in this cycle seems to be dopamine - with secondary players that influence dopamine levels, such as testosterone receptors, prolactin, serotonin, etc. Low dopamine can be very uncomfortable. Consider this experiment where a medical student artificially lowered his dopamine:  http://www.reuniting.info/science/articles/acute_dopamine_depletion_causes_psychological_distress
His symptoms sound a lot like the symptoms many of you report - and like a lot of the symptoms we hear from visitors to our site. Interestingly, those leaving porn behind *also* report extreme symptoms, close to some I've read here in your thread. This is more evidence that it is sexual satiation that sets off the discomfort. Perhaps some people are satiated sooner than others.

The real news I want to share is that there is a way to make love, and release all sexual tension, without orgasm. This means that people suffering from extreme forms of POIS can still make love quite contentedly. When my husband and I got together 7 years ago, we began experimenting with this other way of making love (which has been around for thousands of years and goes by many names). Within four months he had dropped an addiction. Within a year he was off of Prozac, and his chronic depression was gone for good. I also experienced health benefits: no more UTI or yeast infections. It also increases the harmony between us, just as the ancients recorded. Apparently it's a way of tiptoeing around our mammalian mating program.

The other way of making love is gentle intercourse, interspersed with periods of relaxation. You make love as long as you like, but without ever stressing the prostate. The emphasis is on generous affection.

If you're interested in our take on what may be going on in the brain during conventional sex, have a look at "Your Brain on Sex." http://www.reuniting.info/science/sex_in_the_brain

Sorry to go on and on, but it's great to be able to share what we're learning with others who are contributing to the same pool of knowledge.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Guthrie on 11/06/2008 02:21:23
Hello Reuniting/Marina,

Thanks for joining in on our thread.  Actually, your site was one of first that I found, before this thread got off the ground.  You have certainly done a lot of work compiling different articles and information.

In my experience, there was not a difference in my POIS symptoms when I first started dating my current girlfriend.  So, the 'new partner'/'old partner' theory doesn't seem to hold in my case, at least.  I have found no difference in orgasm with 'new partner', 'longtime partner,' or masturbation.  It seems more tied to the mechanism of orgasm itself, rather than the partner or lack thereof.

In some ways, the POIS group seems like it could provide a good way to figure out the 'sexual let-down' mechanism that you think it found in most people.  If our POIS symptoms are a more extreme version of what happens in most people, it might be easier to figure out the general biological mechanism at work by studying us.  Thus, there could be a wider and more extensive benefit to science/medicine/psychology to be gained by focusing on causes or cures for POIS.  In other words, in trying to convince researchers to investigate POIS, it need not be presented only as an ailment that affects very few people, but it could have also implications for (subtler) symptoms that may affect the broader population.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: reuniting on 11/06/2008 03:47:55
I agree that your misery might be the key to understanding a broader problem. Small comfort, eh?  [:(]

I think I wasn't clear. I wasn't asking if you have the problem with a new partner. I was being a bit wicked and asking if, during the POIS period set off by one partner, your symptoms improve if you are offered sex with someone *else.* I'm thinking of a naughty remark by comedian Chris Rock who once said, "There's nothing like new p*ssy to clear the mind!"

My take on that is that his dopamine soars when she shows up...but that at some point after he partakes of his new "p*ssy," he will feel his brain go fuzzy again. So she only seems to be "the cure."

Anyhow, I'm sorry you're suffering with this. My personal version of this problem was to get extremely short tempered after orgasm (not necessarily right after). I can tell you that I don't miss the cause, and very much enjoy the benefits of greater harmony. So maybe this program is a blessing in disguise for those of us who are observant enough to catch  on. Very cool thread.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/06/2008 03:49:25
Hello Reuniting/Marina,

Thanks for joining in on our thread.  Actually, your site was one of first that I found, before this thread got off the ground.  You have certainly done a lot of work compiling different articles and information.

In my experience, there was not a difference in my POIS symptoms when I first started dating my current girlfriend.  So, the 'new partner'/'old partner' theory doesn't seem to hold in my case, at least.  I have found no difference in orgasm with 'new partner', 'longtime partner,' or masturbation.  It seems more tied to the mechanism of orgasm itself, rather than the partner or lack thereof.

In some ways, the POIS group seems like it could provide a good way to figure out the 'sexual let-down' mechanism that you think it found in most people.  If our POIS symptoms are a more extreme version of what happens in most people, it might be easier to figure out the general biological mechanism at work by studying us.  Thus, there could be a wider and more extensive benefit to science/medicine/psychology to be gained by focusing on causes or cures for POIS.  In other words, in trying to convince researchers to investigate POIS, it need not be presented only as an ailment that affects very few people, but it could have also implications for (subtler) symptoms that may affect the broader population.



Guthrie, this is excellent! This might help smooth the road for us to attract our research endocrinologist, since our POIS Group may represent "the tip of the iceberg" and not just a tiny little segment of society! Thanks.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 11/06/2008 03:58:50
HELLO REUNITING--

I have practiced tantric sex with my partner for 9 years. (I believe that's the kind of "gentle intercourse" that you speak of.) But
despite the non-orgasmic focus of tantric sex, occasionally orgasms happen anyway--whether during sex or sometimes during
sleep. And in the case of people with POIS, those symptoms are more severe than the usual "post-sexual satiation let down" that
you are addressing. There are times when, after orgasm, I could not function AT ALL and crashed restlessly all day and felt like I
was on a bad mind-fogging drug trip. Also, on many occasions I have become ill with colds and flus due to orgasmic exhaustion.

Also, I have NEVER felt the urge for a new novel partner in those moments of post orgasm depletion. The idea of more sex at that
point of depletion would be as appealing as trying to eat a multi-course feast after a night of food poisoning.  [;D]

So maybe there is some truth in the "normal" (whatever that means) male/female mammalian "post sexual let down" response that
rings true for those who have a faster rebound, and who aren't as depleted/drained/bottomed-out as some of us are after orgasm.
But speaking for myself, I can't relate much to your theory. Although I do hope you're open to investigating us more thoroughly.
We are definitely in need of being investigated.  [;)]

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 11/06/2008 04:08:04
I do not know if this can help unveil the mystery, but as I say I notice that after an orgasm I completely alters the digestive system and begins fatigue, which is disappearing as I am about evacuating during the week.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 11/06/2008 04:15:44
Reuniting, welcome to the POIS Forum! I agree with girlwind that our symptoms are so severe that it is hard to relate to these "normal" post-satiation observations. The POIS severity usually lasts DAYS. It is often monstrous, debilitating and incapacitating. It has ruined a chunk of my life and most people here, either directly from the symptoms or the "just around the corner" anticipatory fear of having an unwanted orgasm, such as a wet dream.

We are looking for a research endocrinologist to read through our hundreds of posts and to recommend some low-risk cures (I have cured my POIS 75% with Levitra but that is risky for those without ED)

Anything you can do to help along those lines to reach this goal would be greatly appreciated!  Thank you and welcome again.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: reuniting on 11/06/2008 16:37:24
Hi all. Thanks for the greetings. I have no doubt that your symptoms are uniquely severe, and I am not trying to make light of them. And there may be somewhat different causes for each of you. For example, some people have differences in their dopamine receptors, which change their susceptibility to addictions and who knows what else? Others have changes to these mechanisms due to lack of childhood nurturing. Generous, non-goal oriented affection seems to ease some of these symptoms, perhaps due to the effects of oxytocin.

I will say that some of what we have uncovered is pretty strong proof that orgasm is a *long* cycle for everyone. So the fact that your symptoms linger for days is not surprising - even though the severity is greater than most people experience.

Since my husband and I also have orgasm occasionally (inadvertently), we have had a chance to watch the changes in ourselves. (And neither of us ever thought orgasm was a problem *before* we began observing ourselves.) The post-orgasmic fallout is always slightly different. Sometimes the symptoms seem more severe than others. No matter how mild the orgasm, we notice *some* unwelcome feelings (fatigue, irritability, brain fog in lesser degrees than many of you experience) off and on for a full two weeks. Any of you care to add your experiences to this thread? http://www.reuniting.info/node/1319 Effects of Orgasm: Male/Female Differences

As for tantra, I'm not sure that's the same thing as I'm talking about. Some tantra emphasizes the build up of sexual tension. Here's a description of what I'm referring to, just to clarify:

The technique is not based on control. You are not seeking to avoid orgasm or to manipulate your bodily energies; you are merely closing your eyes, feeling those energies stream into your heart, head and genitals and those of your lover, and allowing them to circulate…. You are always relaxing, relaxing, falling back into the heart. Effortless awareness is the key. All your energies will be drawn upward, diffused throughout the body.… As this takes place, lustful tendencies will be transmuted into feelings of love and the need for conventional orgasm will lessen.[James N. Powell, Energy and Eros: Teachings on the Art of Love, William Morrow and company, Inc. (1985):182]
__

Finally, here's an example of another mammal feeling totally knackered after sexual satiation: http://www.reuniting.info/science/coolidge_effect Could some combination of genes, environment, diet, other stimulants, other medications, other illnesses, etc. be speeding up this process in some of us?

I'll certainly post any clues we find - and keep tabs on your discoveries. My intuition says we're talking about the same continuum, but I may be wrong.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 11/06/2008 18:25:09
Reuniting... POIS symptoms are extremely severe.  It's not a case of being more aware of something that most people feel; to be cliche, the difference is like night and day.   

I don't mean to say that you don't have some form of this though -- that is not my place.  Obviously you feel quite strongly about what symptoms you do experience, and I really hope you can help us. :).  I just want to emphasize how this is an uncommon condition (e.g. a majority of people do not have it), and how severe the symptoms are.


Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: rock27 on 11/06/2008 18:42:26
Great news, reuniting. If we are extreme representatives of a more common mechanism, it will be easier to find researchers. Because when they find a cure, they will be able to sell it to many people, not just to the few of us. Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/06/2008 01:25:51

We have been collecting information about post-sexual satiation "let down" for over a decade, although we did not know it had a name (POIS).


Marnia, I think the confusion some of us had was from your sentence above which seems to indicate that you equate the universal post-sexual satiation "let down" with POIS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: reuniting on 12/06/2008 04:49:59
Sorry for the confusion. My theory is that these conditions *are* on the same continuum, albeit at different ends. Who knows?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/06/2008 06:13:23
So your theory is that everyone has POIS?

I would call what we describe here as POIS and the more common one "post-sexual-letdown" - or somehow distinguish the two.

They are worlds apart.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: reuniting on 12/06/2008 18:06:51
Yes Demo, I see that they are worlds apart. Yet if they lie on the same spectrum, it may be that a behavioral change is a possible solution.

I'm not a big fan of pharmaceuticals. The more I learn, the more obvious it is that we don't know as much about the side effects as we think. Psychotropic  drugs (which are necessary to change neurotransmitter levels in the brain - assuming that's part of this condition) are powerful. They alter the brain, they are hard to get off of (withdrawal misery), and they have had some very nasty, unexpected side effects, such as dampening or inflaming libido, causing addictions and even changes in sexual orientation (dopamine agonists), and severe depression (the ones that were promised to "cure" addiction, for example). Viagra, on the other hand, is associated with sudden blindness and heart disease/strokes.

So my thought is that a change in behavior that leads to satisfying lovemaking - albeit different than fertilization-driven sex - might be a better way to cope than pills. I am not in any way trying to downplay your suffering by suggesting that these conditions are on the same spectrum. I'm very sorry if I gave you that impression in error.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 12/06/2008 19:09:59
Psychotropic  drugs (which are necessary to change neurotransmitter levels in the brain - assuming that's part of this condition) are powerful. They alter the brain, they are hard to get off of (withdrawal misery), and they have had some very nasty, unexpected side effects, such as dampening or inflaming libido, causing addictions and even changes in sexual orientation (dopamine agonists), and severe depression (the ones that were promised to "cure" addiction, for example). Viagra, on the other hand, is associated with sudden blindness and heart disease/strokes.

I disagree.  I have a tendency to avoid medication when I can -- as I think most people do -- but SSRIs, for instance, have really helped people with serious depression.  Many have taken them regularly for over 10 years, and the net effect has definitely been positive.  I think these drugs have done a lot more good than harm.  And I'm in a professional situation where I frequently have contact with extremely intelligent research physicians. The general consensus amongst them is the same: SSRIs have done a world of good for a lot of people, where pretty much anything else would have been far less effective.

As far as POIS goes, I would be absolutely thankful for anything that would alleviate the POIS symptoms; I'd easily trade POIS for erectile dysfunction.  I -- and I'm sure most others -- are in a state of desperation.  I don't have the luxury to think "Oh, these drugs have a somewhat unknown effect".  I just want something that works.

But I don't really want to turn this into a debate about whether various drugs are good or bad; I'll take what helps.  No-one would deny L-dopa to someone with Parkinson's.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/06/2008 19:32:25
I don't think cause and effect have been proven with the very rare cases of ED drugs and blindness, but even a handful per millions where there is an association is enough to merit raising awareness and concern.

I agree that pharma can sometimes have unwanted side effects, but I am highly skeptical of any behavioral change working. I tried non-ejaculatory orgasm methods (Mantak Chia) and they failed. I learned that orgasm is the culprit, not ejaculation. But even if the technique worked, it was just way too difficult and an extreme lifestyle change that I believe few can successfully implement.

I'm sure an adept Yogi can adapt to these methods. But what about us mere mortals? I think it's asking too much of most people.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 12/06/2008 19:36:23
Psychotropic  drugs (which are necessary to change neurotransmitter levels in the brain - assuming that's part of this condition) are powerful. They alter the brain, they are hard to get off of (withdrawal misery), and they have had some very nasty, unexpected side effects, such as dampening or inflaming libido, causing addictions and even changes in sexual orientation (dopamine agonists), and severe depression (the ones that were promised to "cure" addiction, for example). Viagra, on the other hand, is associated with sudden blindness and heart disease/strokes.

I disagree.  I have a tendency to avoid medication when I can -- as I think most people do -- but SSRIs, for instance, have really helped people with serious depression.  Many have taken them regularly for over 10 years, and the net effect has definitely been positive.  I think these drugs have done a lot more good than harm.  And I'm in a professional situation where I frequently have contact with extremely intelligent research physicians. The general consensus amongst them is the same: SSRIs have done a world of good for a lot of people, where pretty much anything else would have been far less effective.

As far as POIS goes, I would be absolutely thankful for anything that would alleviate the POIS symptoms; I'd easily trade POIS for erectile dysfunction.  I -- and I'm sure most others -- are in a state of desperation.  I don't have the luxury to think "Oh, these drugs have a somewhat unknown effect".  I just want something that works.

But I don't really want to turn this into a debate about whether various drugs are good or bad; I'll take what helps.  No-one would deny L-dopa to someone with Parkinson's.

COUNTERPOINTS: very well said! SSRI's turned my life around. I could care less about that third ear growing on my neck.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 12/06/2008 20:16:24
Hi, I 'm 38, new in this forum, and with a bad english.
I'm really exhausted since i'm 15  (2 years after the first ejaculation). I realized the fatigue was obviously linked with sex when i was 20. Probably i noticed this because i started to reduce orgasm frequency , this wasn't a voluntary practice, it was naturally happening  without conscious intervention. So, some days i was very tired and other days i was ok and  i was wondering why at the beginning.

Symptoms after orgasm or wet dream are very disabling  :

- can't practice any sport for 15 days. (low energy, weak legs)
- social phobia
- depression
- fear , anxiety
- exhaustion, prostration (> at day 2)
- and others ...
- No diahrrea or constipation. Sorry!

Ok i can be wrong but here are some of my thoughts about that, based on facts.
When i was 13 (1st ejaculation) i was not eating fruits and vegetables but instead, a lot of sugar and meat. 
Now i can say for sure that POIS is extremely aggravated if i eat raw vegetables or even vitamin C in pills. (True for milk also but less). Eating only meat and cereals, without vegetables has an aphrodisiac effect on me and reduce POIS symptoms . (However this diet is causing side effects.) Perhaps  i started sex too soon under the influence of an aphrodisiac diet, when i was under developped for my age (too small adrenals for example) because of inadequate nutrition. Then after with all the fatigue, perhaps the growth isn’t what it should be.

POIS is not a new condition in the medical field: I have a medical dictionnary (1976 french book, Larousse) written by real doctors.
They say that sexual abstinence is necessary
-for teens otherwise they will run to nervous exhaustion. 
-for adults after sexual excess and can help for erectile dysfunction.

According to other books, all the symptoms of POIS, (bad effects following sex) can be artificially given  to everyone with several poisonous substances . Here these substances given in small doses are classified as remedies but be very careful if you take this because you can have irreversible aggravations of your condition (my experience), even if you stop soon and if you feel better at the beginning.
http://www.hpathy.com/diseases/spermatorrhoea-symptoms-treatment-cure.asp

I was thinking that semen loss was responsible for the symptoms because for me and others here the loss of pre-cum liquid cause problems (less) . Semen contains a lot of nutrients. 
Also some old books relate a disease called spermatorrhea where seminal losses occur without orgasm and cause POIS.
Is it possible that with the taoist practices, ejaculation inside,  you lose sperm in the bladder ?
And for women  they can also ejaculate, perhaps without knowing the fact if it’s inside ... Just an idea like that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retrograde_ejaculation
However I’m not against the idea that it’s only the orgasm the main problem, I simply don’t know.

I hope you are all a bit ok anyway !
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 12/06/2008 22:59:11
Drugs are not my cup of Prozac. I definitely prefer natural solutions, which I'm sure are out there and have far less risk.
Everybody is different, of course, and we all can choose what route we want to take.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/06/2008 00:04:01
It would be great if everything had a natural solution. Unfortunately, that's not the real world.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 13/06/2008 03:07:23
It would be great if everything had a natural solution. Unfortunately, that's not the real world.

Exactly.  For instance, it would be transparently foolish to recommend only 'natural' solutions to someone with a condition like Parkinson's disease, or diabetes. 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/06/2008 03:30:11
MARTIN88

Welcome to the POIS forum! Thank you for your post.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/06/2008 03:32:37
It would be great if everything had a natural solution. Unfortunately, that's not the real world.

Exactly.  For instance, it would be transparently foolish to recommend only 'natural' solutions to someone with a condition like Parkinson's disease, or diabetes. 

Definitely. And I believe POIS is right up there - in life-affecting severity - with those 2 conditions.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 13/06/2008 04:48:52
One thing I am absolutely secure, when I have an orgasm I feel almost inmediately that something weird happens in my stomach. I feel like my organism whants to sweep stomach contents to intestine, and that get manifested with fatigue and bad mood. I think that may be some substance poured inside by the orgasm mechanism produce this effect. The process I described it last few days and it is acompanied by other common Pois symthoms that I think are result of that process. And not necessarly having diarrea, it is not my case, I start to get very constipated, wich it helps to get worse others symthomps, like to much fatigue, headaches, swollen nose, greasy nose, sweats, get hungry, specially need for sugar foods somethimes or big meals, little of acne, hard hair hard to comb, among many others.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 13/06/2008 04:59:39
It would be great if everything had a natural solution. Unfortunately, that's not the real world.

Exactly.  For instance, it would be transparently foolish to recommend only 'natural' solutions to someone with a condition like Parkinson's disease, or diabetes. 
Thanks for your welcome B Jim and Demografx
I understand your point Counterpoints and the idea behind. But it's not a very good example for L-Dopa and insulin which can almost be considered natural substances, however not found without prescription at the local natural food/herbal store i admit ! About SSRI i'm sure it has unknown bad effects and i have big hesitation since a long time to take this medication. If it's good for PE perhaps it's good to reduce wet dreams. I have to push myself to try this. It seems i have a kind of gradual POIS : i'm a lot better after pois day 4 but I really start to be mentally well (self confidence) just the day before a wet dream , approx pois day 15-21.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 13/06/2008 05:41:56
It would be great if everything had a natural solution. Unfortunately, that's not the real world.

Exactly.  For instance, it would be transparently foolish to recommend only 'natural' solutions to someone with a condition like Parkinson's disease, or diabetes. 
Thanks for your welcome B Jim and Demografx
I understand your point Counterpoints and the idea behind. But it's not a very good example for L-Dopa and insulin which can almost be considered natural substances, however not found without prescription at the local natural food/herbal store i admit ! About SSRI i'm sure it has unknown bad effects and i have big hesitation since a long time to take this medication. If it's good for PE perhaps it's good to reduce wet dreams. I have to push myself to try this. It seems i have a kind of gradual POIS : i'm a lot better after pois day 4 but I really start to be mentally well (self confidence) just the day before a wet dream , approx pois day 15-21.


We are now getting into the semantics of what it means to be 'natural', and I think this is besides the point.  The way it is often used, 'natural', is somewhat of a vague term; anything is natural in some sense.

Essentially, if your body is complaining because it lacks something, the drug that most effectively replenishes whatever it is you are lacking is the drug that will help you most; whether or not it is easily accessible in nature is not terribly important, relative to treating the condition.  Also, something being 'natural' (e.g. somewhat easily accessible in nature) has good connotations, but not rightly so; there are many many poisons in nature, far worse than the side effects of most pharmaceuticals. Natural remedies (e.g. foxglove) can also have lethal side effects.  The idea of reverting back to the basics is somewhat of a backlash against pharmaceutical industries, and also a result of an inherent mistrust one has for anything that man has tampered with; it's not totally reasonable in many situations, however.

I don't feel I have the luxury of worrying about whether I could find a treatment in nature; I really feel the need for relief, and like those with Parkinson's, or diabetes, a naturally accessible (non-prescription) remedy may not be the most effective option.  There are many, many, other conditions I could also have used as examples -- and that really is besides the point.  The point is that, for well understood reasons, some conditions will be more effectively treated with processed medications than by any other means, and this may be the case with POIS; it's not something I'm going to rule out.  I am desperate for a solution and therefore open minded to suggestions.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 13/06/2008 18:19:14
The point I was making when I triggered this discussion about natural vs synthetic remedies is that we all have a CHOICE
about how to proceed, and that it's up to each of us to find treatment solutions that we are comfortable with, and that suit
our individual needs.

Yes, there are some medical conditions that require the use of pharmaceuticals. But in many instances, there are natural
treatment options that are downplayed or dismissed, because the tendency in our culture is to go for the "quick fix" that
ultimately only suppresses symptoms and ignores the underlying original cause of the problem. THREE EXAMPLES: 1) Many
type two diabetics "cure" their diabetes when they begin to eat healthy and lose weight. 2) Back in the 90's Dr. Dean Ornish
proved that CAD (coronary artery disease) could be reversed with strict low-fat dietary practices, meditation and exercise. 
3) In 1999, in a double-blind study of 30 patients who were recently ill with bipolar disorder, Dr. Andrew Stoll (a Harvard
psychiatrist), discovered that omega-3 fatty acids from concentrated fish oil to be an effective antidepressant and mood
stabilizer--without any of the toxic effects of the pharmaceuticals.

When it comes to POIS, I personally am not willing to submit myself to ingesting synthetic pharmaceuticals in desperation
"to fix" the POIS problem. This decision comes from the facts of my personal medical history and from the serious allergic
reactions and side-effects I've experienced in the past from taking both over-the-counter and pharmaceutical drugs. (I
grew up with a medical doctor father, who like many doctors of his generation, handed out pills like candy. Hence I have
had A LOT of experience with the modern day pharmacopeia. And... I am not impressed.)

Because there is, as of yet, no clear definitive understanding of the CAUSE of POIS, my attitude is a wait-and-see one. I
want to know what I am treating before I commit to treating it.





Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 13/06/2008 19:36:37
TO COUNTERPOINTS: REPLY FROM TNS RE HOSTING YOUR FORM

Hello demografx,
 
thank you for writing. I'm sorry I've been slow to reply - very busy at the moment.
 
I am afraid that we've got to say no to this request purely on the grounds of fairness; we're pretty stretched with our time and resources, and setting up and supporting things like this further eats into that time.
 
Also, I am unwilling to set a precedent because this would mean we could not legitimately refuse to provide other groups or parties with free special infrastructure, and if we were to refuse them we could then be accused of favouritism (or worse).
 
I am quite happy for you to use the forum to canvas opinion from interested parties - and perhaps a carefully crafted poll help you to do that - but I'm afraid that a webform, at this stage, is not something we're willing to provide.
 
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

For The Naked Scientists
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 13/06/2008 21:34:57
Demografx: It would take pretty much zero time and resources for them to give us some web-space, and technical support isn't necessary.  But anyways, if they don't want to help, I will make sure this happens some other way: I know of some people who could easily help, but for the sake of anonymity, I was going to wait on asking.  Thanks for looking into this.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 14/06/2008 05:18:02

Demografx: It would take pretty much zero time and resources for them to give us some web-space, and technical support isn't necessary.  But anyways, if they don't want to help, I will make sure this happens some other way: I know of some people who could easily help, but for the sake of anonymity, I was going to wait on asking.  Thanks for looking into this.


They are extremely busy right now, and also they said they would contact Cambridge U. to inquire about a consulting endocrinologist for our POIS Forum. Thanks for understanding.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 14/06/2008 05:24:35

Because there is, as of yet, no clear definitive understanding of the CAUSE of POIS, my attitude is a wait-and-see one. I want to know what I am treating before I commit to treating it.


girlwind, the POIS-cause information you wish will hopefully come from the research endocrinologist we're trying to recruit. Keep in mind that we're in the very beginning, baby stages with POIS. So far, as you can see, NOTHING has been accomplished to date worldwide re a definitive understanding of this vicious malady. But this Forum, to me, is an incredible breakthrough. Prior to the Forum, we had absolutely nothing. Now we have hundreds of focused pages chock full of fascinating personal history and even some successes in the cure department. To some degree, I attribute my partial cure to this Forum in that it raised my awareness of possible contributors and alleviants of POIS.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 14/06/2008 06:27:01
We are now getting into the semantics of what it means to be 'natural', and I think this is besides the point. 

That's not a problem if it's besides, honestly it was just a friendly remark without importance from me because i found your examples funny, "bad luck choices". For me nothing is more natural than insulin for lack of insulin which is directly involved in a life process.As Girlwind say, it's far more natural to treat diabete with exercise and diet if possible, I know it's difficult to measure out insulin (synthetic, very effective), finally it's not so natural a doctor who thinks he's himself a pancreas ! I'm not against pharmaceuticals or against natural remedies if they are effective and not harmful. I try to stay open minded with all therapies because i think both can be very effective.(eg foxglove !). Since i had an horrible experience with a pharmaceutical drug in the past which could have been replaced by an other one safer if the doctor had correctly red the warnings, I try to avoid now. To use your own terms I don't feel I have the luxury of taking the risk to be worse than i am today, because i'm also severely ill.
I hope you're doing well with your form. The questions you ask are interesting. I don't have experience in medical research. If you have 1000 cases of pois perhaps it can be difficult to compile but at least we can avoid false results inherent to online forms the way you have done this.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 14/06/2008 07:31:46
One thing I am absolutely secure, when I have an orgasm I feel almost inmediately that something weird happens in my stomach. I feel like my organism whants to sweep stomach contents to intestine, and that get manifested with fatigue and bad mood. I think that may be some substance poured inside by the orgasm mechanism produce this effect. The process I described it last few days and it is acompanied by other common Pois symthoms that I think are result of that process. And not necessarly having diarrea, it is not my case, I start to get very constipated, wich it helps to get worse others symthomps, like to much fatigue, headaches, swollen nose, greasy nose, sweats, get hungry, specially need for sugar foods somethimes or big meals, little of acne, hard hair hard to comb, among many others.
Hi Solution, i do not feel anything in the stomach, we are all differents except for fatigue. Try to eat slowly and masticate your food for a long time perhaps this can help a bit.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 15/06/2008 09:03:11
But this Forum, to me, is an incredible breakthrough. Prior to the Forum, we had absolutely nothing. Now we have hundreds of focused pages chock full of fascinating personal history and even some successes in the cure department. To some degree, I attribute my partial cure to this Forum in that it raised my awareness of possible contributors and alleviants of POIS.

Yes, I'm also really happy to have found this forum; it's nice to know that there are other people who understand this experience and that we aren't alone in searching for treatment.  This is by far the best place I've found in about 10 years of many google searches.

(PS.  I aim to have the form up and accessible for us this week.  I think it will be a great way to quickly organize and compile our information for researchers).
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 15/06/2008 15:34:04
viagra, levitra, and cialis are all PDE5 inhibitors.
http://biopsychiatry.com/oxytocin-viagra.htm
http://biopsychiatry.com/viagra-antidepressant.htm
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 15/06/2008 22:43:13
Aight people, I just sent the letter for OHSU, so cross your fingers.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 16/06/2008 04:22:18
I am really impressed by us! We are so wonderfully relentless.  [;D] [;D] [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/06/2008 06:22:44

Aight people, I just sent the letter for OHSU, so cross your fingers.


PYROPEACH, THANK YOU! GREAT GOING. Crossing fingers AND toes!!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/06/2008 06:26:28

(PS.  I aim to have the form up and accessible for us this week.  I think it will be a great way to quickly organize and compile our information for researchers).

This is great. Please keep in mind that we also have much valuable information posted here from people who posted but haven't returned to the Forum.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/06/2008 06:39:46

This is by far the best place I've found in about 10 years of many google searches.


Counterpoints, thank you very much for that great compliment!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 16/06/2008 06:42:20
I am really impressed by us! We are so wonderfully relentless.  [;D] [;D] [;D]

Girlwind, your great spirit shines through [;D]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 16/06/2008 12:53:09
Yes it is a GREAT place here. I hope all the people who left the forum come back sometimes . They will be able to fill the form(s)or to give us details about treatments if they are healed. We should add in the form if we are ready to give some blood samples. Possible but not easy to post blood in ice pack . I can't imagine an endocrinologist working and finding something without lab tests. (however he can be able to find a special technic to give pois to rats ! [::)]  Power of science...). 
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 17/06/2008 15:40:41
when i was 23 my cortisol level was too high (pois day 10) . I was taking multivitamin at this time (with C and B5 in it). I have never done any other test after that but perhaps it's still high because i often wake up very early (3am).

When i was 35 i have done a bioavailable testosterone test pois day 15 and the result was 5 (normal range 4 - 15). I wasn't doing sport at all at this time. I wasn't very tired before the test.

2 years later i have done an other one for testosterone, pois day 1, exactly the same test, same hour. I was very tired before the test. Result 8 (normal 4 - 15) .
I was surprised because i red  this study  : http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11760788
(about this study my doc say it's not a problem because testosterone stay in the range)
I was playing tennis 2h00/week at this time(for the second test). Perhaps this could have changed the result . I have never played tennis before in my life, i'm not very sports oriented since pois, however at 26 i was able to run non stop for two hours every day, only with total sexual abstinence and good nutrition. If i had a wet dream i could only run (not easily) 15-20 min which is not a lot with the training i had at this time.

Hope this helps. For me it's only confusion.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 18/06/2008 03:48:32

Hope this helps. For me it's only confusion.


Martin88, your posts are very valuable. Thank you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 18/06/2008 21:14:12
martin88

I feel the same as you, almost exactly the same kind of problem. I am an athlete, and POIS takes my performance down to about 20% of my abillity. Very annoying!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 19/06/2008 00:23:53
martin88

I feel the same as you, almost exactly the same kind of problem. I am an athlete, and POIS takes my performance down to about 20% of my abillity. Very annoying!

You must have much patience and tolerance. "Very annoying"? I would call 20% effectiveness devastating!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 19/06/2008 02:00:22
martin88

I feel the same as you, almost exactly the same kind of problem. I am an athlete, and POIS takes my performance down to about 20% of my abillity. Very annoying!

I agree....20% deficit in performance  as an athlete IS frustratingly annoying. (mild understatement !!!! )

As an Ex-Athlete myself....... this would have been devastating !!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 19/06/2008 06:34:24
I'm curious: has anyone here had a glucose tolerance test?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 19/06/2008 08:17:57
Also: for those with irritated bowel symptoms (I do not have these), have you tried a gluten free diet?
I was just reading this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coeliac_disease
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 19/06/2008 16:36:05
Why can't I just have peanut butter and jelly sandwiches? They cured _everything_ when I was a kid.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: neilep on 19/06/2008 17:23:18
Why can't I just have peanut butter and jelly sandwiches? They cured _everything_ when I was a kid.

Yummy !!!...Thank Ewe America for Peanut Butter and Jelly Sarnies !!.........
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 19/06/2008 19:44:08
If you all want a good general information health website, here's one I recommend. I've found many answers to  questions on diet
and supplements. http://www.mercola.com/

I've not posted a question about POIS. Since I've posted several other questions, maybe one of you could do that... ?   It's a thought.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 20/06/2008 19:17:28
OUR ENDOCRINOLOGIST SEARCH

Pyropeach has been working hard on finding someone at OHSU (Oregon Health) but it doesn't look like they can help in the immediate future.

If everyone here can find out the email address of your local university/medical contact (ask for the email address of the Chief Endocrinologist), we have letter templates that were posted by me and B_Jim and Counterpoints.

If you can send the letter, great. If not just give one of us the email address and we'll take it from there!

Your phone call to find the email address of your local endocrinologist might be the next step to a POIS cure!

Many thanks for all your efforts!

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 20/06/2008 20:29:35
just a note from my side. I changed the L-Tyrosine to L-Phenylalanine, my POIS has lots to do with Dopamine and Glucose. Therefor these are the only supplements I nowadays will never skip in a day:

1) L-Phenylalanine 100mg on an empty stomach when I wake up
2) Alpha Lipoic Acid and Brewers Yeast with breakfast a little bit later

I found that increasing the ATP energy in my body, things are getting much better. Brewers Yeast has a lot of Ribose and B Vitamins, and Alpha Lipoic Acid helps with glucose transport and insulin tolerance.

THE ABOVE SUPPLEMENTS WERE A VERY GOOD FIND FOR ME. I HAVE BEEN TAKING IT SINCE 1 JUNE, AND LIFE IS GETTING BETTER.

I stopped taking the DHEA. I sometimes take probiotics for the stomach, some rye bread now and then.

To demografx, I recommend L-Phenylalanine and Alpha Lipoic Acid (250mg per day) to you, since my erections also got better.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: hk1979 on 20/06/2008 20:53:53
demografx

I have sent the letter to Dr. Murdock:

http://hisandherhealth.com/contact-dr.-murdock.html

let's see what happens
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: demografx on 21/06/2008 01:20:42
demografx

I have sent the letter to Dr. Murdock:

http://hisandherhealth.com/contact-dr.-murdock.html

let's see what happens

hk1979, THANK YOU! He's a urologist, let's see what he thinks.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 21/06/2008 07:06:17
I think it will be a lot easier to get a positive response once we have the forms filled out.  It may be worth mentioning that all of the information is in the process of being compiled in an organized way.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 21/06/2008 19:09:05
Where do we go to fill out the forms? Is there a site set up for that yet?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 21/06/2008 20:10:30
Where do we go to fill out the forms? Is there a site set up for that yet?

It isn't finished.  I have the code written, and a host secured, but it needs testing.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Counterpoints on 23/06/2008 06:28:55
Update.   There are some bugs that will take time for me to correct, and I am very busy with work at the moment. Also, I have been quite symptomatic recently. I do have a host, although I would prefer if a larger entity did the hosting.  I would still ask that people look into hosting possibilities (that  support php).   On the other hand, progress is being made, and this should all be ready within a relatively short period of time (min: 4 days, max 2 weeks).
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: sparx on 23/06/2008 08:57:05
hi everyone,

Since early teens (now 42) I've been experiencing post-orgasm 'brain fog' that lasts from 1 to 4 days and often 6+ days. In my case, fog is a collection of symptoms that uniquely characterises this experience. Other symptoms may not always seem to manifest, but fog symptoms of varying intensity and duration have always been part of the experience.

I didn't associate brain fog with orgasm through my teens. It's possible my teenage life was an incoherent blur of orgasm-induced fog (one characteristic symptom in my case being a generally apathetic response to anything in life that didn't pose an immediate threat to escaping or deferring personal discomfort ... I spent a lot of time avoiding situations that, in my self-centered judgment, would not sufficiently reward my physical and/or mental effort and pain). Once I did make the orgasm/fog connection in my early twenties, I assumed that it was normal and that everyone (guys at least) had to put up with it. It was only about 10 years ago that these symptoms made my existence miserable enough that even deep fog couldn't obscure the fact I had to search for relief. I asked other guys questions about their post-orgasm experience and found them unable to relate to what I described.

Doctors (general practitioners mainly) so far seem completely unable to accommodate what I've described to them within any logical or intuitive diagnostic framework. They seem to be trapped inside the limits of differential diagnosis and behave defensively when presented with the idea of a relationship between brain fog and orgasm. They also seem prone to falling back on blood pathology results that are, in my case, consistently nominal. Admittedly, one of the most challenging things for me has been trying to communicate the specifics of symptoms to western medical doctors. Providing general descriptions of symptoms that might suggest a very broad range of causes, and then saying that the symptoms evaporate after a week or two without any medical intervention at all, is viewed (I suspect) as an obstacle to treatment by a medical fraternity focused on treating symptoms. However, given that it is so consistent and repeatable, brain fog could (and should) be viewed as a gift to any serious attempt at diagnosing or researching this syndrome. There have been occasions where I've attended an appointment and the conversation seems to imply I'm wasting doctors' precious time with a head problem. I beg to differ though; I'm no hypercondriac, but I'm also not yet ready to dismiss the possibility of POIS symptoms arising from psychophysical conditioning.

Before going any further I'd like to thank John21 for having the courage to post about his experience. I've spent a lot of time googling for explanations of my experience, but I didn't want to discuss this problem in a public forum, let alone on the Internet. So I've been reading this forum for a while as a supplement to other sources of information and I'm jumping in now because I'm hoping to at least help refine a description of POIS symptoms and possibly contribute a few questions that might diversify the investigation without muddying the problem further. It is my sincere hope that we can identify the questions that will eventually liberate John21 and the rest of us. Thanks also B_jim, demografx, Counterpoints, girlwind and gonzo; your contributions, and many others, are very much appreciated. I'm a bit surprised to find this many people experiencing this specific form of human suffering. It seems possible to me that there could be many many more who suffer in silence.

My fog symptoms are much like what many have already described. Gonzo's list of 12 items is a good example. The numbering in my list corresponds reasonably closely to Gonzo's list;

2. Inability to concentrate, entrain mental focus, or prevent mental drift for longer than a few seconds.
3. Severely degraded cognitive function (including reasoning, short term and long term memory)
4. Degraded ability to comprehend printed and spoken English, and speech difficulties
7. Derealisation (gonzo: Dream-like consciousness / surrealism)
8. Emotional dysphoria. Emotionally blocked or blank, apathy, emotional numbness/flatness (though frustration/anger did arise consistently in the past)
11. Inability to entrain steady visual focus. Shifting attention away from maintaining visual focus results in loss of focus.

I've experienced all twelve items on Gonzo's list but the excluded items don't always seem to occur.


--- re: Defining and refining symptoms

In addition to Counterpoints' excellent data collection efforts, and to complement them if possible, I'm wondering if it might be possible to narrow down the specifics of the key symptoms (particularly brain fog). I'm not certain about how to do this as yet, but I imagine collaborating with POIS sufferers to define an agreed list of symptoms and then elaborating sub-symptoms below each point. Then coming up with ways of describing the limits of each sub-symptom (this might require a more sophisticated collaborative environment than TNS is currently offering). One challenge with this might be that each person would have different levels of sensitivity and awareness of their symptoms. Another challenge arises from the nature of brain fog itself (being that brain fog tends to obstruct self-analysis in my experience).

Here's a couple more examples of what I mean by 'more detail' (using the list above);

'3. Severely degraded cognitive function' - one thing I've started trying to do with medical people is establish rapport or capture their attention with their own terminology (used correctly I hope), so I've been referring to "brain fog" as "acute mental akinesia" (meaning "temporarily unable to initiate specific types of mental action"). A specific type of mental akinesia such as "recall akinesia" might manifest as an inability to recall the names of very well known contemporary film actors. For example, "Who played the lead role in Minority Report, Vanilla Sky, Mission Impossible II?" I KNOW that I KNOW the actor's name, I know that I SHOULD be able to recall it almost instantaneously (normally I can). I might even be able to visualise the actor's face. But during an episode of fog it seems like the answer, the name, is right on the edge of awareness, but it just won't pop up into consciousness, as if there is not enough energy to tunnel across some neural threshhold, or there is an impenatrable veil between one mental subsystem and another. Once symptoms set in, that 'Who played..' question may not get answered for hours (or days, if I forget to make the effort to remember due to drifting mental concentration, even if I actively try to use associative recall techniques).

So a memory test might include a timed exercise of recalling well known names (which might vary depending on your country and native language). Taking the test would involve noting down things like number of items able to be recalled within a period of time, in addition to generally scoring one's own level of concentration on a scale of 1 to 10 (same as nurses ask a patient to rate their level of pain on a scale of 1 to 10 when deciding whether to administer morphine - pain, like consciousness and mental clarity, is a subjective experience).

Recall strategy may also be very useful when correlated across a number of participants. Some people recall names using internal visual cues; eg. linking an internal image of a persons face with an image or shape of the words in a person's name. Others might use auditory or kinesthetic cues. Knowing which strategies are more or less successful during an episode of POIS might suggest which parts of the brain are involved in the POIS process.

There might be other ways of describing specific symptoms as well. Again for recall, I sometimes describe it as if there is a jamming signal interfering with the normal flow of coherent thought.

Another example;  '4. Inability to communicate properly' - It would be useful to break this down into specifics. In my case I have problems not only understanding and analysing what I'm hearing or reading (receiving), but actually pronouncing words clearly is a real issue. It's as if the fine motor control required to fluently sequence and coordinate the machanisms of speech have been compromised. Even with close attention and effort, I can't seem to muster the control required to clearly articulate a large proportion of words. And then, as the fog subsides, the problem lifts (like lifting fog) and I can speak clearly and fluently again.

Headaches (number 10 on Gonzo's list), is another example ecause headaches (for anyone, not just POIS sufferers) could manifest in a wide variety of ways. In my case, there's a a very specific type of sensation on the scalp, which I associate with brain fog that might be described as a headache by some but not by others.

So the suggestion is to develop of method that everyone could use to identify, measure and document their symptoms.

.. continued ...
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: sparx on 23/06/2008 08:58:48
... continued from previous post ...

--- Causes : Neurology, Endocrinology, Psychophysical Conditioning

Having just mentioned what appears to be a motor system problem with speech, I might just mention a few things about the possibility of a neurological (as opposed to endocrinological) basis for brain fog. Dopamine has been mentioned plenty of times in relation to POIS. It's possible that fog depends primarily on some kind of imbalance in the brain's dopaminergic systems.

Consider also that the possibility of a neurotransmitter imbalance is a reason to clearly distinguish "brain fog" from other POIS symptoms. If fog is caused by the (un)availability of neurotransmitters (eg. caused by dopamine being unavailable for uptake by receptors in one or more of the brain's main dopamine pathways), that could imply that something is blocking the uptake of a neurotransmitter, while symptoms other than fog might be caused by an absence of that neurotransmitter.

Let me try to clarify what I mean by that in the next couple of paragraphs.

Over the last few years I've been thinking that 'recall akinesia' might be the brain's equivalent of "gait freezing" which is a phenomenon experienced by people suffering from Parkinson's disease. For example, if a Parkinson's sufferer is standing up, they (like any healthy person) could form a "conscious intention" (i.e. volition) to take a step forward. So the "will" to move is there but the motor system may not engage. So they may just remain standing there, even though they are holding the mental "intention" (INternal TENSION) to move. Along with other Parkinson's symptoms this is caused by the absence of dopamine (ie. it's not that the action of dopamine is being blocked, the dopamine just isn't there to be taken up) and this can be compensated for by taking a drug like L-DOPA (a derivative of tyrosine, where a relatively small proportion of each dose crosses the blood-brain barrier, into the brain, where it is metabolised into dopamine).

So, could POIS brain fog be caused by a general lack of dopamine? The clues I have from observing my own symptoms seem ambiguous, but only if one assumes that dopamine levels vary consistently (ie. go up or down together) across all parts of the brain. However there are brain studies that show dopamine levels do not vary consistently throughout the brain, even though the vast majority of the the brain's dopamine is centrally produced. If you want to read about one example of this try (an ADHD dopamine study);
  http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1698925

In my case, POIS symptoms continue beyond the point where sex drive and motivation (general "appetite") have been restored. I can also participate in a wide range of motor-system-intensive activities while fog is happening (eg. play a game of tennis, in spite of possibly feeling general myalgia and/or fatigue). It's possible that my prolactin levels remain elevated and suppress dopamine levels, but there are things one can do to help raise dopamine levels (like ingesting caffine and/or tyrosine and/or ice cream) and, in my case, while this seems to result in other symptoms that suggest an overabundance of dopamine, the brain fog can remain (for days..!). Pumping up my dopamine levels doesn't imply that balance between prolactin/dopamine has been restored to pre-POIS levels, but the persistence of fog may suggest that there is something blocking the uptake of dopamine (perhaps in the tuberoinfundibular and/or mesocortical dopamine pathways).

There are also some interesting things that come up when googling around this idea. For example;

"Chronic blockade of dopamine D2 receptors, a common mechanism of action for antipsychotic drugs, down-regulates D1 receptors in the prefrontal cortex and, as shown here, produces severe impairments in working memory. These deficits were reversed in monkeys by short-term coadministration of a D1 agonist, ABT 431, and this improvement was sustained for more than a year after cessation of D1 treatment. These findings indicate that pharmacological modulation of the  D1 signaling pathway can produce long-lasting changes in functional circuits underlying working memory. Resetting this pathway by brief exposure to the agonist may provide a valuable strategy for therapeutic intervention in schizophrenia and other dopamine dysfunctional states."

I've never taken an antipsychotic but, does the human brain secrete any kind of compound that has effects similar to an antipsychotic? Again, prolactin doesn't block the uptake of dopamine, it only down-regulates production (as does elevated seratonin apparently) so far as I can tell from general reading.

Interestingly, antipsychotic drugs can bring about a syndrome known as "akathisia", but akathisia can occur without exposure to a drug. Check out these symptoms (source URL below);

    - A psychological feeling of “Dis-ease”
    - Dysphoria
    - Apprehension
    - Anxiety (psychic and/or somatic)
    - Tension (psychic and/or somatic)
    - Impatience
    - Irritability
    - Impaired attention
    - Impaired concentration
    - Discomfort (physical)
    - Inner restlessness (especially lower body)
    - Fidgetiness
    - Inability to remain still
    - Compelled to move
    - “On the go”
    - Dysthesia*
    - Jerks

(* Dysthesia: An unpleasant, abnormal sensation, often described as burning, crawling, creeping or ant-like. It may be spontaneous or evoked.)

Check out the following link for the full description and google 'akathisia' for more;
http://psychiatricresourceforum.blogs.com/my_weblog/2006/09/akathisia.html

I'm far from convinced by the dopamine receptor blocking idea, but I wouldn't want to ignore it.

--- endocrinology

On the endocrinology front, the hangover effects of prolactin seems to get quite a lot of attention, but unless POIS sufferers have some special sensitivity to prolactin, I'm not sure it can account for brain fog on its own. And if prolactin can't account for fog, then it seems we could be looking at a broader type of endocrine dysfunction that is undetectable in blood pathology, even during an episode of POIS. I imagine that would be hard for an endocrinologist to accept, but even so I'm guessing there's still scope for endocrine problems, so I'd like to read more about it if anyone has time to write a summary of what they suspect or know.

Yet another study (seems likely some folks would have seen it); "Specificity of the neuroendocrine response to orgasm during sexual arousal in men". If not then here's a link;
  http://joe.endocrinology-journals.org/cgi/reprint/177/1/57.pdf
 It's probably not necessary to read and understand the whole paper; the intro, conclusion might be enough to decide whether it is meaningful and relevant to an investigation into POIS.

--- psychophysical conditioning (neuroendocrine causes?)

An alternative but related hypotheses is an underactive ventral tegmentum complemented by overactive amygdala. By underactive I mean underproducing dopamine. Why might it be underactive? I don't know but, assuming it isn't defective or damaged, I have one suggestion which can be inferred from personal experience.

Let me preface this part by saying that intensity and duration of POIS for me seems to depend primarily on my emotional and mental state before, during and immediately after orgasm.

Specifically, when I feel 'affectionate love', or I feel 'in love' with my partner, POIS symptoms only last a day or so and have at times been negligible (low intensity), though still present.

And, for me, feelings of lust, craving, thirst for the release of orgasm (instead of 'affectionate love') followed by orgasm from either intercourse or masturbation, seem to lead inevitably to longer more intense episodes of POIS. In this emotional context, more than one orgasm, spaced out by hours or one day, seems to compound the duration and intensity of POIS symptoms (in a way that I can only describe as 'brutal!'). And I don't know about anyone else but whenever I have masturbated in the past, it has not been motivated by affectionate love for someone else. The intensity of the orgasm also seems to effect the intensity and duration of POIS and ejaculation (actual emission) is not a necessary precondition for POIS symptoms (maybe the fact that women are at risk for POIS helps narrow the field of causes - thanks girlwind for sharing).

Add to this, fear or even anxiety (habituated fear), and perhaps aversion (hatred) or anger. With this emotional context in play, POIS symptoms can be brutally intense and long lasting. Unfortunately in my case, I've had anxiety problems since childhood. Mood shifts, especially towards frustration and anger, used to seem like an inevitable part of POIS for me.

Over a period of years I've learned that these negative emotions are not an inevitable part of POIS. It's interesting to read that feelings of frustration, annoyance, anger, are common. I too felt this way for years (YEARS!), but it is counterproductive and, I strongly suspect, symptomatic of the syndrome itself.

If I may make one suggestion about how to help minimise the impact of POIS symptoms, it may be helpful to accept negative feelings by just remaining aware of them. Without adding anything to the negative experience of frustration, annoyance or anger ... without wanting the symptoms to stop (which just creates a feedback loop of negative mental and emotional tension) that may prolong the condition, just ramaining mentally equanimous, with detached observation of the condition, will serve you better in terms of immediate functioning and patient effort to be liberated from this condition.

If POIS is due to psychophysical conditioning, perhaps triggered by simultaneous activation of amygdala (either one or both, perhaps due to anxiety because of fundmentalist religious and/or family and/or cultural attitudes to sex) in association with the reward of orgasm (the idea being that 'things that fire together, wire together'), Then there is some clinical research that might (IMHO) offer some anecdotal support to the idea of POIS starting out as a psychophysical condition;

     http://www.cnn.com/2007/HEALTH/02/14/love.science/index.html

     http://www.alibi.com/index.php?scn=feature&story=7180
     http://www.alternativesmagazine.com/36/robinson.html
     

However the problem with this idea remains; something should show up on a blood test. Elevated cortisol perhaps. In my case I've not had any abnormal blood results while in the grip of brain fog.

Finally, there used to be confusion in my mind about whether POIS is a chronic condition. This is because, for me, abstaining from sexual activity of any kind for a few weeks leaves me in relatively good shape. However, at best I'd say POIS is an unrecognised, acute (in the medical sense) psychiatric illness that prevents an otherwise average person from developing whatever potential they might have. 'Debilitating' is probably the right word. In my experience it cripples the intellect, it impairs learning, it may be a source of emotional agitiation or at least amplification of existing negative emotional disturbance, it undermines confidence, it damages social life and intimate relationships and limits career prospects.

But I'm generally optimistic about the future, especially now that POIS has been outed on the Internet. Perhaps now there is an fMRI and/or PET scan in my future, hopefully as part of an international study supervised by Vilayanur Ramachandran. Perhaps I’ll be required to lay there, very still, while some gorgeous lab assistant (an enthusiastic volunteer or course) does her best to blow my brains out (there must be some up-side to POIS; maybe this is it!)

Good luck everyone!
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 24/06/2008 00:31:59
I think that my post orgasm mental fog it is produced by something anoying in my digestive system. Imagine something inside your stomach or intestines for example, something that cannot manifest itself like pain, itching, cold, warm, etc, but it can send a singal to the brain enough to produce mental fog and scalp tension. And only relief will come once I evacuate enough.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: pyropeach on 24/06/2008 08:26:43
Since early teens (now 42) I've been experiencing post-orgasm 'brain fog'

Have you noticed any change in the intensity of the symptoms from when you were in your teens to now?  I am wondering if its possible to outgrow this horrible illness.  It is truly driving me mad.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 24/06/2008 16:11:18

Hi all,

Iam happy too post here  [;D]

Ive had POIS for say 4-5 years but it is getting better.

At its worst symptoms would last 5-7 days now it only lasts 12-24 hours.

I had blood test results too post which can give you a idea what is
wrong with my hormones.

Please note I have been on testosterone and hcg for a year now from
low testosterone levels for my age.

This is my Saliva hormone test result :



-------------------------------------------------

Estradiol (E2) 1.0 pg/ml 0.5-2.2

Progesterone 4230H pg/ml 12-100 (Very high)

Estriol (E3) 3.0 pg/ml 0-3.0 (High)

Estrone (E1) 4.2H pg/ml 0-3.0 (Very High)

Testosterone(Bio) 254 pg/ml 115-3700(5-50mg topical 12-24 hr) (rechecked with
Zrt and my testosterone levels are too high so have lowered testosterone doses)

Dheas 9.3 ng/ml 2-23(Age dependant) (Scale for 18-20s is 8-23 so my level
are in the bottom range, not good for energy and stress management)

Cortisol Morning 4.0 ng/ml 3.7-9.5 (Low)

Healthy cortisol levels should be at its highest in the morning apon waking and then it tapers down during the day and night. From my ZRT symptoms sheet it states I have Andrenal fatigue so that would explain my crappy energy levels and inability too deal with stress.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 24/06/2008 16:23:25
This is my plans :

First too fix the good and bad ratio of the estrogens.(This will also increase testosterone levels so wont have too take as much tesosterone Im injections.)

High estrone levels in males are really rare and Ive only seen one male have success in lowering their estrone levels and not lowering estradiol levels too low.

He did this by taking a supplement called Dual Action Cruciferous vegetables (Lef) 6 tabs a day and 2 tmg pills for 3 months. He also recommended too add Calcium D glucarate for this protocol.

I will do this for 3 months and have monthly tests done too check the progress.

My progesterone levels were sky high. Zrt had asked if I was taking any
Progesterone cream ofc I wasnt.

From my research it seems Hcg is converted too Progesterone and also I was taking a product which had Pregnolone in it around 25mg each pill. It really helped
my chronic fatigue.

Anyways the Pregnolonone was converting too Progesterone which would explain the sky high progesterone levels.

No wonder my libido was shat as high progesterone levels also causes low dht levels which is a double hitter for crap libido.

Anyways have lowered my hcg dose and stopped the Pregnolonone and have started a small dose of Dht cream on the balls. Since doing this for 10 days or so ejaculation frequency went from E4D/E5D too E2D  [;D]

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 24/06/2008 16:33:50


Too fix the low Dhea level Iam rubbing in 15mg of Dhea cream every morning.
This wont pass through the liver so wont have too worry about it converting
too extrogens :D

Will re-adjust dose after a month depending on test result.

For the low cortisol level, it is best too take Isocort first unless
the cortisol levels are below the scale which mine is just above the bottom.

Approx around 2.5mg of cortiol are in each pellet of 1 Isocort so I take
4x in morning, 2x 4 hours later 1 4 hours later and 1 more at bedtime.However you have too work towards this as it can produce Andrenaline dumps from the Thyroid hormones going through the bloodstreams too quick.

I follow the protocol from stopthethyroidmadness.com, they are really helpful people there on the forums.

Iam having another test done right now for free T3, IGF-1, SHBG and PSA.

Usually people with Andrenal problems have also Thyroid problems. I suspect my Free T3 levels are low as Ive measured my temperature levels before for a week every 4 hours and the change was much greater than 0.2 suggested for Thyroid problems.

Im checking my IGF-1 levels as low dhea usually means low IGF-1.

Ive had low Shbg levels in the past so just double checking on this one that hopefully it has reached the early mid 20s.

Psa is just for safety making sure I have no problems with the Prostate.




Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 24/06/2008 16:42:29


After say 2-3 months once all the hormones mentioned have been improved,
I will do a before and after hormone test and a Neurotransmitter test too check what hormones and neurotransmitters actually flucuate after ejaculating when one
has POIS.

From my symptoms I would say drop of testosterone from lack of strength,
cold body temperature due too drop of thyroid free T3, drop of dhea and cortisol
due too lack of energy and cant handle stress and adrenaline dump.

Now if Testosterone drops alot then would the estrogen levels drop alot too due
too lower testosterone levels less aromtasing from testosterone too estrogen?

Also if Dhea levels drop alot then would this cause IGF-1/HGH too drop too?

We know that prolactin can increase alot after having sex or eating in normal healthy individuals but what about people with POIS ??

Iam willing too bet that Prolactin levels probably increase even more with POIS!!

Ive had high Prolactin levels in the past but I take Dostinex 1mg E2D too lower it. Will recheck prolactin levels later.





Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 24/06/2008 16:48:45


I notice that the day after ejaculation sometimes it can cause stomach problems indigestion and diareeha.

I take digestive enzymes and probiotics and it has helped alot but it hasnt cured it. Someone recommended eating rye bread, I might give this a try.

It would be really helpful too everyone here with POIS that if you can afford it go
for a hormone blood/saliva test with your doctor or just order it from a testing lab like ZRT, Genevam Nutra etc

That way we could have evidence proof of what hormones are not optimal with people who have POIS and also the before and after tests would be extremely helpful in determining what is at fault.

I think it costs roughly 300usd for a Saliva home test kit too test all the hormones Ive mentioned above. The good thing is you dont need too go to the doctors, you just spit saliva in the test kit tube and send it back too ZRT Labs in the USA. They get back too you in a week with the results once they have received it :)





Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 24/06/2008 16:58:47
oh yes another good thing about the hormone tests ....

It may be best too not have the hormone results evaluated by a local doctor as 9 times out of 10 they dont have a bloody clue about hormones.

They go by range and that includes everyone whether your age 18 or age 90.

Ive seen 3 local doctors and they said my testosterone levels were fine for my
age  of 21 since it was still in range. They dont go by symptoms or by age only
by the number.

So say someone aged 21 has a testosterone level of

350 range from 250 - 1000

Most doctors would say, your in range, your fine, you have no problems but healthy 21 year olds have testosterone levels above 700 easily.

Ive read many, many times from people who had hormone levels right at the bottom yet their doctors would tell them they are ok. They only realised this was the true problem after doing more research or talking with an Anti Aging medicine doctor.

If you can find an Anti Aging medicine doctor they are the best
for hormone expertise.

Or if you are reaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyy lucky your local doctor might have alot of knowledge on hormones  [;D]

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: John21 on 24/06/2008 22:52:15
(Day 2 today)

Solution,

I have a suggestion concerning your thoughts on a potential intestinal problem. Try eating plenty soluble fiber, like apples and oatmeal. If you are right and there is an intestinal cause, this might help. On a daily basis eat some soluble fiber at each meal. You can also make use of oatmeal bread, and I like the oatmeal squares made by Quaker (although I don't eat them very often due to the trans fat content). The reason I am suggesting this is that I have noticed a potential correlation. The severity of my symptoms is not constant and I was looking for something to explain the variance. Soluble fiber might not be of benefit, but I have to persue anything that "seems" to work. I would love to hear if such a diet has any affect on your POIS symptoms.

Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: solution on 25/06/2008 01:08:47
John, I  think the intestinal cause is meant for the mental fog not for the POIS itself.  I mean POIS produces that intestinal anoyance and that produces mental fog.
I will try the soluble fiber diet, thank you.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 25/06/2008 02:56:54
Hi to new comers and others.
A few years ago, i saw a naturopathic doctor. My wife had cancer and she went to see him to have a complementary treatment. Since i was there with her i decided to try a consultation for myself. This guy gave me a list of expensive tests (private lab) that i wanted to do at the begining but i changed my mind. I'm ready to pay for something useful but in this case i wasn't sure enough.
Michael8028 ,
You're probably a good guy and thank you for the information, but do you realize your posts looks like advertisements ?!

Counterpoints ,
About hosting you can send me all your code by mail if you want. My time is very limited but i'll try some free web hosts.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: girlwind on 25/06/2008 04:51:50
Martin 88 (and anyone else interested)-- I've been researching labs for a couple days and found one that looks good to me.
It's called Bio Health Diagnostics (in San Diego). It's run by a naturopathic doctor (William Timmins) who has 20 years
experience working with chronic health issues, with the emphasis on getting to THE CAUSE. They have a whole slough of
adrenal/cortisol/hormonal saliva tests, as well as tests for intestinal parasites, candida, etc. 

Check it out at   http://www.biodia.com/index.html

Maybe this doctor could read up on our forum and give us his opinion on how to proceed?  Would it be okay if I forward him the
link and let him read all about us?
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: sparx on 25/06/2008 06:31:24
I think that my post orgasm mental fog it is produced by something anoying in my digestive system. Imagine something inside your stomach or intestines for example, something that cannot manifest itself like pain, itching, cold, warm, etc, but it can send a singal to the brain enough to produce mental fog and scalp tension. And only relief will come once I evacuate enough.

hi solution,

I think it's possible your theory about intestinal problems might be at least partially correct, or may at least be a clue to the underlying causes of POIS.

It's also possible that the underlying causes of POIS lay elsewhere and could be masked by layers of, for example, neuroendocrine imbalance and feedback and possibly secondary disease caused by the stresses of suffering from POIS. In spite of the fact that so many here have endured POIS for years, I think it is still 'early days' in terms of coming up with a reliable diagnosis. For now I am assuming that we are all at risk of confusing primary with secondary symptoms and causes with effects.  Having said that, I'm very much in support of current efforts to enlist the help of an endocrinologist; that would be a great advance, and it wouldn't exclude other avenues of investigation (it might even open them up).

It does seem possible to me that forms of mental fog could result from a problem with the gut. I can recall relatively brief occasions in my life when gut problems have made it impossible to function effectively, partly due to being unable to concentrate properly. In my case, constipation, particularly if it continues for more than a couple of days, leads to a feeling of being uncomfortably bloated, which is not a sensation of pain, but a kind of tension that seems to interfere with clear perception and thinking. Being susceptible to anxiety, I've also noticed that my gut seems to react in unpredictable ways (for example I used to suffer from diarrhea in the 24 hours before having to board an aircraft). Stress seems to affect other mammals in similar ways as well (if you've ever tried taking domestic cats in a car to the vet, well ... sometimes things can get messy).

I can't say I've noticed any consistent relationship between POIS (esp. brain fog) and bowel movements. However, I do notice that sexual release does tend to leave me feeling pretty relaxed these days (in contrast to past experience where I would feel apprehensive or even annoyed / angry at having to endure at least few days of brain fog and other symptoms). Being relaxed, not worrying about things unnecessarily, particularly not worrying about whether my bowel is working, seems to give my gut the best chance of just doing its thing.

John21's advice about fibre is well worth taking note of IMHO. I'm a big fan of insoluble wheat bran in muesli; if I forget that then things don't go so well after a couple of days. But other than that I don't have any problems. I'll be getting some soluble fibre to see if that is effective too. Regularly getting some extra fibre in one's diet is essential IMHO.

Having read all of your posts in the past (and i just reviewed them again quickly), it looks to me like you are definitely suffering from POIS in terms of how it is currently being defined. So I hope you will continue reading and posting about your experiences and ideas. Without really knowing how many chronic POIS sufferers there are out there, I definitely have a feeling of kinship with you and many others here (because it seems quite clear to me that unless one has experienced POIS symptoms there is no way to really grasp how difficult they can be). It might take a while but I'm very confident that we will be able to look back at this condition in the light of understanding its causes and look forward to life that is not dominated by POIS.

Good luck  [:)]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: sparx on 25/06/2008 09:13:17
Since early teens (now 42) I've been experiencing post-orgasm 'brain fog'

Have you noticed any change in the intensity of the symptoms from when you were in your teens to now?  I am wondering if its possible to outgrow this horrible illness.  It is truly driving me mad.

hi pyropeach,

Short answer is 'yes' and 'no'. Not very helpful, so let me elaborate a bit.

In so far as I recall the experience in my teens I'd say there have been some very remarkable improvements in my quality of life since then, most of which have developed over the past 10 years or so.

Memories of fog in my 20s and early 30s are of a reliably intense wall of condensed soup (a head state that seemed more like an impenetrable solid rather than a shifting cloud of vapor) that lasted at least 3 days and often longer.

These days the potential for intense, multi-day brain fog is still there and it does clobber me from time to time, but as I tried to explain in the second part of that long post the other day, my emotional and mental state before, during and immediately after orgasm seems to determine intensity and duration.

Masturbation is almost a guarantee of multi-day fog, whereas if I genuinely 'make love' to my girlfriend, for whom I have genuine affection, and with the intention and focus on making it fun for her, rather than seeking to gratify myself, and I continue to hold those positive feelings after orgasm, then fog can be of negligible intensity and only remains noticeable for a short time (it can effectively disappear after sleeping for a few hours).

So the improvements are not from outgrowing POIS, but more from trying to understand what affects it and paying attention to what helps and cultivating that instead of what hurts. That can be difficult at times, especially in a relationship situation, as others here have described, but it can be managed (somehow I went through full-time uni with good passes and a girlfriend, but there were some tough times).

Complete celibacy (meaning no sexual activity at all for at least a week, or even two or three weeks from time to time) is also part of the routine these days. That can be a real challenge if you live with a touchy-feely partner. As POIS goes I guess I'm fortunate in that I haven't experienced NE so far in my life. There are some other activities that I try to maintain which seem to help. In brief they include 'insight' meditation, exercise (aerobic & weight-bearing) and acupuncture treatments once every 6 weeks or so.

cheers & good luck  [:)]
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 25/06/2008 10:04:35
Hi to new comers and others.
A few years ago, i saw a naturopathic doctor. My wife had cancer and she went to see him to have a complementary treatment. Since i was there with her i decided to try a consultation for myself. This guy gave me a list of expensive tests (private lab) that i wanted to do at the begining but i changed my mind. I'm ready to pay for something useful but in this case i wasn't sure enough.
Michael8028 ,
You're probably a good guy and thank you for the information, but do you realize your posts looks like advertisements ?!

Counterpoints ,
Please, since you are in contact with scientific people at your work, perhaps you know about these kind of labs. What do you think ? I'm very interested but sceptical, or suspicious is a better term.

About hosting you can send me all your code by mail if you want. My time is very limited but i'll try some free web hosts.




I do apologise if my posts do come across as advertisements as that wasnt my intention.

My intention was too hopefully influence people too have their hormones tested as
a fellow POIS suffer for 4-5 years most of my hormones that I have had tested
have been imbalanced some either high or low which drwas too the conclusion
that other fellow POIS sufferers probably have imbalanced hormones as well.

In me recommending ZRT, Geneva and Nutra these 3 labs are known as the top 5 testing
labs worldwide for their reliabilty, quick service and accuracy from my research
and from my friends experiences from testing.

You do not need too have the tests done here if you can influence
your own doctor too have the test done for you.



Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: Michael8028 on 25/06/2008 11:37:26
Here is a list of all the hormones at healthy optimal ranges
recommended by Life Extension:

http://www.lef.org/protocols/appendix/blood_testing_01.htm

Most of my hormones except Estradiol (E2) are out of the optimal range.

If you do get a hormone test done and your practitioners are not helpful
you can compare your results above.
Title: Re: Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (POIS)
Post by: martin88 on 25/06/2008 20:17:38
Welcome Martin, Sparx and Michael.
Please keep us informed about your gluten free diet. Not easy to do but you may have good results. In the past i have had strange nervous symptoms (strong nerve pain in the heart and left arm when falling asleep). This has been totally cured by stopping wheat for one year. I realized this by chance, away from home when i was out for holidays with the change of food.