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Can a market regulate itself?
What makes market superior to planned economy is level of INNOVATION because of market dynamism. Bad side is that resources still get invested in sub-optimal areas.
Of course markets do regulate themselves. That is called EMERGENCE.
Bad side [of a market] is that resources still get invested in sub-optimal areas.
We see emergence in nature. Yet, nature is not regulated by rules and laws.Markets tend to regulate rules and laws, not the other way around, friend.
Laws of nature applies to market, but human laws are inferior in maintaining markets, rules, yes even human civilisation.The existence of police is evidence human laws are not universal, because they need force to be maintained.Technocratic solution: Engineer civilisation to make violations physically impossible.
And have regulation deleted insider trading and counterfeiting? If not, they are ineffective firewalls against viruses. We need either better firewall systems, or new economic operative system.
I agree that the current system is irrational but, I don't think I'll ever call a small child 'a unit'.
Quote from: sooyeah on 22/09/2007 13:57:37I agree that the current system is irrational but, I don't think I'll ever call a small child 'a unit'. But the nature of markets is that they can only work if there complexity is allowed to operate outside of the comprehension of human rationale (i.e. they must be irrational, or else they are broken).
Well wait then, if the market has to be irrational, is it not the case that a person would have to act irrationally and think irrationally, to be and work with-in it?
Rule of entropy: Chaos and disorder tend to increase in closed systems without sufficient countermeasures. Since world market is closed system, entropy would eventually increase. Humanity cannot expect to survive by utilising resources inefficiently and in interests of unnecessary expansion of consumption.Definition: Unsustainability.
As earlier stated: Human bio-processor is insufficient to utilise such complex information in optimal way. Enhancements are advised.
Energy accounting, ok but I can't see people going for it, your giving a monetary value to, and sharing out, units of energy, evenly to everyone. It's a nice idea but I just don't think it would work in practice.
Since when is human being some sort of trading good? In slavery perhaps?
Do you think slavery is positive? I do not understand.
Energy accounting is not exchange system, but distribution system. All individual units would be receiving an equal share of the production capacity, to use to satisfy their needs.
ENERGY ACCOUNTING: Total resource base production capacity of technate is divided into shares between all individuals living in area of technate. All individuals "own" their share of production capacity, and are free to use it as they like. Individual orders something, and it's share of production capacity (energy credits) are diverted to that area of production. Individual receive what it have ordered. Therefore, it is not rationing.
ENERGY CREDITS: Energy credits are units of information so technate could keep track on consumption. Therefore, they may not be saved over production cycle. When production cycle is over, the energy certifikate is reloaded. Energy credits cease to exist in disposable form when used.
Trade will not be suppressed. But it will not be profitable any more.
Fact: In technate, there will be no scarcity. Therefore, technocracy wont prohibit bartering, but bartering will not be very popular. Besides, for energy "ration", individual could order what it want to be produced.
When you are trying to give energy credits to someone else, they will dissapear in thin air.
Land would not be owned under technate, and sex is no commodity, but personal issue.
And yes, what is wrong with utopianism? Utopianism is what brought us here today. You seem not to have read wikipedia article.
Quote from: another_someone on 22/09/2007 15:13:46No - it simply means that humans cannot predict the outcome of their actions upon the market. A market that is capable of being rationally controlled by a single player within the market, or a small group of players in the market, is a broken market.I think we are looking at it very differently. By irrational I am actually talking about damage and the non-sustainability of the market itself; not control of but the consequence of the market. How the whole affects the world and its peoples.
No - it simply means that humans cannot predict the outcome of their actions upon the market. A market that is capable of being rationally controlled by a single player within the market, or a small group of players in the market, is a broken market.
Quote from: another_someone on 22/09/2007 15:21:56The question is not whether the systems we have in play are indefinitely sustainable (nothing is), but whether they are the best we have at present, and whether in the end the system will live longer than we shall (i.e. any doctor does not claim you will never die - he merely tries to ensure that what you die of is something other than what he is treating you for, and if the ailment you have is something that will kill you in 40 years, and you are already 70 years old, he may consider the ailment not worth the effort to treat at all).Yeah, I see what you saying but the market has to account for those that will be here in the future and not just those that are here now; The reality that the market currently does not, is in itself irrational, to my mind.
The question is not whether the systems we have in play are indefinitely sustainable (nothing is), but whether they are the best we have at present, and whether in the end the system will live longer than we shall (i.e. any doctor does not claim you will never die - he merely tries to ensure that what you die of is something other than what he is treating you for, and if the ailment you have is something that will kill you in 40 years, and you are already 70 years old, he may consider the ailment not worth the effort to treat at all).
Land is not rented. All land is under administration of technate. People own production capacity, not means of production.
Technate distribute right to dwelling.
Exchange wont be illegal. So it wont be black economy.But since technate is able to produce all that consumer wants, consumer would rather like to utilise service of technate than trade for higher price.
Because there is limited amounts of energy. But human ability to consume is not limitless.
technate is able to produce all that consumer wants
In technate, you do not have ownership, but usership. That means you cannot obtain 600 cars for example, but maybe use 600 cars from different depots at different times. It is for sake of ecological balance.
You decide what should be produced for your energy share. Technate uses automatic factories to deliver it. The cost in your energy share correspond exactly to energy cost. Therefore, zero profits are made. Since there are no wages and no unemployment, social incitaments for starting to trade will be low. If urbanate is overcrowded, new urbanate is erect alongside it. No need for "market solutions" in integrated technate.
Cyborg have sense you do not read links. Read links and answer after.
Of course, you could try to rent apartment or rights to other person under technate. But it wont become popular, since technate by size and ability to produce would be able to outcompete any potential competitor due to virtual control over continent. Therefore, technate alternative would always be cheaper than your alternative.
Since no one could make any profits under technate,
and no one could monopolise access to resource, artificial scarcity wont arise.
Human need is not limitless, and even if it was, human has only limited ability to consume.
Retail and bank sector wont exist in technate. You could try start bank, but no one could deposit anything there since energy credits are non transferable.
School children bartering hockey cards is not problem for technate.
Technate only deal with resources and services, not with religion.
Exclusivity is flaw of human brain. It is creating uncontrolled growth and endangering environment. Human Race survive without it. And what say technate cannot pirate-copy brands if consumers so desire?