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Offline BenV

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« Reply #50 on: 20/01/2009 10:40:33 »
I agree - I'll look into how much filtering power we have.  Please bear in mind that this is a test period, so hopefully we'll have these things ironed out soon.

I'm now expecting adverts for irons and ironing boards...

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Offline Don_1

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« Reply #51 on: 20/01/2009 10:47:54 »
I started the Tortoise First forum with Freeforums. Google Adsense placed ads according to the key words in the forum. In this case the word ‘Tortoise’ was singled out by Adsense.

Google Adsense paid for the forum in its early days. The forum is now free from these ads because removal of Adsense is paid for.

The Google Adsense   here appears to be a somewhat more advanced version which picks out key words not from those in the forum’s name and description, but from the individual posts. Take a look at my thread on exotic pets http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=19519.0 What you will notice is that the ads are contrary to the subject of the thread.

This was the reason for going ‘adsense free’ with the Tortoise First Forum. From the very beginning of the forum’s inauguration I declared the forum would be opposed to the practices of unscrupulous pet traders:-
Quote
This forum is dedicated to the welfare of both captive & wild Tortoises.

The forum does not promote or encourage the keeping of tortoises, but rather to make prospective keepers aware of the special needs of these animals and the necessity upon them to provide such. Please see 'Our Aims'. It is also intended to be a contact point for those who do keep Tortoises’ to exchange knowledge and experience and friendship in order that we can all learn how to care for our shelled friends better.

It shall also be the forum’s aim to prevent, by way of education, the capture of wild Tortoises and the import of Tortoises into the UK for the fulfilment of demand by the pet trade. Many of these imported tortoises being of dubious origin and frequently transported in such poor conditions, that many do not survive the journey. The forum therefore supports the Tortoise Protection Group, The Tortoise Trust and the British Chelonia Group.

The forum does not approve of exhibitions, shows, markets or similar events, to which live tortoises are transported for the purpose of showing or selling to either the trade or the public.
With such a forum it was inappropriate to have Google Adsense placing ads for traders selling Tortoise’s over the internet. One such company, well known to many in the world of Chelonia, and the subject of a BBC exposé, appeared on our forum. Doubtless if a thread opposed to whaling were to be started here, businesses selling Whale bone and meat would get their ads placed on the thread if it were viewed in Japan. Not exactly a fitting advert for such a thread.

As I understand it, Adsense can pick up national identity; therefore, the ads seen in one country may differ from those in another. Adsense cannot, however, pick up on sentiment, only subject words. Adsense is an automated system. The Administrators and Moderators of a forum displaying Adsense ads do not have the ability to screen out any ads which might be considered offensive and/or contrary to the subject matter of the forum/thread.

I am not sure whether Adsense would cause many problems with this forum. As daveshorts has said, running the forum is costly. This is a means to reduce that cost and give us all a forum to play with. Look upon it as ‘junk mail’ coming through your letterbox. What do you do with that? If you find it relevant and useful you keep it and use it. If it is the usual tripe, you ignore it and bin it.

I would, however, suggest being careful with your choice of words in some of those threads which turn a tad on the risqué side, we don’t want too many, ah em, er, shall we say, naughty ads. I think you know what I mean. ‘Firripino* message* etc etc.’
*Deliberate misspelling to throw off Google Adsense.
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Offline BenV

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« Reply #52 on: 20/01/2009 10:49:15 »
I'm glad that you all understand why we're doing this, even if it is a little unsightly and often silly (such as the fact that there are now adverts for steam irons on this page, as predicted).

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Offline RD

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« Reply #53 on: 20/01/2009 10:59:28 »
Maybe the word "Naked" is responsible for attracting the sex (dating) adverts ?. 
« Last Edit: 20/01/2009 11:03:41 by RD »

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Offline dentstudent

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« Reply #54 on: 20/01/2009 11:04:28 »
Maybe the word "Naked" is responsible for attracting the sex (dating) adverts ?. 


RD - I see that you have trimmed this thread - did you not like your hypothesis?

Expecting razors now, perhaps?

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Offline Chemistry4me

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« Reply #55 on: 20/01/2009 11:05:11 »
It appears that I can do a 'Google' myself  [:o]


[attachment=6459]

Absolutely free! [:o] [:o]
I'm coming to get you *spooky ghost music plays in the background*  [:o] [:o] [:o]

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Offline Chemistry4me

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« Reply #56 on: 20/01/2009 11:06:39 »
Maybe the word "Naked" is responsible for attracting the sex (dating) adverts ?. 

Didn't get any results with all those 'Nakeds'???

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Offline RD

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« Reply #57 on: 20/01/2009 11:08:10 »
I thought better of it: the current adverts are bad enough, I don't want to make matters worse.

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Offline dentstudent

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« Reply #58 on: 20/01/2009 11:11:03 »
I thought better of it: the current adverts are bad enough, I don't want to make matters worse.

Fair play!

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Offline Don_1

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« Reply #59 on: 20/01/2009 11:27:47 »
As you can see, the mention of Tortoises and Google Adsense, has attracted ads for Tortoises and Google Adsense.

With this form of Adsense, we could manipulate the ads which appear here to some degree.
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Offline RD

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« Reply #60 on: 20/01/2009 13:59:39 »
I'm using IE7. If I enlarge the display, by pressing "Ctrl" and "+" keys,
 the google ads on the right are cropped off ...

[attachment=6469]


The typeface does go a bit weird though. To shrink the display back down use "Ctrl" and "-" keys.
« Last Edit: 21/01/2009 11:28:54 by RD »

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Offline DoctorBeaver

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« Reply #61 on: 20/01/2009 14:06:56 »
When I checked Chris's "Happy Birthday to me" thread there was an ad for trips to the Guinness brewery in Dublin!  [:D]
Fledgling science site at http://www.sciencefile.org/SF/content/view/54/98/ needs members and original articles. If you can help, please join.

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Offline dentstudent

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« Reply #62 on: 20/01/2009 14:10:34 »
I'm using Windows vista. If I enlarge the display, by pressing "Ctrl" and "+" keys,
 the google ads on the right are cropped off ...

The typeface does go a bit weird though. To shrink the display back down use "Ctrl" and "-" keys.

You can also use "Ctrl" and scroll the wheel on the mouse to make the screen image larger or smaller.

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Offline RD

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« Reply #63 on: 20/01/2009 16:02:50 »
These guys aren't taking the piss, they're selling it ...

TNS/Google Ad
[attachment=6471]


They sell real or "artificial" (?) urine for $40 a time, for use to pass a drug test,
presumably for drug users who do not have any "clean" friends who could give them a sample.
« Last Edit: 20/01/2009 16:14:50 by RD »

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Offline Make it Lady

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« Reply #64 on: 20/01/2009 18:25:07 »
Why do I get the Brazilian dating one ..I just got it again !

Does it know that I shave my joy dept ?
I'm sure it is a shear delight!
Give a man a fire and he is warm for a day, set a man on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life.

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Offline Make it Lady

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« Reply #65 on: 20/01/2009 18:34:41 »
OK Chris, now they are flashing. I can cope with them if they don't move about but I really can't stand the ones that constantly change. I'll be getting a migraine, but at least if I mention migraine the adverts might suggest a cure.
I'm now thinking of interesting threads to post just to see which ads appear.
Give a man a fire and he is warm for a day, set a man on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life.

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Offline chris

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« Reply #66 on: 20/01/2009 23:04:20 »
Ben has now managed to provoke a deluge of ads dedicated to steam irons and trouser presses because he mentioned "ironing out" difficulties. Hilarious.

C
I never forget a face, but in your case I'll make an exception - Groucho Marx

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Offline Chemistry4me

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« Reply #67 on: 21/01/2009 01:03:34 »
Hey, the ads are gone!

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Offline daveshorts

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« Reply #68 on: 21/01/2009 01:04:26 »
As they are obviously causing people problems, I have disabled the right band bar google ads (for the moment until we can find a way around the problems thery are causing) for anyone who is logged in. Hopefully we can come up with a way around this to everyone's satisfaction as soon as possible.

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Offline Chemistry4me

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« Reply #69 on: 21/01/2009 01:05:41 »
I was too carried away to notice that the bottoms ones are still there, but still, it now looks a lot better!!!

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Offline RD

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« Reply #70 on: 21/01/2009 07:57:14 »
TNS / Google Ad...
[attachment=6473]


Quote
Here are some of the Most Fascinating Secrets you’ll Discover Inside:

How to apply Quantum Physics to Create Your PERFECT Reality.
How to Telekinetically Attract MONEY to you and become Very RICH!
How to use Psychic Influence on others to make them DO what you wish.
How to Miraculously Cure ALL SICKNESS and Diseases without Drugs.
How to be Highly Attractive and Desirable to members of the opposite sex.

Only $30.

 [V]
« Last Edit: 21/01/2009 08:00:01 by RD »

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Offline Chemistry4me

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« Reply #71 on: 21/01/2009 07:59:55 »
Might give that one a try! [;)] If I can find it that is...

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Offline RD

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« Reply #72 on: 21/01/2009 08:25:49 »
Might give that one a try! [;)] If I can find it that is...


Quote
The ultimate nature of reality is that it is mental.
http://www.mindreality.com/index.html?seed=quantum-physics

Anyone who coughs up $30 for this pseudoscientific crap must be "mental".

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Offline Chemistry4me

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« Reply #73 on: 21/01/2009 08:26:30 »
I guess that makes me as mad as a hatter! [:o)] [:o)] [:o)]

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Offline RD

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« Reply #74 on: 21/01/2009 09:43:38 »
I'm using IE7. If I set the security level to high the Google ads do not appear on the TNS site.
This does cause some problems when posting to TNS though, e.g. TNS spellchecker is blocked
« Last Edit: 21/01/2009 09:48:51 by RD »

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Offline dentstudent

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« Reply #75 on: 21/01/2009 09:53:35 »
I'm using IE7. If I set the security level to high the Google ads do not appear on the TNS site.
This does cause some problems when posting to TNS though, e.g. TNS spellchecker is blocked

Brilliant!!!!!! I just get the big ad at the bottom. Excellent job, RD!

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Offline RD

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« Reply #76 on: 21/01/2009 10:04:56 »
I'm using IE7. If I set the security level to high the Google ads do not appear on the TNS site.
This does cause some problems when posting to TNS though, e.g. TNS spellchecker is blocked

Brilliant!!!!!! I just get the big ad at the bottom. Excellent job, RD!


I don't get any ads, not even one at the bottom.
If you hit refresh, after you turn the security to high, all the ads disappear.

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Offline dentstudent

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« Reply #77 on: 21/01/2009 10:13:18 »
Hmmn, no, I still get that one. But it's of no real consequence....

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Offline RD

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« Reply #78 on: 21/01/2009 10:22:03 »
So thankfully those who wish to deprive themselves of Google's excretions do have that option.
« Last Edit: 21/01/2009 10:25:20 by RD »

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Offline Make it Lady

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« Reply #79 on: 21/01/2009 21:28:45 »
I fancy some music themed adverts. I will have to blow Chris's trumpet for setting the right tone and noting our discomfort has cancelled the side bar. He didn't quaver from the responsibility. He has managed to stave off further criticism and has done it with his usual sharp wit. I hope his attempts to fund TNS wont fall flat. If it does I will personnally drop a piano on his head.
Lets see which ads come up now. I will be disappointed if I don't get some music based ads. 
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Offline DoctorBeaver

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« Reply #80 on: 21/01/2009 21:59:32 »
How much would it cost to put a private ad here?
Fledgling science site at http://www.sciencefile.org/SF/content/view/54/98/ needs members and original articles. If you can help, please join.

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Offline Make it Lady

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« Reply #81 on: 21/01/2009 22:22:25 »
What kind of services are you selling Beaver?
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Offline DoctorBeaver

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« Reply #82 on: 21/01/2009 22:58:23 »
It's just an idle enquiry
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Offline daveshorts

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« Reply #83 on: 21/01/2009 23:36:17 »
Try e-mailing chris at thenakedscientists and ask him off list.

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Offline DoctorBeaver

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« Reply #84 on: 22/01/2009 08:55:26 »
I still can't look at Dave's avatar without chuckling  [:D]
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Offline BenV

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« Reply #85 on: 22/01/2009 09:27:26 »
We would much prefer to have specific ads on here from companies that we feel have something to offer on a science website, rather than relying on google's whim.  But first we need to supply evidence to potential advertisers that it's worth it, hence running the google ad trial.

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Offline Make it Lady

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« Reply #86 on: 22/01/2009 18:09:37 »
Did you put that "worth it" strap line in for L'oreal?
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Offline JimBob

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« Reply #87 on: 23/01/2009 03:32:39 »
This could be back-firing - this is from a post from Chris

The mind is like a parachute. It works best when open.  -- A. Einstein

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Offline Chemistry4me

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« Reply #88 on: 23/01/2009 04:01:38 »
I've been getting those since the beginning!

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Offline daveshorts

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« Reply #89 on: 19/02/2009 18:15:07 »
As another experiment we are going to try some small text ads on the front page of the forum tomorrow. Hopefully they won't be too annoying.

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Offline techmind

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« Reply #90 on: 19/02/2009 20:36:28 »
How many pageviews does thenakedscientists website get per month?
How many tens/hundreds of gigabytes downloaded per month (excluding podcast downloads)?
And how many podcast downloads?

Presumably the £100000 pa you quote to keep TheNakedScientists running covers an awful lot more than just the website?

Is the cost for hosting the podcast mp3s too high? There are various download companies (I'm thinking of akamai and/or AOL Radio) which may be able to offer cacheing services to lower such costs (I don't know the details, and have no commercial interest in either).

My experience from my sci/tech themed website has been that Google AdSense revenue is now less than a third of what it was at its peak about 3 years ago, despite no significant change in either my website content or its number of visitors (this might partly be that there were more naive advertisers back then bidding up the prices!).
With static pages you can of course "tweak" the pages to help generate the right kind of ads (not obsessively, because the ads continually change anyway - but if you detect a theme then something can be done). With the context of a forum this is much harder.
Overall, a revenue of perhaps $2 per 1000 pageviews might be in the ballpark for my whole site, although some individual pages yeild 2-3 times that and others much less.


Have you considered putting adverts within the podcast downloads (in place of the BBC Cambridgeshire travel or whatever)? Is geography a problem with this type of advertising?
What are the UK "rules" for adverts in podcasts? American podcasts often have the presenters "thanking their sponsors" and extolling the virtues of their products ... very un-British - and probably something that you'd particularly want to avoid in a science podcast which aims to be factual and unbiassed.
The podcast does however present opportunites for quite precisely targetted advertising - and potential higher revenue than general ads - if you can find the right (probably international) sponsor. Do you know much about the geographical spread of TNS podcast-downloads?
The twit.tv podcasts are entirely supported by advertising as far as I can make out.

Potential advertisers/sponsors of the programme obviously include any other public-communication-of-science body, but what about scientific book publishers - could you do a one-minute book-review/promotion per programme? You've got the targetted audience. And if the advertisement/promotion is relevant and not overdone, it won't upset people too much.

Have your recent audience-surveys revealed much about demographics? Although the programme is pitched at the interested non-specialist, it's so good (and so much better than most other "science" programming) that there must be quite a lot of real PhD-educated scientists who enjoy listening too. Are there any scientific-equipment manufacturers who might part-sponsor the programme?


Are there any other overseas broadcasters you could sell your weekly programme to?

Could someone like Prof Steve Jones (UCL) (media/public-understanding-of-science) suggest any more leads with regards to interested advertisers or broadcasters?
« Last Edit: 19/02/2009 23:30:32 by techmind »
"It has been said that the primary function of schools is to impart enough facts to make children stop asking questions. Some, with whom the schools do not succeed, become scientists." - Schmidt-Nielsen "Memoirs of a curious scientist"

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Offline techmind

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« Reply #91 on: 19/02/2009 21:54:08 »
Now there's unobtrusive ads, and there's adverts which really apologise for being there.   [;)]

[attachment=6996]


I think this really is too insignificant for anyone to notice!

I reckon the "large leaderboard" (text-only) format is reasonably unobtrusive, but still big enough to be useful.


Google-targetting is much better than non-targetted ads, but it's still somewhat hit and miss. There's some evidence that Google pays more attention to keywords higher up the page - but I've also observed that certain words (and I'm not thinking anything rude or smutty) however irrelevant can have almost irristable draw on the ads, pulling them off-course.
« Last Edit: 19/02/2009 21:56:46 by techmind »
"It has been said that the primary function of schools is to impart enough facts to make children stop asking questions. Some, with whom the schools do not succeed, become scientists." - Schmidt-Nielsen "Memoirs of a curious scientist"